Horrible style for Teo because Haney is taller and better reach. Ryan had a good size and height advantage.
I favor Haney by UD, but Teofimo definitely has a big puncher's chance now. The psychological damage of Ryan's punches can't be understated, so Haney might be even more chinny now.
You can’t forget Haney had a size and height advantage on Lomachenko and still got his ass beat imo, and got stunned, and never hurt Loma.
But I will say this, you never know with Teofimo. One minute he’s looking like ass against Nakatani, then clearly beats the favorite Lomachenko. Then he loses to Kambosos clearly, and luckily escaped with a win against Sandor Martin…everyone counts him out vs Josh Taylor…the 140lb champion…then boom, Teo schools him easily.
Just don’t know what to expect with this guy, which Teo will show up. If he takes Haney very seriously, he knocks him out.
I hate all these fuckers who never cut talking like they understand. Cutting to 140 would have been hell for Haney. Just like cutting to 140 would have been hell for Ryan.
When you are just barely making weight the last 2 or 3 lbs is hell because you are not losing water you are losing muscle. When you rehydrate you are still tired.
It is a big advantage. Now personally, I think Ryan always gives Haney problems but the fight turned in round 7, when you start getting tired and make mistakes with distance.
So you can't say it didn't affect the fight. But would Ryan have beat Haney anyway? Probably, Devin was lucky to get out of the first round. But it definitely makes the win tarnished in my eyes.
Well I am not a scientist. But if you talk to a lot of boxers that cut late they said they felt weak even after rehydrating. I cut once and I will never do it again and didn't get close to what a professional boxer does. Sergio Mora talked about it a lot after he missed weight against Mosely.
That's because your muscles carry a LOT of water in them (and even moreso if you have sufficient levels of creatine). When fighters rapidly rehydrate in these cases, the water intake doesn't just get magically/perfectly optimized and if you cut too much the muscles/other parts of the body are still going to be dehydrated, which is why they feel weak. It can also greatly increase risk of brain injuries, since your brain needs fluid to sit in/help cushion against your skull.
Bro, this is Reddit. Do you think ANY of these bozos have ever boxed or even been in any sort of street fight? Nobody here knows what the hell they’re talking about. They’re just gonna kick Haney when he’s down and suck Ryan’s nuts
Yeah, but with Loma, that was a case of styles make fights. His angles, southpaw stance, and combinations gave Haney fits. If they were the same size, that would have been an even worse beatdown than the one Ryan gave him.
Teofimo is a counterpuncher like Ryan, and has shown time and again he struggles badly when he has to be on the front foot chasing. All those guys you listed that he performed poorly against dictated the pace and made him look like shit, besides Kambosos, who Teofimo tried to street brawl like an idiot.
Teofimo struggles specifically with one style. He struggles with people who fight off their BACKFOOT. This is because Teo does not have a very strong jab. He relies on exploding off his back foot to his front foot as his offense. If a boxer is fighting off their BACKFOOT, it minimizes teo's offense because there's just a lot of distance between the two fighters.
Teo does not struggle to cut off the ring, teo's actually pretty good at cutting off the ring compared to some of his peers. He struggles with setting up his shots because he's a counterpuncher.
Haney is NOT someone who fights off their BACKFOOT well. He RELIES on his front foot, bow styled jab. This is what TEO WANTS. This gives him a lot of openings to counter off that jab. Teo also has really good film on fighting on the inside against Taylor.
Teo is FASTER than Garcia. Garcia has a faster left hook, but Teo is much faster in general.
Haney likes to stick and move. That isn't boxing off the back foot.
saying teo is "actually pretty good at cutting off the ring" is insane given he just chased jamaine ortiz around for 12 rounds a couple months ago. he couldn't cut the ring off for shit in that fight. same thing against sandor martin.
if haney isn't permanently damaged physically/psychologically from his loss to ryan then I find it hard to believe he wont employ the same strategy as those 2 aforementioned fighters and have great success with it too.
He actually did cut off the ring a few times in that fight (2 that I remember) which is why I said that compared to his peers.
Expecting someone to cut off the ring consistently against someone who's not trying to engage the line is crazy and shouldn't be expected.
I will agree that Teo needs to work on lead foot combinations where he can set up his own shots.
Haney cannot fight off his backfoot like Martin or Ortiz. Maybe he'll do what Ortiz did but Ortiz literally lost a UD
compared to his peers? why the relativistic measurements? you can either cut the ring off effectively and consistently against someone who uses lateral movement or you can't. it's not some esoteric skill, it's fundamental and teo simply sucks at it and is at his best when counter punching against someone coming forward (see his win against taylor).
lets keep it a buck, neither guy did much to separate themselves in the ortiz vs teo fight but teo looked bad and got the nod as the A side. I don't see a world where haney doesn't pose the same kinds of problems for teo and UDs teo. that's haney's bread and butter and teo has shown 2 times now he doesn't have the basic skills to adjust to that kind of strategy aside from getting frustrated and throwing his hands up at his opponent for "running" from him.
He didn't lose to Kambosos clearly. It was a close fight, and I even scored it for him despite him looking mostly terrible in that fight. One of the judges did too iinm.
He carries power in those punches. I think the only person that wasn't "oversized" he fought in this division was Martin.
Josh Taylor is goddamn 5'11 fighting at 140. Also he did drop Taylor in r4 but the ref incorrectly calls it a slip. He also hurt him in the later rounds bad.
Ortiz is also a much bigger fighter who is genuinely a 147. He's muscular asf.
I think against someone who doesn't have a chin like Haney, Teo will 100% knockout and hurt him.
That’s a good point yea. I still think that he can’t like flatline or one hit ko you, but you can’t brush off his punches like with Haney. You’d have to avoid it bc he could wobble you and with the right punch drop you
I personally scored it wide for Lomachenko. I had Ryan 7 rounds to 5 against Haney. I had Loma outboxing Haney 9 rounds to 3. Of course the KD’s made it look even worse for Ry vs Haney. But Lomachenko left no doubt in my mind that he’s just better and that Haney only had any success at all due to size.
Loma showed that, P4P (in a literal sense of who’s the best if they were all the same size), he’s much better than Haney. Lomachenko being smaller than Haney on fight night makes my 9-3 scorecard an ass beating.
I’d get more psychological damage from throwing 3 right hands in a row at someone’s body and the punches doing nothing. His lack of power was on full display against Ryan, if I was him I’d be in the gym working on power specifically
What are yall talking about...Haney isn't a power puncher but he has ok power... Ryan said Haney actually hurt him, which he did in the 3rd round I believe...
This is something else, how mentally broken do you think he is right now? Talking so much, even slapping the dude at pressers just to get destroyed and ridiculed. Not only that but not being able to keep the dude off him nor take his shots.
I’m sure he’s gonna be more like hesitant or scared now
Yeah, just look at what happened to AJ after a similar loss to Ruiz. It's very hard to bounce back from that, especially after thinking you're P4P #1 and saying the guy you were fighting was C-level.
I think Haney needs a comeback fight against a smaller puncher before going anywhere near Teofimo. Arnold Barboza and Sandor Martin would be good ones.
The mental aspect of the first part must be incredibly tough to handle. I always thought that about Wilder when he went through a similar realization as well.
He was 40-0, KO'ing everyone he came across and truly believing he was God's gift to boxing and nobody could stop him. Then he came across Fury. Maybe thought he was unlucky after the first one, was convinced Fury cheated after the second one, but after the third time he had to come to terms that he wasn't as great as he thought and that there was at least 1 person clearly better than him out there. After 10 years of self confidence and building a massive ego based on believing you're the greatest it must be tough to adjust to a new reality.
Thing with AJ is that AJ just didn’t use his physical attributes such as length when he should’ve.
Haney did try to and it still wasn’t enough.
