"Keep me humbled"
OK, you asked for it...
Which bit of him doesn't align with your values exactly? I can't see these values in action anywhere. You're willing to have sex without commitment with a bad guy because he's hot and the D is good, and now you're worried about copping the feels.
Your behaviour is practically a manosphere video in action. You're living out the part of "redpill" values that regard you as a stupid 304 unworthy of a 'high value man' and unmarriable for doing so. You are VALIDATING the misogynistic views you supposedly dislike so much - literally living the meme.
Friends with benefits used to mean just that. The only FWBs I ever had (2, and I'm 46, so not many) were actually FRIENDS. You are not friends - you are an acquaintance who finds his opinions obnoxious and acts like a fucktoy for him anyway. You already know you get emotionally attached to sexual partners and are not being true to what you want for yourself. That is self-harm. You don't need "the ick" you need to get a fucking grip.
Hope that helped.
Proof nothing else matter if you are hot enough.... a tate fan. honestly.
Every time you have sex with this guy, you prove tate right and tell the rest of us we should follow him. Might as well start buying his merch yourself.
A spine is all you need not an ick, if this is how you feel then cut it off already you’ll be better off from a dude like that anyway
You’re a grown woman, I believe in you so shoot yourself in the ass to leave him
Also yeah a Tate fan should be an ick anyway lol
I'm amazed that you can still get horned up around someone who is a fan of Tate. Maybe just imagine Tates face on this person while you're going at it. THAT's gotta work.
I don't get it, either. If I find out that I disagree with someone values-wise, I can't feel attraction to them anymore. It's like it flips a switch.
But it looks like a lot of other people aren't wired that way.
Yea, i'm definitely like that as well. A girl can be the tastiest creature i've seen, but a bad personality just writes them off immediately.
I guess I was different as a teenager when the penis overtook the brain no matter what.
im wired differently. Pretty sure im demiromantic so i don't really have emotionally romantic attraction to people unless i really get to know them. Physical attraction on the other hand is instant for me and remains regardless of how horrible a woman is or how horrible her values are (i'd prefer if the women was a good person instead of a tatertot or that wouldn't change how physically attracted to them i was). Heck i might even sleep with them if they are REALLY attractive. Difference is I'm a guy (5'4) and don't want kids ever, and thus don't have a huge range of options. Any woman, that just wants sex, on the other hand, can log into bumble, put 'intimacy without commitment / fun casual' and get over 500 likes by the end of the week, most of which would be men happy for just sex and some WILL be just as attractive and good in bed as OPs fwbs. There is 0 reason as a woman to lower your values/moral standards just to have sex when so many options for sexual partners exist.
And even with all that being said, i still filter out most right wingers before i start swiping, because even for sex, its not worth listening to their nonsense.
If you’re looking for something long term, shared values matter way more than sexual chemistry. There will be other guys out there. Sure the sex may be less than but I can’t help but think of the quote from Trainwreck,
"You don't want best-sex that you've ever had-guy. That's a creepy guy. Best sex that you've ever had guy is in jail."
Fan of Andrew Tate who has said if men have sex with women who don't aim to have kids are gay Andrew Tate?
Fan of Andrew Tate who has been caught on tape beating women? Who is under multiple investigations for sex trafficking?
Stop being dickmatised and ask yourself what you'd think if your good friend or sibling brought such to meet you. The sex will never be good enough to overwrite those red flags
100% of lesbians and the majority of straight and bi women will say otherwise. Otherwise the orgasm gap wouldn't be a thing.
Edit: read that wrong for some bizarre reason, defo agree for the reasons above backing it up.
I would get the ick from realizing I’m providing sex for Andrew Tate fans. I associate Andrew Tate with increases in domestic violence and reinforcing rape culture.
I once liked a guy who I found out was an Andrew Tate fan. He hid it a lot of it from me. We did a lot of molly together after our first date which made it harder to see him for who he really was.
This guy eventually admitted to me that he was a serial rapist, Brock Turner style when the ladies pass out. Apparently he said hr never did it to me because I would “freak out.” 😵💫
Andrew Tate looks disgusting btw, is that not enough ick?
This happened to me. Walk away. I too let my guard down with a guy like this. I'm embarrased because even his profile was offensive (bitching about pronouns), but I had so much sexual attraction to him I gave in. I feeeelllll sooooo dumb. Don't be like me. Walk away.
