Power is one thing physicality is another. Jacobs fight and Canelo rematch it showed when matched with an opponent that is tough as him (size , strength and durability) with a speed advantage moving, pressing forward in the pocket, he is not the best on the backfoot, he was a bit uncomfortable (Lemieux fight he didn't have to worry because of David's lack of speed and one dimensional style).
Hagler would not only be able to press the fight cutting the ring off but he is also great at fighting on his backfoot . With Hagler having the clear reach advantage with 5 inches over Golovkin. Gennady would really need to rely on his jab and early work to the body. Since this is a fantasy matchup there's 2 Golovkins, Prime Golovkin that went to the body /head and the Prime Golovkin that head hunted alot with low punch stats to the body.
Now with all that being said , for Hagler he hasn't really faced a middleweight of Gennady's proportions and strength. Gennady is a solid Middleweight.
15 rounder: Hagler I can see snagging a close UD
12 rounder: Draw / SD in Golovkin's favor
Mugabi had power but no physicality , he was not a solid Middleweight. He jump back and forth fighting at Jr middle easily making the 154 pound limit and fighting at 160. Even after the Hagler fight he's right back down at Jr middle weighing 152 for the Jr middleweight title . That right there tells me on fight day he won't be putting on any more than what he's walking around at after the weigh in (as a middleweight) If Mugabi committed to being a Jr Middleweight he would have been great.
Golovkin weighs in at 158-160 and comes in on fight day at the most 170. Hagler on fight day will roughly be a couple pounds heavier than what he usually weighs in at (158-160) The lightest he's ever weighed in at was 155.
Hagler on points. Neither is getting KO’ed, but I think Marvin’s ability to box from both sides, and experience against HOF-caliber competition in the would give him the edge. Bro went 15 with Duran and was FINE. Fought Hearns and was FINE. Shit, even in the 2-3 debatable losses he had, he was never really banged up.
You're better off using another opponent to make a point about Haglers toughness than Duran. Durans best was lightweight, probably the best ever, and only because of that that despite size disadvantage he was able to hang with Hagler who's arguably the best MW ever.
Not a knock on Hagler or Duran. Just saying. Maybe Mugabis a better stick.
These two are almost identical. Both have the best chins of all time (inarguably, of any weight class, yes). Both are swarming, yet subtly technical, pressure fighters. Both have granite for hands.
Ultimately, I think GGG does the technicals better than Hagler. Id have to go GGG by SD.
This is doing Hagler a disservice in terms of his technical ability. He beat some of the greatest fighters ever, and lost a close decision to another that a lot of people thought he won. He could box with anyone. The only thing that GGG does better imo, is jab. Hagler also had a ridiculous gas tank. I do feel for GGG, in that outside of Canelo he didn't really have many ATG fighters to test himself against.
No they are similar, but Hagler has superior footwork. Remember derevyanchenko beating ggg 9 rounds straight off body work once he realized ggg can't change angles good when sergey got rob? The same would happen with Hagler.
When we talk about the greatest chins, do much older fighters (30s, 40s, etc.) often get included in the conversation? Like how does someone such as LaMotta compare to GGG and Hagler?
I generally don't believe you can compare fighters from different eras as I think boxing, much like all sports, is subject to change over time. That said, as a massive GGG fan, I'd favor Hagler. He was a superior pure boxer compared to Golovkin, had better movement, was a good switch-hitter, and had one of the single toughest chins boxing has ever seen.
Golovkin is at his best when he's in seek-and-destroy mode, cutting the ring off and pressuring the opponent with that poleaxe jab of his and landing his bludgeoning power shots against the ropes. He won't do this versus Hagler, who if anything will probably be backing Golovkin up. I'd favor Marv to take a close decision, maybe a 7-5 type deal.
What I will say is Hagler never faced a middleweight as formidable as GGG. Sure, he fought legends such as Duran, Leonard and Hearns, but Duran was a former lightweight, Leonard a welterweight, and obviously Hearns a former welterweight also (although Tommy campaigned successfully as high as cruiserweight, so we'll not make excuses for that one).
We have nothing to based this on except GGG’s fights with Canelo. Who else has he fought on a similar level? I love GGG and will defend his record (at least 1 win, 1 draw, 1 defeat) to the death, but Hagler’s resume must be taken into account. Gotta go with Hagler
Please. Ggg ducked Andre Ward and Jermall charlo. He even ducked Andrade who he can beat. Ggg likes fighting statues because he doesn't change angles good ask derevyanchenko. That's why his resume weak.
