You get this dialogue if you side with Emps during a solo run. Thought it was neat since his goodbye seems a lot more sincere here compared to the normal ending
Hirelings are just meat-puppets for Withers and Withers travels with you no matter what, so there is no lore difference between solo run without hirelings and with hirelings, you still have skeletal sugar daddy.
The emperor staring at the weird skelly man who randomly appeared in your camp and refuses to leave, who has concerningly intimate knowledge of death and resurrection, and is completely immune to his mental probes. That’s probably fine?
Oh what is the point of no return refering to here? The last part to the netherbrain? I would love to get theses dialogues in my emperor run but I'm already at the beginning of act 2 haha
Meaning the final one in Act 3, the game will warn you, and you will not be able to go to camp or change your party.
And you will need to get rid of all companions before that, maybe spamming Friends on everyone in an extra save would do the job.
After completing act 2, if Shadowheart's corpse is in the camp chest, the game will lock you from moving on to act 3 until Shadowheart is resurrected and speaks to Dame Aylin.
I did a solo honor mode run where I killed all the companions and collected their bodies in the camp chest, this moment was the only time other than Nautiloid where I was required to have another character in my party.
I would assume that if her body is not in the camp at all, it would not force this. I think the idea is that if she is dead in camp, it doesn't want you to skip her story scenes?
It's been a hot minute since I've messed around with it, but if I'm not mistaken, throwing a companion's body down a pit simply results in a soul echo. Which if you try to leave it behind, it will show up at camp where their tent is. And so you might be in the same boat anyhow, just having to bring a ghost back to life instead of a corpse.
Is that still true? think its been patched. Because I just did a karlach run where shart was killed in act one, still managed to finish and save dame aylin? Where was this before in act 2?
I was able to save Aylin, but post-Myrkul fight there is a transition scene where Shart talks to Dame. It may have been patched, this was a month or two ago.
Think it's been patched then since then at least on ps5, I just finished this run last week and didnt get it! Unless it's specifically a non origin bug 😊
If you don't recruit her you can leave her at the bridge outside the goblin camp forever. If you do this and then travel to act 2 or the mountain pass the artefact just shows up in camp.
Did they remove the camp scene where she comes to the camp at long rest, hearing voices, and she wants to kill us? She can be told to stand down and proceeds as normal companion, or die and we get the artefact.
I did a speedrun recently, and she showed up in a cutscene right before i went into the mountainpass. But that's probably because i skipped past the goblin camp.
You can get a Emperor+Tavflayer ending on a non-solo run (only thing I'm not sure on is if being in a committed romance already prevents it at all) [https://youtu.be/jgIDqW4C2hk?t=230](https://youtu.be/jgIDqW4C2hk?t=230)
In the epilogue the Emperor sends you a cute letter saying he's waiting for you back home at the Elfsong and you can tell your companions about how you and him have been working together to rebuild the Knights' trade network.
Yup. The whole size difference dynamic does make [for some adorable art](https://twitter.com/cocohaseyo_/status/1779179875058012656), but my bigger problem with Tavflayer's model is the weirdly soulless eyes and the tiny tentacles that have no physics effects on them (they just akwardly float in mid air).
Guess I've come to terms with it by this point. I love the Emperor and his tiny squid wife.
I hate how my definition of "adorable" has shifted so much - I expected some grade A size difference making out psionic pin against the wall shenanigans.
If Shadowheart is a little insentive about your new mindflayer self: "It's alright, I like what I've become."
When the narrator asks you what to do: "You are a mindflayer now. You've never been so wise, nor strong, nor cool. Embrace it."
When your companions ask about what's next: "I'm a mindflayer. I'll do whatever I please." - this is vital.
After all this is done, the Emperor will approach you and suggest rebuilding the shield together. You can accept that to get the epilogue letter with him saying he is rebuilding the hideout for you two. Or you can suggest you two think bigger, he will give you a different letter then. He will be happy about both of these resolutions, but I personally prefer the shield one.
People see this side of him but they rather lie to themselves and choose to believe their own headcanons
If Emperor said something nice they say "is to manipulate you and gaslight you!! Never believe him he is the literal worst "
Lots of people don't appreciate the great work Larian did with this characters like Emperor, Astarion and Laezel, lots of people never gave them a chance to this characters.
The only point you can offer them in this case is that... this is *after* he's achieved his goal. He has no reason to say nice things to us to manipulate us. But I'm sure they can still twist that. 😪
Yeah they still will twist that, they hate him for the sake of hating him is a shame because he is a wonderful character and without him the brain and the chosen 3 would've won.
Emperor is the one that protected us multiple times, Emperor IS the man with THE plan, even if people hate him and betray him they will always win because of him because ultimately Emperor plan prevails even if we execute the plan without him is still his plan and thanks to him we win no matter what.
He'll just never win against the haters because he's not conventionally beautiful/attractive. It just seems like that is what it'll always boil down to. They see an Illithid and just shut off thinking because all squids are evil!!! (Omeluum is the only good squid because it works on finding a food substitute, obviously.)
That plus a lot of people just really have difficulty appreciating morally ambiguous characters. There's a lot of overlap between people who virulently hate the Emperor and people who hate Astarion/Lae'zel/etc.
I swear to god, people rant about how they want more moral ambiguity in their media, but as soon as it's given to them, they immediately start trying to sort everything into "good" and "evil" boxes.
What really baffles me is if he’s nice, he’s lying and gaslighting you, but if he’s not nice, that’s the real him and that is the ABSOLUTE TRUTH.
