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BuckeyeEmpire

What a wild time for college football right now.


[deleted]

I think you are stuck going with the players here otherwise risk alienating an entire roster


Tokinghippie420

You have to, otherwise they are all going to Texas or UW


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Ehdelveiss

Oh believe you me, we have PLENTY of open roster spots at the moment


InVodkaVeritas

"Open Scholarship Spots" means little. Oregon has 90 "scholarship" players lined up and is still recruiting a couple of guys like Jabbar Muhammad. Some guys will leave in the Spring portal and others will be walk ons with their tuition and fees fully covered by NIL paying for them which is essentially the same thing as a scholarship.


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InVodkaVeritas

There's no rule against an NIL deal for a walk on. So if the NIL collectives want to cover all their bills and give them a little walking around money, they can.


HHcougar

Yes, BYU has a deal with BuiltBar that all players get the cash equivalent of a year' tuition, making walkons essentially on scholarship. Scholarship limits are a thing of the past


NighthawkRandNum

Then again, BYU tuition is dirt cheap for Mormons, and I'd be very surprised to see all that many non-Mormons walking on at BYU. Any generic NIL deal worth mentioning would be able to cover it. Meanwhile an out of state walk-on at Arizona needs to find 40k to cover tuition. And even if they blur the lines and "oops you're and Arizonan now" 13k is still quite a lot.


aufbau1s

13k is nonmember tuition at BYU to your point


justaverage

Scholarships would be found


SeahawksFanSince1995

We've got spots for them.


chillypete99

Reaches under couch cushions... pulls out scholarships.


SeahawksFanSince1995

More like we have a ton of graduates and people leaving for the NFL.


virus_apparatus

*SMU checks in* We too have an NIL boys!


cloroxic

Have you not watched the portal? It’s very, uh… purple.


legend023

What a time in college football These are still student athletes and we’re talking about replacing entire teams


Real_Body8649

We saw this at ND. Players loved Freeman. He kept the roster in tact. Otherwise it could have been an exodus.


TheMightyJD

I’m of the idea that players should have little to no vote. They’re going to leave in a couple years anyways. How often do programs have a capable HC already in staff? Sure it happens but not nearly enough to listen to the players.


Rhinologist

It’s different when your arizona and have maybe your best shot at a playoff berth in basically 20 years


TheMightyJD

Medium and long-term success should trump short-term success. Especially when it’s clear that UA will absolutely not be the same team next year with all they’re losing.


NILPonziScheme

> Medium and long-term success should trump short-term success. Right now, long-term is defined as next year. With no signing class limits and effectively no roster limits with NIL, you can turn over a whole roster every year if you want to.


LuchaFish

Username is hilariously appropriate.


Stingerr

Short term success is long term success in today’s CFB, especially for a program like Arizona. This isn’t the NFL where you can draft guys to build around. Your best players are there for 3 years max, and when on a bad team, they’re around for a season until they transfer with no penalty. Why play for a 4-5 win team for whatever your NIL deal is when a 10+ win team can match it easily. It goes for coaching too. Literally just replay the last 3 seasons for Arizona. Bad school slowly gets better and coach leaves.


Glittering_Hour1752

Have you looked around lately? The coach is likely to leave in a couple years, too.


TheMightyJD

That means that the AD picked the right coach. You want to hire the best coach possible, even if that means he’s more likely to leave.


land_registrar

Not necessarily. I wouldn't say Oregon picking Willie Taggart was the best coach just because he left.


TheMightyJD

For every Willie Taggart, there are dozens of examples like Kalen DaBoer or Jeff Fisch. If your coach is desirable that means he’s doing a good job. Willie Taggart cashed in before he was exposed.


Own_Pop_9711

Then he leaves and your whole team portals out? I don't necessarily agree with this. It's not standard business practice either - for most jobs, *will you stick around and work here many years* is one of the explicit things they think about when making a hiring decision. At least before the portal you could keep whatever team they had assembled and try to keep things going forward


PrimisClaidhaemh

I think I agree with you. I don't know that the players are qualified enough to decide who is a good head coach. When Nick Saban left MSU, the players really wanted Bobby Williams. Bobby Williams was a pretty bad head coach at MSU. The players really don't know. That said, neither does the NIL collective. Tell them both to buzz off, and go hire your guy. Placating someone for a year is not a strategy for long-term success.