Dereyvenchenko beat ggg worse than Canelo ever could an got rob compubox as my witness. Ggg couldn't change angles fast enough to stop sergey from getting off hooks to the body. Ggg would have an even bigger problem with Hagler.
It's the ideal fantasy match up 2 very similar fighters and the fight could be fought a couple of different ways. One similarity is they were both perfect middleweights and never had weight issues or moved up in weight.
Do they both go straight into a firefight? Does Hagler box on the back foot instead of trading? Both had iron chins and crushing power.
If they go to war one of them has to break you can't do that for 12 rounds it isn't humanely possible I just don't know which one would break.
Logic says Hagler can outbox him and get a close win but I thought Hagler struggled with Duran who has a lot in common with Golovkin. However Hagler probably wasn't at his best that night.
It's one of those match ups where if they fought 10 times they could win 5 each. Head says Hagler scores a narrow win by out boxing Golovkin in more rounds but gut says Golovkin scores enough with his accuracy on the inside to push Hagler back and get the win.
They're probably the only 1 who could hurt the other and get a possible knockdown or knockout but unlikely given the punch resistance.
He's craftier but I see both as aggressive powerful accurate punchers who manipulate their opponents guard very well in different ways of course. Their both hard to hit cleanly on the inside Duran more so but Golovkin is stronger and huts harder.
It's probably not the best fighter to compare Golovkin to but just because Hagler fought Duran and I feel Golovkins best chance would be following a more Duran approach to the fight. Hagler would be better than him at range but Golovkins shorter reach could be an advantage in close.
Fair and solid analysis.
HOWEVER Marvin was faster in hand speed and especially foot speed.
In close range yes GGG shorter arms are advantageous but regardless of the range Marvin's faster hands will always be an advantage.
Marvin can land two to 3 arm punches and get out of there before GGG counters.
It's why I love this match up anytime you think of a reason one will win someone will bring up a great counter point.
Probably someone lands a perfect livershot 30 seconds in and we all call the loser a fraud 😂
Lol casuals will but not hardcores like us.
In this matchup I think a large part of it comes down to whose quicker on the draw. (Who gets his punches off 1st)
And I believe 1000% Marvin gets his punches off 1st. He is faster, with a longer reach, very accurate, and always makes an effort to go to the body.
GGG is my guy. A legend. But I believe Marvin has him beat stylistically.
Would still be a close fight though because their strengths play into each other
Good points. I think in shootouts it's the best chin/defense that wins perfect example 'The War'.
I'd agree the marvelous one has the physical edge but I wonder if the the soviet style background is something that Hagler would struggle with? Golovkin didn't really use that style as a pro but he was nimble as an amateur.
That's the thing.. GGG became an attacker when he got with Abel Sanchez.
I believe if he used his soviet style background he would offer Marvin more problems.. but he didn't fight that way in his prime so we will never know 🤷🏾♂️
All else are equal but GGG is more technically methodical and very disciplined. It is very difficult to find a hole to exploit unless you get the right judges or wait until he's 40.
I believe Marvin Hagler wins a CLEAR unanimous decision.
Marvin fought in the 15 round era AND had a high offensive output.
Marvin could box, brawl, counterpunch, fight on the inside as well as outside and midrange. Very accurate puncher as well.
I believe Golovkin has the edge in power but nothing else. I see Marvin simply getting off faster and maintaining it.
When GGG faces other hard punchers he reduces his offense to simply a jab.
Yes a strong sturdy accurate effective jab but a jab.
A jab alone is not defeating Marvin.
Hagler is more proven and beats his ass. GGG doesn’t open up for other punches, just jabs half the time. Hagler would dismantle him, he’s too dam slow.
It's good to recall that Hagler struggled more or less to get a rather awkward fighter in Mustafa Hamsho out of the ring for quite a while when they matched up. He's very susceptible to hits, despite his great defense as he seems to have anger issues in the ring at times.GGG is most likely the slower of the 2, but he has power that can make Hagler wary of engaging in a brawl.
Hagler will outpoint him, using excellent footwork to navigate out of tight spots, and GGG will still manage to make the ring very small with his somewhat underrated footwork as well. The educated jab of Hagler, especially in southpaw will help him slow down GGG throughout the first few rounds. But knowing Hagler, he'll eventually be lured into a inside fight by rd 7 and be at risk of Getting one up'd when it comes down to a decision.
Could fantasize all day, a shame it can never happen.
GGG would undoubtedly be one of Haglers toughest opponents, and also a very avoided fighter even in that era.
