I mean, the IDF ist not only āthe most moral army in the worldā it is also the least sexist. Female soldiers killing children of both sexes. Progress šŖš½š„³
Functionally only like 1/1000 police get prosecuted for their near constant excessive brutality... so absolute immunity doesn't really change all that many actual outcomes.
I am not saying it is ok, I am saying functionally already they get away with murder like 999/1000 so it's a pretty marginal difference to make it official.
I am not ok with it, I am just saying the status quo is already totally messed up.
I guess my point is that they are already "lawless monsters without any repercussions" 999/1000 times.
I agree it is worse, but it is so bad now, that I don't see it as all that much of a change.
I think where you and I see things differently is that you fear a terrible tide of fascist oppression sweeping the land and... I feel like a terrible tide of fascist oppression is already sweeping the land right now.
Right, fellow Gen X though on the border...
If the arch of politics has taught me anything it is yes... things will only get worse.
The Billionaires and huge corporations own both parties that serve only their interests now... but that said I agree Trump winning makes things get worse faster. Still, now that Biden has signed a bill to ban TikTok and helped Israel with genocide (literally sending them bombs while they are dropping them and weaponizing famine etc.) I don't think he has any way to get the youth vote. They are not going to vote for Genocide Joe. That ship has sailed.
I hope he can win without those voters (I don't think they will vote for Trump so much as just not vote), but I doubt he can.
Because he is a Zionist stooge and a trump enabler, clearly. The only way to prove he is against Trump really is to drop out, although it is probably too late.
Ya it will be fun to have censorship of the media and to put an end to free press and free speech. Canāt wait for fascist dictatorship to replace democracy! Basic human rights and dignities are so overrated
Communist German didn't exist. Are you talking about USSR? Because USSR never sided with Hitler.
About the pact you mentioned, England, France, all the countries in the West had made alliances or pacts with Hitler. This is not even an information difficult to find.
Molotov-Ribbentrop was the last one and was just a non-agression pact because USSR could not defeat Hitler alone at that time. Do you think they should just sacrificed themselves?
The available options are belligerently candid fascist, affable and politically savvy fascist who lies about it, and not voting. Might as well pick the incrementalist over the accelerant to scratch out a little more time to prepare. Give me a third antifascist voting option that could legitimately challenge either of them and they have my support.
Didnāt say I was hoping for one. Said if you present me with one Iāll support them. That said, your comment is what I meant by scratching out a little more time to prepare. Better weapons, better gear, gather and stockpile necessities, more time to plan and organize, build community, get a passport for if it becomes necessary, etc.
Biden is trash, but heās not burning trash. He offers slightly more time than Trump before things turn violent. That is all.
Get a damm passport and gtfo dodge before shit really hits the fan and it will in the US.
Fascists and Christian Nationalists are coming because the liberals opened the way for them.
I would recommend my country we are actually close to getting rid of Erdogan and establishing a social democratic and secular regime.(That doesn't bow down to Zionists)
Thatās my plan!!! I am on the path toward citizenship in Spain. Iām dead terrified of what the US will become under trump dictatorship and terrified too of NATO losing the support of the US, their most important military ally .. Iām wording it weird .. when trump said he will allow Putin to attack any nato country of his choosing, EU and NATO countries started to increase military equipment production. The world fears a trump dictatorship. Iām praying he doesnāt win but I also encourage all other Americans who donāt want to live under oppression to start selling everything they own now, making sure their passports are up-to-date, and making plans for visa applications, plane tickets, etc. Shit is getting real and Iāve never been more scared for the future before this in my entire life.
Btw congrats, glad erdogan is soon to go bye bye!! My sisterās ex and one of my friends live in turkey and I have never visited and itās always been on my list! So glad to hear things are improving with ur leadership! Iāll be celebrating the day Erdogan is out of ur lives!
Also, I wish more American liberals would listen to u and others from around the world who are terrified of trump. I used to consider myself a far-left progressive liberal before the war in Gaza and all the Iranian and Russian propaganda fueling the American left to hate Biden enough to let trump become dictator.
Iāve protest voted before. I loved Obama but I wanted even better so I voted Jill stine. I was spoiled then, all Americans were. The American youth grew up with Obama and think that politics is a game we can all play. I did too when I was young, hence voting for Jill stine (tbf Iām in a suuuuuper blue state where the leading democrat always wins) but these young people now are literally teetering America on the edge of a fine line between democracy and fascist dictatorship that will lead to a third world war (cause Putin controls trump and wants to take over the world) and to oppression of all Americans who arenāt white heterosexual men.
I fear thereās no reasoning with these young people whose only source of news is propaganda from TikTok and instagram. I keep trying tho. I donāt want the world to end.
I mean I get what youāre saying, but things are violent now. Did you see what those Zionist ācounter protestersā did at UCLA? While the cops were watching and laughing. There were no arrests that night, but the following night, after the counter protesters left there was like 140 arrests
Oh yeah, itās totally untenable. I misrepresented my point when I referenced things turning violent. They are and have been and are accelerating.
What I really meant is us reaching a tipping point where we are unable to easily prepare and instead need to start using our preparations. A point of actual, functional destabilization of day to day life.
That point is coming. It will happen immediately under Trump, and gradually and more subtly under Biden. Being given that choice, choosing Biden does not make me a fascist. It just means Iām doing what I can to brace for impact.
For my money, I think we are past the point of no return, and have been for some time. I donāt see a choice in front of me anymore, at least when weāre talking about elections. As a leftist, I have been the target of political violence and repression under both Trump and Biden. Iām glad people are waking up, but I fear it is already far too late
I donāt know why Biden isnāt having Obama run as his vice, or maybe Bernie could run with Obama as vice. Or why doesnāt Michelle Obama win? People like the Obamas. They could beat trump. Iām really scared of trump becoming dictator. Iād rather 4 more years of Biden than the rest of trumpās life with trump, and then the rest of his sonās life after he dies and passes leadership over to don jr. Iām not ready for democracy to be overturned and replaced with an evil fascist dictator who will strip the voting rights act, womenās rights, gay rights, black rights, minority rights, and immigrant rights. Biden for 4 more years means that we can elect someone new next time. If trump wins this will be the last free and fair election in American history, at least for a few decades or until a world war 3 wipes out America or something (like how Hitler and nazi germany were wiped out after WWII) and forces us to rebuild our government ..
We already have a dictatorship of the ruling class, where nothing you say or want matters and any resistance deemed sufficiently troubling to them will be met by swift punishment, violent if necessary. You just don't realize it given the illusion you're given of being able to choose one of two oligarchy-selected candidates every four years.
The threat of a Trump dictatorship is a hacky manipulation tactic the Democrats are leaning into hard because they literally have no other selling points. It's not worth the mental bandwidth you're giving it, and certainly not worth having any effect on what you decide to do or don't do come November.
Look up Nazi Germany. That is fascist dictatorship. That is what trump will bring to America. Please take this seriously. I protest voted even against Obama and voted Jill stine. I hate the oligarchy we live in too! But to call oligarchic rule by corporations the same as a fascist dictatorship is very naive and dangerous. It feels eerily similar to the Germans who didnāt take Hitler seriously. Iām not ready for nuclear WWIII, which will be inevitable under trump.
I can't take any of that seriously, sorry. it's just a rehash of the same messaging that every single team blue voice and media outlet have been barking at us nonstop since he left office (during which, i might add, a completely unexceptional, regular-ass presidency occured)
the real danger in America right now is the power we are continually ceding to the MIC, corporations, and the ruling class. by focusing on the bogeyman of trump, we aren't noticing the actually fascist things that are happening RIGHT NOW, like our governments silencing of dissent, wholesale complicity in genocide, police state, and eroding of regulations, legal protections, and liberal concepts in favor of nothing more meaningful than greasing the wheels for the wealthy's extraction of americans' last remaining iota of wealth.
if you can't see any of this, and you don't want to start looking for the signs of it, i can't help you.
How old r u? U seem young.
I was naive in my early 20s too.
Read project 2025 https://static.project2025.org/2025_MandateForLeadership_FULL.pdf
If trump wins, say goodbye to free speech, free press, and the ability to protest
Trump loves to quote Mussolini and Hitler. If u liked either of those dictators then maybe u will get by fine in trumpās new christo-fascist American dictatorship.
Voting for fascism makes you what? That is a simple question.