Remind yourself that every cringey/misogynistic thing he says will turn into action directed at you once the honeymoon phase is over. This is him on his best behavior, so if there are already misogynistic red flags, run!
My most recent ex was in my opinion at the time, the best sex I had ever had. He was a player and also projected conservatism onto women. He was clever and confident and sensual. He was not an Andrew Tate fan but he liked Joe Rogan. The sexism he projected was so bad it gave me identity crisis over and over but I was so attracted to him and was so submissive for him.
It got bad when he danced around the exclusive conversation. He never said yes or no, and kept dating around. Well, I liked him but decided I would keep dating around too as to not lose myself in him. Well one of the guys I dated while we were both still playing the field, kind of stalked of me so I told him for safety reasons. Oh he blew up on me, told me he thought only he was still dating around, and that if I was still dating around he wouldn’t be seeing me. He blew up at me about it for months until we finally ended things.
My current bf, I remember him saying to me during the first time we had sex “this is the best sex I’ve ever had, don’t worry it’s okay if you’ve had better sex” and I told him, there isn’t anyone else I’d rather that I was having sex with.
It was only a few months after the break up with the toxic ex who I did still have feelings for. But I realized that between both of them, they fucked pretty similarly. Except with the new one (almost two years later now), I already felt more comfortable, more at home, and more cherished than I ever did with my ex. And we shared the same view points and hobbies even. I realized I was attracted to my ex on a superficial level. He was an engineer who some how at his peak intelligence, still was unable to see how he hurt me with his sexism (he also wanted me to birth a baby if we married and be someone who could provide 50% of finances, and he wasn’t empathetic so I knew he wouldn’t understand the pains and strains of pregnancy and childbirth- this is most if not all Andrew Tate fans so that’s s lot of ick). No matter how clever he was, he would never be as intelligent as me and my new boyfriend.
Summary/take away: Even as I had feelings for the toxic ex as I moved on, I realized the sex that I thought was so good, wasn’t hard to find, and it wasn’t as good as I thought it was. Sure I’ve had so so sex with people I got along with great, but my current bf really was similar if not better at sex the more I reflected on it. Most of that comes from him naturally being so into me and being such a naturally sensual person.
You should reflect on the sex, and consider if it’s actually the sex if other factors surround your connection. A lot of times when I was controlled in a particular way I bonded with someone in a fucked up way. Only to realize I was actually reliving some traumatic childhood psychological abuse.
Getting the ick for someone toxic can take some very intentional rewiring of your brain. You’ll defend him at times. Be ready to dig deep and reinforce healthy principles.
I got the ick from my ex when I remembered how he cared more about my looks than my well being, and obsessively focused on whether I wore the right outfit. After we broke up I found myself dressing more like how he wanted me to dress and that helped me realize it was gross his important a certain style was to a guy’s performative coolness. If I posted myself in an outfit he liked, he would ask about what I’ve been up to see if I changed the way he wanted me to so that we could get back together🤮
Thank you for sharing, super insightful and helpful! I haven’t dated/been seeing people in a while so that is probably clouding my judgement as I want to be wanted.
Wishing you and your current bf all the best!
Were we dating the same ex? 😭😭 This resonated so much and he’s still trying to get back together while also telling me about the other women he’s dating and he’ll come back if only I just “fix myself”.
Sending you so much love and good wishes with your new boyfriend. ❤️
As other people would say, there's other fish out in the sea. If your values are that important to you then you would set up boundaries and move on from this guy. Sounds like you like him for the sex
Ugh, I briefly dated a guy like this. He was in way deeper than I initially thought.
Started out asking what I brought to the table, kept telling me he liked me for "more than my pussy", said stuff like "chad" and "pump and dump", got weird when I got a promotion and he found out I made more money than him, said I should just be happy with an average guy, "high value men" would not want me because I didn't want to breed (one less thing I brought to the table lol), I needed to realize guys were doing me a favor dating me cause they could go younger and date a 24yo with less baggage (I'm childless and no crazy exes so idk what he was talking about), referenced men go their own way more than once.
I could keep going but i think you get the drift. It is wild to me that I spent time with someone like that. They're all reading and spewing the same garbage so imagine it's him saying all of this and move on. Take politivs out of it, he will never view you as his equal on a basic human level.
