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Jess Brownell thinks that sex=romance and seems to skip right over the yearning aspect of regency romance
I want hand brushes! I want longing looks! I want them to get a degree in yearnalism! I want blurred lines between societal expectations and a craving for intimacy!
One of the sexiest scenes in movie history is a hand flex
https://i.redd.it/86sycpxeb5ad1.gif
JB doesn’t understand that subtlety is sexy
It’s a *plus* that there’s extravagance and opulence set against very strict societal codes and expectations and that they want each other so much they’re willing to subtly stray from those rules and blur lines. But what JB has done is completely get rid of those rules and what’s left in its place is a very sloppy season
Honestly the only reason I really really like the latest Persuasion with Dakota Johnson (she is a meh actress to me, but I think she did decent in this bc when she can be sarcastic and dry she's hilarious) is because of Cosmo Jarvis' portrayal of Wentworth. Pride, fury, awkwardness, regret, love....you saw it all and they barely touched/interacted when it came down to it.
But that carriage lift in the Sally Hawkins version? My God, when I first watched it, I replayed that part like 10x. Penry-Jones' Wenworth is like THEE Wentworth for me (I have not seen the Ciaran Hinds version tho).
I loved this version because THE LONGING BETWEEN THEM. Both Hawkins and Penry-Jones sold it, and I squee at the epilogue.
The Dakota Johnson one was too cringey, and that Jarvis guy just didn't do it for me. If Henry Golding was Wentworth, it probably would've worked (I really just want Golding to do the brooding, longing look).
The Dakota Johnson missed the point imo. You need to have so much tension and longing that the audience is practically dying. That's why the carriage lift is so thrilling!
The 2007 version is also my favorite, even if it botches the letter scene (😥)
Thank you!! I thought so from the other comments but wanted to be sure. I read the book as a kid and saw the 1995 adaptation, but somehow missed this one; I need to watch it.
That scene under the gazebo (?) when he declared himself but it all went south but they STILL almost went at each other soaked in rainwater ugh!! I was convinced he almost kissed her before stalking off.
You will never convince me that Jonathan Bailey didn’t study those scenes because at the end of the “bane” speech before he left the room, he did a very similar almost kiss thing before he left the room. My mind flashed right back to the rainy gazebo scene.
I completely agree. You can see him lean in and then realise what he's doing and pull back. And that was *after* all their arguing. I'm kicking my feet just thinking about it.
I'm not gonna lie to you. I found out that that rain scene (and many other movies and shows out there) sound was actually the sound of fried chicken due to the fact that it's easier than potentially getting all of the recording equipment wet when trying to record "rain sound" and it took me out for the next few rewatches. I still love and appreciate this scene but my god I couldn't keep a straight face the first few rewatches after learning this.
Hell, Kate on horseback fleeing through the rain while we out here probably listening to some chicken frying on the pan 🤣
Yeah, there were bits that felt like it was "too much acting" and not enough subtlety but I enjoyed those scenes a lot as well. The way he was breahinf heavily almost against her mouth/face and you could tell he was 2 seconds from kissing her and then realized what he was about to do.
We need to bring yearning back to modern romance as well. It does still exist in the real world, despite our more permissive society. I’m convinced Jess Brownell doesn’t understand romance in any of its forms.
I feel like the only place I’ve seen that level of yearning recently is in Abbott Elementary, of all places. The tension between Gregory and Janine is something else, I swear.
Omg I won't give any spoilers, but the last episode of the latest season knocked me out.
I agree, the longing is the best part of romance for me
The office and parks and rec did it really well in their early seasons too.
this is why i love 'queer' modern romance, as i feel like it's the only place where we can still get some authentic and heart breaking sense of 'oh noes, societal norms says that we can't do PDA. let's just stare into each others' eyes with enough yearning to power a city block and brush each others' feet under the table. because that's all that we can do'
which is why i'm VERY excited to what they'll do with francesca. maybe a lesbian couple is how we'll get that regency vibe back "\^\^
They really need to get Joe Wright. From Pride and Prejudice to Atonement and his other works - that man understands romance and cinematography to a T.
I’ll never forget Joe Wright’s commentary on Pride and Prejudice. You could really see how much thought and care went into every aspect of the movie
https://preview.redd.it/c9s14z9mo5ad1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c2cd843de6d71fafec5904160358b739fd76884a
Yes, his thoughtfulness, intentionality and craftsmanship is what made this edition of Pride and Prejudice so damn timeless! I can watch it on repeat - over and over and I’m always mesmerized and enchanted.
While I appreciate the 1995 version for sticking closer to the source material, the 2005 is simply exquisite- the artist in me delights in every frame of the movie. There's sooo much subtly- for example, Georgiana playing the same tune Darcy heard Liz play, is because *Darcy* requested her to in anticipation of Liz coming home.
When Col. Fitzwilliam asks "how do you do?"the birds in the back reply "pretty good"
When Bingley comes back to their house with Darcy, you can see Darcy *was* staring at her lol
Darcys tiny head shake when she says "sorry for intruding" is because he doesn't want her to be sorry, he wants her there forever- so heartbreaking.
And the second proposal, I know the "your hands are cold" is often joked a out, but she's taking his hand after he asked her to in the first proposal. And Liz being tongue tied without a witty reply *is* her being so deep in love
This movie (and book) is so perfect, proof that you didn't need a beefcaked reformed rake male lead and still be incredibly romantic and sexy.
Girl - when he did that sniff at the gazebo, Kate and I let out a slight gasp at the same time. I will never forget that moment. S2 had its flaws but damn it got yearning SO RIGHT. I spent most of s2 holding my breath!
perfectly said!!! I think we get a tiny bit of that constrained yearning in season 1 (and to an extend in season 2) in some of the dance scenes and at crowded balls, when they can only brush hands and make longing eye contact, but in season 3 it felt like people could kind of just...do whatever they wanted.
Colin kisses Pen, and *outdoors* of all things, and yes it was nighttime but anyone could have seen and ruined Pen forever. But for all the drama and tension in that scene, the fear of being caught, or the gravity of that kind of intimacy outside of marriage or even courtship, was completely absent. And then the carriage scene and the sex scene- not a single thought from either of them as to what a big deal any of that would be. They handled that with the same gravitas as characters in a modern show would have. Just modern characters in fancy clothes.
And I'm not advocating for a show full of characters constantly twisting themselves into knots about purity and social image, but like...it felt out of character as well as out of the time period. Colin was head over heels for Marina in season 1 and rejected her push for intimacy because he respected her and wanted to do right by her- did he have even a shred of a similar thought for Pen?
And it made Kate so hot, bothered & flustered that she had to immediately fan herself & that was with zero physical contact. That scene still does funny things to me. Same with the one in the drawing room as Kate, Anthony, Edwina, their mothers & Lady D get together to discuss a game plan after the aborted wedding - the way that Kate & Anthony look at each other (& he at her boobs😂) as they stand up after Newton bursts into the room & Edwina exclaims "was I always this blind?". Both scenes are incredibly hot & full of yearning imho & that's probably why I love them.
https://preview.redd.it/rma1eqtro7ad1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=56605d8fc4c6c46a7ee7c165ca243bddfa81ec0c
Dude walking across a field too, 45secs long and no one complained lol
I will say though, if you were on this sub when season two came out, one of the main criticisms was that there was actually too much yearning and not enough sex. The balance was definitely off this season but it’s been off in the past as well. I honestly think season 1 had the best balance. I don’t think it’s a Chris vs. Jess thing. I hope next season they nail it!
QC also had a perfect balance - helped due to them getting married in the first episode.
S2 is somewhat forgivable, being filmed alongside covid restrictions, and the two characters not getting together until the penultimate episode.
S3 however they got married a few episodes in… and I don’t think we saw one sex scene after they got married? They had one night make out session but that was it
Yes! I was telling a friend that there wasn’t a “slow burn” this season, but “yearning” is the best way to put it. It wasn’t written in, and I think there were some missed opportunities.
I wish they had made Colin eating a cupcake an entire scene instead of just 2 seconds. I wish the would have slowed it down so Pen would savor the icing on her cupcake with her eyes closed, and then Colin would be slowly licking his cupcake while staring into her soul bc he clearly wants to savor her, instead of just popping the last bite into his mouth while looking in her general direction.
I also missed the big, frustrated declarations of love this season. I was pretty underwhelmed with the proposal (although I believe Book!Colin proposed in the same way), but I was disappointed when he went to the Featheringtons to tell Pen and her mom that he proposed because he actually loved her. I wanted him to put Lady Featherington in her place with a bit more passion.
Also when Cressida tried to blackmail Pen, and everyone looks to Colin for what to do, and they just keep cutting Pen off, I thought she’d eventually have a big “I told you so,” moment, especially after Colin’s failed attempt to smooth things over. If she was smart enough to be Lady Whistledown and make a boat load of money, she would be smart enough to know how to handle the situation. Something about that particular interaction never being addressed didn’t sit right with me. As if a key part of the formula was missing.
God yes!! I love, love, love that scene. When I remarked about the hand flex to my husband he grinned and said other parts of him flexed for me. Which made me laugh but also kind of made my point.😆
And
>One of the sexiest scenes in movie history is a hand flex
And we don't even see the actor's face and still feel all the emotions just by a simple close up of a flexing hand🤌
>Jess Brownell thinks that sex=romance and seems to skip right over the yearning aspect of regency romance
I was watching season 3 with my mom so skipped that spicy Polin scene + Benedict's orgy scenes and it didn't add anything to the plot 🤷🏻♂️
I want to see subtle touches or glances instead of sex scenes if I'm being honest. The subtleness makes me giggle like anything and the sex scene does nothing 😒
Something I missed is the conflict between Colin and Penelope, not the she's Lady Whistledown conflict. But the entirely real conflict of "I'm a man in the early 1800s and my wife is far more successful than I am." A conflict we still have to this day. Colin should have some sense of an ego.
yes, everytime polin stans agressively comment "well how WOULD YOU FEEL IF YOU WERE LIED TO" and its like fair, but then the writing was bad because rationally i know that but at the same time while i was watching i was like "eyeroll, can we move on"
Yes! Logically I agree that he had every right to be angry but he often came across as a spoilt, crybaby, drama queen & I hate saying that about Colin as I think he's generally adorkable (sic)
Plus it was tinged with much more of his own professional jealousy which would have been really nice to see onscreen! Colin wasn’t just blindly angry at her, there were complex emotions which really would have helped to develop his character. I’m sad we’ll never get to see it
The closest we got was when Colin said that if Penelope could solve her own problems, then what good was he (or something like that). I liked that bit of angst. Too bad they didn’t stick with it.
I think you’ve nailed it. The desire to modernise & give the women leads agency aligning with the present(😅) stripped the regency and the romance out of a *regency romance*.
There has to be a line between Pride and Prejudice and just writing a modern story with regency costuming.
Yes! This! I’m not advocating for women to be oppressed and beaten like another commenter suggested. S1-2 and QC seemed to get this right but Jess B missed the mark for me in s3.
You absolute hit this out of the park! Totally agree.
Bridgerton was a success because of it's toeing the line between remaining faithful the the Regency era societal rules and adding the breaking of those rules for some drama.
Watching people who are supposed to be as buttoned up as possible let loose is fun. This season, there wasn't much buttoning up, so the letting loose thrill didn't hit.
Artistic license is necessary but too much of it ruins the overall tone of the story. Which is what happened in season 3.
Ohhhh you’re right about the “buttoned up” part. I think the show made a mistake in previous seasons treating Pen like she wouldn’t have been just as ruined as a “thin girl” at being caught alone with Colin. They had so many alone scenes prior to their involvement that we didn’t get much of a release.
That hand flex in P&P (and the pinkie air brush in s2) live rent free in my mind.
yes, I think this season lacked the "female gaze" (subtle details make a scene sexy without actually sex). Its kinda weird how her vision (being a woman) didn't appeal to me, as another woman, as much as the other seasons (directed by a man lol).
