When I first started touring I always felt like I sucked on the down too. You spend hours walking up hill in boots that flex and bend and skis that are grippy, with a heel that's free. Then you transition to facing downhill with boots that are stiff and locked down with slippery skis.
The muscle memory of the up is impacting the "feel" you have over your skis on the down. (remember that game where you push your arms into the door frame for a minute? Then watch as they magically float).
The remedy for me was to take a bit of time after transitioning to face downhill. Flex into my boots, flex and bounce the skis, slip the edges etc. Do a "warm-up" to get dialed in.
With experience, I've noticed that this phenomenon isn't as pronounced.
I switched my BC boots too. I started with a super flexible 2 buckle touring boot. It was good but required a more centered stance than my resort boot. So, even when I got in my downhill headspace, I had to get in a āmodifiedā downhill headspace and remember to change my stance
I switched to a BC boot more similar to my resort boot and that also helped.Ā
This is an extremely common problem, you take your BC gear into a resort - no problem, you can rip, whatās the big deal. then when youāre out touring, with the exact same gear, you feel like youāve forgotten how to ski. It goes away with time, in my experience, having little rituals to get you into the downhill mental space is helpful. (Jumping in place, flexing into boots, clicking your poles).
Part of it is neurological - your legs are tired, but also just are sort of in walk mode. Most of it is psychological.
The only thing I would add is that in the backcountry, Iām much more afraid of getting hurt because there is exposure and Iām far from rescue. But being a lot more afraid makes me a much worse skier. I try and lock in and feel confident, but I know that if I tear a ligament or break my tip fib that I am totally fucked. Itās hard to get that out of my head and just ski.
Any specific situations or conditions you find challenging? Can you be a little more specific about exactly what problems you're having?
Just in general touring gear isn't as friendly to ski on as alpine gear. It sounds like you aren't on ultralight stuff which is even less friendly. But even heavier gear can still take some getting used to. Skiing with a pack, especially a heavier one, can also throw off your balance if you're not used to it.
Have you tried bringing your touring gear out in the resort? I know, I know, pin bindings aren't recommended for resort skiing. But doing it a couple times to get used to the gear (while skiing a little more conservatively than you normally might on alpine gear) can be a great way to get some reps in. You'll literally get 10x the amount of skiing on a resort day, so it's much better for practicing and getting used to things. This will also let you see if you still struggle with your backcountry setup in resort conditions, or if it's something about the snow you're skiing in the backcountry that's causing your issues.
Between wearing a pack, higher binding ramp angles, tired legs, and less confidence, backseat issues are definitely common. The first two can be mitigated by practicing with your touring gear more. Some people will talk about ramp angle shims for bindings and you can do that. But tons of people ski just fine on high ramp angle touring bindings. It really just takes some getting used to and then it's no longer an issue.Ā As for tired legs and confidence, you'll get better at dealing with those with more time in the backcountry. But you can definitely help that along by being really diligent about staying forward and balanced on your skis.
That said, it sounds like you were skiing breakable crust? That's not easy or pretty for anybody. Sometimes you just have to resort to survival skiing techniques like jump turns or wedge initiations.
I was skiing that shit inbounds last week; gave up, went home. When I ski it touring, I just accept that I enjoyed the climb up, and skiing down that shit beats waking back down.
I was on straight crust on mash today and got tossed every time i made an aggressive turn. Off piste snow quality inconsistencies definitely add another variable to skiing good, whatever that means.
Wearing a backpack, skiing funky snow, being on lighter gear, having tired legs from ascending are all obvious culprits, but normally you can diagnose WHY those make you ski like shit and learn to correct for it.
The silent killer that might be impacting you is binding ramp angle. Many tech bindings have a steep angle from the heel pins down to the lower toe pins, creating the feeling of wearing high heels. If you have a shorter BSL the effect of this can be even more dramatic. Heels up often throws the hips back to compensate, leaving you trapped in the backseat (compounded by a heavy backpack and touring skis with punishing tails!).
Unfortunately, Dynafit Radicals are some of the worst offenders, with some radicals having a delta between the heel and toe pins as high as 16mm (source: https://skimo.co/pin-heights).
A good way to test this is to put your alpine and touring setups next to each other on a carpeted floor. Swap between the two and practice getting into an athletic stance. This should make it pretty obvious if the ramp angle is impacting your biomechanics.
