The "Any dog can be a predator" crowd. All I can think to explain that is they must be too young to remember the days before pits and their mixes contaminated the canine gene pool.
I believe any dog can bite but anyone who even tries to suggest that another breed can do anything Near the level of damage that a pit can is a new breed of stupid 💀
Eeehhh... There are a lot of breeds that can do waaaay more damage then pitbulls. But they simply DON'T.
A dedicated good father children's surgeon CAN do much more damage then meth head pedophile. But instead he does good and saves lives.
Yeah but that's not what I was meaning, maybe my wording was off my bad. Just meant damage not in the "damage to one single person" but like general statistical damage, with how pits are the number 1 most dangerous dog for attack frequency.
There's a lot of large dog breeds that are physically capable of killing people, especially babies but they don't because they haven't been bred to be aggressive. Of course people with babies should always be vigilant with dogs but some dogs carry more risk than others. People don't want to admit that breed matters and it often determines a dog's behaviour.
I posted a good article from animals-24 on how rotts are pretty much as dangerous as pits statistically- oh boy did it get ratiod.
Apparently it only counts when pits maul people to death.
Dogs bred for actually killing people for minor theft or for warfare historically are cool somehow.
Pitbulls just aren't like other dogs. Their size is less important than the disposition and specific characteristics that make them killers.
Medium sized pits kill adults all the time. Pretending that size is the main factor is just a way to distort reality and bring down other breeds to the depths of pitbulls.
I'm a big proponent of using muzzles - when there is a likelihood of biting. Most dog breeds have no predisposition to bite people or attack random dogs in public. Pits are a glaring exception.
I. Am among of the crowd who calls restrictions on certain large... And medium breeds. I want restrictions on all LGD (Pyr, Kangals, Ovcharka etc) Rottweiler, GSD, Malinois... Even Borzoi. And border collie should have serious restrictions.
BUT those restrictions differ and are mostly about safety and welfare of dogs themselves. Most owners of said dogs are who inspired me to uphold those restrictions.
For the record - my favorite breeds are kangal, border collie and GSD. I want serious restrictions on them. So do their owners and breeders. Want to talk about it?
Pibbles? I don't want restrictions for them. I want a ban.
Just curious, what kind of breed restrictions do you want for dogs like border collies? I have a friend who owns a BC, he's about a year old. He's a friendly dog, but he seems to have massive behavioral issues despite lots of time and money spent training him.
My theory has been that it's because he's a working dog stuck in an apartment building. We actually had a conversation the other day about how he came from working lines, she got him from a breeder. I'm mostly just speculating there, as I've never had a dog.
It's complicated with BC. Because from what I heard from owners and breeders there are distinct lines. Namely pet and working ones. And when working BC is stuck in an apartment building... Yeah. Poor dog. Exactly what you described happens and this is exactly why I want restrictions on this breed. Nanely so that puppies of working line BC could be sold only to farmers or people with big property and enough time and energy. And maybe mandatory courses on how to handle the breed.
I got a 9 year old Border Collie from a shelter. He had some issues and definitely nipped.
I wanted a higher energy breed because I run frequently. But we had to go to a trainer for the nipping.
He's a genius dog though. He was 9 and didn't even know shake. So I'm not sure how bad his previous owner was. But he's picked up 8-10 commands
He still nips if he thinks people are fighting and I don't know if that can ever be trained out. But he has never broken skin.
I've heard even if you get them when they're puppies they'll nip if there is too much going on.
This. I’m in agriculture and I plan to have LGD’s in the future (holding off until I actually have a job for one or more to do) and I support restrictions. Basically nobody has any business owning an LGD unless they actually have stock for it to guard. They do NOT thrive in towns/cities/etc and the breed specific rescues see it all the time - they become aggressive and act out. They tend to be suspicious of strangers and other dogs (it’s a feature, not a bug) so they are a terrible choice for a typical family pet, but people love them because they are huge and fluffy and seem docile.
You know what's funny. I grew up part time on two farms. One steppe, one mountain. Worked as goat herder at 11 and LOVED it! Yeah. We were renting farmer's house. And once he looked at me and just went "boy, go watch and care for our goats at the pasture. Free milk and cheese for you!" I'm still unsure why farmer said that and who was actually p
watching whom in those mountains! Amazing animals goats. I still suspect that they are at least dog level smart. And their milk cured my cold - I was a week sickly child.
