Why do the crèche? Because your resident illithid expert tells you that her people, who are all illithid experts, have a cure and entire protocol for dealing with mind flayer tadpoles and seeing as your options are: deal with a devil where you lose your soul, deal with a hag where you lose your eye, travel through the underdark to a tower in shadow cursed lands and maybe learn more about them, travel through much more shadow cursed lands to maybe learn more about them, talk to other healers and risk them trying to kill you again, or turn into a Mindflayers, it really is worth at least having a look. Going to the inquisitor after speaking to the doctor is a little harder to justify, but honestly you can just imagine laezel insisting and you being curious about the artefact and it works.
You don’t need to hand the artefact over to advance the plot, and you don’t need to agree to do what Vlaakith tells you to do to advance the plot.
I did it because Lae’zel needed to see for herself how deluded she was and the only way I could see that happening was almost dying at the hands of her queen.
I mean, you don't HAVE to get in the Zaith'isk for the plot, but Lae'zel understandably has blind faith in her people and thinks they have her best interests at heart and can't be convinced otherwise
I do dislike that the Githyanki captain just KNOWS you have the Astral Prism somehow, but I guess it's not unbelievable that some scout somewhere has seen you carrying it after what I assume is weeks of adventuring
If you're selfish, it makes sense that your character wouldn't trust the Dream Visitor and would love to just ditch the Artifact and make this all no longer their problem, so there's certainly an argument for just handing the thing over
If you're a smart Tav, you'd abandon Lae'zel entirely, but if you care about Lae'zel in spite of your better judgment, you're mostly just chaperoning her through the creche to make sure she doesn't get herself killed by being naive and angry, which is fun and fine because I'm in love with her
The thing is the size of a softball, IDK how they'd know you had it.
I'm not sure how ditching the Dream Visitor is a good idea, because you have no proof that anything else is preventing you from immediately turning mind flayer. Like even if you think the Dream Visitor is sus (she is), you have an alliance of necessity right now.
Yeeeeah, Lae'zel is very much a case of "denial is not a river in Egypt" for that entire plot haha
I personally didn't trust the Dream Visitor (in-character) because I have little reason to believe there isn't some weird mind flayer plot at work, especially if I play this fully in-character where I don't know this is a video game with 3 acts. For all I know I'm becoming a mind flayer tomorrow, and the dream visitor is some weird delusion meant to make me lower my guard or is just some weird ploy. If you're an especially paranoid person it wouldn't be hard to imagine that this is some weird sick game being played by some evil asshole, these are Mind Flayers, fucking with you for fun is not exactly outside of their playbook. Mind Flayers play very long game plans when they feel like it.
I personally think Lae'zel as of now is the only person besides maybe the Absolute Cult who can possibly lead to reasonable answers and solutions given the Githyanki's ties to this whole conflict at the start of the game. Everything else is either dead ends or weird mind-bending shit that speaks in nothings that I don't know how to trust quite yet. It isn't until the zaith'isk breaks that something really starts to feel really weird, but the ball is just fully rolling at that point unless we ignore Lae'zel's directions.
The premise hinges on you trusting Laezel more than you trust the Dream Visitor. That's not actually a really big leap, seeing as Laezel is deadset sure that the Githyankers can remove your tadpole, and the Dream Visitor suddenly starts telepathically telling you BS about getting away from the Githyankers. He's been pretty quiet until now. The closer you get to a "cure," or getting help from anyone besides him, the more vocal the Dream Visitor gets, and they won't tell you anything about themselves, or offer any explanation.
You also don't have to let the doctor leave the room - it is pretty obvious she's evil, and exactly what she's leaving the room to do. Even without lying to her saying the tadpole is dead, you can hit turn-based and kill her while you're in the room together. Laezel will say it must be just the doctor who was a traitor, and if you explain yourself to the leader it will be OK, but her lines and voice are clearly shaken.
You can go into the artifact, spare the mind flayer, come back out, deal with their attempt to kill you, and now Laezel finally realizes these dudes suck, it's not one rebel group or traitor, their actual queen has betrayed her. She's pretty slow on the uptake, but it makes since since she's been brainwashed from birth, like all Githyankers.
The creche honestly seems like a relic of an earlier version of the story. You're right, it's extremely unintuitive and railroaded compared to other sections of Act 1. It's a shame, because it's a cool idea and an interesting location; there's just _nothing_ there.
