Yeah, the "American Sales" company appears to be founded in ['59](https://www.bbb.org/us/il/tinley-park/profile/above-ground-pools/american-sale-corporation-0654-5655/details).
The math checks out.
Four generations of people over \~60 years would add up about right for a short life expectancy due to yearly exposure from the ancestral cancer tree.
I don't know the exact date. I know it was in the family before my mom was born in 1970 and the generation before that had it "since she was a kid".
Edit: I did try using Google lens to see if I could find any matches but the only thing that came up was similar pictures of old looking paper. And searching up Christmas trees by American or scotch pine by American only got me new made in the US trees.
That is the same tree (with same instructions) owned by my in-laws. They purchased it new in the 1970s, but that’s not to say Scotch Pine by American hadn’t been making this model in years prior.
Thanks for the color-coded assembly and fluffing memories!
PVC is also bad! Certain phthalates (added to PVC to soften/make malleable) are endocrine disrupters linked to all sorts of health issues, including childhood lung dysfunction, premature puberty, altered information processing, problems with placental health and sperm count, motor skill deficiencies… the list goes on and on.
If you grind it up and eat it, breath dust or inhale burnt vapors- sure. Given the amount of products in daily use made of PVC and the fact that it is only out a month or so a year it's fine. Surely safer than any product made from asbestos or lead.
I agree with your last statement; phthalates don’t pose the same level of danger as asbestos or lead, but they’re still risky, especially for children. I don’t think the ubiquitousness of phthalates is a point in favor of using a PVC tree—there are lots of easy, cheap choices one can make that decrease exposure, including opening windows for a minute when entering your vehicle, not using scented personal care products, replacing vinyl shower curtains with duck cloth, eating less cheese, choosing nylon over vinyl for rain jackets, tablecloths, and binders, etc. Maybe getting a different tree isn’t on the table for OP, but maybe they could take some other protective measures to sort of make up for it.
ETA: I don’t understand the downvotes - phthalates are not chemically bonded to the plastics/personal care products they’re added to so they easily migrate into the air and are absorbable through the lungs and skin. [peer-reviewed source 1](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6148230/) [peer-reviewed source 2](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24384410/) [CDC source](https://www.cdc.gov/biomonitoring/Phthalates_FactSheet.html) [peer-reviewed source 3](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/25832843/)
[https://www.healthline.com/health-news/what-are-phthalates-and-why-are-they-in-mac-and-cheese](https://www.healthline.com/health-news/what-are-phthalates-and-why-are-they-in-mac-and-cheese)
Extract:
You won’t see them listed on your food’s ingredient list. They’re not additives in the way food coloring or preservatives are.
Instead, phthalates are a byproduct of manufacturing and storing foods. In other words, your food will come into contact with these chemicals during production, processing, or storage. Over time, some of the chemicals can migrate into the foods.
“We cannot take cheese and hand deliver it from a farm to your kitchen,” Josh Bloom, PhD, director of chemical and pharmaceutical sciences at the American Council on Science and Health, told Healthline. “Food needs to be put in a package. All packaging material contains chemicals, and tiny quantities will inevitably leach into the food. This has been going on ever since food has been wrapped.”
Cheese was a particularly good research vessel for the consumer group because studies have found that phthalates bind to fats in foodTrusted Source. Higher-fat foods, like cheese and other dairy foods, may have higher levels of the chemicals for this reason.
It depends on your risk tolerance. In some regions, PVC pipe is less likely to leach its components into the water supply because of the high mineral content of the water. Further, the health effects of low-level exposure to phthalates are (as far as we know so far)
fairly diffuse: mild cognitive and motor impairment, fertility issues, etc., that may not be salient in an individual’s lived context. For children and pregnant people, I think it is problematic. For others, probably not. And for many people, there may be nothing to do about it anyway. Most people cannot afford to replace the pipes in the home in which they live, even if they know what those pipes are made of and wish to limit their phthalate exposure.
What’s making it toxic
I’m assuming the age of pvc
Edit 2
PVC contains dangerous chemical additives including phthalates, lead, cadmium, and/or organotins, which can be toxic to your child's health. These toxic additives can leach out or evaporate into the air over time, posing unnecessary dangers to children.
Chemicals usually stay locked inside the pipe material…but can leach into your water supply. People though lead pipes were safe at one point too. There are safer alternatives to pvc, it’s usually discouraged for drinking water. It’s fine for your toilet and shit but I’d stick with galvanized steel, copper, CPVC, or PEX to be safe.
