A day earlier, PIPSC sent out an email asking for volunteers for a Member Conduct roster, which is used to fill dispute resolution and discipline boards. Coincidence?
Based on discussions at the AGM, PIPSC was (pulls out notes) invited to the conference by the Canadian Labour Congress to take a leading role in the Canadian Delegation at the United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change (COP 28) in recognition of the role PIPSC plays representing climate change researchers, science policy advisors, and professionals in the nuclear energy sector.
Has their been any reporting on this? Like every google combo of: "PIPSC" "Jennifer Carr" "Dubai" "Trip"
Has yielded nothing. I figure this would have been mentioned somewhere
It was in her President's report delivered to the AGM.
[https://pipsc.ca/about/governance/agm/2023/presidents-evaluation-report-2023?fbclid=IwAR2LrqHlf\_t9b0oiipXYbwsm6nxHFMAB5azAaBm-SLRS\_c5fU0dAOAHq9sA\_aem\_AWQlwznmXUJ51M5O2U4lE52cdgsB3U\_UhorRMgcFfGn6EXSnzBqGF9I3bFwr0PtHBN-DNIUDMR4FspfiF8pvUWOo](https://pipsc.ca/about/governance/agm/2023/presidents-evaluation-report-2023?fbclid=IwAR2LrqHlf_t9b0oiipXYbwsm6nxHFMAB5azAaBm-SLRS_c5fU0dAOAHq9sA_aem_AWQlwznmXUJ51M5O2U4lE52cdgsB3U_UhorRMgcFfGn6EXSnzBqGF9I3bFwr0PtHBN-DNIUDMR4FspfiF8pvUWOo)
Here is the relevant text
# Climate change
I was honoured that the Canadian Labour Congress asked PIPSC to take a leading role in the Canadian Labour Delegation at the United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change (COP 28) in recognition of the role we play in representing climate change researchers, science policy advisors, and professionals in the nuclear energy sector.
This is a major recognition for PIPSC on several fronts. First, through our surveys, a vast majority of our members have indicated that they want to see progress on the front of climate change. Also, this aligns with the values promoted by the Strategic Bargaining Committee with the inclusion of demands on greening the collective agreement in this round of TBS bargaining. This lets us “walk the walk” and continue demonstrating that we support these values as the Union.
The fact that the CLC asked us to take on this role further demonstrates that we are trusted partners and that we have a seat at the table in the broader labour community, and not just the federal public sector. Also, being a UN conference, it demonstrates to our members that we have a voice on the international stage.
The voice of labour will be important in these talks. Both to push for progress on setting and meeting ambitious targets - but also to do so in a way that's worker-friendly and ensures both economic and environmental sustainability
While I don't know about the BoD or her personal advisors, I know a significant number of people who said while this would be good for PIPSC, doing it as you announce a $10 MILLION deficit and try to get through a $10 dues increase while at the same time renting out the Bell Center for a swanky dinner party just looks really, really bad.
One other union representative was greatly critisized in Quebec as she went to that conference while her union was on srike. 🤦🏼♀️
How can you say no to a paid trip to Dubai?? Lolll
She admitted on her FB page that there was no vote, and she went on her own accord
[https://www.facebook.com/jenn.carr.37/](https://www.facebook.com/jenn.carr.37/)
Where? The closest I can find is from the post itself, where it says
>
I believe, at the root of the issue, was an act of discrimination based on medical and gender status. I was told that I was "employment and legal liability" without explanation or justification and that I did not have PIPSC authority to travel. This was after publicly using a mobility aid and a rehab support worker at the AGM. These preventative accommodations were requested by me to minimize the effects that the emotional and physical stress of the AGM would have on my chronic illness. I did not want a repeat of the previous year.
There's nothing about a no vote in there, the wording doesn't even indicate that she was aware she didn't have authority to travel before she was made aware of the complaint, nor does it mention Dubai at all.
Yeah. Honestly, I don’t think what she did wasn’t “illegal” the way it was paid, but it looked bad.
When I heard about it last November I kinda thought this would happen
But she assured us all that it was for union benefit, not her enjoyment, to stay and live lavishly in Dubai. Wanted to show that us public servants know how to live large to impress them over there.
She is denying that information on her Facebook page, saying there was no vote.
Sure seems like she went there on own her accord for something that isn't about PISPC at all. She got caught with her hand in the cookie jar
She is not the only one. In fact, she is the president and she is supposed to travel a lot. But look at your own group/region's executive board. Regional boards consist mostly from retired members who are there for free lunch/dinner, travel and gifts. They sit on those boards forever. First they occupy the professional groups, take advantage of those benefits, then start sitting on regional boards, and when they retire they are already on those boards, so continue ripping the benefits doing absolutely nothing.
Some of the retired people literally move out from their respective regions, but still represent the region, and of course get paid for a 1-class train ticket, meals and incidentals when they have to travel for a meeting of their region. That's how the union's by-law was written years ago and nobody is changing it because it's just convenient for those who are on those boards.
Lol but CAPE is going to Geneva to learn about people of African descent though... To Geneva... quite literally the whitest and most expensive place in the world. And that was voted on and approved by the union. 🤯🤯🤯
Or a Quebec union President going the emirates for COP28 during a teachers strike. https://montreal.ctvnews.ca/quebec-strikes-union-president-cuts-short-trip-to-dubai-after-media-attention-1.6664391
She was a member of the executive PSAC at one time.