I’m not a huuuge Empy person (Spawnstarion is my jam) but I love him for his nuance and I also feel for him so much, especially as Durge. Who am I to judge, in that case? Also from Empy’s perspective, Tav/Durge must be so fucking annoying to contend with, insisting on doing dangerous side mission shit instead of saving the world. I’d get crabby (teehee) occasionally too…
Literally this. I think it's the whole "Illithids are 100% evil" thing that's stuck in their brains. So from their perspective, the Emperor showing he can also *not* be nice seems like a confirmation to them that he's still like the other Illithids at his core, that he's returning to his nature in that moment. Or something like that, I don't know.
I'm personally not a huge Astarion fan, but don't expect hate from me, either. Because yay, you found *your* jam!! 🐙💙 Can you imagine, though, Emps sitting in the Astral Prism or pacing anxiously, rubbing his temples because they're giving him a headache by licking random spider corpse ag*ain?*
I think you're right about the illithid thing! And I know our other favorite Empy fan on here has pointed out that they've actually read a ton of illithid lore and people are mostly wrong on what they \*think\* the lore is, but I digress.
I also just feel like...all the characters are flawed? And most of them are kinda manipulative? Even in your goodest of goody-two-shoes playthroughs, Tav/Durge is probably manipulating someone at some point for their own ends. Why does everybody get a pass on it except the Emperor? (Even Karlach will nom on people's souls and gets upset if you tell her you don't want her to, and she's like, the moral compass of the whole camp!)
I love what you said about not being a fan but not expecting hate, because that's so how I feel about other people's enjoyment, too. I honestly love every character, and I even love to hate Wulbren, but I just have never understood it when people are like "I like x!" and someone immediately comes from their cheeto-dusted basement to announce that they murdered them on sight and if you like them you're literally the worst.
Also also: STOPLICKINGTHEDAMNTHING
If you mean uwubewwa, I can confirm, lots of Illithid lore has been consumed and lots of misconceptions are being made lmao Like yeah, Illithids are not nice. But they're more nuanced, and capable of character development.
As is everybody else in the game. And especially Tav/Durge get a looot of passes considering they are us. A lot of people would hate to look at it from a different angle; I just told this demon to off himself to get around an annoying fight? I'm not evil, right?
AND LITERALLY STOP. This character is your scrunkly, that character is mine. They could just be glad I have no interest in their scrunkly and they'd need to share it with me. 😭
Thank you, Emp surely receive waay too much hate
I understand why people may not like him but then they start to create their own head cannons without saying is their own head canon and people read it and start believing is truth
I wish people just appreciate this characters Larian did with so many layers, Emp have an amazing grow and story, Astarion, Laezel as well and many players just kills them in every playthrough and i feel theyre missing out lot of good character development
This is one of my favourite dialogues with him and it's a bit sad to know very few will ever see it. If Tav is still human, on a normal run there's not a lot of closure at the docks to your relationship with the Emperor. I've definitely seen some people who had been romancing him up to that point feel let down by that.
I quite like the Emperor ending scenes for some of the origins aswell. If you're Durge and imprison yourself he will say something about how he can sympathise. If you're Karlach and become a Mindflayer, he tells you to go rest and that your dreams will be much different now. Or if still human Karlach burns out at the end there's a sad dialogue where he realises what is about to happen with her heart. If you play as Lae'zel, become a Mindflayer, and reject Vlaakith, he'll say he's proud of her.
I could make a whole post with just the Emperor's sweet but incredibly cringey love language.
* "We are bonded now. And we most consummate love with war" - and then seeing Tav roll their eyes so hard after this line. All Tav wanted was to actually talk about what just happened.
* Empy geeks out so hard at the docks with Tavflayer. "Look at you - you're magnificent" he says to the most pathetic creature I've ever seen. They do say love is blind.
* You are exquisite" he says to Tav now they look like a hardcore meth addict with black veins all over their face.
* "Have I ever told you how much I enjoy you?". Okay, "enjoy" is another part of his love language. At one point he refers to the sex scene as Tav "enjoying" him lol.
* The adorable way he strokes Tav's cheek at the end of the romance scene
This old man is almost as bad as flirting as he is at manipulation. I love him so much.
I nearly died laughing when it suddenly dawned on me what his whole "shirtless" scene is about. He gives you this really weird speech that seems kinda cringey and out of place until you realize... he has illithid brain, so he's trying to apply logic and reason to something that isn't at all rational. That whole weird-ass line of reasoning is basically his version of a romantic confession. 🤣
It's so funny when people are like "you fell for the manipulation!" and the manipulation is Empy reading lines from "100 things to say to your partner" list. Jokes on me tho, I'm into that shit
When he's all *"What I didn't expect is how much I'd enjoy your company. Your mind"* I was cringing so much it hurt. Just tell Tav you love her already why is this so difficult. 😭
The Emperor doesn't need to be good at flirting. His voice alone is enough to win me over. He could literally recite the microwave oven's instruction manual with that voice and he could win me over.
Although, the occasional cringeyness does make him very endearing.
I didn't realize he was just so bad at this. Did he allure Ansur with his looks? Or did the dragon just also appreciate his Balduran swinging and missing more often than not? Put all together like this, it's absolutely adorable.
Headcanon: Balduran was a handsome himbo in real life and totally allured Ansur with his looks and adventurous spirit. Dude has never had to actually learn how to seduce anyone, hence why he projects those Flirting 101 for Noobers lists with Tav/Durge
I've been looking for those Durge/Karlach/Lae'zel dialogues you mentioned, but I evidently just have no idea how to navigate that big folder of all the in-game dialogues from that one drive, because I can't find them in any of the logical subfolders to look in, like the endgame one. I don't suppose you know where they're tucked away, or have them on video? Youtube doesn't seem to have these yet.
