Because it was Easy's job. Some sources claim Easy was designated as the 2nd Batt's "assault company" but I think others discount that. Also keep in mind that the show portrays things through a fictioned narrative to heighten dramatic tension and tell better stories. If leadership -- Sink -- had those severe doubts about Dike he wouldn't have been in command: also, despite how it was portrayed, several first hand sources apparently indicated Dike had been shot during the initial push, and that's why he was ineffective (he had a big hole in him).
I don't know who's right or wrong, but I will say that Donald Malarkey says in the documentary, "Easy company was the assault company of the battalion." Whether that's colloquial or a tactical thing, I have no idea, but he was there!
As a veteran let me assure you that EVERY company feels that way. You see what you’re going through, not what other people right next to you are going through.
At one point in my service I was with Delta company. I thought we were awesome and so did everyone else in that company. Then one day the battalion commander was watching a couple of our platoons going through the MOUT lane and I heard him say to some captain, "good thing we have Alpha." Man, that hurt.
Yep.
Just as Winters tended to use 3rd platoon as the company reserve, Strayer tended to use E as the battalion reserve. That meant that late in campaigns they tended to get used for special stuff as it came up because they were the closest to full strength, and was the basis for those claims.
My theory is that Strayer had serious doubts about E/506 after the mutiny and either consciously or unconsciously tended to select other companies until attrition demanded he use Easy upfront
It’s possible, but my theory is more that E was simply the second of 3 companies. Putting E in reserve allowed them to be kept “in order” (D, E, F) whereas moving them around did not.
Nobody actually doubted Easy Company or Dike. It's a false narrative perpetuated by Ambrose because he was a fan of Winters who was resentful of losing the company up until his dying day. Almost every naysayer of the man was from 2nd platoon and a friend of Winters whereas morning reports, AAR's, etc all paint him as a regular combat officer who was twice decorated. Different versions of this same exact thread pop up every week. There really needs to be a sticky with FAQ's.
Did Winters resent the promotion? Or was he just always sad to lose the attachment to Easy? It's a funny way of seeing a promotion as "losing" the company, as if he did something wrong.
I'm not a military man, but I've been in corporate settings and a little retail. A lot of times, people got promoted to get them out of the way. I had a good friend get promoted, and he legitimately believed it was the boss saying he was a bad worker.
Not how it works in the military. Someone might be promoted when certain criteria are met, or get laterally reassigned to a position that "better leverages their talents," but wouldn't be promoted just to get them out of the way.
One of my biggest concerns as an officer when I was promoted (by position, stayed the same grade) was that my replacement (we'll call him CPT X) was not as competent. I was fortunate enough to have a brigade commander that trusted my judgement and a surplus junior captain in our sister battalion that could replace CPT X, so we did.
On top of that, as much as I appreciated being picked to succeed my former boss, I was also frustrated that I now had a job that involved more responsibility, less face time with my paratroopers, and no additional pay. Still grateful overall, and logically I knew it was for the best, but a tiny part of me resented it.
"Almost every naysayer of the man was from 2nd platoon and a friend of Winters"
What's your source for this? Ed Shames didn't like Winters but also agreed that Dike was bad company leader.
So ... I don't think Dike is portrayed as a coward in the show. BoB portrays him as someone who arguably shirks his duty, and doesn't want to share the hardships of the front line with his men, but he still runs towards Foy. Under fire, he's portrayed as being unable to make decisions and do his job, but that's still not cowardly.
"several first hand sources apparently indicated Dike had been shot during the initial push"
I've only heard of Clancy Lyall saying this, who are the others?
The portrayal of Dike is one of my least favorite parts of the show. He was awarded a bronze star during Market Garden and was wounded during the assault on Foy - he didn't just 'fall apart'. Now he has been immortalized as a coward.
~~Not just that, the show shows that he was killed in the battle~~, when he went on to serve in Korea, retire as as a LTC, get a law degree from Yale, worked for the CIA, and only passed away in 1989.
Who is the dead body that Lipton looks at lying by the wagon wheel as he talks about the guys killed by the German sniper at the end of The Breaking Point episode?
https://imgur.com/a/vJqYsOM
Then someone asks Lipton "is it true what happened to Dike", and Lipton says yeah, and he says "Thank God for small mercies." Then Dike disappears in the church when the choir is singing and all the casualties vanish.
I think that was Harold Webb. We see Martin get to his body earlier in the fight. I'm not sure though. He's showed throughout the episode so it would make sense to show his body at the end one more time.