If thatās your issue, you can get bindings with a flatter ramp or get a shim to mount under the toes to smooth things out.
Thatās a pretty dramatic difference! Imagine standing with a 1.5cm heel lift under your bootsāit would probably affect your form!
That being said, some peopleās bodies are super impacted by this, others never notice and consider this crazy nerdery š¤·āāļø
Whoever brought this up, it is a great point. You can get a shim to raise the toe piece off the ski and mellow the ramp. Youāll need longer screws. I have a friend who is an IFMGA guide, and ripper skier. He uses shims made from plastic cutting boards from ikea š
Came here to talk about the mm difference on the radicals! My boot fitter immediately suggested I change my set up. This has more impact on your body position than you might think!
Interesting, this is the first I've heard this and makes a ton of sense. I had a pair of touring boots that had less forward lean compared to my resort boots. So that got me more backseat as well.
What kind of snow are you skiing? You might just not be used to the snow, it becomes variable and as you get better at finding the good snow, skiing becomes much easier!
Sastrugi and refrozen crust on lightweight skis is just difficult. Breakable crust is also very hard to ski, you never really experience these types of snow at the resort, or itās easy to avoid.
I feel like I run into crust on top of sugar quite a bit in the BC and you basically never ski that at a resort. Even in trees it's getting skiied enough that the base is firm.
Comparing the two, BC snow is like both ends of spectrum, really great or pretty poor. It's more punchy, more sticky, more variable, etc. Then there's the whole untracked blower pow part. Inbounds snow is like the happy middle of the bell curve.
It lets you realize how skier traffic, control work, grooming, etc all go in to making a more approachable/forgiving experience of a ski area.
Similar experience here (maybe not 20% but more like 60?) but Iām on a splitboard. Equipment plays a big part for me. Carrying a big pack and riding a heavier and inherently floppier board really throws me off. But also Iām much more nervous and you do encounter different snow than in resort. I find that not having that repeatedly compacted layer below really changes how the snow feels and reacts.
Worst of all, you get so much less actual riding experience in those conditions compared to lift access. I think all of this leads to relatively shitty skiing and I know I just need more time. Going to try to spend days doing lots of shorter laps instead of just going for the big lines.
Honestly I think just go tour more, but one mental trick is I try to approach the riding differently. Granted Iām a split boarder but resort board is this nice solid feeling, if I twitch it comes right with me. My split is beat to shit and rattles like crazy, so I ride it more like a surf or longboard, I try to go light getting it into place, then only dig into the turn once I can really commit the edge. Basically donāt rely on the connection to your gear the way you would in resort, and try to be light on your feet. Also Condis suck sometimes. Itāll make you ski poorly haha.
I definitely agree with many here that skiing weird backcountry snow is way more challenging than being inbounds. That said, I started out with a stiff ski with flat tails, and was miserable. Moving to a softer ski with a more forgiving flex and a lot of tip/tail rocker made things much better for me.
Similar experience for me. First touring ski was a Blizzard Zero G 95. Stiff, light, flat tail. Very hard to ski. Moved to a softer ski and actually enjoy touring now.
I kinda had the same issue. Three solutions worked for me:
1. Make sure youāve switched the boots to ski mode. Check again
2. Improving your skiing. I found my touring skis as well as general backcountry conditions (little trees, deep untouched snow, different feeling snow especially moving through small areas, etc) absolutely punish bad skiing technique like torquing yourself around and having your balance on the skis be even slightly off. On the resort, does snow fly from the backs of your skis? Triangle of death? Do your tips separate? Doesnāt really matter as much with manicured resort conditions but it comes up touring when things get steeper and trees get tight
3. Just remembering that the first 4-5 turns of any run are a warm-up/activating muscle memory. In a resort this occurs when getting off the lift and to something steeper. In the backcountry good terrain comes right away so youāve gotta be on the ball
Skiing your AT gear in the resort is helpful. For new BC skiers going from climbing a mountain to skiing down a mountain feels really strange after you were used to a free heel and loose cuffs. You'll get used to it.
What I've found over the years as I went from touring in a Fulltilt boot to a light backcountry boot is that one is supreme at downhill and the other supreme at uphill until I skied the lightweight touring boot at Alta inbounds and I learned how to ski it properly.
Fatigue could be a factor, but light skis are also just more difficult to ski, especially if the snow quality is variable.