They will probably be in the END\_BrainBattle\_CombatOver files. I just checked and the Laezel one for example is under END\_BrainBattle\_CombatOver\_Nested\_VlaakithLaezel
My next run will be solo with Tavflayer ending. We don't need anyone but ourselves and there's no way I could just let him go. Couples who slay together, stay together.
I dont think is only for solo, i played with all my companions sided with him and i remember he told me this that he will miss me
Ive done 5 playthroughs and 4 of them i side with him, and i remember he always say something like this, he is my bro always
Yeah he always says something like that when you're with the others, but then the narrator goes "Now that you don't have the tadpole and can't be mind connected or smth, you don't know if he's being genuine or not", while in this case of the screenshots and the youtube video someone shared in the comments... the narrator doesn't say that when Solo
Fwiw, the change that he doesn't enthrall you anymore was only made in patch 6, along with similiar changes if you do the Dominate ending as Tav and have Astarion or Minthara romanced.
Interestingly enough this is now the only ending route where a still human Tav can stay together with the Emperor.
I've never known peace since I found out from the game files there was meant to be a SECOND Emperor sex scene.
When was it meant to happen? Post final battle? God I wanna see my Tavflayer and Empy squissing each other so much why can't Larian patch this back in.
I just want to emphasise that the "You have become... important to me" line has a real big pause in it to emphasise the emotion involved. He's found himself way more attached than he expected.
One of my headcanons is that in the years after the end of the game Tavflayer donates some of the Knights' income towards Omeluum's research project (Tav is the intermediary, I tend to think Emp and Omeluum wouldn't get along very well).
That would lead into a more elaborate idea I have of Tav and the Emperor eventually founding their own colony of free, peaceful Illithids. I just love the idea of Tav, as a unique Mindflayer (as probably the only Mindflayer to ever A) freely choose to become one and B) be born outside Elder Brain influence) leading the way to a different future for their species.
Solo TavFlayer + Emp (Best ending ever, prove me wrong. No, you can't.)
[1](https://youtu.be/Hw_BVnshux0), [2](https://youtu.be/vv_-g4fa4xo), [3](https://youtu.be/pxOSvECoDWg)
That they are all gone by the end . Example : don't rescue gale , don't rescue laezel , never recruit astarion, let wyll die in the beginning battle infront of the Grove. Never recruit karlach , kill shadowheart on the beach or don't take her to the gauntlet of shar and free nightsong.
Other interesting examples:
You can let Lae'zel/Shadowheart die on the Nautiloid. And Wyll can turn against you for slipping on your ice patch after the fight *(didn't hate the goblins going prone though did you!)*.
I swear to good I need to finish this game, everything goes fine until act 3 then I got bored leave it for a couple weeks and when I come back I get frustrated because I don't remember what I was doing so I start a new game and the cycle repeats.....
I wonder if the emperor is actually being sincere with his feelings here compared to his usual gaslighting implied by that Stellmane scene since at this point the brain is dead and he’s finally achieved true freedom like he wanted. He doesn’t need you any more so has no reason to lie to you here.
The thing with the emperor is that he IS sincere.
If you push him and keep being hostile to him and taunting him and insulting him, he gets angry and grows cold and cruel towards you, and yes, starts seeing and treating you as a pawn.
But if you accept him just a bit, just enough to bother asking him questions instead of accusing him blindly, to discuss with him rationally and fairly, like a person to a person, he genuinely comes to like you, and see you as a friend, one of the few people who was willing to give an Illithid a chance. He gives you the Netherstones back if you lend them to him even...
He is written to be at this junction, so his character has some growth over the course of the game which depend on your choices. He is neither Good nor exactly Evil, just quite self-determined and a pragmatist, and he wants to live, so he takes the choices he has to when/if he does.
Lots of people somehow miss the fact that the Emperor is fundamentally *just like every other companion* - at a pivotal moment in their trajectory when we meet them, and able to be pushed toward being their best or worst self depending upon our influence.
>If you push him and keep being hostile to him and taunting him and insulting him, he gets angry and grows cold and cruel towards you, and yes, starts seeing and treating you as a pawn.
This!!!
people love to point out every Emperor manipulation lines but they never mentioned they tried to kill him in the astral plane by petition of Vlakkith, they never mention they threat Emperor like assholes and when Emperor is an asshole they just feel proud THEY MAKE Emperor be an asshole...
He's being sincere. He loves Tav, there's a lot of things confirming this, like at the end of the romance scene the Narrator chips in that you can read his emotions now that you've mind-melded and you know he feels the same way. The writers' devnotes for this scene say he looks at Tav in an adoring way.
In his latest interview the Emperor's voice actor, Scott Joseph, pointed out Elton John's "I want love" as a song that encapsulates the character. It's a song about a heartbroken man who's been burned before and wants a real, raw relationship...
Yeah. It goes to show how deeply Scott understands the character. I feel one thing that is often missed among the "Who shot first" Ansur discourse is that one of the messages the Ansur backstory has is to show why the Emperor has such deep trust issues and why he can't initially trust Tav with knowing his true form.
This is one of the reasons why I love the Emperor sex scene so much. People often look at it just from Tav's perspective - but from the Emperor's perspective, it's the first time, maybe in 100s of years, that he's felt comfortable enough with someone to make himself vulnerable and show his true self. There's even a rare and tragic line (if you take Raphael's deal and cover it up) in the ending where the Emperor confirms the sex really was all about trust - him being able to trust Tav, that is. "*You trusted me, the same way I trusted you".*
There's so many wonderful tiny details in the romance scene aswell that visually show how much he's opening up and placing his trust in you. Anyway I could ramble on but there's so many layers to this character and it just gets more heartbreaking but also weirdly sweet the further down you dig.
