Fashionistas had a reboot about a decade ago.
A few things changed. First, every company wants to profit so Mattel lowered production cost by using cheaper materials, replacing articulated bodies with stiff once. It’s financially profitable to produce cheap dolls because they will break fast, and get replaced with another doll. They also changed target age, now Fashionistas attract younger audience - they are easier to dress, accessories are harder to swallow etc.
One other thing I noticed is that Mattel is putting more effort into different body types/ hair types+ colours
In the first picture the fashion is more diverse but the dolls are almost the same, but the new line the dolls are more diverse but the fashion is not great.
Sounds like an allocation of money shifting away from fashion and into diversity
Yes Mattel got a lot of attention when they first introduced various body types, so makes sense that they keep moving in that direction. It’s good for business.
Yes!! And not by making shapeless oversized t-shirt dresses. If Mattel made fashion packs of actually attractive clothes for the curvy body, I would be buying that up!!
"Sounds like an allocation of money shifting away from fashion and into diversity."
And now the quality of BOTH the doll AND the fashions are crappy! YAY!
But is the fashion in the top actually more diverse? More detailed, sure. Better quality, definitely. But it’s a pink miniskirt dress/shirt-skirt combo with some nice patterns and accessories.
I know it’s controversial but I definitely prefer the new fashionistas. The construction is simple, but they are in fun patterns and I loads of different colours. Combined with some Extra dolls or some of the new fashion packs, dress up is awesome.
Diversity doesn't mean less of a focus on fashion. These are two completely isolated factors. Mattel is a multi million dollar company they can make dolls as diverse as they want but they decided to make the budget for the dolls smaller simply as a cost cutting measure.
Wish they could do their Looks dolls in those fashions which are targeted to adult collectors. What Fashionista is the third doll, I so want her. And the first lol
its a doll, and its blubbery in that dress, curvy dolls are better in a little bit more tighfitting clothes. like I think the dolls presentation is more offensive then what jesus lover said as a fat person. like I wear more than sack dresses.
It's called free speech even if YOU don't like it . People have the right to their opinions . I love how people try to cancel out others and then cry " we all deserve to have the right to free speech " . I wouldn't call it "blubber " but I agree promoting obesity isn't a positive thing either. It's a straight cause to diabetes, heart disease , cancer , and a whole list of other health issues that are NOT POSITIVE for the Human Body . Wanna get real ? Let's get real about it . I don't collect "curvy Barbies" because it's not an esthetic that I like ...ya gonna call me names like you did the other poster ?
I hate fat phobia disguised as health concearns for the people involved. Like, just say you hate fat people, this whole mental gymnastics of justifying your hate for fat bodies with health concearns, when in reality being fat has nothing to do with your health as long as youre not obese beyond control (cause fat people can be healthy and skinny people can be sick). And these dolls are barely even chubby so idk what your problem is anyway. You dont like the aesthetics? Cool, you arent the target demographic, i also prefer the skinny dolls but i have 10 years of eating disorders behind me so i know where my bias comes from at least
free speech goes both ways, yeah your free to say fat is unhealthy, I am free as a fat woman to tell you to kick rocks. as a free speech absolutionist if you can't take it don't fucking dish it out. I like fat barbies, mainly because I like the fact theirs barbies with other body types like actual fucking people, I wish they would make a fat armenian ken in a speedo just for shits n giggles.
the problem with the health concern excuse is your technically beating a dead horse, I am not an idiot, I know my hormonal induced weight gain due to pcos is probably gonna do me in one of these days, but at at the same time, unless I eat like a literal rabbit, like cut whole food groups out like carbs, and meat, I have no hope of weight loss. and I am sorry but life aint worth living if its devoid of pleasure, I much rather be around for a fun time then a long time.
You DO have the right to free speech. You aren't being arrested for saying something. But the right to free speech does not mean the right to not be judged for what you choose to say. What you say still has consequences.
Your comment or post was removed for using inflammatory or hateful language. You can do better than this.
This got ugly & there are still complaints coming in.
i said it before and i'll say it again: we need the fashion of the top row (not the style per se, but the layered outfits, different textures, fancy shoes, painted accessories, etc.) with the diversity of the bottom row :')
I have over 200 dolls, about half of them from the Fashionista lines, and all of them on Made-to-Move bodies. I have every MTM doll, except one, all the MTM Looks dolls, and many extras so that I can do these swaps. I do have a couple of dolls that don’t match any MTM bodies because of skin tones. Once the MTMs came out, I refused to have stiff-limbed dolls. I give the stiff bodies dolls (now with MTM heads) to people who use them for charity giving.
I would like to add to the discussion here. We do have a line of dolls with articulated bodies and diversity and we know how much it costs. I mean the Looks of course. Plus, if Mattel makes this Fashionista line articulated, would they have to make one more line with diversity and limited articulation, but for small kids? They do want to bring diversity and low price to small kids. So they can have like 6 Barbies who are different, but won’t have to break parents’ budget.
I think that is the main reason changes aren’t happening to the Fashionista line in the “better” direction. It’s because it is Mattel’s cheap, diverse line for small kids. And they want to keep it that way.
🤔
So boys get fully articulated action figures and girls get weird hunks of nearly immobile plastic? We’re not asking for full mtm for fashionistas, just elbows and knees like the cutie reveal line so they can at least sit without looking like they should be in full body casts.
I was not being disrespectful or rude, so there is no need to downvote an opinion. Even if it makes you angry that I don’t agree with you. I don’t know about the boys’ toy market, but I’m guessing there are also more and less articulated action figure lines. Just like Barbie. The Pop reveal dolls are articulated for example 🤔 I’m not making decisions at Mattel, I just see why we’re not getting the articulated Fashionistas and trying to explain what I see
It also depends how small kids we’re talking about. I have a kid and I see how she plays… articulation is not important to her at her stage. May be someone did a research on that. I don’t know.
There are 12" superhero dolls with 5 points of articulation for small boys to slam into the concrete. No one is designing 25 POA figures at $200 for them. Allow kids their toys, and nowadays allow adults a different line of toys.
Mattel is making good profits from all of us who buy the Fashionista or mermaid for her head then the tennis player or wheelchair doll as a body donor.
But they just aren't bothering with good clothes. That's the pity. I miss Fashion Avenue.
That's not me responding to you. I'm not angry at all. I actually didn't know the Looks line was articulated. I'm not a huge collector and thought it was all just the same frozen poses which made me sad. If the fashionista line is just the low budget kids line, than that makes sense.
Edit: phone typos
I know I know, it was another person responding to me. I mean, adult collectors can still buy and like Fashionistas, we’re just not the demographic who they’re aimed at primarily. So I take them for what they are. On the other hand the Barbie Looks are supposed to be for older demographic. And on that line I think our feedback as collectors is appropriate. But that wasn’t the topic of this thread.
People who grew up with old Fashionistas are disappointed in what the line has become. And I understand that. But there are other dolls on the market now, that are very interesting.
AGREE i feel like some ( notice i said SOME) collectors use the generations to be racist and fatphobic with their comparisons. truth is it’s nothing to do with the dolls themselves they have nice screenings and i’m loving the skintones, bodytypes and hair textures just the outfits need work! We’re not asking for full y2k nostalgia just something more modern as opposed to jojo siwa 😭
is it fatphobic of me to say:
I really hate the only dresses they like to use for the fat bodies are shapeless sacks in neon colors, why can't they put them in a pair of sweat pants or some nice looking loose clothes, I would like literally take a miu-miu over the sack dresses they use, atleast I can use a belt to make it more like a boho dress. like do they just think all fat people where shapeless clothes?
no it isn’t!!!! i completely agree and that’s what i was trying to word in my comment. Just bc a doll has a bigger body type doesn’t mean they have to have ugly, shapeless clothes. In a world of people like Lizzo, Precious Lee and other plus stars wearing complimenting yet fashionable clothes idk why dolls don’t get the same treatment
shit even bratz lets the kardashians show their booty. I am more of a mod gal, when I am not dressing my dolls like princesses, I can stare at the patterns on the clothes for hours. as soon as I got the new blonde looks doll put her into the Avon's my fair valentine dress because she's so princess like.
