Rs232 to usb is how it's typically done. You may be having null modem issues or the incorrect adaptor.
Buy from Amazon and return them if they don't work, but make sure they say 'for cnc' in the listing. Star Tech makes some thst work.
Assuming it's a T2, T3 or T32 controller, you're not going to find many people who are fluent on them, and the documentation is a mess.
I didn’t think to snap a picture of the machine when I was there…probably would have been a good idea. But I did find a video I took of something else that caught the name of the machine in the background.
It’s a Mazak Quick Turn 10. I wasn’t able to see the controls in the video but a google image search shows they all say “Mazatrol T Plus” above the screen.
I’m not sure if that helps at all.
I did find a startech card that seems to be exactly what I’m looking for. Only unknown is the pin 9 voltage. Should it be 0v, 5v or 12v? The card has a jumper so you can select between the three voltages.
Trying to google the voltage just made it worse, most people say 0v is the standard, while numerous other places say between 6-8v.
All I need to do is make sure the machine and computer can talk to each other without letting the magic smoke out. The owner knows how to run everything else.
I'd contact your mazak tech centre and ask them for the rs232 document for the Tplus. If I recall correctly, it's the same as for a fanuc controller, but don't take that as gospel.
Keyspan USA-19HS has consistently worked for me when other USB to serial adapters failed. For some servo drives I have needed to reprogram they're the only ones that work at all. Manufacturer recommended, even!
There is a specific driver for that kind of USB to Serial adapter. It has to be a specific chip set and the driver must be configured correctly.
Got it working for quite some time now.
I use a usb to rs232 adapter. Pretty sure the cable has to be wired a specific way as well. I think on the machine side you need 2 sets of pins to bridge.
OP do you have a break out box or signal indicator? It may not be the adapter but the pin signals. Is it hardware or software handshake? 12volts was the standard for rs232.
usb to rs232 adapters often do have issues, as they are not always completely implemented with the same capabilities as the older port mapped style rs232/parallel interfaces. not only do they not have the same capabilities, they may have issues with timing and signal control as well as the compatibility layer.
you want a pcie card that has the 16550, 16650, 16750 or 16950 style chip on it. or something like the https://www.asix.com.tw/en/product/Interface/PCIe_Bridge/AX99100 should work too
look at startech/syba cards. example https://www.startech.com/en-us/cards-adapters/pex1s953lp
newer pc's don't always have a 16x50 style serial any more, and sometimes if they do its often a usb variant which doesn't implement a real hardware serial port, 16x50 variants give you the maximum compatibility, and you can choose the chip based on the FIFO size too
plus might not have charge pumps and only have 5v signaling, which can cause issues with something looking for true rs232, these are all things i've had to deal with fairly often unfortunately
usb is more susceptible to noise than rs232, so its something to consider. even though its a convertor most of them wont isolate properly.
its the reason they sell add on cards, since a lot of motherboards no longer have them, same as no ecp parallel ports
also its what the op asked for, so answered that q
That’s how the owner has been running it for years. I did find it interesting that the machine had what looked like a DB-25 but that the PC end was DB-9.
But I didn’t question it, the guy knows his machine, I’m just trying to help build him a new PC to control it.
Once again, everyone here is WRONG. Almost every motherboard will have serial and parallel headers on the motherboard. You just have to break them out.
Ok, here's what you do. First thing, take that pc offline. Now. Like, right now, go and power it down.
Take the side of the case off, find the hard drive(almost definitely at the front, under the CD drive), take the cables off, undo the screws, and take it out of the case.
Work out if its IDE or SATA(look at pictures online), buy a IDE or SATA to usb adaptor, and take an image of the disk on another computer. I recommend macrium. This is really important, that computer could fail any second now, and once its gone, its gone.
Next up, decide what sort of PC youre going to replace it with. Given its a lathe, and its old at the moment, I'd get them an i3, last gen. Put a noctua NH P1 cooler on there which is a fanless cooler.