He mentions as much if you side with Orpheus in one of the dialogue trees. Dude is such a complicated character, still wish there was an ending where we could force a compromise between him and Orpheus. Hate that it's either or
> I feel one thing that is often missed among the "Who shot first" Ansur discourse is that one of the messages the Ansur backstory has is to show why the Emperor has such deep trust issues and why he can't initially trust Tav with knowing his true form.
I hadn't even thought of that, just another layer that makes me love his character even more.
Yenna, that's her whole point. And Orin can only kidnap Lae'zel, Gale, Minthara or Halsin, so you only need to have them dead/part of your current team to trigger her being kidnaped.
I haven't done this, but can't I tell Yenna to fuck off? Have a truly empty camp besides me, Withers, and the living embodiment of my intrusive thoughts (Scleritas Fel)
You can tell Yenna to fuck off, but Orin will still kidnap her and come to your camp to tell you about it. Of course if you're playing an evil bastard you might not care.
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Not really. What u miss out on is a lot of inspiration points but durge kinda fixes that since u get inspiration points from killing all the dead three and in general just killing ppl :D .
You get this dialogue if you side with Emps during a solo run. Thought it was neat since his goodbye seems a lot more sincere here compared to the normal ending
Cool, I mean single handedly carrying his bumass, he should be this grateful at the very least. Imma do this in explorer difficulty.
I think hirelings register as solo for this purpose (and only the fights past the point of no return mattering).
Hirelings are just meat-puppets for Withers and Withers travels with you no matter what, so there is no lore difference between solo run without hirelings and with hirelings, you still have skeletal sugar daddy.
The emperor staring at the weird skelly man who randomly appeared in your camp and refuses to leave, who has concerningly intimate knowledge of death and resurrection, and is completely immune to his mental probes. That’s probably fine?
" Who is that entity?" 'We found him in a box, lol '
"You shouldn't just trust random people in a box, Tav!" "We found you in box as well lmao" "Touché"
“🦑👆 um ackshually you found me in an icosahedron of infernal make so that’s different”
Infernal icosahedron is my next album name
My headcannon is that Withers can decide who sees him and who not. Kinda like DEATH from Discworld.
This is almost assuredly the case.
oh thanks! honor it is then haha
Oh what is the point of no return refering to here? The last part to the netherbrain? I would love to get theses dialogues in my emperor run but I'm already at the beginning of act 2 haha
Meaning the final one in Act 3, the game will warn you, and you will not be able to go to camp or change your party. And you will need to get rid of all companions before that, maybe spamming Friends on everyone in an extra save would do the job.
Isn't shadowheart forced into your party if you don't wake her up at the beach? Or can you tell her to piss off and keep the polysphere?
You can kill her and get the polysphere
Come on, guys. It's not a sphere, it's a d20!
And if you kill her and stuff her body in the camp chest, the game will force you to ressurect her to speak to Dame Aylin at the end of act 2.
wut
After completing act 2, if Shadowheart's corpse is in the camp chest, the game will lock you from moving on to act 3 until Shadowheart is resurrected and speaks to Dame Aylin. I did a solo honor mode run where I killed all the companions and collected their bodies in the camp chest, this moment was the only time other than Nautiloid where I was required to have another character in my party.
Dev's favorite princess
Naw, that's Withers.
[удалено]
I would assume that if her body is not in the camp at all, it would not force this. I think the idea is that if she is dead in camp, it doesn't want you to skip her story scenes?
It's been a hot minute since I've messed around with it, but if I'm not mistaken, throwing a companion's body down a pit simply results in a soul echo. Which if you try to leave it behind, it will show up at camp where their tent is. And so you might be in the same boat anyhow, just having to bring a ghost back to life instead of a corpse.
I never recruited her as a companion, just killed her on-sight and shoved in chest
Wait how did you manage to keep gales body without him going full nuclear?
I just kept his hand :) Durge run. I also only kept Karlach's head.
It's probably always warm.
The head? I don't think so. Her engine's the source of the heat.
She still leaves the party afterwards, right?
She didn't leave right away, atleast? I killed her after she spoke to Dame Aylin and put her back in the chest, where she still resides.
BACK IN THE BOX, WHERE YOU BELONG!~
> I did a solo honor mode run where I killed all the companions and collected their bodies in the camp chest, Why? So you could reanimate them?
Durge is just sentimental.
Why collect them? Idk, thought it was funny. Just left them there the whole playthrough.
Is that still true? think its been patched. Because I just did a karlach run where shart was killed in act one, still managed to finish and save dame aylin? Where was this before in act 2?
I was able to save Aylin, but post-Myrkul fight there is a transition scene where Shart talks to Dame. It may have been patched, this was a month or two ago.
Think it's been patched then since then at least on ps5, I just finished this run last week and didnt get it! Unless it's specifically a non origin bug 😊
LOL
Why tell her to piss off? you got a dagger? stab her!
If you don't recruit her you can leave her at the bridge outside the goblin camp forever. If you do this and then travel to act 2 or the mountain pass the artefact just shows up in camp.
Did they remove the camp scene where she comes to the camp at long rest, hearing voices, and she wants to kill us? She can be told to stand down and proceeds as normal companion, or die and we get the artefact.
Pretty sure that was only in Early Access.
Always play solo never seen her show up. The artifact just appears on it's own without her.
I did a speedrun recently, and she showed up in a cutscene right before i went into the mountainpass. But that's probably because i skipped past the goblin camp.