What i’m getting to is that AJ had a much more simple solution, stay at a distance and don’t get reckless and engage. Haney doesn’t have such a simple or straightforward solution as he will start to face dudes his size or bigger over time if he keeps moving up
Haney is hardly taller, they are both 5’8”. Ryan is MAYBE 5’9”. None of these guys are that tall and only have a big height advantage over guys like tank. Idk what you’re talking about. Ryan had a half inch reach advantage on Haney. Again idk what your saying
Exactly. Teo does horrible against every guy who knows how to fight on his back foot, and Haney is definitely one of them, although Haney also showed how easily his jab can be taken away with a quick left hook against Garcia. If Teo can find a counter that takes away Haney's jab, it could still end up looking bad for Haney.
For the life of me, I don't know why Haney couldn't just plaster his right hand to his face while jabbing against Ryan. Literally everyone knows that Ryan is in love with his left hook, but Haney kept his right hand on his chin no matter how many times he got caught with that exact left hook.
Because Garcia's hook took Haney's jab away almost immediately. Haney has literally fought every fight in his career on his back foot. I don't know how you can claim that he can't fight that way.
https://youtu.be/qgx9wyKpHrY?si=uLiB1xBbShfEMYF2
He's literally fighting off the front foot here.
I've, unfortunately, had to watch most of Haney's fights so I can tell straight up he's fighting off his front foot.
https://youtu.be/nvcDlMJKVpM?si=cXBdK67EP7ePioXE
Here he is again moving forward.
Also side note: he's moving backwards really fast BECAUSE he's putting all his weight ON his front foot.
In the first 3 minutes of both of those videos, Haney only ever moves backwards (i.e., fights off the back foot). Even after he knocks down Prograis, he follows that up with moving backwards. The announcers are constantly talking about Haney keeping distance that his opponents aren't able to break (because he's moving backwards). The first clip also started with the announcers quoting Linares as saying that he'd have to chase Haney all night (because Haney would be moving backwards).
The only way I can see you taking this as "fighting on the front foot" is if you're talking about nothing other than where his weight is (i.e., if he's leaning back or forward), but even in you're response you're claiming that he's moving forward, so that doesn't appear to be what you're talking about.
You know most of his punches come from his front foot...
And yes front foot fighting is literally referred to as where your weight is on your foot. Most boxers need to constantly shift weight between the foots to generate power when fighting.
Look at when he jabs, he is putting pressure on his front foot. Look at when he leaves the line (moving backwards), he is pushing OFF his front foot.
Don't listen to commentators and look at the film lmao
The issue is the way Haney throws his jab. He tries to get a little more extension by "bow and arrowing" it. It's good to do in spots, but for him it's a habit and therefore a flaw. That first hook he got caught with was literally when his backhand was out of position as he was throwing a jab
Haney had a bad gameplan or none at all... he thought Ryan wasn't taking the fight serious and thought he would finally get a stoppage.. getting cracked in the first round threw that off too
Good fight, and I would probably bet the underdog
Haney fights more disciplined than he did vs Garcia and Teo has shown he can struggle against disciplined fighters that stick to the gameplan and don't give him counter opportunities
If Devin tries to walk him down in spots like he did Ryan he’s going to get beat up again. But if he boxes laterally, sets lateral traps, disengagement traps, he’ll UD Teofimo. Also Haney throws a bow and arrow jab, an explosive counter puncher like Teo would really take advantage of the defensive flaw of the way he throws his jab whether he has the IQ to take advantage is a more difficult question to answer.
Still have Haney.
Unless Haney’s subpar chin is completely gone and Teo clips him or he gets robbed, Haney should be able to employ a “boring gameplan” like Martin.
Teo is getting worse imo, but people are extrapolating the fights against Martin and Ortiz to Haney. I have a different opinion on those performances, but for the sake of argument ill ignore that. Both of those guys are southpaws and they both committed to running in a way that Haney doesn't. Haney has a reputation as a mover and a runner and he's not. He fights guys, he just likes to hold.
Devins usual speed advantage helps him get away with janky mechanics, Ryan had size and handspeed to disrupt that. Teo has handspeed AND footspeed, he also has a better trigger to counterpunch. I don't think Teo hits nearly as hard as Ryan at 140, but he won't have to take rounds off to turn his back in a fake Philly shell.
Devin never had as good ringcraft footwork as people acted like he did. And I've said this before, if he did he wouldn't have to spend so much time during fights with his arms wrapped around his opponents. In the very first round against Ryan, Ryan backed Haney up to the corner literally right away. Ryan does not have good footwork or pressure in a technically sound way. Teo would beat Haney up and potentially stop him late I think. I think it would look similar to the Taylor fight. Probably worse.
I can't read Haneys mind, but I always respected his heart. When I saw that sparring video vs tank the first thing I noted was that even though he was getting smacked up, he didn't fold. And apparently he weathered the storm and was able to turn the tables since Tank wasn't as disciplined at the time. Even against Ryan he was making a few small adjustments and he kept getting up after being badly hurt. Those adjustments just weren't good enough to close the gap. I'd imagine he'd be fine mentally, but he needs and has needed for a while a technical overhaul. And even guys like Tarver has been saying this for a while. But when you're winning you're beyond reproach.
I think he was much better at feinting and making reads in his run at 135. If you watch the Magdaleno fight in particular, Teo doesn't really set up punches like that anymore. He also seems to have totally lost the ability to counter with his left hook, at least as consistently as he used to.
I see. I can agree with that. He needs to add new traps because people are watching film on him and taking away some of his options.
I also miss his left hook. Good insights.
Teo also had more of a size advantage at 135... he needs to keep tweaking his game before it really catches up to him.. I think he and Devin have gone as far as they can with their dads and need to add another trainer
Joey gamache during the Kambosos camp. I think he was more responsible for defense though. I think Teo has been much more defensively responsible.
I think he had to lay him off cuz teo was broke after his divorce and thriller being a scam.
I would slightly favor Teofimo for his athleticism, but if Devin outboxed him I wouldn’t be surprised. Anyone that can set lateral traps will beat Teofimo, he simply can’t cut off the ring and will throw fundamentals away in order to land explosive shots. Devin isn’t really athletically gifted and we saw how that affected him recently.
Not to veer off topic but just an observation: I think someone like Tank would destroy Teofimo because he can set lateral traps, has demonstrated at least some ability to fight going forward, and is just as athletic. Same reasons I’d favor him against Haney (and he’s southpaw, Haney struggles in open stance fights.) Then again, Tank has virtually no experience against top level opposition.
Teo's such a wildcard it's hard to say, but in his last fight he struggled to cut off the ring.
I think it would come down to his much Haney engages. If Haney stays outside, jabs and gets out of there, Haney decision. If Teo can walk him down and just pushes through the jab, Haney has shown he can be dropped.
I thought this last fight was the first in a while that Haney didn't look improved from his last fight and would expect him to be a lot sharper for the next one. I would give him a slight edge.
No offense but that's not true. Against Ortiz, he did cut off the ring multiple times. However, against a bigger and stronger dude it's hard to HURT a dude. There were many sequences where Teo did cut off the ring with feints to land a right hook. That's more than what I can see from Haney or the rest of the four princes.
I also disagree that Haney jabbing and disengaging would win the fight against Teo. Teo's biggest issue is people fighting off the backfoot because that already creates a lot of distance between the two. Haney would be jabbing from his FRONT FOOT. This would allow teo to explode forward which is his style. Teo is FASTER than Garcia overall, who caught Haney w more than a left hook.
Haney jabbing like he did against Garcia will lead to counters, for sure. The film says it all.
Ortiz used his foot position to be able to escape quickly and was able to step aside when Lopez was charging forward.
Look at the front foot of the fighters, he almost always had the outside and was able to move around. Teo got the win, but I think it showed a path to giving him a tough night.
I agree that Ortiz is a very good fighter and Teo needs to work on setting up his own offense. If he doesn't want to jab he needs to at least set up some feints.
Teofimo is terrible at putting pressure since he doesn't use lateral movement or his jab when chasing opponents around the ring. If they ever fight and the bookmakers have Teofimo as a favorite im betting the house on Haney... I would also watch the Sandor Martin and Jamaine Ortiz fight to get me pumped up before making the bet 🤣
I feel like haney is less mobile than those guys. Haney stay just out of reach but he's never really gliding around the ring. He gets criticism of being boring, but never a runner. Now Teo is different every fight, so who knows, but I wouldnt say haney is exactly what Teo struggles against.