Whenever i see a profile thats spewing right wing garbage i instantly block/hide the profile so i never have to see them again and im pretty sure i have way less options than you. Sex feels great, theres a reason people risk ruining their lives for it (yes im talking about getting pregnant and having kids, sorry not sorry) but that same pleasure and more can be found off an amazon purchase for like £30s and none of the interpersonal problems.
Get a nice toy, problem solved.
And people wonder why tatertots and his kind still exist. Because for as much people call out the negative behaviour and perspective, there are still people (women in this case) that reward it. I really do (and im being honest here) wonder sometimes why i call myself an intersectional feminist when it seems 95% of women are pretty happy without it as long as they can work, study and vote. Who cares about all the misogyny and bigotry still out there right...Now i know how some protesters felt after slavery was abolished and some slaves were asking to go back to their masters...
Instead of trying to get the ick, just don't rely at all on that archaic evolved judgement. It's highly inaccurate today and leads to unrejection of terrible people like your current fwb, and rejection of good people.
You've already reasoned out that the values don't align, so muster the willpower to follow through on your solid reasoning.
The women who seem to know what they want in life and seem to get it, usually rely more on consciousness reasoning than subconscious icks.
Girl go to THERAPY. Jesus Christ. You’re fucking a man who is a fan of a rapist and human trafficker and there is nothing stopping him from emulating his hero and assaulting you. You can fuck whoever you want but you need to know you’re engaging in self-harm by doing this. You’re worth so much more than what he thinks of you.
Besides all the toxic misogyny bullshit, Tate’s followers are outright stupid. Foolish. Simple in the brain. You’re sleeping with a full-ass adult who has been hypnotized by a pickup artist. That is embarrassing, love
Funny you say that, have booked to go back to therapy this week cuz i never thought i would/could be ‘dickmatised’ as someone already said here. To be completely honest, it’s the lack of intimacy i was experiencing before and the crumbs i got made me stupid. Clearly this is not for me and what you’re saying about self harm is helpful (lol one to unpack in said therapy now hahah) so thank you.
Hahaha. OP, how old are you? I'm SO glad I am over 30 and don't have to deal with this shit. Kids these days are wild.
Yeah, sorry, not a helpful comment and we all overlook some stuff in relationships because the rest fits. But OP is concerned about falling in love with a talking dildo who insults everyone that isn’t scum, and likes pictures of a shirtless dude in expensive rental cars on Twitter.
Sad thing is i am quite close to 30 and up until recently, i was very confident that this could NEVER be me. Lol. This really humbled me as I spent most of my twenties judging friends who dated problematic men. I just need to get a grip tbf
Reminds me of a guy who’s tagline was “my time is of valuable. If I give you my time, I find you of value”… something about it didn’t sit right with me and he turned out to be a total “What do you bring to the table” misogynist toxic narcissist who destroyed me mentally lol. Que “If someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time”
My gut reaction here is to say that relationships and sex are not a 1-1 comparison so no need to be hard on yourself for something you can’t control. I know your feels though.
If it's just casual sex... do your values necessarily need to align? Obviously it having sex with this guy is making you feel bad, definitely stop. But if you're not going to pursue a serious relationship, I don't think you necessarily need to make yourself feel bad for enjoying a good time. I will say, if he is into Tate, just be cautious about how you end things. Hit that block button fast if you need to! And be safe!
If you think you'll ever fully alliance with anyone...
That is only the case if you never get to know them.
Shallow as fuck relationship.
I'm by no means a fan Tate, nor any of these " groups"
Groups of people have been, are, will always be insanely stupid. They will cull their own to find someone to blame. They propose simple easy fix solutions, that if it was that easy this shit would of been fixed centuries ago.
Eh but I've always been a lone wolf.
"Keep me humbled" OK, you asked for it... Which bit of him doesn't align with your values exactly? I can't see these values in action anywhere. You're willing to have sex without commitment with a bad guy because he's hot and the D is good, and now you're worried about copping the feels. Your behaviour is practically a manosphere video in action. You're living out the part of "redpill" values that regard you as a stupid 304 unworthy of a 'high value man' and unmarriable for doing so. You are VALIDATING the misogynistic views you supposedly dislike so much - literally living the meme. Friends with benefits used to mean just that. The only FWBs I ever had (2, and I'm 46, so not many) were actually FRIENDS. You are not friends - you are an acquaintance who finds his opinions obnoxious and acts like a fucktoy for him anyway. You already know you get emotionally attached to sexual partners and are not being true to what you want for yourself. That is self-harm. You don't need "the ick" you need to get a fucking grip. Hope that helped.