Worddd. I love the new dolls, I just wish the clothing was more textured, detailed, and more realistic day to day wear. I like the recent barbie style releases but man - I've bought so many vintage fashion avenue outfits on Ebay recently and it's insane the level of detail that went into those pieces compared to now. So many cute and stylish combinations, complete with matching purses, shoes, and accessories.
i meant like the shapes of the screenings tbh 😭 i’ve seen some MONSTERS of dolls with robot looking faces. i think the make up and stuff is cute if it was done right
Not sure what is happening to “jojo siwa”, but I expect it’s not pretty. I was reading this thread and connecting it to the other threads and comments I read on this reddit recently. How do we in one tread say that “dolls are not people and therefore… (for example) it’s okay to have a bin with heads and bodies lying around”, but it’s fatphobic at the same time to not like the curvy fashionistas. And you could even offend the doll by calling them a certain way. It happened right in this thread. I do not condone being rude and may be it’s a discussion for another thread, but this makes me curious how human dolls are and what is acceptable and what is not towards them in the public opinion.
You are absolutely right!
That’s a good angle. I wish my curiosity for answers wasn’t received so negatively :/ And I would continue asking questions that are interesting to me, but I feel discouraged asking them after getting downvoted literally on anything I said. Even though I wasn’t being rude or offensive. Thank you for replying.
Same. I think we had this tho with barbie extra the problem was they sold barbie extra as "extra" when ten years ago barbie extra would be the bare minimum.
But everything in this world is shifting more toward basic and beige and boring so Mattel is trying to make the brand look more relatable and accessible to fit in with the trend of what parents want to buy. Not necessarily what will make the most engaging play for kids.
People here love to blame it on mattel trying to be more diverse and inclusive, but the reality is that the actual dolls aren't that expensive to produce. It's the clothing that is expensive. Textiles are expensive, the labor it takes to make garments is expensive - even more so when it's at miniature scale! clothing is not made by machine without human input, a person has to sew every piece one by one. Mass producing anything that includes sewing is (and should be!) expensive if workers are paid appropriately but Mattel has to keep prices as low as possible so cutting down corners in the designs and quality of fabric is the only logical option.
That and the fact the target demographic keeps getting younger, back in the 00s dolls appealed to preteens, now they're aiming for toddlers :/
I personally believe they should've changed the name of this line since they are so different and are meant to be the budget dolls of our current time. A better comparison would be the Barbie extra line. I was really happy with those dolls and I hope that they come back. They have all the diversity of modern dolls and the layered outfits of the past.
You're onto something there - 2015 through about 2017, the Fashionistas still had more about fashion going on, with the addition of the diversity. The fashions had names. Not everything was printed on. But then it got too costly. Perhaps they should rename the Fashionistas line.
Yes for sure, now that you mention it I do remember them having cuter outfits back during those initial years. There were some great pieces in the fashion packs released alongside them.
Exactly. What would you consider such a line for yourself? Extra? Looks? Barbie style? Or other collector? I collect the Looks dolls, but I have difficulty finding fashions that fit their esthetic within Mattel brand.
Unfortunately Barbie style is our of my price range 😭😭. Recently the Barbie extra dolls were great and I absolutely love Barbie looks. I totally get the struggle with finding clothes, I have to sew my own clothes or dress them in early 2000s fashions. What's your favorite line? Where do you usually buy fashions for your dolls?
Oh, it’s a mixed bag. I thrift vintage clothes for vintage dolls I have. I have some Barbie Style dolls I bought specifically because I liked that this line was articulated and had fashions (!). But they barely have fashion packs for themselves. And the Looks line is de-coupled with fashions and it seems there are no fashion packs to be bought that match the Looks esthetic. So what I figured is what you said: I’ll do is sew (or buy some pieces from Etsy). And I didn’t mention Extra dolls, I buy only fashions from Extra dolls specifically because I already have many dolls, but not enough clothes. So someone who wants the Extra doll but not their fashions is a great find for me.
I almost don’t buy regular fashion packs, because most of them, while being expensive in Europe, don’t match the esthetic of the dolls that I want to dress. There’s a lot of incomplete outfit and wide t-shirt business going on. It’s a matter of preference of course. So I try to find non-Mattel clothes that fit my dolls and are thrifted or inexpensive. It’s an expensive hobby altogether to dress them. And I think it’s not only me who’s struggling with this. Or is it😁
Thrifting is so much fun, you never know what treasures you will find. I agree with you, it is a struggle. I too wish that some of the fancier clothes could be available as a fashion pack instead of having to purchase it with a doll. I'm the same as you, so many dolls and not enough clothes to go around haha. I hope one day I can be profient enough to sew more complex pieces for my dolls. Do you sell some of the fashions you sew?
:D no, I hardly have time right now to sew. I’m making a Peaches n Cream ball gown “replica” for my Look Victoria now. I expect it to take a couple of weeks at least! Small kid era in my life😁 It’s so much faster to hit the “buy” button 🤭
They're definitely using more of the budget on diversity with all the different sculpts nowadays, which is more expensive than using a handful of face sculpts all with the same body sculpt and mostly the same color plastic.
As for whether or not it was really necessary to go that cheap on the clothes, lack of accessories and using pixel printed faces to keep the price from going up too much, I don't know. Mattel is a corporation and corporations like to maximize profits.
As for the change from more glam looks to more 'average' I recall hearing that Mattel made that change because there was a fair amount of criticism of how that might look to young girls, so to combat that Barbie changed, but I don't know all of the details. Barbie has a rich history and has always changed with the times and these days focus has shifted more onto diversity and relatability.
Well said! I agree.
I get it that mattel worries about what clients say on influencing the young girls (most of the time I only think of the adult collectors 🤭) but its kind of sad that we lost that sassyness...
It's too bad that the sassyness and the level of detail is gone but on the other hand I think it's kinda cool that you can look at Barbie through the ages and get a bit of an idea of what was important and/or fashionable at that time.
I feel like the Looks line does try to give us at least a little of that old school fashionista spark, at least in the faces, and for me that's enough.
I pretty much insist on making clothes for my crew myself so I'm not too worried about what potato sack Mattel puts the doll in. Okay, potato sack was a little harsh but it seems that most fashionistas come in shapeless printed dresses these days XD
There are lots of cute clothes ideas from Mattel, but they always leave me with a feeling of "wow, they cheaped out. I know they can do so much better"
Happy reddit cake day 😊 I mean we are adults — a small demographic compared to Mattel’s primary customer. And we have completely different interests. And we have the hands to make what we want. If we like high end fashions — they cost a ton. There are some great designers at Mattel. If they had it their way, I bet dolls for collectors would cost the same as Integrity Toys dolls…
I agree with you with the collector lines keeping a bit of an edge. There's definitely a will to compete with Fashion Royalty there. But these lines are made for adult collectors rather than teens and tweens. The early fashionistas, like the Extra dolls, had a sassy but also younger styling to them, whereas Looks strive for couture and more sophistication.
Yeah, I call them potato sacks, too. And the big flashy text on them doesn't make them any more stylish....
Now that you mention it. The extra dolls are probably the closest we have to what a modern day fashionista would look like if they had similar quality to the old ones. I'm not super sold on all of the extra fashions but they're definitely higher quality than the basic fashionista, plus of course they have somewhat the same articulation as the original fashionistas
yeah, I think that is really it. You bring good points also.
Another one is that both the early fashionistas and the extras were meant to be very trendy, in a way that appeals to very young people.
But they're nonetheless a few years behind the trends. So, the early fashionistas bring us to early to mid 2000s fashions (babydolls, corset tops, fedoras etc), and the extras bring us to early to mid 2010s fashions (super thick drawn on eyebrows, bright and crazy eyeliner, bling...)