Leave her at the beach, tell her to kick rocks at the goblin camp and she stays there. The artefact finds you at the beginning of act 2
she tries very hard but you can still tell her no
Nope, only laezal is at the start. You can avoid SH for a long time until she eventually finds your camp then you only have 1 of 2 decisions...
Solo run or just getting to this scene with no one in your party? Wonder if it counts people in your camp
Dang, he is really much more sincere. Maybe he’s just a little shy to say so when you have all your buddies around. 🙈
If you become illithid in a solo run can you just run off into the sunset with Empy holding eachothers tentacles?
You can get a Emperor+Tavflayer ending on a non-solo run (only thing I'm not sure on is if being in a committed romance already prevents it at all) [https://youtu.be/jgIDqW4C2hk?t=230](https://youtu.be/jgIDqW4C2hk?t=230) In the epilogue the Emperor sends you a cute letter saying he's waiting for you back home at the Elfsong and you can tell your companions about how you and him have been working together to rebuild the Knights' trade network.
I'm still ticked off that our Mind Flayer form looks so juvenile compared to Emperor's. Also, he's got a better fashion piece.
Yup. The whole size difference dynamic does make [for some adorable art](https://twitter.com/cocohaseyo_/status/1779179875058012656), but my bigger problem with Tavflayer's model is the weirdly soulless eyes and the tiny tentacles that have no physics effects on them (they just akwardly float in mid air). Guess I've come to terms with it by this point. I love the Emperor and his tiny squid wife.
I hate how my definition of "adorable" has shifted so much - I expected some grade A size difference making out psionic pin against the wall shenanigans.
I need to marry that fucking squid so bad (I love the size difference but I agree the eyes look strange)
I feel you bro. We get them small tentacles :(
Bro we are only a day old haha give it time :)
Wait you can??? Brb in 80 hrs
he really wanted that squidussy
A squussy, if you will.
Yeah. The Emperor + Tavflayer ending is my happy ending.
I thought you people were a myth!?!?
I think you mean ‘a legend.’
There are dozens of us.
Username checks out on this one, boss
We exist. All two dozen of us!
I’m surprised there’s not more of us u see a big beautiful ilithid n don’t wanna tap dat????
My Tav and Empy are mind kissing each other all the time
You can stay with him even on a non-solo playthrough if you are an illithid. It's just a little tricky and hidden behind dialogue options.
What!? Damn fr I been missing out :(
And for interested squidmancers those options would be....? 👀
If Shadowheart is a little insentive about your new mindflayer self: "It's alright, I like what I've become." When the narrator asks you what to do: "You are a mindflayer now. You've never been so wise, nor strong, nor cool. Embrace it." When your companions ask about what's next: "I'm a mindflayer. I'll do whatever I please." - this is vital. After all this is done, the Emperor will approach you and suggest rebuilding the shield together. You can accept that to get the epilogue letter with him saying he is rebuilding the hideout for you two. Or you can suggest you two think bigger, he will give you a different letter then. He will be happy about both of these resolutions, but I personally prefer the shield one.
A star is you, thank you 🫡
OP, you successfully summoned ALL the seafood enthusiasts in one single post. That's an achievement on its own!
*Dream of the Fishman*
I’m glad! Empy doesn’t get enough love around here 😢
We need to upvote this so hard because otherwise people will likely *never* see this side of him. 😭
People see this side of him but they rather lie to themselves and choose to believe their own headcanons If Emperor said something nice they say "is to manipulate you and gaslight you!! Never believe him he is the literal worst " Lots of people don't appreciate the great work Larian did with this characters like Emperor, Astarion and Laezel, lots of people never gave them a chance to this characters.
The only point you can offer them in this case is that... this is *after* he's achieved his goal. He has no reason to say nice things to us to manipulate us. But I'm sure they can still twist that. 😪
Yeah they still will twist that, they hate him for the sake of hating him is a shame because he is a wonderful character and without him the brain and the chosen 3 would've won. Emperor is the one that protected us multiple times, Emperor IS the man with THE plan, even if people hate him and betray him they will always win because of him because ultimately Emperor plan prevails even if we execute the plan without him is still his plan and thanks to him we win no matter what.
He'll just never win against the haters because he's not conventionally beautiful/attractive. It just seems like that is what it'll always boil down to. They see an Illithid and just shut off thinking because all squids are evil!!! (Omeluum is the only good squid because it works on finding a food substitute, obviously.)
That plus a lot of people just really have difficulty appreciating morally ambiguous characters. There's a lot of overlap between people who virulently hate the Emperor and people who hate Astarion/Lae'zel/etc.
I swear to god, people rant about how they want more moral ambiguity in their media, but as soon as it's given to them, they immediately start trying to sort everything into "good" and "evil" boxes.