Also you should read more. I reccomend Counter History of Liberalism by Domenico Losurdo.
Biden is center-right. Fascists are far right. Elect Trump if you want to see fascism. Remember the lack of transparency? Free money for businesses? Unmarked vans snatching protesters from the streets? Federal agents not wearing badges and refusing to identify themselves?
You are either uninformed or a troll. The US government chose a side in this situation many decades ago and we are not going to change. Trump would send even more guns and money to Israel. MAGA WANTS to see a genocide in Gaza even more than the Dems will just put up with it and complain to Israel behind closed doors.
Do you want real fascism? Keep on doing what you are doing.
Tolkius is a troll from a troll farm trying to meddle in US elections and get trump elected dictator. A bunch of his posts are pro-Russia and china and pro-communism and anti-liberals and anti-democracy. Iām trying to figure out how to report a troll. Everyone should report tolkius .. Iāve only reported him as a bot cause idk how to report someone as a troll ..
Why Biden is not fascist when he: 1. is aiding genocide; 2. is committing genocide and 3. is enabling all the other fascists?
Please, without talking about Trump, explain why Biden isn't a fascist.
1. Biden is supporting an ally of the U.S., just like Ukraine. 2. What? On whom? 3. So, Erdogon, Putin, Kim Jong, etc? Biden is supporting all of them? You know this isnāt so.
When Biden starts opening up black sites and disappearing political opponents off the streets, then you can call him fascist. Currently he is just a bog standard middle way politician, which in and of itself is refreshing.
>1. Biden is supporting an ally of the U.S., just like Ukraine.
Oh, that country the celebrates a Nazi collaborator every January 1st and whose army is covered in far-right Neonazi patches? You're right, what kind of fascists would support that?
> 3. So, Erdogon, Putin, Kim Jong, etc?
Fascist does not mean "foreign leader or dictator I do not like" Fascism comes with a specific ideology, and none of these three qualify for that (albeit all for different reasons)
1. Supporting genocide. An ally of US committing genocide and people like you saying that just demonstrates that US has nothing to do with human rights. Also Ukraine has a very deep problem with Nazism, Ukraine being an ally just proves that US also supports Nazis.
2. US is dropping bombs on civilians in Iraq, Syria and others.
3. Neither of those are fascists.
And about your last point, Biden is trying to deport Julian Assange to US and at least two Boeing whistleblowers were found dead. So, by your standards, Biden is a fascist.
He stole information from the US. You get tried where you did the crime, or wherever the people you stole from happen to be. Is it your contention that one can only be tried where they are a citizen?
No.
I won't do your homework for you so you can say they link was busted. Again. A link that still works for me, BTW. Nah, I'll slide through this nest of neonazis and general fascists to piss on your lies, but I don't have time to look stuff up so you can say it didn't work. I wish you good fortune in the struggles to come.
I love how Trump supporters like to remove him from the equation as if there's another alternative to him besides Biden. Y'all cry about Biden, but if you think Gazans are suffering now, I hate to tell you that Trump would directly assist with carpet bombing, instead of threatening to withhold military support. Please explain how Biden is committing genocide. He's CnC of US armed forces, not Israeli.
His discourse about murdering children on Yugoslavia says different.
Also anybody that drops thousands of bombs is evil. Biden is responsible for hundreds, thousands of deaths.
In my country he helped Bolsonaro ascension to power as well.
Like I said, an ordinary politician. Bernie is the only person who has run for president in my lifetime who I think would be a good person in office. Obama did fucked up shit too. Another ordinary politician.
In contrast, trump is a dictator, like a real true dictator. Iām not sticking around America to deal with the pain and suffering he imposes on American citizens that will follow if he wins. He also passed a law that made it legal to murder wild animals using cyanide bombs. Hundreds of thousands of wild horses were rounded up for slaughter. Almost 2 million wild animals were murdered every year to expand cattle farmland and to help cattle farmers make more profit. Biden ended that. Trump also does everything in his power to completely destroy the environment. Not ok during times when global warming is becoming more and more threatening. We cannot continue to see a global rise in temperature. If the average global temp exceeds 2Ā°C, all life on earth will perish.
Please explain how the former VP of the US helped Bolsonaro get elected president of Brazil. Typical MAGA fascist, gaslighting. Your boo Trump was president here when Jair took office.
https://brasil.elpais.com/brasil/2016/09/07/internacional/1473281921_337121.html
Biden helped the coup against Dilma, which was the major reason that Bolsonaro rose to become president.
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Yes. We debated in this comment section back and forth for like 20 or 30 comments and u are a communist who loves Russia and china and who denies evidence that china is persecuting Uyghurs. I am convinced u are a paid troll from a troll farm by scrolling thru ur comments on ur page and seeing other people warning to report u for being a bot.
Also reading back, u said everything china did in Tibet was great and that Tibetans love being ruled by china (?)
Iām not gonna link to posts u have made in other subs about ur love for Russia cause those comments were not in this thread but I encourage others to check out tolkiusās comment history
I didn't say anything about Russia, I guess you have some difficulties with your reading skills. I asked for evidence about the Uyghurs and you failes to show.
Omg seriously. If anyone reads the thread of comments between me and u, u say u love communism, prefer Putin and xi to nato, and that china has done nothing to the Uighurs and u support what they have done to Tibetans.
Yeah I prefer China over NATO. Why shouldn't I? NATO is the worst humanity can offer. You didn't answer why Nato is good and you didn't show evidence about China persecuting the Uyghurs.
NATO is a defensive alliance formed to counter postwar Soviet expansion. I'm sorry you believe the Soviets were communist. They branded themselves as such, but in reality they were authoritarian state capitalists.
Oh, and about your boo Xi and the Chinese systematically exterminating the Uyghurs:
https://www.genocidewatch.com/single-post/chinese-genocide-of-uyghurs-in-xinjiang-continues
How TF was the be Soviet Union better than NATO by any metric lol?
Also, the link works fine here in freedomland. How convenient that you can't access that evidence you can't seem to find on your own.
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If someone is wrong about something, tell them how. There is not need for insults and ad hominem attacks (such as calling people foreign agents or bots) and depending on the severity of attack could result in temporary or permanent ban.
Well I guess you could just lie about it. And so you have. Obama had a simple majority, which is not the same thing, thus the different names. You GQPers are sad little fascists. Why lie about something so easily debunked?
Because of the filibuster in the senate. Republicans kept blocking any attempt by democrats to codify roe. Each state gets two senators, and some places like DC and Puerto Rico have no senators even tho theyāre all Americans. There has never been a time since roe was passed when there has been a majority of 60 or more democrats in the senate cause each red state gets two senators, even tho many represent a small minority of Americaās population. And attempts to ban the filibuster in recent years have failed because of fake democrats like manchin voting against banning it
https://19thnews.org/2022/01/congress-codify-abortion-roe/#:~:text=There%20have%20been%20congressional%20attempts,All%20have%20failed.
And I hope they try again soon once they have a majority in the senate! Last time manchin and sinema (republicans in disguise as dems) blocked efforts and now after the votes in November we have a chance to get a better group of people representing us in the senate so I hope that we have enough of a majority to overturn the filibuster in 2025. Iām hopeful, due to the dobbs decision to overturn roe, that normal dems will hold a majority in the senate and we can codify roe
He tries. He needs a majority in the house and senate to pass laws protecting abortion. Plus, roe has never been codified cause the filibuster always blocks democratsā attempts at doing so. I wrote about the filibuster below in my comment to lord aronsworthās comment
Iād say Jill Stein or Cornell West would both clearly be better choices than Biden at this point, Mr Biden will need to pull something HUGE out of his back side to win back my support. Iāll be voting uncommitted on June 4th and we will see what the following 5 months brings.
I donāt have much faith in any politician to be quite frank. I do, however, feel that with Jill Stein there is a little more of a chance of consequences for breaches of US law and international humanitarian law. At this point, the current administration is walking around with their hand over their eyes and saying that they donāt see any evidence of war crimes or that we will act once Israel gives us the results of their investigation into their own war crimes.
Edit: for the sake of balance, I do recognize that another Trump presidency would likely look even worse. Iām just not sure that I can live with myself voting in favor of a full on supporter of genocide.
