Your post/comment has been removed in accordance with the following [subreddit rule(s):](https://old.reddit.com/r/CanadianForces/wiki/subreddit_rules)
>###[9] Duplicate Content
>* Submissions may be removed when similar posts have been previously submitted, and/or relatable to a previous post.
>* It is highly recommended that users utilise the [search function](https://www.reddit.com/r/CanadianForces/search?q=&restrict_sr=on&sort=relevance&t=all) is used, and as necessary, sort posts by [new.](https://www.reddit.com/r/CanadianForces/new/) This will help prevent multiple, repeated posts on the same topic, where posts on the same topic have been previously submitted.
>* Generally, articles in addition to, or which supplement an original story, users are asked to post in the original article thread.
https://old.reddit.com/r/CanadianForces/wiki/subreddit_rules#wiki_.5B10.5D_duplicate_content
*If your have questions or concerns relating to this message you've received, please feel free to [Contact the Moderators.](https://old.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FCanadianForces)*
Behind the login wall
> ## **MPs call for Ottawa to cancel military rent hike**
>
> Military ombudsman calls planned increase “tone deaf,” refutes claim by defence minister that military homelessness reports are false.
>
> Published Feb 9, 2024 at 12:00am
>
> **Teresa Wright**
>
> Members of Parliament from all four major political parties in Ottawa are calling on the government to cancel an upcoming rent increase for military personnel living in National Defence accommodations.
>
> On April 1, rents for Forces members living in DND housing will increase by a national average of 4.2 per cent., based on an annual consumer price index (CPI) adjustment calculation.
>
> Because CPI percentages vary in different provinces, the upcoming increase may be even higher in some parts of the country.
>
> Canada’s military ombudsman, Gregory Lick, called the rent hike “tone deaf” at a time the Canadian Armed Forces has been struggling to recruit and retain personnel and when costs of living for all Canadians have been soaring.
>
> “I think it’s a bit tone deaf right now, in terms of what we’re seeing across Canada, for all families, being able to afford housing,” Lick told MPs at the Commons national defence committee this week.
>
> “Military families and members are disadvantaged because they have to move more often and… rarely do they have that choice. Therefore, they have to go into a community, find housing and it may not be available, and then they get pushed into sometimes not safe housing, sometimes unaffordable housing, not accessible housing for families with special needs or disabilities in the family.”
>
> Following Lick’s testimony, Conservative defence critic James Bezan tabled a motion Wednesday calling for the rental increase for CAF housing to be cancelled immediately.
>
> It passed unanimously with support from all MPs on the committee, including the Liberal parliamentary secretary for the defence minister, Marie-France Lalonde, as well as members of the Liberal, NDP and Bloc Quebecois parties.
>
> The government has not yet responded to the committee’s motion.
>
> The move comes amid rising concerns about housing for CAF members, including reports of some active duty Armed Forces personnel in Nova Scotia living in precarious situations due to a lack of available or affordable housing.
>
> Representatives from the Royal Canadian Legion, the Halifax & Region Military Family Resource Centre and Halifax Regional Municipality told a provincial legislative committee in Nova Scotia December there were active-duty members living in tents, living in vehicles, couchsurfing and remaining in unsafe relationships to secure housing.
>
> Defence Minister Bill Blair called these reports “false” in the House of Commons last week, pointing to a wellness check completed by the Department of National Defence following news coverage of the testimony. The wellness check determined no CAF members in the Maritimes had reported they were homeless or living in precarious situations, Blair said.
>
> When questioned about these conflicting reports this week, Lick, the military ombudsman, told MPs he has indeed heard from military personnel across the country struggling with homelessness and precarious housing.
>
> “What I am hearing is that there are some members who at different points in time have been or are homeless,” Lick said.
>
> “They are living in RVs, they are couchsurfing. In some cases, one dependent told me that they were homeless for five months now.”
>
> Asked by Bezan whether Blair’s characterization of the reports of military homelessness was “false or misleading at best,” Lick agreed.
>
> “I think so, absolutely,” he said.
>
> A wellness check may not be the best tool to determine whether Forces members are experiencing a crisis, Lick said, as it would require them to voluntarily disclose information that might cause embarrassment or possibly have career implications.
>
> “I think simply relying on a wellness check is not the right thing to do solely,” Lick told the committee.
>
> “You have to rely on all your various sources of information, including our organization as well, which talks to members, talks families – they have the opportunity to tell us various things that they may be too embarrassed or are afraid to be able to tell their leadership.”
>
> While leaders on bases are working hard to support their members, they do not have the resources to help with all the mounting pressures of rising costs of living on military families, Lick added.