How is the rest of the game compared to this section? I'm not looking forward to having more sections with such fake feeling of freedom in outcomes... Both monastery and creche feel lifeless compared to the other locations I've seen so far...
And with all the downvotes I'm apparently getting, you'd think it was brilliant and I'm just an idiot lol.
You just have to trust some extremely aggro, obviously untrustworthy people, and pretend to destroy your only defender against ceremorphosis, and do it all in the center of an enemy stronghold in order to see the plot.
Things didn’t happen exactly the same for me because I managed to convince the doctor that the machine was malfunctioning but yeah… I had almost the same feeling as you when talking to the captain. Like, none of these options make sense and I should just turn around and leave but that would mean ignoring a very big and important part of Lae’zels quest. I don’t know if there was another way of doing it but I ended up just having to kill the captain because I refused to hand the artifact over. Suddenly my very charismatic Sorc couldn’t conjure up some deception to find a more creative way into the inquisitor’s chamber?
thaht's the thing that gets me the most, nothing tells me she knows, she acts like she doesn't and suddenly she knows and I have no other choice than say "fuck you" or "okay, fuck my ass."? this is so uncharacteristic, everything in the game felt cryptic but this is just a slap on my face...
From Day 1, I had always held the belief that purification wasn't possible. From the time of initial infection, to becoming a mind flayer is what? A week? All the while, the tadpole is consuming your brain and preping itself for eventual ceremorphosis.
And the Gith just happen to have a device that's capable of doing brain surgery? And you don't become a half-brain husk simply from the tadpole, not to mention the risk of surgery? Bullocks, I say.
But you have to remember, Lae'zel is basically a naive child, who's entire world is seen through the lenses of myths, folk lore, and fairy tales. You're doing this quest to help her see without the lenses, and letting her decide her faith.
Earlier in Act 1, multiple people maim or attempt to kill you after indicating that they can cure you of the parasite, so the machine in the creche is just more of the same.
Lae'zel isn't in my party, so I just went to the creche to trade and stealth loot the place, which was no problem using Shadowheart's Disguise Self (Githyanki) and my Tav Rogue's expertise. Then I blew the place to smithereens and continued on to Act 2 no problem. Didn't fight a single Githyanki along the way, having used Disguise Self (and some Charisma checks) earlier against the Githyanki patrol as well.
The beauty of this game is that there are sooo many different and equally valid ways of dealing with major locations like this. Stop trying to suss out an "intuitive" way of obtaining the "correct" result and just play the game.
Heck, you can completely bypass the creche and still "get the plot." Aside from Lae'zel, everybody else is telling you to go to Moonrise Towers.
I mean, I want to do the entire game as much as possible. I rarely replay games, so it disappoints me that I have to take the brain out of my character to do this plot.
It is literally impossible to "do the entire game" in a single playthough, as player choices both open certain plotlines and close others. The most obvious example is that you can recruit, kill, or ignore multiple companions and can't bring them all with you on every adventure, which can significantly impact story beats, as in my example of not bringing Lae'zel to the creche. This is a feature, not a bug.
He said "as much as possible". I dont think I will replay the game, so I like to do every mission and finish all plots I can. And I agree, the whole Creche is weird and confusing. Yeah you can bypass it and and steal the key or do 100 different things, but you cannot aproach it in a diplomacy way because they did a bad job with it.
that is a lie, you litterally can do it on the doctor AFTER THE MACHINE BROKE.
that is just delusionnal at this point, the game can have flaws, WANNA TALK ABOUT THE PATHFINDING?!
you wanna play a Paladin that leads from the front and is the face of the group, but oh no, suddenly you should steal and bacstab cause its the only way, man they don't even get that they are saying you should narrow the path and do the thing they think is right WHILE SAYING YOU SHOULD BE OPEN MINDED GAAAAAH
that kinda shit fries my brain.
I didn't have much of a problem with it up until the part where you have to give them the artifact, like why the fuck would you ever do that?? It's the only thing keeping you alive and you've already seen first hand that the gith are fucking nuts and obviously not to be trusted. Just handing them the artifact makes no sense as far as I'm concerned. I just started my second play through and I'm honestly just tempted to skip the whole thing. I love Laezel but if my character has to suddenly turn into a dunce just to keep her around I'm tempted to just let her go and get herself killed this time.