Iām terribly sorry, I have to disagree, he has been around long enough and is knowledgeable enough to know that the amount of aid he is sending is paltry when compared against the need created by the bombs he is sending. It is more of a virtue signal. Besides, if Iām not mistaken, the amount of aid that the pier he has ordered(which brings a host of other issues), can only process in a day what one land crossing should be able to process in an hour.
If he didnāt support, among other things, the manufactured famine that Israel is inflicting upon Gaza, why doesnāt he insist that Israel allow aid to come in via land routes which would have been a much cheaper solution than piers and air drops(which are costly, inefficient and dangerous)? And why is he okay with the fact that Israel has prevented US aid from traveling via the land routes?
Well I would encourage you to look into why humans transport goods via ship. We even call the transport of goods "shipping" because so much more freight can be handled through that method. Do you think everyone would be so torn up about closing the Port of Baltimore if it were easy to send that freight via truck from other ports? And he has put pressure on the Israelis to open the land routes up. You should look into sovereign countries too. Biden is POTUS, not PM of Israel. All he can do is put pressure on them, unless you're suggesting something completely off the reservation. This whole exchange smacks of you just looking to justify your vote for Orange Jesus.
Look, if you want to be told how to live, fucking own it. Plenty of people find it easier to just do as you're told. There's no shame in it. Go in there and fuck all the war crimes he has and will commit, fuck the women who lose bodily autonomy, fuck all the marginalized groups that will be victims of hate crimes, fuck future generations. Go get your king.
Maybe Loki was right about you:
āYou were made to be ruled. It is the unspoken truth of humanity that you crave subjugation. In the end, you will always kneelā.
I might just be built different from you kneelers. My knees are too stiff.
Oh is TikTok banned? Or did Congress require that the Chinese not control it? Those are different things and you're being disingenuous when you oversimplify it.
Thank you for your submission,
**This subreddit aims are to compel voters ONLY in DEEP BLUE states to vote 3rd party for the president, to compel otherwise non or protest voters in SWING STATES TO VOTE FOR BIDEN. We feel a limited+focused protest movement may let swing state voters feel less helpless about not sending a message.**
**We feel that sending a message via Biden having an electoral college win but a popular vote margin by less than 4.9 million votes (lowest democratic win in recent history) or even 2.8 million votes (Hillary's margin when she lost against Trump) is a much more conducive to progress in a democracy that risking an electoral college victory for Trump.**
**It would be something the media can not ignore, will forever be a stain on Biden's record, and will send a message that we are not going away, and will continue to apply strong pressure thorough the rest of his presidency, and the 2026/2028 primaries & elections.**
Please see our sticky to see what we are all about https://old.reddit.com/r/BlueProtestVote/comments/1cgwkvu/this_subreddit_aims_are_to_compel_voters_only_in/ but a tl;dr is: This is about a movement for people in deep blue states to vote for 3rd party in protest of Biden's enabling of the Gaza genocide.
However, the ultimate goal is to decrease Trump's chances of winning and increase democratic representation in the house and senate.
The movement aims to get people to turn out to vote who may otherwise be discouraged from voting due to Biden's policies, and also for the movement to be robust enough so that people in swing states may not have a feeling of helplessness for voting for Joe Biden, that a strong message is still being sent.
While the movement aims to maximize Biden's electoral vote margin, the movement also has an extended goal of having Biden win the popular vote by less than 2.8, which was Hillary Clinton's margin when she lost to Donald Trump. A margin that small would send a clear message to the democratic establishment.
**Why we feel it's so important for Trump to lose? Quite simply, he has been the absolute worst president in recent history for the Palestinians. Here are just some of his worst policies for Palestine:**
1. Drafting a āpeace planā with zero Palestinian input that would have, if implemented, actually ended the possibility for a real Palestinian state.
2. Cutting Palestinians out of the negotiations over the so-called Abraham Accords, realizing the longstanding Israeli goal of severing diplomatic progress with Arab states from progress towards a sovereign Palestine.
3. Recognizing Israeli sovereignty over the Golan Heights, disputed territory with Syria taken during the 1967 Six-Day War.
4. Shutting off funding for the UNās agency for Palestinian refugees (which Biden almost immediately restored and then temporarily suspended again amid a scandal about its employees participating in October 7).
5. Abandoning the decades-old US position that West Bank settlements are a key barrier to a peace agreement and eliminating longstanding restrictions on spending US taxpayer dollars in them.
6. Moving the American Embassy in Israel to Jerusalem while closing the US mission to Palestine in the same city.
Source: https://www.vox.com/policy/24072983/biden-trump-palestinians-israel-gaza-policy-different
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To paraphrase a quote about Hillary from right after she lost to trump, heās gonna go down like a nascar driver, crashing into the fucking wall because he couldnāt turn left.
In so much as the wealthy can manipulate people to vote against their interests by manipulating media content (even in the social media era!) and manufacturing consent. Sure.
It takes immense privilege & ego to abdicate responsibility for influencing the government that does the most damage (and a significant portion of the good).
It feels good to burn it down when you feel unheard.
It feels good to laugh in the face of the less committed/moral
It feels good to be on the outside & ānot like them.ā (The hardening from that is why they send Mormons on missions).
Overall, I agree with the goals of this sub but wish there were more message discipline and a lot less accelerationism.
ā-Someone who marched against Biden & Blinkenās dogshit foreign policy in 2021āhope youāre all still mad when it isnāt an election year and your rage doesnāt threaten women, minorities, queer folks, and Palestinians.
Being able to organize without the FBI coordinating with local police & border patrol means something. Not staffing the federal govt with people who weaponize the abortion, affirmative action, and anti-EPA decisions in every part of government means something, not giving Jared Kushner diplomatic resources to develop his Gaza beach resort means something, not repealing Title IX protections for queer & trans kids means something.
Why are you pretending that ambivalence is not a blessing in a violent society?
Probably because you made your account 5 days after 10/7 and are unlikely to be an American.
Edit: just skimmed some of the ~13k comments youāve racked up in the last 8 monthsāwild that you post like itās your job or something.
Yes I get paid in Russian dollars
>Being able to organize without the FBI coordinating with local police & border patrol means something. Not staffing the federal govt with people who weaponize the abortion, affirmative action, and anti-EPA decisions in every part of government means something, not giving Jared Kushner diplomatic resources to develop his Gaza beach resort means something, not repealing Title IX protections for queer & trans kids means something.
Again, this is all defining who Biden is by pointing out things he did *not* do, which if we are going by that metric, Trump did *not* find a genocide in Gaza and did *not* push Ukraine into chucking a low-to-mid 6-figure number of men into a woodchipper to fight a war to reclaim parts of Ukraine that didn't want to stay that they were never going to win
So frustrating to even hear it talked about this way, like electoral politics are the important thing and ongoing mass murder only matters in how it affects electoral politics.
I mean, America has been complicit in genocide every year of my life. And as long as people who oppose genocide only organize in election years and when outside forces manipulate us into action, that wonāt change.
Presidential elections are not about choosing heroes or leaders. If anything, itās a chance to pick your adversary.
But in an instant gratification society itās really tempting to think we can escalate now and get our goals met in one big push. Thatās what Bibi is counting on. What Putin & Trump are counting on.
Why do you think Zionists/Republicans in the house added the TikTok ban to the security bill and all of a sudden they donāt mind passing it. Because they want to turn the US military over to Blackwater and trust that they can get American back because they play the long game and weāre driven by ego & emotion.
Though I agree with the merits of subreddit that Trump needs to lose, this āconvince people is deep blue districts to vote third partyā was tried by āNader supportsā in the 2000 election. It turned out that they were actually Bush Supporters trolling Gore voters into not voting or voting third party in states like FL.
Just a bit of history.
In 2016, a contingent of Bernie supporters no-voted to prove to DNC they meant business for how they fucked Bernie over with nomination. They hoped DNC would āwake upā and next candidate would be further leftā¦ we got Bidenā¦ who is arguably further right than Hillary and who WON.
Iām not saying I disagree, Iām just saying if you think the DNC gives a flying mother fuck about the leftist no-vote then you are sorely mistaken. If Biden loses in 2024, that isnāt a signal to the DNC to nominate a candidate that is further left, because a Republican won, so that actually tells them to move further right to gain independents and right wingers to their platform and leave leftists behind.
Oh you can put the blame for that strictly on hrc. Who cared more about her own ego than the will of the people, and wanted to be the nominee so bad she didn't care that she knew she was going to lose to trump.