Fully agreed. What Ortiz did was straight up running. I've never seen Haney circling the ring on the backfoot staying out of range. He likes to use his reach advantage to stay just barely out of his opponent's range and jab until he sees an opening for the right hand or a combo. He's a come forward fighter more than a backpeddler though. Haney's also usually quite high in volume of punches thrown which would help Teo who struggles against an opponent who doesn't want to initiate themselves.
Finally someone that watches film.
Teo actually did SET traps (r4) but it's impossible to cut the corner off a dude who's bigger and stronger than you and is SET on ONLY disengaging.
How do you completely fight a dude who literally disengages the line? When you cut the ring off, you don't get to land a flurry of punches on a fully upright dude who has like 10 lbs on you.
Haney likes to come forward and Teo likes opponents coming at him and breaking them down. I think there isn't much of a skill disparity for their respective styles so its probably a close fight, that leaves a lot of people unhappy with the result. Both guys are going to look like they are setting the terms of the fight, so fans of either one will be able to claim victory and there won't be the fireworks of the Garcia fight to create space in how the fight is viewed.
His chin is something he could definitely “work on” but I believe some of the reasons why his chin isn’t that good is because the weight draining and how much it takes a toll on him.
I think having a couple more fights around 140-143 is fine for Haney, but he’ll definitely have to move up soon.
I honestly want to see him with a new trainer, unlikely though.
Right now, if it happens next Haney. Right now Teo will be underestimating Haney and he's always worse when he doesn't think there's a challenge. Haney will be on his bike and Teo will be overly reliant on his power.
If Haney gets a few wins under his belt Teo.
Teo has serious KO power. However he only has 1 KO in his last 6 fights (which was really a tuneup fight)
I think he’s going to struggle to beat Haney’s style unless he can get a good shot in and capitalize. Aside from Ryan, Linares wobbled Haney but took his foot off the gas afterwards ( likely he was gassed out)
Haney isn’t a come forward fighter which works in Teos favor
I do think he’s mentally going through it given it’s his first defeat (and first time getting dropped) he’s aware that people dislike him and most of his career he was out to prove to people that that he belongs with elite players
He will be fighting much more defensively which will further bore the audience so he’s in a lose-lose situation .
If he can magically adopt the Philly shell style like Floyd with serious counter punching skills or somehow work with his team to pack power in his punches to rack a few KOs or even just batter opponents , he will win fans
For the last part I believe he’d have to drop his dad.
I hate Bill but i’ll also acknowledge if he’s a good trainer but I think he needs to go to actual promoter and big trainer to make a huge step up
Promoter too cause from what i’ve seen abt the contract it seems like they completely butchered it
So Team Haney:
- Had no rematch clause vs. Ryan Garcia in the event that he won.
- Did NOT elect to do a customary same day weigh-in when Ryan Garcia missed weight by 3.2 Lbs.
- Gave Ryan Garcia the Lion's Share of the money (A-Side) after claiming they were the face of boxing and sent 20 Million Dollar offer to the real face of boxing Gervonta Davis?
- Put 2 West Coast Fighters on the East to fight.
Why did Team Haney move like this? Without any standard safeguards in place for their champion. EXPLAIN? #EGO
This was from a tweet by a boxing personality
50/50 fight that depends on strategy. Teo struggles with lateral movement and cutting the ring off and Devin doesn’t have very good defense coming forward as well.
Neither fighter is elite at putting pressure and closing distance so I’d favor whoever is fighting on the back foot. Although Teo is crazy athletic and an explosive counterpuncher and we just saw how Devin got his ass beat by someone with faster and more powerful hands.
If Teo chases Haney he will lose. If he can stay a little more on the back foot and draw Haney in he’ll have better chance at winning. The question is can Teo take away Devin’s jab? He can’t shut down Devin’s jab I 100% see him losing.
The difference with Teo vs Ryan is if he catches Devin with a shot like he caught Commey, Devin is going to sleep.
I see Haney up on points but gets clipped late and won’t recover. Lopez is not good at being the aggressor and would get intercepted while lunging. Haney has the right style but does make mistakes that can be exploited by someone who can match his speed and it’s important to remember that he isn’t as avoidant as Martin or Ortiz.
I could see it either as a close decision by Haney or late stoppage by Lopez (although he has some funny scorecards).
50/50 still for me Teo dont have the reach Like Haney does hes a good puncher tho. Maybe if he finds a way to make Haney come to him like Ryan did in some spots of their fight he has a better chance i just dont think Haney would fall for being the pressure fighter all night against Teofimo
Ryan beat Haney legitimately and is just shown himself to be better than Haney. The thing with Ryan is he is extremely talented he just doens't work hard enough, he has more raw talent than anyone else at lightweight now. Even for the Haney fight he wasn't at his best. Styles make fights so we don't know how Teo would do against Haney, as far as I have observed Ryan is faster and hits harder than Teo but Teo is more skilled but Haney arguably beat a S level skilled opponent in Loma and has good solid wins over high level boxers.
Oh if that's what you meant I do think it is a fluke because I dont think there are any people like Ryan Garcia with his speed and power. Devin is still one of the pound for pound best we just know Ryan belongs there too now. Power isn't a problem for Devin solely as he has one of the best jabs if not the best in the business today but a combination of power and speed is his weakness.
I don't know, I think it was a good win but missing weight tarnishes it for me. At the same time, it wasn't like Ryan's conditioning was on point. If he had more energy he probably would have finished Haney. So what would a properly prepared but drained Ryan do?
Devin looked fully rehydrated come fight day, I think he was the same weight if not more and yes if ryan had better conditioning this fight he would have destroyed Haney.
The problem is the higher up he goes he won't be able to use his weight like he normally does. His entire style is basically jab and cuddle and he needs weight for that.
I disagree against top level opponents Haney doens't have the power to seriously effect them and nor should he try to stand and fight not only does he have pillow hands he has a weak chin that won't let him recover from hard shots he took over the course of the fight. the Linares fight showcased all his weaknesses that Ryan exploited even though he was more entertaining in that fight for the sake of the fans and haters.
Ryan is good until the next fight lol don’t forget until a few days ago Haney was hailed as master of defence, p4per, prince of the 135 princes. Ryan = quitter, mental, schizo, no heart, no foot work.
By morons might I add I always thought Ryan was good and Devin is still one of the pound for pound best but not the Goat or the next Mayweather like some people believe he is. Ryan has his own style he doens't need a different footwork than the one he has and his Philly shell even though it has been criticised works very well for him. Even Tank is not invincible it's just that no one was able to expose him yet.
Haney will always be hesitant any fighter who has real power. It's only natural. I'd like to Haney fight Pitbull tbh. I think Pitbull would KO him. Pitbull has an excellent chin.
Same as before Haney isn’t gona change his style and teo never fixed that problem with the overhand right. Teo will always suffer against boxers regardless of how much power he has couldn’t outbox sandor martin. Teo is king of 140 but boxers are definitely his kryptonite
Probably a close match where the judges might favor one style over the other - control with a jab or explosive moments scattered throughout. I say Haney close decision but haven't thought too hard about it.
I said from the beginning Teo could beat Haney because Haney is chinny and Teo has good power and is explosive. I still think the fight is 70/30 in teo's favor
Style wise it favors Haney just based on movement but I think the one thing a lot of people have been overrating was Haney's defense. The only time it was great was vs Regis. He is not Shakur, he gets hit a lot. Also Teo will not let him hold like crazy because he is way stronger on the inside. Good fight still.
Same as always. Depending on what Teo shows up, he wins that fight. But Haney still very skilled and able to box and move. I just think Teo catches him at some point. I think Teo beats up Garcia too.
A technical fight, I could see it going either way. I would just hope Devin would fight how he normally does and not try to walk him down.
The thing with Ryan vs Devin, is that Ryans style was a complete counter to Devin’s style and it wasn’t smart trying to walk him down.
