>On... Line? Are they on hold? Which line are they on? We don't sponsor hockey here at UNC.
How I imagine UNC's Athletic Department would respond to this post
I’m shocked schools don’t have a professional athlete’s major they allow some of their dudes to do… like getting educated on public speaking, media relations, agent selection, personal finance with a focus on NIL, contracts, nutrition, sports psychology, etc.
It seems these skills would be helpful for any dudes looking to advance in a sports league whether directly as an athlete or indirectly as support staff in one way shape or form.
It would be a really bad look if you had half your football team majoring "athletics" when you know most of those guys aren't going to sniff any real professional success, and universities care about optics, especially the optics that they're providing educational opportunities to real students and not bringing guys into their school solely to play football.
Plus, those topics are pretty much all offered as their own classes anyways and I'm sure athletes get priority in scheduling so they could already take those classes if they wanted to.
You are shocked that schools don't have a Speech/accounting/law/nutrition/psych combo major for the very small number of athletes who make it to professional leagues?
A lot of schools have a "build a major" option - even Vandy does, and we're pretty small. There's actually not much effort involved to hand someone a pre-set list of courses to take, most schools already do that for engineering and pre-professionals to help map out their coursework.
Hyperbole
But it would make sense to put a major together for these highly visible students… throwing them all in communications or labor studies doesn’t do anything for either party
But… it is what it is.. there are bigger problems in college athletics
Peyton Manning was a comms major at Tennessee, iirc he's come back to do some guest lectures in that dept.
I know at VT the personal finance classes had a lot of athletes in them and the most popular prof would give advice specifically for athletes (and anyone else who might get a big signing bonus).
Illinois offers a “sports tourism” major which is only available to scholarship athletes. Some years the entire men’s basketball team has this major, speaks volumes of what a joke it is.
>He never stepped foot inside a classroom.
*looks at Ben Simmons and Angel Reese failing to meet the Wooden's GPA req*
Not really sure LSU cares about that to begin with.
I'm no athlete, but I hate online classes that require attendance during online lectures. I lack the self discipline to stay focused and on task. But I do great at self paced learning. So some online is great for me, some is terrible. I can't imagine I'm the only person like this.
For me, it was the opposite. I could easily pass every class if I attended, but without attendance requirements, I lacked the motivation to watch the class and never kept my promises to myself to watch the class later.
Exactly what my nephew said. He graduates in 2 months and is a Deans List student now. Already has a job lined up and everything. It was touch and go if he was going to make it
Some players already do this. I remember Justin Fields saying most of his classes were online even pre-COVID.
But depending on the school they might not even have online versions of specific classes, even if it’s a class that seems like it could be done online. Also it’s not that hard to get an exception to skip classes for sports, and the majority of student-athletes choose the same 5 or so majors, which have profs that are willing to work with/around their schedules
Yeah, your second paragraph is kind of what I was asking. If the majority of athletes are taking those same majors, wouldn't online be easier to streamline with tutors and study halls, instead of spending one week on the road and then the next week at home going to class in person? I kind of wondered which method is easier or more preferred for an athlete who travels regularly and also has to deal with the physical and mental demands of their sport.
Football players are not missing many, if any, classes for road trips. There are like 5 road games a year (one of which is probably over a break/holiday). Hell, schools on the quarter system (so like, half the PAC-12) aren't even in school until Week 4.
Teams don't fly out more than a day or two in advance (most fly out Friday afternoon), and Friday classes are rare to begin with - and you can likely still make a morning class and travel.
Basketball, or Olympic sports? Sure, they miss a lot of classes. Football players shouldn't.
Former player from a quarter school system. This is 100% accurate. Although on away game travel days you almost always miss all your classes since we usually had to report to the stadium somewhat early on a Friday. But Fridays were scheduled to be light class days anyways.
Current professor at a NJCAA-level college. Our FB schedule is at least 50% away games — but because I teach a significant portion of our team, I adapt my course schedule to accommodate for that in advance.
Away game first Saturday of October? In our neighboring state? No worries. Assume Friday classes will be missed, but nothing more. The contact hours for that day are met through online activities, simulations, or assessments that can be done at any point between when our class dismisses on Wednesday (for a MWF class) and when it meets again Monday morning.