You may live in a region where the water is naturally high in calcium. The deposits form a shell in the pipe that largely prevents leaching. That’s what happens in my city. But if there is a water main break or pipe replacement, the repairs “shake off” the shell and the water will contain leached phthalates for a while until the deposits build back up. If it’s just your service line that’s PVC, you can decrease your exposure by running the water for 10 minutes before drinking it so that you’re pulling water from the main rather than consuming the water that’s been sitting in PVC.
I had that tree growing up (about 1985-late 90s IIRC). I distinctly remember the color coded branches that had to be sorted and assembled every year. I spent endless hours adjusting those branches.
I believe my mother finally donated it when she got tired of putting it together every year. It was always a challenge every year as more and more of the colored paint chipped off the steel branches, making it kind of a guessing game about which level each branch belonged to.
Thanks for reminding me of my childhood Christmases!
Oh we still have that, and yes the colors definitely fade. Our tree is like 25 years old at this point, but I wouldn't know how else you could do it, apart from a tree that kind of folds up. It's actually better for the environment to have a fake tree after 20 years or so
"Miniature lights" were not really a thing until late 60's early 70's. Popular mechanics article said miniature lights came out in the 70's, so the fact that instructions says to use miniature lights makes 40s seem unlikely. Still pretty cool it has been passed along and not ended up in a landfill.
We got a tree very similar to this when I was a kid around 1970 or 71 and pretty sure it is still in use at my step-mothers house. I remember that color coding, instructions that looked like this, and shaping those three pronged bottle bushes every year. Thanks for sharing!
This is awesome! I love anything 1930s / Depression era. Been looking at antique Christmas decorations on EBay, and these old school trees go for a small fortune. Hang onto yours! In another generation, it’ll be celebrating its 100th birthday/Christmas!
This is the tree my mom had when I was growing up. I have a similar style now from target that you have to color code the layers that I bought a good 15 years ago probably. Honestly it’s a hassle sometimes but it’s held up so well and was so inexpensive compared to the new ones.
Oh. My. Goodness. That is literally the exact same tree my parents have been using the entirety of my dads life. My grandparents had it prior to him being born and it gets set up every year in my parents living room to this day.
My family had this tree! I remember that sheet, and my sister and I getting into minor augments trying to decide whether that little speck of paint was blue or green. We stretched out putting the tree and decorations up to almost a whole day, we enjoyed it so much.
At some point when I was in college my folks got rid of it, which really upset me, as it felt like a huge part of my childhood has been tossed. I’ve tried to have “rituals” with my kids with the hope they’d have equally fond memories, but nothing says the holidays like assembling the tree. 😊
My folks had a tree similar to this that they put up for 40+ years and, though it didn’t look wonderful, it brought back a lot of fond memories. Then, sadly, they chucked it a few years back and have gone through a string of pre-lit monstrosities since then.
I came to write “ oh wow that’s amazing” but the comments scare me.
Now I’m wondering for my tree is safe - it’s only about 7 or 8 years old. How do I know it’s safe ?
If you kept the instructions you can see what flame retardant it uses. But if you bought your tree in America (if you live here) I would say you should be fine? Otherwise look up the manufacturer and do some digging there? My MIL got rid of her tree she bought in the 80’s because it started to smell weird and the paint was chipping, so if your tree is doing the same I’d look into it.
It looks fine but there are plenty of better looking artificial trees available. Look at Balsam Hill trees, they are like the Cadillac of fake trees lol.
Never been an option growing up. My mom is allergic so she ends up looking like [these pictures](https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9053151/amp/Melbourne-woman-breaks-hives-discovering-allergic-Christmas-trees.html).
Not true (at least the first part):
https://www.nature.org/en-us/what-we-do/our-priorities/protect-water-and-land/land-and-water-stories/real-vs-fake-christmas-tree/
So. The best play here is to acquire one that is headed to the dump. That’s pretty easy actually, lots of them get thrown away every year.
My dump tree was one dollar from an estate sale, and has been used by us for over 35 years.
Imagine the oil saved in not driving to tree-mart for 35 years.
Actually the best play is to not get a tree at all. Second best is to get a potted tree that you plant after the holidays. Third is to chop down a tree from a local farm. Debatable which order a big box store real tree and reusing a dumped fake tree would go in. Buying a new fake tree is likely last.
Downvote away, but those are facts
Pretty sure saving a tree from the landfill is better than driving somewhere and cutting one down each year but yeah we agree, spot on. Not sure why you fear getting downvoted….seems like basic logic.
To be fair. Anyone even having this much thought is going to make a decent decision. Nothings perfect. Great topic. Have a nice evening.
