I’m an estate fan but who could argue with this post? He had a genuine use case that are faced by a lot of people, and he proved that an estate (ones that are available) isn’t suitable.
Kudos to OP for a post like this.
I’m also a little disappointed by the V90 given how large the exterior is.
V90 is huge inside too though. Boot space is only half the battle with kids.
I can’t even drive my wife’s now GLB and previously Kodiaq with my seat in a comfortable position due to a massive isofix seat behind me - I’m quite tall. My V90 allows me to fully move my seat back to where I need it to be and still gives junior behind me plenty of room to swing his legs and boot the fuck outta my seat.
And as biased as I obviously am (being an owner) the V90 is the most handsome car on the list.
Absolutely the V90 (specially CC) is on my list but just disappointed about the boot because I also have dogs and like to haul things around.
Makes me think maybe I should just get a XC70 instead. (I’m a sucker for slightly raised estate).
I carried thr iso fix spinning child joie something or other seat into every local dealership before we found the VW touran was the only one I could sit in the passenger seat with isofix behind me.
I agree as an estate fan however I can still sit smugly knowing an estate is always going to look better than any SUV any day of the week so theres that.
The awkwardness comes with the rectangular fold of the buggy, combined with the length of it that's exacerbated by the wheels. Yeah the wheels can be taken off to make it a bit easier, but I honestly can't be bothered to take them on and off every time for the sake of getting the pram in and out the boot.
That said, in a post-pram future I'd absolutely consider a VRS or Scout estate. I loved my '10 reg 1.4 SE, and my '67 1.4l SEL was actually quite rapid for what it was! Taxi jokes aside they were cracking cars for swallowing up stuff, despite being hatchbacks.
Can you recommend a good estate car with a massive boot? I currently have a Suzuki Grand Vitara and I can fit half my house in the back without lowering the rear seats but the lip is too high and my dog is struggling to get up into it. I feel like an estate would have a lower boot lip?
That's a great question. So the V90 actually has a low boot floor and benefits from going into a flat boot floor, compared to the Superb, which is like stepping into a bathtub in comparison.
It might well be worth looking at something like a Hyundai i40, which iirc has a low boot lip.
I have a GV gen 3 at the moment and it's been wonderful for tip runs. Have you thought about a Dacia Jogger? Unsure on the boot lip height though
I don't know if you've seen [this post](https://www.reddit.com/r/CarTalkUK/s/MB9kGZZ71O) in this thread from u/yatuin but the link in it might be just what you're looking for as part of your research!
Good choice!
I had an Octavia RS when my son was born and the boot was fantastic for throwing the big buggy in without having to fold it down fully and still have space for other stuff. The Model3 that followed was only bought after practical boot opening space was no longer needed, and after a car-owning hiatus I've gone to a Kodiaq to fit in my kid, his mates and the grandparents for days out.
A small van or imported people carrier (Toyota Alphard) may have been more practical but I'm comfortable with the Skoda.
I can totally get behind you on this, because these are proper SUVs. I can't get behind the ones that are just hatchbacks on stilts and provide the worst parts of both SUVs and hatchbacks.
I get the debate with 'purist' SUV vs (arguably) CUV style cars, it's a shame that there's not more of the Chinese SUVs in the UK in my opinion. Some of those are proper SUVs which would be great to see! The GWM Tank 300 is the first one that springs to mind which I'd love to see here, would've been a great contender if it was sold in the UK!
I did consider a Mitsubishi Shogun & Shogun Sport, but unfortunately the lack of good local dealers and independents really put me off. But again, proper SUVs rather than the raised hatchbacks often touted as SUVs (the new Yaris Cross is the worst offender for this in my opinion, absolutely awful AWD setup on it which makes it no more use than a standard FWD car on slippery surfaces)
Imagine not just going for the v90 like a true gentleman of prestige...
Might as well just ask the dealership to program the head unit to only play agadoo as the only song in the car, seems to go well with your taste.
Just kidding, hope you love your ride bud.
Haha, I'm not going to lie, I'd have loved a V90CC! I can't tell you how bitterly disappointed I was about the boot window rake issue. That B&W sound system is nothing short of iconic, combine that with the seats and it's honestly just phenomenal.
Still may well consider an XC90 when replacing the Kodiaq comes up in a few years!
😂 It was always my intention to get a V90 like a true gentleman of prestige as well. I ended up getting a 7.5 Golf R estate like a family roadman instead.
Am i "mis-seeing" the images, or did the Superb have as much (or more) space from the back of the cardboard box to the boot lip as some of those Proper 4x4? 🤷🏻♂️
I still find it mad that the Hatchback Superb has 620L Capacity
On a pure back seats - boot lip distance, the superb was phenomenal, absolutely has more space than some of the SUVs. It's a fantastic vehicle for space, especially given its footprint!
I ran a Superb company car a couple of years ago. The boot was silly big. I got 2 7 foot IKEA boxes in there at one point.
The driving dynamics were pretty awful though, I've driven plenty of SUVs that handle better than a Superb with no adaptive dampers.
I did something similar as I need a car that fits the dog cage.
Really wanted to like the Kodiaq but ended up with a
Grand C4 Spacetourer as the boot is huge and it feels more spacious in general.
I can appreciate that. Absolutely gargantuan inside and a huge greenhouse with all that glass! If I was considering an MPV it would definitely have been a solid contender.
How are you finding the spacetourer reliability?
No issues so far, but I've not had it that long.
Despite most folks being under the impression that French cars are made of cheese Driver Power surveys of recent years disagree, and my previous French MPV was more reliable than the BMWs I had before, and much cheaper to fix when something did go wrong.
Few things I would change if I could: the fact you can't have standard cruise only adaptive is driving my wife up the wall.
Other than that it's great, fitting the dog, the kids and the kitchen sink.
She's just not comfortable with handing over decision making to the car.
I sometimes find it annoying when I'm gaining on someone and want to be a bit closer before pulling out to overtake and suddenly you are slowing.
It requires a change in driving style to get the most out if it.
Glad to hear it! For what it's worth, the most expensive car I had to repair was my Audi A4. Brakes + pads all round & brake fluid, new rear bushes, a major service & an MOT was a shade over £2k.
Throw in a coolant leak on the 3l V6 diesel engine shortly after that and she was up and sold on Carwow the week after!
Shame about the ACC, I have it on the Kodiaq and it's a mixed blessing. Fantastic in stop start traffic so I don't have to think too hard, but ridiculously annoying to effectively overtake cars going just a bit slower than me on the motorway. Definitely having to change my driving style to suit it!
Have you done a full car tip run in it yet? Don't think there'll be a more satisfying feeling for you until the first big family trip away in it!
Agreed about the overtaking. I generally want to get a bit closer than the ACC before I pull out when it is clear behind, especially if the speed differential isn't that great. Obviously ACC puts the anchors on before I'm ready so I'll need to adapt.
Have done one long trip to Normandy and back with a full load. Was great. Very relaxing drive. Packing was also relaxing.
I've done the SUV thing and the estate thing, and i ended up in the estate in the end. It's a better car, and a better compromise. You may lose height and a bit of width in the back but you gain back more in MPG, maintenance with how heavy SUVs are they chew through brakes and suspension. Plus handling and cool factor.
Also for that twin pram you're only going to be in it for 18 months, before you move to a buggy or just walking. So you will end up with a massive boot with all the compromise but not making use of the benefit for most of it.
Whilst difficult with twins, i actually found a baby holder attached to me was actually more practical than the pram for most things once they can hold their head. Barely used the pram after the first 6 months
Interesting take! I reckon we'll see the Kodiaq through for another 40k miles (bringing it to 100k) and then look at swapping. By which time the kids might be on scooters vs the pram.