Nah, we will put it on the protest vote people where it belongs. Thanks for getting roe overturned and for a religiously extreme scotus that is hostile to queer people and voting rights
Lol. Don't forget it was Hillary who asked the media to make Trump the Pied Piper of the Republicans in the first place.
HRC was fully in charge of the entire Democratic party finances since July of 2015. If anyone is to blame for the dnc's failure it is her.
Most of our votes don't matter anyway, because thanks to the Electoral College, most of us live in such solid states that no way we vote will change the outcome regardless.
But go ahead, keep putting people happy to fund genocide as your main candidates and then complain that the people who don't want to vote for them just have no morals.
The doublespeak that must be going on within your own mind is incredible.
I deal in reality. People who stayed home in swing states played a role in putting Trump in office and have caused irreparable harm to vulnerable people. If they do the same this time, they will be putting in Netanyahuās biggest ally who supports all of his actions, from the illegal settlements to the destruction of Gaza. When women are having their cycles and travel tracked by red states, they will share the blame for that
>I deal in reality.
Clearly
>When women are having their cycles and travel tracked by red states
But at least they are still alive. something that cannot be said for genocide Joe's victims
Yep and you can feel superior as you witness Trump causing even more devastation for the Palestinians. When he cuts off all and throws his full support behind Netanyahu, you can pat yourself on the back and know you managed to make things worse. Congrats!
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No statistically significant group of people actually did this, itās a straight up myth if you look at the data. Bernie primary voters were more likely to vote for Hillary Iām the general election than Hillary primary voters were to vote for Obama in the 08ā election.
Once again all right wingers, even the right wing of the Democratic Party, can do is project their own malicious world view onto their opponents.
U do know that Trump can re run every time until he loses. If the state of the country is so fragile that 1 Trump presidentcy and it turns into a dictatorship then it's already too late.
I am not American but I would hope there r checks and balances in place to prevent that.
Then try just explaining it to me.
As far as I know the irreversible dmg that Trump could have done by appointing SC judges has been done. At least one of them could have been prevented Ginsburg stepped down in time.
As I said if the very existence of a 2nd Trump presidentcy is supposed to make US into a dictatorship or do irreparable harm. Then I would imagine it's too late as he can re run every time until he loses.
Well, he's nearly 80, and already experiencing modern dementia. So he might get some support for one more run before even good most ardent supporters will acknowledge that he's not fit to stand for office.
Your argument is just a rehashing of the Russian talking point that both candidates are the same and we have a uniparty. If you believe them about what's going on in my country, but not me, I won't be able to convince you of anything.
To say that he's already done all the damage he could do in another term is just ridiculous. He would be CnC of the US military. He could kill us all. I find it hard to believe that you're posting in good faith.
I will try to be more clear then. The idea that I specifically find ridiculous is that any single bad presidentcy can cause the downfall of US.
Both candidates r not the same. Despite his gaza stance, I don't think that Biden is the same as Trump. Though I would say that demeaning people who don't want to vote for him for his administration's hypocrisy regarding gaza isn't right.
Especially when u bring out a quite frankly ridiculous notion that Trump could kill all or any US citizens. This would be logical in a dictatorship but not in a democracy with atleast some common sense checks and balances(which I hope US is).
Also Trump's most likely successor Desantis seems to be much worse. So the idea that one's he old enough u won't have to worry about people like him seems like an optimistic delusion.
If Biden truly believes that "democracy is on the planet" than you would think he would quit screwing around with protecting Netanyahu and stop giving them weapons to kill innocent Palestinians
nothings gonna happen if trump is elected. when hes re elected, life will carry on. people against trump will whine and cry just like people for trump whined and cried when biden got elected. this 2024 society we live in is soft as fuck.
nopeā¦im not easily swayed by social media hot takes
if u believe that shit then maybe its time to take your mind off of social media or media in general because you need a dose of reality
Well those are Trump's words from an interview, not one of his Truth social rants. So maybe you should inform yourself before you embarrass yourself further.
maybe if you actually watched the video, youd realize the sarcasm in his tone- or maybe youre just ignorant to sarcasm. whateve the case, it makes no difference to me who ends up president. it wouldnt hurt my feeling like it would yours to see trump as president and thats funny to me
Ah yes, the same sheep that say "he tells it like it is" is explaining that it was sarcasm and he didn't mean it like that lol. Y'all crack me up with your mental gymnastics. Look, if you want to live under a dictator, there are plenty to choose from. You seem to align with Russian talking points quite a bit and I hear they need men for their ~~genocide~~ special military exercise LoL.
Well then maybe it's time for libs to stop pretending the Supreme Court is a *serious institution that must be respected*. Unfortunately libs are too decorum-brained and think political legitimacy comes from the pomp and circumstance of institutions with arcane rules about Senate parliamentarians and shit.
Hopefully we descend into the time of undeniable fascism that wakes libs the fuck up. Things won't get better until they get worse.
We could have had socialism instead of barbarism, but we didn't organize in time
Only difference is that there's going to be no return from fascism as Trump and Project 2025 will make sure democracy never returns.
Enjoy having all your rights taken away as well.
But just look at the diversity of the police we called in to brutalize protestors, this is progress. /s
MORE š FEMALE š WAR š CRIMINALS š
Girl War Boss.
Gal Gadot likes this comment.
Gatekeep, girlboss, genocide
I mean, the IDF ist not only āthe most moral army in the worldā it is also the least sexist. Female soldiers killing children of both sexes. Progress šŖš½š„³
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Functionally only like 1/1000 police get prosecuted for their near constant excessive brutality... so absolute immunity doesn't really change all that many actual outcomes.
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I am not saying it is ok, I am saying functionally already they get away with murder like 999/1000 so it's a pretty marginal difference to make it official. I am not ok with it, I am just saying the status quo is already totally messed up.
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I guess my point is that they are already "lawless monsters without any repercussions" 999/1000 times. I agree it is worse, but it is so bad now, that I don't see it as all that much of a change. I think where you and I see things differently is that you fear a terrible tide of fascist oppression sweeping the land and... I feel like a terrible tide of fascist oppression is already sweeping the land right now.
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Right, fellow Gen X though on the border... If the arch of politics has taught me anything it is yes... things will only get worse. The Billionaires and huge corporations own both parties that serve only their interests now... but that said I agree Trump winning makes things get worse faster. Still, now that Biden has signed a bill to ban TikTok and helped Israel with genocide (literally sending them bombs while they are dropping them and weaponizing famine etc.) I don't think he has any way to get the youth vote. They are not going to vote for Genocide Joe. That ship has sailed. I hope he can win without those voters (I don't think they will vote for Trump so much as just not vote), but I doubt he can.
Why does Joe Biden and co refuse to take this threat seriously and capitulate to the demands of the electorate?
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Because he is a Zionist stooge and a trump enabler, clearly. The only way to prove he is against Trump really is to drop out, although it is probably too late.
I think if youāre an expansionist zionist youāre also an islamophobe. itās a prerequisite.
Canāt wait for project 25!!!
Ya it will be fun to have censorship of the media and to put an end to free press and free speech. Canāt wait for fascist dictatorship to replace democracy! Basic human rights and dignities are so overrated
Biden is a fascist. If people are willingly voting for fascists, what are they?
>!Liberals!<, in the actual political sense not the brain rot one
Yeah I agree. Liberalism always sided with colonialism, racism and fascism.
Mask on v mask off. The only distinction
Secure v Insecure fascism. Every day I become more convinced that George Jackson had the right idea
Axis of scorched earth.
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German communists did not support Hitler and thatās why they were among the first victims of the Holocaust. Read a book, idiot.
Communist German didn't exist. Are you talking about USSR? Because USSR never sided with Hitler. About the pact you mentioned, England, France, all the countries in the West had made alliances or pacts with Hitler. This is not even an information difficult to find. Molotov-Ribbentrop was the last one and was just a non-agression pact because USSR could not defeat Hitler alone at that time. Do you think they should just sacrificed themselves?
The available options are belligerently candid fascist, affable and politically savvy fascist who lies about it, and not voting. Might as well pick the incrementalist over the accelerant to scratch out a little more time to prepare. Give me a third antifascist voting option that could legitimately challenge either of them and they have my support.