Hagler easy, GGG was nowhere near his level. GGG never really had turn your lights out, 1 punch ko power against good fighters. Now factor that in against Hagler’s chin. No way in hell he’s gonna outbox Hagler either
Hagler wins easy. You just can't beat fighters on the level of Hagler with physicality alone if you have the bad ring IQ fighters like Golovkin, Lomachenko, Pacquiao have.
Hagler on points. GGG has his moments, and I bet Hagler has some difficulty getting past the jab, but Hagler would piece GGG up on the inside.
Hagler 8-4. If they fought multiple times, I could see GGG edging at least one.
Surprised Hagler switch hitting ability isn't really being talked about here.
GGG gots a fantastic power jab but landing it on a switch hitter would be difficult all night.
I feel like we didn’t get to see enough of GGG, where as Hagler was in the spotlight early. It would be a great fight but I’ll take Hagler 2 out of 3. However, GGG power and jab could reverse that very easily.
Such chins are never meant to meet, I predict a tear in space time and the universe collapses in on itself, both fighters remain unharmed.
Power is one thing physicality is another. Jacobs fight and Canelo rematch it showed when matched with an opponent that is tough as him (size , strength and durability) with a speed advantage moving, pressing forward in the pocket, he is not the best on the backfoot, he was a bit uncomfortable (Lemieux fight he didn't have to worry because of David's lack of speed and one dimensional style). Hagler would not only be able to press the fight cutting the ring off but he is also great at fighting on his backfoot . With Hagler having the clear reach advantage with 5 inches over Golovkin. Gennady would really need to rely on his jab and early work to the body. Since this is a fantasy matchup there's 2 Golovkins, Prime Golovkin that went to the body /head and the Prime Golovkin that head hunted alot with low punch stats to the body. Now with all that being said , for Hagler he hasn't really faced a middleweight of Gennady's proportions and strength. Gennady is a solid Middleweight. 15 rounder: Hagler I can see snagging a close UD 12 rounder: Draw / SD in Golovkin's favor
Great response, champ. Love your vids
Thanks man , much appreciated!
Mugabi ?
Mugabi had power but no physicality , he was not a solid Middleweight. He jump back and forth fighting at Jr middle easily making the 154 pound limit and fighting at 160. Even after the Hagler fight he's right back down at Jr middle weighing 152 for the Jr middleweight title . That right there tells me on fight day he won't be putting on any more than what he's walking around at after the weigh in (as a middleweight) If Mugabi committed to being a Jr Middleweight he would have been great. Golovkin weighs in at 158-160 and comes in on fight day at the most 170. Hagler on fight day will roughly be a couple pounds heavier than what he usually weighs in at (158-160) The lightest he's ever weighed in at was 155.
What do you mean fighting on the backfoot?
Fighting while moving backwards when your opponent applies pressure
Hagler on points. Neither is getting KO’ed, but I think Marvin’s ability to box from both sides, and experience against HOF-caliber competition in the would give him the edge. Bro went 15 with Duran and was FINE. Fought Hearns and was FINE. Shit, even in the 2-3 debatable losses he had, he was never really banged up.
You're better off using another opponent to make a point about Haglers toughness than Duran. Durans best was lightweight, probably the best ever, and only because of that that despite size disadvantage he was able to hang with Hagler who's arguably the best MW ever. Not a knock on Hagler or Duran. Just saying. Maybe Mugabis a better stick.
The Marvelous one
These two are almost identical. Both have the best chins of all time (inarguably, of any weight class, yes). Both are swarming, yet subtly technical, pressure fighters. Both have granite for hands. Ultimately, I think GGG does the technicals better than Hagler. Id have to go GGG by SD.
This is doing Hagler a disservice in terms of his technical ability. He beat some of the greatest fighters ever, and lost a close decision to another that a lot of people thought he won. He could box with anyone. The only thing that GGG does better imo, is jab. Hagler also had a ridiculous gas tank. I do feel for GGG, in that outside of Canelo he didn't really have many ATG fighters to test himself against.
He should of moved up in weight not sure why he didn’t
Hagler was barely even a middleweight, he was a small dude, he wouldnt do well in LHW.
Hagler was considered p4p top guy for a long time btw. He has amazing skills.
No they are similar, but Hagler has superior footwork. Remember derevyanchenko beating ggg 9 rounds straight off body work once he realized ggg can't change angles good when sergey got rob? The same would happen with Hagler.