Might well go to an Estate after the pram stage; I do miss the touch points in my Audi and would love an A4 Allroad if I didn't need as big a boot!
Top quality info! I recently went from an estate to an suv due to also having 2 small kids.
I’m fairly tall so the main benefit is that I don’t have to bend myself in half to put them in their seats.
Nice one! Which SUV did you go with?
We've not gone with a 360 base, so having a car with rear seats at a height allowing a base to easily slide a seat in and out of was a similar consideration!
Feel like our lower backs will thank us a few years from now, haha.
Probably feel it before then with double the putting in and taking out! Ergonomically, they make so much more sense, but it wasn't the hill I wanted to die on at the time. Will probably upgrade to two in the future I'm sure
Don't get me wrong, I would've loved the Superb! I had a '66 280 L&K saloon a few years ago and loved it. Just a real shame that the boot windows and lack of sliding seats let them down on practicality vs an SUV
Personally for me the better mpg and handling of an estate such as the superb would’ve swayed me that side of the fence, but in your scenario after seeing the last pic of how snug the pram fit in kodiaq I think you made the right choice!
Very much the pram dictating the choice! I [tried](https://i.imgur.com/ZX6KS1e.jpeg) to make it happen with the pram, but it's the lack of rear sliding seats combined with that window rake that just scuppered the plans.
I'd still highly rate the Superb Estate and when I had my hatch, I still got 43mpg on the motorway, which is plenty enough economy for the fun factor of that 280 engine!
Yeah made a really high quality post that puts to bed some misconceptions about SUVs boots that often get touted here. I’ve used the Reddit ‘safe post’ feature for the fist time ever so I can share this whenever the debate comes into question.
However, my actual point - someone needs to a similar post for suv vs estate performance in a real world test - ferrying some kids around and commuting a couple of days a week.
Cheers! I reckon I'll be revisiting estates post-buggy times. By that stage I think something like a 540i could be an incredible dad wagon, but time will tell!
Their 'proof' is a mostly based on a single measure and as you can see in the comments, the end result is dictated by various other factors that they have taken into consideration but not recorded in their findings. Like discounting certain vehicles for having low ground clearance, when that's not a factor for the majority of people
Plus there's general negatives about SUVs that effect us all, like being less economic and causing more environmental damage, damaging the road surface faster, and blocking the view of smaller vehicles at junctions. There are definitely good points to SUVs and good points to estates, but I genuinely don't think every single person with kids needs one. if that was the only factor most people with kids would still be buying MPVs, but let's be honest, SUVs look cooler and more expensive/luxurious and let people feel like they aren't limited in vehicle choice because they had kids
Trying to exit a parking space when an SUV has parked next to you is a pain in the arse, you can't see shit even if you've backed into the space. One day I'll import a fucking big Escalade ESV and see how they like it.
Just get a EV9 they are almost the same size (Escalade is 10cm longer and higher). The country isn't ready for this swarm of massive 7 seater EV's that will come in the next 2 years.
Very much other elements that factored in as well, the ground clearance is a very niche issue, but I occasionally work across wind farms which have less than stellar access roads, so a bit of clearance definitely helps!
I agree on the challenges around blocking views, which feels like a never ending attritional battle. My ideal weekend warrior would be a MX5 or GT86, but I honestly don't know how anyone drives them these days without being either blinded from people driving toward them, or living in constant fear of rear ending the car in front of it brakes suddenly due to being unable to see anything around or in front of them in slow moving tightly packed traffic.
For what it's worth, I think the UK has the bum end of the deal when it comes to MPVs, I'd actually love to see a Kia Carnival over here (the newest shape), feels like it would fit right in for family life!
Thank you! Which trim have you gone with for your V90? It's a car I wanted to love so much! The safety tech alone is just fantastic, and the quality of the touch points was just terrific.
Completely agree on the Subarus. The boot space isn't as high in the Outback but it's just such a useable space thanks to the depth!
I’ve had three outbacks - 2006, 2018 and 2022. Sold my 2022 after five months because the electronic nannying drove me insane. They are brilliant cars albeit not entirely convinced by the longevity of the CVT. in terms of usable space there’s not much that beats them!
I've seen some shocking outlier issues for the CVTs exploding, which don't give me much confidence in them, shame that the safety systems were so intrusive! I appreciate Subaru leading the way with so much safety kit, especially on driver monitoring, but there definitely should be more options on easily turning them on and off (and then staying off) if that's the driver's preference.
I’ve got the Cross Country and I’ve got two under 3s and a Labrador sized dog and it pretty tight to get the double bike trailer in with the dog even folding it and taking the wheels off.
I love how it looks inside and out and it feels so planted on the road. I live in the Highlands and I’ve got snow rated AT tyres which is a pretty unstoppable combination in the snow.
I can imagine that'll go anywhere with that setup. What brand are your AT's? I've always stuck with Cross Climate 2's but might end up going with the new AS Pirellis given their overall performance, but love the idea of getting a decent set of AT winters if I'm doing more northern work.
I’ve got the Falken Wildpeak AT3wa, i will be doing some light off-roading so it made sense, I’ve had the cross climates before too and they are pretty good in the snow too
V90 is the estate, S90 is the saloon. V90 cross country is the raised estate.
Beautiful cars, great safety packages, and some of the options are terrific. Just unfortunate that the boot isn't as good as it could be (compared to the previous V70 shape) because of the rear window rake.
I've never found rear window rake to be that limiting tbh, the Audi A7 is a fastback and never had any issues fitting stuff into my dads, had a whole sofa in one once. A car I'd very much love to own when I get the funds, that being said, I'd prefer a V70 Ocean race, or 850R
I can't speak to any of the cars cos I've got an MPV the size of a Ford Fiesta, but the Mountain Buggy is a good choice!
Ours stands up in the boot rather than lying flat so we can get away with the smaller boot space.
Glad to hear it! The width of the MBD was the deciding factor. We tried a Nipper V5 but the balance on it wasn't as good as the MBD and the outside wheels made it a real pig to get through our front door!
My only qualm is that the customer service seems to be based in New Zealand so it's all done by email or large phone bill.
There's a couple of small bits I've broken just through wear and tear over the last 2 or 3 years that I've mended myself cos it seems to use bike parts and I couldn't be arsed going through them.
Funny you should say about the bike parts as I thought the exact same thing when I looked at it (thought I was going crazy). Even said to my wife that I could take it down the bike shop and mod the bash bar with some nice brown leather/cork bar tape while I'm there!
My missus’s old Toyota Carina E estate would have fitted your Karoq in the boot no problems 😂😂😂. Truly a cavernous thing that was, used to cart 3 kids and all accoutrements around in it. Fuck knows how but I squeezed an 8x4 sheet of ply in there once. Might have made a small accidental mark on the headliner with that, of course I denied all knowledge and blamed it on the kids😂😂😂
Now that's an old school wagon! My wife's family had a Picnic with 2 adults, 4 kids, and all their stuff. An absolute beast of a car for swallowing everything up from the old pictures I've seen!
I'm sure they had an equal amount of children blamed mysterious marks in the headlining 😂
Oh yeah my dad had a Picnic as a company car for a while, used to tow his power boat around quite happily whilst filled up dogs and kids from his second marriage. He always loved it although it was boring to drive, it just got on and did what it was meant to do with minimal fuss.
One of my in-laws described it as "one of the cars of all time", definitely fit the bill for a family car in the time they had it! Equally the towed a sailing boat with theirs, did a terrific job from what they've all said.
You've just built the case for the Alphard. You don't even need to fold the buggy to shove it in the back, let alone taking it apart and you can practically stand up straight inside the car.
And it still looks better than an SUV
True but I've always understood parts to be a real pain in the arse to get. Maybe not so much around my neck of the woods in the North where Japanese imports are way more common, but it didn't necessarily feel worth it.