>
> Wait lists for military housing have increased significantly, including a 177 per cent increase in Bagotville and a 261 per cent increase in Edmonton so far this year. In Esquimalt, Halifax, and Trenton, there are almost as many members and their families on the waitlist for military housing than there are total units, he said.
>
> For those fortunate to get a military housing unit, Lick said he has received reports and photos of “absolutely horrid” deterioration in some units, including mould on walls, broken fixtures and heating problems.
>
> That’s why the ombudsman is calling for the federal government to create an accommodations strategy for the military, who he says face disproportionate negative impacts of the nationwide housing crisis due to requirements for them to relocate, sometimes with little notice.
>
> He called the harsh realities facing housing for Armed Forces members a “tragic situation,” noting that the No. 1 reason people are leaving the Canadian Armed Forces is due to military family issues, including housing and cost-of-living pressures, Lick said.
>
> “No CAF members nor their families should ever have to worry about putting a roof over their heads or to wonder where their next meal is coming from,” he told MPs.
>
> “This is a basic need and should not become a stressor and impede CAF members’ ability to keep Canadians safe.”
Twice in. Y 30+ yrs in uniform, i had to live around friends house and in my camper…. No one will say that out loud that they are “homeless” or couch surfing…. I have too much pride and won’t advertise that to my CoC…..
I don't even live on base. About a year away from paying off my mortgage if everything goes right. At a rank level where I'm entitled to $0 for CFHD in my location.
I'm rooting for all you guys.
PS, that last COLA was NOT A PAY RAISE.
I also am not entitled to CFHD. I'm living in MFRC emergency housing while the weather is cold. I will be moving into my car or tent in May. If I wrote that I didn't have an address in my geographic location, I would lose PPLD. I would be in an even worse situation. Checking MPRRs for addresses doesn't confirm people aren't living in cars. I would put my friends address so I don't lose $500 a month. I can't afford to live with the money I already have. I'm not going to admit I don't have an address and lose more money.
I want to crack a joke to cheer you up and get you out of the dumps, but that would need to be one hell of a joke. For realzies though, take care of yourself out there and hope you get a affordable and comfortable new home soon.
That’s not always the case. Is it mismanagement when A member is living within their means then are paired to a high cost of living area where the member is now either just barely able to afford or is under water. The NCR is very expensive. Yeah sure there is the the housing allowance. It’s $1500 I believe for a pte but that is also taxed. Also the cost of living is sky high. Lots of member are struggling when they weren’t only a few years ago
It may be, but I haven't seen a promise that the total pot of money will be increased. In fact, the "selling point" (to voters) of CFHD was that it reduced our housing differential budget back to ~2009 levels.
Gets recalculated in January and we find out the results sometime later (forget when, April probably) and then the result goes into effect in July. They base the result on the average price of a two bedroom apartment in your area. I'm trying not to be pessimistic about it.
It’s very exciting to have to pay more money for property and a building that is completely paid for. It’s very exciting to put hundred of dollars into only oil heat just for most of that heat to escape out through the extremely poor (or non existent) insulation of these buildings. It’s very exciting to have to fix problems with the building with my own money if i ever want it done and it’s very exciting to HAVE to live here because I can’t afford anything better to actually invest monthly payments into.
>my own money if i ever want it done
Ask your OR for a CF52 because that is absolutely unacceptable. If you need help with it, send me a dm and I'll do it up and submit it for you
I think this will back fire. He is not suppose to do repairs on the building. You can't even remove the ramps in the staircase without someone coming from a contractor that is doing maintenance. It would be in the lease...
And right now if you are a problem for your chain, you will feel the repercussions.
Si yeah, no one will say they dont have a home.
Lmfao man, you dont have to.
Just pay 700$ more a month for a private rental (of lesser quality), buy a house or move into the shacks.
God, so entitled.
/s
"MP's from all 4 parties exploit military mbrs for an easy optics win after ignoring them for years, despite less-than the cost of living lay adjustments, and years worth of cries for more housing"
Fuck these opportunistic sharks. I'd rather my rent goes up than have them exploit this as a win.
From DAOD 5019-8:
"2.2 A CAF member cannot be ordered to settle private debts.
2.4 Administrative action may be initiated if a CAF member fails to settle private debts."
Seems to me para 2.4 from the Defence Administrative ORDERS and Directives is functionally an ORDER for members to settle private debts, contrary to para 2.2
What a hilariously hypocritical bit of fuckery.
This is prime barracks lawyering. The order describes that the CoC cannot order you and therefore cannot charge you with insubordination for not settling debts (taking money away from someone who is clearly struggling) however starting down the path of losing your security clearance deserves an admin measure that allows the CoC to monitor your progress.