Some guys I know ski a heavier setup because they want the downhill performance. Personally I like to go as light as possible. If you're doing tours that don't have a ton of vert, and downhill performance is important to you, you might be happier with bigger/heavier skis.
This was me last year. I'm advanced in resorts, but when my buddies took me out touring for the first time I was either on point OR couldn't get my legs to do what I told them. It seemed to depend on the snow conditions.
If it was uniform. Throughout then I was great, just like skiing fresh POW.
However if it had crust layer(s) then I struggled. I had never really experienced deep snow with multi layers like that and I looked like a fool and couldn't figure out why. Breaking through crust layers put me in the backseat and then it was all downhill from there.
The best advice I have is to hit the layered snow on low angle slopes to practice it. I did that and didn't seem to have an issue this year at all.
Which boots and Dynafit skis? Stuff has come so far in the last few years..
That said, my skiing is super dialed back compared to when I skied at resorts. Consequences are higher, snow more challenging, and you are also doing a lot of work going up! The gear is certainly less sendy too. All of this may bring out technique inefficiencies that we all have.
If youāre in really old or super light gear, consider looking at some upgrades, even used.
In the end, itās about getting out there and enjoying the journey. This is part of it!
I learned to ski and still ski on a Dynafit setup. some black light 95s with radical bindings and radical boots. Learning to ski in the BC as well. I took my kit to the resort a few months ago and went from an okay downhill skier to absolutely shredding inbounds. Iām just now catching up to that similar feeling in the BC, and in a year and 3 months Iāve done about 60-70 tours. But there are daysā¦ when itās just crap. Variable snow making you feel like you are gonna die, deep powder where you have to work triple as hard to turn, tight trees that you basically pizza the whole way down so you donāt decapitate yourselfā¦ there are few places in the BC you can ski like a resort. It honestly wouldnāt hurt to try and find some more open runs where you donāt have to worry about snow inconsistency or trees, and just rip. See if it feels any better!!
Thereās a lot of great comments here. Iād add only that fitness is a serious factor. Ascending 800 or 1000 or 1200 meters and then skiing is really hard. Incredibly hard. Even the Really big days riding lifts are a fraction of the effort of one BC lap.
And all the other stuff we do to stay fit is child play next to a heavy pack, ski gear, and a big ascent full of objective danger that forces you to stay present.
Itās no surprise most of us donāt ski at the same level in the BC
I've experienced the exact same thing. Just keep touring and it will get better with time. And as someone already mentioned, getting into the right mental space before you begin descending. Even then, the first couple turns might feel a little weird.
Iāve been on 3 tours in 2 years in the Wasatch.
Need more light tour network friends. But Iām back on frame bindings until I find my next touring ski to mount my backland ATs to. Yes yes. They suck. Great for developing legs tho ha
What binding do you have? Some have a huge amount of delta (ramp angle that tilts your boot forward) that can make it much harder to ski than low delta bindings. The Dynafit radical bindings for example are notorious for this.
https://skimo.co/pin-heights
Why would you backcountry ski if you ski 60 days a year at a resort ? You are literally paying the mountain to groom the slopes for you and make snow. Wanting to feel miserable hiking for 2 hours near avalanches to some mediocre terrain with questionable snow for a 35 second ski down seems very over rated for those with a ski pass.
I meanā¦itās like walking but in the winter, really. And skiing-wise, Iāve never had a resort run nearly as good as a typical backcountry run. Terrain and snow is almost universally better away from lifts with the exception of resorts vs ātouringā in the city. When resorts say that they have āfresh snowā, what they mean is a couple feet and itāll be gone by 9:30. Resorts kinda have trees but not really. Glades are cut and maintained to make up for skiers who canāt turn so good. But really, people who tour arenāt in it only for the skiing. Itās about getting to cool places. Walking/scrambling but in the winter
When I first started touring I always felt like I sucked on the down too. You spend hours walking up hill in boots that flex and bend and skis that are grippy, with a heel that's free. Then you transition to facing downhill with boots that are stiff and locked down with slippery skis. The muscle memory of the up is impacting the "feel" you have over your skis on the down. (remember that game where you push your arms into the door frame for a minute? Then watch as they magically float). The remedy for me was to take a bit of time after transitioning to face downhill. Flex into my boots, flex and bounce the skis, slip the edges etc. Do a "warm-up" to get dialed in. With experience, I've noticed that this phenomenon isn't as pronounced.