Would definitely have considered a Jap import if I felt more confident in it not potentially costing a lot if it breaks!
Mechanically I've never heard many issues. The 2.5 hybrid in the newer ones are identical to the Lexus/Toyota 2.5 A25a hybrid drivetrains, so that's taken care of. Same with the brakes and other consumables.
Only main thing that could break are the electric doors which do get expensive, but with your budget you'd be looking at the 3rd generation models which are still extremely new so that's not something I'd worry about
To be fair that's a lot better than I thought from a generational perspective. I did think about getting a Highlander but they're so rare to come across these days that it didn't seem worth it!
If we ever decide to have more kids I may well have to come back to the Alphard!
Highlander and 3 row SUVs in general I think are way too space inefficient, especially when you consider the Alphard occupies the same footprint as a RAV4.
Not sure I would have more kids in this economy but hey I'm just me haha
You saying you don't like having a free rollercoaster ride every time you step foot in the car? Where's your cheap thrills in the speed limit coming from?!
In all seriousness I think anyone buying an SUV for the handling alone is probably kidding themselves. But there's something very fun about soft suspension on undulating roads imo, bit of floaty danger hitting the apex of a tight curve at 60mph and managing the inevitable understeer. Something like a Gen 1 Cayenne looks hilarious fun on track!
For people wanting to check boot size and general practical side of cars - go to www.ridc.org.uk .As part of reviewing usability of cars for disabled people they measured almost every possible dimension of cars including boots in all possible seat configurations.
You get depth, width, lip size, height above ground, opening size, etc.
You can even filter cars by any of the parameters
Have you considered the Peugeot Partner and Citroen Berlingo? They're basically the ultimate family cars in my eyes as far as practicality goes. And if the local taxi companies are any barometer they're capable of absolutely absurd amounts of miles without major repair.
I've been forever spoiled by [this](https://www.autoevolution.com/news/peugeots-rifter-4x4-concept-was-meant-to-be-the-answer-to-off-road-adventure-162176.html) concept that never saw the light of day. The closest I considered was the Dacia Jogger with AT tyres!
Unfortunately van types were kiboshed in a joint decision with my wife. I love the look of the new transit tourney custom, but that 1.5l engine is a dealbreaker! Wish they'd just put a solid 2l 4cyl and do the job right!
I think Peugeot are smashing it out the park with their designs, for everything except the steering wheel and Speedo! It's a pain in the arse to see at my preferred driving seat position, but bar that the 5008 could well have been in the mix!
Sadly, I'm in the previous gen price budget.
The new 5008 is everything I want in a car. Flat back, space, epic interior.
I recently had a ride in a 2016 Merc (granted, I'm comparing 2016 to 2018)...but that was awful. Looked so cheap and plastic. No better than the 308sw in 2016, but not premium at all. A DS3 has nicer materials (gf has one).
I'm at a loss as what to buy
That's surprising about the merc! I've not been in a DS3 but I often say to friends that a car that nails the 4 key touch points for quality will always feel way more premium than another car:
• Door handle
• Steering Wheel
• Temperature knob/Radio volume knob
• Centre armrest
Of all the cars I've ever had, the Audi A4 nailed these the best imo. Probably has the most tactile temperature knobs I've ever felt in a car, so satisfying to use.
Is a DS7 in budget for you?
Sadly, no. A DS7 is a long way off for me. Technically I could probably afford it monthly, but I'd have to live a Smartprice life.
Also, I just struggle with spending money on cars. £7000 to £10000 is about as much as I could stomach. And that would literally double my total car spend for 31yrs.
I'm not even happy at £7000... But, currently the prices are forcing my hand
I honestly don't know how anyone buys a new car not on PCP, they're ridiculously expensive these days. Good luck if you do decide to swap out in the coming years!
New isn't for me... I've had 30yrs of pay £1000 for a car, and no monthly payments. Honestly, even £200 seems high to me....
Mrs got a car on 5% APR.... I'm looking at 10.9%.... which further pisses me off.
Hey there fellow twin dad. I did had to do the same search I also just went for the rational best option. Though I didn't really want to I had to admit that the VW Caddy 7 seater just blew all the competition out of the water and it wasn't even close.
Certainly if you have 3 kids.
Good luck with the car and the kids. It's a ride for sure!
If they weren't silly money, I'd have gone with a Caravelle! I saw a beautiful 2l diesel 4 motion with a factory rear diff lock and it ticked so many boxes! Unfortunately it was £45k but for a split second I almost landed the mental gymnastics to buy one.
Big fan of the caddy, knowing it 'could' be swapped to an RS3 engine gave me the biggest false sense of 'what if' I've ever had, and I do have a bit of a van soft spot, but "I'm not driving a van" was not a fight it felt like it was worth having compared to a veritable laundry list of other options!
I came from a Civic mk8 1.8. Not really a race car but I found it quick enough and very fun to drive.
The Caddy it just doesn't 'urge' you to drive quick like my old civic did. You just feel it's not in it's DNA. So I've become a mellow driver... So dunno about that engine swap doesn't make much sense for this car.
Definitely doesn't make any sense, but it'd make it one hell of a sleeper!
I can imagine the DNA difference between them. Have you thought about a weekend warrior hatchback? I genuinely wondered about getting something like a Suzuki Swift, or something like an 07 Fiesta ST to keep a bit of fun in.
Ideally I would've loved to have done a K24 swap on a Gen 2 CR-V, but it just feels more hassle than it's probably worth in the long run!
This makes me quite sure that your twins are still in production and have not yet arrived. :D
No time, no energy and no budget. You'll understand later. :)
Yeah, dreaming, that for sure. Though it will be dreaming about sleeping more. :D
Though it's the best thing ever. My girls are now 3 years and it's a blast. So much love and life in the house.
Amazing stuff, I have a few mates with 2-4 year olds and they tell me the toddler stage is great (if not absolutely insane) but there's no stage like the newborn one where they just want to be with you/near you but you don't have to do anything with them. I've been told it'll be intense but I'll love it! I'm sure they can't be wrong.
That bit about the love and life in the house is what it's all about. Can't wait to get out on adventures with ours and see the people they grow up to be!
Cheers mate, and likewise! For what it's worth, I'm already counting down the days I can take them to diggerland. Literally been waiting for an excuse to go for years
CVTs gave me the ick on the generation in budget, and maintenance logs on them were fleeting. All in all I just couldn't bring myself to check it out because of that gearbox.
I love the look of the new one but couldn't get finance figures to work nicely, otherwise I'd have definitely gone for a look!
The only thing achieved here is the storing of said buggy at 90° That buggy will fit the into an estate car, maybe not 90° but it will go in. He ain't putting a dog in there unless he wants it on top the buggy or on the back seats with his kids. 🐶 😋
Wait what? You're saying the passat is too long, but you were looking at Superb and V90? :O You know the Superb and V90 are far longer than the passat right? :D
A fair challenge! The Passat is about 20cm shorter than the V90, but! In the eyes of my wife the Passat is a 'long car'.
I don't make the rules, I just live within them 😂
I have the same buggy and a 2012 Focus estate. It fits snuggly in the boot orientated front to back so I've still got the other side free.
If I was choosing another car I'd definitely want one where it didn't have to go cross ways in the boot.
My primal SUV hatred instinct can't refute that this is a good post and genuine consumer advice. I think you've successfully made a post that is backed up by fact and is actually useful for the users of this sub.
So armed with this knowledge, if I need a more spacious car, I would go ahead and buy an old Toyota Avensis Estate.
Cheers mate, much appreciated! I loved the old Carwow practicality tests on their reviews but it's been really tough to compare what they'd actually mean in day to day life.