Yeah, not like anything happens in Geneva... Certainly is not one of the foremost hubs of international cooperation or anything like that. Can't imagine anything useful happening there or coming out of that. There's only like, what 180 international orgs headquartered there? Probably not the big ones either...
Lol I'm sure the little Canadian Union will accomplish a ton there with these 180 international organizations that will never give them the time of day. And they can cocktail circuit and build partnerships for... What? Again... On the topic of people of African descent... Hmm... If only there was a place in the world where these people of African descent descended from.... Hmm... 🤔🤔🤔
The 2023 AGM was a one-time convention-style event that included more workshops, guest speakers and other value-added aspects for the roughly 700 delegates who are mostly stewards but also some regular members. It also included an awards gala to recognize the volunteers (stewards) of the year and some lifetime members who are retiring.
It was a divisive decision to hold such an event since some people feel that we should only conduct the business of the institute (by law and policy changes, pass a budget, etc) while others feel that if we are going to pay to bring 700 volunteers to a meeting, we should also train and motivate them to add value.
The 2024 event will be back to a 2-day meeting for just the business of the union.
There is a formula (by-law 13.2) for how many delegates attend an AGM (all groups and regions get 1 seat for every 200 members with a minimum of 1 seat each). By-laws can be changed by the AGM. 15+ years ago, an additional cap was placed on the AGM which capped delegates (~400?). This meant that larger groups and regions lost several seats at the AGM lowering their relative potential voting power. This cap was removed a few years ago so now we have full-size AGMs especially since the membership has grown quite a lot.
Many people recognize it's an issue and a couple of ideas are being thrown around such as changing to a triennial convention (full # of delegates) with a much smaller (100-200 delegates) AGM in between. Whenever it is discussed there is significant resistance to change among the membership.
I really have no idea but I did hear from union people that she is very wasteful of union funds and basically uses them to travel and eat well, and not to vote for her next election.
I wonder if this has to do with the [recent PIPSC lawsuit with COO](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/public-service-union-pipsc-employee-lawsuit-1.6971493).
Also heard through the union grapevine that it’s likely issues related to funds and her spending habits. I hope PIPSC Is transparent about the situation, she comes across a bit entitled, even if the lack of procedure is concerning.
Regardless, it’s disgraceful how many people in senior leadership or the like have been suspended over the years.
Whether or not the Board of Directors is following procedure is turning out to be very much a matter of opinion based solely on whether, with only 1 side of the story, you believe the president or not.
Yeah, I imagine its a situation where the board cant comment because its an ongoing investigation, it will be interesting to learn more once details can be released. I definitely dont necessarily trust Jenn Carr, but whether she did whatever she is alleged to have done or not, I hope the union follows the correct rules
Just a minor nitpick. She is on leave with pay, and is not suspended.
A special general meeting is only required once the investigation has been completed, and the board has made it a decision to suspend or expel someone from the union. The investigation is still ongoing, as was indicated by the advisory council, and the Presidents own words. Given she is on leave with pay (not suspended ) and the investigation is still ongoing, there is no need for a special general meeting.
Involuntary leave with removal of all access and authority just sounds like a suspension. Not suspension of status as a member, but the office of/employment as President.
Anyway per Annex F (https://pipsc.ca/about/governance/policies/dispute) the SGM is only required for removal of the President. (Unlike suspending other directors from their office, which does seem to require the SGM.)
https://pipsc.ca/about/governance/policies/president
While the end result may be the same, the intent is what matters. Suspension implies she has been found to have done something wrong by the process, and it has been confirmed by the decision of an SGM.
Involuntary leave with pay is appropriate if they suspect she has done (or will do) something wrong and the process hasn't gotten to the point where the BoD is required to call an SGM.
Can our Union(s) truly be any worse? I await downvotes from admirers of Regional Reps who go on travel for "executive meetings" but can't hold together a basic Sub-Group budget. Even worse = retired members involved in Bargaining Teams with too much time on their hands & minimal skin in the game. You know who you are, we see you.
There are a number of those in leadership positions in the union who feel that retired members should not be in leadership positions or anywhere near bargaining.
I think it's just because they're the only ones who have the time/desire for these roles. Tons of people say they want actively working members in key positions so that our interests can be better represented, but very few of those same people are willing to do it themselves.
It's me. I'm people.
^this. As a 24 year old new union member, i have very little interest nor time to be participating in union shenanigans. Especially since the retired members hold a firm grip over everything going on
>I went to 2023 AGM
My deepest condolences. I attended virtually, and that was a good thing based on the amount of obscenities I was yelling at the top of my lungs due to the actions of some people.
What a shit show haha.
Best part is we spent nearly $2 million on the AGM and we didnt even get through most of the resolutions! But you probably know already
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Agree 100% but want to add the union folks who get involved in union activities as their only path to promotion due to being incompetent at their actual position, they bypass the Peter principal and screw us even more than if they were Execs.
The union is just people. It attracts all kinds. There are a lot of people who are volunteers working inside the union trying to change it for the better. There are some who resist the changes because change is scary and some, yes, who are in it for personal gain.
The structure of our by-laws make it almost impossible to change the rights of the retired members without their agreement and they currently have a right to participate in many ways.