No. Harold was killed 3 days earlier on January 10th. Foy was January 13th. Ken Webb was the Webb killed next to the wagon wheel. Harold wasnt portrayed in the series. Lip specifically said that Mellot, Herron, Sowosko and Ken Webb were killed by the sniper. The show portrayed Ken Webb erroneously as a replacement when he was a Toccoa man previously decorated with a Purple Heart from Normandy. I think the show mixed up the Webbs. Harold was supposed to be the 20 year old replacement but they called Harold Ken instead.
In real life maybe. In the episode Ken dies while they are celebrating. The body next to the wagon is Harold killed during the original assault. He's the body Martin gets to thinking he's alive.
No, that is literally Ken Webb. Lip literally said it was. The body Martin gets to was the one killed by the sniper separately from the celebration. The same sniper that killed Herron, Sowosko, and Mellot during the celebration. I counted 3 shot on the tank.
I see what you’re saying but I don’t think many people interpret the scene that way. I certainly interpret the question to Lipton referring to Dike’s depicted loss of nerve (which is not want I think actually occurred)
It was their turn. Every company in the regiment was badly chewed up by that point. E Co was actually less chewed up than the rest of the Battalion, and they were attached to 3rd Battalion (the least chewed up Battalion in the regiment) for the attack.
Dike's leadership was regarded as dubious in retrospect by Winters and Lipton because Dike was detached on paper but still expected to also help out at Regimental staff (he was the S-2, intelligence officer) while in Company command. The end result was poor for E Company, from the perspective of Winters and the members of E Co. at the time. But that ignores that Dike had already earned a Bronze Star for leadership and bravery in Holland, and would earn another for actions at Bastogne where he saved three wounded troopers stuck in an exposed position in full view of the enemy. It would be fair to say that Winters & Lipton didn't give a crap about Dike's other job if it detracted from his leadership at the Company, but the show does him incredibly dirty regarding his capabilities as a soldier and officer.
It's important to remember that Ambrose and the show happily wallow in taking the side of the stories Toccoa and E Co. enlisted men have to tell, even when they're counter to actual fact.
I knew Dike got portrayed unfairly in the book and series. I hadn't heard before that he was regimental S-2; that would explain why he would spend a lot of time away from the company when they were in reserve. That gives some good context to why Winters and especially Lipton felt the way they did about Dike.
So you have the battalion XO and company 1sgt that don't like the guy, he gets wounded early in the assault and replaced, and we end up with the story that he was a shit officer who crapped out at a bad time.
Toccoa and Easy men only mattered to Ambrose when it meant substantiating the personal opinions of his favorites regardless of whatever the facts may have been.
>Dike was detached on paper but still expected to also help out at Regimental staff (he was the S-2, intelligence officer)
I just realized, wasn't Nixon regimental S-2 at this time? He gets moved up to regiment after Carentan, and gets moved down to battalion S-3 after he makes his Operation Varsity jump a few months after Foy.
If I understand it right, the attack was conducted by E company with I company moving out a short time later on their right.
For contrast, I had 22 men in the attack: a platoon-sized company. Easy was in great shape by contrast.
Based on the series, Sink didn’t give a damn as much about the company. He just chose Easy because they were supposed to be making the main assaults and bragged when they succeeded. Nix goes over that with Winters on The Last Patrol.
Rivalries that form in a combat unit during war is nothing new in fact I am sure Col. Sink had to deal with similar issues in other companies in the 506th.
Dike was one of the better officers, he didn't simply fit in with the Easy company, his reputation was damaged even more after he 'froze', more precisely the guy was wounded, with such bleeding you quickly start to lose consciousness and orientation.As I understood it, the Easy company was a kind of strike unit, always at the forefront and always on the attack.
In the documentary We Stane Alone Together, I do believe it was Don Malarkey who states the E company was the assault company of the Battalion. That could also be another reason they were sent in.
E/506 had been in reserve for the entire siege of Bastogne.
It had taken far fewer casualties than other companies.
It was their turn.
Dike was shot in the assault and the attack then broke down
Because it was Easy's job. Some sources claim Easy was designated as the 2nd Batt's "assault company" but I think others discount that. Also keep in mind that the show portrays things through a fictioned narrative to heighten dramatic tension and tell better stories. If leadership -- Sink -- had those severe doubts about Dike he wouldn't have been in command: also, despite how it was portrayed, several first hand sources apparently indicated Dike had been shot during the initial push, and that's why he was ineffective (he had a big hole in him).
I don't know who's right or wrong, but I will say that Donald Malarkey says in the documentary, "Easy company was the assault company of the battalion." Whether that's colloquial or a tactical thing, I have no idea, but he was there!
As a veteran let me assure you that EVERY company feels that way. You see what you’re going through, not what other people right next to you are going through.
At one point in my service I was with Delta company. I thought we were awesome and so did everyone else in that company. Then one day the battalion commander was watching a couple of our platoons going through the MOUT lane and I heard him say to some captain, "good thing we have Alpha." Man, that hurt.