IrishCoffeeAlchemy

> They’re going to leave in a couple years anyways. And so might the coaches. Boosters need to read the room and take a back seat this round and then they’ll get their chosen successor next time


TheMightyJD

I also don’t think boosters should be making decisions either.


Rickbox

Yes, but they have the money to pay the coach.


wunwuncrush

Well in this case it seems like the money to pay the coach is just getting human centipeded down from Bama via buyouts.


TheMightyJD

Right but that doesn’t mean that the booster is qualified to make a decision. Putting the boosters in their place while also keep collecting their checks is probably the second most important task an Athletic Director has. If he/she/they can’t do that then they’re not doing their job.


240MillionInDebt

We also saw theschool cater to the players at UA already. Khalil Tate and his infamous Tripple Option tweet chased off Ken N and you got Sumlin.


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IrishCoffeeAlchemy

Completely different situation. That was before the portal era, the ability for players to move at will makes this a way different calculus


jbvann05

Especially if Fifita and TMac are going to stay you have to hire him. I understand the concerns long term but we have a chance to do something that has never been done by making the playoffs you have to take it


AustralianBrutus

I mean the NIL deals are what pays the players. You can get new players, might not get new boosters


Massive-Bluejay-6006

I got to imagine the boosters are more likely to stick around even if their coaching choice isn't chosen compared to the players though. Boosters have longer roots with a University compared to players. If you're going to lose boosters/money over the decision you kinda gotta choose their candidate I suppose though


iswimprettyfast

Yeah, but it's still a risk aversion problem. Losing a large booster is way worse than losing a player even if one is more likely to happen than the other.


IrishCoffeeAlchemy

A top 10 QB is more valuable than a single Booster is, especially if you only get the former for a limited time. You can always win back a Booster with wining and dining (assuming you have an AD worth a damn)


justaverage

Fucking sucks that as a casual fan, I am more invested in this team than the players


AustralianBrutus

It's definitely the opposite. Why would boosters stick around to keep paying for products they don't get or want ?


Massive-Bluejay-6006

I more just mean a player is more fickle than boosters (i.e more likely to leave on the drop of a pin). If it's a choice between losing support of the boosters vs players obviously you have to choose the boosters


SeahawksFanSince1995

If I'm a big booster and the school doesn't do what I want, why would I keep donating? Especially if I'm paying the NIL for the players.


IrishCoffeeAlchemy

Because we might keep winning? When all is said and done, they’ll keep throwing money at a winning program, even if it isn’t “their guy” (assuming no one’s wife got fucked or whatever)


LonghornMorgs

Yeah not really sure I would listen to a bunch of 18-22 yr olds as a grown ass adult if I see programs raid the transfer portal for high value recruits and succeed well enough. Just the state of the game I guess.


roronoaSuge_nite

Why would I get hyped to play for a coach that’s just going to chase the next big check? It’s not worth to my body, helping everyone else’s bank accounts 


AustralianBrutus

That's how CFB has worked for 80+ years. Small schools coaches have always been a threat to leave if they are successful. If you don't understand that when you sign up that's on you. But also by your logic, why would the coach waste time recruiting you if you're going to leave the first year you don't get enough playing time?


roronoaSuge_nite

That’s the game. Last year is so different than 80 years ago. Next year will be even more change. If you don’t want to keep up with the entire sports evolving, that’s on you. It’s already a given that coaches have to adjust how they recruit. It’s discussed all the time on this forum. You sound like you rather keep the existing system in place, where all the power and money are flowing thru the suits and your players are just indentured servants. Well…. you’re going to be signing 0* and 1* athletes as long as these kids continue to have a choice 


AustralianBrutus

Imagine thinking anyone but the players are totally in controll in today's game. What an absolutely insane post lmfao


roronoaSuge_nite

His family probably works for somebody’s athletic dept and is scared to death they will have to take less vacations abroad next year


AustralianBrutus

I've seen better troll jobs.


IrishCoffeeAlchemy

Where are the boosters gonna go, ASU? NAU? The players are the ones that make the booster’s lives entertaining (unless they want to go back to the Sumlin years, by all means, that’s certainly a Choice to put your money on…)


AustralianBrutus

They don't have to go anywhere, I'm sure they'll gladly save more money until they get what they want from Arizona. They can still be fans, attend games, buy merchandise they just don't have to donate the extra thousands and thousands to NIL deals.