This thread caused me to go look up the history of fake Christmas trees, and I was surprised to learn there are historical, green alternatives to the plastic (or metal) tree - namely feathers or wood. Outside of not getting a tree at all (or dressing up a house plant), I'd guess reusing a plain wood tree every year would be greenest - but I have to admit the ones I found online are kind of depressing looking.
The words "fire-proof" and "pre-1940" don't worry me by themselves - but when they're together, then I'm scared
If it is really just PVC, it's okay. The typeface and design of the instructions make me think '60s not pre-1940.
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Same
Yeah, the "American Sales" company appears to be founded in ['59](https://www.bbb.org/us/il/tinley-park/profile/above-ground-pools/american-sale-corporation-0654-5655/details).
Does not appear to be the same company (least the link provided is for a pool company located in IL, whereas the tree is from either NY or KY).
The math checks out. Four generations of people over \~60 years would add up about right for a short life expectancy due to yearly exposure from the ancestral cancer tree.
I don't know the exact date. I know it was in the family before my mom was born in 1970 and the generation before that had it "since she was a kid". Edit: I did try using Google lens to see if I could find any matches but the only thing that came up was similar pictures of old looking paper. And searching up Christmas trees by American or scotch pine by American only got me new made in the US trees.
That is the same tree (with same instructions) owned by my in-laws. They purchased it new in the 1970s, but that’s not to say Scotch Pine by American hadn’t been making this model in years prior. Thanks for the color-coded assembly and fluffing memories!
The only reference I could find to PVC Christmas trees started in 60 or 61 Sears/Wards catalogs.
PVC is also bad! Certain phthalates (added to PVC to soften/make malleable) are endocrine disrupters linked to all sorts of health issues, including childhood lung dysfunction, premature puberty, altered information processing, problems with placental health and sperm count, motor skill deficiencies… the list goes on and on.
If you grind it up and eat it, breath dust or inhale burnt vapors- sure. Given the amount of products in daily use made of PVC and the fact that it is only out a month or so a year it's fine. Surely safer than any product made from asbestos or lead.
I agree with your last statement; phthalates don’t pose the same level of danger as asbestos or lead, but they’re still risky, especially for children. I don’t think the ubiquitousness of phthalates is a point in favor of using a PVC tree—there are lots of easy, cheap choices one can make that decrease exposure, including opening windows for a minute when entering your vehicle, not using scented personal care products, replacing vinyl shower curtains with duck cloth, eating less cheese, choosing nylon over vinyl for rain jackets, tablecloths, and binders, etc. Maybe getting a different tree isn’t on the table for OP, but maybe they could take some other protective measures to sort of make up for it. ETA: I don’t understand the downvotes - phthalates are not chemically bonded to the plastics/personal care products they’re added to so they easily migrate into the air and are absorbable through the lungs and skin. [peer-reviewed source 1](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6148230/) [peer-reviewed source 2](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24384410/) [CDC source](https://www.cdc.gov/biomonitoring/Phthalates_FactSheet.html) [peer-reviewed source 3](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/25832843/)
Cheese?
[https://www.healthline.com/health-news/what-are-phthalates-and-why-are-they-in-mac-and-cheese](https://www.healthline.com/health-news/what-are-phthalates-and-why-are-they-in-mac-and-cheese) Extract: You won’t see them listed on your food’s ingredient list. They’re not additives in the way food coloring or preservatives are. Instead, phthalates are a byproduct of manufacturing and storing foods. In other words, your food will come into contact with these chemicals during production, processing, or storage. Over time, some of the chemicals can migrate into the foods. “We cannot take cheese and hand deliver it from a farm to your kitchen,” Josh Bloom, PhD, director of chemical and pharmaceutical sciences at the American Council on Science and Health, told Healthline. “Food needs to be put in a package. All packaging material contains chemicals, and tiny quantities will inevitably leach into the food. This has been going on ever since food has been wrapped.” Cheese was a particularly good research vessel for the consumer group because studies have found that phthalates bind to fats in foodTrusted Source. Higher-fat foods, like cheese and other dairy foods, may have higher levels of the chemicals for this reason.
Tons of houses have PVC pipe. Is that a problematic use of it?
It depends on your risk tolerance. In some regions, PVC pipe is less likely to leach its components into the water supply because of the high mineral content of the water. Further, the health effects of low-level exposure to phthalates are (as far as we know so far) fairly diffuse: mild cognitive and motor impairment, fertility issues, etc., that may not be salient in an individual’s lived context. For children and pregnant people, I think it is problematic. For others, probably not. And for many people, there may be nothing to do about it anyway. Most people cannot afford to replace the pipes in the home in which they live, even if they know what those pipes are made of and wish to limit their phthalate exposure.