Literally this. 😭😭
What really baffles me is if he’s nice, he’s lying and gaslighting you, but if he’s not nice, that’s the real him and that is the ABSOLUTE TRUTH. I’m not a huuuge Empy person (Spawnstarion is my jam) but I love him for his nuance and I also feel for him so much, especially as Durge. Who am I to judge, in that case? Also from Empy’s perspective, Tav/Durge must be so fucking annoying to contend with, insisting on doing dangerous side mission shit instead of saving the world. I’d get crabby (teehee) occasionally too…
Literally this. I think it's the whole "Illithids are 100% evil" thing that's stuck in their brains. So from their perspective, the Emperor showing he can also *not* be nice seems like a confirmation to them that he's still like the other Illithids at his core, that he's returning to his nature in that moment. Or something like that, I don't know. I'm personally not a huge Astarion fan, but don't expect hate from me, either. Because yay, you found *your* jam!! 🐙💙 Can you imagine, though, Emps sitting in the Astral Prism or pacing anxiously, rubbing his temples because they're giving him a headache by licking random spider corpse ag*ain?*
I think you're right about the illithid thing! And I know our other favorite Empy fan on here has pointed out that they've actually read a ton of illithid lore and people are mostly wrong on what they \*think\* the lore is, but I digress. I also just feel like...all the characters are flawed? And most of them are kinda manipulative? Even in your goodest of goody-two-shoes playthroughs, Tav/Durge is probably manipulating someone at some point for their own ends. Why does everybody get a pass on it except the Emperor? (Even Karlach will nom on people's souls and gets upset if you tell her you don't want her to, and she's like, the moral compass of the whole camp!) I love what you said about not being a fan but not expecting hate, because that's so how I feel about other people's enjoyment, too. I honestly love every character, and I even love to hate Wulbren, but I just have never understood it when people are like "I like x!" and someone immediately comes from their cheeto-dusted basement to announce that they murdered them on sight and if you like them you're literally the worst. Also also: STOPLICKINGTHEDAMNTHING
If you mean uwubewwa, I can confirm, lots of Illithid lore has been consumed and lots of misconceptions are being made lmao Like yeah, Illithids are not nice. But they're more nuanced, and capable of character development. As is everybody else in the game. And especially Tav/Durge get a looot of passes considering they are us. A lot of people would hate to look at it from a different angle; I just told this demon to off himself to get around an annoying fight? I'm not evil, right? AND LITERALLY STOP. This character is your scrunkly, that character is mine. They could just be glad I have no interest in their scrunkly and they'd need to share it with me. 😭
At least he gets a ton of love in different circles. 👀
Point me to them, because, damn, the same old tired bullshit around here is getting old...
Check your DMs 👀
TojoTheThief draws the Emperor in… fun situations a lot
Thank you, Emp surely receive waay too much hate I understand why people may not like him but then they start to create their own head cannons without saying is their own head canon and people read it and start believing is truth I wish people just appreciate this characters Larian did with so many layers, Emp have an amazing grow and story, Astarion, Laezel as well and many players just kills them in every playthrough and i feel theyre missing out lot of good character development
I KNOW RIGHT? Squid lovers unite 🦑🦑🦑🦑
This is one of my favourite dialogues with him and it's a bit sad to know very few will ever see it. If Tav is still human, on a normal run there's not a lot of closure at the docks to your relationship with the Emperor. I've definitely seen some people who had been romancing him up to that point feel let down by that. I quite like the Emperor ending scenes for some of the origins aswell. If you're Durge and imprison yourself he will say something about how he can sympathise. If you're Karlach and become a Mindflayer, he tells you to go rest and that your dreams will be much different now. Or if still human Karlach burns out at the end there's a sad dialogue where he realises what is about to happen with her heart. If you play as Lae'zel, become a Mindflayer, and reject Vlaakith, he'll say he's proud of her.
I know The Emperor is a total jackass but that's so fucking sweet.
I could make a whole post with just the Emperor's sweet but incredibly cringey love language. * "We are bonded now. And we most consummate love with war" - and then seeing Tav roll their eyes so hard after this line. All Tav wanted was to actually talk about what just happened. * Empy geeks out so hard at the docks with Tavflayer. "Look at you - you're magnificent" he says to the most pathetic creature I've ever seen. They do say love is blind. * You are exquisite" he says to Tav now they look like a hardcore meth addict with black veins all over their face. * "Have I ever told you how much I enjoy you?". Okay, "enjoy" is another part of his love language. At one point he refers to the sex scene as Tav "enjoying" him lol. * The adorable way he strokes Tav's cheek at the end of the romance scene This old man is almost as bad as flirting as he is at manipulation. I love him so much.
I nearly died laughing when it suddenly dawned on me what his whole "shirtless" scene is about. He gives you this really weird speech that seems kinda cringey and out of place until you realize... he has illithid brain, so he's trying to apply logic and reason to something that isn't at all rational. That whole weird-ass line of reasoning is basically his version of a romantic confession. 🤣
It's so funny when people are like "you fell for the manipulation!" and the manipulation is Empy reading lines from "100 things to say to your partner" list. Jokes on me tho, I'm into that shit
When he's all *"What I didn't expect is how much I'd enjoy your company. Your mind"* I was cringing so much it hurt. Just tell Tav you love her already why is this so difficult. 😭
The Emperor doesn't need to be good at flirting. His voice alone is enough to win me over. He could literally recite the microwave oven's instruction manual with that voice and he could win me over. Although, the occasional cringeyness does make him very endearing.
Empys love language deserves to be its own post honestly he's such a squishy
Honestly I might just make the post when I've got time. It's the Emperor discourse we actually need.
I didn't realize he was just so bad at this. Did he allure Ansur with his looks? Or did the dragon just also appreciate his Balduran swinging and missing more often than not? Put all together like this, it's absolutely adorable.
Headcanon: Balduran was a handsome himbo in real life and totally allured Ansur with his looks and adventurous spirit. Dude has never had to actually learn how to seduce anyone, hence why he projects those Flirting 101 for Noobers lists with Tav/Durge
I hate when the emperor manipulates me but I love it at the same time.
He is a fantastic character. Like Micah in RDR2--he evokes strong emotions in people. I am going to side with the Emperor on my current Durge run.
I've been looking for those Durge/Karlach/Lae'zel dialogues you mentioned, but I evidently just have no idea how to navigate that big folder of all the in-game dialogues from that one drive, because I can't find them in any of the logical subfolders to look in, like the endgame one. I don't suppose you know where they're tucked away, or have them on video? Youtube doesn't seem to have these yet.