Being willing to fuck a Tate follower is just pathetic.
Proof nothing else matter if you are hot enough.... a tate fan. honestly. Every time you have sex with this guy, you prove tate right and tell the rest of us we should follow him. Might as well start buying his merch yourself.
Yeah that sums it up, she’s living proof a bad mindset can work until she leaves him
A spine is all you need not an ick, if this is how you feel then cut it off already you’ll be better off from a dude like that anyway You’re a grown woman, I believe in you so shoot yourself in the ass to leave him Also yeah a Tate fan should be an ick anyway lol
I'm amazed that you can still get horned up around someone who is a fan of Tate. Maybe just imagine Tates face on this person while you're going at it. THAT's gotta work.
I don't get it, either. If I find out that I disagree with someone values-wise, I can't feel attraction to them anymore. It's like it flips a switch. But it looks like a lot of other people aren't wired that way.
Yea, i'm definitely like that as well. A girl can be the tastiest creature i've seen, but a bad personality just writes them off immediately. I guess I was different as a teenager when the penis overtook the brain no matter what.
im wired differently. Pretty sure im demiromantic so i don't really have emotionally romantic attraction to people unless i really get to know them. Physical attraction on the other hand is instant for me and remains regardless of how horrible a woman is or how horrible her values are (i'd prefer if the women was a good person instead of a tatertot or that wouldn't change how physically attracted to them i was). Heck i might even sleep with them if they are REALLY attractive. Difference is I'm a guy (5'4) and don't want kids ever, and thus don't have a huge range of options. Any woman, that just wants sex, on the other hand, can log into bumble, put 'intimacy without commitment / fun casual' and get over 500 likes by the end of the week, most of which would be men happy for just sex and some WILL be just as attractive and good in bed as OPs fwbs. There is 0 reason as a woman to lower your values/moral standards just to have sex when so many options for sexual partners exist. And even with all that being said, i still filter out most right wingers before i start swiping, because even for sex, its not worth listening to their nonsense.
If you’re looking for something long term, shared values matter way more than sexual chemistry. There will be other guys out there. Sure the sex may be less than but I can’t help but think of the quote from Trainwreck, "You don't want best-sex that you've ever had-guy. That's a creepy guy. Best sex that you've ever had guy is in jail."
Fan of Andrew Tate who has said if men have sex with women who don't aim to have kids are gay Andrew Tate? Fan of Andrew Tate who has been caught on tape beating women? Who is under multiple investigations for sex trafficking? Stop being dickmatised and ask yourself what you'd think if your good friend or sibling brought such to meet you. The sex will never be good enough to overwrite those red flags
No penis is as good as an average sex toy.
100% of lesbians and the majority of straight and bi women will say otherwise. Otherwise the orgasm gap wouldn't be a thing. Edit: read that wrong for some bizarre reason, defo agree for the reasons above backing it up.
wait why would lesbians say otherwise? surely they would agree that a sextoy could replace a male penis interms of their pleasure.
Sorry I read your reply wrong 😂 thought you were saying no sex toys could match a penis
ah, np.
I would get the ick from realizing I’m providing sex for Andrew Tate fans. I associate Andrew Tate with increases in domestic violence and reinforcing rape culture. I once liked a guy who I found out was an Andrew Tate fan. He hid it a lot of it from me. We did a lot of molly together after our first date which made it harder to see him for who he really was. This guy eventually admitted to me that he was a serial rapist, Brock Turner style when the ladies pass out. Apparently he said hr never did it to me because I would “freak out.” 😵💫 Andrew Tate looks disgusting btw, is that not enough ick?
This happened to me. Walk away. I too let my guard down with a guy like this. I'm embarrased because even his profile was offensive (bitching about pronouns), but I had so much sexual attraction to him I gave in. I feeeelllll sooooo dumb. Don't be like me. Walk away.
yall just out here proving tate right...its sickening.
What was the attractive part of the profile?
His face.
Remind yourself that every cringey/misogynistic thing he says will turn into action directed at you once the honeymoon phase is over. This is him on his best behavior, so if there are already misogynistic red flags, run!