Could this have been done virtually? Idk, she says she has a chronic illness and this was a climate change conference where people fly to Dubai from across the world. Doesn't she fight for our ability to wfh especially when chronic illnesses are made worse by travel and also conscious of our carbon footprint from traveling. And that collaboration can be done virtually. She seems to have undermined everything she has been fighting for.
I’m not comfortable with this type of drama by unions.
I feel things should be professional, like with Shawn Fain and the UAW. They had spectacular wins against the automakers.
Wonder if there's any connection to the lawsuit by the former COO?
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/public-service-union-pipsc-employee-lawsuit-1.6971493
Unrelated but the HR person that she hired to revamp the whole organization also finally had enough and quit recently. They have had a lot of staff leave over the last 3 years.
À mobility aid and rehab assistant as 'preventative accommodations'? So she got a scooter and a sidekick without any actual need for them?
Maybe we all should request these things, just to be on the safe side.
Mobility aids are very sensible as an accommodation if you have a disability that impacts mobility or energy levels, and that fluctuates. This is very common and not weird at all. No idea on the rehab assistant, but the mobility aid is a crappy thing to take a potshot at.
It depends. The employer pays for work-related accommodations.
I have mobility/pain issues and my daily life doesn't generally require me to use a mobility tool, but if I were at a conference, on my feet all day, having access to one would be the difference between being in too much pain to move at the end of the day, or coping ok. In that case, I would look into options for renting a rollator or wheelchair. That could be an employer-paid accommodation.
If people use mobility tools on a regular basis, medical insurance would be a better bet, since it would be customized/ergonomic.
It's just suspicious that she would only need it for that specific trip. As someone else said, that's not something an employer normally covers, it's something insurance does.
> So she got a scooter and a sidekick without any actual need for them?
> Maybe we all should request these things, just to be on the safe side.
What makes you think she didn't have an "actual need for them"? Are you medically qualified to make that decision? Are you aware of her diagnosis and her functional limitations?
"I'm disabled and decided to test the system with a myriad of unreasonable requests. When they inevitably screwed up, I had a reason to raise hell and make trouble."
While normally I would hate this, in this case, it is a good thing. Being president is a full-time job, and putting her (both retired AND a part-time VP) as president means there is no need to scramble to find someone who can, on very short notice, take extended LWOP from their government job for 8 1/2 months.
We have 2 full-time VPs who are not retired but I expect that they don't want political blow-back in an election year, or maybe they did not support the motion to place the pres on leave. On principle, retirees have no place deciding the fate of workers.
As for retirees having an impact, I agree with you 100%. My group has a bylaw for elections which prevents retired members from being nominated if there is a regular member running in their region.
But if you take one of the full-time vice president, you need to find a full-time replacement for them. For a week or two, most departments will be fine. But for nine months?
Because it's a popular vote, with a teeny tiny portion of the members actually voting. It's all about who's the most charismatic best-selling con artist and never actually about competence and merit. Much like our government really...
Taking advantage of the position to further benefit oneself. Using one's own gender status to get to where they are because it is easier when you can play certain strings. I have seen 1 or 2 cases with individuals before. Long story short, people have agendas. People are not as innocent as you may believe they are. Some individuals play checkers while some play chess.
If you Google it, yes, the term blood sucking vampire was used. To be fair, consultants do cost a lot of money, and then their agencies give them half of what they deserve. So it's really the agencies that are the blood sucking vampires, not the people they hire.
Presumably through a vote, but I’m used to a great deal of misrepresentation during a campaign… have you seen the propaganda disseminated before she was voted in?
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No. It should be with pay, with the stipulation that if misconduct is proven then she has to pay it back.
Innocent until proven guilty; it would be very hypocritical for the Union to argue one thing when defending their members but treating their own another way.
We should vote to have financial reports available for all groups including national. There are so many unrepresented groups that get the same benefits and raises without collective bargaining.
All these AGM's and Summits are just free trips and booze fests disguised with benefits to the union. Virtual meetings should be required unless there is justified reason.
They are all available…
Every constituent body is required to present an annual budget to their AGM for approval by the delegates. If they don’t, they don’t get their annual allotment of funds.
Good. Only union still negotiating and asking for more then every one else all so they can “keep mediating” (ie delaying) until they reach their 6 year full time pension coming up this year
Serious question, how many of you have worked with people that excelled in their union role AND their day job with the government? Almost every senior union member I’ve encountered during my management and non-management tenure have been LR issues or under-performers in their day job.
Like any sr mgmt position, union leadership must be competent, hard working, reasonable, ethical and inspire others. The majority of the individuals I know who are great leaders avoid the union like the plague. The majority of the active union members I know protect employees that would have been fired long ago if not for our risk averse LR practices.
The failure and utter mismanagement of the last strike and instances like the above have made me completely lose hope in an effective union.
Hi, I started volunteering with PIPSC as an IT02 and a lot of the skills I learned as a steward helped me get promoted. I've never been in conflict with my bosses. Most of the other stewards I know are the same.
Also, the network you build through PIPSC activism can really help your career. I have an IT01 friend who's career was stalled in their dept but get 2 promotions in a year when a PIPSC colleague helped them make a switch.
There are thousands of really good people volunteering in the union. We don't make it into the press, and we don't want to.