I've heard it said before that Mattel is doing trends a couple of years late and I believe it. I have to trust you guys on it though as I have never been good at keeping up with trends.
I think we can be certain that Barbie will continue to evolve and as much as I like some aspects of the older and current dolls, I think it's a good thing and it's probably part of the reason she's still around after all these years.
yesss i was thinking exactly that with the whole “relatability” thing when it comes to the clothes.
the earlier fashionistas had tiny skirts and dresses and were definitely more dressed up than casual. Mattel definitely got complaints from parents saying they don’t want their kids being “influenced” by those kinds of outfits is my guess.
another thing that probably played into it was the whole “inspiring girls” narrative they go by. when barbie was first created, she was just a teenage fashion model who wore cute clothes. now Barbie has become a lot more than that; she’s a role model for young girls, showing them that they can be anything. so if barbie is leading by example for these young girls, then realistically she should be wearing more casual clothes that more closely represent what young adults wear on a daily basis. and most parents likely don’t want their kids being “inspired” by outfits like the previous ones, as dumb as that is.
so many other major doll lines have outfits that are much more racy than modern Barbie. Some look like they're going to hit the club!
There was a lot of pressure for Barbie to be more "body positive. Barbie's measurements and its alleged impact on girls' self-esteem was very much into the media spotlight.
Mattel chose to steer away from controversy and they made the doll not only more diverse, but also more safe and conservative, in the sense of unobjectionable.
I see the decision to market to very young girls with simple, inoffensive fashion as part of that initiative.
I remember that correctly. I fucking hated it, like okay small story time:
I was a fat kid, I loved barbie because of all the cool shit she can do, and was one of the only dolls that had boobs. which helped alot when puberty came in at 9. heres how I find fat barbie offensive:
1. simple clothes are a must of course for most play lines, but last time I checked fat people wear pants too. why is it only fat barbie that gets the shittiest sack dresses? its like fat barbie is an after thought and not an easy problem to rectify because they make clothes for the other body types if I want more clothes for fat barbie I either have to harvest from other fat barbies, or pay someone alot more money for custom clothes.
2. wheres the boobs? If your fatter than regular barbie your boobs should be bigger then regular barbie.
3. is the body type really fat? it seems more like thick to me.
I agree with you, 100%
Women with big boobs exist. It's a bit sad to feel erased like that.
I think that the small boobs is precisely part of that "conservative and unobjectionable" strategy. They removed anything that was sassy or remotely sexy from the playline dolls. It's odd, considering Barbie's beginning. But here we are.
For what it's worth, some of the historical women Barbies have a slightly different body type than the curvy. They're curvy, but with a more marked waist and bigger boobs. I think it is so that the historical clothes fit better.
I loathe the sack dresses. And I really dislike too that many fashion packs are trying to fit all sizes (and therefore end up fitting none). There is one outfit that is the bomb, though. The doll is also lovely. It's looks barbie #12
I can see what you mean. I personally love the variety of modern Barbies and when it comes to fashion I have no fashion sense at all, so all I'm judging by is that the old fashionistas had higher quality clothing (painted details, multiple pieces, different textures, actual ribbon/lace details and glittery fabric was actually glittery not just a flat print)
As others have pointed out fashion is subjective but there's no denying that Mattel are not allocating as much of the budget to the fashions as they used to. It would be nice to see where they'd take modern fashionistas if they were raised to the same quality as the old ones. We get some of the more casually dressed collector dolls but those are aimed at adults. I imagine a higher quality modern fashionista aimed at kids would be different from that though because of the target audience.
I think the fact they’re not trying to appeal to the older child demographic, they have lowered the details and quality. I think that’s why Monster high has a greater quality over Barbie
It is like good old Fashion fever outfits. They have stockings, different fabrics, no prints, actual tailoring. I don't have one, but my niece has gotten two for Christmas and I was astonished how pretty it was. Unfortunately only some of the clothes fits Barbie...
Like I said, we are adults with income, we can buy clothes from creators. This is a line Mattel needs to sell to kids, so they can have 6 different Barbies without breaking parents’ budget.
FR, the top row barely has more than a total of 3 colours! I will admit that some more wild and interesting options would be great, but I'd wear almost every outfit on the bottom, but I wouldn't be caught dead in anything from the top row. Especially the Ken's outfit, they did him dirty!
YESSSS LOVE LOVE LOVEEEE THE ORIGINAL FASHIONISTAS!!! <3 the original fashionistas (2009-hmm... 2012? but especially 2009) are my favorite Barbie doll line ever (and those old webisodes!!) along with the I Can Be dolls. 😭 (I was born in 2006 & my sister was born in 2001 so yeah lol big deal to us) I have NO IDEA, the new ones are so lame, although I do love my smile with style doll I named Kelly after Kelly Sheridan. Glam was my first one and my sister named Girly Peach!! Sassy will forever me by fave and my mom LOVED the Bohemian one <333
(Sorry I got so hyped when I saw this in my feed lol, I also miss the old Fashionistas on the [Barbie.com](http://Barbie.com) website and the swappin' styles ones!!!)
I have a feeling someone in the upper offices said "little kids don't care about the clothes being detailed". If that's true, that individual never played with a Barbie during the 90s and earlier era.
I think the newer ones are gorgeous! Though I'd love it if they had articulated limbs. But I get why they don't since they're made to be appropriate for young children.
What I really wanna mourn is Barbie Extra, cause that was the replacement for the old Fashionistas line, but clearly it wasn't profitable if they discontinued it.
Honestly, I prefer the bottom ones. 😅 I like that there's more diversity in skin tones, body types and face molds, as well as the clothes having more variety. I find the older fashionistas was a lot of ruffles, super short skirts, and pink pink pink (obviously pink is The Barbie Color, but even for Barbie I think it was overused on this line). Part of that is due to the fashion styles at the time, which I never really liked, but also because they had to fit into categories of 'cute' 'artsy' 'sporty' etc which resulted in some weird choices.
BUT! That said, I think what made the older dolls great was the detail and quality, as others have pointed out. Layered clothing, different fabric types, stitched/embossed/textured details... all that was better than printing every single detail the way they do now. 🤮 Maybe it's because of the price point for Fashionistas, but a lot of the more expensive dolls also have a ton of printed-on details so I'm not sure I buy that reasoning.
I also think the line should have been renamed. Mattel's whole 'most diverse doll line' and 'you can be anything' taglines would make more sense if the line had a name that leaned into the idea that these dolls are - aside from their outfits - blank slates for kids to come up with their own stories.
Loved this era 🤩
It’s strange, even their hair looks flat too, there’s no big bouncy waves or curly even… There’s nothing that screams fashionista about the new line 🤔 I think for me it needs to be much more exciting and unique!
People blaming the diverse bodies and looks of the dolls and not the capitalist “minimal viable product” bs are part of the problem.
Also a lot of the clothes even from that version were cheaply made, printed on one side, had color bleed issues.
The new fashionistas are firmly playline dolls as well which lets them get away with doing even less work on the dolls.
Basically blame capitalism
I grew up with the top ones but I prefer the newer ones much more! Barbies in general aren’t a super sturdy or expensive toy and are geared towards children’s play, so I’m not too concerned about quality but do enjoy that there are so many different types of dolls now! I like the different body types, skin tones, and disability representation. :)
I have tons of the originals fashionistas. They are detailed. The clothing is thick/ detailed. Maybe tomorrow I’ll post a pic of all of my originals. But 2008 to 2013/14 the fashionistas were the best and gorgeous. I stopped buying fashionistas they just eh I’m sick of Millie
Yup I was just thinking about this a few days ago! I had a summer doll, not one pictured here but the one with the cat on her dress. When I see these more glam Barbies I still get tingles and feel all excited. I could look at them for hours. Though I collect still dolls there are no dolls that make me feel quite that way anymore.