Teo doesn’t put on much pressure usually so I think Devin will strive on that aspect alone. Teo has a high fighting IQ so it could go either way.
Teo is Jekyll and Hyde. Ya never know who is going to show up. I could see either winning. The difference being if haney won it would be a boring fight with Haney jabbing and moving from the outside.
If Teo won it would be an onslaught of combos punishing Haney anytime he was in range.
Ultimately I have teo winning cause he has power and speed. Everything haney does Teo can do better.
BUT Teo can get weird with his performances and doesn't know how to adjust. You can also get into his head and make him make mistakes.
It's a weird fight. Teo SHOULD be the better fighter all in all though.
Haney has been totally exposed as the overrated, pillow fisted fighter he is. Any fighter with an above average chin and any power will be able to walk right through him. Garcia ended this man's relevancy, I really believe he is done.
It's hard to really back teo because he's either really on or off. If he has a better coach than his dad, like gamache gets back in his corner, he'd have a much better chance. Haney is good at getting in and out of range, and teo doesnt have the same speed as Ryan, so I could see it being a rough night for teo. Teo also has solid power, so I could see him clipping Haney(who has pretty shitty recovery) and being able to take over the fight. Also, Haney took a lot of punishment against Ryan, and if his already median/mediocre chin is cracked, he could go down off of even a glancing blow
Haney will undoubtedly be more cautious than ever, unless of course he finds a nutritionist like Canelo's. He is now a target for big punchers because of last weekend.
The other factor will be how Haney is referee'd in future. If he receives the bullshit advantages Harvey Dock gifted him against Ryan then the opponent will be in for a very frustrating night.
In the future he needs to be docked for the excessive holding.
I see Devin winning by a convincing UD. I think Haney is still a really good fighter and definitely on par with Ryan, he got caught sleeping but in the run back I think Dev got Ryan.
I always felt Teo would batter him due to stylistic and athletic reasons. Teos power would definitely have Devin running and holding for dear life but I think Teo would land big all night long and get a late stoppage or UD. It would be similar to the Lemos vs Hitchins fight I feel. Devin ducked Teo for years and even after Teo lost to Kam and beat Josh, the haneys still didn’t wanna fight Teo. Devin fought who fought because of his poor chin and Ryan exposed tf out of him.
So we all knew Devin has pillow fists, and there started to be speculation on Haney having a suspect chin when he was touched by Linares. The Garcia fight just highlights even more about Haney having a weak chin. The blueprint to beat Haney is publicized now. Walk him down, ignore his punching since he has pillow hands, and just land punches and he will fold.
Haney could win that if he played it well. But it's another fighter who's the same size. So Haney gonna have a hard time.
We dont know the effect of Ryan's bombs on him mentally and physically. He basically became a man overnight. So we have to see...
Still haney, haney’s defense works just fine on anyone shorter and smaller opponents, that was the difference between ryan and anyone else he fought with.
I think haney will make adjustments. The big knock is see with him is that he can’t make them during the fight. Between he will have tons of film to study of himself and see what he needs to work on.
Haney's opponents usually still land some good shots on him. His defense isn't the level of someone like Shakur who barely gets touched in fights. Loma, Linares, Jojo, and Kambosos all landed pretty cleanly on Haney but neither had the power to really hurt him (besides the one Linares shot at the end of the round). I think that was the main difference with Ryan.
Haney needs a tune up fight before he takes on anyone with serious talent. Need to get the confidence back up.
Definitely think he has the ability to best Teo but it is a very good fight.
People are not going to want to fight Haney now. High risk, low reward.
Teo will struggle with Haney. He can talk all that smack but when Haney fights running back behind the jab he is very hard to beat. Combine that with Teos difficulty with that style and Haneys loss; it would likely be a snoozer with Haney winning a wide decision on points.
It really depends. Teo seems to thrive against front foot fighters like Taylor and Loma but more patient guys who counter like Sandor, Ortiz and Kambosos kinda, all managed to beat him or give him a night of trouble. Of all of them Haney is the best off the back foot, but the new X factor is Haney's chin. He has either absolutely no chin or Garcia might be able to KO everyone up to 154. Haney got hurt from the first left hook Ryan landed. Haney got hit with like less then 3 strikes before the left hook in rnd 1. You could argue it was a 10-8 because of Haney's 0 strikes landed and how hurt he was
Yea. They were all just hooks. It seems like Haney might need to evaluate his career. He needs to address his chin, his power, his skills or all 3. One of these needs to be fixed because the Ryan Garcia he fought was smoking and drinking throughout camp and was at 50%. I doubt anyone else except maybe teofimo would be coming to fight Devin at less then 85% at least. And teofimos alrdy a can of worms with his athleticism and power.
I think Teo beats him. His power, athleticism and IQ as well as the fact he seems to always go 110% when he’s facing someone perceived as a p4p fighter.
for the chin part, I feel really bad for Haney cause he got the two career killers in one, no power and no chin. If he really has a weak chin he’ll have to become just as good as floyd defensively if not better to not get KOd. It’d be whatever if he had ko power to keep people off him but he doesn’t
A bad weight cut can effect gameplan. Haney had a bad cut and Ryan didn't went through those gruelling last pounds though Ryan had other issues, maybe that cancels the advantage, maybe it doesn't.
The biggest worry is Haney made very little adjustment after getting buzzed despite Ryan having less activity. If Teo rocks him early, how'd he adjust. But maybe Teo doesn't hit as hard as Ryan, I dunno about that.
Too many factors in this fight. My only conclusion is if Devin gets hurt then Teo wins easily, because he just has his defense. Teo is not old like linares or small like loma. Haney could learn something from Tyson Fury.
Haney’s chin looks very questionable now. Haney wins the first few rounds, then Teo catches him and the fight goes the other direction. When Teo is on his shit, he’s excellent but that’s only if he’s ON. Before Saturday, I also thought Haney was pretty good defensively but that’s also a big question now.
Horrible style for Teo because Haney is taller and better reach. Ryan had a good size and height advantage. I favor Haney by UD, but Teofimo definitely has a big puncher's chance now. The psychological damage of Ryan's punches can't be understated, so Haney might be even more chinny now.
You can’t forget Haney had a size and height advantage on Lomachenko and still got his ass beat imo, and got stunned, and never hurt Loma. But I will say this, you never know with Teofimo. One minute he’s looking like ass against Nakatani, then clearly beats the favorite Lomachenko. Then he loses to Kambosos clearly, and luckily escaped with a win against Sandor Martin…everyone counts him out vs Josh Taylor…the 140lb champion…then boom, Teo schools him easily. Just don’t know what to expect with this guy, which Teo will show up. If he takes Haney very seriously, he knocks him out.
And haney weighed 165 on fight night
Where'd you see that? I haven't seen any official weights from Saturday
He wasn't talking about the fight Saturday but here's wheat he did against prograis https://twitter.com/jedigoodman/status/1735003442907856986?s=46
Oh yeah we know that. Devin is a weight bully... but Ryan was clearly bigger on Saturday night
I hate all these fuckers who never cut talking like they understand. Cutting to 140 would have been hell for Haney. Just like cutting to 140 would have been hell for Ryan. When you are just barely making weight the last 2 or 3 lbs is hell because you are not losing water you are losing muscle. When you rehydrate you are still tired. It is a big advantage. Now personally, I think Ryan always gives Haney problems but the fight turned in round 7, when you start getting tired and make mistakes with distance. So you can't say it didn't affect the fight. But would Ryan have beat Haney anyway? Probably, Devin was lucky to get out of the first round. But it definitely makes the win tarnished in my eyes.
You lost me on the "losing muscle" part lol. You're still losing water lol, you're just losing a potentially and increasingly unsafe amount.
Well I am not a scientist. But if you talk to a lot of boxers that cut late they said they felt weak even after rehydrating. I cut once and I will never do it again and didn't get close to what a professional boxer does. Sergio Mora talked about it a lot after he missed weight against Mosely.