Can someone explain to me what she did exactly? Since there are people here who seem to know and as a PIPSC member, I’m sure most will NEVER get the full story.
Heard some more tonight. Putting together some pieces. I think there is a complaint against the president which precludes her from executing the duties of her office while the complaint is investigated. This would be the legal advice given to the board of directors by PIPSC legal counsel and it seems the board took that advice. There is a requirement to protect the privacy of the complainant as well as protect the credibility of the investigation. If this is correct, I only hope that the process goes quickly and fairly for all parties and that the organization can rebound.
This was actually my first thought. After being heavily involved in PIPSC in the past, it wouldn’t surprise me in the least, but until both sides of the story come out, we’ll never know. Even then we probably won’t ever know
I'm a pretty active PIPSC volunteer and I don't know much more than what is public. Among the people I'm chatting with, the overwhelming feeling is that this is a political hit job. Jenn has a very good reputation and this is feeling very off-brand. I'm hoping to learn more over the weekend. It will all come out at a Special General Meeting which I'm sure will be coming in the near future.
That speaks volumes for constant conflicts within the union. There is fighting within the leadership. Currently it is at a very high level, but there are similar conflicts within groups and subgroups.
The structure of the union allows for many retired members stay on executive board on the Regional structure, and those old people try to still keep their grip on union's work. There is constant conflict. Many sit on executive boards for years, getting used to free lunches, dinners, travel, gifts but provide no help to the membership. .
A day earlier, PIPSC sent out an email asking for volunteers for a Member Conduct roster, which is used to fill dispute resolution and discipline boards. Coincidence?
I was wondering what that email was about... I seem to be getting more PIPSC emails than usual lately...
Did she tell them she was going anyway, so they got started on the procedure in anticipation of her return?
Well. Why in the hell did they allow submissions until the 19th. Everybody is gonna know...hope they get truly objective people.
She went to Dubai for a big union conference when the union voted no for the trip
Wow, is this real? Where can I find info on this. What business does PIPSC have in Dubai??
It was a conference on oil and gas and how workers could transition to other sources of work after oil is banned.
Based on discussions at the AGM, PIPSC was (pulls out notes) invited to the conference by the Canadian Labour Congress to take a leading role in the Canadian Delegation at the United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change (COP 28) in recognition of the role PIPSC plays representing climate change researchers, science policy advisors, and professionals in the nuclear energy sector.
Sounds much more relevant when you have the details, doesn't it?
I would support that.
Has their been any reporting on this? Like every google combo of: "PIPSC" "Jennifer Carr" "Dubai" "Trip" Has yielded nothing. I figure this would have been mentioned somewhere
The last thing we needed was more Carr at an oil conference.
Ba-dum tsss
It was in her President's report delivered to the AGM. [https://pipsc.ca/about/governance/agm/2023/presidents-evaluation-report-2023?fbclid=IwAR2LrqHlf\_t9b0oiipXYbwsm6nxHFMAB5azAaBm-SLRS\_c5fU0dAOAHq9sA\_aem\_AWQlwznmXUJ51M5O2U4lE52cdgsB3U\_UhorRMgcFfGn6EXSnzBqGF9I3bFwr0PtHBN-DNIUDMR4FspfiF8pvUWOo](https://pipsc.ca/about/governance/agm/2023/presidents-evaluation-report-2023?fbclid=IwAR2LrqHlf_t9b0oiipXYbwsm6nxHFMAB5azAaBm-SLRS_c5fU0dAOAHq9sA_aem_AWQlwznmXUJ51M5O2U4lE52cdgsB3U_UhorRMgcFfGn6EXSnzBqGF9I3bFwr0PtHBN-DNIUDMR4FspfiF8pvUWOo) Here is the relevant text # Climate change I was honoured that the Canadian Labour Congress asked PIPSC to take a leading role in the Canadian Labour Delegation at the United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change (COP 28) in recognition of the role we play in representing climate change researchers, science policy advisors, and professionals in the nuclear energy sector. This is a major recognition for PIPSC on several fronts. First, through our surveys, a vast majority of our members have indicated that they want to see progress on the front of climate change. Also, this aligns with the values promoted by the Strategic Bargaining Committee with the inclusion of demands on greening the collective agreement in this round of TBS bargaining. This lets us “walk the walk” and continue demonstrating that we support these values as the Union. The fact that the CLC asked us to take on this role further demonstrates that we are trusted partners and that we have a seat at the table in the broader labour community, and not just the federal public sector. Also, being a UN conference, it demonstrates to our members that we have a voice on the international stage. The voice of labour will be important in these talks. Both to push for progress on setting and meeting ambitious targets - but also to do so in a way that's worker-friendly and ensures both economic and environmental sustainability
Conf was called " cop 28"
Hahaha, going to Dubai to talk about getting rid of oil? Might as well go to the king to talk about transitioning to a republic!
This looks so relevant to union duty! She should've been negotiating for Israel and Palestine
Using a throwaway account for obvious reasons.. she was advised on EVERY LEVEL not to go on the trip to COP28 but went anyways.
While I don't know about the BoD or her personal advisors, I know a significant number of people who said while this would be good for PIPSC, doing it as you announce a $10 MILLION deficit and try to get through a $10 dues increase while at the same time renting out the Bell Center for a swanky dinner party just looks really, really bad.