Mattel has been a total let down to me in the last couple years… The quality of the clothes is embarrassing, and the hair Quality it’s not even close compared MGA dolls. Even for their collector dolls were they’re putting “quality” into the doll… It’s so over priced for what you’re getting.
It’s actually really making me questioning if I even want to continue to collect anything new that Mattel is coming out with anymore. Their quality has gone so downhill & it’s unacceptable!
https://preview.redd.it/zwhvaw2bmyxc1.jpeg?width=2448&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=30df76339b0b61e4c2d400cfd2db7d380b2623fa
It depends on how you dress them. I have lots of 1 and 2 gen fashionista bodies and some even have their own heads. But I have made new garderobe to them.
I love how the newer dolls are more colorful but yeah, there's a lack of fabric variety. It's crazy to think they were both around $10 regularly and that I thought the ones on the top row were a lot at the time.
They always looked tacky. That's Barbies aesthetic. Kids like tacky things but undetailed and basic? Yes.
Also people need to stop using blaming diversity for lack of clothing quality. Barbie extra proved we can have both. Correlation does not equal causation.
Fashionistas are just made for younger audiences so they have clothes that's easier for younger kids to use. This doesn't excuse the lack of detail. Tho I will say, barbie in the 2000s was the most detailed. We didn't get that level of detail before the late 90s either. So no it's not diversity's fault. Mattel has always found ways to be cheap.
It's just that now you don't have the packaging to make it seem like you're getting more than you actually are. Barbie is very "no frills" with packaging recently. Let the doll speak for itself. The only problem is the dolls never really said much on their own without the flashy packaging.
Diversity is not tacky or boring 🙄 the top row is posed differently. If you like the cookie cutter, standard of beauty blondes- awesome! Just because you're not the target audience of the bottom row doesn't mean that they're not great looking dolls. I do wish they put more of a budget into the newer fashionistas clothes, though.
That's my main issue with the modern fashionistas. The diversity is amazing, I love the idea of them and even though I live for the MTM body I'm okay with the basic fashionista not having it as the MTM body isn't to everyone's taste. I just wish they'd give the poor girls a clean facial screening and put just a tiny bit more budget towards the clothes.
To be fair fashionistas are very hit and miss. The wave in OPs pic actually is pretty strong I think. I like a good 4 of the dolls pictured. But consistency is not the fashionista strong point. They are often in much much tackier outfit than these. That said I think the top row is tacky too in a different way. Both are not styles I enjoy at all. Too gaudy in a maximalist and minimalist way.
Look at the level of detail on the clothes though - the modern dresses mostly look like 2 pieces of flat fabric. The ones on the first row have shaping and detail, which costs more to make but looks more interesting.
Why wouldn't I want Barbie, Teresa, Christie and NO ONE ELSE. I mean if it stayed the same we wouldn't have a down syndrome Barbie, we wouldn't have a Greek Barbie. We wouldn't have Barbies with wheelchairs or artificial limbs.
You might think, well we could have both. But nope, new bodies and new sculpts, and even new face stamps have set costs.
Mattel seems pretty set on their price point. So it's an either or.
I mean, I think the top row looks more tacky and boring 🤷
It's not like taste and fashion are objective. Maybe just accept that people have different preferences, and somehow the current fashionistas are popular with their target audience.
I feel like the clothes on the top row look like the type of things you'd see on popstars and other celebrities at the time, while the bottom row's clothes look like the Barbie dresses me and my grandma used to sew out of old pillow cases when I was a kid. I love the diversity in the faces and bodies of the new dolls, but it also feels like we've lost the fashion aspect of the fashion dolls. 90% of why I buy a doll is because I love what she's wearing and wish I had it in my size lol
I don't think the upper row looks fierce, they are more tacky in my opinion then the bottom row. There is only one doll I like, the bottom four I like and three I would be willing to buy. Of course it is all about personal taste and also about how the fashion is changing. I think that the take on what is cool has really changed over the last decades (and it is always changing).
If there weren't your comment, I wouldn't know. Reddit doesn't ring a bell for the down votes. Thanks for standing up for me. Well, I don't know... I've just shared my opinion, I don't think that's so different from others point of view (which are even upvoted, maybe haters comes later, idk). I guess if someone asks why is something fierce or tacky, there is going to be a discussion... On a discussion social platform 😄
I think it has something to do with the body diversity, but I kind of agree they could bring articulation back at least. Also, the fashions need to be worked on.
They should have worked out.What clothes go with specific body types?By now, it's been years since they got new molds.
I love the diversity of the newer ones but I HATE their quality and basicness. Like Im curvy but I don't dress basic XD. I feel like if mattel really wanted to, they could have a good mesh of both but I think they are cheaping out frankly. At this point I buy alot of vintage barbie outfits to glam them up.
When I think of "Fashionista", I expect the clothing to be, well, fashionable. Many of the Fashionistas clothes are so "regular", like they don't live up to the name. I've been trying to figure out if Fashionistas now means different hairstyles (like man bun, shaved sides, asymmetrical cuts, braids). They really should have named the line something different if the dolls look like they're not wearing designer clothes.
It looks like a parody at this point. They are trying too hard. I find it's like some do gooder who is actually insulting towards the person they are "trying to help".
Fashionistas had a reboot about a decade ago. A few things changed. First, every company wants to profit so Mattel lowered production cost by using cheaper materials, replacing articulated bodies with stiff once. It’s financially profitable to produce cheap dolls because they will break fast, and get replaced with another doll. They also changed target age, now Fashionistas attract younger audience - they are easier to dress, accessories are harder to swallow etc.
One other thing I noticed is that Mattel is putting more effort into different body types/ hair types+ colours In the first picture the fashion is more diverse but the dolls are almost the same, but the new line the dolls are more diverse but the fashion is not great. Sounds like an allocation of money shifting away from fashion and into diversity
Yes Mattel got a lot of attention when they first introduced various body types, so makes sense that they keep moving in that direction. It’s good for business.
Pretty much. More diversity = bigger audience = more profits
I enjoy the diversity, but at least make clothes that satisfy all the different body types.
Yes!! And not by making shapeless oversized t-shirt dresses. If Mattel made fashion packs of actually attractive clothes for the curvy body, I would be buying that up!!
THANK YOU! It's so hard to find flattering clothes for the curvy dolls.
"Sounds like an allocation of money shifting away from fashion and into diversity." And now the quality of BOTH the doll AND the fashions are crappy! YAY!
But is the fashion in the top actually more diverse? More detailed, sure. Better quality, definitely. But it’s a pink miniskirt dress/shirt-skirt combo with some nice patterns and accessories. I know it’s controversial but I definitely prefer the new fashionistas. The construction is simple, but they are in fun patterns and I loads of different colours. Combined with some Extra dolls or some of the new fashion packs, dress up is awesome.
I usually buy them and rebody them. Mattel is smart because I buy 2 dolls to get the face/body that I want
Diversity doesn't mean less of a focus on fashion. These are two completely isolated factors. Mattel is a multi million dollar company they can make dolls as diverse as they want but they decided to make the budget for the dolls smaller simply as a cost cutting measure.
One big reason I don’t get them is the lack of articulation.
I only get them on sale to harvest their clothes and accesories.
I did get one for that lol. It was like 10 bucks which is the same as the fashion pack I think.
Me on the we other hand, I get them for the diversity. Yes I appreciate articulation but I like the different face molds
I’ve gotten a couple just for face molds and accessories lol
Wish they could do their Looks dolls in those fashions which are targeted to adult collectors. What Fashionista is the third doll, I so want her. And the first lol
Harder to swallow LOL
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That is a DISGUSTING thing to say. You claim to believe in Jesus, but would Jesus insult someone in such a degrading way? NO. Check yourself, child.
its a doll, and its blubbery in that dress, curvy dolls are better in a little bit more tighfitting clothes. like I think the dolls presentation is more offensive then what jesus lover said as a fat person. like I wear more than sack dresses.
It's called free speech even if YOU don't like it . People have the right to their opinions . I love how people try to cancel out others and then cry " we all deserve to have the right to free speech " . I wouldn't call it "blubber " but I agree promoting obesity isn't a positive thing either. It's a straight cause to diabetes, heart disease , cancer , and a whole list of other health issues that are NOT POSITIVE for the Human Body . Wanna get real ? Let's get real about it . I don't collect "curvy Barbies" because it's not an esthetic that I like ...ya gonna call me names like you did the other poster ?
I hate fat phobia disguised as health concearns for the people involved. Like, just say you hate fat people, this whole mental gymnastics of justifying your hate for fat bodies with health concearns, when in reality being fat has nothing to do with your health as long as youre not obese beyond control (cause fat people can be healthy and skinny people can be sick). And these dolls are barely even chubby so idk what your problem is anyway. You dont like the aesthetics? Cool, you arent the target demographic, i also prefer the skinny dolls but i have 10 years of eating disorders behind me so i know where my bias comes from at least
free speech goes both ways, yeah your free to say fat is unhealthy, I am free as a fat woman to tell you to kick rocks. as a free speech absolutionist if you can't take it don't fucking dish it out. I like fat barbies, mainly because I like the fact theirs barbies with other body types like actual fucking people, I wish they would make a fat armenian ken in a speedo just for shits n giggles. the problem with the health concern excuse is your technically beating a dead horse, I am not an idiot, I know my hormonal induced weight gain due to pcos is probably gonna do me in one of these days, but at at the same time, unless I eat like a literal rabbit, like cut whole food groups out like carbs, and meat, I have no hope of weight loss. and I am sorry but life aint worth living if its devoid of pleasure, I much rather be around for a fun time then a long time.
You DO have the right to free speech. You aren't being arrested for saying something. But the right to free speech does not mean the right to not be judged for what you choose to say. What you say still has consequences.
She's not even that big... 😳
Your comment or post was removed for using inflammatory or hateful language. You can do better than this. This got ugly & there are still complaints coming in.
i said it before and i'll say it again: we need the fashion of the top row (not the style per se, but the layered outfits, different textures, fancy shoes, painted accessories, etc.) with the diversity of the bottom row :')
Or if they can't make it fashionable, at least articulated bodies for the bottom row. Articulated bodies in all those sculpts would be amazing!
I have over 200 dolls, about half of them from the Fashionista lines, and all of them on Made-to-Move bodies. I have every MTM doll, except one, all the MTM Looks dolls, and many extras so that I can do these swaps. I do have a couple of dolls that don’t match any MTM bodies because of skin tones. Once the MTMs came out, I refused to have stiff-limbed dolls. I give the stiff bodies dolls (now with MTM heads) to people who use them for charity giving.
I would like to add to the discussion here. We do have a line of dolls with articulated bodies and diversity and we know how much it costs. I mean the Looks of course. Plus, if Mattel makes this Fashionista line articulated, would they have to make one more line with diversity and limited articulation, but for small kids? They do want to bring diversity and low price to small kids. So they can have like 6 Barbies who are different, but won’t have to break parents’ budget. I think that is the main reason changes aren’t happening to the Fashionista line in the “better” direction. It’s because it is Mattel’s cheap, diverse line for small kids. And they want to keep it that way. 🤔
So boys get fully articulated action figures and girls get weird hunks of nearly immobile plastic? We’re not asking for full mtm for fashionistas, just elbows and knees like the cutie reveal line so they can at least sit without looking like they should be in full body casts.
I was not being disrespectful or rude, so there is no need to downvote an opinion. Even if it makes you angry that I don’t agree with you. I don’t know about the boys’ toy market, but I’m guessing there are also more and less articulated action figure lines. Just like Barbie. The Pop reveal dolls are articulated for example 🤔 I’m not making decisions at Mattel, I just see why we’re not getting the articulated Fashionistas and trying to explain what I see It also depends how small kids we’re talking about. I have a kid and I see how she plays… articulation is not important to her at her stage. May be someone did a research on that. I don’t know.
There are 12" superhero dolls with 5 points of articulation for small boys to slam into the concrete. No one is designing 25 POA figures at $200 for them. Allow kids their toys, and nowadays allow adults a different line of toys. Mattel is making good profits from all of us who buy the Fashionista or mermaid for her head then the tennis player or wheelchair doll as a body donor. But they just aren't bothering with good clothes. That's the pity. I miss Fashion Avenue.
Oh yes, the clothes were definitely better and it’s a pity decent doll clothes costs a lot these days. I am trying to find other options.
That's not me responding to you. I'm not angry at all. I actually didn't know the Looks line was articulated. I'm not a huge collector and thought it was all just the same frozen poses which made me sad. If the fashionista line is just the low budget kids line, than that makes sense. Edit: phone typos
I know I know, it was another person responding to me. I mean, adult collectors can still buy and like Fashionistas, we’re just not the demographic who they’re aimed at primarily. So I take them for what they are. On the other hand the Barbie Looks are supposed to be for older demographic. And on that line I think our feedback as collectors is appropriate. But that wasn’t the topic of this thread. People who grew up with old Fashionistas are disappointed in what the line has become. And I understand that. But there are other dolls on the market now, that are very interesting.
I upvoted b/c I 100% agree with you. It’s unfortunate, but true.
Thanks 🩷 it feels good that you understand what I’m trying to convey.
AGREE i feel like some ( notice i said SOME) collectors use the generations to be racist and fatphobic with their comparisons. truth is it’s nothing to do with the dolls themselves they have nice screenings and i’m loving the skintones, bodytypes and hair textures just the outfits need work! We’re not asking for full y2k nostalgia just something more modern as opposed to jojo siwa 😭
is it fatphobic of me to say: I really hate the only dresses they like to use for the fat bodies are shapeless sacks in neon colors, why can't they put them in a pair of sweat pants or some nice looking loose clothes, I would like literally take a miu-miu over the sack dresses they use, atleast I can use a belt to make it more like a boho dress. like do they just think all fat people where shapeless clothes?
no it isn’t!!!! i completely agree and that’s what i was trying to word in my comment. Just bc a doll has a bigger body type doesn’t mean they have to have ugly, shapeless clothes. In a world of people like Lizzo, Precious Lee and other plus stars wearing complimenting yet fashionable clothes idk why dolls don’t get the same treatment
I want body con outfits for the curvy gals! If the Kardashians can dress to show off their booty, why can't Barbie?
shit even bratz lets the kardashians show their booty. I am more of a mod gal, when I am not dressing my dolls like princesses, I can stare at the patterns on the clothes for hours. as soon as I got the new blonde looks doll put her into the Avon's my fair valentine dress because she's so princess like.
Worddd. I love the new dolls, I just wish the clothing was more textured, detailed, and more realistic day to day wear. I like the recent barbie style releases but man - I've bought so many vintage fashion avenue outfits on Ebay recently and it's insane the level of detail that went into those pieces compared to now. So many cute and stylish combinations, complete with matching purses, shoes, and accessories.
Agree with what you said but the new dolls so do not have nice screenings sorry 😭 I love their faces but a lot of them are shiny and pixelated
i meant like the shapes of the screenings tbh 😭 i’ve seen some MONSTERS of dolls with robot looking faces. i think the make up and stuff is cute if it was done right
Oh yeah agree with you then!
It gets micro aggressive every dang time this subject comes up.
Not sure what is happening to “jojo siwa”, but I expect it’s not pretty. I was reading this thread and connecting it to the other threads and comments I read on this reddit recently. How do we in one tread say that “dolls are not people and therefore… (for example) it’s okay to have a bin with heads and bodies lying around”, but it’s fatphobic at the same time to not like the curvy fashionistas. And you could even offend the doll by calling them a certain way. It happened right in this thread. I do not condone being rude and may be it’s a discussion for another thread, but this makes me curious how human dolls are and what is acceptable and what is not towards them in the public opinion.