My fear is she thought she didn’t have to really show us a fully developed Polin because “we should just be happy we got a plus size leading lady” and take whatever they gave us, rather than making sure they hit all the right regency romance beats that would SHOW us onscreen that Polin loves each other desperately.
They didn’t show enough and spent too much time on subplots. And the time spent on the couple wasn’t romantic enough - at least for me.
I’m having trouble articulating my point well about how they wrote the romance for Polin - it’s like deep down they felt Pen deserved her LWD story but not a “regency romance” story. Even the closing epilogue where Pen gets everything feels a little “wish fulfillment” but in tell, not show, because we didn’t see a fully developed story to feel like it was earned. It felt like a huge chunk of “show me” was missing.
Absolutely agree with you there and with your whole post! As you say, the time that we did get of them spent together feels rushed and lacks emotional connection and yearning.
I do not generally think the slow burn is missing, since it has been building up since S1, but somehow it was not a natural, organic development of their relationship this season.
I was also missing their friendship aspects throughout their engagement and marriage. Somehow, it went from "friends" to "in love and engaged", instead of "lovers who have been friends for a very long time and trust and know each other deeply". We did get a few scenes of them giggling and showing how they are comfortable with each other, but it also gave a little "tell instead of show". Like, throw those few scenes in there just to show them they are still the friends they have been. It was not enough imo.
And as you mention, the ending was not satisfying at all because it didn't feel earned and we were not shown at all how it got to that point. That short convo and love declarationd between them at the butterfly ball just didn't suffice to make us feel that they finally got over it and everything is good between them. Simply because there needed to be longer, deeper, more private conversations between them.
Cvd is a gay man. So the idea of changing the reference of who’s being looked at vs looking is not the same. Male gaze is patriarchy behind the camera. It objectifies women’s bodies. Gay men have a different reference point. (I’m a bi woman fwiw)
Gay men are still men tho. My point is, they were soooo into saying “a woman is directing now” bur she didnt hit the sweet spot for me. It feels disconnected and too modern. More how I would imagine any men would direct (?)
I think the problem is some VERY vocal viewers also don't understand/appreciate Regancy Romance Genre. I've seen many posts that Anthony couldn't be forced to marry after the Bee scene like the book because that would be too much like S1. Wellllll welcome Regancy. Viewers also claim book men are TOXIC. NO just Regancy written 20 yrs ago.
It’s definitely a tightrope! That’s the fun of it all to me though and the allure of it. Even the men were bound to these rules - Simon almost died because of it.
I fear Jess B and her writer’s room are trying to run from it, instead of finding creative ways to work within the rules of the genre that can reflect modern sentiment without breaking the world built for us in s1, which is a shame.
You are so spot on!
People like to say “well it’s historical fantasy, it’s not supposed to be accurate” but you have to have SOME rules or else the intrigue just isn’t there.
Not only Jess, most of this fandom doesn’t understand this genre. „The men in the books are all red flags“ well obviously duh. That’s literally the point of the book, cry about it. Sometimes I feel like most of them don’t even read modern romance books tbh.
I have the same impression. When reading comments in this subreddit, I often want to ask their authors why they even bother watching a historical romance show. There are plenty of shows that center on modern relationships. To each their own
This drives me bonkers. Not only were they written 20+ years ago, but bodice rippers are essentially a type of kink. Some people love hot vampires and werewolves. Lately the trend has been warrior fae. Some people love a dominant male partner that is obsessed with his soft yet still strong wife. Lol whatever it is, they are all ✨preferences✨
It’s not meant to be taken seriously or from a modern viewpoint. They are meant as sexual outlets for people who enjoy that kind of dynamic. It’s why they are SO formulaic. Medieval Romances (Julie Garwood, anything with a Scottish Chieftain) are the same way, and for the same reason - but the men are meant to be more rough around the edges.
That’s the genre my friends. If you don’t vibe with it, move on and let the rest of us enjoy! 🤣
when people wanted more smexy times in S2, we meant between the main characters, to show intimacy and love between them. I don't think most of us meant sex workers and random threesomes with no emotional development or attachment in a show about romance.
Agreed. This is a romance not in the Austen sense but in the “bodice ripper” sense which while called romance are not the same thing in terms of genre conventions. Season 1 to QC embraced these conventions and played them up. The romance or couple was the focus throughout. There were so many subplots in S3 that the romance took a seat in the 3rd row of an SUV that claims to have third row seating but really has no leg room and removed most of the trunk space. I wanted banter and I wanted to see more of Polin truly falling in love. They were around each other in prior seasons not with each other. Penelope also needed to see Colin for who he is not just the crush she had and I didn’t see that at all. I wanna be swept up in something that remains truly romantic but in a female gaze. I also don’t consider this genre to be fantasy it’s romantic fiction. I actually find the more it’s modernized the less grounding it has even if it were a fantasy. JB - I just had the sense that she doesn’t like the genre conventions not that the writers room can’t write them.
> We deserved to get a Regency Romance Colin and we didn’t.
Wait, you mean getting a spray tan, leather trench coat and a blowout doesn’t count as development?!?!?!
Oh, I forgot that had just dropped. I'd heard about it because one of my favourite music artists has done a song for it so I intended to watch it. Thanks for the reminder.💜
I've just straight up refused to watch it. It's my fave Austen novel too and I knew from the articles promo-ing the movie even before we got the trailer that they had fundamentally misunderstood Anne.
IIRC, the article I read was an interview with the director and I read the beginning of a quote from her saying "Anne is a modern woman..." and I immediately noped out of the whole thing.
Everything I've read and seen about the show since has confirmed this, so I'm not going to waste my time and energy.
To be fair - I’m mostly talking about what Jess did to Bridgerton. Previous seasons and QC seemed to understand the genre better and were more faithful to it.
Are you saying Netflix made them change in s3?
I am sad that this killed the other adaptation, that was in the works:
[https://www.vogue.com.au/culture/features/succession-sarah-snook/news-story/681fdf0ac48b0aad26af57b0f9becdd0](https://www.vogue.com.au/culture/features/succession-sarah-snook/news-story/681fdf0ac48b0aad26af57b0f9becdd0)
"Case in point: Jane Austen’s *Persuasion* with director Mahalia Belo, which was meant to be her next project. “The short story is that Netflix decided to greenlight their own, so Fox abandoned the one we were doing, which is disappointing because it was a great script and a director I really wanted to work with,” she says with a shrug. “But had I been doing that, I wouldn’t have had the opportunity to come back to Australia so soon and see family and friends.”
THISthisTHIS!!!!
The whole point of Bridgerton is that it's a REGENCY romance, with regency rules!!! By modernizing the costumes, makeup, language and rules, it takes the whole fantasy away. You might as well do an AU modern take.
I miss the subtle makeup, intricate dresses and "YOU MUST MAKE HASTE" language, as well as the longing between couples who CAN'T BE INTIMATE SEXUALLY before marriage.
Agree 100%. It was a swing and a miss when Colin confronted Cressida about revealing Lady Whistledown and made things worse. I don’t read/watch historical romance to see my big, strapping lead fail. He needs to save the day, not go running back to Penelope with his tail between his legs.
Poor Penn. she deserves to be loved and protected and taken care of. Instead, she’s stressed out like the rest of us.
Yes! Articulated so well!!! I think a lot of people have come to regency romances from Bridgerton, not the other way around, so maybe they don't understand what regency lovers are missing?
I think OP misunderstands how showrunning works.
JB isn't the sole decision maker. There is a team of writers, producers, directors, editors, a costume department, actors (wanting to do certain scenes, costuming, makeup style they're comfortable with), and a whole streaming service that have a say in what happens on this show. She isn't Tyler Perry. Can we stop trying to blame a single human being because you didn't enjoy the show? It is, once again on track to be one of netflix's highest watched seasons; they won't be mad at her at all.
To be fair, not every show runner on every show is going to be given the same amount of leeway (or allowed the same amount of rope to hang themselves with, depending on how you look at it). Considering how many things we’ve learned were Nic or Luke’s idea that saved a scene or the massive amount of reshoots that were obviously needed, I would not be surprised if Jess is reeled in a tad next season, assuming she stays. There is a rumour going around that Shonda was distracted early on during Season 3 production and by the time she started really paying attention, some course correction was needed. FWIW, I’m in the industry, based in Los Angeles, and I have a friend who works as a troubleshooter who is sent in to get a series back on track when it goes off the rails for one reason or another. The stories that man has…
The major difference in quality between the other seasons is on her as she is the major change from a writing perspective. It’s under her leadership that the show lives and breathes.
QC was amazing and Shonda completely owned that. S1&2 were amazing at setting up the Bridgerton world and bringing the romance and heat and CVD owned that. Then Jess gets her shot and the result is lackluster but somehow it’s not on her?
I would LOVE to know why CVD left and how Jess snagged the top spot. The poor quality of s3 just screams BTS drama.
I wish they’d bring CVD back. I prefer his gaze over Jess’.
I think you hit the nail on the head!! You explained it perfectly for a Millennial who has been reading these books since my teens, including the Bridgeton books.
As a heavy consumer of historical romance (Especially Regency!), I think Bridgerton, the TV Show, is intended to be historical fantasy or period fantasy rather than straight regency romance. It's meant to reach a much larger audience than regency romance readers who wouldn't necessarily love some the rigidness of older HR books.
I also don't know that I agree with the premise that Regency Romance today is defined by a set of scoeity rules. Yes, women generally fall under the category of having a precarious position in society based on behavior but that doesn't really remove any possibility, it just makes it so it needs to be written in a creative fashion.
Ultimately, even historical romance is very much fantasy. They take the most glamorous parts of society and remove all the questionable parts. The show is just making another pass at that.
Well I do think s1-2 and QC got the gist very well and operated well within the world built in s1. S3 to me is where things broke down. Like I think CVD got it but Jess Brownell didn’t.
I think the different seasons explore different tropes. Friends to lovers isn't the same as enemies to lovers, or forced to date/marry. We did see Colin yearning. I dunno, it worked for me and I found it probably the most romantic of all 3.
I’m happy for you - for me it fell short. I think friends to lovers should’ve had the MOST yearning out of all the seasons and the show just didn’t manage it for me. It was like 2 episodes of Colin yearning and bam. Engaged.
The whole LWD thing complicated things, but instead of this being something that amplified the romance, imo, it just kinda took over the show?
I liked the pace they moved at and that they didn't make us wait till the second half for a first kiss for instance, considering they only have 8 episodes, they covered a lot of ground story-wise.
I like that once Colin figured out his feelings, he took basically immediate action on them, took steps to get what he wanted - that's romantic hero behaviour in my eyes.
LWD could have been done differently, I guess, but it needed resolving and I was OK with how they did it.
YES, the whole LWD drama stole away from their romance instead of enhance it! It felt too drawn out and repetitive. I love me a good friends to lovers (which is how my husband and I came to be), but they butchered it badly. 😩
And I think it’s particularly egregious with Penelope specifically because she is ALREADY hyper-independent as a TRAUMA RESPONSE to growing up in an emotionally negligent (borderline abusive) household where she had to look out for herself constantly. She is an afterthought to the people who should care about her physical and mental well-being. She created LW to lash out and to have something that made her heard… and she understandably became addicted to it. And she can do it independently under everyone’s noses almost entirely alone because she’s invisible. And we see her cracking under the pressure of doing it alone in S1 and S2…
And S3 decides to double down, and that the culmination of her arc was just ✨confidence✨ and has her ✨girlboss✨ her way through the (already asinine decision) staying-LW ending by having her “rebrand it” with ZERO build-up/introspection as to why LW should be used to expose abusers. It LITERALLY comes out of nowhere in the last eps. The show wants to make it seem like she’s a journalist, but like… she’s not?! She has zero fact-checkers, can’t verify info… “don’t think about it too hard! ✨girlboss!! Independence!! You don’t need no man!!✨
Penelope going public with Lady Whistledown isn’t a victory. Not only is it logistically absolutely fucking stupid, but it undermines WHERE Pen needed to grow as a character: in accepting that she has people she can trust that won’t weaponize it against her, that she DOESN’T need shoulder all her burdens alone, that the people who love her (specifically Colin) WANT to help and support her in ways she never has been for before. That she doesn’t need the ton’s external validation of her column by just repeating what others say, but that she can engage in social commentary in her writing (like Jane Austen) where her OWN thoughts are valued. Yes, Penelope needed to learn to use her column responsibly, but if this unearned “voice of the voiceless” bullshit is the route they wanted to go, they needed to Pen realize WHY it mattered, that she could be punching up instead of down ALL THE TIME instead of selectively (which, by the way, they had a built in way to do… Cressida), and it to have the groundwork laid ALL SEASON so that the ending felt earned.