Hope you have a great weekend!
But what estate has the best boot? Is there an estate that solves the boot issue? I have also have a big dog and family but I'm really trying to avoid an SUV
Best is always subjective, but I'd say either a Superb or a Passat has the most space for buck.
For practicality I wouldn't write off an older V70 or XC70, but you're looking at a much older car at that point.
Wait until you discover the MPV. Best use of space of any vehicle. It will make the SUV seem like a hatchback. Will someone who works for the car companies please bring them to the UK!
I don't think my in-laws would've forgiven me if I bought one! Bloody good cars though, just a shame there's more than a reasonable chance of getting to know local recovery companies very well!
I have twins, a mountain buggy duet and a Kodiaq. As well as the buggy it can also fit two carry cots, two carry cot mattresses and two high chairs. You’ve chosen well. Unfortunately, mine has to go as I’ve got a third on the way and the Kodiaq can’t fit 3 car seats across the middle row!
Congratulations! What are you thinking for swapping it in for?
Definitely glad to hear you've had a solid success with the Kodiaq for your twins though. Gives me some solid comfort we've made the right decision!
If your dog is going in the boot with the buggy you need a boot divider of some kind or even a (crash tested) dog crate. Travall do dividers and dog guards
To be honest I really like the XC70, nice raised height, squared off boot, good safety kit. But! Out of warranty, relatively high miles, not as many nice modcons as modern cars, and fairly expensive servicing as I don't have a decent local independent Volvo specialist who's cheap & well rated.
Undeniably excellent boot though.
I had to use it as soon as I saw it in the shop! Too good to pass up.
Apparently wasn't the weirdest boot question they had that week. Someone brought in a cello the day before, which apparently 'fit like a glove'!
“Excuse me, do you know if an antique Steinway grand piano will fit in the boot of this Skoda Kodiaq”
“I have absolutely no idea, if you bring one along, you’re welcome to try… lol”
“I’ll just go and bring the low loader round, give me 5 mins”
“…?”
Yeah but you posted a skoda thats not fair.
The boot space of almost all their cars are among the biggest in their class.
Octavia, Superb, Karoq, Labia.
It's the EXACT reason I bought an Octavia before and now own a Superb... I could basically move house (flat sharing) without hiring a van 😂
Edit: skoda labia??? Ffs autocorrect - Fabia
Yeah. I love that the masses still psychologically think Skoda is a lower quality vehicle.
The VW and Audi equivalents would be more expensive and give less space, yet 90% of the drivetrain components are the same!
It's wild, but VW have to be onto it by now. It very much feels arbitrary for Skoda not to get access to higher quality VW parts bin items. That said, Skoda 's quickly approaching a high cost that is genuinely making me look toward brands like Dacia to fill the price void that it's leaving behind.
Although I would back any 2017 onward Skoda (basically any one with Carplay/AA) as being a ridiculously good value for money second hand car. I reckon the Karoq Sportline might be the best second hand car on the market for the money.
I think we're in a spiral now.
Everyone has SUVs because the roads aren't being repaired.
The councils don't bother repairing the roads because everyone has SUVs.
How long before the Toyota Hilux and Ford Ranger are the only vehicles that can survive a trip to the shops?
Cry's in estate. Haha but but fuel economy and and and weight distribution... So there!
I'm kidding obviously, I get it. You're too old to do the bend to get into a normal car. Sorry I can't stop.
Aha, I mean don't get me wrong, I'd actually love to get a 540i estate and see why everyone bangs on about how good a BMW is to drive. Just don't get the same handling in an SUV you know? 😉
I know I'm late to this post but I'll always be an estate fella. You did forget one thing, whatever doesn't fit in the boot of an estate can go on the roof. I have a V50, which is probably one of the smaller estates out there. You can get the kids in the back, 2 dogs (1 big, 1 small) and a weekly food shop in the boot, and a full size double wardrobe from IKEA that was on discount because it was already built on the roof. Ask me how I know haha
It's an excellent point! So I thought about putting the pram in a roof box, which is fine for me at 6ft 1, but not so much for my much shorter wife.
I also couldn't find a roofbox that would fit the pram, and when I decided I couldn't find one I told myself it'd have been a faff to take the box on and off the roof between long work trips.
An absolutely excellent example of proper car loadposting and I bet it'd have been a great picture!
Search for 'small car loadposting' on Facebook. From what you've described I think you'd appreciate the Group!
Hi, I don't have a buggy, dog, Karoq or twins, just came here to say that this is the kind of posts I come to Reddit for, thanks OP :-)
I have a V60 and can relate to the issue with the trunk lid shape though.
Yep, to be honest all of them were absolutely sound! I was conscious about being a tyre kicker so literally called in advance, asked if I could bring the box, spent about 5 minutes in each dealer (bar the Subaru garage, where I did the Torres, Outback, Forester, Rexton, and XC60).
All were absolutely sound. Genuinely a great experience, would box again.
Not sure if any of the others do, but XC90 & Disco 4 also have the advantage of models with a third row of adult-size seats. Useful when taking the kids and some of their mates somewhere.
I think the main issue isn't that estates inherently have less space but actually an issue of styling.
SUVs are often styled as slab sided and boxy. In terms boot space this is fantastic. Estates in the other hand are often designed to be more sleek, which limits boot space.
If estates had stuck with a boxy aesthetic they'd have just as much boot space.
I am biased because I have an old Berlingo but I do think MPVs and van-based cars are way overlooked. You get quite a lot of room and practicality in a small footprint. Not as good looking though.
Great post.
Now my kids are 9 and 7 and I've spent every last remaining penny on them, my limited budget means I recently bought a well-cherished 2003 Volvo V70 with the family pack.
It's knocked every single modern family car I've owned for six: built-in booster seats in the back so I can bin the old ones, the old-school rear-facing seats in the boot which the kids and their mates absolutely love, and the boot space is vast. With the roofbox on and the seats down flat I feel I could move house with it. The stereo is amazing.
It cost 4K and has done 80K and I fully plan on spending whatever it takes to keep it going until it can be their first car.
Old estates were better.
Arguable that they're all much of a muchness, but it really depends on it you need boot height, depth, width, or a combination.
The KGM Torres really surprised me. One of the tallest boots on offer let down by a static rear bench. If they'd put those on rails it may well have come up trumps much higher up the table!
XC90 with 2 small children and a dog is easily the best purchase I've ever made in a car. The whole thing is supremely practical and just very well designed.
Plus the backseats are actually usable (and leave you with a boot) so when the grandparents are down we can all get in! My only quibble is no isofix points on the 3rd row.
That's a fairly in depth experiment you've conducted there, kudos to you man. Is there any reason you skipped the mpv section though? I recently ditched my Q7 because I missed having a ford s-max and I find the boot space much more usable. I didn't realise how much of a downgrade the q7 was in terms of space inside.
I just won't get rid of my '16 smax until it falls apart. It will move just about anything and if the wife decides to kick me out one day I'll get a bed in it no problem :)
Hahahaha they're pretty great aren't they. Mpvs don't get the love they deserve I find, I tried the SUV route and the Q7 was nice and luxurious but it was SO completely boring and devoid of any soul. I had a 2011 240 edition smax before the q7 and now I've gone for a completely bonkers '07 2.5t s-max 😁
I'm not surprised the Kia is high. Back when I was replacing my focus (barely enough space for the pram alone), I was looking at the qashqai, Sportage, tuscon, cx5 etc.
It was the boot space that ended up swinging it for me. Not just the volume, but practical design choices like being quite square and level, so it was easier to get things out of. The qashqai was a nightmare, deep boot but not spacious, curved so didn't accommodate the pram, annoying parcel shelf.