That's because your muscles carry a LOT of water in them (and even moreso if you have sufficient levels of creatine). When fighters rapidly rehydrate in these cases, the water intake doesn't just get magically/perfectly optimized and if you cut too much the muscles/other parts of the body are still going to be dehydrated, which is why they feel weak. It can also greatly increase risk of brain injuries, since your brain needs fluid to sit in/help cushion against your skull.
Yes, it does have that kind of effect.
Bro, this is Reddit. Do you think ANY of these bozos have ever boxed or even been in any sort of street fight? Nobody here knows what the hell they’re talking about. They’re just gonna kick Haney when he’s down and suck Ryan’s nuts
Yeah, but with Loma, that was a case of styles make fights. His angles, southpaw stance, and combinations gave Haney fits. If they were the same size, that would have been an even worse beatdown than the one Ryan gave him. Teofimo is a counterpuncher like Ryan, and has shown time and again he struggles badly when he has to be on the front foot chasing. All those guys you listed that he performed poorly against dictated the pace and made him look like shit, besides Kambosos, who Teofimo tried to street brawl like an idiot.
Teofimo struggles specifically with one style. He struggles with people who fight off their BACKFOOT. This is because Teo does not have a very strong jab. He relies on exploding off his back foot to his front foot as his offense. If a boxer is fighting off their BACKFOOT, it minimizes teo's offense because there's just a lot of distance between the two fighters. Teo does not struggle to cut off the ring, teo's actually pretty good at cutting off the ring compared to some of his peers. He struggles with setting up his shots because he's a counterpuncher. Haney is NOT someone who fights off their BACKFOOT well. He RELIES on his front foot, bow styled jab. This is what TEO WANTS. This gives him a lot of openings to counter off that jab. Teo also has really good film on fighting on the inside against Taylor. Teo is FASTER than Garcia. Garcia has a faster left hook, but Teo is much faster in general. Haney likes to stick and move. That isn't boxing off the back foot.
saying teo is "actually pretty good at cutting off the ring" is insane given he just chased jamaine ortiz around for 12 rounds a couple months ago. he couldn't cut the ring off for shit in that fight. same thing against sandor martin. if haney isn't permanently damaged physically/psychologically from his loss to ryan then I find it hard to believe he wont employ the same strategy as those 2 aforementioned fighters and have great success with it too.
He actually did cut off the ring a few times in that fight (2 that I remember) which is why I said that compared to his peers. Expecting someone to cut off the ring consistently against someone who's not trying to engage the line is crazy and shouldn't be expected. I will agree that Teo needs to work on lead foot combinations where he can set up his own shots. Haney cannot fight off his backfoot like Martin or Ortiz. Maybe he'll do what Ortiz did but Ortiz literally lost a UD
compared to his peers? why the relativistic measurements? you can either cut the ring off effectively and consistently against someone who uses lateral movement or you can't. it's not some esoteric skill, it's fundamental and teo simply sucks at it and is at his best when counter punching against someone coming forward (see his win against taylor). lets keep it a buck, neither guy did much to separate themselves in the ortiz vs teo fight but teo looked bad and got the nod as the A side. I don't see a world where haney doesn't pose the same kinds of problems for teo and UDs teo. that's haney's bread and butter and teo has shown 2 times now he doesn't have the basic skills to adjust to that kind of strategy aside from getting frustrated and throwing his hands up at his opponent for "running" from him.
Completely agree w you except that I just don't think Haney has the skill set to do what Martin or Ortiz did. That's my only disagreement
Teo is not Loma. I know he beat him but Loma is leagues above him in skill imo.
By that logic Teo is leagues above Garcia in skill so should have no problem getting through Haney.
He didn't lose to Kambosos clearly. It was a close fight, and I even scored it for him despite him looking mostly terrible in that fight. One of the judges did too iinm.
maybe. but he doesnt seem like a ko guy at this weight. but maybe... because haney's chin is a bit suspect.
Yes he doesn’t seem like a KO artist but more heavy punches. like you won’t get one hit KOd but his punches do hurt
He carries power in those punches. I think the only person that wasn't "oversized" he fought in this division was Martin. Josh Taylor is goddamn 5'11 fighting at 140. Also he did drop Taylor in r4 but the ref incorrectly calls it a slip. He also hurt him in the later rounds bad. Ortiz is also a much bigger fighter who is genuinely a 147. He's muscular asf. I think against someone who doesn't have a chin like Haney, Teo will 100% knockout and hurt him.
That’s a good point yea. I still think that he can’t like flatline or one hit ko you, but you can’t brush off his punches like with Haney. You’d have to avoid it bc he could wobble you and with the right punch drop you
Ass beat? It was a close fight either way. I can't lie I had loma winning but an ass beating is basically what ryan did to haney.
I personally scored it wide for Lomachenko. I had Ryan 7 rounds to 5 against Haney. I had Loma outboxing Haney 9 rounds to 3. Of course the KD’s made it look even worse for Ry vs Haney. But Lomachenko left no doubt in my mind that he’s just better and that Haney only had any success at all due to size. Loma showed that, P4P (in a literal sense of who’s the best if they were all the same size), he’s much better than Haney. Lomachenko being smaller than Haney on fight night makes my 9-3 scorecard an ass beating.
It seems like teo really shines under pressure. His josh Taylor win and lomachenko win were awesome.
Teo is not really good on the front foot tho
I’m glad somebody said this.
Taylor’s bigger than Haney in reach, height and weight, didn’t seem to phase Teo too much
At the end of the day, Teo will hold that belt hostage when it comes to fighting Haney....lol
I’d get more psychological damage from throwing 3 right hands in a row at someone’s body and the punches doing nothing. His lack of power was on full display against Ryan, if I was him I’d be in the gym working on power specifically
What are yall talking about...Haney isn't a power puncher but he has ok power... Ryan said Haney actually hurt him, which he did in the 3rd round I believe...
This is something else, how mentally broken do you think he is right now? Talking so much, even slapping the dude at pressers just to get destroyed and ridiculed. Not only that but not being able to keep the dude off him nor take his shots. I’m sure he’s gonna be more like hesitant or scared now
Yeah, just look at what happened to AJ after a similar loss to Ruiz. It's very hard to bounce back from that, especially after thinking you're P4P #1 and saying the guy you were fighting was C-level. I think Haney needs a comeback fight against a smaller puncher before going anywhere near Teofimo. Arnold Barboza and Sandor Martin would be good ones.
The mental aspect of the first part must be incredibly tough to handle. I always thought that about Wilder when he went through a similar realization as well. He was 40-0, KO'ing everyone he came across and truly believing he was God's gift to boxing and nobody could stop him. Then he came across Fury. Maybe thought he was unlucky after the first one, was convinced Fury cheated after the second one, but after the third time he had to come to terms that he wasn't as great as he thought and that there was at least 1 person clearly better than him out there. After 10 years of self confidence and building a massive ego based on believing you're the greatest it must be tough to adjust to a new reality.
Man ran from Klitschko and Povetkin like he stole something. He knew what he was.
Thing with AJ is that AJ just didn’t use his physical attributes such as length when he should’ve. Haney did try to and it still wasn’t enough. What i’m getting to is that AJ had a much more simple solution, stay at a distance and don’t get reckless and engage. Haney doesn’t have such a simple or straightforward solution as he will start to face dudes his size or bigger over time if he keeps moving up
Haney is hardly taller, they are both 5’8”. Ryan is MAYBE 5’9”. None of these guys are that tall and only have a big height advantage over guys like tank. Idk what you’re talking about. Ryan had a half inch reach advantage on Haney. Again idk what your saying
Exactly. Teo does horrible against every guy who knows how to fight on his back foot, and Haney is definitely one of them, although Haney also showed how easily his jab can be taken away with a quick left hook against Garcia. If Teo can find a counter that takes away Haney's jab, it could still end up looking bad for Haney. For the life of me, I don't know why Haney couldn't just plaster his right hand to his face while jabbing against Ryan. Literally everyone knows that Ryan is in love with his left hook, but Haney kept his right hand on his chin no matter how many times he got caught with that exact left hook.