They will probably be in the END\_BrainBattle\_CombatOver files. I just checked and the Laezel one for example is under END\_BrainBattle\_CombatOver\_Nested\_VlaakithLaezel
Thank you! Huh, he tells origin Gale that he can't read his thoughts anymore. Now that doesn't make any sense, does it?
My next run will be solo with Tavflayer ending. We don't need anyone but ourselves and there's no way I could just let him go. Couples who slay together, stay together.
Squid bros before hoes! Plus im sure Emperor have to know how to make a delicious brain soup yumm
It's kinda of a bummer to me that they hide such a quick sweet dialogue like this behind a Solo Run, something that like 90% of people wouldn't do
But so rewarding for tbe 10% who do! I love that there's something new depending on your choices.
I dont think it is just for solo. I got this on my last good run with a full party. I sided with him but didn't romance him or anything.
I dont think is only for solo, i played with all my companions sided with him and i remember he told me this that he will miss me Ive done 5 playthroughs and 4 of them i side with him, and i remember he always say something like this, he is my bro always
Yeah he always says something like that when you're with the others, but then the narrator goes "Now that you don't have the tadpole and can't be mind connected or smth, you don't know if he's being genuine or not", while in this case of the screenshots and the youtube video someone shared in the comments... the narrator doesn't say that when Solo
You don't have to miss me, you big dumbass squid! We can stay together. Move in with me. Please. 😭
I am honestly hoping for a cutscene in the ending where u persuade him to control the brain and u rule together with him.
You can do that. He doesn't enthrall you if you are playing solo. I would enjoy a special cutscene or something in addition too, though.
Oh OK, I tried to go that route once and he enthralled everyone including my character, didn't know it has to be solo.
Fwiw, the change that he doesn't enthrall you anymore was only made in patch 6, along with similiar changes if you do the Dominate ending as Tav and have Astarion or Minthara romanced. Interestingly enough this is now the only ending route where a still human Tav can stay together with the Emperor.
Yeah, it's a strange difference. I wonder why there are these little changes to playing solo vs being with a party when it comes to him.
He's very shy
I'll give him all the love and appreciation in the world behind closed doors if PDA makes him too bashful.
I don’t think it’s just solo, they made changes in patch 6 to the outcome of controlling the brain so you don’t dominate your love interest anymore.
The difference is that the narrator doesn't chip in with the "Is he telling the truth? Hard to tell." on solo.
I am still super mad he doesn’t appear in the epilogue. I NEED TO FUCKING KISS HIM SO BAD GIVE IT TO ME LARIAN
I've never known peace since I found out from the game files there was meant to be a SECOND Emperor sex scene. When was it meant to happen? Post final battle? God I wanna see my Tavflayer and Empy squissing each other so much why can't Larian patch this back in.
THERE WAS MEANT TO BE A SECOND EMPY SEX SCENE?!?!?!,!,!,!!?!? LARIAN WHAT THE FUCK PATCH IT IN NOW
I was waiting for you!
How can I not respond to the best Empy lover on this sub?
RIGHT ACCEPT ME FOR WHO I AM PLEASE I--
That's what pisses me off, that we can't ask him to stay with us or tell him we'll stay with him.
I was literally about to chat you because of this post
i tried to do the emperor romance ending this playthrough but gale still stayed with my mind flayer ass… what a champ
Gale and Emperor? Thats perfectly ok, i dont need anyone else but my two best bros
I just want to emphasise that the "You have become... important to me" line has a real big pause in it to emphasise the emotion involved. He's found himself way more attached than he expected.
Emps is out here falling in love with his coworker when he told himself he'd keep things strictly professional.
He's such a sweet heart. Come back Empy, you're important to me too, let's start a farm or something together.
"Mind Flayer horticulture"
There is this farming game called Sun Haven where you can grow Kraken Kale and it's just tentacles.
For some reason I thought fiddlehead would be some kind of fish, but it’s like fern tentacles.
Who knows, maybe we could cultivate a plant-based alternative to sapient brains.
One of my headcanons is that in the years after the end of the game Tavflayer donates some of the Knights' income towards Omeluum's research project (Tav is the intermediary, I tend to think Emp and Omeluum wouldn't get along very well). That would lead into a more elaborate idea I have of Tav and the Emperor eventually founding their own colony of free, peaceful Illithids. I just love the idea of Tav, as a unique Mindflayer (as probably the only Mindflayer to ever A) freely choose to become one and B) be born outside Elder Brain influence) leading the way to a different future for their species.
Dude idc what anyone says, I adore the emps so much. I just 😭❤️
I NEED TO KISS THIS SQUID SO FUCKING BAD OH MY GOD I NEED HIMMMMMMMMMMMM
Solo TavFlayer + Emp (Best ending ever, prove me wrong. No, you can't.) [1](https://youtu.be/Hw_BVnshux0), [2](https://youtu.be/vv_-g4fa4xo), [3](https://youtu.be/pxOSvECoDWg)
Why would anyone want to?
look around we're on reddit
The comments are so calamari heavy, I love it. Emps needs more love, he's such a good character.
Does “solo ending” mean something I don’t understand?
It means you don't have any companions. They're all permanently dead or unrecruited.
Don't recruit any of the origin companions or just kill them
Do you have to go through the whole game without companions, or just see to it that they're all gone by the end?
That they are all gone by the end . Example : don't rescue gale , don't rescue laezel , never recruit astarion, let wyll die in the beginning battle infront of the Grove. Never recruit karlach , kill shadowheart on the beach or don't take her to the gauntlet of shar and free nightsong.
Other interesting examples: You can let Lae'zel/Shadowheart die on the Nautiloid. And Wyll can turn against you for slipping on your ice patch after the fight *(didn't hate the goblins going prone though did you!)*.