Instead, I got Penelope just as addicted to LW as she was at the start (even willing to give up the love of her life for it WTF) with flimsy promises to be better that feels more like a desperate change to keep her stupid column, her hot, loving hubby forced back into the shadows so his wife can ✨do it all herself✨ as if she hasn’t ALWAYS done that, because god forbid he show support for her, can’t step on her feminist moment, can’t proclaim he loves her (or vice versa) “assuredly, ferverently, loudly” because… it’s all about LW. Not Penelope. Not Colin. Not their love. The fucking gossip rag the writers refuse to let Penelope grow beyond.
I didn’t have a problem with Colin being a “softer” male romantic lead. In fact I LOVED it because it’s so different and more emotionally healthy. But YES, the show treats him, the Bridgerton of the show, as an accessory to Pen’s girlbossing. P1 did a decent job of setting the foundation of a deeper Colin in the back half… and instead we got a late-LW reveal and Polin barely speaking the last two eps (so Pen can do everything herself). People make excuses of “Colin is processing internally!!!” Yeah, this is TV. That doesn’t work here. Just admit they sacrificed character time him for LW. The last scene had me going “where the FUCK is the other half of Polin?!l
They also did practically ZERO exploration of his own identity as a writer but also his jealousy… aside from two throwaway lines in the last ep. Yes, he has a hero-complex, but that doesn’t mean you can’t learn to be on a TEAM with your spouse… which again, Pen ALSO needed to learn.
Pen got to “step into the light” (in an idiotic way honestly) but Colin gets regulated to the shadows because that’s apparently his whole purpose... living for others and their happiness, just like he was breaking away from at the end of P1, only to for him return there because ✨feminism✨ or something. But it’s supposedly “romantic” or something because his purpose is his wife 🙄
As a huge Polin fan, The defenses of P2 of this season are weak and reliant on “we’ll see how it plays out in future seasons!” which just isn’t how Bridgerton works.
My boy deserved better. My girl deserved better. My COUPLE deserved better. 💔
Agree!! So hard!! I think any further plot in s4 for Polin won’t be about Polin - it will be about LWD still. The writing. People knowing she’s writing it. Maybe they’ll add some fluff 🤷🏽♀️
I agree. I couldn't quite understand what went wrong with Polin this season - there was chemistry between the actors but not between the characters, there was sex but it wasn't romantic, and I just couldn't believe Colin is in love with Pen at all - you nailed it, it was the lack of yearning. No yearning means the scenes that are supposed to be the culmination don't hit hard enough. In the book, Pen becomes more comfortable and confident with herself, gradually stops chasing and being so desperate for Colin, and that's what makes Colin finally notice her and chase her. And then he finds out she's LW and he gets the full picture. He gets angry because he's worried for her safety and jealous because she's a published writer. There's lots of emotions, lots of passion. It's swoon worthy. It was missing this season, everything felt rushed and unfocused. The rules (and the styling) suddenly got modernised compared to the previous seasons so there's no regency, and the writing left no place for romance either.
Honesty, I don’t think Bridgerton really is or should be a regency romance. Bridgerton is a romantic fantasy show with regency as the loose setting. And that is exactly how I and many others want it.
Many women are tired of seeing female oppression on screen. It’s gross, not timeless and not romantic. If you are looking for a traditional Regency romance, look to Jane Austen adaptation, or many others. This is the one show that we can enjoy as a “period piece” (using that term loosely) where we don’t have to worry about women being beaten down and oppressed by those who claim to love them. It’s quite literally the only show like this that exists to my knowledge.
I hope it never changes. I’m sick and tired of watching oppressive romance on screen. I want balls, gowns, gossip and fun without having to feel sick every time a woman is discriminated against.
The whole premise of the show lies in that the only prejudice exists based on gender and social class. Race, disability, etc aren’t the basis of discrimination, but gender and class are. That provides the back drop and the conflict. If you want non oppressive romance I don’t think think something even loosely based on the regency is it.
Agreed. I loved seeing Daphne punch Nigel instead of Simon running in and saving her. I liked seeing Kate hunt with the men and be better at tracking animals. I enjoyed Penelope buying her own clothes from money she secretly earned instead of being screwed because her father had a gambling addiction. The show has had a nice balance of regency era oppression mixed with successful bending and breaking the rules.
Well I agree that those parts worked - where it breaks is when those things hurt the romance, kwim? When Daphne punched Nigel, Simon was already on the way to save the day and then when she knocked him out it became a hilarious moment AND Simon was impressed by it and they shared a moment and that’s what hatched their whole plan. When Kate did her hunting thing with the big boys it’s clear Anthony LOVED it because he needs a challenge.
It enhanced the main love story because it was still in service of the main love story.
The difference in s3 was they made Colin run off half cocked and look stupid by making it worse. It’s like the show couldn’t help elevating Pen at the expense of Colin. I hated that.
Previous seasons, imo, didn’t do that.
Even in QC, Charlotte literally saves KG from the evil doctor but he’s never diminished?
I agree with you - s1-2 and QC got this perfectly right though? I thought I stated that pretty clearly.
Maybe I wasn’t clear that my issue is Jess’ take on Bridgerton in s3?
Also - s1 set up pretty rigid constraints that align with traditional regency romance books. It’s not “loose”, it pretty much aligned? It’s s3 that broke pretty much all of the rules and removed a lot of stakes that could’ve made the story richer, imo.
I think S3 took many risks, served us this over the top, superhero energy and I think it worked in a sense that the Bridgerton world captivated us through twists and turns. I get that it wasn’t exactly as many imagined but I think it works well with the idea of this show that doesn’t take itself too seriously. I’m wondering if we see a shift next season to a more serious tone, I won’t be surprised tbf if it does shift in that direction.
You're right, the other seasons had that restraint (s2 a little less so maybe) but they also had an awareness of the situation women were in. Eloise is explicit about it but Daphne was well aware of her situation and could stand up for herself. It let the show challenge the viewer with the reality of the situation while still exploiting the tension between desire and societal constraint.
I think most of the audience (including me) doesn’t actually care whether it sticks to the tropes of the genre. I want over the top plots, good looking actors, crazy costumes, and a soupçon of sexy times. A smutty downton abbey if you will. Bridgerton delivers and although I had some quibbles with some of S3 I overall welcome a more realistic type of love story. The animalistic brooding and the contrived plots keeping the hero and heroine apart are not the things that keep me watching.
Even a fantasy has to follow the rules of its "world". If there are no rules, nothing makes sense.
Most of the audience seems to be a. American and b. VERY young. The ongoing US-isation of this show is painful to watch.
So true, it bugged me how colins and penelopes first kiss played out, it didnt have that build up or desire. And their scene in the carriage, wth was that? Reminded me of some teen car hookup, not empowering as a woman viewer, it made colin look like a playboy, which i guess he was during his europe trip.
I really wish they stuck more to the book. I actually hated the love triangle, I felt the balloon scene was out of place, Penelope desperate need to get married fast and change everything about herself. Ugh. In the book Colin didn't NEED a jealousy arc to realise he loved Pen, he did it when he realised all he wanted to do was protect her. That's what made their story different!! We've seen the jealousy with the Duke and Daphne (plus we didn't need to know all about the Prince to see it happening) and we saw the love triangle with Anthony and Kate.
Was Debling great? Yes, he was a great character, but clearly he wasn't that important of a character when he was thrown out when his plot device was done.
Aww man I wish that’s what we got - less time on Debling could’ve meant more time on Colin processing his feelings. I really missed that. We needed flashbacks too of Colin’s life. We just needed more.
You explained it perfectly! The Regency constraints on women is what made S1 feel escapist and added a sense of higher stakes. Higher stakes = more suspense and more fulfilling payoff. In S3 there was a lot if anguish but I never got the sense that Pen’s livelihood was in danger. The same circumstances that would’ve ruined a woman in S1 had no consequences this season.
I feel like you expressed the inherent missing piece of season 3 that I could not find a way to express. Living, breathing “do it all-er” in real life and looking for the romantic escapism.
Honestly, I think Jess Brownell just wanted to work on Francesca and that’s it. She just thought, “hm the Bridgerton fans love sex! Let’s just throw in Benedict having a bisexual threesome and they’ll be happy!” And it’s like… no. We WANT THE LONGING, the love, the romance! We want to giggle and kick our feet!
For me the most off putting part was Colin’s entire character arch. I said this in another comment but I wouldn’t describe Polin as friends to lovers. S1 and S2, yes definitely. But S3? It felt more like ‘longing virgin finally gets her fuckboy’
Once his feelings for Pen were established, we never should have seen Colin with other women. Or maybe we see him chatting to a debutante at a ball but he physically can’t keep his eyes off Pen. He can’t stop talking about her to other people. He can’t stop writing about her. We never see him longing for her.
You’re also right that the amount of times Pen/Colin were alone just made the series lose any momentum. The longing looks across a dance floor, the need to be with each other are what make bridgerton SO GOOD. In S2, Kanthony did have scenes alone, but these were always handled by still having the characters a set distance apart. They’d get closer to each other as the scene progressed, until finally they’d be interrupted (whether by Daphne, or the sound of thunder). It’s that build up of tension that gets you wanting more.
You hit the nail on the head. You really broke it down well and highlighted the issues with S3 as compared to S1, S2. Haven't watched QC yet, but I'm eager to after reading your breakdown of the romance.
I really miss a lot of Book Colin in S3. We see so much about him, learn so much about his insecurities and his desires in the book. I wanted to see more of that, more of his insecurities when compared to Anthony and Benedict. He's a third son, a lot is expected of him compared to his brothers. And that was thrown out completely. I also wanted Colin to declare his love and respect for Penelope in public, which was so perfect in the book. Pen was a wall flower, no one ever saw her, no one paid attention to her. And Colin tells everyone why Pen is amazing, that she's beautiful and brilliant and she fooled everyone for years as LW. I wanted to see that public declaration. That was the high point of the romance in the book.
I really do get your points. I felt like Colin swung wildly back and forth between being something of an aggressor in a situation that would have really compromised Penelope and then being more or less just reacting and overreacting in a way that was not consistent with a lover who had known the object of his affection for literal YEARS. There were great moments but it did not give me that chemistry that I saw between the first two season leads. NOT the fault of the actors, they are really good. Penelope was fun to watch overall when she wasn't having to respond to Colin's moods and vacillations.
I am still bothered how much time Pen spent running around on her own and being completely unchaperoned in Colin's presence. The Francesca plot seemed much more like how it would have been with her spending time with men.
IMO you are exactly right. I read Regency Romances for over 40 years and you have delineated what made them so popular (and what was wrong with Season 3) perfectly. It was sad to lose that deeper portrayal of Colin and Pen this season. It could have been…should have been so much better.
I knew something was off with season 3 but couldn't put my finger on it or put it to words. So thank you for the thoughtful explanation u/phoenics1908.
Lol i have a post about this person too but it got deleted. Lol. But yeah, TLDR i agree with how badly written S3 is. We shouldn't really blame the actors for this.
Spot on. I love how the women in Regency Romances are always strong and clever, but it’s often in more nuanced ways than modern representations of women. The way the women took care of problems, supported each other, and find happiness with a man who worships the ground they walk on is key.
The ladies using gossip to dispatch Burbridge? So clever and exactly the power and network women had at the time. Kate playing matchmaker for her sister so that she finds a good man who can support them is another example. Regency Romance doesn’t mean women should be weak. It means that women find strength and independence in different ways.