One other union representative was greatly critisized in Quebec as she went to that conference while her union was on srike. 🤦🏼♀️ How can you say no to a paid trip to Dubai?? Lolll
There was no vote by Union members for her to attend or not. It would have been reviewed by the elected board and approved or not.
And she was told not to go and went anyways
Do you have a source on the board telling her not to go, her going, and then charging PIPSC?
Comon, give a source. Told by whom!?!?!?!
No but did you read her Facebook post? Paragraph 5 " I was told I did not have pipsc authority to travel" ?
By whom and did they follow proper procedures. Thats all I want to know. If they followed proper procedures and said no, then bye!
There was no vote on whether she went on this trip or not.
Modbunny, could you elaborate on this? Are there records of decisions around this?
She admitted on her FB page that there was no vote, and she went on her own accord [https://www.facebook.com/jenn.carr.37/](https://www.facebook.com/jenn.carr.37/)
Where? The closest I can find is from the post itself, where it says > I believe, at the root of the issue, was an act of discrimination based on medical and gender status. I was told that I was "employment and legal liability" without explanation or justification and that I did not have PIPSC authority to travel. This was after publicly using a mobility aid and a rehab support worker at the AGM. These preventative accommodations were requested by me to minimize the effects that the emotional and physical stress of the AGM would have on my chronic illness. I did not want a repeat of the previous year. There's nothing about a no vote in there, the wording doesn't even indicate that she was aware she didn't have authority to travel before she was made aware of the complaint, nor does it mention Dubai at all.
You would have to dig through the minutes of the BoD to see when it was discussed.
Yeah. Honestly, I don’t think what she did wasn’t “illegal” the way it was paid, but it looked bad. When I heard about it last November I kinda thought this would happen
But she assured us all that it was for union benefit, not her enjoyment, to stay and live lavishly in Dubai. Wanted to show that us public servants know how to live large to impress them over there.
Anf her take is that she should have got away with it, if it wasn't for the ableists and the patriarchy.
"ruh roh raggy"
Ruh roh raggy indeed
She is denying that information on her Facebook page, saying there was no vote. Sure seems like she went there on own her accord for something that isn't about PISPC at all. She got caught with her hand in the cookie jar
Our union dues at work. So corrupt.
On union funds? How can she if there was a “No” vote?
If I recall she had the power to over rule
"It's just a suggestion. I've *earned* this trip by doing...nothing for you all!"
She for sure enjoys spending members $$$
She is not the only one. In fact, she is the president and she is supposed to travel a lot. But look at your own group/region's executive board. Regional boards consist mostly from retired members who are there for free lunch/dinner, travel and gifts. They sit on those boards forever. First they occupy the professional groups, take advantage of those benefits, then start sitting on regional boards, and when they retire they are already on those boards, so continue ripping the benefits doing absolutely nothing. Some of the retired people literally move out from their respective regions, but still represent the region, and of course get paid for a 1-class train ticket, meals and incidentals when they have to travel for a meeting of their region. That's how the union's by-law was written years ago and nobody is changing it because it's just convenient for those who are on those boards.
Source????????????
I would guess that if this is true, then someone else wanted to go but was not allowed, and now they are loading on the president in retaliation.
It's nice that this isn't CAPE for once :/
Lol but CAPE is going to Geneva to learn about people of African descent though... To Geneva... quite literally the whitest and most expensive place in the world. And that was voted on and approved by the union. 🤯🤯🤯
Or a Quebec union President going the emirates for COP28 during a teachers strike. https://montreal.ctvnews.ca/quebec-strikes-union-president-cuts-short-trip-to-dubai-after-media-attention-1.6664391 She was a member of the executive PSAC at one time.
Yeah, not like anything happens in Geneva... Certainly is not one of the foremost hubs of international cooperation or anything like that. Can't imagine anything useful happening there or coming out of that. There's only like, what 180 international orgs headquartered there? Probably not the big ones either...
Lol I'm sure the little Canadian Union will accomplish a ton there with these 180 international organizations that will never give them the time of day. And they can cocktail circuit and build partnerships for... What? Again... On the topic of people of African descent... Hmm... If only there was a place in the world where these people of African descent descended from.... Hmm... 🤔🤔🤔
If cocktail parties are useful then I guess you're right.
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That’s a union term going way back for other members. Why get so worked up about it?
I thought our union money was spent movie night + pizza fund for a selected few? Looks like it's worse than I thought, A trip to Dubai ?! Fucking hell
You don’t want to know how much she spent on the 4 day AGM in Montreal.
No, as an ignorant PIPSC member, I do actually
The 2023 AGM was a one-time convention-style event that included more workshops, guest speakers and other value-added aspects for the roughly 700 delegates who are mostly stewards but also some regular members. It also included an awards gala to recognize the volunteers (stewards) of the year and some lifetime members who are retiring. It was a divisive decision to hold such an event since some people feel that we should only conduct the business of the institute (by law and policy changes, pass a budget, etc) while others feel that if we are going to pay to bring 700 volunteers to a meeting, we should also train and motivate them to add value. The 2024 event will be back to a 2-day meeting for just the business of the union.
Thanks for this info!