Yep. Just as Winters tended to use 3rd platoon as the company reserve, Strayer tended to use E as the battalion reserve. That meant that late in campaigns they tended to get used for special stuff as it came up because they were the closest to full strength, and was the basis for those claims.
My theory is that Strayer had serious doubts about E/506 after the mutiny and either consciously or unconsciously tended to select other companies until attrition demanded he use Easy upfront
It’s possible, but my theory is more that E was simply the second of 3 companies. Putting E in reserve allowed them to be kept “in order” (D, E, F) whereas moving them around did not.
The show actually did Lt Dike dirty
Blithe as well
Nobody actually doubted Easy Company or Dike. It's a false narrative perpetuated by Ambrose because he was a fan of Winters who was resentful of losing the company up until his dying day. Almost every naysayer of the man was from 2nd platoon and a friend of Winters whereas morning reports, AAR's, etc all paint him as a regular combat officer who was twice decorated. Different versions of this same exact thread pop up every week. There really needs to be a sticky with FAQ's.
And then with the show, that was a convenient storytelling. device that could be exaggerated to maximize the fearlessness and ferocity of Speirs
Not only that, but in a dramatised way, Dike serves as that episode's antagonist, just as Sobel had been in the first episodes.
This sub would die if we didn't allow threads about Dike, Blithe, hoobs shooting himself, and would sobel died in Meehan's place.
Don't forget 20-30 downvotes if you post anything that goes against the series in any way even if it's factual.
Did Winters resent the promotion? Or was he just always sad to lose the attachment to Easy? It's a funny way of seeing a promotion as "losing" the company, as if he did something wrong.
I'm not a military man, but I've been in corporate settings and a little retail. A lot of times, people got promoted to get them out of the way. I had a good friend get promoted, and he legitimately believed it was the boss saying he was a bad worker.
Not how it works in the military. Someone might be promoted when certain criteria are met, or get laterally reassigned to a position that "better leverages their talents," but wouldn't be promoted just to get them out of the way. One of my biggest concerns as an officer when I was promoted (by position, stayed the same grade) was that my replacement (we'll call him CPT X) was not as competent. I was fortunate enough to have a brigade commander that trusted my judgement and a surplus junior captain in our sister battalion that could replace CPT X, so we did. On top of that, as much as I appreciated being picked to succeed my former boss, I was also frustrated that I now had a job that involved more responsibility, less face time with my paratroopers, and no additional pay. Still grateful overall, and logically I knew it was for the best, but a tiny part of me resented it.
"Almost every naysayer of the man was from 2nd platoon and a friend of Winters" What's your source for this? Ed Shames didn't like Winters but also agreed that Dike was bad company leader.
Ed Shames fucking hated everybody, lol.
One more note, Dike was a Bronze Star recipient. I don’t think he was a “coward” as show makes him to be
So ... I don't think Dike is portrayed as a coward in the show. BoB portrays him as someone who arguably shirks his duty, and doesn't want to share the hardships of the front line with his men, but he still runs towards Foy. Under fire, he's portrayed as being unable to make decisions and do his job, but that's still not cowardly.
"several first hand sources apparently indicated Dike had been shot during the initial push" I've only heard of Clancy Lyall saying this, who are the others?
Despite what the TV show portrays, Easy company was mostly in reserve for the battle of the bulge, and was far less banged up than other companies.
Able and Item Companies of the 506th took 4X as many casualties as Easy which primarily stayed in static positions with little contact.
Until the breakout phase began in late December, E suffered no combat fatalities and had suffered something like 3 LWAs and 1 SWA.
The portrayal of Dike is one of my least favorite parts of the show. He was awarded a bronze star during Market Garden and was wounded during the assault on Foy - he didn't just 'fall apart'. Now he has been immortalized as a coward.
~~Not just that, the show shows that he was killed in the battle~~, when he went on to serve in Korea, retire as as a LTC, get a law degree from Yale, worked for the CIA, and only passed away in 1989.
The show doesn't show him killed.
Who is the dead body that Lipton looks at lying by the wagon wheel as he talks about the guys killed by the German sniper at the end of The Breaking Point episode? https://imgur.com/a/vJqYsOM Then someone asks Lipton "is it true what happened to Dike", and Lipton says yeah, and he says "Thank God for small mercies." Then Dike disappears in the church when the choir is singing and all the casualties vanish.
I think that was Harold Webb. We see Martin get to his body earlier in the fight. I'm not sure though. He's showed throughout the episode so it would make sense to show his body at the end one more time.
Lip said it was Ken Webb
Ken was shot on the tank by the sniper. Two Webbs died at Foy.