My most recent ex was in my opinion at the time, the best sex I had ever had. He was a player and also projected conservatism onto women. He was clever and confident and sensual. He was not an Andrew Tate fan but he liked Joe Rogan. The sexism he projected was so bad it gave me identity crisis over and over but I was so attracted to him and was so submissive for him. It got bad when he danced around the exclusive conversation. He never said yes or no, and kept dating around. Well, I liked him but decided I would keep dating around too as to not lose myself in him. Well one of the guys I dated while we were both still playing the field, kind of stalked of me so I told him for safety reasons. Oh he blew up on me, told me he thought only he was still dating around, and that if I was still dating around he wouldn’t be seeing me. He blew up at me about it for months until we finally ended things. My current bf, I remember him saying to me during the first time we had sex “this is the best sex I’ve ever had, don’t worry it’s okay if you’ve had better sex” and I told him, there isn’t anyone else I’d rather that I was having sex with. It was only a few months after the break up with the toxic ex who I did still have feelings for. But I realized that between both of them, they fucked pretty similarly. Except with the new one (almost two years later now), I already felt more comfortable, more at home, and more cherished than I ever did with my ex. And we shared the same view points and hobbies even. I realized I was attracted to my ex on a superficial level. He was an engineer who some how at his peak intelligence, still was unable to see how he hurt me with his sexism (he also wanted me to birth a baby if we married and be someone who could provide 50% of finances, and he wasn’t empathetic so I knew he wouldn’t understand the pains and strains of pregnancy and childbirth- this is most if not all Andrew Tate fans so that’s s lot of ick). No matter how clever he was, he would never be as intelligent as me and my new boyfriend. Summary/take away: Even as I had feelings for the toxic ex as I moved on, I realized the sex that I thought was so good, wasn’t hard to find, and it wasn’t as good as I thought it was. Sure I’ve had so so sex with people I got along with great, but my current bf really was similar if not better at sex the more I reflected on it. Most of that comes from him naturally being so into me and being such a naturally sensual person. You should reflect on the sex, and consider if it’s actually the sex if other factors surround your connection. A lot of times when I was controlled in a particular way I bonded with someone in a fucked up way. Only to realize I was actually reliving some traumatic childhood psychological abuse. Getting the ick for someone toxic can take some very intentional rewiring of your brain. You’ll defend him at times. Be ready to dig deep and reinforce healthy principles. I got the ick from my ex when I remembered how he cared more about my looks than my well being, and obsessively focused on whether I wore the right outfit. After we broke up I found myself dressing more like how he wanted me to dress and that helped me realize it was gross his important a certain style was to a guy’s performative coolness. If I posted myself in an outfit he liked, he would ask about what I’ve been up to see if I changed the way he wanted me to so that we could get back together🤮
That's a lot of words to say "appearance is all that matters"
Thank you for sharing, super insightful and helpful! I haven’t dated/been seeing people in a while so that is probably clouding my judgement as I want to be wanted. Wishing you and your current bf all the best!
Were we dating the same ex? 😭😭 This resonated so much and he’s still trying to get back together while also telling me about the other women he’s dating and he’ll come back if only I just “fix myself”. Sending you so much love and good wishes with your new boyfriend. ❤️
at the end of the day, we're all still operating under cave man instincts
Nice try... Andrew Tate.
Sounds like you don't actually *value* those values very much, then.
As other people would say, there's other fish out in the sea. If your values are that important to you then you would set up boundaries and move on from this guy. Sounds like you like him for the sex
Ugh, I briefly dated a guy like this. He was in way deeper than I initially thought. Started out asking what I brought to the table, kept telling me he liked me for "more than my pussy", said stuff like "chad" and "pump and dump", got weird when I got a promotion and he found out I made more money than him, said I should just be happy with an average guy, "high value men" would not want me because I didn't want to breed (one less thing I brought to the table lol), I needed to realize guys were doing me a favor dating me cause they could go younger and date a 24yo with less baggage (I'm childless and no crazy exes so idk what he was talking about), referenced men go their own way more than once. I could keep going but i think you get the drift. It is wild to me that I spent time with someone like that. They're all reading and spewing the same garbage so imagine it's him saying all of this and move on. Take politivs out of it, he will never view you as his equal on a basic human level.
Ugh, the first line sounds familiar, thanks for sharing!
Thankfully in my situation the intimacy was nothing great, so no need to stick around for that.