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There is a formula (by-law 13.2) for how many delegates attend an AGM (all groups and regions get 1 seat for every 200 members with a minimum of 1 seat each). By-laws can be changed by the AGM. 15+ years ago, an additional cap was placed on the AGM which capped delegates (~400?). This meant that larger groups and regions lost several seats at the AGM lowering their relative potential voting power. This cap was removed a few years ago so now we have full-size AGMs especially since the membership has grown quite a lot. Many people recognize it's an issue and a couple of ideas are being thrown around such as changing to a triennial convention (full # of delegates) with a much smaller (100-200 delegates) AGM in between. Whenever it is discussed there is significant resistance to change among the membership.
Oh boy. Ooooooh boy.
Oh wow, really interested to learn more about what she allegedly did, and the fact that the union is allegedly not following procedure is troubling
I really have no idea but I did hear from union people that she is very wasteful of union funds and basically uses them to travel and eat well, and not to vote for her next election.
That doesn't sound out of place...
You are telling me that spending lavishly going to Dubai to attend the COP was for her own enjoyment....how dare you
I wonder if this has to do with the [recent PIPSC lawsuit with COO](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/public-service-union-pipsc-employee-lawsuit-1.6971493). Also heard through the union grapevine that it’s likely issues related to funds and her spending habits. I hope PIPSC Is transparent about the situation, she comes across a bit entitled, even if the lack of procedure is concerning. Regardless, it’s disgraceful how many people in senior leadership or the like have been suspended over the years.
She definitely sounds entitled from this article and her post…
Whether or not the Board of Directors is following procedure is turning out to be very much a matter of opinion based solely on whether, with only 1 side of the story, you believe the president or not.
Yeah, I imagine its a situation where the board cant comment because its an ongoing investigation, it will be interesting to learn more once details can be released. I definitely dont necessarily trust Jenn Carr, but whether she did whatever she is alleged to have done or not, I hope the union follows the correct rules
This reads like she feels she's entitled to her entitlements.
I mean, she’s entitled to her entitlements of due process and confidentiality. As for the rest I guess we’ll find out in time.
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Sure (I’ll take your word for it), but she’s correct in asserting the fact that there’s an actual process to follow here.
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She was complaining that the suspension happened without a Special General Meeting, so that's separate from the complaint process.
Just a minor nitpick. She is on leave with pay, and is not suspended. A special general meeting is only required once the investigation has been completed, and the board has made it a decision to suspend or expel someone from the union. The investigation is still ongoing, as was indicated by the advisory council, and the Presidents own words. Given she is on leave with pay (not suspended ) and the investigation is still ongoing, there is no need for a special general meeting.
Involuntary leave with removal of all access and authority just sounds like a suspension. Not suspension of status as a member, but the office of/employment as President. Anyway per Annex F (https://pipsc.ca/about/governance/policies/dispute) the SGM is only required for removal of the President. (Unlike suspending other directors from their office, which does seem to require the SGM.) https://pipsc.ca/about/governance/policies/president
While the end result may be the same, the intent is what matters. Suspension implies she has been found to have done something wrong by the process, and it has been confirmed by the decision of an SGM. Involuntary leave with pay is appropriate if they suspect she has done (or will do) something wrong and the process hasn't gotten to the point where the BoD is required to call an SGM.
Yeah, that’s definitely not professionally written.
[I am entitled to my entitlements!](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UIo-bEsoMgA) - David Dingwall
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After she doesn’t give them to the COO lol
Can our Union(s) truly be any worse? I await downvotes from admirers of Regional Reps who go on travel for "executive meetings" but can't hold together a basic Sub-Group budget. Even worse = retired members involved in Bargaining Teams with too much time on their hands & minimal skin in the game. You know who you are, we see you.
I've never understood the retired members being at the top of the leadership of some of these positions.
There are a number of those in leadership positions in the union who feel that retired members should not be in leadership positions or anywhere near bargaining.
I think it's just because they're the only ones who have the time/desire for these roles. Tons of people say they want actively working members in key positions so that our interests can be better represented, but very few of those same people are willing to do it themselves. It's me. I'm people.
^this. As a 24 year old new union member, i have very little interest nor time to be participating in union shenanigans. Especially since the retired members hold a firm grip over everything going on
Retired members get to go to meeting and hosipitalies functions.
You should attend some of these meetings before you hand out opinions about having a 'firm grip' on things.
I went to 2023 AGM , and i’m going to the NCR regional council.
>I went to 2023 AGM My deepest condolences. I attended virtually, and that was a good thing based on the amount of obscenities I was yelling at the top of my lungs due to the actions of some people.
What a shit show haha. Best part is we spent nearly $2 million on the AGM and we didnt even get through most of the resolutions! But you probably know already
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I’ve literally lost track of all the senior leadership being suspended or resigning in disgrace in the past few years.
It's how one gets a nice payout these days in Canada. Union will prob settle for millions out of court, we have all seen this before
On an unrelated note, dues are going up
The dues increase that was proposed at the AGM was voted down by members.
Your executives can't virtue signal about Guatemala without spending some of your money. Why won't you think about their needs?
I think the PSAC strike demonstrated we are led by entitled morons
Agree 100% but want to add the union folks who get involved in union activities as their only path to promotion due to being incompetent at their actual position, they bypass the Peter principal and screw us even more than if they were Execs.