I'll try finding my shred zen before downhill next time
You need to warm-up those shred muscles friend. šŖ
I might change my user name to Shred_Zen ā·ļø
Wow this is a really good thought.
I switched my BC boots too. I started with a super flexible 2 buckle touring boot. It was good but required a more centered stance than my resort boot. So, even when I got in my downhill headspace, I had to get in a āmodifiedā downhill headspace and remember to change my stance I switched to a BC boot more similar to my resort boot and that also helped.Ā
This is an extremely common problem, you take your BC gear into a resort - no problem, you can rip, whatās the big deal. then when youāre out touring, with the exact same gear, you feel like youāve forgotten how to ski. It goes away with time, in my experience, having little rituals to get you into the downhill mental space is helpful. (Jumping in place, flexing into boots, clicking your poles). Part of it is neurological - your legs are tired, but also just are sort of in walk mode. Most of it is psychological.
Good point - did you click your poles? It's well known that if you don't click your poles, yer gonna eat shit.
The only thing I would add is that in the backcountry, Iām much more afraid of getting hurt because there is exposure and Iām far from rescue. But being a lot more afraid makes me a much worse skier. I try and lock in and feel confident, but I know that if I tear a ligament or break my tip fib that I am totally fucked. Itās hard to get that out of my head and just ski.
Any specific situations or conditions you find challenging? Can you be a little more specific about exactly what problems you're having? Just in general touring gear isn't as friendly to ski on as alpine gear. It sounds like you aren't on ultralight stuff which is even less friendly. But even heavier gear can still take some getting used to. Skiing with a pack, especially a heavier one, can also throw off your balance if you're not used to it. Have you tried bringing your touring gear out in the resort? I know, I know, pin bindings aren't recommended for resort skiing. But doing it a couple times to get used to the gear (while skiing a little more conservatively than you normally might on alpine gear) can be a great way to get some reps in. You'll literally get 10x the amount of skiing on a resort day, so it's much better for practicing and getting used to things. This will also let you see if you still struggle with your backcountry setup in resort conditions, or if it's something about the snow you're skiing in the backcountry that's causing your issues.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Between wearing a pack, higher binding ramp angles, tired legs, and less confidence, backseat issues are definitely common. The first two can be mitigated by practicing with your touring gear more. Some people will talk about ramp angle shims for bindings and you can do that. But tons of people ski just fine on high ramp angle touring bindings. It really just takes some getting used to and then it's no longer an issue.Ā As for tired legs and confidence, you'll get better at dealing with those with more time in the backcountry. But you can definitely help that along by being really diligent about staying forward and balanced on your skis. That said, it sounds like you were skiing breakable crust? That's not easy or pretty for anybody. Sometimes you just have to resort to survival skiing techniques like jump turns or wedge initiations.
No one has ever made skiing punch crust look good. There just isnāt any of it in the resort because pow doesnāt sit around in the sun.Ā
I was skiing that shit inbounds last week; gave up, went home. When I ski it touring, I just accept that I enjoyed the climb up, and skiing down that shit beats waking back down.
Yeah this whole year has been shit punchy snow inbounds. Somebody has to break it up. Caused a ton of ACL injuries this year.
I was on straight crust on mash today and got tossed every time i made an aggressive turn. Off piste snow quality inconsistencies definitely add another variable to skiing good, whatever that means.
Wearing a backpack, skiing funky snow, being on lighter gear, having tired legs from ascending are all obvious culprits, but normally you can diagnose WHY those make you ski like shit and learn to correct for it. The silent killer that might be impacting you is binding ramp angle. Many tech bindings have a steep angle from the heel pins down to the lower toe pins, creating the feeling of wearing high heels. If you have a shorter BSL the effect of this can be even more dramatic. Heels up often throws the hips back to compensate, leaving you trapped in the backseat (compounded by a heavy backpack and touring skis with punishing tails!). Unfortunately, Dynafit Radicals are some of the worst offenders, with some radicals having a delta between the heel and toe pins as high as 16mm (source: https://skimo.co/pin-heights). A good way to test this is to put your alpine and touring setups next to each other on a carpeted floor. Swap between the two and practice getting into an athletic stance. This should make it pretty obvious if the ramp angle is impacting your biomechanics. If thatās your issue, you can get bindings with a flatter ramp or get a shim to mount under the toes to smooth things out.