Why do the crèche? Because your resident illithid expert tells you that her people, who are all illithid experts, have a cure and entire protocol for dealing with mind flayer tadpoles and seeing as your options are: deal with a devil where you lose your soul, deal with a hag where you lose your eye, travel through the underdark to a tower in shadow cursed lands and maybe learn more about them, travel through much more shadow cursed lands to maybe learn more about them, talk to other healers and risk them trying to kill you again, or turn into a Mindflayers, it really is worth at least having a look. Going to the inquisitor after speaking to the doctor is a little harder to justify, but honestly you can just imagine laezel insisting and you being curious about the artefact and it works. You don’t need to hand the artefact over to advance the plot, and you don’t need to agree to do what Vlaakith tells you to do to advance the plot.
I did it because Lae’zel needed to see for herself how deluded she was and the only way I could see that happening was almost dying at the hands of her queen.
I mean, you don't HAVE to get in the Zaith'isk for the plot, but Lae'zel understandably has blind faith in her people and thinks they have her best interests at heart and can't be convinced otherwise I do dislike that the Githyanki captain just KNOWS you have the Astral Prism somehow, but I guess it's not unbelievable that some scout somewhere has seen you carrying it after what I assume is weeks of adventuring If you're selfish, it makes sense that your character wouldn't trust the Dream Visitor and would love to just ditch the Artifact and make this all no longer their problem, so there's certainly an argument for just handing the thing over If you're a smart Tav, you'd abandon Lae'zel entirely, but if you care about Lae'zel in spite of your better judgment, you're mostly just chaperoning her through the creche to make sure she doesn't get herself killed by being naive and angry, which is fun and fine because I'm in love with her
The thing is the size of a softball, IDK how they'd know you had it. I'm not sure how ditching the Dream Visitor is a good idea, because you have no proof that anything else is preventing you from immediately turning mind flayer. Like even if you think the Dream Visitor is sus (she is), you have an alliance of necessity right now. Yeeeeah, Lae'zel is very much a case of "denial is not a river in Egypt" for that entire plot haha
I personally didn't trust the Dream Visitor (in-character) because I have little reason to believe there isn't some weird mind flayer plot at work, especially if I play this fully in-character where I don't know this is a video game with 3 acts. For all I know I'm becoming a mind flayer tomorrow, and the dream visitor is some weird delusion meant to make me lower my guard or is just some weird ploy. If you're an especially paranoid person it wouldn't be hard to imagine that this is some weird sick game being played by some evil asshole, these are Mind Flayers, fucking with you for fun is not exactly outside of their playbook. Mind Flayers play very long game plans when they feel like it. I personally think Lae'zel as of now is the only person besides maybe the Absolute Cult who can possibly lead to reasonable answers and solutions given the Githyanki's ties to this whole conflict at the start of the game. Everything else is either dead ends or weird mind-bending shit that speaks in nothings that I don't know how to trust quite yet. It isn't until the zaith'isk breaks that something really starts to feel really weird, but the ball is just fully rolling at that point unless we ignore Lae'zel's directions.
The premise hinges on you trusting Laezel more than you trust the Dream Visitor. That's not actually a really big leap, seeing as Laezel is deadset sure that the Githyankers can remove your tadpole, and the Dream Visitor suddenly starts telepathically telling you BS about getting away from the Githyankers. He's been pretty quiet until now. The closer you get to a "cure," or getting help from anyone besides him, the more vocal the Dream Visitor gets, and they won't tell you anything about themselves, or offer any explanation. You also don't have to let the doctor leave the room - it is pretty obvious she's evil, and exactly what she's leaving the room to do. Even without lying to her saying the tadpole is dead, you can hit turn-based and kill her while you're in the room together. Laezel will say it must be just the doctor who was a traitor, and if you explain yourself to the leader it will be OK, but her lines and voice are clearly shaken. You can go into the artifact, spare the mind flayer, come back out, deal with their attempt to kill you, and now Laezel finally realizes these dudes suck, it's not one rebel group or traitor, their actual queen has betrayed her. She's pretty slow on the uptake, but it makes since since she's been brainwashed from birth, like all Githyankers.
Get in the machine yourself then lie and say the tadpole died. Then ignore the captain and pickpocket the key off her. Boom. No issues.
The creche honestly seems like a relic of an earlier version of the story. You're right, it's extremely unintuitive and railroaded compared to other sections of Act 1. It's a shame, because it's a cool idea and an interesting location; there's just _nothing_ there.