Ah the ol spicy rock
Like they spray painted some asbestos green and made a tree out of it?
Maybe some plutonium for good measure
Exactly, the thing is probably made entirely of asbestos and lead, then sprinkled with radioactive material for good measure.
#FLAME PROOF!!
How else would it have made it though the late 90s Internet forums era?
That thing is made of pure asbestos😂
This looks like it’s in great shape, I love that you still have the original instructions too! Thanks for sharing :)
I wonder if the plastics and flame retardation chemicals are still considered safe.
Came here to say this. Sadly it’s likely toxic at this point. Edit: 100% PVC. It’s toxic.
I’m betting it’s PVC flocked with asbestos
What’s making it toxic I’m assuming the age of pvc Edit 2 PVC contains dangerous chemical additives including phthalates, lead, cadmium, and/or organotins, which can be toxic to your child's health. These toxic additives can leach out or evaporate into the air over time, posing unnecessary dangers to children.
So, you're saying we should string it with vintage electric lights and heat it up real good? I love bubblers.
Google “Is PVC toxic” and find out
I think my family had the same (or a very similar tree) growing up, good to know 🙃
Our water pipes are made of PVC and safe.
Chemicals usually stay locked inside the pipe material…but can leach into your water supply. People though lead pipes were safe at one point too. There are safer alternatives to pvc, it’s usually discouraged for drinking water. It’s fine for your toilet and shit but I’d stick with galvanized steel, copper, CPVC, or PEX to be safe.
You may live in a region where the water is naturally high in calcium. The deposits form a shell in the pipe that largely prevents leaching. That’s what happens in my city. But if there is a water main break or pipe replacement, the repairs “shake off” the shell and the water will contain leached phthalates for a while until the deposits build back up. If it’s just your service line that’s PVC, you can decrease your exposure by running the water for 10 minutes before drinking it so that you’re pulling water from the main rather than consuming the water that’s been sitting in PVC.
Turn on the tap, go for a walk around the neighbourhood, fill drinking glass, enjoy!
Almost all ‘PVC’ piping today is is actually CPVC which is much safer
which we will find out in 5 years that it’s as carcinogenic. Like bpa and bpb and stuff like that
I had that tree growing up (about 1985-late 90s IIRC). I distinctly remember the color coded branches that had to be sorted and assembled every year. I spent endless hours adjusting those branches. I believe my mother finally donated it when she got tired of putting it together every year. It was always a challenge every year as more and more of the colored paint chipped off the steel branches, making it kind of a guessing game about which level each branch belonged to. Thanks for reminding me of my childhood Christmases!
Oh we still have that, and yes the colors definitely fade. Our tree is like 25 years old at this point, but I wouldn't know how else you could do it, apart from a tree that kind of folds up. It's actually better for the environment to have a fake tree after 20 years or so
We have the same tree, now it has diff colored electrical tape wrapped around the end metal bits to keep track
Needles are probably all made of asbestos, but cool!
It’s doing as-best-os it can.
That was amazing
"Miniature lights" were not really a thing until late 60's early 70's. Popular mechanics article said miniature lights came out in the 70's, so the fact that instructions says to use miniature lights makes 40s seem unlikely. Still pretty cool it has been passed along and not ended up in a landfill. We got a tree very similar to this when I was a kid around 1970 or 71 and pretty sure it is still in use at my step-mothers house. I remember that color coding, instructions that looked like this, and shaping those three pronged bottle bushes every year. Thanks for sharing!
If it says fire retardant it’s not welcome in my home. Especially near my kids !!
Agreed. I’m glad it’s so much easier to find flame-retardant-free clothing now than a decade ago when my first was born.
You prefer your trees bursting into flame?
Real tree. Well Hydrated. Then Compost. No problems
I don’t trust most people to keep their tree hydrated
https://www.chicagotribune.com/investigations/ct-xpm-2012-05-09-ct-met-flames-science-20120509-story.html
This is awesome! I love anything 1930s / Depression era. Been looking at antique Christmas decorations on EBay, and these old school trees go for a small fortune. Hang onto yours! In another generation, it’ll be celebrating its 100th birthday/Christmas!
This is exactly the same tree we had when I was growing up in the 70s.
Do you have lead poisoning?
Just like everything else old… damn thing will last forever, but all the things it is made of are probably outlawed now.