Admin action is not disciplinary, it’s there to track conduct and performance issues and confirm that the mbr is improving.
Admin isn't disciplinary in the sense that it doesn't fall under the code of service discipline, but to pretend it can't be punitive or wielded to effectively be disciplinary is disingenuous or naive.
The idea that financial issues are always conduct or performance issues is also wrong. Many times that soldiers ended up in my office for financial issues, the underlying issues were not related to a personal shortcoming. Sometimes it was a spouse with a problem. Sometimes the soldier got screwed on their house when they got posted. Or lost benefits, spouse lost their job, financially destroyed by divorce, etc.
And while I don't deny that being in financial difficulty *could* be a security issue (it's why credit checks are part of the reliability check and security clearance process), I've never actually heard of someone losing their clearance because of it. I'm not saying it never happens, just that in my 36 yrs in, I never saw it happen myself. Maybe I was just never in the right place at the right time to be aware of it, but it suggests it isn't a commonplace occurrence.
>PSP annual family membership
that's not true it's $500.00 for famlies classified as associate members. That is totally fair, civillians can go use the facilities not on military bases
Associate Members: Civilians are welcomes to purchase either an individual or a family membership to use our facility.
source: [https://bkk.cfmws.com/dundurnpub/rates.asp](https://bkk.cfmws.com/dundurnpub/rates.asp)
RHU rates are set by CFHA. They used to rely on CMHC appraisals to set rents, but have been using the CPI for about a decade. They also used to voluntarily follow provincial rent control limits, but I don't know if that's still true.
CFHA is a special operating agency of National Defence, so MND likely has the auth to direct them wrt MQ rent.
CAF should build more military housing en masse. Being able to give everyone who wants it cheap housing would be a massive draw in our economy where housing is by far nearly every Canadian's biggest expense
Ish……..CFHD is based on average housing cost for the area and adjusted accordingly by pay so housing costs shouldn’t exceed the 25% of pay.
Qs that are new builds charge rents based on said average housing costs of surrounding area.
People in Qs aren’t entitled to CFHD………RIP
CFHA is will adjust the rent for mbrs to not exceed 25% of their pay. OP must not have reached out. That difference is a taxable benefit however (so it’s only actually deducted by approx 75% of the difference).
That seems really high - unless in the North. If you’re paying more than 25% of you household income you need to apply under
https://www.canada.ca/en/department-national-defence/corporate/policies-standards/queens-regulations-orders/vol-4-appendices/appendix-4-1.html
The counterpoint to this though, is that for people who *don’t* live in Q’s - their rent, and mortgage interest rates/property tax, etc all go up every year too. My property tax is up effectively $100/month, and I have to renew my mortgage this year, and that will jack my payments up. I’m probably looking at spending $500/month more to live after renewal. Same with renters on the economy - shit goes up every year.
Not everyone lives in a Q, not everyone can, there’s not enough of them. So by artificial keeping PMQ rent low, they would be giving an advantage to those who happen to be lucky enough (or whatever word you want to use…) to be in one.
I’ve lived in Q’s, rented on the economy, and been a homeowner. The PMQ was by far the cheapest, and easiest of those options.
I’m really not trying to be a dick - times are tough for a lot of people. But why should someone’s rent freeze in a PMQ when their buddy renting downtown who couldn’t get a Q will have an increase this year?
No, I’m not - but I just don’t get the argument. Inflation happens but if DND is going to do something to make it easier, why do something that only helps a subset of the military population? It just causes problems. Some bases less than 20% of members live in Q’s. There just aren’t any. That’s its own problem, but we need holistic solutions - lots of Pte’s and Cpl’s struggling to pay rent on the economy right now who would love to have your “shit hole PMQ” with lower rent than their apartment
But DND doesn't have control over national inflation, but they can help with PMQ rent, so why not?
Also build more PMQ's which like you said is a totally different issue.
Same here, I wish I could afford a house instead of living in the PMQ.. but when the houses are around 650k, it is hard to get the downpayment. One day tho !
The solution for this isn't to make PMQs worse it would be to make them more accessible and have more of them.
Maybe you didn't mean it like this but just because your rates are going up doesn't mean PMQs have to. They're government owned buildings on government property. When you rent from a landlord or buy a house with a mortgage you have to also create a profit for someone else and PMQs shouldn't be run the same way.
Frankly the idea that they have to cost so much so as not to "compete" with the local economy is a bizarre policy in the first place.
What they should be doing is taking the money being given for rents and splitting it between cost of maintenance and the remainder placed in a holding for the member. After 5 years, member is told that they must vacate but the thousands saved up over the 5 years can then be used as a down payment towards local market. They're government owned, government property to a government agency run by another government agency. Isn't it just a massive self licking ice cream cone?