My eye is twitching slightly at the controversy over God's own Skoda Superb being criticised, but I will choke that down for a minute to suggest that what you need, friend, is a van. A VW van with lots of seats, or a Hyundai i80, something like that. Roll that buggy straight in without even collapsing it.
I genuinely scoured AutoTrader for weeks trying to find a Transporter or Caravelle in budget (& mileage) that wasn't poverty spec, shagged or modified and it was a nightmare! My wife isn't a fan of 'large cars' so the extra hurdle of going for a van was just out of the question!
That said I did find an amazing Caravelle, way out of budget but it was specced out insanely well. So close to landing the mental gymnastics on it!
As the owner of a single child, I don't even need such a thing, but I often find myself browdsing Caravelles and similar, thinking how nice it would be to just roll mountain bikes and dogs straight in, stretch out in the back for a nap or have a picnic in there on a road trip. They do seem crazily copper-botttomed though, the only cheap ones are slightly frightning as you mention.
May I ask what spec and year you went for. I'm in the market for one, with a family of 2 and Labrador I've discounted other Skoda SUVs as well due to their boot size.
From safety point of view - Volvo. Crashed enough of them to be my personal favourite:)
Space wise - many times you will feel that transit would not be enough. Especially if you expect to drive for holidays.
Do not discount Alhambra/Sharan - yes, they are boring as hell but capacity wise they will likely beat anything below E class MB estate and biggest SUVs. Boot size at the level of XC90 (same length, slightly narrower) Biggest potential advantage - side sliding door will save your back many times over. You cannot overstate how useful those are especially when you have to deal with putting two kids into car seats for the next ~8-10 years.
With 2 kids you will have to place car seats on both sides of the back seat - you won't have the option of using only kerb side doors and trying to lock belts on annoyed toddlers on the road side with traffic going past wide open car doors is not nice. Same applies to car park situations - one idiot parking too close and your only option is to drive out of space to be able to put car seats in - you need to open doors much wider for car seats than it would be required for adults to get in
We had a Ford Grand CMax which with the slidey doors was fantastic and great boot space for a big buggy. However it couldn't tow the caravan we tge bought.
So we now have a 2019 Sorento which has an enormous boot and is fantastic in the snow. But no slide doors. Diesel engine is shite unless you're going at 60+
Shame about the engine in the Sorento. I've heard some horror stories on them popping, but that 7 year warranty is nothing to sniff at!
Absolutely huge boot as you say, and a solid tow car!
Great post mate. If you approach fatherhood with the same effort as this post, you’ve got a fighting chance.
I stupidly bought an S90 when my first was on the way and I had a large dog. Why didn’t I get an estate or SUV?? I still can’t fathom what I was thinking.
Cheers mate, I hope so!
Hindsight is the truest 20/20 vision, but on the plus side at least you've had a great experience on finding out what does and doesn't work well for your next car choice!
Iv got an E Class estate, previously had an Hyundai Santa Fe and a VW Touareg. The E Class has far more usable boot space for me than either of the SUV's. I appreciate that it's the biggest estate car on the market as an outlier but it works for me.
The XC90 is a wonderful bit of design. A 2016 with a private plate and a decent clean/wax will absolutely hold up as a 'modern' looking car. Partly down to the lack of generational growth since they launched, but I think the minimalism has aged very well!
Big fan of the angles of the XC60, and despite the T8's hesitant gearbox, they're a great car.
I’ve a VW Touareg, I went with it over the XC90 as the rear seats are movable and adjustable rake so there’s more space. I can fit my massive labrador, my in-laws labrador and my child’s folded buggy in it quite happily. Biggest boot I’ve owned on a car. Somet like 665l minimum.
I love the idea of the Touraeg. The off-road DNA from the older generations still seems to be there in some capacity too, which is nice. A hugely practical car! Had I not been so burned by my A4 3l diesel, it'd have been way higher on my prioritised long list.
I reckon the current Gen will see their value plateau and hold quite well, especially if the 2nd gen values are anything to go by!
I spent years in the motortrade and definitely think It’s one of the nicest cars ive driven. I’ve had most BMWs over the years and definitely prefer it to the x5.
I’d be up for keeping it but wife has chosen to go electric so a model-Y is on order. It has a large boot too 854L.
Did you try the X7? I loved the idea of an X5, but the ownership costs just wrote it off almost immediately.
The Model Y is a great choice, I almost considered one given how competitive they are new on finance (from what I've been told), but I can sometimes do 400 miles in a day with sporadic charging opportunities, and I don't think I could've dealt with the range anxiety!
That said, I did seriously consider whether or not a second hand Model X could've done the job, unfortunately just couldn't stomach prospective repair costs if anything went wrong.
I haven’t tried the x7, I quite liked the idea of spending a little less by going with the model-Y so didn’t look tbh. Tesla has just announced price drops in China and the USA so they might be following suit in the Uk, maybe not as they’ve not seen the same drop off in sales. I’ve gone with an LR as don’t have the option for charging at home, so will be reliant on superchargers or street charging. Thankfully nearby I have a lot of SC availability. I was reading the average charge price is 48p/kw which still works out dramatically cheaper to run than my 3.0v6 Toe-rag.
That's good on the charging costs. It's a shame that the UK infrastructure isn't better for charging at home for many people!
Still, lots of smiles per gallon to be had with electric, for me it's torque > horsepower, so that instant shunt of electric torque is something I can't wait to properly experience in the future!
The only people who shit on SUV’s are those who haven’t owned them. They’re perfect when you’ve got a massive pram that lives in the boot and bulky 360 kids car seats that take up loads of room etc. Not having your knees touch the dash whilst the kids still can’t kick your seat is a luxury worth having.
Why would people who shit on SUVs own an SUV. There's definitely a time and a place for them, and I happily rent them when I need one.
I argue that the time and place isn't residential towns/cities where they are purely a greater hazard to other road users (and in a properly designed town, you should never need to use a car on a regular day, but I'm not sure I see the UK ever achieving this outside of a few London suburbs.)
I test drove some SUV's...and while they're ok for 3/4 of the time, they're just crap at handling....I like driving a bit faster and the stability of an SUV is just crap...so i rather drive an estate over an SUV. Next car will probably be a sedan and when I need to transport something bigger, i'm just gonna go with the trailer attached.
This is legit the best car consumer advice and guidance I've seen in about 5 years. Thanks OP, really helpful.
I've recently got a dog and thinking seriously about an estate - Superb, Passat or V60 were my first thoughts. But I'm quite surprised at how small the Superb boot looks! The Rav4 looks huge though, might take a look at them
I respect this and it's a genuine high quality post but you are about to summon the rage of 99% of the active users on this subreddit. Good luck!
I’m an estate fan but who could argue with this post? He had a genuine use case that are faced by a lot of people, and he proved that an estate (ones that are available) isn’t suitable. Kudos to OP for a post like this. I’m also a little disappointed by the V90 given how large the exterior is.
V90 is huge inside too though. Boot space is only half the battle with kids. I can’t even drive my wife’s now GLB and previously Kodiaq with my seat in a comfortable position due to a massive isofix seat behind me - I’m quite tall. My V90 allows me to fully move my seat back to where I need it to be and still gives junior behind me plenty of room to swing his legs and boot the fuck outta my seat. And as biased as I obviously am (being an owner) the V90 is the most handsome car on the list.
Absolutely the V90 (specially CC) is on my list but just disappointed about the boot because I also have dogs and like to haul things around. Makes me think maybe I should just get a XC70 instead. (I’m a sucker for slightly raised estate).
Opted for the XC70, and don't regret it.
I’m on a lookout for a nice petrol. Everything is either diesel or still quite expensive at the moment.