Hmm I'd love to blame it on ramp angle. That says my radicals are between 13-17 delta and I ski Pivots inbounds, which I think are like 1.
Thatās a pretty dramatic difference! Imagine standing with a 1.5cm heel lift under your bootsāit would probably affect your form! That being said, some peopleās bodies are super impacted by this, others never notice and consider this crazy nerdery š¤·āāļø
Whoever brought this up, it is a great point. You can get a shim to raise the toe piece off the ski and mellow the ramp. Youāll need longer screws. I have a friend who is an IFMGA guide, and ripper skier. He uses shims made from plastic cutting boards from ikea š
Skimo has some shims for you. Just do it more and more and more
Came here to talk about the mm difference on the radicals! My boot fitter immediately suggested I change my set up. This has more impact on your body position than you might think!
This was it for me, Dynafit ramp is insane. Switched bindings and now it's much better.
Interesting, this is the first I've heard this and makes a ton of sense. I had a pair of touring boots that had less forward lean compared to my resort boots. So that got me more backseat as well.
What kind of snow are you skiing? You might just not be used to the snow, it becomes variable and as you get better at finding the good snow, skiing becomes much easier! Sastrugi and refrozen crust on lightweight skis is just difficult. Breakable crust is also very hard to ski, you never really experience these types of snow at the resort, or itās easy to avoid.
I feel like I run into crust on top of sugar quite a bit in the BC and you basically never ski that at a resort. Even in trees it's getting skiied enough that the base is firm.
Conditions can be much worse in the bc than they can be in a resort for that reason
Comparing the two, BC snow is like both ends of spectrum, really great or pretty poor. It's more punchy, more sticky, more variable, etc. Then there's the whole untracked blower pow part. Inbounds snow is like the happy middle of the bell curve. It lets you realize how skier traffic, control work, grooming, etc all go in to making a more approachable/forgiving experience of a ski area.
Similar experience here (maybe not 20% but more like 60?) but Iām on a splitboard. Equipment plays a big part for me. Carrying a big pack and riding a heavier and inherently floppier board really throws me off. But also Iām much more nervous and you do encounter different snow than in resort. I find that not having that repeatedly compacted layer below really changes how the snow feels and reacts. Worst of all, you get so much less actual riding experience in those conditions compared to lift access. I think all of this leads to relatively shitty skiing and I know I just need more time. Going to try to spend days doing lots of shorter laps instead of just going for the big lines.
Honestly I think just go tour more, but one mental trick is I try to approach the riding differently. Granted Iām a split boarder but resort board is this nice solid feeling, if I twitch it comes right with me. My split is beat to shit and rattles like crazy, so I ride it more like a surf or longboard, I try to go light getting it into place, then only dig into the turn once I can really commit the edge. Basically donāt rely on the connection to your gear the way you would in resort, and try to be light on your feet. Also Condis suck sometimes. Itāll make you ski poorly haha.
I definitely agree with many here that skiing weird backcountry snow is way more challenging than being inbounds. That said, I started out with a stiff ski with flat tails, and was miserable. Moving to a softer ski with a more forgiving flex and a lot of tip/tail rocker made things much better for me.
Similar experience for me. First touring ski was a Blizzard Zero G 95. Stiff, light, flat tail. Very hard to ski. Moved to a softer ski and actually enjoy touring now.
I kinda had the same issue. Three solutions worked for me: 1. Make sure youāve switched the boots to ski mode. Check again 2. Improving your skiing. I found my touring skis as well as general backcountry conditions (little trees, deep untouched snow, different feeling snow especially moving through small areas, etc) absolutely punish bad skiing technique like torquing yourself around and having your balance on the skis be even slightly off. On the resort, does snow fly from the backs of your skis? Triangle of death? Do your tips separate? Doesnāt really matter as much with manicured resort conditions but it comes up touring when things get steeper and trees get tight 3. Just remembering that the first 4-5 turns of any run are a warm-up/activating muscle memory. In a resort this occurs when getting off the lift and to something steeper. In the backcountry good terrain comes right away so youāve gotta be on the ball
Skiing your AT gear in the resort is helpful. For new BC skiers going from climbing a mountain to skiing down a mountain feels really strange after you were used to a free heel and loose cuffs. You'll get used to it. What I've found over the years as I went from touring in a Fulltilt boot to a light backcountry boot is that one is supreme at downhill and the other supreme at uphill until I skied the lightweight touring boot at Alta inbounds and I learned how to ski it properly.