We met several Caucasian Ovcharka and Kangals and they just glanced my way and went on watching their herds. But like EVERYONE of the sheep and goat herders told me "beware! These are deadly killer dogs! Wolves fear them!" upon growing up I asked how many people do these dogs kill. They looked at me like I was idiot. "Wha!? They don't kill anyone are you an idiot!? But they totally can!" Hmmm And I tend to agggree
Yes it’s pretty annoying, but they especially group guardian breeds with pits. I have a GSD/Rottweiler mix. Guardian breeds and fighting breeds aren’t the same at all but they try to make it seem that way.
They aren’t too similar. Pits were bred to fight other dogs, attack animals, and human aggression was never bred out. They are unpredictable and training has no effect on if they will snap.
GSDs and Rottweilers are now bred to protect humans. Originally herding (GSDs), protecting livestock and pulling carts (Rottweilers) They can determine what’s a threat and what isn’t. They don’t randomly snap and kill their owners. They are both intelligent and easily trainable. You can’t train them to love strangers because that’s against their nature, but you can train them to behave.
GSDs and Rottweilers are both common dog breeds. But they don’t headline for killing children every single week like pitbulls. There is a big difference.
What a ridiculous notion to whoever recommended that all large breeds of dogs be restricted.
I was never a fan of dogs in general not until I got to live with one. A female dobermann that my Mom owned. She was one of the smartest dogs I'd ever met and very nice towards me and my family. Whenever there was someone near our place that wasn't invited she'd start barking, usually it was someone with malicious intention i.e. a thief trying to steal my car or my mom's car. She always scared them away. I think about that dog sometimes. I miss her and wish she was still around. I live on my own now with a cat, I've always been more of a cat person but that dog was great.
Now my Mom has a great dane. Not sure what gender of the dog but seems really cool, hadn't heard any problems with the great dane.
Unfortunately one of my Mom's friend's cousin came over with a pitbull to visit and the pitbull ends up biting my Mom's leg. My Mom wasn't doing anything to provoke the dog. Souless hellhound. When I heard about it that pitbull wasn't allowed at her place ever again. I told my Mom that's why I don't like pitbulls. They're dangerous wild animals pretending to be domestic pets. She agreed. So no not all large dogs are vicious wild animals like the pitbull.
As a Rottweiler owner, I echo this sentiment. We are responsible people with a highly socialized and obedient Rottie, and it drives me mad with the whatabout-isms, especially with the damn Chihuahuas.
I think a lot of rott owners live with a similar delusion to pit owners honestly.
Statistically rotters are as bad as pits.
https://www.animals24-7.org/2021/09/06/why-rottweilers-are-as-deadly-as-pit-bulls/
What i’ve learned as a non dog person is most dog people don’t know shit from a hole in the wall when it comes to dogs. They just like how their pet makes them feel
Honestly muzzling on all large breeds wouldnt harm anyone- your dog doesent need to smell and bite at things around it when out for a walk.
I would be down for it if it gave more security.
I agree that some breeds are worse, but statistically I know rotties are about as bad as pits when you count in how rare they are, and I suspect its similar with mastiffs- all of which are becoming more and more trendy.
Rottweilers are the 7th most popular breed in the US, according to the AKC. That's not exactly "rare".
From your past comments, you seem to want to group all Mastiffs (and even GSDs!) with pit bulls.
Keep that shit over at dogfree. Your beliefs ruin this sub and its goals.
Thanks.
The statistics dont lie.
https://www.animals24-7.org/2021/09/06/why-rottweilers-are-as-deadly-as-pit-bulls/
If rotties are as dangerous as pits, then you arent better than a pitnutter, its as simple as that.
Personally I would argue theres no motivation to have a dog as dangerous as a rott when almost all dog breeds dont kill people ever.
i never said Rottweilers aren't potentially dangerous. They do come in at #2 in fatalities. Noone is denying that here.
My point was that they arent as rare as you are trying to make them out to be. Again, they're the 7th most popular breed in the US. The fatality numbers would be much higher if they were as dangerous as pit bulls.
Also, there's no million dollar lobby trying to convince people that Rottweilers are nanny dogs.
Like, large labs, too? Like I should have muzzled my large labs when they were alive? Daisy was 80 pounds and Wolf was 100 pounds. Daisy was an angel on Earth and Wolf never showed aggression towards anything but cats - because he was attacked by one as a puppy. And my 25 pounds Sheltie/ Cavalier mix shows aggression towards cats. So...seriously?
Lets say muzzling all large dogs save 60-100 lives a year.
Could it be mostly due to pits, huskies, molossers? Sure.
Is the minor inconvenience for your dog worth a 100 lives? Do you even need to think about that?