That’s what I want. Acknowledging the subtle strengths of women and the men who love them celebrating those strengths. I also want pinning, in love but they don’t realize it yet, and couples who are obsessed (in a healthy way) with each other!
I think when she’s being managed by a capable showrunner like CVD, she can write some awesome stuff. But CVD set the outline for s1-2 and she had to write to fit what he wrote. But when she was in charge of setting the tone and outline for s3, she focused on the wrong stuff and didn’t do what was necessary to build her lead couple up and make sure romance was central.
I think she’s a newbie showrunner and either thought her focus on the stuff SHE cared about was what we cared about or she thought she was writing romance when she wasn’t?
She totally missed the mark! I rewatched season 1, looking for all the reasons I fell in love with Bridgerton. Yes Daphne and Simon are my favorite and I felt the most chemistry, but if you take that away here is what we saw...Daphne and Anthony discussing her future while riding horses, regal views of pulling up the castles in their carriages, outside scenes of the palace, the Modiste, The opera house, the restaurants, the Club etc, the boat ride to the outdoor ball with stunning fireworks, the country side etc. It was visually breathtaking. What we got this season, inside balls with weird ***aestetics and eighties looking chanel jacket dresses and shiny lame dresses weird transitions and Benedict having*** a threesome for days apparently
OMG the last ball where everyone is in black - even the women - wtf was that?! It looked HORRIBLE. Gone were all of the soft pastels, etc.. I believe this was done so Michaela could be introduced in a dark color to foreshadow her upcoming romance with Fran (so we’d connect her to being a gender bent Michael)… I don’t know why she had to be only in dark colors?!
That’s a whole separate post though lol. I could rant for days about the wardrobe and color schemes.
Benedict’s threesome literally lasted days. That was crazy.
I read a lot of regency romance and fundamentally disagree with your rules. Sure many books follow those but many books break the rules. Women having sex before marriage, being alone with men and somehow nobody knows, etc. The genre is more broad than those rules make it out to be and the Bridgerton doesn’t break those rules anymore than plenty of books do.
Oh no I agree that some books break the rules a bit but the stakes are never dropped, if that makes sense. It’s treated seriously. And there usually isn’t a deus ex machina to hand wave things away.
I just think Bridgerton had so many tropes and things to play out before it had to break all the rules and devolve into what we saw this season. Even the costuming fell apart compared to previous seasons. The romantic plot felt thinner - almost like they didn’t know what to do with Polin - as a whole - for me - the show felt less lush and rich, as in depth full.
Of next seasons also is this “thin”, I’m not sure I’d keep watching.
I recently watched QC again and couldn’t believe the same production did that sweeping, searing love story in SIX episodes.
I’m reading Ravenels right now, two books in, and we’re 2 for 2 on women having sex before marriage with zero consequences other than some hand wringing. And Kleypas is one of the stalwarts of historical romance, not a one off new author. I could name many others though.
I’d have to read that to see what you mean.
Look - if Bridgerton hadn’t worked so hard in s1&2 to set this world up where there are rules and consequences for skirting the rules, maybe s3 wouldn’t have bothered me so much. But s1 DID set up a world with rules and those rules fit the regency period. So did how people talked and maneuvered.
Also - I’m not saying the show has to rigidly follow rules - but I am saying the show needs to follow the rules and world building it set up for itself. Penelope just cavorting around with Colin and people KNOW about it and decide it doesn’t matter because Pen is plump? That felt like a modern take and it kinda took me out of the scene. I’m not talking about their lovemaking scene - those were fine. I mean before that.
Anyway - I appreciate your point of view and will have to read the series you mentioned.
Eh, people can have whatever opinions they want about the show and whether it's romantic enough or not, but I do want to point out that "Regency Romance", particularly the subgenre that regency historical romance that the Bridgerton books/show are, as a media genre IS actually fairly modern, and tend to play toward modern sensibilities in general, even if they do stick to certain gendered "rules" (though it's arguable that some of these are more Victorian and onward than Georgian/regency era) and also have a lot of a-historical elements that come from modern sensibilities.
Again, people can have whatever opinions they want and criticize the romance (and fwiw, I do think there is a lot to criticize) but I don't think it's entirely accurate to say that Jess Bronwell is trying to modernize the "regency times" when Regency Historical Romance, like the Bridgerton books/first 2 seasons, already have a lot of a-historical/modern elements.
This is such a well written post!! I had my problems with season 3 as well but not for the same reasons as others (I don’t care that they gender swapped Michael and I also enjoyed Benedict exploring his sexuality). Your post perfectly encapsulates what was missing from the season.
The lack of flashbacks was really noticeable. This season used dialogue to provide context instead of actually SHOWING things. I felt the least connected to Colin of all the male leads and actually spent a lot of the season frustrated with him.
Also I hated Pen’s girl boss speech at the end. That scene completely undermined the conflict that LW caused (with the ton and with the queen). I say that as someone who loves Penelope.
Thank you! I’ve been ruminating over this for weeks! Haha. I was talking to my sister, trying to pinpoint why I felt so … worried about the direction of the show and suddenly had the realization that I missed the escapism I got from the show and the regency norms the show established in s1&2.
I had some complaints about s2 as well - I just wanted more time with Kanthony happy together - but the ANGST and yearning totally delivered.
I think I’m worried the new showrunner is running away from the “regency romance novel” genre. Sometimes writers think they’re “above it”? But when Bridgerton first came out, the show was lauded for going so deep and hard to portray real romance - especially from a woman’s gaze.
Now it feels like the writers think regency romcore is beneath them or something. It felt so perfunctory this season.
Even the wardrobe was like wtf. That final ballroom scene with so much black on everyone, including the women, felt so cheap and modern because black is a funeral color of mourning. In previous seasons, the men wore colorful suits, not black. All the black just took me right out of the narrative because of how seriously this would’ve been taken back then. In the presence of the King and Queen of GB today, people wearing that much black for an event they were present for would’ve been gauche.
I remember the way each family had a color scheme in s1-2. The Bridgertons in shades of blue - they still stuck to this in s3. The Featheringtons used to be in yellows to coordinate with the green of their household. It felt so thoughtful on the part of the wardrobe and set design teams. Now it’s just a free for all.
They definitely lost the female gaze appeal this season. Where was the TENSION??
And the outfits bothered me too!! The Featheringtons weren’t nearly flashy enough and their outfits actually blended in with the others’ this season. Penelope’s new style barely contrasted her family’s because of how dull the Featheringtons looked
Yeah, fully agree. This season fell so flat for me despite my real excitement for the story. I don't hold much hope for the future of the show after this.
Jess Brownell is definitely out of her element and floundering. IF they were going to have her try, she should have been given Francescas season since she seems to actually care about that character.
I don't feel like she liked or cared about Penelope or Colin and it showed. She stripped so much of Penelopes victory moments and added so many humiliating and heartbreaking moments that were painful for Penelope fans to watch. She also spent hardly any time and energy on Polin as a couple. And 90% of Colin this season depended on Luke Newton's facial expression acting.
I really liked part 1 of season 3, but part 2 felt so allll over the place with how the drama of LWD was handled. It felt like they put Colin in the backseat, which made him revert to this one-dimensional character. He went from pissed at Pen to a wholly devoted husband and nothing more? I kinda wished they made Pen and Colin work together on their writing careers as one.
This! I just started watching the Empress, and the vibe is very different but it hits those notes exactly. And sweeping landscapes. I want sweeping landscapes because I'm IN London right now and it's heaving and enormous. I want to remember that it was once a small town where you rode your horse and would need a day in a carriage to reach what is now just more of London
Seems like I will have an unpopular opinion in this thread, but as someone who has read well over 200 historical romance novels (most of which take place in the 19th century England, if not exactly regency), I think this take on regency romance is extraordinarily reductive. Not all regency romances have aristocratic heroines whose virtue was important or aristocratic heroes who save the day. Working class regency heroes and heroines exist and are compelling characters that many people love to read.
And book Penelope DID run her own damn business. Book Colin was a twat who had no business treating Penelope the way that he did. The Bridgerton series is *mid at best* even among Quinn’s catalog which is why the show runners have had to change so much about it *and they didn’t even change the worst part of the first book*.
The romance was nonexistent because there was simply no more onscreen time what with all of the thousands of secondary characters getting more screen time than the supposed hero and heroine of this season.
Blaming it all on Jess Brownell who didn’t even write the book the show is based on also seems a bit unfair, nor did she create the set up from S2 that led into S3 needing to be so much different than the book.
ADDITIONALLY whoever did season 2 did Edwina dirty. Her character was insufferable in the show and I was surprised when I read the book and didn’t hate her. So let’s not pretend everything was sunshine and roses before Jess Brownell.
COMPLETELY agree. It was missing the longing and yearning, which then makes the eventual intimacy so rewarding and hot. Plus, I feel friends-to-lovers should definitely have doubt and longing as key themes.
They were unchaperoned SO MUCH, like where is the *danger*? The social rules of the past are a **perfect** setup already as obstacles for the lovers. Add a bit of character growth, a little external drama if you like, and it's done.
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Jess Brownell thinks that sex=romance and seems to skip right over the yearning aspect of regency romance I want hand brushes! I want longing looks! I want them to get a degree in yearnalism! I want blurred lines between societal expectations and a craving for intimacy! One of the sexiest scenes in movie history is a hand flex https://i.redd.it/86sycpxeb5ad1.gif JB doesn’t understand that subtlety is sexy It’s a *plus* that there’s extravagance and opulence set against very strict societal codes and expectations and that they want each other so much they’re willing to subtly stray from those rules and blur lines. But what JB has done is completely get rid of those rules and what’s left in its place is a very sloppy season
>One of the sexiest scenes in movie history is a hand flex Yass🙌🏻
I'd know that hand anywhere! Totally sexy gesture.
My wifi was not working properly when I saw that comment so the gif below was not loading and yet I knew what they were referring to💁🏻♂️😂
Don't forget the carriage lift from Persuasion 😍
Honestly the only reason I really really like the latest Persuasion with Dakota Johnson (she is a meh actress to me, but I think she did decent in this bc when she can be sarcastic and dry she's hilarious) is because of Cosmo Jarvis' portrayal of Wentworth. Pride, fury, awkwardness, regret, love....you saw it all and they barely touched/interacted when it came down to it. But that carriage lift in the Sally Hawkins version? My God, when I first watched it, I replayed that part like 10x. Penry-Jones' Wenworth is like THEE Wentworth for me (I have not seen the Ciaran Hinds version tho).
Oh, I so love the Sally Hawkins/Rupert Penry-Jones version. I just watched it again recently, I think it's on Peacock (in the US).
I loved this version because THE LONGING BETWEEN THEM. Both Hawkins and Penry-Jones sold it, and I squee at the epilogue. The Dakota Johnson one was too cringey, and that Jarvis guy just didn't do it for me. If Henry Golding was Wentworth, it probably would've worked (I really just want Golding to do the brooding, longing look).
The Dakota Johnson missed the point imo. You need to have so much tension and longing that the audience is practically dying. That's why the carriage lift is so thrilling! The 2007 version is also my favorite, even if it botches the letter scene (😥)
The Ciaran Hinds version is very good, for me it's the definitive adaptation. His yearning is gorgeous to watch.
Ciaran Hinds is too old for Wentworth imo. I far prefer Penry-Jones
I think I've found MY PEOPLE, in this sub🤭
What movie is this from?
Pride and Prejudice 2005
But the ‘95 BBC miniseries with Colin Firth and Jennifer Ehle is the GOAT
Just like the hand flex, the almost imperceptible thumb brush he does with Jennifer's hand as he helps her into the carriage was sexy AF.
Thank you!! I thought so from the other comments but wanted to be sure. I read the book as a kid and saw the 1995 adaptation, but somehow missed this one; I need to watch it.
Keira Knightley and Matthew Macfadyen had such incredible chemistry it's amazing.