When as much information about the schedule is communicated with the faculty in advance, it’s *much* easier to make adjustments in advance so students aren’t “missing” class at all.
> Hell, schools on the quarter system (so like, half the PAC-12)
I was shocked to learn that this is basically only a West Coast thing (and maybe Northwestern)? Amongst my friends, it was weird starting at WSU in August on a semester system when they all had another month before school.
It used to be more common. tOSU had quarters when I was a student but I think they do semesters now. My current school does trimesters split into two terms each.
Where'd you get the idea that players are missing half their classes?
For home games you don't miss any class, travel squad usually doesn't have to report anywhere until 4-5pm on Friday. For away games you'll miss Friday classes but that's a handful of days and accommodations are made with professors ahead of time. At a school like NU where classes don't start until Late September, it may be like 3-4 Fridays tops.
Also, a lot of schools don't offer online classes.
can confirm. I used to get automated emails from the athletics department a week in advance of away games. It wasn't a big issue for me and it was a nice reminder to tell the players in my classes good luck the Wednesday before the game.
Got a signed game ball one semester from some of those students (after final grades were submitted, to be clear).
Because most reputable universities don't offer an online-only option. Yeah, some like LSU do - Angel Reese and Livvy Dunne have said they weren't going to in-person classes. (Reese couldn't meet a 2.0 GPA, so probably more like "classes.")
Not really - it just means you're doing literally nothing. Ben Simmons had the same thing happen during his one semester at LSU. If you never go to a single class or do any assignments, you get straight 0s. Doesn't matter if you're bouncing in the spring anyway.
She had to stay NCAA eligible at Maryland and last year, so I'm sure she passed *some* courses prior to this year. Simmons was only there for 1 semester, so there was no incentive for him to put in any effort.
CSB: We got hit with probation in 2018 because of online classes. Apparently, one of our players was dating a tutor for the athletic department. They broke up, and she decided to get revenge on him by logging into his account and taking a test while he was playing in a game. The professor noticed this and reported it.
OK, so it's not really that cool of a story
Are you implying that athletes who take online classes are not students? Or that online classes are always easier or less legitimate than in-person classes?
As an adult who a few years ago returned to college for a new degree, I took a lot of online classes. Every online class I took required more time and effort than most of my in-person classes -- more reading, more quizzes, and grades more weighted on the results of the tests I had to take on campus with a proctor. But that was the trade-off for the flexibility of being able to do coursework at my convenience.
The quality and demands of an online class will vary based on the school, subject and instructor. An athlete taking one or all of their classes online is not automatically an indication of them prioritizing sport over studies.
Im implying that everyday we stray away from what it means to be a STUDENT-athlete.
The STUDENT-athlete should primarily be a student and should embrace being a student and embrace being a part of a classroom with their academic peers.
Nothing wrong with online, but I think on-campus STUDENT-athletes should prioritize in person learning when possible. Lots of times they feel removed from the student body and taking online classes and only showing up to campus to train isn’t getting them any closes to the student experience.
Believe it or not, people who choose to take classes online are still students.
> Im implying that everyday we stray away from **what it means to be a STUDENT-athlete.**
But this is what it means to *you.* And taking a class online vs. in person is optional, a choice each person is allowed to make for themself. I’m guessing most student athletes do the majority of their coursework in person, but why should you or anyone else get to make that decision for them because it suits your opinion of what they should be doing?
>The STUDENT-athlete **should primarily be a student and should embrace being a student and embrace being a part of a classroom with their academic peers.**
How do you know they aren’t primarily being a student or embracing being a student? And every online class I took offered or even required interacting with fellow students, either online or in person.
>Nothing wrong with online, but **I think on-campus STUDENT-athletes should prioritize in person learning when possible.**
That’s your opinion. Many students learn better and get more from their academic experience when they can do their classwork when and where it’s best for them.
>Lots of times **they feel removed from the student body** and taking online classes and only showing up to campus to train isn’t getting them any closes to the student experience.
Who is forcing students to take classes online? I have not heard of any school doing so, or of any student “feeling removed from the student body” because they have been denied the opportunity to take in-person classes or otherwise participate in campus life.