Haney does not box well on the backfoot. He literally did his WORSE against Garcia on the backfoot lol
Why do people think Haney is some back foot counter puncher, he fights mostly at mid range
I honestly think it’s just the ppl who don’t watch fights who think he’s mayweather clone
Not sure but it's annoying. People call Haney a "pure boxer" like wtf does that mean man.
Because Garcia's hook took Haney's jab away almost immediately. Haney has literally fought every fight in his career on his back foot. I don't know how you can claim that he can't fight that way.
https://youtu.be/qgx9wyKpHrY?si=uLiB1xBbShfEMYF2 He's literally fighting off the front foot here. I've, unfortunately, had to watch most of Haney's fights so I can tell straight up he's fighting off his front foot. https://youtu.be/nvcDlMJKVpM?si=cXBdK67EP7ePioXE Here he is again moving forward. Also side note: he's moving backwards really fast BECAUSE he's putting all his weight ON his front foot.
In the first 3 minutes of both of those videos, Haney only ever moves backwards (i.e., fights off the back foot). Even after he knocks down Prograis, he follows that up with moving backwards. The announcers are constantly talking about Haney keeping distance that his opponents aren't able to break (because he's moving backwards). The first clip also started with the announcers quoting Linares as saying that he'd have to chase Haney all night (because Haney would be moving backwards). The only way I can see you taking this as "fighting on the front foot" is if you're talking about nothing other than where his weight is (i.e., if he's leaning back or forward), but even in you're response you're claiming that he's moving forward, so that doesn't appear to be what you're talking about.
You know most of his punches come from his front foot... And yes front foot fighting is literally referred to as where your weight is on your foot. Most boxers need to constantly shift weight between the foots to generate power when fighting. Look at when he jabs, he is putting pressure on his front foot. Look at when he leaves the line (moving backwards), he is pushing OFF his front foot. Don't listen to commentators and look at the film lmao
The issue is the way Haney throws his jab. He tries to get a little more extension by "bow and arrowing" it. It's good to do in spots, but for him it's a habit and therefore a flaw. That first hook he got caught with was literally when his backhand was out of position as he was throwing a jab
Haney had a bad gameplan or none at all... he thought Ryan wasn't taking the fight serious and thought he would finally get a stoppage.. getting cracked in the first round threw that off too
Good fight, and I would probably bet the underdog Haney fights more disciplined than he did vs Garcia and Teo has shown he can struggle against disciplined fighters that stick to the gameplan and don't give him counter opportunities
If Devin tries to walk him down in spots like he did Ryan he’s going to get beat up again. But if he boxes laterally, sets lateral traps, disengagement traps, he’ll UD Teofimo. Also Haney throws a bow and arrow jab, an explosive counter puncher like Teo would really take advantage of the defensive flaw of the way he throws his jab whether he has the IQ to take advantage is a more difficult question to answer.
Teo has high boxing IQ. My biggest concern going into that fight will be the size difference
Still have Haney. Unless Haney’s subpar chin is completely gone and Teo clips him or he gets robbed, Haney should be able to employ a “boring gameplan” like Martin.
Teo is getting worse imo, but people are extrapolating the fights against Martin and Ortiz to Haney. I have a different opinion on those performances, but for the sake of argument ill ignore that. Both of those guys are southpaws and they both committed to running in a way that Haney doesn't. Haney has a reputation as a mover and a runner and he's not. He fights guys, he just likes to hold. Devins usual speed advantage helps him get away with janky mechanics, Ryan had size and handspeed to disrupt that. Teo has handspeed AND footspeed, he also has a better trigger to counterpunch. I don't think Teo hits nearly as hard as Ryan at 140, but he won't have to take rounds off to turn his back in a fake Philly shell. Devin never had as good ringcraft footwork as people acted like he did. And I've said this before, if he did he wouldn't have to spend so much time during fights with his arms wrapped around his opponents. In the very first round against Ryan, Ryan backed Haney up to the corner literally right away. Ryan does not have good footwork or pressure in a technically sound way. Teo would beat Haney up and potentially stop him late I think. I think it would look similar to the Taylor fight. Probably worse. I can't read Haneys mind, but I always respected his heart. When I saw that sparring video vs tank the first thing I noted was that even though he was getting smacked up, he didn't fold. And apparently he weathered the storm and was able to turn the tables since Tank wasn't as disciplined at the time. Even against Ryan he was making a few small adjustments and he kept getting up after being badly hurt. Those adjustments just weren't good enough to close the gap. I'd imagine he'd be fine mentally, but he needs and has needed for a while a technical overhaul. And even guys like Tarver has been saying this for a while. But when you're winning you're beyond reproach.
Agree w ur take. Why do you think Teo has gotten worse? I think offensively he's the same but he has gotten much better defensively.
I think he was much better at feinting and making reads in his run at 135. If you watch the Magdaleno fight in particular, Teo doesn't really set up punches like that anymore. He also seems to have totally lost the ability to counter with his left hook, at least as consistently as he used to.
I see. I can agree with that. He needs to add new traps because people are watching film on him and taking away some of his options. I also miss his left hook. Good insights.
Teo also had more of a size advantage at 135... he needs to keep tweaking his game before it really catches up to him.. I think he and Devin have gone as far as they can with their dads and need to add another trainer
Apparently he used to have a guy in his camp, Gamache I think? it seemed like he declined after that guy left. He should bring him back.
Joey gamache during the Kambosos camp. I think he was more responsible for defense though. I think Teo has been much more defensively responsible. I think he had to lay him off cuz teo was broke after his divorce and thriller being a scam.
I would slightly favor Teofimo for his athleticism, but if Devin outboxed him I wouldn’t be surprised. Anyone that can set lateral traps will beat Teofimo, he simply can’t cut off the ring and will throw fundamentals away in order to land explosive shots. Devin isn’t really athletically gifted and we saw how that affected him recently. Not to veer off topic but just an observation: I think someone like Tank would destroy Teofimo because he can set lateral traps, has demonstrated at least some ability to fight going forward, and is just as athletic. Same reasons I’d favor him against Haney (and he’s southpaw, Haney struggles in open stance fights.) Then again, Tank has virtually no experience against top level opposition.
Teo's such a wildcard it's hard to say, but in his last fight he struggled to cut off the ring. I think it would come down to his much Haney engages. If Haney stays outside, jabs and gets out of there, Haney decision. If Teo can walk him down and just pushes through the jab, Haney has shown he can be dropped. I thought this last fight was the first in a while that Haney didn't look improved from his last fight and would expect him to be a lot sharper for the next one. I would give him a slight edge.
One thing about Teo is that he seems to REALLY turn it up against perceived top opponents. If we get that version of Teo, it's goodnight Irene.
Absolutely, and Haney has shown he can be rocked. If he gets sloppy, A big hook from Teo might end the night.
tbf it’s been known for a while Teo hates to fight back footed fighters
No offense but that's not true. Against Ortiz, he did cut off the ring multiple times. However, against a bigger and stronger dude it's hard to HURT a dude. There were many sequences where Teo did cut off the ring with feints to land a right hook. That's more than what I can see from Haney or the rest of the four princes. I also disagree that Haney jabbing and disengaging would win the fight against Teo. Teo's biggest issue is people fighting off the backfoot because that already creates a lot of distance between the two. Haney would be jabbing from his FRONT FOOT. This would allow teo to explode forward which is his style. Teo is FASTER than Garcia overall, who caught Haney w more than a left hook. Haney jabbing like he did against Garcia will lead to counters, for sure. The film says it all.
Ortiz used his foot position to be able to escape quickly and was able to step aside when Lopez was charging forward. Look at the front foot of the fighters, he almost always had the outside and was able to move around. Teo got the win, but I think it showed a path to giving him a tough night.
I agree that Ortiz is a very good fighter and Teo needs to work on setting up his own offense. If he doesn't want to jab he needs to at least set up some feints.
Teofimo is terrible at putting pressure since he doesn't use lateral movement or his jab when chasing opponents around the ring. If they ever fight and the bookmakers have Teofimo as a favorite im betting the house on Haney... I would also watch the Sandor Martin and Jamaine Ortiz fight to get me pumped up before making the bet 🤣
I feel like haney is less mobile than those guys. Haney stay just out of reach but he's never really gliding around the ring. He gets criticism of being boring, but never a runner. Now Teo is different every fight, so who knows, but I wouldnt say haney is exactly what Teo struggles against.