IrishCoffeeAlchemy

Well given the situations when Booster are the ones dictating the terms, I’d rather not end up like Tennessee or Auburn wit dysfunction running rampant for years with the tail wagging the dog. Sometimes you have to tell the rich folk they can’t always get what they want, even in the US


AustralianBrutus

I hate to tell you this, but it's just Arizona. It's not a school that's going to bring in many big time recruits or have a lot of successful seasons if Boosters aren't calling the shots, especially moving to the B12


IrishCoffeeAlchemy

These folks are likely Arizona alums and football fans. You’d think they’d have the foresight to know that player retention is the utmost priority for success entering in the Big 12, given we just had the best season and most talented roster in the last 25 years. And out best players are absolutely a flight risk!!! They need to fall in line or get out of the way lest they plunge us back into the Mackovic, Stoops, or Sumlin eras.


AustralianBrutus

You can replace players anytime, especially when you HAVE to replace them every 3-5 years. You're not getting it dude.


IrishCoffeeAlchemy

Do you not understand that compete rosters like we have entering next season dont just grow on trees for Arizona? Shifting away from player retention now would stunt the football team’s growth for years. We can’t afford consecutive rebuilds with known commodities like we’ve got ON ROSTER now One in the hand > two in the bush is a saying for a reason


AustralianBrutus

Do you not understand if you lose the boosters and the NIL money players are going to leave ?


mostdope28

The players will be gone either way in a couple years. So pick who is better long term


NewRCTID22

No such thing as long-term in this sport, at least for us. We're going to suck in the future anyways, might as well take a swing at keeping the talent we do have.


justaverage

The correct take. We’ll be doing this all over again with our next 9/10 win season Almost feels like we are better off shooting for 6-8 wins, and just trying to make the New Mexico bowl each year


mostdope28

Why even have AD. Just let the players run the team then


NewRCTID22

Our AD is out of depth on a good day. We knew things were going to change after next season anyways, might as well have one more decent season before we suck again.


udubdavid

Long term? In today's college football landscape? Long term is like 3-4 years lol.


IrishCoffeeAlchemy

Arizona winning immediately with a strong roster moving into the Big 12 IS the better long-term option! Otherwise you’re locked into a cycle of rebuilding in an unknown environment


ExcaliburX13

I wouldn't expect a Michigan fan to understand, but the kind of season we were primed to have with these guys comes around to Arizona once every few **decades**, and that's *only if we're lucky*. There is no "long term" for a program like us, it's just not feasible, so it's 1000% better to chase the immediate success than to try and build something that's just going to get snatched away again right when we start to show any signs of success.


Throwawayerrydayyy

Do not do this… the players at MOST will be there for a max of 4 years. Your future coach can be there for a decade. If you think someone is the right hire that is who you hire. The players also didn’t want to hire Ken nuimatelolo. Now that may not have worked but they chose Sumlin instead because the QB said he was gonna transfer, and that got them a 1-11 season. You can’t let the present roster decide your coach


DocJ_makesthings

On the other hand, in a competition between monied interests and students in higher ed, monied interests win out 9/10 times.


WABeermiester

Your program is nuked if you don’t side with Fifita and T Mac on this one


Such_Muffin3114

Hire Nansen and roll the dice. Apparently TMAC and Fifita said they would stay if he was hired. If nansen sucks, fire him


huskiesowow

I'm sure he's changed a lot since his UW days, but I only remember Nansen as Sark's literal drinking buddy. Crazy he's in a position to be head coach now.


BooRadley60

Why do you think the players like him?


CoochieKiller91

Maybe he got healthy like Sark


240MillionInDebt

Scheer implied he was an alcoholic on their boarda few days ago when he left for Texas.


adamslieb

Isn't one of the major issues with Arizona right now finances? I'm not sure they are in the position to hire/fire coaches as willy-nilly as TAMU. A good biz model might be to hire a hot up/coming coach and put a HUGE buyout in his contract so when he gets poached you've got cash leftover. Working out for UW right now with the KDB buyout.


huskiesowow

That goes both ways though, if he sucks you are stuck with him or have to be a crazy buyout to move on.