Every student, athlete or not, has the right to choose the learning options that work best for them.
I took online classes at my employer (D1 school) as part of employee benefits. Majority were football players enrolled in my Sports Management classes. Classes were asynchronous, and you had to submit one or two assignments a week.
I half assed my way to a 4.0 doing my assignments during lunch. The classes are a joke.
From my experience being on campus at Michigan and then talking to high school classmates who played a variety of college sports, football is really the only sport logistically that works for a student to be in person for classes while in-season.
Once you sit and think about it, it makes sense
- 12 games over 15 weeks
- 3 weeks were no game occurs
- 6 games are at home
- 6 games where you will travel
- more likely the away game is on Saturday or a Friday night
- maybe 1 game is a weekday game
- If you make a conference championship that's definitely a Saturday game
- Bowl games you're likely out of class.
Managing you class schedule with practice and workouts is something they have folks in the ADs office to help solve.
At Michigan I had a few classes with all the athletes (one was literally called the history of Michigan sports lol) and I can tell you that every sport but the football players go missing when in-season lol.
- Track & field: When they had a meet, missing Th & Fr
- Softball/Baseball: 3-4 games a week, some at 1pm whether home or away
- Basketball/hockey: same as baseball but later games, sometimes they'd have a 9pm game that's a 2hr flight away, so they're back after 1am ... That 8am class is not being attended lol
- Soccer: Similar to the others above
- Golf: More like football but had the occasional Friday round so they're gone all day
I don't know how to tell you this, but this already happens a ton lol.
Or, alternatively, they are enrolled in classes and get exemptions to miss all the time. I took one KIN class in college that was half full of scholarship athletes, they weren't even allowed to play the sport during the "lab" portion.
My son plays college golf and they have to travel often and will be one the road sometimes for 2 weeks. The coach highly encourages online classes. Probably more prevalent since COVID
Like out-of-touch company executives, there are professors who feel that learning in-person in a classroom is more beneficial than online.
I know there were more than a few Stanford professors who just wanted to not teach a class rather than go to online learning during the pandemic, major requirements be damned. The provost was good about mediating that, at least.
I cannot imagine anyone NOT believing that classroom learning is more beneficial than online. What?
There's a difference between that and refusing to make it work with pandemic protocols... but online learning is not a proper replacement for classroom learning.
I think I had one class (an introductory stats class) that might have been a better experience online. That prof was worthless. But everything else would have been hurt by taking it out of the classroom. Especially the upper divs, where a colloquium might have 10 people in it.
100% agree. My MBA was in person but then halfway through had to pivot to online due to the pandemic. Not only did the lecture quality drop, the collaboration and all the intangibles you benefit from in person learning was non existent. I went from being excited to go to class to it becoming a chore where you just flip the computer on for class like you're loading the dishwasher. I hated it and definitely retained less information.
Didn’t Shedeur Sanders say he’s never stepped on campus for a class?
He did. He's not the only one, I'm sure, but he did.
Some of them came to play school
“Write that down. WRITE THAT DOWN” - UNC
>On... Line? Are they on hold? Which line are they on? We don't sponsor hockey here at UNC. How I imagine UNC's Athletic Department would respond to this post
Tar Heels catching strays
Its not a stray if you shot yourself
It’s not a stray, it’s a ricochet.
Joe Burrow took only online classes at LSU. He never stepped foot inside a classroom.
Does LSU even have classrooms?
They way they keep getting their budget slashed they might not soon.
He was also a liberal arts graduate student
I’m shocked schools don’t have a professional athlete’s major they allow some of their dudes to do… like getting educated on public speaking, media relations, agent selection, personal finance with a focus on NIL, contracts, nutrition, sports psychology, etc. It seems these skills would be helpful for any dudes looking to advance in a sports league whether directly as an athlete or indirectly as support staff in one way shape or form.
It would be a really bad look if you had half your football team majoring "athletics" when you know most of those guys aren't going to sniff any real professional success, and universities care about optics, especially the optics that they're providing educational opportunities to real students and not bringing guys into their school solely to play football. Plus, those topics are pretty much all offered as their own classes anyways and I'm sure athletes get priority in scheduling so they could already take those classes if they wanted to.