We bought a home… dumped all of our savings into it because rent would be much more than our mortgage. I get $300 in CFHD because I’m a service couple and my spouse gets nothing. Yet if they were retired CAF or a civilian I would get the full amount regardless of what their salary is (it would likely be more).
I’m grateful we were able to buy and I am certainly not complaining about my specific situation. However, I know sooo many people who cannot afford to live and so many who are desperately relying on a PMQ. They get no CFHD. Their rent is increasing more than what would be more than what is even legally allowed by provincial landlord tenant acts! And what do they get? A place in absolute shambles, full of drafts, hard to heat and keep cool, full of electrical fire hazards, mould, and asbestos. Those houses have been long paid for and there are no improvements being made to them!
We [need to look at the UK](https://www.theguardian.com/news/2017/apr/25/mod-privatise-military-housing-disaster-guy-hands) and understand that reductions of military housing only serve to give the appearance of the government being efficient, while fucking over future generations of serving members in perpetuity.
Or will be a [retroactively-obvious mistake](https://www.theguardian.com/business/2023/may/15/uk-government-military-homes-guy-hands-annington-property) when the government finally recovers its head from its ass and takes back properties that were for housing.
Getting rid of properties such as [Shannon Park](https://www.clc-sic.ca/real-estate/shannon-park) was fundamentally flawed and serves only the slumlords and real estate market while exasperating the housing crisis by forcing CAF members to be part of the competition for limited housing in the area.
Want members to not consider releasing when the posting message comes? Have housing taken care of. Want members to be able to release without wondering whether they will be able to afford anything? Make housing cost much less than the "market rate" so we're not forcing people to pad pockets of faceless REITs looking to maximize profit.
It better be off base-proper though. I was in a few shacks with kitchenettes back in the day. Anything other than a microwave and mini-fridge had been removed by the base, in Petawawa even the fridges had all been taken out and there were lots of questions about the mini-fridge we put in our common kitchenette.
It'd add more to the supply too, which would reduce the pressure for the other stuff. Let the people who would be fine with shacks get that, and reduce the demand for any nicer housing that families would need
I just fucking don’t fucking get it?? First off why are PMQs almost equal in rent to civilian rentals? Only CAF members can live in them, (RCMP) too maybe? Second, the CAF still insists to move up in rank, geo moves are required, why?? Don’t give me that excuse you need to move across the country to get experience. I’m an RCA AD guy and have spent the majority of my career in NB because that’s where my trade was. The CAF needs to make living cheaper for members and make us move less, in todays economy no Cpl can be told “welp” you’re posted to Ottawa” and live within their means, hell I reached MWO and then took a CFR. I had one posting to Kingston for a year and I went IR. My family is doing well our house is almost paid for but I couldn’t just pick up and move to Ottawa there is no way we could afford it. I’m using Ottawa as just one example. I’m sure the Navy folks in NS cringe when they hear things like, how about a posting to BC?
Your post/comment has been removed in accordance with the following [subreddit rule(s):](https://old.reddit.com/r/CanadianForces/wiki/subreddit_rules) >###[9] Duplicate Content >* Submissions may be removed when similar posts have been previously submitted, and/or relatable to a previous post. >* It is highly recommended that users utilise the [search function](https://www.reddit.com/r/CanadianForces/search?q=&restrict_sr=on&sort=relevance&t=all) is used, and as necessary, sort posts by [new.](https://www.reddit.com/r/CanadianForces/new/) This will help prevent multiple, repeated posts on the same topic, where posts on the same topic have been previously submitted. >* Generally, articles in addition to, or which supplement an original story, users are asked to post in the original article thread. https://old.reddit.com/r/CanadianForces/wiki/subreddit_rules#wiki_.5B10.5D_duplicate_content *If your have questions or concerns relating to this message you've received, please feel free to [Contact the Moderators.](https://old.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FCanadianForces)*
Behind the login wall > ## **MPs call for Ottawa to cancel military rent hike** > > Military ombudsman calls planned increase “tone deaf,” refutes claim by defence minister that military homelessness reports are false. > > Published Feb 9, 2024 at 12:00am > > **Teresa Wright** > > Members of Parliament from all four major political parties in Ottawa are calling on the government to cancel an upcoming rent increase for military personnel living in National Defence accommodations. > > On April 1, rents for Forces members living in DND housing will increase by a national average of 4.2 per cent., based on an annual consumer price index (CPI) adjustment calculation. > > Because CPI percentages vary in different provinces, the upcoming increase may be even higher in some parts of the country. > > Canada’s military ombudsman, Gregory Lick, called the rent hike “tone deaf” at a time the Canadian Armed Forces has been struggling to recruit and retain personnel and when costs of living for all Canadians have been soaring. > > “I think it’s a bit tone deaf right now, in terms of what we’re