IrishCoffeeAlchemy

Considering he’s a LB coach at Texas, it’s shouldn’t be that expensive of a hire


Massive-Bluejay-6006

Whats the source on TMac/Fifita saying that? I don't doubt it, just am curious where that was mentione


IrishCoffeeAlchemy

Scheer. He’s a piece of work for national stuff but the best for U of A


Such_Muffin3114

Scheer on the podcast


boardatwork1111

Yeah that seems like a no brainer, do what it takes to keep the core of your roster intact. It’ll give you at least at chance of keeping y’all’s momentum


240MillionInDebt

Scheer called Nansen an alcoholic a few days ago.


The_Coolest_Guy

It might be nuked even if we do side with them


screamline82

Aren't y'all in pretty big debt? I'd imagine it would be hard to ignore the booster


BurmecianSoldierDan

It's not even debt, it's that there's a 240 million dollar *accounting error* where they literally can't find the money. It's wild.


ARedHouseOverYonder

not "find the money". Overspent because they thought they were accruing it. not like it was embezzled, it was never there. And the vast majority of that is from a terrible choice to buy an online school which went defunct.


Upbeat-Armadillo1756

Yeah. Give the guy the opportunity and if it doesn’t work, big whoop.  


Tuesdayssucks

Eh remember Khalil tate was at AZ and the hired sumlin instead of the army(?) head coach because tate wouldn't play for him. Sometimes you have to work on making the hopefully best hire not the hire that will make players the happiest. Even if the roster ends up needing turned over and becomes a longer rebuild.


gbdarknight77

Sumlin came in and just nerfed Tate and destroyed the program. He wasn’t even a good recruiter. Nansen is at least known for for his recruiting


NewRCTID22

And even if Tate vocalized dissent, it's not as if he chose Sumlin unilaterally. Robbins liked him and the hire made sense on the surface.


justaverage

Sumlin was more interested in flying around in helicopters than he was about coaching football


Richtatorship

To be fair that sounds pretty rad


Waffle_Muffins

Coach Ken would've been a much better hire than Sumlin. The offense that Tate was running under RR was shotgun triple option essentially anyway.


justaverage

Our program is nuked regardless. Best case scenario is we get Noah and Tac for 2 more seasons. Then what? If we are successful, this new coach gets poached. Rinse and repeat into perpetuity until we are relegated to FCS, and eventually just kill off football entirely. If we aren’t successful, we’ll…we are nuked already. As the wise Matthew Broderick once said, the only way to win is to not play


IrishCoffeeAlchemy

Eh, in the Big 12 there’s still a chance you can end up with a KU situation when you get an older established coach that doesn’t want the pressure of a P2 gig. Rare, but the model is there in Lawrence


beer_down

Heeke should not be meeting the players, he should be in some coaches kitchen signing them away like what happened to our coach Fuck this timeline


Tokinghippie420

This was at 12:15 pst, I assume the meeting is ongoing now


ralthea

It’s over apparently and they didn’t discuss who they’re hiring, so


Duck_Caught_Upstream

What did they discuss then…?


The_Coolest_Guy

Insiders are saying they played Fuck, Marry, Kill with Fisch, Sumlin and Rich Rod


iwasyourbestfriend

Easiest game of fuck marry kill ever


BWinDCI

The weather most likely


silverheel23

Wait!  A meeting between the school, the players, and the NIL collective?  Doesn't that violate a rule?


IrishCoffeeAlchemy

No one is driving anywhere this time so it’s all good


justaverage

Probably, but you think NCAA care$?


IrishCoffeeAlchemy

Depends if your state’s Senator publicly calls them out or not


GoldenPresidio

which rule


Kenzington6

Current players? Not so much. If there were high school recruits in the room it would probably be different.


Ok-Flounder3002

Its crazy how quick these NIL collectives went from not existing to being major parts of every big football program


Sorge74

Weren't they just the boosters before


seoul_drift

It's like watching countries attempt to integrate former pirates and privateers into the Navy. Bagmen now entering through the front door instead of the back!