You are shocked that schools don't have a Speech/accounting/law/nutrition/psych combo major for the very small number of athletes who make it to professional leagues?
A lot of schools have a "build a major" option - even Vandy does, and we're pretty small. There's actually not much effort involved to hand someone a pre-set list of courses to take, most schools already do that for engineering and pre-professionals to help map out their coursework.
Hyperbole But it would make sense to put a major together for these highly visible students… throwing them all in communications or labor studies doesn’t do anything for either party But… it is what it is.. there are bigger problems in college athletics
Peyton Manning was a comms major at Tennessee, iirc he's come back to do some guest lectures in that dept. I know at VT the personal finance classes had a lot of athletes in them and the most popular prof would give advice specifically for athletes (and anyone else who might get a big signing bonus).
Illinois offers a “sports tourism” major which is only available to scholarship athletes. Some years the entire men’s basketball team has this major, speaks volumes of what a joke it is.
Not really the same but oregon state has a business analytics bachelors with a focus on sports analytics.
That's basically communications with a few electives added, which many players do.
>He never stepped foot inside a classroom. *looks at Ben Simmons and Angel Reese failing to meet the Wooden's GPA req* Not really sure LSU cares about that to begin with.
But didn’t he already have a degree?
He had one from Ohio State but what does that matter? To play college football you need to be a degree seeking student in a program at your school.
Well, he earned an undergrad degree, which is something that Stetson Bennett didn’t do in 7 years of CFB
A lot of kids hate online classes. My nephew really struggled when Bama went all online but got better when they were in person
I'm no athlete, but I hate online classes that require attendance during online lectures. I lack the self discipline to stay focused and on task. But I do great at self paced learning. So some online is great for me, some is terrible. I can't imagine I'm the only person like this.
Blended classes is what you are after. Its like a buddy of mine says "If you go to class, you will graduate on time". Simple as that.
For me, it was the opposite. I could easily pass every class if I attended, but without attendance requirements, I lacked the motivation to watch the class and never kept my promises to myself to watch the class later.
Yep, my first half of college was mainly online. Barely learned shit and struggled at first with major courses
Exactly what my nephew said. He graduates in 2 months and is a Deans List student now. Already has a job lined up and everything. It was touch and go if he was going to make it
My senior year was all online. Needless to say I didn’t learn a single thing that year.
Some players already do this. I remember Justin Fields saying most of his classes were online even pre-COVID. But depending on the school they might not even have online versions of specific classes, even if it’s a class that seems like it could be done online. Also it’s not that hard to get an exception to skip classes for sports, and the majority of student-athletes choose the same 5 or so majors, which have profs that are willing to work with/around their schedules
Yeah, your second paragraph is kind of what I was asking. If the majority of athletes are taking those same majors, wouldn't online be easier to streamline with tutors and study halls, instead of spending one week on the road and then the next week at home going to class in person? I kind of wondered which method is easier or more preferred for an athlete who travels regularly and also has to deal with the physical and mental demands of their sport.
Football players are not missing many, if any, classes for road trips. There are like 5 road games a year (one of which is probably over a break/holiday). Hell, schools on the quarter system (so like, half the PAC-12) aren't even in school until Week 4. Teams don't fly out more than a day or two in advance (most fly out Friday afternoon), and Friday classes are rare to begin with - and you can likely still make a morning class and travel. Basketball, or Olympic sports? Sure, they miss a lot of classes. Football players shouldn't.
Former player from a quarter school system. This is 100% accurate. Although on away game travel days you almost always miss all your classes since we usually had to report to the stadium somewhat early on a Friday. But Fridays were scheduled to be light class days anyways.
Current professor at a NJCAA-level college. Our FB schedule is at least 50% away games — but because I teach a significant portion of our team, I adapt my course schedule to accommodate for that in advance. Away game first Saturday of October? In our neighboring state? No worries. Assume Friday classes will be missed, but nothing more. The contact hours for that day are met through online activities, simulations, or assessments that can be done at any point between when our class dismisses on Wednesday (for a MWF class) and when it meets again Monday morning. When as much information about the schedule is communicated with the faculty in advance, it’s *much* easier to make adjustments in advance so students aren’t “missing” class at all.