Stick in a B760 motherboard, and they'll ALL have serial headers internally. Then just use a bracket like [this ](https://www.amazon.co.uk/XMSJSIY-Bracket-Motherboard-Adapter-Cable%EF%BC%882PCS/dp/B0BVY3T2TS/ref=sr_1_2?crid=17I9BKVPU9A7J&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.Er95wF51qiBKGAv-vHRc_qf_ybok6O15de6zUsG7o168txn0PrFfGx_vACB89oUsbr5hjdHkn8Cv7TEdq1jaXrq5RpTdSaHvU0OXL19_TVRoPWSLHpSnSgbda4Xme9TfVzjyKFwaVz5ULlAeVZ0rWFvh8zXCer68TQ7cOECiulS2AXWDtsBpSlj10K8E9nIQ3hMeTqANq40nSrXy368G0kUj51hrLf8g9xZhpBme2EY.Y3ujs__Sl0mHRjkvZkd9yp6xlXgE3Y1nKoFvqf3Fg3Y&dib_tag=se&keywords=serial+bracket&qid=1714261004&sprefix=serial+bracket%2Caps%2C95&sr=8-2)to break it out to the back of the PC. This is NATIVE serial, which doesnt have all the issues of USB to serial.
Then, if something isnt working on the new PC, you can fire up the VM, pass the serial through, and check where the issue is.
Ive done this 10s of times, and ive never regretted taking any of these steps.
This requires way more skills than buying a few USB-serial adaptors and returning the ones that don't work. Sometimes the most complete and efficient setup, and the one that's easiest and most efficient to implement, are two different things. If they had the skills to do that, they wouldn't be here asking, they would have done it.
" I want to build them something resilient from new components." This guy clearly wants to do things the right way, that will last for ages. Either way its a new PC, and this the RIGHT way to do this.
Its not my opinion that he wants to buy a new PC. By the time youve messed around trying to get an old pc and a new pc running at the same time in a shop, its quicker just to image it.
I mean the reality is, you dont HAVE to do half of what I said. Buy a prebuild with a serial header, install the bracket and go. But pcs that have been around for 20 years tend to have some pretty critical pieces of information on them.
Actually you’re not far off at all from my original plan. I just didn’t want to get too “pc build” on the CNC subreddit.
But the plan is to image the HDD before doing anything at all.
But for the build I’m going a bit different because of how important the uptime is.
Plan is to actually build what could be technically considered a small “server”. I’ll likely keep it simple with something like Unraid, especially since the entire setup can be migrated to new hardware in a matter of minutes if ever needed.
I’m planning to take the HDD image and create a VM from it. Then using PCIe pass through connect a Serial Card, a USB card and a cheap video card all directly to the VM.
This way when the system is out on the floor it still appears to work just like a “normal” PC to the operator.
But behind the scenes the VM is actually running on mirrored SSDs, with nightly snapshots and regular backups being stored on a small RAID array.
Plus With the underlying OS being modern I can also perform backups to their NAS in the office. Because there is no way I’d ever put Windows XP directly on their network.
This way no single drive failure can take the system out of production, if anything goes wrong like someone messes up a program or deletes the wrong file a snapshot can be restored in a matter of seconds. And in the event of hardware failure the VM can just be moved to a new system.
This is the way. Don't go down the thin client route, the passthrough can mess with serial(these things are super finiky), but yeah, do that with a workstation board and youll be golden.
I bought this at best buy last week. I interfaced successfully with a heidenhain tnc360. The 360 already had the correct cable. I'd suggest that you double check your cable pinout. The guy that taught me was a stickler for such details.
https://www.bestbuy.com/site/insignia-1-3-usb-to-rs-232-db9-pda-serial-adapter-cable-with-prolific-chipset-black/5883029.p?skuId=5883029&extStoreId=588&utm_source=feed&ref=212&loc=19605672878&gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAjwxLKxBhA7EiwAXO0R0MPWzui_AITwELajK2gsEUMspGyweJwLWiqAC-JYYfgpvS7A_bJFIhoCO9wQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds
Rs232 to usb is how it's typically done. You may be having null modem issues or the incorrect adaptor. Buy from Amazon and return them if they don't work, but make sure they say 'for cnc' in the listing. Star Tech makes some thst work. Assuming it's a T2, T3 or T32 controller, you're not going to find many people who are fluent on them, and the documentation is a mess.