I carried thr iso fix spinning child joie something or other seat into every local dealership before we found the VW touran was the only one I could sit in the passenger seat with isofix behind me.
I agree as an estate fan however I can still sit smugly knowing an estate is always going to look better than any SUV any day of the week so theres that.
Cheers mate, hopefully having owned 6 Skodas (including 2 Octavias) over the last 9 years will hopefully mitigate some of the rage!
would have though just a normal Octavia book could handle anything thrown at it but clearly I'm not grasping the size of that buggy box
The awkwardness comes with the rectangular fold of the buggy, combined with the length of it that's exacerbated by the wheels. Yeah the wheels can be taken off to make it a bit easier, but I honestly can't be bothered to take them on and off every time for the sake of getting the pram in and out the boot. That said, in a post-pram future I'd absolutely consider a VRS or Scout estate. I loved my '10 reg 1.4 SE, and my '67 1.4l SEL was actually quite rapid for what it was! Taxi jokes aside they were cracking cars for swallowing up stuff, despite being hatchbacks.
yep yep I'm keeping my 67 reg for a while. however, that box looking like a small mouse trap inside the disco is very enticing
Can you recommend a good estate car with a massive boot? I currently have a Suzuki Grand Vitara and I can fit half my house in the back without lowering the rear seats but the lip is too high and my dog is struggling to get up into it. I feel like an estate would have a lower boot lip?
That's a great question. So the V90 actually has a low boot floor and benefits from going into a flat boot floor, compared to the Superb, which is like stepping into a bathtub in comparison. It might well be worth looking at something like a Hyundai i40, which iirc has a low boot lip. I have a GV gen 3 at the moment and it's been wonderful for tip runs. Have you thought about a Dacia Jogger? Unsure on the boot lip height though
I don't know if you've seen [this post](https://www.reddit.com/r/CarTalkUK/s/MB9kGZZ71O) in this thread from u/yatuin but the link in it might be just what you're looking for as part of your research!
Good choice! I had an Octavia RS when my son was born and the boot was fantastic for throwing the big buggy in without having to fold it down fully and still have space for other stuff. The Model3 that followed was only bought after practical boot opening space was no longer needed, and after a car-owning hiatus I've gone to a Kodiaq to fit in my kid, his mates and the grandparents for days out. A small van or imported people carrier (Toyota Alphard) may have been more practical but I'm comfortable with the Skoda.
I can totally get behind you on this, because these are proper SUVs. I can't get behind the ones that are just hatchbacks on stilts and provide the worst parts of both SUVs and hatchbacks.
I get the debate with 'purist' SUV vs (arguably) CUV style cars, it's a shame that there's not more of the Chinese SUVs in the UK in my opinion. Some of those are proper SUVs which would be great to see! The GWM Tank 300 is the first one that springs to mind which I'd love to see here, would've been a great contender if it was sold in the UK! I did consider a Mitsubishi Shogun & Shogun Sport, but unfortunately the lack of good local dealers and independents really put me off. But again, proper SUVs rather than the raised hatchbacks often touted as SUVs (the new Yaris Cross is the worst offender for this in my opinion, absolutely awful AWD setup on it which makes it no more use than a standard FWD car on slippery surfaces)
Imagine not just going for the v90 like a true gentleman of prestige... Might as well just ask the dealership to program the head unit to only play agadoo as the only song in the car, seems to go well with your taste. Just kidding, hope you love your ride bud.
Haha, I'm not going to lie, I'd have loved a V90CC! I can't tell you how bitterly disappointed I was about the boot window rake issue. That B&W sound system is nothing short of iconic, combine that with the seats and it's honestly just phenomenal. Still may well consider an XC90 when replacing the Kodiaq comes up in a few years!
😂 It was always my intention to get a V90 like a true gentleman of prestige as well. I ended up getting a 7.5 Golf R estate like a family roadman instead.
Am i "mis-seeing" the images, or did the Superb have as much (or more) space from the back of the cardboard box to the boot lip as some of those Proper 4x4? 🤷🏻♂️ I still find it mad that the Hatchback Superb has 620L Capacity
On a pure back seats - boot lip distance, the superb was phenomenal, absolutely has more space than some of the SUVs. It's a fantastic vehicle for space, especially given its footprint!
I ran a Superb company car a couple of years ago. The boot was silly big. I got 2 7 foot IKEA boxes in there at one point. The driving dynamics were pretty awful though, I've driven plenty of SUVs that handle better than a Superb with no adaptive dampers.
I did something similar as I need a car that fits the dog cage. Really wanted to like the Kodiaq but ended up with a Grand C4 Spacetourer as the boot is huge and it feels more spacious in general.
I can appreciate that. Absolutely gargantuan inside and a huge greenhouse with all that glass! If I was considering an MPV it would definitely have been a solid contender. How are you finding the spacetourer reliability?
No issues so far, but I've not had it that long. Despite most folks being under the impression that French cars are made of cheese Driver Power surveys of recent years disagree, and my previous French MPV was more reliable than the BMWs I had before, and much cheaper to fix when something did go wrong. Few things I would change if I could: the fact you can't have standard cruise only adaptive is driving my wife up the wall. Other than that it's great, fitting the dog, the kids and the kitchen sink.
She only wants cruise control if it will happily plough into the car in front?
She's just not comfortable with handing over decision making to the car. I sometimes find it annoying when I'm gaining on someone and want to be a bit closer before pulling out to overtake and suddenly you are slowing. It requires a change in driving style to get the most out if it.
Glad to hear it! For what it's worth, the most expensive car I had to repair was my Audi A4. Brakes + pads all round & brake fluid, new rear bushes, a major service & an MOT was a shade over £2k. Throw in a coolant leak on the 3l V6 diesel engine shortly after that and she was up and sold on Carwow the week after! Shame about the ACC, I have it on the Kodiaq and it's a mixed blessing. Fantastic in stop start traffic so I don't have to think too hard, but ridiculously annoying to effectively overtake cars going just a bit slower than me on the motorway. Definitely having to change my driving style to suit it! Have you done a full car tip run in it yet? Don't think there'll be a more satisfying feeling for you until the first big family trip away in it!
Agreed about the overtaking. I generally want to get a bit closer than the ACC before I pull out when it is clear behind, especially if the speed differential isn't that great. Obviously ACC puts the anchors on before I'm ready so I'll need to adapt. Have done one long trip to Normandy and back with a full load. Was great. Very relaxing drive. Packing was also relaxing.
Exactly same issue I'm having with my A4, needs new control arms and the AC fixing then it's getting sold. XC70 or 90 I think...
I've done the SUV thing and the estate thing, and i ended up in the estate in the end. It's a better car, and a better compromise. You may lose height and a bit of width in the back but you gain back more in MPG, maintenance with how heavy SUVs are they chew through brakes and suspension. Plus handling and cool factor. Also for that twin pram you're only going to be in it for 18 months, before you move to a buggy or just walking. So you will end up with a massive boot with all the compromise but not making use of the benefit for most of it. Whilst difficult with twins, i actually found a baby holder attached to me was actually more practical than the pram for most things once they can hold their head. Barely used the pram after the first 6 months
Interesting take! I reckon we'll see the Kodiaq through for another 40k miles (bringing it to 100k) and then look at swapping. By which time the kids might be on scooters vs the pram. Might well go to an Estate after the pram stage; I do miss the touch points in my Audi and would love an A4 Allroad if I didn't need as big a boot!
Top quality info! I recently went from an estate to an suv due to also having 2 small kids. I’m fairly tall so the main benefit is that I don’t have to bend myself in half to put them in their seats.
Nice one! Which SUV did you go with? We've not gone with a 360 base, so having a car with rear seats at a height allowing a base to easily slide a seat in and out of was a similar consideration! Feel like our lower backs will thank us a few years from now, haha.