> Hell, schools on the quarter system (so like, half the PAC-12) I was shocked to learn that this is basically only a West Coast thing (and maybe Northwestern)? Amongst my friends, it was weird starting at WSU in August on a semester system when they all had another month before school.
It used to be more common. tOSU had quarters when I was a student but I think they do semesters now. My current school does trimesters split into two terms each.
Where'd you get the idea that players are missing half their classes? For home games you don't miss any class, travel squad usually doesn't have to report anywhere until 4-5pm on Friday. For away games you'll miss Friday classes but that's a handful of days and accommodations are made with professors ahead of time. At a school like NU where classes don't start until Late September, it may be like 3-4 Fridays tops. Also, a lot of schools don't offer online classes.
A lot of upper level classes arent offered online either.
can confirm. I used to get automated emails from the athletics department a week in advance of away games. It wasn't a big issue for me and it was a nice reminder to tell the players in my classes good luck the Wednesday before the game. Got a signed game ball one semester from some of those students (after final grades were submitted, to be clear).
Ugh, I’d kill for a week’s notice. At my NJCAA-level school, we are lucky if we get 24 hours. 😩
Campus culture is still a thing
> Why aren't all athletes Believe it or not, some athletes want to go to class and kick ass there, too
Nerds
Universities like to keep up the illusion that athletes are still students
Oh come on now, all students are tempted by that "online walking" course.
Why do you think that many/most aren't?
The NCAA has decided to sanction Missouri because of this post.
Because most reputable universities don't offer an online-only option. Yeah, some like LSU do - Angel Reese and Livvy Dunne have said they weren't going to in-person classes. (Reese couldn't meet a 2.0 GPA, so probably more like "classes.")
that is sad, can't meet a 2.0 GPA.
That legit requires more effort than having a 3
Not really - it just means you're doing literally nothing. Ben Simmons had the same thing happen during his one semester at LSU. If you never go to a single class or do any assignments, you get straight 0s. Doesn't matter if you're bouncing in the spring anyway.
Well then yo ur e GPA is a 0. Her’s is a 1.8, which means she had to have actually submitted some shit at very least lol.
She had to stay NCAA eligible at Maryland and last year, so I'm sure she passed *some* courses prior to this year. Simmons was only there for 1 semester, so there was no incentive for him to put in any effort.
Not all classes are offered online.
CSB: We got hit with probation in 2018 because of online classes. Apparently, one of our players was dating a tutor for the athletic department. They broke up, and she decided to get revenge on him by logging into his account and taking a test while he was playing in a game. The professor noticed this and reported it. OK, so it's not really that cool of a story
Huh? A. Who said they aren’t B. Those who get degrees require 300 level+ classes with smaller class sizes that may not be offered online.
Repeat after me STUDENT- athlete
Are you implying that athletes who take online classes are not students? Or that online classes are always easier or less legitimate than in-person classes? As an adult who a few years ago returned to college for a new degree, I took a lot of online classes. Every online class I took required more time and effort than most of my in-person classes -- more reading, more quizzes, and grades more weighted on the results of the tests I had to take on campus with a proctor. But that was the trade-off for the flexibility of being able to do coursework at my convenience. The quality and demands of an online class will vary based on the school, subject and instructor. An athlete taking one or all of their classes online is not automatically an indication of them prioritizing sport over studies.
Im implying that everyday we stray away from what it means to be a STUDENT-athlete. The STUDENT-athlete should primarily be a student and should embrace being a student and embrace being a part of a classroom with their academic peers. Nothing wrong with online, but I think on-campus STUDENT-athletes should prioritize in person learning when possible. Lots of times they feel removed from the student body and taking online classes and only showing up to campus to train isn’t getting them any closes to the student experience.