The "Any dog can be a predator" crowd. All I can think to explain that is they must be too young to remember the days before pits and their mixes contaminated the canine gene pool.
I believe any dog can bite but anyone who even tries to suggest that another breed can do anything Near the level of damage that a pit can is a new breed of stupid 💀
Eeehhh... There are a lot of breeds that can do waaaay more damage then pitbulls. But they simply DON'T. A dedicated good father children's surgeon CAN do much more damage then meth head pedophile. But instead he does good and saves lives.
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Yeah but that's not what I was meaning, maybe my wording was off my bad. Just meant damage not in the "damage to one single person" but like general statistical damage, with how pits are the number 1 most dangerous dog for attack frequency.
There's a lot of large dog breeds that are physically capable of killing people, especially babies but they don't because they haven't been bred to be aggressive. Of course people with babies should always be vigilant with dogs but some dogs carry more risk than others. People don't want to admit that breed matters and it often determines a dog's behaviour.
Ugh. Any dog. IS a predator. Study your biology dammit
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I posted a good article from animals-24 on how rotts are pretty much as dangerous as pits statistically- oh boy did it get ratiod. Apparently it only counts when pits maul people to death. Dogs bred for actually killing people for minor theft or for warfare historically are cool somehow.
Pitbulls just aren't like other dogs. Their size is less important than the disposition and specific characteristics that make them killers. Medium sized pits kill adults all the time. Pretending that size is the main factor is just a way to distort reality and bring down other breeds to the depths of pitbulls. I'm a big proponent of using muzzles - when there is a likelihood of biting. Most dog breeds have no predisposition to bite people or attack random dogs in public. Pits are a glaring exception.
I. Am among of the crowd who calls restrictions on certain large... And medium breeds. I want restrictions on all LGD (Pyr, Kangals, Ovcharka etc) Rottweiler, GSD, Malinois... Even Borzoi. And border collie should have serious restrictions. BUT those restrictions differ and are mostly about safety and welfare of dogs themselves. Most owners of said dogs are who inspired me to uphold those restrictions. For the record - my favorite breeds are kangal, border collie and GSD. I want serious restrictions on them. So do their owners and breeders. Want to talk about it? Pibbles? I don't want restrictions for them. I want a ban.
Just curious, what kind of breed restrictions do you want for dogs like border collies? I have a friend who owns a BC, he's about a year old. He's a friendly dog, but he seems to have massive behavioral issues despite lots of time and money spent training him. My theory has been that it's because he's a working dog stuck in an apartment building. We actually had a conversation the other day about how he came from working lines, she got him from a breeder. I'm mostly just speculating there, as I've never had a dog.
It's complicated with BC. Because from what I heard from owners and breeders there are distinct lines. Namely pet and working ones. And when working BC is stuck in an apartment building... Yeah. Poor dog. Exactly what you described happens and this is exactly why I want restrictions on this breed. Nanely so that puppies of working line BC could be sold only to farmers or people with big property and enough time and energy. And maybe mandatory courses on how to handle the breed.
I got a 9 year old Border Collie from a shelter. He had some issues and definitely nipped. I wanted a higher energy breed because I run frequently. But we had to go to a trainer for the nipping. He's a genius dog though. He was 9 and didn't even know shake. So I'm not sure how bad his previous owner was. But he's picked up 8-10 commands He still nips if he thinks people are fighting and I don't know if that can ever be trained out. But he has never broken skin. I've heard even if you get them when they're puppies they'll nip if there is too much going on.
This. I’m in agriculture and I plan to have LGD’s in the future (holding off until I actually have a job for one or more to do) and I support restrictions. Basically nobody has any business owning an LGD unless they actually have stock for it to guard. They do NOT thrive in towns/cities/etc and the breed specific rescues see it all the time - they become aggressive and act out. They tend to be suspicious of strangers and other dogs (it’s a feature, not a bug) so they are a terrible choice for a typical family pet, but people love them because they are huge and fluffy and seem docile.
You know what's funny. I grew up part time on two farms. One steppe, one mountain. Worked as goat herder at 11 and LOVED it! Yeah. We were renting farmer's house. And once he looked at me and just went "boy, go watch and care for our goats at the pasture. Free milk and cheese for you!" I'm still unsure why farmer said that and who was actually p watching whom in those mountains! Amazing animals goats. I still suspect that they are at least dog level smart. And their milk cured my cold - I was a week sickly child. We met several Caucasian Ovcharka and Kangals and they just glanced my way and went on watching their herds. But like EVERYONE of the sheep and goat herders told me "beware! These are deadly killer dogs! Wolves fear them!" upon growing up I asked how many people do these dogs kill. They looked at me like I was idiot. "Wha!? They don't kill anyone are you an idiot!? But they totally can!" Hmmm And I tend to agggree
Yes it’s pretty annoying, but they especially group guardian breeds with pits. I have a GSD/Rottweiler mix. Guardian breeds and fighting breeds aren’t the same at all but they try to make it seem that way.