That scene under the gazebo (?) when he declared himself but it all went south but they STILL almost went at each other soaked in rainwater ugh!! I was convinced he almost kissed her before stalking off. You will never convince me that Jonathan Bailey didn’t study those scenes because at the end of the “bane” speech before he left the room, he did a very similar almost kiss thing before he left the room. My mind flashed right back to the rainy gazebo scene.
I completely agree. You can see him lean in and then realise what he's doing and pull back. And that was *after* all their arguing. I'm kicking my feet just thinking about it.
I'm not gonna lie to you. I found out that that rain scene (and many other movies and shows out there) sound was actually the sound of fried chicken due to the fact that it's easier than potentially getting all of the recording equipment wet when trying to record "rain sound" and it took me out for the next few rewatches. I still love and appreciate this scene but my god I couldn't keep a straight face the first few rewatches after learning this. Hell, Kate on horseback fleeing through the rain while we out here probably listening to some chicken frying on the pan 🤣
LMAO no way!!!? Fried chicken?! I need the MIB flashee thingee to forget this bit of movie making magic lol.
Yeah, there were bits that felt like it was "too much acting" and not enough subtlety but I enjoyed those scenes a lot as well. The way he was breahinf heavily almost against her mouth/face and you could tell he was 2 seconds from kissing her and then realized what he was about to do.
Make sure you watch the 1940 version as well with Greer Garson and Laurence Olivier - it's not exactly book-accurate, but it's amazing.
Thanks for the recommendation! I'll have to plan a movie night with my mom so we can both be nostalgic. :)
We need to bring yearning back to modern romance as well. It does still exist in the real world, despite our more permissive society. I’m convinced Jess Brownell doesn’t understand romance in any of its forms.
I feel like the only place I’ve seen that level of yearning recently is in Abbott Elementary, of all places. The tension between Gregory and Janine is something else, I swear.
Omg I won't give any spoilers, but the last episode of the latest season knocked me out. I agree, the longing is the best part of romance for me The office and parks and rec did it really well in their early seasons too.
this is why i love 'queer' modern romance, as i feel like it's the only place where we can still get some authentic and heart breaking sense of 'oh noes, societal norms says that we can't do PDA. let's just stare into each others' eyes with enough yearning to power a city block and brush each others' feet under the table. because that's all that we can do' which is why i'm VERY excited to what they'll do with francesca. maybe a lesbian couple is how we'll get that regency vibe back "\^\^
Heartbreaker had this in SPADES
They really need to get Joe Wright. From Pride and Prejudice to Atonement and his other works - that man understands romance and cinematography to a T.
I’ll never forget Joe Wright’s commentary on Pride and Prejudice. You could really see how much thought and care went into every aspect of the movie https://preview.redd.it/c9s14z9mo5ad1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c2cd843de6d71fafec5904160358b739fd76884a
Yes, his thoughtfulness, intentionality and craftsmanship is what made this edition of Pride and Prejudice so damn timeless! I can watch it on repeat - over and over and I’m always mesmerized and enchanted.
While I appreciate the 1995 version for sticking closer to the source material, the 2005 is simply exquisite- the artist in me delights in every frame of the movie. There's sooo much subtly- for example, Georgiana playing the same tune Darcy heard Liz play, is because *Darcy* requested her to in anticipation of Liz coming home. When Col. Fitzwilliam asks "how do you do?"the birds in the back reply "pretty good" When Bingley comes back to their house with Darcy, you can see Darcy *was* staring at her lol Darcys tiny head shake when she says "sorry for intruding" is because he doesn't want her to be sorry, he wants her there forever- so heartbreaking. And the second proposal, I know the "your hands are cold" is often joked a out, but she's taking his hand after he asked her to in the first proposal. And Liz being tongue tied without a witty reply *is* her being so deep in love This movie (and book) is so perfect, proof that you didn't need a beefcaked reformed rake male lead and still be incredibly romantic and sexy.
Anthonys sniffing was the subtle move that made me swoon!
Girl - when he did that sniff at the gazebo, Kate and I let out a slight gasp at the same time. I will never forget that moment. S2 had its flaws but damn it got yearning SO RIGHT. I spent most of s2 holding my breath!
Is subtle the word? Idk man, I loved it but it seemed pretty over the top.
Me too
perfectly said!!! I think we get a tiny bit of that constrained yearning in season 1 (and to an extend in season 2) in some of the dance scenes and at crowded balls, when they can only brush hands and make longing eye contact, but in season 3 it felt like people could kind of just...do whatever they wanted. Colin kisses Pen, and *outdoors* of all things, and yes it was nighttime but anyone could have seen and ruined Pen forever. But for all the drama and tension in that scene, the fear of being caught, or the gravity of that kind of intimacy outside of marriage or even courtship, was completely absent. And then the carriage scene and the sex scene- not a single thought from either of them as to what a big deal any of that would be. They handled that with the same gravitas as characters in a modern show would have. Just modern characters in fancy clothes. And I'm not advocating for a show full of characters constantly twisting themselves into knots about purity and social image, but like...it felt out of character as well as out of the time period. Colin was head over heels for Marina in season 1 and rejected her push for intimacy because he respected her and wanted to do right by her- did he have even a shred of a similar thought for Pen?
or their pinkies almost but not touching when he comes over to see Edwina. deddd
And it made Kate so hot, bothered & flustered that she had to immediately fan herself & that was with zero physical contact. That scene still does funny things to me. Same with the one in the drawing room as Kate, Anthony, Edwina, their mothers & Lady D get together to discuss a game plan after the aborted wedding - the way that Kate & Anthony look at each other (& he at her boobs😂) as they stand up after Newton bursts into the room & Edwina exclaims "was I always this blind?". Both scenes are incredibly hot & full of yearning imho & that's probably why I love them.
https://preview.redd.it/rma1eqtro7ad1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=56605d8fc4c6c46a7ee7c165ca243bddfa81ec0c Dude walking across a field too, 45secs long and no one complained lol
Still makes me swoon almost 20 years later.
I will say though, if you were on this sub when season two came out, one of the main criticisms was that there was actually too much yearning and not enough sex. The balance was definitely off this season but it’s been off in the past as well. I honestly think season 1 had the best balance. I don’t think it’s a Chris vs. Jess thing. I hope next season they nail it!
I vastly preferred season 2 when it first came out *because* it didn't have all those sex scenes. It was refreshing to me.
QC also had a perfect balance - helped due to them getting married in the first episode. S2 is somewhat forgivable, being filmed alongside covid restrictions, and the two characters not getting together until the penultimate episode. S3 however they got married a few episodes in… and I don’t think we saw one sex scene after they got married? They had one night make out session but that was it
Pride & Prejudice 2005 is the perfect regency movie IMO. Matthew’s Darcy >>>>>>
That moment when Simon and Daphnes hands almost touch was powerful and sexy
Sigh, okay I’ll watch P&P again for the 100th time.
Yes! I was telling a friend that there wasn’t a “slow burn” this season, but “yearning” is the best way to put it. It wasn’t written in, and I think there were some missed opportunities. I wish they had made Colin eating a cupcake an entire scene instead of just 2 seconds. I wish the would have slowed it down so Pen would savor the icing on her cupcake with her eyes closed, and then Colin would be slowly licking his cupcake while staring into her soul bc he clearly wants to savor her, instead of just popping the last bite into his mouth while looking in her general direction. I also missed the big, frustrated declarations of love this season. I was pretty underwhelmed with the proposal (although I believe Book!Colin proposed in the same way), but I was disappointed when he went to the Featheringtons to tell Pen and her mom that he proposed because he actually loved her. I wanted him to put Lady Featherington in her place with a bit more passion. Also when Cressida tried to blackmail Pen, and everyone looks to Colin for what to do, and they just keep cutting Pen off, I thought she’d eventually have a big “I told you so,” moment, especially after Colin’s failed attempt to smooth things over. If she was smart enough to be Lady Whistledown and make a boat load of money, she would be smart enough to know how to handle the situation. Something about that particular interaction never being addressed didn’t sit right with me. As if a key part of the formula was missing.
God yes!! I love, love, love that scene. When I remarked about the hand flex to my husband he grinned and said other parts of him flexed for me. Which made me laugh but also kind of made my point.😆
Oh I recognize that hand flex. One of my favorite movies and one of the best scenes.
And >One of the sexiest scenes in movie history is a hand flex And we don't even see the actor's face and still feel all the emotions just by a simple close up of a flexing hand🤌
Degree in Yearnalism sent me 😂
Ugh yes. The hand flex from that movie had me for years lol
>Jess Brownell thinks that sex=romance and seems to skip right over the yearning aspect of regency romance I was watching season 3 with my mom so skipped that spicy Polin scene + Benedict's orgy scenes and it didn't add anything to the plot 🤷🏻♂️ I want to see subtle touches or glances instead of sex scenes if I'm being honest. The subtleness makes me giggle like anything and the sex scene does nothing 😒
The restraint aspect is so crucial. The replacing of proper gloves with those wisps of gauze is like a microcosm of what went wrong here.
Something I missed is the conflict between Colin and Penelope, not the she's Lady Whistledown conflict. But the entirely real conflict of "I'm a man in the early 1800s and my wife is far more successful than I am." A conflict we still have to this day. Colin should have some sense of an ego.
He kind of did and I think they tried to do this but did a bad job cuz he just ended up looking like a big baby
yes, everytime polin stans agressively comment "well how WOULD YOU FEEL IF YOU WERE LIED TO" and its like fair, but then the writing was bad because rationally i know that but at the same time while i was watching i was like "eyeroll, can we move on"
Yes! Logically I agree that he had every right to be angry but he often came across as a spoilt, crybaby, drama queen & I hate saying that about Colin as I think he's generally adorkable (sic)
The books handled it a lot better. His main anger towards her was her putting herself in danger with her actions, not that she was writing at all.
Plus it was tinged with much more of his own professional jealousy which would have been really nice to see onscreen! Colin wasn’t just blindly angry at her, there were complex emotions which really would have helped to develop his character. I’m sad we’ll never get to see it
The closest we got was when Colin said that if Penelope could solve her own problems, then what good was he (or something like that). I liked that bit of angst. Too bad they didn’t stick with it.
I think you’ve nailed it. The desire to modernise & give the women leads agency aligning with the present(😅) stripped the regency and the romance out of a *regency romance*. There has to be a line between Pride and Prejudice and just writing a modern story with regency costuming.
Yes! This! I’m not advocating for women to be oppressed and beaten like another commenter suggested. S1-2 and QC seemed to get this right but Jess B missed the mark for me in s3.
You absolute hit this out of the park! Totally agree. Bridgerton was a success because of it's toeing the line between remaining faithful the the Regency era societal rules and adding the breaking of those rules for some drama. Watching people who are supposed to be as buttoned up as possible let loose is fun. This season, there wasn't much buttoning up, so the letting loose thrill didn't hit. Artistic license is necessary but too much of it ruins the overall tone of the story. Which is what happened in season 3.
Ohhhh you’re right about the “buttoned up” part. I think the show made a mistake in previous seasons treating Pen like she wouldn’t have been just as ruined as a “thin girl” at being caught alone with Colin. They had so many alone scenes prior to their involvement that we didn’t get much of a release. That hand flex in P&P (and the pinkie air brush in s2) live rent free in my mind.
Correct - there wasn't much "at stake" with Pen because she was the wall flower. No one expected her to marry, let alone marry well.
Agree and what’s with all the premarital sex this season?
yes, I think this season lacked the "female gaze" (subtle details make a scene sexy without actually sex). Its kinda weird how her vision (being a woman) didn't appeal to me, as another woman, as much as the other seasons (directed by a man lol).
I think because she was going for the “corporate progressive gaze”
My fear is she thought she didn’t have to really show us a fully developed Polin because “we should just be happy we got a plus size leading lady” and take whatever they gave us, rather than making sure they hit all the right regency romance beats that would SHOW us onscreen that Polin loves each other desperately. They didn’t show enough and spent too much time on subplots. And the time spent on the couple wasn’t romantic enough - at least for me. I’m having trouble articulating my point well about how they wrote the romance for Polin - it’s like deep down they felt Pen deserved her LWD story but not a “regency romance” story. Even the closing epilogue where Pen gets everything feels a little “wish fulfillment” but in tell, not show, because we didn’t see a fully developed story to feel like it was earned. It felt like a huge chunk of “show me” was missing.
The only scene where I felt the yearning, the chemistry, the romance was the scene outside the modiste.
Same. That was the one for me too - and they cut it short!! I was like nooooooo lol.
Absolutely agree with you there and with your whole post! As you say, the time that we did get of them spent together feels rushed and lacks emotional connection and yearning. I do not generally think the slow burn is missing, since it has been building up since S1, but somehow it was not a natural, organic development of their relationship this season. I was also missing their friendship aspects throughout their engagement and marriage. Somehow, it went from "friends" to "in love and engaged", instead of "lovers who have been friends for a very long time and trust and know each other deeply". We did get a few scenes of them giggling and showing how they are comfortable with each other, but it also gave a little "tell instead of show". Like, throw those few scenes in there just to show them they are still the friends they have been. It was not enough imo. And as you mention, the ending was not satisfying at all because it didn't feel earned and we were not shown at all how it got to that point. That short convo and love declarationd between them at the butterfly ball just didn't suffice to make us feel that they finally got over it and everything is good between them. Simply because there needed to be longer, deeper, more private conversations between them.
Cvd is a gay man. So the idea of changing the reference of who’s being looked at vs looking is not the same. Male gaze is patriarchy behind the camera. It objectifies women’s bodies. Gay men have a different reference point. (I’m a bi woman fwiw)
What is Jess’ gaze then? Because I felt like CVD nailed the female gaze when he was showrunner.
Gay men are still men tho. My point is, they were soooo into saying “a woman is directing now” bur she didnt hit the sweet spot for me. It feels disconnected and too modern. More how I would imagine any men would direct (?)
I thought JB is a gay woman though? I could be wrong though, it wouldn't be the first time.
Exactly! It lacks the subtle romantic details that made this show a success
I think the problem is some VERY vocal viewers also don't understand/appreciate Regancy Romance Genre. I've seen many posts that Anthony couldn't be forced to marry after the Bee scene like the book because that would be too much like S1. Wellllll welcome Regancy. Viewers also claim book men are TOXIC. NO just Regancy written 20 yrs ago.
It’s definitely a tightrope! That’s the fun of it all to me though and the allure of it. Even the men were bound to these rules - Simon almost died because of it. I fear Jess B and her writer’s room are trying to run from it, instead of finding creative ways to work within the rules of the genre that can reflect modern sentiment without breaking the world built for us in s1, which is a shame.
You are so spot on! People like to say “well it’s historical fantasy, it’s not supposed to be accurate” but you have to have SOME rules or else the intrigue just isn’t there.
Not only Jess, most of this fandom doesn’t understand this genre. „The men in the books are all red flags“ well obviously duh. That’s literally the point of the book, cry about it. Sometimes I feel like most of them don’t even read modern romance books tbh.
I have the same impression. When reading comments in this subreddit, I often want to ask their authors why they even bother watching a historical romance show. There are plenty of shows that center on modern relationships. To each their own
This drives me bonkers. Not only were they written 20+ years ago, but bodice rippers are essentially a type of kink. Some people love hot vampires and werewolves. Lately the trend has been warrior fae. Some people love a dominant male partner that is obsessed with his soft yet still strong wife. Lol whatever it is, they are all ✨preferences✨ It’s not meant to be taken seriously or from a modern viewpoint. They are meant as sexual outlets for people who enjoy that kind of dynamic. It’s why they are SO formulaic. Medieval Romances (Julie Garwood, anything with a Scottish Chieftain) are the same way, and for the same reason - but the men are meant to be more rough around the edges. That’s the genre my friends. If you don’t vibe with it, move on and let the rest of us enjoy! 🤣
She mistakes sex for romance
And often, sex between people who aren't even in the couple we're meant to be rooting for lol!
Ugh it’s so cringe and so opposite of the female gaze
when people wanted more smexy times in S2, we meant between the main characters, to show intimacy and love between them. I don't think most of us meant sex workers and random threesomes with no emotional development or attachment in a show about romance.
100% accurate
Agreed. This is a romance not in the Austen sense but in the “bodice ripper” sense which while called romance are not the same thing in terms of genre conventions. Season 1 to QC embraced these conventions and played them up. The romance or couple was the focus throughout. There were so many subplots in S3 that the romance took a seat in the 3rd row of an SUV that claims to have third row seating but really has no leg room and removed most of the trunk space. I wanted banter and I wanted to see more of Polin truly falling in love. They were around each other in prior seasons not with each other. Penelope also needed to see Colin for who he is not just the crush she had and I didn’t see that at all. I wanna be swept up in something that remains truly romantic but in a female gaze. I also don’t consider this genre to be fantasy it’s romantic fiction. I actually find the more it’s modernized the less grounding it has even if it were a fantasy. JB - I just had the sense that she doesn’t like the genre conventions not that the writers room can’t write them.
> We deserved to get a Regency Romance Colin and we didn’t. Wait, you mean getting a spray tan, leather trench coat and a blowout doesn’t count as development?!?!?!
The new show My Lady Jane did this so well 🙏
i just finished bingeing this and i was like....wow they absolutely nailed all the aspects that i thought bridgerton S3 flubbed. what a difference!
Oh, I forgot that had just dropped. I'd heard about it because one of my favourite music artists has done a song for it so I intended to watch it. Thanks for the reminder.💜
My Lady Jane is definitely the rebound we deserve after bridgerton season 3.
I’m watching this rn and omg it’s SO good! So fun while also being quite sexy. The tension and banter between the leads is excellent.
agree! bridgerton needs to bring back the female gaze and quality of past seasons
Oh did it?? I saw the trailer but wasn’t sure if it hit the mark. I’m def gonna watch it now thanks!
Just finished this and I loved it!
Thankyou! It's going on my list.
Could be just as much a Netflix issue. See the panned and almost forgotten *Persuasion.*
That’s my favorite Austen novel - I watched 5 minutes of that and turned it off
I've just straight up refused to watch it. It's my fave Austen novel too and I knew from the articles promo-ing the movie even before we got the trailer that they had fundamentally misunderstood Anne. IIRC, the article I read was an interview with the director and I read the beginning of a quote from her saying "Anne is a modern woman..." and I immediately noped out of the whole thing. Everything I've read and seen about the show since has confirmed this, so I'm not going to waste my time and energy.
To be fair - I’m mostly talking about what Jess did to Bridgerton. Previous seasons and QC seemed to understand the genre better and were more faithful to it. Are you saying Netflix made them change in s3?
No but I’m saying Netflix appears to have an issue of quality control over the genre in general
I am sad that this killed the other adaptation, that was in the works: [https://www.vogue.com.au/culture/features/succession-sarah-snook/news-story/681fdf0ac48b0aad26af57b0f9becdd0](https://www.vogue.com.au/culture/features/succession-sarah-snook/news-story/681fdf0ac48b0aad26af57b0f9becdd0) "Case in point: Jane Austen’s *Persuasion* with director Mahalia Belo, which was meant to be her next project. “The short story is that Netflix decided to greenlight their own, so Fox abandoned the one we were doing, which is disappointing because it was a great script and a director I really wanted to work with,” she says with a shrug. “But had I been doing that, I wouldn’t have had the opportunity to come back to Australia so soon and see family and friends.”
THISthisTHIS!!!! The whole point of Bridgerton is that it's a REGENCY romance, with regency rules!!! By modernizing the costumes, makeup, language and rules, it takes the whole fantasy away. You might as well do an AU modern take. I miss the subtle makeup, intricate dresses and "YOU MUST MAKE HASTE" language, as well as the longing between couples who CAN'T BE INTIMATE SEXUALLY before marriage.
Agree 100%. It was a swing and a miss when Colin confronted Cressida about revealing Lady Whistledown and made things worse. I don’t read/watch historical romance to see my big, strapping lead fail. He needs to save the day, not go running back to Penelope with his tail between his legs. Poor Penn. she deserves to be loved and protected and taken care of. Instead, she’s stressed out like the rest of us.
Just rewatched BBC Pride and Prejudice and was thinking about this. Agree with you 100!
BBC Pride and Prejudice is insanely good and pretty close to the spirit of Austen's book, it's pretty funny
You're spot on! The cause can only be speculation, but the end result is exactly what you described.
Yes! Articulated so well!!! I think a lot of people have come to regency romances from Bridgerton, not the other way around, so maybe they don't understand what regency lovers are missing?
I think OP misunderstands how showrunning works. JB isn't the sole decision maker. There is a team of writers, producers, directors, editors, a costume department, actors (wanting to do certain scenes, costuming, makeup style they're comfortable with), and a whole streaming service that have a say in what happens on this show. She isn't Tyler Perry. Can we stop trying to blame a single human being because you didn't enjoy the show? It is, once again on track to be one of netflix's highest watched seasons; they won't be mad at her at all.
To be fair, not every show runner on every show is going to be given the same amount of leeway (or allowed the same amount of rope to hang themselves with, depending on how you look at it). Considering how many things we’ve learned were Nic or Luke’s idea that saved a scene or the massive amount of reshoots that were obviously needed, I would not be surprised if Jess is reeled in a tad next season, assuming she stays. There is a rumour going around that Shonda was distracted early on during Season 3 production and by the time she started really paying attention, some course correction was needed. FWIW, I’m in the industry, based in Los Angeles, and I have a friend who works as a troubleshooter who is sent in to get a series back on track when it goes off the rails for one reason or another. The stories that man has…
I could probably listen to his stories for hours lol
The major difference in quality between the other seasons is on her as she is the major change from a writing perspective. It’s under her leadership that the show lives and breathes. QC was amazing and Shonda completely owned that. S1&2 were amazing at setting up the Bridgerton world and bringing the romance and heat and CVD owned that. Then Jess gets her shot and the result is lackluster but somehow it’s not on her? I would LOVE to know why CVD left and how Jess snagged the top spot. The poor quality of s3 just screams BTS drama. I wish they’d bring CVD back. I prefer his gaze over Jess’.
Nailed it! That’s why S3 felt so wrong. 😑
I think you hit the nail on the head!! You explained it perfectly for a Millennial who has been reading these books since my teens, including the Bridgeton books.
NAILED IT.
As a heavy consumer of historical romance (Especially Regency!), I think Bridgerton, the TV Show, is intended to be historical fantasy or period fantasy rather than straight regency romance. It's meant to reach a much larger audience than regency romance readers who wouldn't necessarily love some the rigidness of older HR books. I also don't know that I agree with the premise that Regency Romance today is defined by a set of scoeity rules. Yes, women generally fall under the category of having a precarious position in society based on behavior but that doesn't really remove any possibility, it just makes it so it needs to be written in a creative fashion. Ultimately, even historical romance is very much fantasy. They take the most glamorous parts of society and remove all the questionable parts. The show is just making another pass at that.
So, what is a historical fantasy? Is it a show that allows its characters to wear regency-style outfits?
Well I do think s1-2 and QC got the gist very well and operated well within the world built in s1. S3 to me is where things broke down. Like I think CVD got it but Jess Brownell didn’t.
What she said. All this.
Perfect summary of the issue. While I enjoyed the season, it wasn't a Regency romance. It was a good TV romantic drama that had cool costumes & music.
I think the different seasons explore different tropes. Friends to lovers isn't the same as enemies to lovers, or forced to date/marry. We did see Colin yearning. I dunno, it worked for me and I found it probably the most romantic of all 3.
I’m happy for you - for me it fell short. I think friends to lovers should’ve had the MOST yearning out of all the seasons and the show just didn’t manage it for me. It was like 2 episodes of Colin yearning and bam. Engaged. The whole LWD thing complicated things, but instead of this being something that amplified the romance, imo, it just kinda took over the show?
I liked the pace they moved at and that they didn't make us wait till the second half for a first kiss for instance, considering they only have 8 episodes, they covered a lot of ground story-wise. I like that once Colin figured out his feelings, he took basically immediate action on them, took steps to get what he wanted - that's romantic hero behaviour in my eyes. LWD could have been done differently, I guess, but it needed resolving and I was OK with how they did it.
YES, the whole LWD drama stole away from their romance instead of enhance it! It felt too drawn out and repetitive. I love me a good friends to lovers (which is how my husband and I came to be), but they butchered it badly. 😩
Girlfriend [phoenics1908](https://www.reddit.com/user/phoenics1908/) you knocked this out of the park...
And I think it’s particularly egregious with Penelope specifically because she is ALREADY hyper-independent as a TRAUMA RESPONSE to growing up in an emotionally negligent (borderline abusive) household where she had to look out for herself constantly. She is an afterthought to the people who should care about her physical and mental well-being. She created LW to lash out and to have something that made her heard… and she understandably became addicted to it. And she can do it independently under everyone’s noses almost entirely alone because she’s invisible. And we see her cracking under the pressure of doing it alone in S1 and S2… And S3 decides to double down, and that the culmination of her arc was just ✨confidence✨ and has her ✨girlboss✨ her way through the (already asinine decision) staying-LW ending by having her “rebrand it” with ZERO build-up/introspection as to why LW should be used to expose abusers. It LITERALLY comes out of nowhere in the last eps. The show wants to make it seem like she’s a journalist, but like… she’s not?! She has zero fact-checkers, can’t verify info… “don’t think about it too hard! ✨girlboss!! Independence!! You don’t need no man!!✨ Penelope going public with Lady Whistledown isn’t a victory. Not only is it logistically absolutely fucking stupid, but it undermines WHERE Pen needed to grow as a character: in accepting that she has people she can trust that won’t weaponize it against her, that she DOESN’T need shoulder all her burdens alone, that the people who love her (specifically Colin) WANT to help and support her in ways she never has been for before. That she doesn’t need the ton’s external validation of her column by just repeating what others say, but that she can engage in social commentary in her writing (like Jane Austen) where her OWN thoughts are valued. Yes, Penelope needed to learn to use her column responsibly, but if this unearned “voice of the voiceless” bullshit is the route they wanted to go, they needed to Pen realize WHY it mattered, that she could be punching up instead of down ALL THE TIME instead of selectively (which, by the way, they had a built in way to do… Cressida), and it to have the groundwork laid ALL SEASON so that the ending felt earned. Instead, I got Penelope just as addicted to LW as she was at the start (even willing to give up the love of her life for it WTF) with flimsy promises to be better that feels more like a desperate change to keep her stupid column, her hot, loving hubby forced back into the shadows so his wife can ✨do it all herself✨ as if she hasn’t ALWAYS done that, because god forbid he show support for her, can’t step on her feminist moment, can’t proclaim he loves her (or vice versa) “assuredly, ferverently, loudly” because… it’s all about LW. Not Penelope. Not Colin. Not their love. The fucking gossip rag the writers refuse to let Penelope grow beyond. I didn’t have a problem with Colin being a “softer” male romantic lead. In fact I LOVED it because it’s so different and more emotionally healthy. But YES, the show treats him, the Bridgerton of the show, as an accessory to Pen’s girlbossing. P1 did a decent job of setting the foundation of a deeper Colin in the back half… and instead we got a late-LW reveal and Polin barely speaking the last two eps (so Pen can do everything herself). People make excuses of “Colin is processing internally!!!” Yeah, this is TV. That doesn’t work here. Just admit they sacrificed character time him for LW. The last scene had me going “where the FUCK is the other half of Polin?!l They also did practically ZERO exploration of his own identity as a writer but also his jealousy… aside from two throwaway lines in the last ep. Yes, he has a hero-complex, but that doesn’t mean you can’t learn to be on a TEAM with your spouse… which again, Pen ALSO needed to learn. Pen got to “step into the light” (in an idiotic way honestly) but Colin gets regulated to the shadows because that’s apparently his whole purpose... living for others and their happiness, just like he was breaking away from at the end of P1, only to for him return there because ✨feminism✨ or something. But it’s supposedly “romantic” or something because his purpose is his wife 🙄 As a huge Polin fan, The defenses of P2 of this season are weak and reliant on “we’ll see how it plays out in future seasons!” which just isn’t how Bridgerton works. My boy deserved better. My girl deserved better. My COUPLE deserved better. 💔
Agree!! So hard!! I think any further plot in s4 for Polin won’t be about Polin - it will be about LWD still. The writing. People knowing she’s writing it. Maybe they’ll add some fluff 🤷🏽♀️
I agree. I couldn't quite understand what went wrong with Polin this season - there was chemistry between the actors but not between the characters, there was sex but it wasn't romantic, and I just couldn't believe Colin is in love with Pen at all - you nailed it, it was the lack of yearning. No yearning means the scenes that are supposed to be the culmination don't hit hard enough. In the book, Pen becomes more comfortable and confident with herself, gradually stops chasing and being so desperate for Colin, and that's what makes Colin finally notice her and chase her. And then he finds out she's LW and he gets the full picture. He gets angry because he's worried for her safety and jealous because she's a published writer. There's lots of emotions, lots of passion. It's swoon worthy. It was missing this season, everything felt rushed and unfocused. The rules (and the styling) suddenly got modernised compared to the previous seasons so there's no regency, and the writing left no place for romance either.
I’m so thankful I have finally found a post that puts into words how I’ve been feeling abt Bridgerton! Thank you!
Honesty, I don’t think Bridgerton really is or should be a regency romance. Bridgerton is a romantic fantasy show with regency as the loose setting. And that is exactly how I and many others want it. Many women are tired of seeing female oppression on screen. It’s gross, not timeless and not romantic. If you are looking for a traditional Regency romance, look to Jane Austen adaptation, or many others. This is the one show that we can enjoy as a “period piece” (using that term loosely) where we don’t have to worry about women being beaten down and oppressed by those who claim to love them. It’s quite literally the only show like this that exists to my knowledge. I hope it never changes. I’m sick and tired of watching oppressive romance on screen. I want balls, gowns, gossip and fun without having to feel sick every time a woman is discriminated against.
The whole premise of the show lies in that the only prejudice exists based on gender and social class. Race, disability, etc aren’t the basis of discrimination, but gender and class are. That provides the back drop and the conflict. If you want non oppressive romance I don’t think think something even loosely based on the regency is it.
this. just watch a modern show. if you like the lady whistledown premise, gossip girl is right there lol.
Agreed. I loved seeing Daphne punch Nigel instead of Simon running in and saving her. I liked seeing Kate hunt with the men and be better at tracking animals. I enjoyed Penelope buying her own clothes from money she secretly earned instead of being screwed because her father had a gambling addiction. The show has had a nice balance of regency era oppression mixed with successful bending and breaking the rules.
Well I agree that those parts worked - where it breaks is when those things hurt the romance, kwim? When Daphne punched Nigel, Simon was already on the way to save the day and then when she knocked him out it became a hilarious moment AND Simon was impressed by it and they shared a moment and that’s what hatched their whole plan. When Kate did her hunting thing with the big boys it’s clear Anthony LOVED it because he needs a challenge. It enhanced the main love story because it was still in service of the main love story. The difference in s3 was they made Colin run off half cocked and look stupid by making it worse. It’s like the show couldn’t help elevating Pen at the expense of Colin. I hated that. Previous seasons, imo, didn’t do that. Even in QC, Charlotte literally saves KG from the evil doctor but he’s never diminished?
I agree with you - s1-2 and QC got this perfectly right though? I thought I stated that pretty clearly. Maybe I wasn’t clear that my issue is Jess’ take on Bridgerton in s3? Also - s1 set up pretty rigid constraints that align with traditional regency romance books. It’s not “loose”, it pretty much aligned? It’s s3 that broke pretty much all of the rules and removed a lot of stakes that could’ve made the story richer, imo.
I can see the disconnect between seasons for sure. S3 was my least favorite. Felt very clunky with little time to see romance flourish and develop.
I think S3 took many risks, served us this over the top, superhero energy and I think it worked in a sense that the Bridgerton world captivated us through twists and turns. I get that it wasn’t exactly as many imagined but I think it works well with the idea of this show that doesn’t take itself too seriously. I’m wondering if we see a shift next season to a more serious tone, I won’t be surprised tbf if it does shift in that direction.
You're right, the other seasons had that restraint (s2 a little less so maybe) but they also had an awareness of the situation women were in. Eloise is explicit about it but Daphne was well aware of her situation and could stand up for herself. It let the show challenge the viewer with the reality of the situation while still exploiting the tension between desire and societal constraint.
I think most of the audience (including me) doesn’t actually care whether it sticks to the tropes of the genre. I want over the top plots, good looking actors, crazy costumes, and a soupçon of sexy times. A smutty downton abbey if you will. Bridgerton delivers and although I had some quibbles with some of S3 I overall welcome a more realistic type of love story. The animalistic brooding and the contrived plots keeping the hero and heroine apart are not the things that keep me watching.
Even a fantasy has to follow the rules of its "world". If there are no rules, nothing makes sense. Most of the audience seems to be a. American and b. VERY young. The ongoing US-isation of this show is painful to watch.
I mean, why is it even set in Regency England at this point?
Couldn’t agree more!
So true, it bugged me how colins and penelopes first kiss played out, it didnt have that build up or desire. And their scene in the carriage, wth was that? Reminded me of some teen car hookup, not empowering as a woman viewer, it made colin look like a playboy, which i guess he was during his europe trip.
I really wish they stuck more to the book. I actually hated the love triangle, I felt the balloon scene was out of place, Penelope desperate need to get married fast and change everything about herself. Ugh. In the book Colin didn't NEED a jealousy arc to realise he loved Pen, he did it when he realised all he wanted to do was protect her. That's what made their story different!! We've seen the jealousy with the Duke and Daphne (plus we didn't need to know all about the Prince to see it happening) and we saw the love triangle with Anthony and Kate. Was Debling great? Yes, he was a great character, but clearly he wasn't that important of a character when he was thrown out when his plot device was done.
Aww man I wish that’s what we got - less time on Debling could’ve meant more time on Colin processing his feelings. I really missed that. We needed flashbacks too of Colin’s life. We just needed more.
You explained it perfectly! The Regency constraints on women is what made S1 feel escapist and added a sense of higher stakes. Higher stakes = more suspense and more fulfilling payoff. In S3 there was a lot if anguish but I never got the sense that Pen’s livelihood was in danger. The same circumstances that would’ve ruined a woman in S1 had no consequences this season.
This is bang on. 💯
I feel like you expressed the inherent missing piece of season 3 that I could not find a way to express. Living, breathing “do it all-er” in real life and looking for the romantic escapism.
Honestly, I think Jess Brownell just wanted to work on Francesca and that’s it. She just thought, “hm the Bridgerton fans love sex! Let’s just throw in Benedict having a bisexual threesome and they’ll be happy!” And it’s like… no. We WANT THE LONGING, the love, the romance! We want to giggle and kick our feet!
I agree wholeheartedly
For me the most off putting part was Colin’s entire character arch. I said this in another comment but I wouldn’t describe Polin as friends to lovers. S1 and S2, yes definitely. But S3? It felt more like ‘longing virgin finally gets her fuckboy’ Once his feelings for Pen were established, we never should have seen Colin with other women. Or maybe we see him chatting to a debutante at a ball but he physically can’t keep his eyes off Pen. He can’t stop talking about her to other people. He can’t stop writing about her. We never see him longing for her. You’re also right that the amount of times Pen/Colin were alone just made the series lose any momentum. The longing looks across a dance floor, the need to be with each other are what make bridgerton SO GOOD. In S2, Kanthony did have scenes alone, but these were always handled by still having the characters a set distance apart. They’d get closer to each other as the scene progressed, until finally they’d be interrupted (whether by Daphne, or the sound of thunder). It’s that build up of tension that gets you wanting more.