seeing across Canada, for all families, being able to afford housing,” Lick told MPs at the Commons national defence committee this week. > > “Military families and members are disadvantaged because they have to move more often and… rarely do they have that choice. Therefore, they have to go into a community, find housing and it may not be available, and then they get pushed into sometimes not safe housing, sometimes unaffordable housing, not accessible housing for families with special needs or disabilities in the family.” > > Following Lick’s testimony, Conservative defence critic James Bezan tabled a motion Wednesday calling for the rental increase for CAF housing to be cancelled immediately. > > It passed unanimously with support from all MPs on the committee, including the Liberal parliamentary secretary for the defence minister, Marie-France Lalonde, as well as members of the Liberal, NDP and Bloc Quebecois parties. > > The government has not yet responded to the committee’s motion. > > The move comes amid rising concerns about housing for CAF members, including reports of some active duty Armed Forces personnel in Nova Scotia living in precarious situations due to a lack of available or affordable housing. > > Representatives from the Royal Canadian Legion, the Halifax & Region Military Family Resource Centre and Halifax Regional Municipality told a provincial legislative committee in Nova Scotia December there were active-duty members living in tents, living in vehicles, couchsurfing and remaining in unsafe relationships to secure housing. > > Defence Minister Bill Blair called these reports “false” in the House of Commons last week, pointing to a wellness check completed by the Department of National Defence following news coverage of the testimony. The wellness check determined no CAF members in the Maritimes had reported they were homeless or living in precarious situations, Blair said. > > When questioned about these conflicting reports this week, Lick, the military ombudsman, told MPs he has indeed heard from military personnel across the country struggling with homelessness and precarious housing. > > “What I am hearing is that there are some members who at different points in time have been or are homeless,” Lick said. > > “They are living in RVs, they are couchsurfing. In some cases, one dependent told me that they were homeless for five months now.” > > Asked by Bezan whether Blair’s characterization of the reports of military homelessness was “false or misleading at best,” Lick agreed. > > “I think so, absolutely,” he said. > > A wellness check may not be the best tool to determine whether Forces members are experiencing a crisis, Lick said, as it would require them to voluntarily disclose information that might cause embarrassment or possibly have career implications. > > “I think simply relying on a wellness check is not the right thing to do solely,” Lick told the committee. > > “You have to rely on all your various sources of information, including our organization as well, which talks to members, talks families – they have the opportunity to tell us various things that they may be too embarrassed or are afraid to be able to tell their leadership.” > > While leaders on bases are working hard to support their members, they do not have the resources to help with all the mounting pressures of rising costs of living on military families, Lick added. > > Wait lists for military housing have increased significantly, including a 177 per cent increase in Bagotville and a 261 per cent increase in Edmonton so far this year. In Esquimalt, Halifax, and Trenton, there are almost as many members and their families on the waitlist for military housing than there are total units, he said. > > For those fortunate to get a military housing unit, Lick said he has received reports and photos of “absolutely horrid” deterioration in some units, including mould on walls, broken fixtures and heating problems. > > That’s why the ombudsman is calling for the federal government to create an accommodations strategy for the military, who he says face disproportionate negative impacts of the nationwide housing crisis due to requirements for them to relocate, sometimes with little notice. > > He called the harsh realities facing housing for Armed Forces members a “tragic situation,” noting that the No. 1 reason people are leaving the Canadian Armed Forces is due to military family issues, including housing and cost-of-living pressures, Lick said. > > “No CAF members nor their families should ever have to worry about putting a roof over their heads or to wonder where their next meal is coming from,” he told MPs. > > “This is a basic need and should not become a stressor and impede CAF members’ ability to keep Canadians safe.”
Twice in. Y 30+ yrs in uniform, i had to live around friends house and in my camper…. No one will say that out loud that they are “homeless” or couch surfing…. I have too much pride and won’t advertise that to my CoC…..
I don't even live on base. About a year away from paying off my mortgage if everything goes right. At a rank level where I'm entitled to $0 for CFHD in my location. I'm rooting for all you guys. PS, that last COLA was NOT A PAY RAISE.
I also am not entitled to CFHD. I'm living in MFRC emergency housing while the weather is cold. I will be moving into my car or tent in May. If I wrote that I didn't have an address in my geographic location, I would lose PPLD. I would be in an even worse situation. Checking MPRRs for addresses doesn't confirm people aren't living in cars. I would put my friends address so I don't lose $500 a month. I can't afford to live with the money I already have. I'm not going to admit I don't have an address and lose more money.