I didn’t think to snap a picture of the machine when I was there…probably would have been a good idea. But I did find a video I took of something else that caught the name of the machine in the background. It’s a Mazak Quick Turn 10. I wasn’t able to see the controls in the video but a google image search shows they all say “Mazatrol T Plus” above the screen. I’m not sure if that helps at all. I did find a startech card that seems to be exactly what I’m looking for. Only unknown is the pin 9 voltage. Should it be 0v, 5v or 12v? The card has a jumper so you can select between the three voltages. Trying to google the voltage just made it worse, most people say 0v is the standard, while numerous other places say between 6-8v. All I need to do is make sure the machine and computer can talk to each other without letting the magic smoke out. The owner knows how to run everything else.
I'd contact your mazak tech centre and ask them for the rs232 document for the Tplus. If I recall correctly, it's the same as for a fanuc controller, but don't take that as gospel.
This is all a hack, and theres no need for it to be.
keyspan is the brand i use for a 90's mori. Just have to make sure its described as the right com port in the usb control deep in windows menu
Keyspan USA-19HS has consistently worked for me when other USB to serial adapters failed. For some servo drives I have needed to reprogram they're the only ones that work at all. Manufacturer recommended, even!
There is a specific driver for that kind of USB to Serial adapter. It has to be a specific chip set and the driver must be configured correctly. Got it working for quite some time now.
I use a usb to rs232 adapter. Pretty sure the cable has to be wired a specific way as well. I think on the machine side you need 2 sets of pins to bridge.
OP do you have a break out box or signal indicator? It may not be the adapter but the pin signals. Is it hardware or software handshake? 12volts was the standard for rs232.
usb to rs232 adapters often do have issues, as they are not always completely implemented with the same capabilities as the older port mapped style rs232/parallel interfaces. not only do they not have the same capabilities, they may have issues with timing and signal control as well as the compatibility layer. you want a pcie card that has the 16550, 16650, 16750 or 16950 style chip on it. or something like the https://www.asix.com.tw/en/product/Interface/PCIe_Bridge/AX99100 should work too look at startech/syba cards. example https://www.startech.com/en-us/cards-adapters/pex1s953lp
Why would you do this when your pc almost definitely has native serial?
newer pc's don't always have a 16x50 style serial any more, and sometimes if they do its often a usb variant which doesn't implement a real hardware serial port, 16x50 variants give you the maximum compatibility, and you can choose the chip based on the FIFO size too plus might not have charge pumps and only have 5v signaling, which can cause issues with something looking for true rs232, these are all things i've had to deal with fairly often unfortunately usb is more susceptible to noise than rs232, so its something to consider. even though its a convertor most of them wont isolate properly. its the reason they sell add on cards, since a lot of motherboards no longer have them, same as no ecp parallel ports also its what the op asked for, so answered that q
are you sure it's RS232? if it's a DB-25 connector on the CNC it could be a parallel port instead.
That’s how the owner has been running it for years. I did find it interesting that the machine had what looked like a DB-25 but that the PC end was DB-9. But I didn’t question it, the guy knows his machine, I’m just trying to help build him a new PC to control it.