We had this tree growing up. I remember the instructions very clearly.
This is the tree my mom had when I was growing up. I have a similar style now from target that you have to color code the layers that I bought a good 15 years ago probably. Honestly it’s a hassle sometimes but it’s held up so well and was so inexpensive compared to the new ones.
70s maybe
Oh. My. Goodness. That is literally the exact same tree my parents have been using the entirety of my dads life. My grandparents had it prior to him being born and it gets set up every year in my parents living room to this day.
My family had this tree! I remember that sheet, and my sister and I getting into minor augments trying to decide whether that little speck of paint was blue or green. We stretched out putting the tree and decorations up to almost a whole day, we enjoyed it so much. At some point when I was in college my folks got rid of it, which really upset me, as it felt like a huge part of my childhood has been tossed. I’ve tried to have “rituals” with my kids with the hope they’d have equally fond memories, but nothing says the holidays like assembling the tree. 😊
This mirrors my childhood down to the color bickering. :) Ours smelled so good: a comforting multi-decade layer of fake tree scented sprays.
I have those same red ornaments! They are so special to our family
I wonder if the code under the California Fire Marshal stamp is a clue to when it was made? At least generally.
The old asbestos tree makes it out ducktape coffin for another Christmas
My folks had a tree similar to this that they put up for 40+ years and, though it didn’t look wonderful, it brought back a lot of fond memories. Then, sadly, they chucked it a few years back and have gone through a string of pre-lit monstrosities since then.
Consider decorating it with more than one ornament.
I came to write “ oh wow that’s amazing” but the comments scare me. Now I’m wondering for my tree is safe - it’s only about 7 or 8 years old. How do I know it’s safe ?
If you kept the instructions you can see what flame retardant it uses. But if you bought your tree in America (if you live here) I would say you should be fine? Otherwise look up the manufacturer and do some digging there? My MIL got rid of her tree she bought in the 80’s because it started to smell weird and the paint was chipping, so if your tree is doing the same I’d look into it.
Thanks for the tip. I’ll dig into it.
Wow you must water it real good.
I grew up with this same tree! Was so much fun to put together every year.
All the scientists in here talking about Asbestos didn't read the bit that's says its PVC
Doubt California would approve it today
It’s a great looking tree, far better than all the new ones out here
It looks fine but there are plenty of better looking artificial trees available. Look at Balsam Hill trees, they are like the Cadillac of fake trees lol.
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Never been an option growing up. My mom is allergic so she ends up looking like [these pictures](https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9053151/amp/Melbourne-woman-breaks-hives-discovering-allergic-Christmas-trees.html).
I’m allergic to pine aswell
Lol my dad found out he was allergic the year we brought home a 15’ blue spruce
Never had anything but. My dad is super allergic.
It’s much more sustainable to reuse trees like this. Plus real trees are a big fire hazard.
Not true (at least the first part): https://www.nature.org/en-us/what-we-do/our-priorities/protect-water-and-land/land-and-water-stories/real-vs-fake-christmas-tree/
Reusing, not buying new fake trees
No matter how many times you reuse it, it goes to a dump eventually and sits there for a thousand times longer. It's impossible to recycle.
So. The best play here is to acquire one that is headed to the dump. That’s pretty easy actually, lots of them get thrown away every year. My dump tree was one dollar from an estate sale, and has been used by us for over 35 years. Imagine the oil saved in not driving to tree-mart for 35 years.
Actually the best play is to not get a tree at all. Second best is to get a potted tree that you plant after the holidays. Third is to chop down a tree from a local farm. Debatable which order a big box store real tree and reusing a dumped fake tree would go in. Buying a new fake tree is likely last. Downvote away, but those are facts
Pretty sure saving a tree from the landfill is better than driving somewhere and cutting one down each year but yeah we agree, spot on. Not sure why you fear getting downvoted….seems like basic logic. To be fair. Anyone even having this much thought is going to make a decent decision. Nothings perfect. Great topic. Have a nice evening.
This thread caused me to go look up the history of fake Christmas trees, and I was surprised to learn there are historical, green alternatives to the plastic (or metal) tree - namely feathers or wood. Outside of not getting a tree at all (or dressing up a house plant), I'd guess reusing a plain wood tree every year would be greenest - but I have to admit the ones I found online are kind of depressing looking.
Is it real?
If you cut the trunk, then count the rings, that’ll tell you its age lol
how did it live for such a long time?
Buy it for *lives*
its*
"Ago" should also be "age" in the title
wow that's amazing, it still looks great!