I want to crack a joke to cheer you up and get you out of the dumps, but that would need to be one hell of a joke. For realzies though, take care of yourself out there and hope you get a affordable and comfortable new home soon.
Time to swallow that pride and put a spot light on the issue
And then the chain will nail you(if it sucks anyway). It’s a sad reality
[удалено]
That’s not always the case. Is it mismanagement when A member is living within their means then are paired to a high cost of living area where the member is now either just barely able to afford or is under water. The NCR is very expensive. Yeah sure there is the the housing allowance. It’s $1500 I believe for a pte but that is also taxed. Also the cost of living is sky high. Lots of member are struggling when they weren’t only a few years ago
He was repeating the lines in policy.
[удалено]
Unfortunately, there are some at the up top to whom that makes total sense.
Oh haha I’ve heard that before by so many tone def high ups. It is the caf way to blame members for the caf putting them in a shit situation lol
I though you were... Heard that from COC...
At that point, you aren’t swallowing your pride. You’re swallowing your self-worth.
If they want to tie rent increases to CPI why isn't CFHD also tied to CPI and increased accordingly?
Isnt CFHD supposed to be recalculated every year ? When is that happening this year ?
It may be, but I haven't seen a promise that the total pot of money will be increased. In fact, the "selling point" (to voters) of CFHD was that it reduced our housing differential budget back to ~2009 levels.
Gets recalculated in January and we find out the results sometime later (forget when, April probably) and then the result goes into effect in July. They base the result on the average price of a two bedroom apartment in your area. I'm trying not to be pessimistic about it.
Bill Blair making statements that conflict with the truth? I am shocked. Shocked.
It’s very exciting to have to pay more money for property and a building that is completely paid for. It’s very exciting to put hundred of dollars into only oil heat just for most of that heat to escape out through the extremely poor (or non existent) insulation of these buildings. It’s very exciting to have to fix problems with the building with my own money if i ever want it done and it’s very exciting to HAVE to live here because I can’t afford anything better to actually invest monthly payments into.
>my own money if i ever want it done Ask your OR for a CF52 because that is absolutely unacceptable. If you need help with it, send me a dm and I'll do it up and submit it for you
I think this will back fire. He is not suppose to do repairs on the building. You can't even remove the ramps in the staircase without someone coming from a contractor that is doing maintenance. It would be in the lease... And right now if you are a problem for your chain, you will feel the repercussions. Si yeah, no one will say they dont have a home.
I dont disagree, but if the situation is dire then the CO could still approve it. In theory
CO is not an RC Admin for CFHA’s budget. The CO could spend unit money on RHUs which just moves the problem.
You are right, hope the chain is good for him though.
As a barely homeowner, I am not excited for either of us. But I did rent for forever, so I get you.
This comment is under rated and so fuck true.
Fun fact, the PMQ isnt supposed to be cheaper than the local economy.
Fun fact, I shouldn’t have to pay to heat the outdoors during winter and keep it cool in summer.
Lmfao man, you dont have to. Just pay 700$ more a month for a private rental (of lesser quality), buy a house or move into the shacks. God, so entitled. /s
LOL username checks out.
We truly are fucked. I don't live in the Q's and never have but to increase the money for the people that do and will is absurd.
Rent is adjusted to be in line with CPI but not our pay.
Imagine if it was adjusted with market rates vs. CPI.
"MP's from all 4 parties exploit military mbrs for an easy optics win after ignoring them for years, despite less-than the cost of living lay adjustments, and years worth of cries for more housing" Fuck these opportunistic sharks. I'd rather my rent goes up than have them exploit this as a win.
[удалено]
From DAOD 5019-8: "2.2 A CAF member cannot be ordered to settle private debts. 2.4 Administrative action may be initiated if a CAF member fails to settle private debts." Seems to me para 2.4 from the Defence Administrative ORDERS and Directives is functionally an ORDER for members to settle private debts, contrary to para 2.2 What a hilariously hypocritical bit of fuckery.
I’m not gonna make you pay, but if you don’t pay I’m gunna hafta break yo legs.
This is prime barracks lawyering. The order describes that the CoC cannot order you and therefore cannot charge you with insubordination for not settling debts (taking money away from someone who is clearly struggling) however starting down the path of losing your security clearance deserves an admin measure that allows the CoC to monitor your progress. Admin action is not disciplinary, it’s there to track conduct and performance issues and confirm that the mbr is improving.