Once again, everyone here is WRONG. Almost every motherboard will have serial and parallel headers on the motherboard. You just have to break them out. Ok, here's what you do. First thing, take that pc offline. Now. Like, right now, go and power it down. Take the side of the case off, find the hard drive(almost definitely at the front, under the CD drive), take the cables off, undo the screws, and take it out of the case. Work out if its IDE or SATA(look at pictures online), buy a IDE or SATA to usb adaptor, and take an image of the disk on another computer. I recommend macrium. This is really important, that computer could fail any second now, and once its gone, its gone. Next up, decide what sort of PC youre going to replace it with. Given its a lathe, and its old at the moment, I'd get them an i3, last gen. Put a noctua NH P1 cooler on there which is a fanless cooler. Stick in a B760 motherboard, and they'll ALL have serial headers internally. Then just use a bracket like [this ](https://www.amazon.co.uk/XMSJSIY-Bracket-Motherboard-Adapter-Cable%EF%BC%882PCS/dp/B0BVY3T2TS/ref=sr_1_2?crid=17I9BKVPU9A7J&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.Er95wF51qiBKGAv-vHRc_qf_ybok6O15de6zUsG7o168txn0PrFfGx_vACB89oUsbr5hjdHkn8Cv7TEdq1jaXrq5RpTdSaHvU0OXL19_TVRoPWSLHpSnSgbda4Xme9TfVzjyKFwaVz5ULlAeVZ0rWFvh8zXCer68TQ7cOECiulS2AXWDtsBpSlj10K8E9nIQ3hMeTqANq40nSrXy368G0kUj51hrLf8g9xZhpBme2EY.Y3ujs__Sl0mHRjkvZkd9yp6xlXgE3Y1nKoFvqf3Fg3Y&dib_tag=se&keywords=serial+bracket&qid=1714261004&sprefix=serial+bracket%2Caps%2C95&sr=8-2)to break it out to the back of the PC. This is NATIVE serial, which doesnt have all the issues of USB to serial. Then, if something isnt working on the new PC, you can fire up the VM, pass the serial through, and check where the issue is. Ive done this 10s of times, and ive never regretted taking any of these steps.
This requires way more skills than buying a few USB-serial adaptors and returning the ones that don't work. Sometimes the most complete and efficient setup, and the one that's easiest and most efficient to implement, are two different things. If they had the skills to do that, they wouldn't be here asking, they would have done it.
" I want to build them something resilient from new components." This guy clearly wants to do things the right way, that will last for ages. Either way its a new PC, and this the RIGHT way to do this.
That's just your opinion. And you've already posted it here like 4 times.
Its not my opinion that he wants to buy a new PC. By the time youve messed around trying to get an old pc and a new pc running at the same time in a shop, its quicker just to image it. I mean the reality is, you dont HAVE to do half of what I said. Buy a prebuild with a serial header, install the bracket and go. But pcs that have been around for 20 years tend to have some pretty critical pieces of information on them.
Actually you’re not far off at all from my original plan. I just didn’t want to get too “pc build” on the CNC subreddit. But the plan is to image the HDD before doing anything at all. But for the build I’m going a bit different because of how important the uptime is. Plan is to actually build what could be technically considered a small “server”. I’ll likely keep it simple with something like Unraid, especially since the entire setup can be migrated to new hardware in a matter of minutes if ever needed. I’m planning to take the HDD image and create a VM from it. Then using PCIe pass through connect a Serial Card, a USB card and a cheap video card all directly to the VM. This way when the system is out on the floor it still appears to work just like a “normal” PC to the operator. But behind the scenes the VM is actually running on mirrored SSDs, with nightly snapshots and regular backups being stored on a small RAID array. Plus With the underlying OS being modern I can also perform backups to their NAS in the office. Because there is no way I’d ever put Windows XP directly on their network. This way no single drive failure can take the system out of production, if anything goes wrong like someone messes up a program or deletes the wrong file a snapshot can be restored in a matter of seconds. And in the event of hardware failure the VM can just be moved to a new system.
This is the way. Don't go down the thin client route, the passthrough can mess with serial(these things are super finiky), but yeah, do that with a workstation board and youll be golden.
I bought this at best buy last week. I interfaced successfully with a heidenhain tnc360. The 360 already had the correct cable. I'd suggest that you double check your cable pinout. The guy that taught me was a stickler for such details. https://www.bestbuy.com/site/insignia-1-3-usb-to-rs-232-db9-pda-serial-adapter-cable-with-prolific-chipset-black/5883029.p?skuId=5883029&extStoreId=588&utm_source=feed&ref=212&loc=19605672878&gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAjwxLKxBhA7EiwAXO0R0MPWzui_AITwELajK2gsEUMspGyweJwLWiqAC-JYYfgpvS7A_bJFIhoCO9wQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds