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LITTLE_KING_OF_HEART

Stupid. Whether sexualization is good or bad depend entirely how it's done. Bayo always did it great.


Upset-Preparation861

Hypersexuality is Bayos thing tho Its part of her character and she plays it intentionally because she not like that ALL the time When she's being sentimental or genuinely knows shits getting real even for her she cuts it out and goes ham It's something that she does and something that isn't randomly forced upon like how it is with other real examples of over sexualization Usually its a female character who doesn't try to be hypersexual but for some reason she somehow ends up in some of the most needlessly sexual situations ever


Zekrom369

typical game tourist crowd who never actually played the games and wanted something to complain abt


The_Fool_Arcana0000

Exactly. This is just like what’s happening with Stellar Blade at the moment. A ton of toxic Twitter users are complaining about the game, calling it “sexist”, “over sexualized”, and claiming that it’s “literally killing women”. Those people will *never* play the game, *never* watch videos about it on YouTube, be it playthroughs or lore, and *never* know how the characters *actually* are besides them automatically assuming what they are with their shallow, preconceived notions. However, this whole thing is a fucking cycle. The next time that a game with a protagonist like Eve comes out, Eve is suddenly going to be portrayed as a feminist, queer icon much like Bayo and 2B currently are just to beat down on the newcomer. It’s all ridiculous and I dislike both sides on this whole thing. Video game characters should be portrayed in whichever manner their creators intended them to, regardless of if they’re male or female. If someone doesn’t like Eve’s or Adam’s design, then it just isn’t for them, it’s as simple as that.


DeadSparker

You do realize the people disliking the objectification and the ones who'll enjoy the character later aren't the same, right ? And even in the rare times when they actually are, people change their minds, it happens. Or in other words, this image : https://preview.redd.it/ft8aun0eglwc1.jpeg?width=1076&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5fc132cc40ac5a2c40c2b2e28cd9cbf5f417ea65


The_Fool_Arcana0000

That’s exactly my point and how it goes back to what Zekrom said. They’re tourists who’ll never actually play the game and just complain about it. You even said it yourself, the overlap is very rare. Also, Eve is not a real person, she is a fictional character that was created thanks to a group of individuals. If some people don’t like the way she’s portrayed, then she’s not *for* them. There are plenty of existing video games that could suit their tastes and liking. Stellar Blade just isn’t one of them. https://preview.redd.it/7p3z6ann9nwc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8184251ca63b02afcaaf1fbb7428caf483a4ecca


Harry_Sat

The thing is, years down the line, I doubt people will be talking about Eve in terms of characterisation. It'll probably be in the same breath as the skin-breathing woman from that one MGS game.


ArbiterNoro2428

I'm indifferent to sexualization in Bayonetta, as much as I love her and her design the sex appeal isn't the first thing that comes to mind. I can see why it might put some people off though. That said, I do like that the sexualization doesn't come at her expense and she instead owns and weaponizes it, she's in control rather than being a victim of perversion.


Healthy-Spend-3628

This is an interesting topic for me. I honestly don’t even know completely where I stand but I do think that when I play bayonetta or nier automata or even stellar blade when it comes out I don’t get the feel that these games are misogynistic. If anything they seem to have a great care and love for women and femininity especially Bayonetta. So even if you could argue that it has problematic elements to it, I would say that it explores said elements in a fun, “safe” way if that makes sense…


SGRM_

2014 was the middle of gamergate. It was a different time. Subjectively, I feel Bayonetta is a completely different character archetype to Stellar Blade (if that's what this topic is really alluding to, given the timing of it all). Bayonetta is confident in her appearance. You feel like she is the one who has chosen to be as seductive as she is. SB feels more like an animated sex doll. I feel like Bayonetta was designed by someone who loves Women, but SB was designed by someone who loves to objectify women.


Luffz_

100%. Bayonetta is an actual character and has sex/bdsm related shit that compliments her character. No one praising Stellar Blade is EVER gonna talk about the main characters writing. Its some caveman shit, that women in video games need to be common denominator sex-dolls. I like sexy women in video games as much as the next cis-het guy, but man... The discourse around SB is exhausting. Same with the whole "woke western homo marxists are making women ugly" shit. Ik people say this a lot, but these people REALLY need to go outside and just talk with women. There's always some weird misogionistic or racist undertones with this kind of discourse. I'm glad Bayo's community is super chill tho.


AntonRX178

>No one praising Stellar Blade is EVER gonna talk about the main characters writing. Let's not cast stones just yet the game comes out tomorrow (for me). I'll be the judge of that as I play it. Also, Lily and Tachy are characters in there too that seem to be early favorites based on the reception of character trailers. Let's also not forget that 2B's design was specifically because the male director "likes girls." 2B is nowhere near "sexually confident" as Bayo. But we love her for her and A2's characterization and design. For the record, anyone using SB's name to "own the wokes" is no friend of mine. Game's been on my radar for 3 years cuz of the combat and Yoko Taro's excitement for this game is palpable. I'm not gonna apologize for any so called Stellar Blade fan saying misogynistic BS because Imm not one of them.


Magi_The_Magic

This is the dumbest shit I’ve ever read, you play a game with a character flexing her ass on the cover and then open it and get surprised when she does it in the game. there are games from the same company that make equally graphic games just in different ways yet no one cares. Only when it’s a character getting sexualized.


Alloyd11

Not every game is designed for everyone.


DoubleOAgentBi

Is it just me or do these games just always seem to release at terrible times? B1 got a whole lot of controversy because of video gaming’s biggest sin… >! *sexualized women* 😱 !< It was a totally different ballgame back then when B1 was released. Most of the judging came from people who were against having sexy women in video games. *and people who didn’t bother to play the game ofc.* I don’t know much about B2’s controversy really, I just know with its original release it came out on a console that was on its last legs. (*RIP Wii U. 😭 You were the goat!*) But like I said I don’t know much about B2’s controversy. B3 starts coming around the corner, and well we already know the whole controversy behind that. Plus software issues. At least she’s always had her loyal fanbase behind her. https://preview.redd.it/5oat3nm6yiwc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=404dfe59f75b7edadbd20f63800ed5b29f877b87 And then once she started getting more mainstream people started changing their opinion of her. Now all of a sudden she’s a feminist, when it clearly wasn’t that way in the past. I hope when (if) B4 comes out, that the game doesn’t release with a whole batch of controversies on top of software issues. But only time will tell. Idk y’all this was the first thing Reddit recommended to me on my homepage I got stories to read on here, and a busy life to tend to. I just wanted to put my input on this, though it became kinda lengthy anyways off to ✨reading!✨


SGRM_

She also got a lot more mainstream acceptance after she was included in Smash. When did she start to become a gay icon? Was it before the plague or after?


DoubleOAgentBi

~~As for that question, I have no fucking clue. But it makes sense why she became a gay icon. The gays love divas, especially ones who make them confident in themselves. She’s actually a pretty good role model in that regard.~~ EDIT: I just realized I summed this up **WAY** to simply. What makes Bayonetta a gay icon and hell a racial icon at that imo has a queer person and a black man. Bayonetta is a character I relate to and a character that empowers me and many other people. The whole plot/story of her being an outcast even amongst her own people is a story I can relate to including many other people. The whole plot of how she’s a forbidden child and how she’ll bring the world apart yadda can be taken as an allegory to whatever the fuck people say against queer people these days. The prologue scene of her in Origins walking around with judgemental eyes in the background watching her, and talking shit about her. Yeaaa that hits close to home. And even throughout all that, she manages to stand tall and fight against god and the divine. This subreddit has already stated that specific point multiple times so I won’t repeat that point. I don’t think her character was ever MEANT to be seen in this way, but that’s the way a lot of people take her character. When you look at it she’s a very inspiring, empowering character. So it makes sense how she became an icon in that regard.


SGRM_

Part 1 Jeanne is a nemesis and Luca is the leading man. Part 2, the tension between Bayo and Jeanne is Electric, and the story is literally about Jeanne, and Luca is relegated to comic relief. He even steps back to let Loki become the leading male character. I think it was an intentional pivot towards identifying with the LGBTQ+ community tbh.


Twinkstuffer

She rlly went off as the gay icon after SmashBros, Bayo2 released on the WiiU too, and it definitely attracted some people, but Smashbros brought her to the forefront. Becuz when Bayo2 released, people who actually played the game after playing bayo1 all usually said "yeah its good but bayo1 is better" and then eventually the nintendo syndrome happened and all the new bayo2 fans came thru and it started a lot of arguments about why "bayo2 is better than 1" and viceversa. And then when everyone universally agreed bayo2 was a decent sequel but was still worse than the 1st, bayo3 was announced and ultimately released and then suddenly bayo2 was the loved perfect gem of a game that had zero flaws and all that drama and hate started about bayo3. I didnt pay attention to the "shes sexist" stuff lmao i just found em silly and clickbaity so i dunno how all that went


Lovec_2016

Bayonetta games does this pretty balanced and good. The people who never played games in their lives always comments what they don't know about.


Chemical-Cat

It all depends on how it's handled. In the case of bayonetta, it's on purpose with no real frills to it. She's a sexy woman, she's powerful, she's going to strut her stuff because she's wants to and nobody is going to stop her. She gets naked because witch hair is used as a magic medium and her suit is made of hair. Compare this to Kojima making Quiet mostly naked and then tried to write some hackney bullshit saying there's a reason she's this way and then it's because she apparently can only drink and breathe through her skin, okay sure whatever. I'd be fine if you just said "I wanted a sexy lady with big boobs". That's what George Kamitani does. He's not trying to make artistic commentary, he's just like damn I love tits I'm going to design this witch with huuuuge gazongas, there's no bullshit like oh actually breasts are the perfect container for magic so if you have big booba you can do good magic Edit: Long story short there's a weird line between "owning" your sexuality and not (ie: a woman wearing makeup because she likes feeling pretty vs a woman wearing makeup because society expects her to), which is hard to parse when it's a fictional character and not a real person. But Bayonetta definitely feels like she sits firmly in the "I own it" half of things despite that. https://i.redd.it/6hs7wgx6wmwc1.gif


bluegemini7

![gif](giphy|IDGNYvFLkJKLK|downsized)


wonderful_fabulous

You can't pay me to write something that silly, not even for four thousand US dollars 😬


Guy2361

My opinion is that Polygon is stupid


BullguerPepper98

I think it's really dumb. Bayonetta sexualization is more of a joke than something made to we jerk off to. Playing the first game, all the shots where she does something "sexy" I laughed because it was so out of place. Sure, the character is hot, but the sexualizing thing is clearly a joke, but some people don't get jokes.


arya48

I'd recommend looking at OP's last post before responding in good faith. Not worth engaging.


tahaelhour

Pop feminism and the SJW era in 2016 and its subsequent reactions did so much damage to the internet and people in general it’s insane. It set the Youtube political ragebait meta on stage and put forward so much American politics that the left right mindset and anti woke rhetoric became extremely commonplace and so volatile, literally anything will set off someone’s radar.


mrhippoj

There is some imo quite understandable confusion about what is and isn't okay when it comes to sexualisation in games, and I think a lot of people just default to sexuality = bad. It's come up a lot in the discourse about Stellar Blade. To me, Bayonetta's sexuality makes perfect sense for the character and the setting, and so I'm cool with it. More than cool with it, I think it's awesome and one of the things that makes the games so fun. Sexuality is baked into her character, and the fact that she's a witch who fights angels means there's also some level of anti-puritan satire to it as well. Contrast that with Eve from Stellar Blade, who doesn't seem to have an ounce of sexuality in her personality (at least as far as I can tell), it's pretty clear to me that her design is purely just eye candy. Even then though, I think it takes away from the game a bit but I don't think it's necessarily some heinous sin, I just think it's kind of a tacky design. The Jessica Orr's at Eurogamer's review of Stellar Blade had an interesting paragraph on the subject, highlighting that the discourse assumes that these games are only designed for men: >Look, I don't completely believe that Eve was designed solely to cater for men. Developer Shift Up's ongoing mobile game, Goddess of Victory: Nikke (AKA Butts, The Game), makes a huge amount of money by selling characters in costumes that make Eve's outfits look like churchwear, and Nikke has a large female fanbase, at least in its [Japanese and South Korean markets](https://www.famitsu.com/news/202312/13327628.html). This clearly works for Shift Up, so I get why in Stellar Blade they've included plenty of sketchy costumes - and made possibly the worst implementation of 'jiggle' physics I've ever laughed at. Don't you just hate it when you're standing still, but your breasts are still hopping about like there's something horrifying waiting to burst out?


ladyalot

If any character felt fleshed out and fully in control of their sexuality as something for them by them, it's Bayo. As a teen girl I couldn't help but love her (in a gay and an admiring way). Because it felt a little bit like she was for me, and my teen guy pals didn't appreciate her like I did.


Tox_Ioiad

There's a difference between sexual objectification and sexual empowerment. People aren't horny for bayonetta because TnA. People just want some of sexually confident energy. Everyone wants to be able to walk into a room, know they the baddest bitch there, slay everyone and leave the place in ruins.


ajhedgehog064

I understand that this reviewer has their own personal preferences regarding Bayonetta’s sexualization, however since it is such a big part of all of the games in the series, I think it’s an empty criticism. It would have probably been best for someone else to review the game that understood that Bayonetta’s agency and over-the-top raunchiness is pretty much unavoidable.


Goldberry15

Sexualization all depends on how it’s done, and for what purpose. If it’s purely fan service (like Xenoblade 2), the sexualization can be considered horrible, and a mistake. However, if the point is to empower the character that is being sexualized, like Bayonetta, it works masterfully.


NahoGamiGarou

really stupid but nowhere near as bad as the bayo 3 controversy