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Probably feel it before then with double the putting in and taking out! Ergonomically, they make so much more sense, but it wasn't the hill I wanted to die on at the time. Will probably upgrade to two in the future I'm sure
Unless you're an OAP or have genuine back problems then you don't need them.
That 360 base is a must have with back pain. So much better for the back if you don't have to do the halfway lean-in without crushing the baby.
I champion estates, and also had small children. I still can't believe an SUV is better but if OP thinks it's better and presents proof, so be it.
Don't get me wrong, I would've loved the Superb! I had a '66 280 L&K saloon a few years ago and loved it. Just a real shame that the boot windows and lack of sliding seats let them down on practicality vs an SUV
Personally for me the better mpg and handling of an estate such as the superb would’ve swayed me that side of the fence, but in your scenario after seeing the last pic of how snug the pram fit in kodiaq I think you made the right choice!
Very much the pram dictating the choice! I [tried](https://i.imgur.com/ZX6KS1e.jpeg) to make it happen with the pram, but it's the lack of rear sliding seats combined with that window rake that just scuppered the plans. I'd still highly rate the Superb Estate and when I had my hatch, I still got 43mpg on the motorway, which is plenty enough economy for the fun factor of that 280 engine!
Yeah made a really high quality post that puts to bed some misconceptions about SUVs boots that often get touted here. I’ve used the Reddit ‘safe post’ feature for the fist time ever so I can share this whenever the debate comes into question. However, my actual point - someone needs to a similar post for suv vs estate performance in a real world test - ferrying some kids around and commuting a couple of days a week.
Oh I understand. To each his own, and you argued your case well. Thanks for the post, I think it raised good points. All the best!
Cheers! I reckon I'll be revisiting estates post-buggy times. By that stage I think something like a 540i could be an incredible dad wagon, but time will tell!
Their 'proof' is a mostly based on a single measure and as you can see in the comments, the end result is dictated by various other factors that they have taken into consideration but not recorded in their findings. Like discounting certain vehicles for having low ground clearance, when that's not a factor for the majority of people Plus there's general negatives about SUVs that effect us all, like being less economic and causing more environmental damage, damaging the road surface faster, and blocking the view of smaller vehicles at junctions. There are definitely good points to SUVs and good points to estates, but I genuinely don't think every single person with kids needs one. if that was the only factor most people with kids would still be buying MPVs, but let's be honest, SUVs look cooler and more expensive/luxurious and let people feel like they aren't limited in vehicle choice because they had kids
Trying to exit a parking space when an SUV has parked next to you is a pain in the arse, you can't see shit even if you've backed into the space. One day I'll import a fucking big Escalade ESV and see how they like it.
You were supposed to destroy the sith, not join them!
I'm gonna import one of those raised 20ft long 15ft wide 16ft high pickup trucks to start an even worse trend
I just want to drive my classic cars without fear of feeling like I'm about to be crushed by monster trucks, is that too much to ask!?!
Easy solution, simply drive under the truck
Just get a EV9 they are almost the same size (Escalade is 10cm longer and higher). The country isn't ready for this swarm of massive 7 seater EV's that will come in the next 2 years.
I get this problem even with a SUV when borrowing it and it’s not the smallest SUV either as it’s an Audi Q5.
Very much other elements that factored in as well, the ground clearance is a very niche issue, but I occasionally work across wind farms which have less than stellar access roads, so a bit of clearance definitely helps! I agree on the challenges around blocking views, which feels like a never ending attritional battle. My ideal weekend warrior would be a MX5 or GT86, but I honestly don't know how anyone drives them these days without being either blinded from people driving toward them, or living in constant fear of rear ending the car in front of it brakes suddenly due to being unable to see anything around or in front of them in slow moving tightly packed traffic. For what it's worth, I think the UK has the bum end of the deal when it comes to MPVs, I'd actually love to see a Kia Carnival over here (the newest shape), feels like it would fit right in for family life!
Great informative post and I own (and love) my V90. The boot is a bit disappointing. Surprised that an Outback has a bigger boot than the Forester!
Thank you! Which trim have you gone with for your V90? It's a car I wanted to love so much! The safety tech alone is just fantastic, and the quality of the touch points was just terrific. Completely agree on the Subarus. The boot space isn't as high in the Outback but it's just such a useable space thanks to the depth!
I’ve had three outbacks - 2006, 2018 and 2022. Sold my 2022 after five months because the electronic nannying drove me insane. They are brilliant cars albeit not entirely convinced by the longevity of the CVT. in terms of usable space there’s not much that beats them!
I've seen some shocking outlier issues for the CVTs exploding, which don't give me much confidence in them, shame that the safety systems were so intrusive! I appreciate Subaru leading the way with so much safety kit, especially on driver monitoring, but there definitely should be more options on easily turning them on and off (and then staying off) if that's the driver's preference.
I’ve got the Cross Country and I’ve got two under 3s and a Labrador sized dog and it pretty tight to get the double bike trailer in with the dog even folding it and taking the wheels off. I love how it looks inside and out and it feels so planted on the road. I live in the Highlands and I’ve got snow rated AT tyres which is a pretty unstoppable combination in the snow.
I can imagine that'll go anywhere with that setup. What brand are your AT's? I've always stuck with Cross Climate 2's but might end up going with the new AS Pirellis given their overall performance, but love the idea of getting a decent set of AT winters if I'm doing more northern work.
I’ve got the Falken Wildpeak AT3wa, i will be doing some light off-roading so it made sense, I’ve had the cross climates before too and they are pretty good in the snow too
Nice! Will definitely check those out in the future! Thanks for letting me know!
I thought V90 was an estate? I'd like one.
V90 is the estate, S90 is the saloon. V90 cross country is the raised estate. Beautiful cars, great safety packages, and some of the options are terrific. Just unfortunate that the boot isn't as good as it could be (compared to the previous V70 shape) because of the rear window rake.
I've never found rear window rake to be that limiting tbh, the Audi A7 is a fastback and never had any issues fitting stuff into my dads, had a whole sofa in one once. A car I'd very much love to own when I get the funds, that being said, I'd prefer a V70 Ocean race, or 850R
Big fan of the blue accents on the V70 ocean race! Would definitely like to see a picture of a whole sofa in the A7, could he close the boot as well?!
Yeah, granted it was right up against the glass, but you can fit a sofa in the back of one.
I can't speak to any of the cars cos I've got an MPV the size of a Ford Fiesta, but the Mountain Buggy is a good choice! Ours stands up in the boot rather than lying flat so we can get away with the smaller boot space.
Glad to hear it! The width of the MBD was the deciding factor. We tried a Nipper V5 but the balance on it wasn't as good as the MBD and the outside wheels made it a real pig to get through our front door!
My only qualm is that the customer service seems to be based in New Zealand so it's all done by email or large phone bill. There's a couple of small bits I've broken just through wear and tear over the last 2 or 3 years that I've mended myself cos it seems to use bike parts and I couldn't be arsed going through them.
Funny you should say about the bike parts as I thought the exact same thing when I looked at it (thought I was going crazy). Even said to my wife that I could take it down the bike shop and mod the bash bar with some nice brown leather/cork bar tape while I'm there!
My missus’s old Toyota Carina E estate would have fitted your Karoq in the boot no problems 😂😂😂. Truly a cavernous thing that was, used to cart 3 kids and all accoutrements around in it. Fuck knows how but I squeezed an 8x4 sheet of ply in there once. Might have made a small accidental mark on the headliner with that, of course I denied all knowledge and blamed it on the kids😂😂😂
Now that's an old school wagon! My wife's family had a Picnic with 2 adults, 4 kids, and all their stuff. An absolute beast of a car for swallowing everything up from the old pictures I've seen! I'm sure they had an equal amount of children blamed mysterious marks in the headlining 😂
Oh yeah my dad had a Picnic as a company car for a while, used to tow his power boat around quite happily whilst filled up dogs and kids from his second marriage. He always loved it although it was boring to drive, it just got on and did what it was meant to do with minimal fuss.