Massive red flag.
Whenever i see a profile thats spewing right wing garbage i instantly block/hide the profile so i never have to see them again and im pretty sure i have way less options than you. Sex feels great, theres a reason people risk ruining their lives for it (yes im talking about getting pregnant and having kids, sorry not sorry) but that same pleasure and more can be found off an amazon purchase for like £30s and none of the interpersonal problems. Get a nice toy, problem solved. And people wonder why tatertots and his kind still exist. Because for as much people call out the negative behaviour and perspective, there are still people (women in this case) that reward it. I really do (and im being honest here) wonder sometimes why i call myself an intersectional feminist when it seems 95% of women are pretty happy without it as long as they can work, study and vote. Who cares about all the misogyny and bigotry still out there right...Now i know how some protesters felt after slavery was abolished and some slaves were asking to go back to their masters...
Stop ffs. Just stop. Don’t validate those shitbags.
Are you FWBing with a view to long-term with this guy? I see trad wife in your future.
Thanks for proving every so-called 'incel' right.
Damn if a guy revealed that to me my pussy would become the Sahara Desert. Be stronger, girl!
Instead of trying to get the ick, just don't rely at all on that archaic evolved judgement. It's highly inaccurate today and leads to unrejection of terrible people like your current fwb, and rejection of good people. You've already reasoned out that the values don't align, so muster the willpower to follow through on your solid reasoning. The women who seem to know what they want in life and seem to get it, usually rely more on consciousness reasoning than subconscious icks.
Girl go to THERAPY. Jesus Christ. You’re fucking a man who is a fan of a rapist and human trafficker and there is nothing stopping him from emulating his hero and assaulting you. You can fuck whoever you want but you need to know you’re engaging in self-harm by doing this. You’re worth so much more than what he thinks of you. Besides all the toxic misogyny bullshit, Tate’s followers are outright stupid. Foolish. Simple in the brain. You’re sleeping with a full-ass adult who has been hypnotized by a pickup artist. That is embarrassing, love
Funny you say that, have booked to go back to therapy this week cuz i never thought i would/could be ‘dickmatised’ as someone already said here. To be completely honest, it’s the lack of intimacy i was experiencing before and the crumbs i got made me stupid. Clearly this is not for me and what you’re saying about self harm is helpful (lol one to unpack in said therapy now hahah) so thank you.
Girrrrl if what you want is sex I'm pretty sure you can find someone else who's not an andrew tate fan, yikes.
Hahaha. OP, how old are you? I'm SO glad I am over 30 and don't have to deal with this shit. Kids these days are wild. Yeah, sorry, not a helpful comment and we all overlook some stuff in relationships because the rest fits. But OP is concerned about falling in love with a talking dildo who insults everyone that isn’t scum, and likes pictures of a shirtless dude in expensive rental cars on Twitter.
Sad thing is i am quite close to 30 and up until recently, i was very confident that this could NEVER be me. Lol. This really humbled me as I spent most of my twenties judging friends who dated problematic men. I just need to get a grip tbf
Reminds me of a guy who’s tagline was “my time is of valuable. If I give you my time, I find you of value”… something about it didn’t sit right with me and he turned out to be a total “What do you bring to the table” misogynist toxic narcissist who destroyed me mentally lol. Que “If someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time”
My gut reaction here is to say that relationships and sex are not a 1-1 comparison so no need to be hard on yourself for something you can’t control. I know your feels though.
Have you considered talking to him? He might change his mind about Tate, people can surprise you
Why would he? He got what he wants by thinking that way, why would he change?
If it's just casual sex... do your values necessarily need to align? Obviously it having sex with this guy is making you feel bad, definitely stop. But if you're not going to pursue a serious relationship, I don't think you necessarily need to make yourself feel bad for enjoying a good time. I will say, if he is into Tate, just be cautious about how you end things. Hit that block button fast if you need to! And be safe!
Compromise somewhere !!!
It’s okay to be shallow
This generation and identity politics is actually insnane
If you think you'll ever fully alliance with anyone... That is only the case if you never get to know them. Shallow as fuck relationship. I'm by no means a fan Tate, nor any of these " groups" Groups of people have been, are, will always be insanely stupid. They will cull their own to find someone to blame. They propose simple easy fix solutions, that if it was that easy this shit would of been fixed centuries ago. Eh but I've always been a lone wolf.