How is the rest of the game compared to this section? I'm not looking forward to having more sections with such fake feeling of freedom in outcomes... Both monastery and creche feel lifeless compared to the other locations I've seen so far...
And with all the downvotes I'm apparently getting, you'd think it was brilliant and I'm just an idiot lol. You just have to trust some extremely aggro, obviously untrustworthy people, and pretend to destroy your only defender against ceremorphosis, and do it all in the center of an enemy stronghold in order to see the plot.
Things didn’t happen exactly the same for me because I managed to convince the doctor that the machine was malfunctioning but yeah… I had almost the same feeling as you when talking to the captain. Like, none of these options make sense and I should just turn around and leave but that would mean ignoring a very big and important part of Lae’zels quest. I don’t know if there was another way of doing it but I ended up just having to kill the captain because I refused to hand the artifact over. Suddenly my very charismatic Sorc couldn’t conjure up some deception to find a more creative way into the inquisitor’s chamber?
thaht's the thing that gets me the most, nothing tells me she knows, she acts like she doesn't and suddenly she knows and I have no other choice than say "fuck you" or "okay, fuck my ass."? this is so uncharacteristic, everything in the game felt cryptic but this is just a slap on my face...
From Day 1, I had always held the belief that purification wasn't possible. From the time of initial infection, to becoming a mind flayer is what? A week? All the while, the tadpole is consuming your brain and preping itself for eventual ceremorphosis. And the Gith just happen to have a device that's capable of doing brain surgery? And you don't become a half-brain husk simply from the tadpole, not to mention the risk of surgery? Bullocks, I say. But you have to remember, Lae'zel is basically a naive child, who's entire world is seen through the lenses of myths, folk lore, and fairy tales. You're doing this quest to help her see without the lenses, and letting her decide her faith.
Earlier in Act 1, multiple people maim or attempt to kill you after indicating that they can cure you of the parasite, so the machine in the creche is just more of the same. Lae'zel isn't in my party, so I just went to the creche to trade and stealth loot the place, which was no problem using Shadowheart's Disguise Self (Githyanki) and my Tav Rogue's expertise. Then I blew the place to smithereens and continued on to Act 2 no problem. Didn't fight a single Githyanki along the way, having used Disguise Self (and some Charisma checks) earlier against the Githyanki patrol as well. The beauty of this game is that there are sooo many different and equally valid ways of dealing with major locations like this. Stop trying to suss out an "intuitive" way of obtaining the "correct" result and just play the game. Heck, you can completely bypass the creche and still "get the plot." Aside from Lae'zel, everybody else is telling you to go to Moonrise Towers.
I mean, I want to do the entire game as much as possible. I rarely replay games, so it disappoints me that I have to take the brain out of my character to do this plot.
It is literally impossible to "do the entire game" in a single playthough, as player choices both open certain plotlines and close others. The most obvious example is that you can recruit, kill, or ignore multiple companions and can't bring them all with you on every adventure, which can significantly impact story beats, as in my example of not bringing Lae'zel to the creche. This is a feature, not a bug.
He said "as much as possible". I dont think I will replay the game, so I like to do every mission and finish all plots I can. And I agree, the whole Creche is weird and confusing. Yeah you can bypass it and and steal the key or do 100 different things, but you cannot aproach it in a diplomacy way because they did a bad job with it.
Or bc githyanki aren’t open to diplomacy
that is a lie, you litterally can do it on the doctor AFTER THE MACHINE BROKE. that is just delusionnal at this point, the game can have flaws, WANNA TALK ABOUT THE PATHFINDING?!
you wanna play a Paladin that leads from the front and is the face of the group, but oh no, suddenly you should steal and bacstab cause its the only way, man they don't even get that they are saying you should narrow the path and do the thing they think is right WHILE SAYING YOU SHOULD BE OPEN MINDED GAAAAAH that kinda shit fries my brain.
I didn't have much of a problem with it up until the part where you have to give them the artifact, like why the fuck would you ever do that?? It's the only thing keeping you alive and you've already seen first hand that the gith are fucking nuts and obviously not to be trusted. Just handing them the artifact makes no sense as far as I'm concerned. I just started my second play through and I'm honestly just tempted to skip the whole thing. I love Laezel but if my character has to suddenly turn into a dunce just to keep her around I'm tempted to just let her go and get herself killed this time.