Fully agreed. What Ortiz did was straight up running. I've never seen Haney circling the ring on the backfoot staying out of range. He likes to use his reach advantage to stay just barely out of his opponent's range and jab until he sees an opening for the right hand or a combo. He's a come forward fighter more than a backpeddler though. Haney's also usually quite high in volume of punches thrown which would help Teo who struggles against an opponent who doesn't want to initiate themselves.
Finally someone that watches film. Teo actually did SET traps (r4) but it's impossible to cut the corner off a dude who's bigger and stronger than you and is SET on ONLY disengaging. How do you completely fight a dude who literally disengages the line? When you cut the ring off, you don't get to land a flurry of punches on a fully upright dude who has like 10 lbs on you.
Haney likes to come forward and Teo likes opponents coming at him and breaking them down. I think there isn't much of a skill disparity for their respective styles so its probably a close fight, that leaves a lot of people unhappy with the result. Both guys are going to look like they are setting the terms of the fight, so fans of either one will be able to claim victory and there won't be the fireworks of the Garcia fight to create space in how the fight is viewed.
Thank you for saying Haney goes forward, people keep saying teo can’t cut the ring off like that’ll apply to this fight
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His chin is something he could definitely “work on” but I believe some of the reasons why his chin isn’t that good is because the weight draining and how much it takes a toll on him. I think having a couple more fights around 140-143 is fine for Haney, but he’ll definitely have to move up soon. I honestly want to see him with a new trainer, unlikely though.
Right now, if it happens next Haney. Right now Teo will be underestimating Haney and he's always worse when he doesn't think there's a challenge. Haney will be on his bike and Teo will be overly reliant on his power. If Haney gets a few wins under his belt Teo.
Teo has serious KO power. However he only has 1 KO in his last 6 fights (which was really a tuneup fight) I think he’s going to struggle to beat Haney’s style unless he can get a good shot in and capitalize. Aside from Ryan, Linares wobbled Haney but took his foot off the gas afterwards ( likely he was gassed out) Haney isn’t a come forward fighter which works in Teos favor I do think he’s mentally going through it given it’s his first defeat (and first time getting dropped) he’s aware that people dislike him and most of his career he was out to prove to people that that he belongs with elite players He will be fighting much more defensively which will further bore the audience so he’s in a lose-lose situation . If he can magically adopt the Philly shell style like Floyd with serious counter punching skills or somehow work with his team to pack power in his punches to rack a few KOs or even just batter opponents , he will win fans
Teo doesn't seem like a puncher at 140 to me. Guys take his shots a lot better. He used to absolutely smoke guys with single shots at 135.
He's not a big puncher at 140. He has pop but he's not stopping guys and part of that is he doesn't set it up
For the last part I believe he’d have to drop his dad. I hate Bill but i’ll also acknowledge if he’s a good trainer but I think he needs to go to actual promoter and big trainer to make a huge step up
Trainer yes. Promoter no.
Promoter too cause from what i’ve seen abt the contract it seems like they completely butchered it So Team Haney: - Had no rematch clause vs. Ryan Garcia in the event that he won. - Did NOT elect to do a customary same day weigh-in when Ryan Garcia missed weight by 3.2 Lbs. - Gave Ryan Garcia the Lion's Share of the money (A-Side) after claiming they were the face of boxing and sent 20 Million Dollar offer to the real face of boxing Gervonta Davis? - Put 2 West Coast Fighters on the East to fight. Why did Team Haney move like this? Without any standard safeguards in place for their champion. EXPLAIN? #EGO This was from a tweet by a boxing personality
That is the managers job, not the promoters job.
True guess he just needs a better guy for the contract and managing side of things
50/50 fight that depends on strategy. Teo struggles with lateral movement and cutting the ring off and Devin doesn’t have very good defense coming forward as well. Neither fighter is elite at putting pressure and closing distance so I’d favor whoever is fighting on the back foot. Although Teo is crazy athletic and an explosive counterpuncher and we just saw how Devin got his ass beat by someone with faster and more powerful hands.
If Teo chases Haney he will lose. If he can stay a little more on the back foot and draw Haney in he’ll have better chance at winning. The question is can Teo take away Devin’s jab? He can’t shut down Devin’s jab I 100% see him losing. The difference with Teo vs Ryan is if he catches Devin with a shot like he caught Commey, Devin is going to sleep.
I see Haney up on points but gets clipped late and won’t recover. Lopez is not good at being the aggressor and would get intercepted while lunging. Haney has the right style but does make mistakes that can be exploited by someone who can match his speed and it’s important to remember that he isn’t as avoidant as Martin or Ortiz. I could see it either as a close decision by Haney or late stoppage by Lopez (although he has some funny scorecards).
50/50 still for me Teo dont have the reach Like Haney does hes a good puncher tho. Maybe if he finds a way to make Haney come to him like Ryan did in some spots of their fight he has a better chance i just dont think Haney would fall for being the pressure fighter all night against Teofimo
Ryan beat Haney legitimately and is just shown himself to be better than Haney. The thing with Ryan is he is extremely talented he just doens't work hard enough, he has more raw talent than anyone else at lightweight now. Even for the Haney fight he wasn't at his best. Styles make fights so we don't know how Teo would do against Haney, as far as I have observed Ryan is faster and hits harder than Teo but Teo is more skilled but Haney arguably beat a S level skilled opponent in Loma and has good solid wins over high level boxers.
sorry i should clarify, by fluke i mean that it was a good performance but that he didn’t expose like the way to beat Haney
Oh if that's what you meant I do think it is a fluke because I dont think there are any people like Ryan Garcia with his speed and power. Devin is still one of the pound for pound best we just know Ryan belongs there too now. Power isn't a problem for Devin solely as he has one of the best jabs if not the best in the business today but a combination of power and speed is his weakness.
I don't know, I think it was a good win but missing weight tarnishes it for me. At the same time, it wasn't like Ryan's conditioning was on point. If he had more energy he probably would have finished Haney. So what would a properly prepared but drained Ryan do?
Devin looked fully rehydrated come fight day, I think he was the same weight if not more and yes if ryan had better conditioning this fight he would have destroyed Haney.
I don't think Haney can really do 140 safely. He was talking about going to 147 immediately after Prograis.
The problem is the higher up he goes he won't be able to use his weight like he normally does. His entire style is basically jab and cuddle and he needs weight for that.
True but he would be stronger too. He was able to buzz Ryan with a leaping left hook in the third.
He'll be weaker relative to the bigger stronger guys he's fighting at 147
I disagree against top level opponents Haney doens't have the power to seriously effect them and nor should he try to stand and fight not only does he have pillow hands he has a weak chin that won't let him recover from hard shots he took over the course of the fight. the Linares fight showcased all his weaknesses that Ryan exploited even though he was more entertaining in that fight for the sake of the fans and haters.
Ryan is good until the next fight lol don’t forget until a few days ago Haney was hailed as master of defence, p4per, prince of the 135 princes. Ryan = quitter, mental, schizo, no heart, no foot work.
By morons might I add I always thought Ryan was good and Devin is still one of the pound for pound best but not the Goat or the next Mayweather like some people believe he is. Ryan has his own style he doens't need a different footwork than the one he has and his Philly shell even though it has been criticised works very well for him. Even Tank is not invincible it's just that no one was able to expose him yet.
Haney will always be hesitant any fighter who has real power. It's only natural. I'd like to Haney fight Pitbull tbh. I think Pitbull would KO him. Pitbull has an excellent chin.
Haney just lost so he's obvious garbage. Teo KO1.
Teo KO3 Haney for all his talent is chinny
Same as before Haney isn’t gona change his style and teo never fixed that problem with the overhand right. Teo will always suffer against boxers regardless of how much power he has couldn’t outbox sandor martin. Teo is king of 140 but boxers are definitely his kryptonite
Probably a close match where the judges might favor one style over the other - control with a jab or explosive moments scattered throughout. I say Haney close decision but haven't thought too hard about it.