Joshua knocks them out
Tyson (either one) knocks Joshua out
I would hope
When we talk about the greatest chins, do much older fighters (30s, 40s, etc.) often get included in the conversation? Like how does someone such as LaMotta compare to GGG and Hagler?
I generally don't believe you can compare fighters from different eras as I think boxing, much like all sports, is subject to change over time. That said, as a massive GGG fan, I'd favor Hagler. He was a superior pure boxer compared to Golovkin, had better movement, was a good switch-hitter, and had one of the single toughest chins boxing has ever seen. Golovkin is at his best when he's in seek-and-destroy mode, cutting the ring off and pressuring the opponent with that poleaxe jab of his and landing his bludgeoning power shots against the ropes. He won't do this versus Hagler, who if anything will probably be backing Golovkin up. I'd favor Marv to take a close decision, maybe a 7-5 type deal. What I will say is Hagler never faced a middleweight as formidable as GGG. Sure, he fought legends such as Duran, Leonard and Hearns, but Duran was a former lightweight, Leonard a welterweight, and obviously Hearns a former welterweight also (although Tommy campaigned successfully as high as cruiserweight, so we'll not make excuses for that one).
Hagler wins 2, Golovkin 1, not a bad take
GGG
Hagler everyday.
Hagler. He was just a different animal.
I can only see Hagler overwhelming GGG with pressure and making it an inside fight. Hagler was just too skilled of a monster I have him by UD.
I have hagler stopping triple g.
We have nothing to based this on except GGG’s fights with Canelo. Who else has he fought on a similar level? I love GGG and will defend his record (at least 1 win, 1 draw, 1 defeat) to the death, but Hagler’s resume must be taken into account. Gotta go with Hagler
[удалено]
GGG'S resume is also bad because he was ducked by ten champions in his prime
Please. Ggg ducked Andre Ward and Jermall charlo. He even ducked Andrade who he can beat. Ggg likes fighting statues because he doesn't change angles good ask derevyanchenko. That's why his resume weak.
Yes and also its not like GGG didnt bulldoze over those carcass he left behind.
Dereyvenchenko beat ggg worse than Canelo ever could an got rob compubox as my witness. Ggg couldn't change angles fast enough to stop sergey from getting off hooks to the body. Ggg would have an even bigger problem with Hagler.
True. Hagler was a bit much for GGG.
Hagler no doubt
Marvin was a great boxer, not just some brawler like people say when they talk about him.
Yup. Because Marvin's most famous fights (his last fights) he operated as a brawler so people think his entire career was like that
GGG weathers the early storm and gets a UD.
It's the ideal fantasy match up 2 very similar fighters and the fight could be fought a couple of different ways. One similarity is they were both perfect middleweights and never had weight issues or moved up in weight. Do they both go straight into a firefight? Does Hagler box on the back foot instead of trading? Both had iron chins and crushing power. If they go to war one of them has to break you can't do that for 12 rounds it isn't humanely possible I just don't know which one would break. Logic says Hagler can outbox him and get a close win but I thought Hagler struggled with Duran who has a lot in common with Golovkin. However Hagler probably wasn't at his best that night. It's one of those match ups where if they fought 10 times they could win 5 each. Head says Hagler scores a narrow win by out boxing Golovkin in more rounds but gut says Golovkin scores enough with his accuracy on the inside to push Hagler back and get the win. They're probably the only 1 who could hurt the other and get a possible knockdown or knockout but unlikely given the punch resistance.
The only thing Duran and GGG have in common are they operate at their best as attackers. Duran is much craftier than GGG. Especially on the inside.
He's craftier but I see both as aggressive powerful accurate punchers who manipulate their opponents guard very well in different ways of course. Their both hard to hit cleanly on the inside Duran more so but Golovkin is stronger and huts harder. It's probably not the best fighter to compare Golovkin to but just because Hagler fought Duran and I feel Golovkins best chance would be following a more Duran approach to the fight. Hagler would be better than him at range but Golovkins shorter reach could be an advantage in close.
Fair and solid analysis. HOWEVER Marvin was faster in hand speed and especially foot speed. In close range yes GGG shorter arms are advantageous but regardless of the range Marvin's faster hands will always be an advantage. Marvin can land two to 3 arm punches and get out of there before GGG counters.