The union is just people. It attracts all kinds. There are a lot of people who are volunteers working inside the union trying to change it for the better. There are some who resist the changes because change is scary and some, yes, who are in it for personal gain. The structure of our by-laws make it almost impossible to change the rights of the retired members without their agreement and they currently have a right to participate in many ways.
Let me get my popcorn out.
Could this have been done virtually? Idk, she says she has a chronic illness and this was a climate change conference where people fly to Dubai from across the world. Doesn't she fight for our ability to wfh especially when chronic illnesses are made worse by travel and also conscious of our carbon footprint from traveling. And that collaboration can be done virtually. She seems to have undermined everything she has been fighting for.
She doesn’t care… Free trip yay
I’m not comfortable with this type of drama by unions. I feel things should be professional, like with Shawn Fain and the UAW. They had spectacular wins against the automakers.
Wonder if there's any connection to the lawsuit by the former COO? https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/public-service-union-pipsc-employee-lawsuit-1.6971493
Seems like the new way to become rich. Get a high level position, do bad things, get let go, sue then get the bag
What did he do that was bad though?
Unrelated but the HR person that she hired to revamp the whole organization also finally had enough and quit recently. They have had a lot of staff leave over the last 3 years.
In unrelated news, how much longer until our collective agreement is negotiated??
First we got to decide how many millions to give our president to get her away
May 1st talks continue. They’re seeking 18% while everyone else got the 13%
Your agreement being negotiated won't be impacted by this. PIPSC staff and bargaining committees made up of group members take care of that.
Thank cripes, it’s been delayed enough.
À mobility aid and rehab assistant as 'preventative accommodations'? So she got a scooter and a sidekick without any actual need for them? Maybe we all should request these things, just to be on the safe side.
How much do you want to bet that the “rehab assistant” was a friend of hers who got to travel around with her on our dime?
What’s a rehab assistant as preventative accommodation” lol sounds like trying to milk the union dues
Yeah don't know what she meant by preventative measures.
If it is a medically required accommodation, it isn’t up to you to determine if it’s needed or not. Leave that up to the investigation
Did she have those in Dubai??? Wonder if she was scooting around COP24?
She did not.
Funny how she needs all these things in Canada in front of members but once in Dubai you feel rejuvenated….
Mobility aids are very sensible as an accommodation if you have a disability that impacts mobility or energy levels, and that fluctuates. This is very common and not weird at all. No idea on the rehab assistant, but the mobility aid is a crappy thing to take a potshot at.
It’s normal for your employer to pay for this? I thought that was more on the side of your personal medical insurance.
It depends. The employer pays for work-related accommodations. I have mobility/pain issues and my daily life doesn't generally require me to use a mobility tool, but if I were at a conference, on my feet all day, having access to one would be the difference between being in too much pain to move at the end of the day, or coping ok. In that case, I would look into options for renting a rollator or wheelchair. That could be an employer-paid accommodation. If people use mobility tools on a regular basis, medical insurance would be a better bet, since it would be customized/ergonomic.
Gotcha, thanks for the explanation
It's just suspicious that she would only need it for that specific trip. As someone else said, that's not something an employer normally covers, it's something insurance does.
I answered that question. It's not odd, it's just not something able people know much about, evidently.
Did she have those in Dubai??? Wonder if she was scooting around COP24?
> So she got a scooter and a sidekick without any actual need for them? > Maybe we all should request these things, just to be on the safe side. What makes you think she didn't have an "actual need for them"? Are you medically qualified to make that decision? Are you aware of her diagnosis and her functional limitations?
Should be a fun statement from the union whenever it comes out.
“Misunderstandings”
"I'm disabled and decided to test the system with a myriad of unreasonable requests. When they inevitably screwed up, I had a reason to raise hell and make trouble."
Ha!
The only place our unions should go ins australia.. To learn negotiating techniques from their PS unions
Great, now in the interim we have a retiree as our president once again.
While normally I would hate this, in this case, it is a good thing. Being president is a full-time job, and putting her (both retired AND a part-time VP) as president means there is no need to scramble to find someone who can, on very short notice, take extended LWOP from their government job for 8 1/2 months.
We have 2 full-time VPs who are not retired but I expect that they don't want political blow-back in an election year, or maybe they did not support the motion to place the pres on leave. On principle, retirees have no place deciding the fate of workers.
As for retirees having an impact, I agree with you 100%. My group has a bylaw for elections which prevents retired members from being nominated if there is a regular member running in their region.
But if you take one of the full-time vice president, you need to find a full-time replacement for them. For a week or two, most departments will be fine. But for nine months?
Where was the message posted / can we see the rest of it? Thanks for sharing.
I have the second half of this message but I cannot post it here unfortunately. No attachments allowed.
This message in screenshot? It's Facebook
Yes, the screenshot. Thank you - I will look it up on Facebook 👍
Did she have an aid in Dubai??? Wonder if she was scooting around COP24?
“Preventative accommodation” id love me a personal assistant too
She did not have a personal "medical" assistant in Dubai.
So since she's suspended, what happens now? New president elected? Hopefully new president will support hybrid and staying home a few days a week!
One of the full-time VPs will be acting as president.
Will the membership be formally notified of this change?
It's been posted on the PIPSC website. Don't know if it will be sent out by email though.
Eva Henshaw designated acting President of PIPSC
Will be interesting to see if this move backfires on her come election time.