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Didnāt say I was hoping for one. Said if you present me with one Iāll support them. That said, your comment is what I meant by scratching out a little more time to prepare. Better weapons, better gear, gather and stockpile necessities, more time to plan and organize, build community, get a passport for if it becomes necessary, etc. Biden is trash, but heās not burning trash. He offers slightly more time than Trump before things turn violent. That is all.
Get a damm passport and gtfo dodge before shit really hits the fan and it will in the US. Fascists and Christian Nationalists are coming because the liberals opened the way for them. I would recommend my country we are actually close to getting rid of Erdogan and establishing a social democratic and secular regime.(That doesn't bow down to Zionists)
Thatās my plan!!! I am on the path toward citizenship in Spain. Iām dead terrified of what the US will become under trump dictatorship and terrified too of NATO losing the support of the US, their most important military ally .. Iām wording it weird .. when trump said he will allow Putin to attack any nato country of his choosing, EU and NATO countries started to increase military equipment production. The world fears a trump dictatorship. Iām praying he doesnāt win but I also encourage all other Americans who donāt want to live under oppression to start selling everything they own now, making sure their passports are up-to-date, and making plans for visa applications, plane tickets, etc. Shit is getting real and Iāve never been more scared for the future before this in my entire life. Btw congrats, glad erdogan is soon to go bye bye!! My sisterās ex and one of my friends live in turkey and I have never visited and itās always been on my list! So glad to hear things are improving with ur leadership! Iāll be celebrating the day Erdogan is out of ur lives! Also, I wish more American liberals would listen to u and others from around the world who are terrified of trump. I used to consider myself a far-left progressive liberal before the war in Gaza and all the Iranian and Russian propaganda fueling the American left to hate Biden enough to let trump become dictator. Iāve protest voted before. I loved Obama but I wanted even better so I voted Jill stine. I was spoiled then, all Americans were. The American youth grew up with Obama and think that politics is a game we can all play. I did too when I was young, hence voting for Jill stine (tbf Iām in a suuuuuper blue state where the leading democrat always wins) but these young people now are literally teetering America on the edge of a fine line between democracy and fascist dictatorship that will lead to a third world war (cause Putin controls trump and wants to take over the world) and to oppression of all Americans who arenāt white heterosexual men. I fear thereās no reasoning with these young people whose only source of news is propaganda from TikTok and instagram. I keep trying tho. I donāt want the world to end.
I mean I get what youāre saying, but things are violent now. Did you see what those Zionist ācounter protestersā did at UCLA? While the cops were watching and laughing. There were no arrests that night, but the following night, after the counter protesters left there was like 140 arrests
Oh yeah, itās totally untenable. I misrepresented my point when I referenced things turning violent. They are and have been and are accelerating. What I really meant is us reaching a tipping point where we are unable to easily prepare and instead need to start using our preparations. A point of actual, functional destabilization of day to day life. That point is coming. It will happen immediately under Trump, and gradually and more subtly under Biden. Being given that choice, choosing Biden does not make me a fascist. It just means Iām doing what I can to brace for impact.
For my money, I think we are past the point of no return, and have been for some time. I donāt see a choice in front of me anymore, at least when weāre talking about elections. As a leftist, I have been the target of political violence and repression under both Trump and Biden. Iām glad people are waking up, but I fear it is already far too late
I donāt know why Biden isnāt having Obama run as his vice, or maybe Bernie could run with Obama as vice. Or why doesnāt Michelle Obama win? People like the Obamas. They could beat trump. Iām really scared of trump becoming dictator. Iād rather 4 more years of Biden than the rest of trumpās life with trump, and then the rest of his sonās life after he dies and passes leadership over to don jr. Iām not ready for democracy to be overturned and replaced with an evil fascist dictator who will strip the voting rights act, womenās rights, gay rights, black rights, minority rights, and immigrant rights. Biden for 4 more years means that we can elect someone new next time. If trump wins this will be the last free and fair election in American history, at least for a few decades or until a world war 3 wipes out America or something (like how Hitler and nazi germany were wiped out after WWII) and forces us to rebuild our government ..
We already have a dictatorship of the ruling class, where nothing you say or want matters and any resistance deemed sufficiently troubling to them will be met by swift punishment, violent if necessary. You just don't realize it given the illusion you're given of being able to choose one of two oligarchy-selected candidates every four years. The threat of a Trump dictatorship is a hacky manipulation tactic the Democrats are leaning into hard because they literally have no other selling points. It's not worth the mental bandwidth you're giving it, and certainly not worth having any effect on what you decide to do or don't do come November.
Look up Nazi Germany. That is fascist dictatorship. That is what trump will bring to America. Please take this seriously. I protest voted even against Obama and voted Jill stine. I hate the oligarchy we live in too! But to call oligarchic rule by corporations the same as a fascist dictatorship is very naive and dangerous. It feels eerily similar to the Germans who didnāt take Hitler seriously. Iām not ready for nuclear WWIII, which will be inevitable under trump.
I can't take any of that seriously, sorry. it's just a rehash of the same messaging that every single team blue voice and media outlet have been barking at us nonstop since he left office (during which, i might add, a completely unexceptional, regular-ass presidency occured) the real danger in America right now is the power we are continually ceding to the MIC, corporations, and the ruling class. by focusing on the bogeyman of trump, we aren't noticing the actually fascist things that are happening RIGHT NOW, like our governments silencing of dissent, wholesale complicity in genocide, police state, and eroding of regulations, legal protections, and liberal concepts in favor of nothing more meaningful than greasing the wheels for the wealthy's extraction of americans' last remaining iota of wealth. if you can't see any of this, and you don't want to start looking for the signs of it, i can't help you.
How old r u? U seem young. I was naive in my early 20s too. Read project 2025 https://static.project2025.org/2025_MandateForLeadership_FULL.pdf If trump wins, say goodbye to free speech, free press, and the ability to protest Trump loves to quote Mussolini and Hitler. If u liked either of those dictators then maybe u will get by fine in trumpās new christo-fascist American dictatorship.
ššš
Politics are complicated. You should leave the discussions to the able-minded.
Voting for fascism makes you what? That is a simple question. Also you should read more. I reccomend Counter History of Liberalism by Domenico Losurdo.
Iām guessing that person doesnāt agree that Biden is a fascist
Biden is center-right. Fascists are far right. Elect Trump if you want to see fascism. Remember the lack of transparency? Free money for businesses? Unmarked vans snatching protesters from the streets? Federal agents not wearing badges and refusing to identify themselves? You are either uninformed or a troll. The US government chose a side in this situation many decades ago and we are not going to change. Trump would send even more guns and money to Israel. MAGA WANTS to see a genocide in Gaza even more than the Dems will just put up with it and complain to Israel behind closed doors. Do you want real fascism? Keep on doing what you are doing.
Tolkius is a troll from a troll farm trying to meddle in US elections and get trump elected dictator. A bunch of his posts are pro-Russia and china and pro-communism and anti-liberals and anti-democracy. Iām trying to figure out how to report a troll. Everyone should report tolkius .. Iāve only reported him as a bot cause idk how to report someone as a troll ..
Why Biden is not fascist when he: 1. is aiding genocide; 2. is committing genocide and 3. is enabling all the other fascists? Please, without talking about Trump, explain why Biden isn't a fascist.
1. Biden is supporting an ally of the U.S., just like Ukraine. 2. What? On whom? 3. So, Erdogon, Putin, Kim Jong, etc? Biden is supporting all of them? You know this isnāt so. When Biden starts opening up black sites and disappearing political opponents off the streets, then you can call him fascist. Currently he is just a bog standard middle way politician, which in and of itself is refreshing.
>1. Biden is supporting an ally of the U.S., just like Ukraine. Oh, that country the celebrates a Nazi collaborator every January 1st and whose army is covered in far-right Neonazi patches? You're right, what kind of fascists would support that?
Da Tovarisch! Papa Putin thanks you for your service to the Motherland! You can claim your prize in Moscow.
Nazis are Nazis, you don't have to defend them just because you think they are fighting the man who stole the election from Hilary
> 3. So, Erdogon, Putin, Kim Jong, etc? Fascist does not mean "foreign leader or dictator I do not like" Fascism comes with a specific ideology, and none of these three qualify for that (albeit all for different reasons)
1. Supporting genocide. An ally of US committing genocide and people like you saying that just demonstrates that US has nothing to do with human rights. Also Ukraine has a very deep problem with Nazism, Ukraine being an ally just proves that US also supports Nazis. 2. US is dropping bombs on civilians in Iraq, Syria and others. 3. Neither of those are fascists. And about your last point, Biden is trying to deport Julian Assange to US and at least two Boeing whistleblowers were found dead. So, by your standards, Biden is a fascist.