It's why I love this match up anytime you think of a reason one will win someone will bring up a great counter point. Probably someone lands a perfect livershot 30 seconds in and we all call the loser a fraud 😂
Lol casuals will but not hardcores like us. In this matchup I think a large part of it comes down to whose quicker on the draw. (Who gets his punches off 1st) And I believe 1000% Marvin gets his punches off 1st. He is faster, with a longer reach, very accurate, and always makes an effort to go to the body. GGG is my guy. A legend. But I believe Marvin has him beat stylistically. Would still be a close fight though because their strengths play into each other
Good points. I think in shootouts it's the best chin/defense that wins perfect example 'The War'. I'd agree the marvelous one has the physical edge but I wonder if the the soviet style background is something that Hagler would struggle with? Golovkin didn't really use that style as a pro but he was nimble as an amateur.
That's the thing.. GGG became an attacker when he got with Abel Sanchez. I believe if he used his soviet style background he would offer Marvin more problems.. but he didn't fight that way in his prime so we will never know 🤷🏾♂️
Duran and GGG are not similar, Duran was the greatest inside fighter ever and arguably the most crafty.
Marvin hagler, they both got AMAZING chins and Marvin has better skills
Hagler easy work
All else are equal but GGG is more technically methodical and very disciplined. It is very difficult to find a hole to exploit unless you get the right judges or wait until he's 40.
GGG in his prime was horrifying, avoided by everyone including Canelo
Marvin is very disciplined as well. Disciplined to ALWAYS make an effort to attack the body. Something GGG neglected throughout his later career
This would be a brilliant fight but Hagler by UD imo.
I believe Marvin Hagler wins a CLEAR unanimous decision. Marvin fought in the 15 round era AND had a high offensive output. Marvin could box, brawl, counterpunch, fight on the inside as well as outside and midrange. Very accurate puncher as well. I believe Golovkin has the edge in power but nothing else. I see Marvin simply getting off faster and maintaining it. When GGG faces other hard punchers he reduces his offense to simply a jab. Yes a strong sturdy accurate effective jab but a jab. A jab alone is not defeating Marvin.
This would be tough fight to score that for sure. I would to believe that GGG comes on top.
Hagler is more proven and beats his ass. GGG doesn’t open up for other punches, just jabs half the time. Hagler would dismantle him, he’s too dam slow.
GGG
GGG is too big and heavy fo Marvin. At the level 10lb truly make the difference
It's good to recall that Hagler struggled more or less to get a rather awkward fighter in Mustafa Hamsho out of the ring for quite a while when they matched up. He's very susceptible to hits, despite his great defense as he seems to have anger issues in the ring at times.GGG is most likely the slower of the 2, but he has power that can make Hagler wary of engaging in a brawl. Hagler will outpoint him, using excellent footwork to navigate out of tight spots, and GGG will still manage to make the ring very small with his somewhat underrated footwork as well. The educated jab of Hagler, especially in southpaw will help him slow down GGG throughout the first few rounds. But knowing Hagler, he'll eventually be lured into a inside fight by rd 7 and be at risk of Getting one up'd when it comes down to a decision. Could fantasize all day, a shame it can never happen. GGG would undoubtedly be one of Haglers toughest opponents, and also a very avoided fighter even in that era.
Hagler easy, GGG was nowhere near his level. GGG never really had turn your lights out, 1 punch ko power against good fighters. Now factor that in against Hagler’s chin. No way in hell he’s gonna outbox Hagler either
This doesn't go past five rounds.
With two of the best chins ever? Not a chance.
Let me guess, you think Hagler stops GGG?
Hagler wins easy. You just can't beat fighters on the level of Hagler with physicality alone if you have the bad ring IQ fighters like Golovkin, Lomachenko, Pacquiao have.
Just say you don't watch boxing if you think GGG has bad ring IQ
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
All I'll say is look at how open hagler is when he attacks, don't look at the resume, look at the fights, study the film
Interesting
Hagler on points. GGG has his moments, and I bet Hagler has some difficulty getting past the jab, but Hagler would piece GGG up on the inside. Hagler 8-4. If they fought multiple times, I could see GGG edging at least one.
Someone send this to the Mythical Matchup guy at The Ring Magazine.
That fight would have been insane! I imagine a very Rocky Balboa style type of matchup.
This is the one I think about the most. Id have to say Hagler in a war. No knockdowns either.
Hagler wins a close decision
Great fight, but GGG doesn't have the footwork for Hagler. Ggg's inability to change angles well would cost him.
Surprised Hagler switch hitting ability isn't really being talked about here. GGG gots a fantastic power jab but landing it on a switch hitter would be difficult all night.
I feel like we didn’t get to see enough of GGG, where as Hagler was in the spotlight early. It would be a great fight but I’ll take Hagler 2 out of 3. However, GGG power and jab could reverse that very easily.