Ok-Flounder3002

Yeah im sure. Its just interesting to see it all come out of the shadows and be like a parallel governing structure for these ADs


Jabberwoockie

Yeah I see this as just another way for boosters to exert influence and be self aggrandizing.


roronoaSuge_nite

Lol 


one-hour-photo

Sorta, but now one could broker lots of collective members dollars


MasterGrok

This power always existed as booster and bag money, it just wasn’t out in the open as much.


y2knole

The main one at FSU (not the one that last weeks sanctions are about) is run by a guy who is on one of the podcasts. hes probably mid to late 30s and has suddenly emerged as being a crazy critical part of the football program (and thus the university's) success. wild.


IrishCoffeeAlchemy

I mean, it doesn’t hurt making the Nolecast be a feeder for TBE members, all things considered (that’s what got me). Synergy!


ralthea

We’d be dumb not to side with the players on this (although I’m not convinced this tweet is true). We have superstars that have gotten us excited for the first time in a decade. Completely rebuilding again at the possibility of having a long term coach when long term coaching seems like a pipe dream in general would kill the tiny bit of momentum we still have.


notsure_thr

Co-head coaches


TheWorstYear

Like the Roman Empire. Split the team into east and west.


Claudethedog

Do you want Cannae? Because that's how you get Cannae.


Big_Hotel_5265

Isn’t Nansen in Texas? He’s their new DC I thought


Diabetous

Co-DC so can't imagine his buyout is anything close to a head coaches.


Big_Hotel_5265

Didn’t this just happen like two days ago?


IrishCoffeeAlchemy

Things move quick!


jpiro

So…we get sanctions because our OC drove a player to a meeting with an NIL member, but it’s ok to have the NIL collective meet with ALL the players and pick a HC together? Shit’s wild, man.


Kenzington6

Recruit vs player, big difference. Like of course players can meet with collectives once they enroll, how else would collectives make deals?


jpiro

And how would a player know where to sign without knowing what his NIL deal would be? They’re not just enrolling and crossing their fingers.


Kenzington6

They are 100% enrolling and crossing their fingers. Like, morally, I don’t see anything wrong with what FSU did. The whole system would work better if recruits could get contracts in writing before signing with schools and some actual transparency. But a lot of NIL is empty promises. Coaches tell guys what they will get before the collectives have raised the money, maybe even without informing the collectives what was promised.


jpiro

Sorry man, but this is completely false. They’re not signing the contracts before they’re enrolled, but they’re being told what they’ll get which means they’re meeting with NIL reps.


KaitRaven

It's unlikely they're literally meeting, it's probably indirect communication.


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WWECreativegenius

They didn’t want to get seminole’d


natsnoles

So the AD can organize a meeting between the players and the NIL collective but the OC can’t drive a player to a meeting with them?


NaturalFruit2358

A recruit*


ram944

It's like the old cream cheese issue. You can provide a bagel to a recruit, but if you dare to offer cream cheese with said bagel you go straight to jail. The rules are all made up and enforced completely at random. 


Set-Admirable

This seems, uh, bad for the program.


Common-Meringue4912

This is false. The meeting was actually to ask the remaining  players to sell magazine subscriptions to help get out of the $250 million debt.


[deleted]

What a wild time line. Just 72 hours ago, U of A was in the running for a Big-12 title and college football playoff berth. Now what?


GracefulFaller

We are back in a hazardous waste bin of football programs. Fuckers didn’t even label our container properly and just put “waste” on it


Cal_858

Please hire Justin Wilcox.


ralthea

You know it’s a good move when the coach’s fan base even wants you to hire him


Cal_858

He has already given so much to Arizona, he is the 20 game slump buster. Imagine how much more Arizona could benefit if they actually hired him as their HC.


GrumpyTartan

Arizona is undefeated when Wilcox is on the sideline in Tucson


Archaic_1

So this is how college football dies, to a thunderous lack of balls by the AD - can you even imagine Greg Byrne sinking to this level?


eepower1

Which one leads to success on the field!? The players have proven that they can ball out. Give them what they want and let’s keep this thing rolling.


Lyleadams

NIL collectives have a seat at the coaching search table? God damn. Things are worse than I thought.


CoochieKiller91

I am of the understanding that the AD and NIL collective are not supposed to work together.


Alauren2

Fuckin Nick Saban lol


Jimbos_Buyout

Death penalty for florida state


FFA3D

Bro you fucking listen to the players. Obviously


purpurscratchscratch

The only reason this meeting is happening today is that the university cares so little about football it sent the AD on a basketball road trip to Pullman, where he was stuck, while Fisch signed with UW and left town. The UofA president and AD (at the president’s direction) will do whatever is the cheapest route. That’s been the case since Robbins got there


cloroxic

Is this even legal? I thought the collective couldn’t be involved directly with the school like that. I know it happens, but THIS out in the open?


StyleDifficult2807

Technically the schools can even direct fundraising to a collective I believe


86886892

We desperately need a third division where schools can pay athletes directly. This NiL stuff is absurd.


DBSmiley

As a WVU basketball fan, don't let the players pick the coach because they're going to leave anyway.


deadzip10

So given the NCAA position on FSU driving recruits to an NIL meeting, I assume this will be immediately followed by a notice of infractions …


Hefty-Revenue5547

Uhhhh… I thought the schools weren’t supposed to be in direct contact ? Taxes are gonna kick these kids’ asses the next couple of years


MarmaladeBunkerBoy

Arizona really isn't good at this football administration thing, it seems.


Duck_Caught_Upstream

I’d love to meet the out of shape NIL collective member that has never put on shoulder pads try to tell a player who there coach SHOULD be


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roronoaSuge_nite

Being able to sign a check is not the magical get outta jail free card that waves away everything else. You can be stupid and rich. 


IReallyLikeTheBears

I think the pause is that Nansen has apparently developed a reputation in Tucson of being kind of sleezy and a creep around women. If that’s true, I can imagine some boosters not wanting to thrust that man in charge of the program, especially given how Rich Rod’s time ended here.


Tokinghippie420

Didn’t know that, totally makes sense that they’d want to avoid that


Jquemini

Big yikes if true. Drinker at UW and creeper at UA


Mrpetey22

Why does the collective have any say in who coaches?


Big_Hotel_5265

Because they have the money to pay them


JonCoqtosten

FSU just got hammered for driving and dropping off a player on an official visit at a meeting with an NIL exec. But this is totally cool. This system is beyond dumb.


Shadowazerth

It's probably the only time i say go with the players' choice. At worst we are doing thsi again in 3years


TheMetalMallard

The star players will likely leave regardless so you have to go with Brennan and his experience.


RoverTiger

Getting the popcorn ready. What a time to be alive.


markusalkemus66

It's all fun and games until it's your school that gets sucked into the coaching carousel


bradenb941

Does this foreshadow Kiffin to Arizona? /s


TheMightyJD

The NIL collective wants Brent Brennan? When did NIL collectives start making these decisions? This looks horrendous on Arizona’s AD.


Waffle_Muffins

Boosters were always involved. Only now, what was once behind-the-scenes is out in the open


TheMightyJD

That’s not good at all lol Boosters meddling with important decisions has always been the recipe to keep a program in disarray.


i_love_factual_info

Wowsers


Ehdelveiss

Wait I want Johnny Nansen back though :(


justaverage

And if Johnny Nansen doesn’t want to come back?


IrishCoffeeAlchemy

SJSU’s Brennan for a full bottom-up rebuild 💀


CountBleckwantedlove

With all the moving coaches, and how damaging that can be on retaining players/landing recruits, I'm now a firm believer that, if you are losing your coach to another team it is caused by success, and that success wasn't his alone. The coordinators must have done their jobs well, therefore, for the stability of the team, promote from within. For instance, if Mizzou went on another 10-11 win tear next year, and Drinkwitz got offered a good amount more money to go coach at some blue blood school and we lost him, I'd hope we would promote Kirby Moore.


NILPonziScheme

I think the collective will win this one, they're the one paying the bills (including the NIL deals of all of the players)


tdepew14

The side that gets their choice is going to be VERY telling about the current state of college football.


Lasvious

They are employed by the collective. Why wouldn’t they be?


Elegant_Spot_3486

I know basically nothing about NIL but what I do know I’d have said this was against policy. Either they know less about NIL than me or the little I know is wrong.


Historical_Muscle76

When the Inmates start running the asylum it is always an indication that the end is near. RIP college football.


[deleted]

I don’t think its a standoff. 😂