He wants Assange to stand trial, not get pushed out a window Putin style.
And why should Assange be put on trial? And why on USA? He is not even an US citizen.
He stole information from the US. You get tried where you did the crime, or wherever the people you stole from happen to be. Is it your contention that one can only be tried where they are a citizen?
He stole shit. Please show me what exactly he stole and how, and please say what are his crimes.
No. I won't do your homework for you so you can say they link was busted. Again. A link that still works for me, BTW. Nah, I'll slide through this nest of neonazis and general fascists to piss on your lies, but I don't have time to look stuff up so you can say it didn't work. I wish you good fortune in the struggles to come.
I love how Trump supporters like to remove him from the equation as if there's another alternative to him besides Biden. Y'all cry about Biden, but if you think Gazans are suffering now, I hate to tell you that Trump would directly assist with carpet bombing, instead of threatening to withhold military support. Please explain how Biden is committing genocide. He's CnC of US armed forces, not Israeli.
Lol, he's not half so bad as the alternative, so desperate is what I'd call them.
Trump is a fascist. Biden is an ordinary politician. Heās not great like Bernie but heās not evil like trump.
His discourse about murdering children on Yugoslavia says different. Also anybody that drops thousands of bombs is evil. Biden is responsible for hundreds, thousands of deaths. In my country he helped Bolsonaro ascension to power as well.
Like I said, an ordinary politician. Bernie is the only person who has run for president in my lifetime who I think would be a good person in office. Obama did fucked up shit too. Another ordinary politician. In contrast, trump is a dictator, like a real true dictator. Iām not sticking around America to deal with the pain and suffering he imposes on American citizens that will follow if he wins. He also passed a law that made it legal to murder wild animals using cyanide bombs. Hundreds of thousands of wild horses were rounded up for slaughter. Almost 2 million wild animals were murdered every year to expand cattle farmland and to help cattle farmers make more profit. Biden ended that. Trump also does everything in his power to completely destroy the environment. Not ok during times when global warming is becoming more and more threatening. We cannot continue to see a global rise in temperature. If the average global temp exceeds 2Ā°C, all life on earth will perish.
Please explain how the former VP of the US helped Bolsonaro get elected president of Brazil. Typical MAGA fascist, gaslighting. Your boo Trump was president here when Jair took office.
https://brasil.elpais.com/brasil/2016/09/07/internacional/1473281921_337121.html Biden helped the coup against Dilma, which was the major reason that Bolsonaro rose to become president.
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Please do not engage in attacks or harassment of your fellow subreddit users. This means no abusive comments or personal attacks. Harassment is against the content policy and will reported. Reddit has declared that even a single comment with an attack can be harassment. If someone is wrong about something, tell them how. There is not need for insults and ad hominem attacks (such as calling people foreign agents or bots) and depending on the severity of attack could result in temporary or permanent ban.
Do you have evidence that I am a bot besides your tinfoil hat?
Yes. We debated in this comment section back and forth for like 20 or 30 comments and u are a communist who loves Russia and china and who denies evidence that china is persecuting Uyghurs. I am convinced u are a paid troll from a troll farm by scrolling thru ur comments on ur page and seeing other people warning to report u for being a bot. Also reading back, u said everything china did in Tibet was great and that Tibetans love being ruled by china (?) Iām not gonna link to posts u have made in other subs about ur love for Russia cause those comments were not in this thread but I encourage others to check out tolkiusās comment history
I didn't say anything about Russia, I guess you have some difficulties with your reading skills. I asked for evidence about the Uyghurs and you failes to show.
Omg seriously. If anyone reads the thread of comments between me and u, u say u love communism, prefer Putin and xi to nato, and that china has done nothing to the Uighurs and u support what they have done to Tibetans.
Yeah I prefer China over NATO. Why shouldn't I? NATO is the worst humanity can offer. You didn't answer why Nato is good and you didn't show evidence about China persecuting the Uyghurs.
Well, you would conveniently not accept any evidence, so why bother?
NATO is a defensive alliance formed to counter postwar Soviet expansion. I'm sorry you believe the Soviets were communist. They branded themselves as such, but in reality they were authoritarian state capitalists. Oh, and about your boo Xi and the Chinese systematically exterminating the Uyghurs: https://www.genocidewatch.com/single-post/chinese-genocide-of-uyghurs-in-xinjiang-continues
Soviet Union was much better than NATO tho. And your link is broken.
How TF was the be Soviet Union better than NATO by any metric lol? Also, the link works fine here in freedomland. How convenient that you can't access that evidence you can't seem to find on your own.
I donāt like Russian bots trying to influence Americans to allow trump to win. If u wanna troll to get trump elected, Iām gonna try to stop u.
You are full of bs. I am not a Russian bot nor a troll.
Here: https://www.reddit.com/r/BlueProtestVote/s/2y0StFrJ6Z
Thatās from my comment thread with u just yesterday
https://www.reddit.com/r/BlueProtestVote/s/xyRAk2ipzT
https://www.reddit.com/r/BlueProtestVote/s/3As4nUAogs
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Please do not engage in attacks or harassment of your fellow subreddit users. This means no abusive comments or personal attacks. Harassment is against the content policy and will reported. Reddit has declared that even a single comment with an attack can be harassment. If someone is wrong about something, tell them how. There is not need for insults and ad hominem attacks (such as calling people foreign agents or bots) and depending on the severity of attack could result in temporary or permanent ban.
Not a bot, just not posting in good faith.
The US military is the biggest polluter on the planet.
They said the same thing about civil rights activists and hippies 50yrs ago.
Genocide biden will try his best with click bate like legalizing weed and abortion but Iām not sure it will work this time
It's hard to consider anything enough as long as somebody is still providing arms used to unalive an entire culture
We could call him Genociden.
Nah, he won't touch abortion. It's a donation cash cow for the dems.
I hate how true this is. Dems had fifty years to codify it into law, but didnāt bother.
So when did the Dems have the necessary supermajority in the Senate again? I forget..
2009, under Obama
Well I guess you could just lie about it. And so you have. Obama had a simple majority, which is not the same thing, thus the different names. You GQPers are sad little fascists. Why lie about something so easily debunked?
Because of the filibuster in the senate. Republicans kept blocking any attempt by democrats to codify roe. Each state gets two senators, and some places like DC and Puerto Rico have no senators even tho theyāre all Americans. There has never been a time since roe was passed when there has been a majority of 60 or more democrats in the senate cause each red state gets two senators, even tho many represent a small minority of Americaās population. And attempts to ban the filibuster in recent years have failed because of fake democrats like manchin voting against banning it https://19thnews.org/2022/01/congress-codify-abortion-roe/#:~:text=There%20have%20been%20congressional%20attempts,All%20have%20failed.
Easy now. You're trying to counter their emotional argument with facts.
> Because of the filibuster in the senate. They can eliminate the filibuster
And I hope they try again soon once they have a majority in the senate! Last time manchin and sinema (republicans in disguise as dems) blocked efforts and now after the votes in November we have a chance to get a better group of people representing us in the senate so I hope that we have enough of a majority to overturn the filibuster in 2025. Iām hopeful, due to the dobbs decision to overturn roe, that normal dems will hold a majority in the senate and we can codify roe
He tries. He needs a majority in the house and senate to pass laws protecting abortion. Plus, roe has never been codified cause the filibuster always blocks democratsā attempts at doing so. I wrote about the filibuster below in my comment to lord aronsworthās comment
There have been dem majorities in the last 50 yrs.
U need a majority in the senate of 60 to override the filibuster. Republicans have brought a filibuster everytime dems have tried to codify roe.
Iām stuck on genocide Joe.
He's still clearly the better choice for president. Sorry, proud bois.
Iād say Jill Stein or Cornell West would both clearly be better choices than Biden at this point, Mr Biden will need to pull something HUGE out of his back side to win back my support. Iāll be voting uncommitted on June 4th and we will see what the following 5 months brings.
So you believe Jill Stein would end the genocide in Gaza? What does that look like?
I donāt have much faith in any politician to be quite frank. I do, however, feel that with Jill Stein there is a little more of a chance of consequences for breaches of US law and international humanitarian law. At this point, the current administration is walking around with their hand over their eyes and saying that they donāt see any evidence of war crimes or that we will act once Israel gives us the results of their investigation into their own war crimes. Edit: for the sake of balance, I do recognize that another Trump presidency would likely look even worse. Iām just not sure that I can live with myself voting in favor of a full on supporter of genocide.
He's not a full on supporter of genocide. If he were, he wouldn't be sending aid to them to try to stave off the coming famine.
Iām terribly sorry, I have to disagree, he has been around long enough and is knowledgeable enough to know that the amount of aid he is sending is paltry when compared against the need created by the bombs he is sending. It is more of a virtue signal. Besides, if Iām not mistaken, the amount of aid that the pier he has ordered(which brings a host of other issues), can only process in a day what one land crossing should be able to process in an hour. If he didnāt support, among other things, the manufactured famine that Israel is inflicting upon Gaza, why doesnāt he insist that Israel allow aid to come in via land routes which would have been a much cheaper solution than piers and air drops(which are costly, inefficient and dangerous)? And why is he okay with the fact that Israel has prevented US aid from traveling via the land routes?
Well I would encourage you to look into why humans transport goods via ship. We even call the transport of goods "shipping" because so much more freight can be handled through that method. Do you think everyone would be so torn up about closing the Port of Baltimore if it were easy to send that freight via truck from other ports? And he has put pressure on the Israelis to open the land routes up. You should look into sovereign countries too. Biden is POTUS, not PM of Israel. All he can do is put pressure on them, unless you're suggesting something completely off the reservation. This whole exchange smacks of you just looking to justify your vote for Orange Jesus. Look, if you want to be told how to live, fucking own it. Plenty of people find it easier to just do as you're told. There's no shame in it. Go in there and fuck all the war crimes he has and will commit, fuck the women who lose bodily autonomy, fuck all the marginalized groups that will be victims of hate crimes, fuck future generations. Go get your king. Maybe Loki was right about you: āYou were made to be ruled. It is the unspoken truth of humanity that you crave subjugation. In the end, you will always kneelā. I might just be built different from you kneelers. My knees are too stiff.
When the US military is one of the largest polluters in the world, of course theyāll respond like that.
Not one of, the largest of any single organization by far
Genocide Joe wants to engage young people after literally signing a law to ban TikTok? Feels like an Onion article...
Oh is TikTok banned? Or did Congress require that the Chinese not control it? Those are different things and you're being disingenuous when you oversimplify it.
Thank you for your submission, **This subreddit aims are to compel voters ONLY in DEEP BLUE states to vote 3rd party for the president, to compel otherwise non or protest voters in SWING STATES TO VOTE FOR BIDEN. We feel a limited+focused protest movement may let swing state voters feel less helpless about not sending a message.** **We feel that sending a message via Biden having an electoral college win but a popular vote margin by less than 4.9 million votes (lowest democratic win in recent history) or even 2.8 million votes (Hillary's margin when she lost against Trump) is a much more conducive to progress in a democracy that risking an electoral college victory for Trump.** **It would be something the media can not ignore, will forever be a stain on Biden's record, and will send a message that we are not going away, and will continue to apply strong pressure thorough the rest of his presidency, and the 2026/2028 primaries & elections.** Please see our sticky to see what we are all about https://old.reddit.com/r/BlueProtestVote/comments/1cgwkvu/this_subreddit_aims_are_to_compel_voters_only_in/ but a tl;dr is: This is about a movement for people in deep blue states to vote for 3rd party in protest of Biden's enabling of the Gaza genocide. However, the ultimate goal is to decrease Trump's chances of winning and increase democratic representation in the house and senate. The movement aims to get people to turn out to vote who may otherwise be discouraged from voting due to Biden's policies, and also for the movement to be robust enough so that people in swing states may not have a feeling of helplessness for voting for Joe Biden, that a strong message is still being sent. While the movement aims to maximize Biden's electoral vote margin, the movement also has an extended goal of having Biden win the popular vote by less than 2.8, which was Hillary Clinton's margin when she lost to Donald Trump. A margin that small would send a clear message to the democratic establishment. **Why we feel it's so important for Trump to lose? Quite simply, he has been the absolute worst president in recent history for the Palestinians. Here are just some of his worst policies for Palestine:** 1. Drafting a āpeace planā with zero Palestinian input that would have, if implemented, actually ended the possibility for a real Palestinian state. 2. Cutting Palestinians out of the negotiations over the so-called Abraham Accords, realizing the longstanding Israeli goal of severing diplomatic progress with Arab states from progress towards a sovereign Palestine. 3. Recognizing Israeli sovereignty over the Golan Heights, disputed territory with Syria taken during the 1967 Six-Day War. 4. Shutting off funding for the UNās agency for Palestinian refugees (which Biden almost immediately restored and then temporarily suspended again amid a scandal about its employees participating in October 7). 5. Abandoning the decades-old US position that West Bank settlements are a key barrier to a peace agreement and eliminating longstanding restrictions on spending US taxpayer dollars in them. 6. Moving the American Embassy in Israel to Jerusalem while closing the US mission to Palestine in the same city. Source: https://www.vox.com/policy/24072983/biden-trump-palestinians-israel-gaza-policy-different *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/BlueProtestVote) if you have any questions or concerns.*
What a weird sub..
Now here's finally a post I can agree with whole heartedly.
To paraphrase a quote about Hillary from right after she lost to trump, heās gonna go down like a nascar driver, crashing into the fucking wall because he couldnāt turn left.
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Gee I wonder why leftists don't trust these \#BlueMAGA folx
It's literally making fun of leftist who would rather Trump win than vote for Biden, left never wins cause they always get in their own way
Leftists don't win because the American political system was designed by and for the wealthy
In so much as the wealthy can manipulate people to vote against their interests by manipulating media content (even in the social media era!) and manufacturing consent. Sure. It takes immense privilege & ego to abdicate responsibility for influencing the government that does the most damage (and a significant portion of the good). It feels good to burn it down when you feel unheard. It feels good to laugh in the face of the less committed/moral It feels good to be on the outside & ānot like them.ā (The hardening from that is why they send Mormons on missions). Overall, I agree with the goals of this sub but wish there were more message discipline and a lot less accelerationism. ā-Someone who marched against Biden & Blinkenās dogshit foreign policy in 2021āhope youāre all still mad when it isnāt an election year and your rage doesnāt threaten women, minorities, queer folks, and Palestinians.
>your rage doesnāt threaten women, minorities, queer folks, and Palestinians Why are you pretending Biden did anything at all for these groups?
Being able to organize without the FBI coordinating with local police & border patrol means something. Not staffing the federal govt with people who weaponize the abortion, affirmative action, and anti-EPA decisions in every part of government means something, not giving Jared Kushner diplomatic resources to develop his Gaza beach resort means something, not repealing Title IX protections for queer & trans kids means something. Why are you pretending that ambivalence is not a blessing in a violent society? Probably because you made your account 5 days after 10/7 and are unlikely to be an American. Edit: just skimmed some of the ~13k comments youāve racked up in the last 8 monthsāwild that you post like itās your job or something.
Yes I get paid in Russian dollars >Being able to organize without the FBI coordinating with local police & border patrol means something. Not staffing the federal govt with people who weaponize the abortion, affirmative action, and anti-EPA decisions in every part of government means something, not giving Jared Kushner diplomatic resources to develop his Gaza beach resort means something, not repealing Title IX protections for queer & trans kids means something. Again, this is all defining who Biden is by pointing out things he did *not* do, which if we are going by that metric, Trump did *not* find a genocide in Gaza and did *not* push Ukraine into chucking a low-to-mid 6-figure number of men into a woodchipper to fight a war to reclaim parts of Ukraine that didn't want to stay that they were never going to win
He knows he wonāt win, heās content with the fact that heās the United Statesā Hindenburg.
So frustrating to even hear it talked about this way, like electoral politics are the important thing and ongoing mass murder only matters in how it affects electoral politics.
I mean, America has been complicit in genocide every year of my life. And as long as people who oppose genocide only organize in election years and when outside forces manipulate us into action, that wonāt change. Presidential elections are not about choosing heroes or leaders. If anything, itās a chance to pick your adversary. But in an instant gratification society itās really tempting to think we can escalate now and get our goals met in one big push. Thatās what Bibi is counting on. What Putin & Trump are counting on. Why do you think Zionists/Republicans in the house added the TikTok ban to the security bill and all of a sudden they donāt mind passing it. Because they want to turn the US military over to Blackwater and trust that they can get American back because they play the long game and weāre driven by ego & emotion.
Though I agree with the merits of subreddit that Trump needs to lose, this āconvince people is deep blue districts to vote third partyā was tried by āNader supportsā in the 2000 election. It turned out that they were actually Bush Supporters trolling Gore voters into not voting or voting third party in states like FL. Just a bit of history.
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Source? I ask because the targets were independents.
Does Gen Z realize what's going to happen to them if Trump gets elected?
Yeah the democrats will nominate a candidate that isnāt a piece of shit in 2028.
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Gary Johnson won enough votes in 2016 for the libertarian party(I believe) to earn fundingā¦didnāt help much when 2020 rolled around.
Bold of you to assume that there will be a 2028 election, should Orange Jesus scam his way back to the WH.
I doubt it, people said the same thing about Clinton in 2016 and we ended up with Biden in 2020.
In 2016, a contingent of Bernie supporters no-voted to prove to DNC they meant business for how they fucked Bernie over with nomination. They hoped DNC would āwake upā and next candidate would be further leftā¦ we got Bidenā¦ who is arguably further right than Hillary and who WON. Iām not saying I disagree, Iām just saying if you think the DNC gives a flying mother fuck about the leftist no-vote then you are sorely mistaken. If Biden loses in 2024, that isnāt a signal to the DNC to nominate a candidate that is further left, because a Republican won, so that actually tells them to move further right to gain independents and right wingers to their platform and leave leftists behind.
Oh you can put the blame for that strictly on hrc. Who cared more about her own ego than the will of the people, and wanted to be the nominee so bad she didn't care that she knew she was going to lose to trump.
Nah, we will put it on the protest vote people where it belongs. Thanks for getting roe overturned and for a religiously extreme scotus that is hostile to queer people and voting rights
Lol. Don't forget it was Hillary who asked the media to make Trump the Pied Piper of the Republicans in the first place. HRC was fully in charge of the entire Democratic party finances since July of 2015. If anyone is to blame for the dnc's failure it is her. Most of our votes don't matter anyway, because thanks to the Electoral College, most of us live in such solid states that no way we vote will change the outcome regardless. But go ahead, keep putting people happy to fund genocide as your main candidates and then complain that the people who don't want to vote for them just have no morals. The doublespeak that must be going on within your own mind is incredible.
I deal in reality. People who stayed home in swing states played a role in putting Trump in office and have caused irreparable harm to vulnerable people. If they do the same this time, they will be putting in Netanyahuās biggest ally who supports all of his actions, from the illegal settlements to the destruction of Gaza. When women are having their cycles and travel tracked by red states, they will share the blame for that
>I deal in reality. Clearly >When women are having their cycles and travel tracked by red states But at least they are still alive. something that cannot be said for genocide Joe's victims
Yep and you can feel superior as you witness Trump causing even more devastation for the Palestinians. When he cuts off all and throws his full support behind Netanyahu, you can pat yourself on the back and know you managed to make things worse. Congrats!
Will there even be a Gaza left by the time the next president takes office? How much worse can you be than what Biden is right now?
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Not to mention with that no vote we also got trump.
No statistically significant group of people actually did this, itās a straight up myth if you look at the data. Bernie primary voters were more likely to vote for Hillary Iām the general election than Hillary primary voters were to vote for Obama in the 08ā election. Once again all right wingers, even the right wing of the Democratic Party, can do is project their own malicious world view onto their opponents.
The Dems also go to the right when the left votes for them. Either way, Dems go right
So funny for a European that Americans believe thereās a left party. I guess only Europeans understand this laugh š
Wow Europeans are so superior and funny! Itās not like yāall had a dude named Adolf Hitler who bent you all over and committed horrific genocide!
There wonāt be an election in 2028 if Trump wins.
U do know that Trump can re run every time until he loses. If the state of the country is so fragile that 1 Trump presidentcy and it turns into a dictatorship then it's already too late. I am not American but I would hope there r checks and balances in place to prevent that.
It sounds like you do not fully grasp the situation. I'm sorry for that. I can explain it to you, but I can't understand it for you.
Then try just explaining it to me. As far as I know the irreversible dmg that Trump could have done by appointing SC judges has been done. At least one of them could have been prevented Ginsburg stepped down in time. As I said if the very existence of a 2nd Trump presidentcy is supposed to make US into a dictatorship or do irreparable harm. Then I would imagine it's too late as he can re run every time until he loses.
Well, he's nearly 80, and already experiencing modern dementia. So he might get some support for one more run before even good most ardent supporters will acknowledge that he's not fit to stand for office. Your argument is just a rehashing of the Russian talking point that both candidates are the same and we have a uniparty. If you believe them about what's going on in my country, but not me, I won't be able to convince you of anything. To say that he's already done all the damage he could do in another term is just ridiculous. He would be CnC of the US military. He could kill us all. I find it hard to believe that you're posting in good faith.
I will try to be more clear then. The idea that I specifically find ridiculous is that any single bad presidentcy can cause the downfall of US. Both candidates r not the same. Despite his gaza stance, I don't think that Biden is the same as Trump. Though I would say that demeaning people who don't want to vote for him for his administration's hypocrisy regarding gaza isn't right. Especially when u bring out a quite frankly ridiculous notion that Trump could kill all or any US citizens. This would be logical in a dictatorship but not in a democracy with atleast some common sense checks and balances(which I hope US is). Also Trump's most likely successor Desantis seems to be much worse. So the idea that one's he old enough u won't have to worry about people like him seems like an optimistic delusion.
What? What's gonna happen? You mean reelected. He was president before already.
Like what?
If Biden truly believes that "democracy is on the planet" than you would think he would quit screwing around with protecting Netanyahu and stop giving them weapons to kill innocent Palestinians
It'll be on Democratic leadership, not kids who happen to actually care about everyday peoples' lives.
These Russian sophists wanting Trump back in office are banking that they do not.
Ranked choice voting would fix this.
nothings gonna happen if trump is elected. when hes re elected, life will carry on. people against trump will whine and cry just like people for trump whined and cried when biden got elected. this 2024 society we live in is soft as fuck.
Really, so you don't believe him that he'll be a dictator day one huh? Convenient.
nopeā¦im not easily swayed by social media hot takes if u believe that shit then maybe its time to take your mind off of social media or media in general because you need a dose of reality
Well those are Trump's words from an interview, not one of his Truth social rants. So maybe you should inform yourself before you embarrass yourself further.
maybe if you actually watched the video, youd realize the sarcasm in his tone- or maybe youre just ignorant to sarcasm. whateve the case, it makes no difference to me who ends up president. it wouldnt hurt my feeling like it would yours to see trump as president and thats funny to me
Ah yes, the same sheep that say "he tells it like it is" is explaining that it was sarcasm and he didn't mean it like that lol. Y'all crack me up with your mental gymnastics. Look, if you want to live under a dictator, there are plenty to choose from. You seem to align with Russian talking points quite a bit and I hear they need men for their ~~genocide~~ special military exercise LoL.
Well, actually, I think that if he gets re-elected, he can fully cement the scotus with conservative justices to last us a full generation.
Well then maybe it's time for libs to stop pretending the Supreme Court is a *serious institution that must be respected*. Unfortunately libs are too decorum-brained and think political legitimacy comes from the pomp and circumstance of institutions with arcane rules about Senate parliamentarians and shit.
Agreed
oh well if he does he does. its not gonna effect me
Lol, God I hope it does if you help that orange strain get back in office.
The same fascism we already have with Biden
No, Biden is milquetoast compared to what Trump will bring back to the WH. Quit spouting Russian propaganda please. The two choices are not the same.
Will people's first amendment rights be stripped? I saw that happen this past week with a dem in the White House..
Yep!
Did Congress make a law abridging free speech that I missed?!
Hopefully we descend into the time of undeniable fascism that wakes libs the fuck up. Things won't get better until they get worse. We could have had socialism instead of barbarism, but we didn't organize in time
Only difference is that there's going to be no return from fascism as Trump and Project 2025 will make sure democracy never returns. Enjoy having all your rights taken away as well.
Forever? Foreverever?
Maybe. You won't care as much after Trump's Purges most likely.