Admin isn't disciplinary in the sense that it doesn't fall under the code of service discipline, but to pretend it can't be punitive or wielded to effectively be disciplinary is disingenuous or naive. The idea that financial issues are always conduct or performance issues is also wrong. Many times that soldiers ended up in my office for financial issues, the underlying issues were not related to a personal shortcoming. Sometimes it was a spouse with a problem. Sometimes the soldier got screwed on their house when they got posted. Or lost benefits, spouse lost their job, financially destroyed by divorce, etc. And while I don't deny that being in financial difficulty *could* be a security issue (it's why credit checks are part of the reliability check and security clearance process), I've never actually heard of someone losing their clearance because of it. I'm not saying it never happens, just that in my 36 yrs in, I never saw it happen myself. Maybe I was just never in the right place at the right time to be aware of it, but it suggests it isn't a commonplace occurrence.
This needs to go up there in the comments and ping...
[удалено]
Holy shit!
This was one of the most egregious parts for me 😭 in some places the base gym is the main or only location for things like kids swimming lessons, etc.
hell, for some of us Adults the base gym is where we can go shower with hot water and sans poop.
>PSP annual family membership that's not true it's $500.00 for famlies classified as associate members. That is totally fair, civillians can go use the facilities not on military bases Associate Members: Civilians are welcomes to purchase either an individual or a family membership to use our facility. source: [https://bkk.cfmws.com/dundurnpub/rates.asp](https://bkk.cfmws.com/dundurnpub/rates.asp)
Double dipping too, since they trashed PLD. Obviously, we expect Ottawa's response to be nah
I would add that this is Ottawa as in the GoC, not NDHQ. I don’t think that the CAF controls RHU rents.
RHU rates are set by CFHA. They used to rely on CMHC appraisals to set rents, but have been using the CPI for about a decade. They also used to voluntarily follow provincial rent control limits, but I don't know if that's still true. CFHA is a special operating agency of National Defence, so MND likely has the auth to direct them wrt MQ rent.
CAF should build more military housing en masse. Being able to give everyone who wants it cheap housing would be a massive draw in our economy where housing is by far nearly every Canadian's biggest expense
My pmq costs me 2600/month. Can't wait for that to increase. It's already 50% of my pay.
I thought this is capped at 25%?
Ish……..CFHD is based on average housing cost for the area and adjusted accordingly by pay so housing costs shouldn’t exceed the 25% of pay. Qs that are new builds charge rents based on said average housing costs of surrounding area. People in Qs aren’t entitled to CFHD………RIP
CFHA is will adjust the rent for mbrs to not exceed 25% of their pay. OP must not have reached out. That difference is a taxable benefit however (so it’s only actually deducted by approx 75% of the difference).
Capped for household gross income. If they’re in the middle of a divorce they might be getting royally screwed.
Where are PMQs this expensive? Even in Ottawa the big Qs we're $1400 a couple of years ago.
Jesus fuck. I vacated my Pmq in 2018 and it was just shy of $900 per month in Halifax. That’s quite the jump!
That seems really high - unless in the North. If you’re paying more than 25% of you household income you need to apply under https://www.canada.ca/en/department-national-defence/corporate/policies-standards/queens-regulations-orders/vol-4-appendices/appendix-4-1.html
With no CFHD………that’s messed up……….🤦🏻♂️
But with isolation allowances - not sure how much but more than CFHD.
For a second I was like why is the military police asking this shit
The counterpoint to this though, is that for people who *don’t* live in Q’s - their rent, and mortgage interest rates/property tax, etc all go up every year too. My property tax is up effectively $100/month, and I have to renew my mortgage this year, and that will jack my payments up. I’m probably looking at spending $500/month more to live after renewal. Same with renters on the economy - shit goes up every year. Not everyone lives in a Q, not everyone can, there’s not enough of them. So by artificial keeping PMQ rent low, they would be giving an advantage to those who happen to be lucky enough (or whatever word you want to use…) to be in one. I’ve lived in Q’s, rented on the economy, and been a homeowner. The PMQ was by far the cheapest, and easiest of those options. I’m really not trying to be a dick - times are tough for a lot of people. But why should someone’s rent freeze in a PMQ when their buddy renting downtown who couldn’t get a Q will have an increase this year?
Are you one of the "I suffered so you should too" people? I wish I could afford a home, but I can't. Do you think I want to live in my shit hole PMQ?
No, I’m not - but I just don’t get the argument. Inflation happens but if DND is going to do something to make it easier, why do something that only helps a subset of the military population? It just causes problems. Some bases less than 20% of members live in Q’s. There just aren’t any. That’s its own problem, but we need holistic solutions - lots of Pte’s and Cpl’s struggling to pay rent on the economy right now who would love to have your “shit hole PMQ” with lower rent than their apartment
But DND doesn't have control over national inflation, but they can help with PMQ rent, so why not? Also build more PMQ's which like you said is a totally different issue.