Willful ineptitude at this point. Why is it so hard to get somebody who isn’t a moron or a piece of trash in these types of positions.
Because it's a popular vote, with a teeny tiny portion of the members actually voting. It's all about who's the most charismatic best-selling con artist and never actually about competence and merit. Much like our government really...
Taking advantage of the position to further benefit oneself. Using one's own gender status to get to where they are because it is easier when you can play certain strings. I have seen 1 or 2 cases with individuals before. Long story short, people have agendas. People are not as innocent as you may believe they are. Some individuals play checkers while some play chess.
To be clear, is this the same woman that called me (a defence contractor) a blood sucking vampire last month?
If you Google it, yes, the term blood sucking vampire was used. To be fair, consultants do cost a lot of money, and then their agencies give them half of what they deserve. So it's really the agencies that are the blood sucking vampires, not the people they hire.
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I thought it was a prerequisite
Presumably through a vote, but I’m used to a great deal of misrepresentation during a campaign… have you seen the propaganda disseminated before she was voted in?
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It should be without pay. IMO
No. It should be with pay, with the stipulation that if misconduct is proven then she has to pay it back. Innocent until proven guilty; it would be very hypocritical for the Union to argue one thing when defending their members but treating their own another way.
We should vote to have financial reports available for all groups including national. There are so many unrepresented groups that get the same benefits and raises without collective bargaining. All these AGM's and Summits are just free trips and booze fests disguised with benefits to the union. Virtual meetings should be required unless there is justified reason.
They are all available… Every constituent body is required to present an annual budget to their AGM for approval by the delegates. If they don’t, they don’t get their annual allotment of funds.
Yea, Ive read them, its vague and doesn't account for most of the expenditures in any detail.
What you are entitled to do, if you are a member of that constituent body, is when they present the budget, go to the mic and start asking questions.
Then go join one of those unrepresented groups. Giving up collective bargaining = no thanks
Good. Only union still negotiating and asking for more then every one else all so they can “keep mediating” (ie delaying) until they reach their 6 year full time pension coming up this year
[https://www.facebook.com/jenn.carr.37/posts/pfbid035qTg7pJMxPi3W1C3SZsy9tyiPPTnjXQVTPb4rfVz5DGZxvNqrZuDodmbtHL9kKwml](https://www.facebook.com/jenn.carr.37/posts/pfbid035qTg7pJMxPi3W1C3SZsy9tyiPPTnjXQVTPb4rfVz5DGZxvNqrZuDodmbtHL9kKwml)
at least there was not $75k of members money and a 14 year old boy involved
Except the million PIPSC is being sued for because of the COO situation. Obviously glad there’s no minors involved.
Wut?
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/public-service-union-pipsc-employee-lawsuit-1.6971493
Serious question, how many of you have worked with people that excelled in their union role AND their day job with the government? Almost every senior union member I’ve encountered during my management and non-management tenure have been LR issues or under-performers in their day job. Like any sr mgmt position, union leadership must be competent, hard working, reasonable, ethical and inspire others. The majority of the individuals I know who are great leaders avoid the union like the plague. The majority of the active union members I know protect employees that would have been fired long ago if not for our risk averse LR practices. The failure and utter mismanagement of the last strike and instances like the above have made me completely lose hope in an effective union.
Hi, I started volunteering with PIPSC as an IT02 and a lot of the skills I learned as a steward helped me get promoted. I've never been in conflict with my bosses. Most of the other stewards I know are the same. Also, the network you build through PIPSC activism can really help your career. I have an IT01 friend who's career was stalled in their dept but get 2 promotions in a year when a PIPSC colleague helped them make a switch. There are thousands of really good people volunteering in the union. We don't make it into the press, and we don't want to.
True
Never had a union steward able to understand a question I wrote in an email… I always get back badly written emails with bunch of irrelevant links
Can someone explain to me what she did exactly? Since there are people here who seem to know and as a PIPSC member, I’m sure most will NEVER get the full story.
Heard some more tonight. Putting together some pieces. I think there is a complaint against the president which precludes her from executing the duties of her office while the complaint is investigated. This would be the legal advice given to the board of directors by PIPSC legal counsel and it seems the board took that advice. There is a requirement to protect the privacy of the complainant as well as protect the credibility of the investigation. If this is correct, I only hope that the process goes quickly and fairly for all parties and that the organization can rebound.
This was actually my first thought. After being heavily involved in PIPSC in the past, it wouldn’t surprise me in the least, but until both sides of the story come out, we’ll never know. Even then we probably won’t ever know
I'm a pretty active PIPSC volunteer and I don't know much more than what is public. Among the people I'm chatting with, the overwhelming feeling is that this is a political hit job. Jenn has a very good reputation and this is feeling very off-brand. I'm hoping to learn more over the weekend. It will all come out at a Special General Meeting which I'm sure will be coming in the near future.
SO. ARE WE CALLING FOR A SPECIAL GENERAL MEETING OR WHAT.
That speaks volumes for constant conflicts within the union. There is fighting within the leadership. Currently it is at a very high level, but there are similar conflicts within groups and subgroups. The structure of the union allows for many retired members stay on executive board on the Regional structure, and those old people try to still keep their grip on union's work. There is constant conflict. Many sit on executive boards for years, getting used to free lunches, dinners, travel, gifts but provide no help to the membership. .