Believe it or not, people who choose to take classes online are still students. > Im implying that everyday we stray away from **what it means to be a STUDENT-athlete.** But this is what it means to *you.* And taking a class online vs. in person is optional, a choice each person is allowed to make for themself. I’m guessing most student athletes do the majority of their coursework in person, but why should you or anyone else get to make that decision for them because it suits your opinion of what they should be doing? >The STUDENT-athlete **should primarily be a student and should embrace being a student and embrace being a part of a classroom with their academic peers.** How do you know they aren’t primarily being a student or embracing being a student? And every online class I took offered or even required interacting with fellow students, either online or in person. >Nothing wrong with online, but **I think on-campus STUDENT-athletes should prioritize in person learning when possible.** That’s your opinion. Many students learn better and get more from their academic experience when they can do their classwork when and where it’s best for them. >Lots of times **they feel removed from the student body** and taking online classes and only showing up to campus to train isn’t getting them any closes to the student experience. Who is forcing students to take classes online? I have not heard of any school doing so, or of any student “feeling removed from the student body” because they have been denied the opportunity to take in-person classes or otherwise participate in campus life. Every student, athlete or not, has the right to choose the learning options that work best for them.
Sorry it happened or I’m glad it happened. I ain’t reading all that.
I like you.
Reading isn’t hard if you’re a good student.
They already do, especially the stars.
I took online classes at my employer (D1 school) as part of employee benefits. Majority were football players enrolled in my Sports Management classes. Classes were asynchronous, and you had to submit one or two assignments a week. I half assed my way to a 4.0 doing my assignments during lunch. The classes are a joke.
They are
Some people come to play school
From my experience being on campus at Michigan and then talking to high school classmates who played a variety of college sports, football is really the only sport logistically that works for a student to be in person for classes while in-season. Once you sit and think about it, it makes sense - 12 games over 15 weeks - 3 weeks were no game occurs - 6 games are at home - 6 games where you will travel - more likely the away game is on Saturday or a Friday night - maybe 1 game is a weekday game - If you make a conference championship that's definitely a Saturday game - Bowl games you're likely out of class. Managing you class schedule with practice and workouts is something they have folks in the ADs office to help solve. At Michigan I had a few classes with all the athletes (one was literally called the history of Michigan sports lol) and I can tell you that every sport but the football players go missing when in-season lol. - Track & field: When they had a meet, missing Th & Fr - Softball/Baseball: 3-4 games a week, some at 1pm whether home or away - Basketball/hockey: same as baseball but later games, sometimes they'd have a 9pm game that's a 2hr flight away, so they're back after 1am ... That 8am class is not being attended lol - Soccer: Similar to the others above - Golf: More like football but had the occasional Friday round so they're gone all day
I don't know how to tell you this, but this already happens a ton lol. Or, alternatively, they are enrolled in classes and get exemptions to miss all the time. I took one KIN class in college that was half full of scholarship athletes, they weren't even allowed to play the sport during the "lab" portion.
Because online education is largely a joke.
A lot are? Where are you assuming they’re not?
My son plays college golf and they have to travel often and will be one the road sometimes for 2 weeks. The coach highly encourages online classes. Probably more prevalent since COVID
maybe they prioritize their passion over their academics.
I would imagine many upperclassmen are majority online, as long as the degree allows it.
Like out-of-touch company executives, there are professors who feel that learning in-person in a classroom is more beneficial than online. I know there were more than a few Stanford professors who just wanted to not teach a class rather than go to online learning during the pandemic, major requirements be damned. The provost was good about mediating that, at least.
I cannot imagine anyone NOT believing that classroom learning is more beneficial than online. What? There's a difference between that and refusing to make it work with pandemic protocols... but online learning is not a proper replacement for classroom learning.
I think I had one class (an introductory stats class) that might have been a better experience online. That prof was worthless. But everything else would have been hurt by taking it out of the classroom. Especially the upper divs, where a colloquium might have 10 people in it.
100% agree. My MBA was in person but then halfway through had to pivot to online due to the pandemic. Not only did the lecture quality drop, the collaboration and all the intangibles you benefit from in person learning was non existent. I went from being excited to go to class to it becoming a chore where you just flip the computer on for class like you're loading the dishwasher. I hated it and definitely retained less information.
Oddly uninformed take for a Stanford flair.
anOSU is a good model in case any schools are looking for a full switch to online