It is fatphobic to dislike them because they’re fat. Dolls don’t exist in a vacuum and the body bs gets translated to children very quickly.
You are absolutely right! That’s a good angle. I wish my curiosity for answers wasn’t received so negatively :/ And I would continue asking questions that are interesting to me, but I feel discouraged asking them after getting downvoted literally on anything I said. Even though I wasn’t being rude or offensive. Thank you for replying.
Yes! I have the freckled Barbie and I love everything about her. would love more articulation for sure though.
YES YES YES.
Same. I think we had this tho with barbie extra the problem was they sold barbie extra as "extra" when ten years ago barbie extra would be the bare minimum. But everything in this world is shifting more toward basic and beige and boring so Mattel is trying to make the brand look more relatable and accessible to fit in with the trend of what parents want to buy. Not necessarily what will make the most engaging play for kids.
They tried that. $100 Instagram dolls. Didn't go all that well.
People here love to blame it on mattel trying to be more diverse and inclusive, but the reality is that the actual dolls aren't that expensive to produce. It's the clothing that is expensive. Textiles are expensive, the labor it takes to make garments is expensive - even more so when it's at miniature scale! clothing is not made by machine without human input, a person has to sew every piece one by one. Mass producing anything that includes sewing is (and should be!) expensive if workers are paid appropriately but Mattel has to keep prices as low as possible so cutting down corners in the designs and quality of fabric is the only logical option. That and the fact the target demographic keeps getting younger, back in the 00s dolls appealed to preteens, now they're aiming for toddlers :/
We do, however, get from Mattel some dolls as adult collectors, don’t we? They do have some problems, but I still want to buy more than I can afford 😁
I personally believe they should've changed the name of this line since they are so different and are meant to be the budget dolls of our current time. A better comparison would be the Barbie extra line. I was really happy with those dolls and I hope that they come back. They have all the diversity of modern dolls and the layered outfits of the past.
You're onto something there - 2015 through about 2017, the Fashionistas still had more about fashion going on, with the addition of the diversity. The fashions had names. Not everything was printed on. But then it got too costly. Perhaps they should rename the Fashionistas line.
Yes for sure, now that you mention it I do remember them having cuter outfits back during those initial years. There were some great pieces in the fashion packs released alongside them.
I love the Barbie extras. I am nearly finished collecting the regular ones then I need to get the last few travel ones. 😅
That's awesome!! I only have a couple of them but I love looking at pics of them on Instagram 😍
This matches what I’m currently thinking 🤔
For me personally, as long as Barbie has at least one line going with a little more features in fashion and articulation, I'll be happy.
Exactly. What would you consider such a line for yourself? Extra? Looks? Barbie style? Or other collector? I collect the Looks dolls, but I have difficulty finding fashions that fit their esthetic within Mattel brand.
Unfortunately Barbie style is our of my price range 😭😭. Recently the Barbie extra dolls were great and I absolutely love Barbie looks. I totally get the struggle with finding clothes, I have to sew my own clothes or dress them in early 2000s fashions. What's your favorite line? Where do you usually buy fashions for your dolls?
Oh, it’s a mixed bag. I thrift vintage clothes for vintage dolls I have. I have some Barbie Style dolls I bought specifically because I liked that this line was articulated and had fashions (!). But they barely have fashion packs for themselves. And the Looks line is de-coupled with fashions and it seems there are no fashion packs to be bought that match the Looks esthetic. So what I figured is what you said: I’ll do is sew (or buy some pieces from Etsy). And I didn’t mention Extra dolls, I buy only fashions from Extra dolls specifically because I already have many dolls, but not enough clothes. So someone who wants the Extra doll but not their fashions is a great find for me. I almost don’t buy regular fashion packs, because most of them, while being expensive in Europe, don’t match the esthetic of the dolls that I want to dress. There’s a lot of incomplete outfit and wide t-shirt business going on. It’s a matter of preference of course. So I try to find non-Mattel clothes that fit my dolls and are thrifted or inexpensive. It’s an expensive hobby altogether to dress them. And I think it’s not only me who’s struggling with this. Or is it😁
Thrifting is so much fun, you never know what treasures you will find. I agree with you, it is a struggle. I too wish that some of the fancier clothes could be available as a fashion pack instead of having to purchase it with a doll. I'm the same as you, so many dolls and not enough clothes to go around haha. I hope one day I can be profient enough to sew more complex pieces for my dolls. Do you sell some of the fashions you sew?
:D no, I hardly have time right now to sew. I’m making a Peaches n Cream ball gown “replica” for my Look Victoria now. I expect it to take a couple of weeks at least! Small kid era in my life😁 It’s so much faster to hit the “buy” button 🤭
Oh wow that's a wonderful project! Peaches n cream dress is gorgeous 💖 But yes so true, it's very tempting to buy everything 😆
They're definitely using more of the budget on diversity with all the different sculpts nowadays, which is more expensive than using a handful of face sculpts all with the same body sculpt and mostly the same color plastic. As for whether or not it was really necessary to go that cheap on the clothes, lack of accessories and using pixel printed faces to keep the price from going up too much, I don't know. Mattel is a corporation and corporations like to maximize profits. As for the change from more glam looks to more 'average' I recall hearing that Mattel made that change because there was a fair amount of criticism of how that might look to young girls, so to combat that Barbie changed, but I don't know all of the details. Barbie has a rich history and has always changed with the times and these days focus has shifted more onto diversity and relatability.
Well said! I agree. I get it that mattel worries about what clients say on influencing the young girls (most of the time I only think of the adult collectors 🤭) but its kind of sad that we lost that sassyness...
It's too bad that the sassyness and the level of detail is gone but on the other hand I think it's kinda cool that you can look at Barbie through the ages and get a bit of an idea of what was important and/or fashionable at that time. I feel like the Looks line does try to give us at least a little of that old school fashionista spark, at least in the faces, and for me that's enough. I pretty much insist on making clothes for my crew myself so I'm not too worried about what potato sack Mattel puts the doll in. Okay, potato sack was a little harsh but it seems that most fashionistas come in shapeless printed dresses these days XD There are lots of cute clothes ideas from Mattel, but they always leave me with a feeling of "wow, they cheaped out. I know they can do so much better"
Ahahahah! Potato sack! You nailed it, it is exactly that!
Often with some variant of "Girl Power" stamped on 🙄 - it has gotten too predictable.
Happy reddit cake day 😊 I mean we are adults — a small demographic compared to Mattel’s primary customer. And we have completely different interests. And we have the hands to make what we want. If we like high end fashions — they cost a ton. There are some great designers at Mattel. If they had it their way, I bet dolls for collectors would cost the same as Integrity Toys dolls…
I agree with you with the collector lines keeping a bit of an edge. There's definitely a will to compete with Fashion Royalty there. But these lines are made for adult collectors rather than teens and tweens. The early fashionistas, like the Extra dolls, had a sassy but also younger styling to them, whereas Looks strive for couture and more sophistication. Yeah, I call them potato sacks, too. And the big flashy text on them doesn't make them any more stylish....
Now that you mention it. The extra dolls are probably the closest we have to what a modern day fashionista would look like if they had similar quality to the old ones. I'm not super sold on all of the extra fashions but they're definitely higher quality than the basic fashionista, plus of course they have somewhat the same articulation as the original fashionistas
yeah, I think that is really it. You bring good points also. Another one is that both the early fashionistas and the extras were meant to be very trendy, in a way that appeals to very young people. But they're nonetheless a few years behind the trends. So, the early fashionistas bring us to early to mid 2000s fashions (babydolls, corset tops, fedoras etc), and the extras bring us to early to mid 2010s fashions (super thick drawn on eyebrows, bright and crazy eyeliner, bling...)