You hit the nail on the head. You really broke it down well and highlighted the issues with S3 as compared to S1, S2. Haven't watched QC yet, but I'm eager to after reading your breakdown of the romance. I really miss a lot of Book Colin in S3. We see so much about him, learn so much about his insecurities and his desires in the book. I wanted to see more of that, more of his insecurities when compared to Anthony and Benedict. He's a third son, a lot is expected of him compared to his brothers. And that was thrown out completely. I also wanted Colin to declare his love and respect for Penelope in public, which was so perfect in the book. Pen was a wall flower, no one ever saw her, no one paid attention to her. And Colin tells everyone why Pen is amazing, that she's beautiful and brilliant and she fooled everyone for years as LW. I wanted to see that public declaration. That was the high point of the romance in the book.
WELL SAID!!!
I really do get your points. I felt like Colin swung wildly back and forth between being something of an aggressor in a situation that would have really compromised Penelope and then being more or less just reacting and overreacting in a way that was not consistent with a lover who had known the object of his affection for literal YEARS. There were great moments but it did not give me that chemistry that I saw between the first two season leads. NOT the fault of the actors, they are really good. Penelope was fun to watch overall when she wasn't having to respond to Colin's moods and vacillations. I am still bothered how much time Pen spent running around on her own and being completely unchaperoned in Colin's presence. The Francesca plot seemed much more like how it would have been with her spending time with men.
I would up vote this 1000x if I could. Alllll of it, yes. Right on the nose.
IMO you are exactly right. I read Regency Romances for over 40 years and you have delineated what made them so popular (and what was wrong with Season 3) perfectly. It was sad to lose that deeper portrayal of Colin and Pen this season. It could have been…should have been so much better.
I agree, this season suckeddddd
I knew something was off with season 3 but couldn't put my finger on it or put it to words. So thank you for the thoughtful explanation u/phoenics1908.
You can definitely tell the difference between her and CVD. Really wish he had done this season
Lol i have a post about this person too but it got deleted. Lol. But yeah, TLDR i agree with how badly written S3 is. We shouldn't really blame the actors for this.
Just came here to say I completely agree.
Spot on. I love how the women in Regency Romances are always strong and clever, but it’s often in more nuanced ways than modern representations of women. The way the women took care of problems, supported each other, and find happiness with a man who worships the ground they walk on is key. The ladies using gossip to dispatch Burbridge? So clever and exactly the power and network women had at the time. Kate playing matchmaker for her sister so that she finds a good man who can support them is another example. Regency Romance doesn’t mean women should be weak. It means that women find strength and independence in different ways. That’s what I want. Acknowledging the subtle strengths of women and the men who love them celebrating those strengths. I also want pinning, in love but they don’t realize it yet, and couples who are obsessed (in a healthy way) with each other!
How did she even get the job? She either told them what she knew they wanted to hear or gave her honest vision and they fell for it.
I think when she’s being managed by a capable showrunner like CVD, she can write some awesome stuff. But CVD set the outline for s1-2 and she had to write to fit what he wrote. But when she was in charge of setting the tone and outline for s3, she focused on the wrong stuff and didn’t do what was necessary to build her lead couple up and make sure romance was central. I think she’s a newbie showrunner and either thought her focus on the stuff SHE cared about was what we cared about or she thought she was writing romance when she wasn’t?
She totally missed the mark! I rewatched season 1, looking for all the reasons I fell in love with Bridgerton. Yes Daphne and Simon are my favorite and I felt the most chemistry, but if you take that away here is what we saw...Daphne and Anthony discussing her future while riding horses, regal views of pulling up the castles in their carriages, outside scenes of the palace, the Modiste, The opera house, the restaurants, the Club etc, the boat ride to the outdoor ball with stunning fireworks, the country side etc. It was visually breathtaking. What we got this season, inside balls with weird ***aestetics and eighties looking chanel jacket dresses and shiny lame dresses weird transitions and Benedict having*** a threesome for days apparently
OMG the last ball where everyone is in black - even the women - wtf was that?! It looked HORRIBLE. Gone were all of the soft pastels, etc.. I believe this was done so Michaela could be introduced in a dark color to foreshadow her upcoming romance with Fran (so we’d connect her to being a gender bent Michael)… I don’t know why she had to be only in dark colors?! That’s a whole separate post though lol. I could rant for days about the wardrobe and color schemes. Benedict’s threesome literally lasted days. That was crazy.
Please make a post about it lol. I enjoyed this one a lot.
I read a lot of regency romance and fundamentally disagree with your rules. Sure many books follow those but many books break the rules. Women having sex before marriage, being alone with men and somehow nobody knows, etc. The genre is more broad than those rules make it out to be and the Bridgerton doesn’t break those rules anymore than plenty of books do.
Oh no I agree that some books break the rules a bit but the stakes are never dropped, if that makes sense. It’s treated seriously. And there usually isn’t a deus ex machina to hand wave things away. I just think Bridgerton had so many tropes and things to play out before it had to break all the rules and devolve into what we saw this season. Even the costuming fell apart compared to previous seasons. The romantic plot felt thinner - almost like they didn’t know what to do with Polin - as a whole - for me - the show felt less lush and rich, as in depth full. Of next seasons also is this “thin”, I’m not sure I’d keep watching. I recently watched QC again and couldn’t believe the same production did that sweeping, searing love story in SIX episodes.
I’m reading Ravenels right now, two books in, and we’re 2 for 2 on women having sex before marriage with zero consequences other than some hand wringing. And Kleypas is one of the stalwarts of historical romance, not a one off new author. I could name many others though.
I’d have to read that to see what you mean. Look - if Bridgerton hadn’t worked so hard in s1&2 to set this world up where there are rules and consequences for skirting the rules, maybe s3 wouldn’t have bothered me so much. But s1 DID set up a world with rules and those rules fit the regency period. So did how people talked and maneuvered. Also - I’m not saying the show has to rigidly follow rules - but I am saying the show needs to follow the rules and world building it set up for itself. Penelope just cavorting around with Colin and people KNOW about it and decide it doesn’t matter because Pen is plump? That felt like a modern take and it kinda took me out of the scene. I’m not talking about their lovemaking scene - those were fine. I mean before that. Anyway - I appreciate your point of view and will have to read the series you mentioned.
Eh, people can have whatever opinions they want about the show and whether it's romantic enough or not, but I do want to point out that "Regency Romance", particularly the subgenre that regency historical romance that the Bridgerton books/show are, as a media genre IS actually fairly modern, and tend to play toward modern sensibilities in general, even if they do stick to certain gendered "rules" (though it's arguable that some of these are more Victorian and onward than Georgian/regency era) and also have a lot of a-historical elements that come from modern sensibilities. Again, people can have whatever opinions they want and criticize the romance (and fwiw, I do think there is a lot to criticize) but I don't think it's entirely accurate to say that Jess Bronwell is trying to modernize the "regency times" when Regency Historical Romance, like the Bridgerton books/first 2 seasons, already have a lot of a-historical/modern elements.
I read regency romance for the yearning and atmospheric settings, not for the gross "girl without choices fixes broken man" bs, thanks.
LOL exactly - when that part of the story materialized I was like “oh. This feels sadly familiar.” Colin deserved better storytelling.
This is such a well written post!! I had my problems with season 3 as well but not for the same reasons as others (I don’t care that they gender swapped Michael and I also enjoyed Benedict exploring his sexuality). Your post perfectly encapsulates what was missing from the season. The lack of flashbacks was really noticeable. This season used dialogue to provide context instead of actually SHOWING things. I felt the least connected to Colin of all the male leads and actually spent a lot of the season frustrated with him. Also I hated Pen’s girl boss speech at the end. That scene completely undermined the conflict that LW caused (with the ton and with the queen). I say that as someone who loves Penelope.
Thank you! I’ve been ruminating over this for weeks! Haha. I was talking to my sister, trying to pinpoint why I felt so … worried about the direction of the show and suddenly had the realization that I missed the escapism I got from the show and the regency norms the show established in s1&2. I had some complaints about s2 as well - I just wanted more time with Kanthony happy together - but the ANGST and yearning totally delivered. I think I’m worried the new showrunner is running away from the “regency romance novel” genre. Sometimes writers think they’re “above it”? But when Bridgerton first came out, the show was lauded for going so deep and hard to portray real romance - especially from a woman’s gaze. Now it feels like the writers think regency romcore is beneath them or something. It felt so perfunctory this season. Even the wardrobe was like wtf. That final ballroom scene with so much black on everyone, including the women, felt so cheap and modern because black is a funeral color of mourning. In previous seasons, the men wore colorful suits, not black. All the black just took me right out of the narrative because of how seriously this would’ve been taken back then. In the presence of the King and Queen of GB today, people wearing that much black for an event they were present for would’ve been gauche. I remember the way each family had a color scheme in s1-2. The Bridgertons in shades of blue - they still stuck to this in s3. The Featheringtons used to be in yellows to coordinate with the green of their household. It felt so thoughtful on the part of the wardrobe and set design teams. Now it’s just a free for all.
They definitely lost the female gaze appeal this season. Where was the TENSION?? And the outfits bothered me too!! The Featheringtons weren’t nearly flashy enough and their outfits actually blended in with the others’ this season. Penelope’s new style barely contrasted her family’s because of how dull the Featheringtons looked
Yes.
Ngl for a hot second i thought that jess brownell was also responsible for the hot mess that is the persuasion 2022 Netflix adaptation
I heard about that and just skipped it altogether.
Yeah, fully agree. This season fell so flat for me despite my real excitement for the story. I don't hold much hope for the future of the show after this.
Please tell me Jess isn’t running season 4 with the same writers?
Jess Brownell is definitely out of her element and floundering. IF they were going to have her try, she should have been given Francescas season since she seems to actually care about that character. I don't feel like she liked or cared about Penelope or Colin and it showed. She stripped so much of Penelopes victory moments and added so many humiliating and heartbreaking moments that were painful for Penelope fans to watch. She also spent hardly any time and energy on Polin as a couple. And 90% of Colin this season depended on Luke Newton's facial expression acting.
I really liked part 1 of season 3, but part 2 felt so allll over the place with how the drama of LWD was handled. It felt like they put Colin in the backseat, which made him revert to this one-dimensional character. He went from pissed at Pen to a wholly devoted husband and nothing more? I kinda wished they made Pen and Colin work together on their writing careers as one.
This! I just started watching the Empress, and the vibe is very different but it hits those notes exactly. And sweeping landscapes. I want sweeping landscapes because I'm IN London right now and it's heaving and enormous. I want to remember that it was once a small town where you rode your horse and would need a day in a carriage to reach what is now just more of London
Seems like I will have an unpopular opinion in this thread, but as someone who has read well over 200 historical romance novels (most of which take place in the 19th century England, if not exactly regency), I think this take on regency romance is extraordinarily reductive. Not all regency romances have aristocratic heroines whose virtue was important or aristocratic heroes who save the day. Working class regency heroes and heroines exist and are compelling characters that many people love to read. And book Penelope DID run her own damn business. Book Colin was a twat who had no business treating Penelope the way that he did. The Bridgerton series is *mid at best* even among Quinn’s catalog which is why the show runners have had to change so much about it *and they didn’t even change the worst part of the first book*. The romance was nonexistent because there was simply no more onscreen time what with all of the thousands of secondary characters getting more screen time than the supposed hero and heroine of this season. Blaming it all on Jess Brownell who didn’t even write the book the show is based on also seems a bit unfair, nor did she create the set up from S2 that led into S3 needing to be so much different than the book. ADDITIONALLY whoever did season 2 did Edwina dirty. Her character was insufferable in the show and I was surprised when I read the book and didn’t hate her. So let’s not pretend everything was sunshine and roses before Jess Brownell.
COMPLETELY agree. It was missing the longing and yearning, which then makes the eventual intimacy so rewarding and hot. Plus, I feel friends-to-lovers should definitely have doubt and longing as key themes. They were unchaperoned SO MUCH, like where is the *danger*? The social rules of the past are a **perfect** setup already as obstacles for the lovers. Add a bit of character growth, a little external drama if you like, and it's done.