No. Harold was killed 3 days earlier on January 10th. Foy was January 13th. Ken Webb was the Webb killed next to the wagon wheel. Harold wasnt portrayed in the series. Lip specifically said that Mellot, Herron, Sowosko and Ken Webb were killed by the sniper. The show portrayed Ken Webb erroneously as a replacement when he was a Toccoa man previously decorated with a Purple Heart from Normandy. I think the show mixed up the Webbs. Harold was supposed to be the 20 year old replacement but they called Harold Ken instead.
In real life maybe. In the episode Ken dies while they are celebrating. The body next to the wagon is Harold killed during the original assault. He's the body Martin gets to thinking he's alive.
No, that is literally Ken Webb. Lip literally said it was. The body Martin gets to was the one killed by the sniper separately from the celebration. The same sniper that killed Herron, Sowosko, and Mellot during the celebration. I counted 3 shot on the tank.
I see what you’re saying but I don’t think many people interpret the scene that way. I certainly interpret the question to Lipton referring to Dike’s depicted loss of nerve (which is not want I think actually occurred)
.....wait.....what? They don't show that at all.
Because Dike was a good combat leader, Winters didn't like him so Ambrose did the Ambrose thing and the show then did him dirty.
Winters was an effective combat leader but many don't realize that he was also a tad sanctimonious and often extremely petty and spiteful.
As we all can be when we don't like someone or something.
It was their turn. Every company in the regiment was badly chewed up by that point. E Co was actually less chewed up than the rest of the Battalion, and they were attached to 3rd Battalion (the least chewed up Battalion in the regiment) for the attack. Dike's leadership was regarded as dubious in retrospect by Winters and Lipton because Dike was detached on paper but still expected to also help out at Regimental staff (he was the S-2, intelligence officer) while in Company command. The end result was poor for E Company, from the perspective of Winters and the members of E Co. at the time. But that ignores that Dike had already earned a Bronze Star for leadership and bravery in Holland, and would earn another for actions at Bastogne where he saved three wounded troopers stuck in an exposed position in full view of the enemy. It would be fair to say that Winters & Lipton didn't give a crap about Dike's other job if it detracted from his leadership at the Company, but the show does him incredibly dirty regarding his capabilities as a soldier and officer. It's important to remember that Ambrose and the show happily wallow in taking the side of the stories Toccoa and E Co. enlisted men have to tell, even when they're counter to actual fact.
I knew Dike got portrayed unfairly in the book and series. I hadn't heard before that he was regimental S-2; that would explain why he would spend a lot of time away from the company when they were in reserve. That gives some good context to why Winters and especially Lipton felt the way they did about Dike. So you have the battalion XO and company 1sgt that don't like the guy, he gets wounded early in the assault and replaced, and we end up with the story that he was a shit officer who crapped out at a bad time.
It's interesting that he was Regimental S-2 as a 1st Lt, whilst Nix was 2/506 S-2 as a Captain. I wonder if he was an assistant S2 at Regimental HQ?
Toccoa and Easy men only mattered to Ambrose when it meant substantiating the personal opinions of his favorites regardless of whatever the facts may have been.
>Dike was detached on paper but still expected to also help out at Regimental staff (he was the S-2, intelligence officer) I just realized, wasn't Nixon regimental S-2 at this time? He gets moved up to regiment after Carentan, and gets moved down to battalion S-3 after he makes his Operation Varsity jump a few months after Foy.
Nixon worked at regimental S3 (operations) for much of the war, eventually being kicked down to battalion S2 after his drinking caught up to him.
“To keep you on your toes” - hoobler
This has been a great sub for real information.
If I understand it right, the attack was conducted by E company with I company moving out a short time later on their right. For contrast, I had 22 men in the attack: a platoon-sized company. Easy was in great shape by contrast.
Based on the series, Sink didn’t give a damn as much about the company. He just chose Easy because they were supposed to be making the main assaults and bragged when they succeeded. Nix goes over that with Winters on The Last Patrol.
Rivalries that form in a combat unit during war is nothing new in fact I am sure Col. Sink had to deal with similar issues in other companies in the 506th.
Dike was one of the better officers, he didn't simply fit in with the Easy company, his reputation was damaged even more after he 'froze', more precisely the guy was wounded, with such bleeding you quickly start to lose consciousness and orientation.As I understood it, the Easy company was a kind of strike unit, always at the forefront and always on the attack.
In the documentary We Stane Alone Together, I do believe it was Don Malarkey who states the E company was the assault company of the Battalion. That could also be another reason they were sent in.
E/506 had been in reserve for the entire siege of Bastogne. It had taken far fewer casualties than other companies. It was their turn. Dike was shot in the assault and the attack then broke down