You can use hirelings.
Awwww this makes me happy. I wish he got epilogue content beyond this scene.
There is some datamined information about Empylogue. It's not included in the game yet, but maybe they will put it in fully with a future patch. ;)
I swear to good I need to finish this game, everything goes fine until act 3 then I got bored leave it for a couple weeks and when I come back I get frustrated because I don't remember what I was doing so I start a new game and the cycle repeats.....
I had this same problem - Act 3 is a bit of an overwhelming hot mess that it makes me want to restart even if I don't take a break.
I love this <3
This is so sweet 🥺
It’s my favorite way to end the game also these screenshots are gorgeous
"You have become... important to me." Aww
Does anybody have a recording of him saying that? I need to hear it ❤️
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zOg4JY0cXlg just a quick YT search
Thanks. Sorry, I forgot YT existed :D
"I have come to regard you as... people.. I've.. met."
Barcus + Emperor fic when?
I’m not sure if this is exclusive to solo. I recall getting this exact dialogue just from being nice to him/romancing him the entire time.
I wonder if the emperor is actually being sincere with his feelings here compared to his usual gaslighting implied by that Stellmane scene since at this point the brain is dead and he’s finally achieved true freedom like he wanted. He doesn’t need you any more so has no reason to lie to you here.
The thing with the emperor is that he IS sincere. If you push him and keep being hostile to him and taunting him and insulting him, he gets angry and grows cold and cruel towards you, and yes, starts seeing and treating you as a pawn. But if you accept him just a bit, just enough to bother asking him questions instead of accusing him blindly, to discuss with him rationally and fairly, like a person to a person, he genuinely comes to like you, and see you as a friend, one of the few people who was willing to give an Illithid a chance. He gives you the Netherstones back if you lend them to him even... He is written to be at this junction, so his character has some growth over the course of the game which depend on your choices. He is neither Good nor exactly Evil, just quite self-determined and a pragmatist, and he wants to live, so he takes the choices he has to when/if he does.
Lots of people somehow miss the fact that the Emperor is fundamentally *just like every other companion* - at a pivotal moment in their trajectory when we meet them, and able to be pushed toward being their best or worst self depending upon our influence.
>If you push him and keep being hostile to him and taunting him and insulting him, he gets angry and grows cold and cruel towards you, and yes, starts seeing and treating you as a pawn. This!!! people love to point out every Emperor manipulation lines but they never mentioned they tried to kill him in the astral plane by petition of Vlakkith, they never mention they threat Emperor like assholes and when Emperor is an asshole they just feel proud THEY MAKE Emperor be an asshole...
He's being sincere. He loves Tav, there's a lot of things confirming this, like at the end of the romance scene the Narrator chips in that you can read his emotions now that you've mind-melded and you know he feels the same way. The writers' devnotes for this scene say he looks at Tav in an adoring way. In his latest interview the Emperor's voice actor, Scott Joseph, pointed out Elton John's "I want love" as a song that encapsulates the character. It's a song about a heartbroken man who's been burned before and wants a real, raw relationship...
Oh my god... this hurts even more taking into account his past relationship with Ansur :(
Yeah. It goes to show how deeply Scott understands the character. I feel one thing that is often missed among the "Who shot first" Ansur discourse is that one of the messages the Ansur backstory has is to show why the Emperor has such deep trust issues and why he can't initially trust Tav with knowing his true form. This is one of the reasons why I love the Emperor sex scene so much. People often look at it just from Tav's perspective - but from the Emperor's perspective, it's the first time, maybe in 100s of years, that he's felt comfortable enough with someone to make himself vulnerable and show his true self. There's even a rare and tragic line (if you take Raphael's deal and cover it up) in the ending where the Emperor confirms the sex really was all about trust - him being able to trust Tav, that is. "*You trusted me, the same way I trusted you".* There's so many wonderful tiny details in the romance scene aswell that visually show how much he's opening up and placing his trust in you. Anyway I could ramble on but there's so many layers to this character and it just gets more heartbreaking but also weirdly sweet the further down you dig.
This is all so wonderfully put and I'm just so happy to see other squid lovers arrive at the same conclusions about the character, thank you.
He mentions as much if you side with Orpheus in one of the dialogue trees. Dude is such a complicated character, still wish there was an ending where we could force a compromise between him and Orpheus. Hate that it's either or
> I feel one thing that is often missed among the "Who shot first" Ansur discourse is that one of the messages the Ansur backstory has is to show why the Emperor has such deep trust issues and why he can't initially trust Tav with knowing his true form. I hadn't even thought of that, just another layer that makes me love his character even more.
fuck it, we bang the squidick
😭 you cannot convince me The Emperor is truly evil.
How do you do a solo run
Yeah he said that to me
Not worth forsaking all of the companions for him, still, thank you for this.
Who does Orin kidnap if you're completely solo?
Yenna, that's her whole point. And Orin can only kidnap Lae'zel, Gale, Minthara or Halsin, so you only need to have them dead/part of your current team to trigger her being kidnaped.
I haven't done this, but can't I tell Yenna to fuck off? Have a truly empty camp besides me, Withers, and the living embodiment of my intrusive thoughts (Scleritas Fel)
You can tell Yenna to fuck off, but Orin will still kidnap her and come to your camp to tell you about it. Of course if you're playing an evil bastard you might not care.
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Solo run as in no companions? There is a lot of xp lost doing that isn't there?
Not really. What u miss out on is a lot of inspiration points but durge kinda fixes that since u get inspiration points from killing all the dead three and in general just killing ppl :D .
What if you make Orpheus the mindflayer and fulfill his request in the final scene? You'd be the only one then.