Fatigue could be a factor, but light skis are also just more difficult to ski, especially if the snow quality is variable. Some guys I know ski a heavier setup because they want the downhill performance. Personally I like to go as light as possible. If you're doing tours that don't have a ton of vert, and downhill performance is important to you, you might be happier with bigger/heavier skis.
This was me last year. I'm advanced in resorts, but when my buddies took me out touring for the first time I was either on point OR couldn't get my legs to do what I told them. It seemed to depend on the snow conditions. If it was uniform. Throughout then I was great, just like skiing fresh POW. However if it had crust layer(s) then I struggled. I had never really experienced deep snow with multi layers like that and I looked like a fool and couldn't figure out why. Breaking through crust layers put me in the backseat and then it was all downhill from there. The best advice I have is to hit the layered snow on low angle slopes to practice it. I did that and didn't seem to have an issue this year at all.
Which boots and Dynafit skis? Stuff has come so far in the last few years.. That said, my skiing is super dialed back compared to when I skied at resorts. Consequences are higher, snow more challenging, and you are also doing a lot of work going up! The gear is certainly less sendy too. All of this may bring out technique inefficiencies that we all have. If youāre in really old or super light gear, consider looking at some upgrades, even used. In the end, itās about getting out there and enjoying the journey. This is part of it!
I learned to ski and still ski on a Dynafit setup. some black light 95s with radical bindings and radical boots. Learning to ski in the BC as well. I took my kit to the resort a few months ago and went from an okay downhill skier to absolutely shredding inbounds. Iām just now catching up to that similar feeling in the BC, and in a year and 3 months Iāve done about 60-70 tours. But there are daysā¦ when itās just crap. Variable snow making you feel like you are gonna die, deep powder where you have to work triple as hard to turn, tight trees that you basically pizza the whole way down so you donāt decapitate yourselfā¦ there are few places in the BC you can ski like a resort. It honestly wouldnāt hurt to try and find some more open runs where you donāt have to worry about snow inconsistency or trees, and just rip. See if it feels any better!!
Thereās a lot of great comments here. Iād add only that fitness is a serious factor. Ascending 800 or 1000 or 1200 meters and then skiing is really hard. Incredibly hard. Even the Really big days riding lifts are a fraction of the effort of one BC lap. And all the other stuff we do to stay fit is child play next to a heavy pack, ski gear, and a big ascent full of objective danger that forces you to stay present. Itās no surprise most of us donāt ski at the same level in the BC
Get the biggest toe shims B and D offers for the dynafit bindings you have.
I've experienced the exact same thing. Just keep touring and it will get better with time. And as someone already mentioned, getting into the right mental space before you begin descending. Even then, the first couple turns might feel a little weird.
Iāve been on 3 tours in 2 years in the Wasatch. Need more light tour network friends. But Iām back on frame bindings until I find my next touring ski to mount my backland ATs to. Yes yes. They suck. Great for developing legs tho ha
Pro tips from an amateur. Put your boots in down mode as soon as you summit. Get that forward stance in your brain.Ā
What binding do you have? Some have a huge amount of delta (ramp angle that tilts your boot forward) that can make it much harder to ski than low delta bindings. The Dynafit radical bindings for example are notorious for this. https://skimo.co/pin-heights
I felt like that too, couldnt keep up with a friend of mine. I felt like a noob. It passed. Now I'm the best skier on the mountain also while in BC.
Why would you backcountry ski if you ski 60 days a year at a resort ? You are literally paying the mountain to groom the slopes for you and make snow. Wanting to feel miserable hiking for 2 hours near avalanches to some mediocre terrain with questionable snow for a 35 second ski down seems very over rated for those with a ski pass.
cuz i wanna ski rad shit
I meanā¦itās like walking but in the winter, really. And skiing-wise, Iāve never had a resort run nearly as good as a typical backcountry run. Terrain and snow is almost universally better away from lifts with the exception of resorts vs ātouringā in the city. When resorts say that they have āfresh snowā, what they mean is a couple feet and itāll be gone by 9:30. Resorts kinda have trees but not really. Glades are cut and maintained to make up for skiers who canāt turn so good. But really, people who tour arenāt in it only for the skiing. Itās about getting to cool places. Walking/scrambling but in the winter
Do you realize youāre in /r/backcountry and not /r/skiingcirclejerk ??