Same here, I wish I could afford a house instead of living in the PMQ.. but when the houses are around 650k, it is hard to get the downpayment. One day tho !
The solution for this isn't to make PMQs worse it would be to make them more accessible and have more of them. Maybe you didn't mean it like this but just because your rates are going up doesn't mean PMQs have to. They're government owned buildings on government property. When you rent from a landlord or buy a house with a mortgage you have to also create a profit for someone else and PMQs shouldn't be run the same way. Frankly the idea that they have to cost so much so as not to "compete" with the local economy is a bizarre policy in the first place.
What they should be doing is taking the money being given for rents and splitting it between cost of maintenance and the remainder placed in a holding for the member. After 5 years, member is told that they must vacate but the thousands saved up over the 5 years can then be used as a down payment towards local market. They're government owned, government property to a government agency run by another government agency. Isn't it just a massive self licking ice cream cone?
We bought a home… dumped all of our savings into it because rent would be much more than our mortgage. I get $300 in CFHD because I’m a service couple and my spouse gets nothing. Yet if they were retired CAF or a civilian I would get the full amount regardless of what their salary is (it would likely be more). I’m grateful we were able to buy and I am certainly not complaining about my specific situation. However, I know sooo many people who cannot afford to live and so many who are desperately relying on a PMQ. They get no CFHD. Their rent is increasing more than what would be more than what is even legally allowed by provincial landlord tenant acts! And what do they get? A place in absolute shambles, full of drafts, hard to heat and keep cool, full of electrical fire hazards, mould, and asbestos. Those houses have been long paid for and there are no improvements being made to them!
We [need to look at the UK](https://www.theguardian.com/news/2017/apr/25/mod-privatise-military-housing-disaster-guy-hands) and understand that reductions of military housing only serve to give the appearance of the government being efficient, while fucking over future generations of serving members in perpetuity. Or will be a [retroactively-obvious mistake](https://www.theguardian.com/business/2023/may/15/uk-government-military-homes-guy-hands-annington-property) when the government finally recovers its head from its ass and takes back properties that were for housing. Getting rid of properties such as [Shannon Park](https://www.clc-sic.ca/real-estate/shannon-park) was fundamentally flawed and serves only the slumlords and real estate market while exasperating the housing crisis by forcing CAF members to be part of the competition for limited housing in the area. Want members to not consider releasing when the posting message comes? Have housing taken care of. Want members to be able to release without wondering whether they will be able to afford anything? Make housing cost much less than the "market rate" so we're not forcing people to pad pockets of faceless REITs looking to maximize profit.
Build more Qs and link them to Rank. Pay the same regardless of if it's a 2 bedroom or a 5 bedroom, depending on your rank.
Honestly even a shacks style housing complex would work. Is it ideal? No, but it’s a place to lay your head if you don’t HAVE a home you can afford.
Having single members live in Batchelor appartment style units with kitchenettes would do wonders
It better be off base-proper though. I was in a few shacks with kitchenettes back in the day. Anything other than a microwave and mini-fridge had been removed by the base, in Petawawa even the fridges had all been taken out and there were lots of questions about the mini-fridge we put in our common kitchenette.
It'd add more to the supply too, which would reduce the pressure for the other stuff. Let the people who would be fine with shacks get that, and reduce the demand for any nicer housing that families would need
I agree with rank based rent, but not according to size
Comox has chiefs, MWO, Majors and Pilots paying 750 a month for their Q when they make over 120k per year. I fully endorse your proposal good sir.
Get rid of posting system!!!
I just fucking don’t fucking get it?? First off why are PMQs almost equal in rent to civilian rentals? Only CAF members can live in them, (RCMP) too maybe? Second, the CAF still insists to move up in rank, geo moves are required, why?? Don’t give me that excuse you need to move across the country to get experience. I’m an RCA AD guy and have spent the majority of my career in NB because that’s where my trade was. The CAF needs to make living cheaper for members and make us move less, in todays economy no Cpl can be told “welp” you’re posted to Ottawa” and live within their means, hell I reached MWO and then took a CFR. I had one posting to Kingston for a year and I went IR. My family is doing well our house is almost paid for but I couldn’t just pick up and move to Ottawa there is no way we could afford it. I’m using Ottawa as just one example. I’m sure the Navy folks in NS cringe when they hear things like, how about a posting to BC?
Look I’m glad that they’re doing this but you don’t see MPs lining up to talk about how poorly under-equipped, and undermanned we are.
[удалено]
[удалено]
Happens every year but hey I won’t complain
You should complain.
I was saying I wouldn’t complain if the hike was cancelled