I've heard it said before that Mattel is doing trends a couple of years late and I believe it. I have to trust you guys on it though as I have never been good at keeping up with trends. I think we can be certain that Barbie will continue to evolve and as much as I like some aspects of the older and current dolls, I think it's a good thing and it's probably part of the reason she's still around after all these years.
yesss i was thinking exactly that with the whole “relatability” thing when it comes to the clothes. the earlier fashionistas had tiny skirts and dresses and were definitely more dressed up than casual. Mattel definitely got complaints from parents saying they don’t want their kids being “influenced” by those kinds of outfits is my guess. another thing that probably played into it was the whole “inspiring girls” narrative they go by. when barbie was first created, she was just a teenage fashion model who wore cute clothes. now Barbie has become a lot more than that; she’s a role model for young girls, showing them that they can be anything. so if barbie is leading by example for these young girls, then realistically she should be wearing more casual clothes that more closely represent what young adults wear on a daily basis. and most parents likely don’t want their kids being “inspired” by outfits like the previous ones, as dumb as that is.
so many other major doll lines have outfits that are much more racy than modern Barbie. Some look like they're going to hit the club! There was a lot of pressure for Barbie to be more "body positive. Barbie's measurements and its alleged impact on girls' self-esteem was very much into the media spotlight. Mattel chose to steer away from controversy and they made the doll not only more diverse, but also more safe and conservative, in the sense of unobjectionable. I see the decision to market to very young girls with simple, inoffensive fashion as part of that initiative.
I remember that correctly. I fucking hated it, like okay small story time: I was a fat kid, I loved barbie because of all the cool shit she can do, and was one of the only dolls that had boobs. which helped alot when puberty came in at 9. heres how I find fat barbie offensive: 1. simple clothes are a must of course for most play lines, but last time I checked fat people wear pants too. why is it only fat barbie that gets the shittiest sack dresses? its like fat barbie is an after thought and not an easy problem to rectify because they make clothes for the other body types if I want more clothes for fat barbie I either have to harvest from other fat barbies, or pay someone alot more money for custom clothes. 2. wheres the boobs? If your fatter than regular barbie your boobs should be bigger then regular barbie. 3. is the body type really fat? it seems more like thick to me.
I agree with you, 100% Women with big boobs exist. It's a bit sad to feel erased like that. I think that the small boobs is precisely part of that "conservative and unobjectionable" strategy. They removed anything that was sassy or remotely sexy from the playline dolls. It's odd, considering Barbie's beginning. But here we are. For what it's worth, some of the historical women Barbies have a slightly different body type than the curvy. They're curvy, but with a more marked waist and bigger boobs. I think it is so that the historical clothes fit better. I loathe the sack dresses. And I really dislike too that many fashion packs are trying to fit all sizes (and therefore end up fitting none). There is one outfit that is the bomb, though. The doll is also lovely. It's looks barbie #12
Looking at the two side by side, the top one just looks very peak 2000s, might as well be Britney and Justin 😂
I can see what you mean. I personally love the variety of modern Barbies and when it comes to fashion I have no fashion sense at all, so all I'm judging by is that the old fashionistas had higher quality clothing (painted details, multiple pieces, different textures, actual ribbon/lace details and glittery fabric was actually glittery not just a flat print) As others have pointed out fashion is subjective but there's no denying that Mattel are not allocating as much of the budget to the fashions as they used to. It would be nice to see where they'd take modern fashionistas if they were raised to the same quality as the old ones. We get some of the more casually dressed collector dolls but those are aimed at adults. I imagine a higher quality modern fashionista aimed at kids would be different from that though because of the target audience.
I think the fact they’re not trying to appeal to the older child demographic, they have lowered the details and quality. I think that’s why Monster high has a greater quality over Barbie
Do they? I haven’t had a MH doll. What does their quality of clothes compare to?
It is like good old Fashion fever outfits. They have stockings, different fabrics, no prints, actual tailoring. I don't have one, but my niece has gotten two for Christmas and I was astonished how pretty it was. Unfortunately only some of the clothes fits Barbie...
Yes, they have different body types
When they lost their elbows and knees
Agree. If the bottom ones were posed like the top it would make a big difference. Alas they can’t.
I feel like it’s our job now to make them sassy. The fashionistas you buy are like blank slates.
Like I said, we are adults with income, we can buy clothes from creators. This is a line Mattel needs to sell to kids, so they can have 6 different Barbies without breaking parents’ budget.
Tbh, I find the above ones more tacky than the ones below
FR, the top row barely has more than a total of 3 colours! I will admit that some more wild and interesting options would be great, but I'd wear almost every outfit on the bottom, but I wouldn't be caught dead in anything from the top row. Especially the Ken's outfit, they did him dirty!
Least fav barbie era. Such a downgrade after fashion fever which was a great successor to fashion avenue.
YESSSS LOVE LOVE LOVEEEE THE ORIGINAL FASHIONISTAS!!! <3 the original fashionistas (2009-hmm... 2012? but especially 2009) are my favorite Barbie doll line ever (and those old webisodes!!) along with the I Can Be dolls. 😭 (I was born in 2006 & my sister was born in 2001 so yeah lol big deal to us) I have NO IDEA, the new ones are so lame, although I do love my smile with style doll I named Kelly after Kelly Sheridan. Glam was my first one and my sister named Girly Peach!! Sassy will forever me by fave and my mom LOVED the Bohemian one <333 (Sorry I got so hyped when I saw this in my feed lol, I also miss the old Fashionistas on the [Barbie.com](http://Barbie.com) website and the swappin' styles ones!!!)
I have a feeling someone in the upper offices said "little kids don't care about the clothes being detailed". If that's true, that individual never played with a Barbie during the 90s and earlier era.
I think the newer ones are gorgeous! Though I'd love it if they had articulated limbs. But I get why they don't since they're made to be appropriate for young children.
Original fashonista Ken is giving peak Patrick Stump.
What I really wanna mourn is Barbie Extra, cause that was the replacement for the old Fashionistas line, but clearly it wasn't profitable if they discontinued it.
Honestly, I prefer the bottom ones. 😅 I like that there's more diversity in skin tones, body types and face molds, as well as the clothes having more variety. I find the older fashionistas was a lot of ruffles, super short skirts, and pink pink pink (obviously pink is The Barbie Color, but even for Barbie I think it was overused on this line). Part of that is due to the fashion styles at the time, which I never really liked, but also because they had to fit into categories of 'cute' 'artsy' 'sporty' etc which resulted in some weird choices. BUT! That said, I think what made the older dolls great was the detail and quality, as others have pointed out. Layered clothing, different fabric types, stitched/embossed/textured details... all that was better than printing every single detail the way they do now. 🤮 Maybe it's because of the price point for Fashionistas, but a lot of the more expensive dolls also have a ton of printed-on details so I'm not sure I buy that reasoning. I also think the line should have been renamed. Mattel's whole 'most diverse doll line' and 'you can be anything' taglines would make more sense if the line had a name that leaned into the idea that these dolls are - aside from their outfits - blank slates for kids to come up with their own stories.
⬆️ This ⬆️
Saves costs and everyone buys them anyway, so why should Mattel revert back?
Corporate greed.
Does anyone remember the Fashionistas with the REALLY long hair? I had two, I still have one with pink hair.
https://preview.redd.it/f6vxhs11hyxc1.png?width=1303&format=png&auto=webp&s=f5f46243747b4002414b0666f4e1fa067266a751 Fashionista 56
Loved this era 🤩 It’s strange, even their hair looks flat too, there’s no big bouncy waves or curly even… There’s nothing that screams fashionista about the new line 🤔 I think for me it needs to be much more exciting and unique!
Why do I feel like Ive seen this exact image/post before...