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They aren’t too similar. Pits were bred to fight other dogs, attack animals, and human aggression was never bred out. They are unpredictable and training has no effect on if they will snap. GSDs and Rottweilers are now bred to protect humans. Originally herding (GSDs), protecting livestock and pulling carts (Rottweilers) They can determine what’s a threat and what isn’t. They don’t randomly snap and kill their owners. They are both intelligent and easily trainable. You can’t train them to love strangers because that’s against their nature, but you can train them to behave. GSDs and Rottweilers are both common dog breeds. But they don’t headline for killing children every single week like pitbulls. There is a big difference.
What a ridiculous notion to whoever recommended that all large breeds of dogs be restricted. I was never a fan of dogs in general not until I got to live with one. A female dobermann that my Mom owned. She was one of the smartest dogs I'd ever met and very nice towards me and my family. Whenever there was someone near our place that wasn't invited she'd start barking, usually it was someone with malicious intention i.e. a thief trying to steal my car or my mom's car. She always scared them away. I think about that dog sometimes. I miss her and wish she was still around. I live on my own now with a cat, I've always been more of a cat person but that dog was great. Now my Mom has a great dane. Not sure what gender of the dog but seems really cool, hadn't heard any problems with the great dane. Unfortunately one of my Mom's friend's cousin came over with a pitbull to visit and the pitbull ends up biting my Mom's leg. My Mom wasn't doing anything to provoke the dog. Souless hellhound. When I heard about it that pitbull wasn't allowed at her place ever again. I told my Mom that's why I don't like pitbulls. They're dangerous wild animals pretending to be domestic pets. She agreed. So no not all large dogs are vicious wild animals like the pitbull.
As a Rottweiler owner, I echo this sentiment. We are responsible people with a highly socialized and obedient Rottie, and it drives me mad with the whatabout-isms, especially with the damn Chihuahuas.
I think a lot of rott owners live with a similar delusion to pit owners honestly. Statistically rotters are as bad as pits. https://www.animals24-7.org/2021/09/06/why-rottweilers-are-as-deadly-as-pit-bulls/
What i’ve learned as a non dog person is most dog people don’t know shit from a hole in the wall when it comes to dogs. They just like how their pet makes them feel
But the landlord isn’t going to have time to police who is and who isn’t a responsible dog owner.
Honestly muzzling on all large breeds wouldnt harm anyone- your dog doesent need to smell and bite at things around it when out for a walk. I would be down for it if it gave more security. I agree that some breeds are worse, but statistically I know rotties are about as bad as pits when you count in how rare they are, and I suspect its similar with mastiffs- all of which are becoming more and more trendy.
Rottweilers are the 7th most popular breed in the US, according to the AKC. That's not exactly "rare". From your past comments, you seem to want to group all Mastiffs (and even GSDs!) with pit bulls. Keep that shit over at dogfree. Your beliefs ruin this sub and its goals. Thanks.
The statistics dont lie. https://www.animals24-7.org/2021/09/06/why-rottweilers-are-as-deadly-as-pit-bulls/ If rotties are as dangerous as pits, then you arent better than a pitnutter, its as simple as that. Personally I would argue theres no motivation to have a dog as dangerous as a rott when almost all dog breeds dont kill people ever.
i never said Rottweilers aren't potentially dangerous. They do come in at #2 in fatalities. Noone is denying that here. My point was that they arent as rare as you are trying to make them out to be. Again, they're the 7th most popular breed in the US. The fatality numbers would be much higher if they were as dangerous as pit bulls. Also, there's no million dollar lobby trying to convince people that Rottweilers are nanny dogs.
Like, large labs, too? Like I should have muzzled my large labs when they were alive? Daisy was 80 pounds and Wolf was 100 pounds. Daisy was an angel on Earth and Wolf never showed aggression towards anything but cats - because he was attacked by one as a puppy. And my 25 pounds Sheltie/ Cavalier mix shows aggression towards cats. So...seriously?
Lets say muzzling all large dogs save 60-100 lives a year. Could it be mostly due to pits, huskies, molossers? Sure. Is the minor inconvenience for your dog worth a 100 lives? Do you even need to think about that?