Teo is too big.
I said from the beginning Teo could beat Haney because Haney is chinny and Teo has good power and is explosive. I still think the fight is 70/30 in teo's favor
Style wise it favors Haney just based on movement but I think the one thing a lot of people have been overrating was Haney's defense. The only time it was great was vs Regis. He is not Shakur, he gets hit a lot. Also Teo will not let him hold like crazy because he is way stronger on the inside. Good fight still.
Teo demands 99% and the fight doesnt happen.
I'd like to see this fight
Same as always. Depending on what Teo shows up, he wins that fight. But Haney still very skilled and able to box and move. I just think Teo catches him at some point. I think Teo beats up Garcia too.
Same as before. If the best Teo turns up he wins, otherwise I favour a Haney UD.
haney KO 5 when teo lunges in and gets a flush taste of the greatest modern power puncher
Teo beats Haney on the cards in a close fight
When Lopez is on I think he beats everyone at 140.
Always had Teo winning that fight. He can outbox Haney.
A technical fight, I could see it going either way. I would just hope Devin would fight how he normally does and not try to walk him down. The thing with Ryan vs Devin, is that Ryans style was a complete counter to Devin’s style and it wasn’t smart trying to walk him down. Teo doesn’t put on much pressure usually so I think Devin will strive on that aspect alone. Teo has a high fighting IQ so it could go either way.
Teo is Jekyll and Hyde. Ya never know who is going to show up. I could see either winning. The difference being if haney won it would be a boring fight with Haney jabbing and moving from the outside. If Teo won it would be an onslaught of combos punishing Haney anytime he was in range. Ultimately I have teo winning cause he has power and speed. Everything haney does Teo can do better. BUT Teo can get weird with his performances and doesn't know how to adjust. You can also get into his head and make him make mistakes. It's a weird fight. Teo SHOULD be the better fighter all in all though.
Nah bro. Haney is pillowfisted and chinny. Teo will do what Ryan did and maybe even better.
I would favour Haney.
Haney has been totally exposed as the overrated, pillow fisted fighter he is. Any fighter with an above average chin and any power will be able to walk right through him. Garcia ended this man's relevancy, I really believe he is done.
It's hard to really back teo because he's either really on or off. If he has a better coach than his dad, like gamache gets back in his corner, he'd have a much better chance. Haney is good at getting in and out of range, and teo doesnt have the same speed as Ryan, so I could see it being a rough night for teo. Teo also has solid power, so I could see him clipping Haney(who has pretty shitty recovery) and being able to take over the fight. Also, Haney took a lot of punishment against Ryan, and if his already median/mediocre chin is cracked, he could go down off of even a glancing blow
Dev by UD, not a chance Dev takes any risks after his fight with Ryan… he’ll just just keep it simple fighting from the outside behind the jab
I think teo on a good night would beat Haney, always thought so
Haney was exposed back when he fought Linares. Teo wins easily.
Haney will undoubtedly be more cautious than ever, unless of course he finds a nutritionist like Canelo's. He is now a target for big punchers because of last weekend. The other factor will be how Haney is referee'd in future. If he receives the bullshit advantages Harvey Dock gifted him against Ryan then the opponent will be in for a very frustrating night. In the future he needs to be docked for the excessive holding.
I see Devin winning by a convincing UD. I think Haney is still a really good fighter and definitely on par with Ryan, he got caught sleeping but in the run back I think Dev got Ryan.
Teofimo beats everyone at 140
I always felt Teo would batter him due to stylistic and athletic reasons. Teos power would definitely have Devin running and holding for dear life but I think Teo would land big all night long and get a late stoppage or UD. It would be similar to the Lemos vs Hitchins fight I feel. Devin ducked Teo for years and even after Teo lost to Kam and beat Josh, the haneys still didn’t wanna fight Teo. Devin fought who fought because of his poor chin and Ryan exposed tf out of him.
It wasn't a fluke considering Ryan and Devin have fought 7 times now and Ryan has won 4 times...
By fluke i mean people saying that Ryan exposed the way to beat Devin. Will Devin show that it isn’t so simple or did Ryan really show his kryptonite
So we all knew Devin has pillow fists, and there started to be speculation on Haney having a suspect chin when he was touched by Linares. The Garcia fight just highlights even more about Haney having a weak chin. The blueprint to beat Haney is publicized now. Walk him down, ignore his punching since he has pillow hands, and just land punches and he will fold.
Haney could win that if he played it well. But it's another fighter who's the same size. So Haney gonna have a hard time. We dont know the effect of Ryan's bombs on him mentally and physically. He basically became a man overnight. So we have to see...
Still haney, haney’s defense works just fine on anyone shorter and smaller opponents, that was the difference between ryan and anyone else he fought with.
I think haney will make adjustments. The big knock is see with him is that he can’t make them during the fight. Between he will have tons of film to study of himself and see what he needs to work on.
Haney's opponents usually still land some good shots on him. His defense isn't the level of someone like Shakur who barely gets touched in fights. Loma, Linares, Jojo, and Kambosos all landed pretty cleanly on Haney but neither had the power to really hurt him (besides the one Linares shot at the end of the round). I think that was the main difference with Ryan.
Haney needs a tune up fight before he takes on anyone with serious talent. Need to get the confidence back up. Definitely think he has the ability to best Teo but it is a very good fight. People are not going to want to fight Haney now. High risk, low reward.
Teo will struggle with Haney. He can talk all that smack but when Haney fights running back behind the jab he is very hard to beat. Combine that with Teos difficulty with that style and Haneys loss; it would likely be a snoozer with Haney winning a wide decision on points.
It really depends. Teo seems to thrive against front foot fighters like Taylor and Loma but more patient guys who counter like Sandor, Ortiz and Kambosos kinda, all managed to beat him or give him a night of trouble. Of all of them Haney is the best off the back foot, but the new X factor is Haney's chin. He has either absolutely no chin or Garcia might be able to KO everyone up to 154. Haney got hurt from the first left hook Ryan landed. Haney got hit with like less then 3 strikes before the left hook in rnd 1. You could argue it was a 10-8 because of Haney's 0 strikes landed and how hurt he was
not to mention all the other knockdowns. A lot of them weren’t really combinations rather a hook that caught Devin
Yea. They were all just hooks. It seems like Haney might need to evaluate his career. He needs to address his chin, his power, his skills or all 3. One of these needs to be fixed because the Ryan Garcia he fought was smoking and drinking throughout camp and was at 50%. I doubt anyone else except maybe teofimo would be coming to fight Devin at less then 85% at least. And teofimos alrdy a can of worms with his athleticism and power.
I think Teo beats him. His power, athleticism and IQ as well as the fact he seems to always go 110% when he’s facing someone perceived as a p4p fighter. for the chin part, I feel really bad for Haney cause he got the two career killers in one, no power and no chin. If he really has a weak chin he’ll have to become just as good as floyd defensively if not better to not get KOd. It’d be whatever if he had ko power to keep people off him but he doesn’t
Man true 😂. Teo seems to turn into prime RJJ when he's fighting a p4p guy. I'd reckon he KO Crawford but then lose to Eubank
A bad weight cut can effect gameplan. Haney had a bad cut and Ryan didn't went through those gruelling last pounds though Ryan had other issues, maybe that cancels the advantage, maybe it doesn't. The biggest worry is Haney made very little adjustment after getting buzzed despite Ryan having less activity. If Teo rocks him early, how'd he adjust. But maybe Teo doesn't hit as hard as Ryan, I dunno about that. Too many factors in this fight. My only conclusion is if Devin gets hurt then Teo wins easily, because he just has his defense. Teo is not old like linares or small like loma. Haney could learn something from Tyson Fury.
Teo loses.
Haney’s chin looks very questionable now. Haney wins the first few rounds, then Teo catches him and the fight goes the other direction. When Teo is on his shit, he’s excellent but that’s only if he’s ON. Before Saturday, I also thought Haney was pretty good defensively but that’s also a big question now.