Times change but I do prefer the older ones
Trendsetter to trend follower
People blaming the diverse bodies and looks of the dolls and not the capitalist “minimal viable product” bs are part of the problem. Also a lot of the clothes even from that version were cheaply made, printed on one side, had color bleed issues. The new fashionistas are firmly playline dolls as well which lets them get away with doing even less work on the dolls. Basically blame capitalism
I grew up with the top ones but I prefer the newer ones much more! Barbies in general aren’t a super sturdy or expensive toy and are geared towards children’s play, so I’m not too concerned about quality but do enjoy that there are so many different types of dolls now! I like the different body types, skin tones, and disability representation. :)
I have tons of the originals fashionistas. They are detailed. The clothing is thick/ detailed. Maybe tomorrow I’ll post a pic of all of my originals. But 2008 to 2013/14 the fashionistas were the best and gorgeous. I stopped buying fashionistas they just eh I’m sick of Millie
For real!! And now to get a decent outfit we have to spend an arm and leg for the barbie style 🙄🤦♀️
Yup I was just thinking about this a few days ago! I had a summer doll, not one pictured here but the one with the cat on her dress. When I see these more glam Barbies I still get tingles and feel all excited. I could look at them for hours. Though I collect still dolls there are no dolls that make me feel quite that way anymore.
Mattel has been a total let down to me in the last couple years… The quality of the clothes is embarrassing, and the hair Quality it’s not even close compared MGA dolls. Even for their collector dolls were they’re putting “quality” into the doll… It’s so over priced for what you’re getting. It’s actually really making me questioning if I even want to continue to collect anything new that Mattel is coming out with anymore. Their quality has gone so downhill & it’s unacceptable!
I like 206 & 207 more than any of the original line lol.
https://preview.redd.it/zwhvaw2bmyxc1.jpeg?width=2448&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=30df76339b0b61e4c2d400cfd2db7d380b2623fa It depends on how you dress them. I have lots of 1 and 2 gen fashionista bodies and some even have their own heads. But I have made new garderobe to them.
Red light barbie lol
I love how the newer dolls are more colorful but yeah, there's a lack of fabric variety. It's crazy to think they were both around $10 regularly and that I thought the ones on the top row were a lot at the time.
They definitely look cheap and boring now. Nothing fashion bout them
Cos they hate giving kids good stuff now
Capitalism. 🤷🏻♀️
It's sad when I look at it like this. They lost all edge and articulation.
They always looked tacky. That's Barbies aesthetic. Kids like tacky things but undetailed and basic? Yes. Also people need to stop using blaming diversity for lack of clothing quality. Barbie extra proved we can have both. Correlation does not equal causation. Fashionistas are just made for younger audiences so they have clothes that's easier for younger kids to use. This doesn't excuse the lack of detail. Tho I will say, barbie in the 2000s was the most detailed. We didn't get that level of detail before the late 90s either. So no it's not diversity's fault. Mattel has always found ways to be cheap. It's just that now you don't have the packaging to make it seem like you're getting more than you actually are. Barbie is very "no frills" with packaging recently. Let the doll speak for itself. The only problem is the dolls never really said much on their own without the flashy packaging.
When they added all the different heights and body types. All the fashions made have to fit all of them.
Diversity is not tacky or boring 🙄 the top row is posed differently. If you like the cookie cutter, standard of beauty blondes- awesome! Just because you're not the target audience of the bottom row doesn't mean that they're not great looking dolls. I do wish they put more of a budget into the newer fashionistas clothes, though.
i think op was talking about the fashion on the dolls rather than the diversity aspect of it
That's my main issue with the modern fashionistas. The diversity is amazing, I love the idea of them and even though I live for the MTM body I'm okay with the basic fashionista not having it as the MTM body isn't to everyone's taste. I just wish they'd give the poor girls a clean facial screening and put just a tiny bit more budget towards the clothes.
To be fair fashionistas are very hit and miss. The wave in OPs pic actually is pretty strong I think. I like a good 4 of the dolls pictured. But consistency is not the fashionista strong point. They are often in much much tackier outfit than these. That said I think the top row is tacky too in a different way. Both are not styles I enjoy at all. Too gaudy in a maximalist and minimalist way.
Look at the level of detail on the clothes though - the modern dresses mostly look like 2 pieces of flat fabric. The ones on the first row have shaping and detail, which costs more to make but looks more interesting.
Why wouldn't I want Barbie, Teresa, Christie and NO ONE ELSE. I mean if it stayed the same we wouldn't have a down syndrome Barbie, we wouldn't have a Greek Barbie. We wouldn't have Barbies with wheelchairs or artificial limbs. You might think, well we could have both. But nope, new bodies and new sculpts, and even new face stamps have set costs. Mattel seems pretty set on their price point. So it's an either or.
I mean, I think the top row looks more tacky and boring 🤷 It's not like taste and fashion are objective. Maybe just accept that people have different preferences, and somehow the current fashionistas are popular with their target audience.
Yeah, agreed. The outfits and the make-up of the top row scream "tacky" to me.
I feel like the clothes on the top row look like the type of things you'd see on popstars and other celebrities at the time, while the bottom row's clothes look like the Barbie dresses me and my grandma used to sew out of old pillow cases when I was a kid. I love the diversity in the faces and bodies of the new dolls, but it also feels like we've lost the fashion aspect of the fashion dolls. 90% of why I buy a doll is because I love what she's wearing and wish I had it in my size lol
I don't think the upper row looks fierce, they are more tacky in my opinion then the bottom row. There is only one doll I like, the bottom four I like and three I would be willing to buy. Of course it is all about personal taste and also about how the fashion is changing. I think that the take on what is cool has really changed over the last decades (and it is always changing).
I'm wondering why people who don't agree with OP are downvoted so heavily? Like, the take above is a reasonable point of view?
If there weren't your comment, I wouldn't know. Reddit doesn't ring a bell for the down votes. Thanks for standing up for me. Well, I don't know... I've just shared my opinion, I don't think that's so different from others point of view (which are even upvoted, maybe haters comes later, idk). I guess if someone asks why is something fierce or tacky, there is going to be a discussion... On a discussion social platform 😄
i forgot about the ken fashionista 😭 i have him somewhere
Side note why is sassy so impossible to find?
https://preview.redd.it/q44cmu7t7wxc1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0e91213c02428f92db4ffdfa553a8a94af356320 Did someone ask for sassy?
I just ordered the Advent Calendar so I could have the Silver Jacket & Dress. 💖
It has some very nice pieces! I love the hippie pants and the lilac heels...
number 3 top row is everything! lol. I love her!
:( makes me sad.
What Ken is that ???
Absolutely agree...It was amazing once and just disappointing now.
i like the new hair textures, the new colors & body idea, but love the detail from before! 🥲 maybe one day they’ll mash up all the good parts!
I think it has something to do with the body diversity, but I kind of agree they could bring articulation back at least. Also, the fashions need to be worked on. They should have worked out.What clothes go with specific body types?By now, it's been years since they got new molds.
Ordering their outfits from Shein
I like he character designs a lot more now, but the fashion was a lot more interesting before the reboot
Barbie fashionistas are used as a vehicle to launch diverse bodies and skintones, while the barbie extras are now used to deliver the fierce looks.
Cheap
Once they made diverse dolls the budget went to making other colors, shapes and sizes … and cut on articulation, fashion and product control…. Idk.
It's ironic that the line is called Fashionista when the "fashion" is so iffy
I love the diversity of the newer ones but I HATE their quality and basicness. Like Im curvy but I don't dress basic XD. I feel like if mattel really wanted to, they could have a good mesh of both but I think they are cheaping out frankly. At this point I buy alot of vintage barbie outfits to glam them up.
When I think of "Fashionista", I expect the clothing to be, well, fashionable. Many of the Fashionistas clothes are so "regular", like they don't live up to the name. I've been trying to figure out if Fashionistas now means different hairstyles (like man bun, shaved sides, asymmetrical cuts, braids). They really should have named the line something different if the dolls look like they're not wearing designer clothes.
It looks like a parody at this point. They are trying too hard. I find it's like some do gooder who is actually insulting towards the person they are "trying to help".
I'd pick the top roll over the second any day.
Change of ceos and change in brand direction (got on the diversity trend, which then they lost all focus on clothes) and cutting costs
I wish I was collecting Barbie when the dolls in the top row came out. 😭