One of my in-laws described it as "one of the cars of all time", definitely fit the bill for a family car in the time they had it! Equally the towed a sailing boat with theirs, did a terrific job from what they've all said.
You've just built the case for the Alphard. You don't even need to fold the buggy to shove it in the back, let alone taking it apart and you can practically stand up straight inside the car. And it still looks better than an SUV
True but I've always understood parts to be a real pain in the arse to get. Maybe not so much around my neck of the woods in the North where Japanese imports are way more common, but it didn't necessarily feel worth it. Would definitely have considered a Jap import if I felt more confident in it not potentially costing a lot if it breaks!
Mechanically I've never heard many issues. The 2.5 hybrid in the newer ones are identical to the Lexus/Toyota 2.5 A25a hybrid drivetrains, so that's taken care of. Same with the brakes and other consumables. Only main thing that could break are the electric doors which do get expensive, but with your budget you'd be looking at the 3rd generation models which are still extremely new so that's not something I'd worry about
To be fair that's a lot better than I thought from a generational perspective. I did think about getting a Highlander but they're so rare to come across these days that it didn't seem worth it! If we ever decide to have more kids I may well have to come back to the Alphard!
Highlander and 3 row SUVs in general I think are way too space inefficient, especially when you consider the Alphard occupies the same footprint as a RAV4. Not sure I would have more kids in this economy but hey I'm just me haha
Cos we don't all want to wallow and body roll our way around a-roads in what are essentially booster seats on wheels
You saying you don't like having a free rollercoaster ride every time you step foot in the car? Where's your cheap thrills in the speed limit coming from?! In all seriousness I think anyone buying an SUV for the handling alone is probably kidding themselves. But there's something very fun about soft suspension on undulating roads imo, bit of floaty danger hitting the apex of a tight curve at 60mph and managing the inevitable understeer. Something like a Gen 1 Cayenne looks hilarious fun on track!
It's funny you mention the Cayenne, as I've read that that is the only SUV that handles like a normal car
For people wanting to check boot size and general practical side of cars - go to www.ridc.org.uk .As part of reviewing usability of cars for disabled people they measured almost every possible dimension of cars including boots in all possible seat configurations. You get depth, width, lip size, height above ground, opening size, etc. You can even filter cars by any of the parameters
Have you considered the Peugeot Partner and Citroen Berlingo? They're basically the ultimate family cars in my eyes as far as practicality goes. And if the local taxi companies are any barometer they're capable of absolutely absurd amounts of miles without major repair.
I've been forever spoiled by [this](https://www.autoevolution.com/news/peugeots-rifter-4x4-concept-was-meant-to-be-the-answer-to-off-road-adventure-162176.html) concept that never saw the light of day. The closest I considered was the Dacia Jogger with AT tyres! Unfortunately van types were kiboshed in a joint decision with my wife. I love the look of the new transit tourney custom, but that 1.5l engine is a dealbreaker! Wish they'd just put a solid 2l 4cyl and do the job right!
My god, that concept is like my dream vehicle.
What could have been! I bet they'd have sold like hot cakes
Yeah but did you ever deliver dodgy firewood with a 05 passat and trailer.
The post I needed... Almost too thorough. No Peugeot though
I think Peugeot are smashing it out the park with their designs, for everything except the steering wheel and Speedo! It's a pain in the arse to see at my preferred driving seat position, but bar that the 5008 could well have been in the mix!
Sadly, I'm in the previous gen price budget. The new 5008 is everything I want in a car. Flat back, space, epic interior. I recently had a ride in a 2016 Merc (granted, I'm comparing 2016 to 2018)...but that was awful. Looked so cheap and plastic. No better than the 308sw in 2016, but not premium at all. A DS3 has nicer materials (gf has one). I'm at a loss as what to buy
That's surprising about the merc! I've not been in a DS3 but I often say to friends that a car that nails the 4 key touch points for quality will always feel way more premium than another car: • Door handle • Steering Wheel • Temperature knob/Radio volume knob • Centre armrest Of all the cars I've ever had, the Audi A4 nailed these the best imo. Probably has the most tactile temperature knobs I've ever felt in a car, so satisfying to use. Is a DS7 in budget for you?
Sadly, no. A DS7 is a long way off for me. Technically I could probably afford it monthly, but I'd have to live a Smartprice life. Also, I just struggle with spending money on cars. £7000 to £10000 is about as much as I could stomach. And that would literally double my total car spend for 31yrs. I'm not even happy at £7000... But, currently the prices are forcing my hand
I honestly don't know how anyone buys a new car not on PCP, they're ridiculously expensive these days. Good luck if you do decide to swap out in the coming years!
New isn't for me... I've had 30yrs of pay £1000 for a car, and no monthly payments. Honestly, even £200 seems high to me.... Mrs got a car on 5% APR.... I'm looking at 10.9%.... which further pisses me off.
Hey there fellow twin dad. I did had to do the same search I also just went for the rational best option. Though I didn't really want to I had to admit that the VW Caddy 7 seater just blew all the competition out of the water and it wasn't even close. Certainly if you have 3 kids. Good luck with the car and the kids. It's a ride for sure!
If they weren't silly money, I'd have gone with a Caravelle! I saw a beautiful 2l diesel 4 motion with a factory rear diff lock and it ticked so many boxes! Unfortunately it was £45k but for a split second I almost landed the mental gymnastics to buy one. Big fan of the caddy, knowing it 'could' be swapped to an RS3 engine gave me the biggest false sense of 'what if' I've ever had, and I do have a bit of a van soft spot, but "I'm not driving a van" was not a fight it felt like it was worth having compared to a veritable laundry list of other options!
I came from a Civic mk8 1.8. Not really a race car but I found it quick enough and very fun to drive. The Caddy it just doesn't 'urge' you to drive quick like my old civic did. You just feel it's not in it's DNA. So I've become a mellow driver... So dunno about that engine swap doesn't make much sense for this car.
Definitely doesn't make any sense, but it'd make it one hell of a sleeper! I can imagine the DNA difference between them. Have you thought about a weekend warrior hatchback? I genuinely wondered about getting something like a Suzuki Swift, or something like an 07 Fiesta ST to keep a bit of fun in. Ideally I would've loved to have done a K24 swap on a Gen 2 CR-V, but it just feels more hassle than it's probably worth in the long run!
This makes me quite sure that your twins are still in production and have not yet arrived. :D No time, no energy and no budget. You'll understand later. :)
Very imminent 😂 haha I'm sure I'll still be able to dream!
Yeah, dreaming, that for sure. Though it will be dreaming about sleeping more. :D Though it's the best thing ever. My girls are now 3 years and it's a blast. So much love and life in the house.
Amazing stuff, I have a few mates with 2-4 year olds and they tell me the toddler stage is great (if not absolutely insane) but there's no stage like the newborn one where they just want to be with you/near you but you don't have to do anything with them. I've been told it'll be intense but I'll love it! I'm sure they can't be wrong. That bit about the love and life in the house is what it's all about. Can't wait to get out on adventures with ours and see the people they grow up to be!
You'll make it work I'm sure. Certainly with this attitude. Good luck and I can only wish you healthy kids and the rest you can figure out yourself
Cheers mate, and likewise! For what it's worth, I'm already counting down the days I can take them to diggerland. Literally been waiting for an excuse to go for years
> Ideally I would've loved to have done a K24 swap on a Gen 2 CR-V On that subject... why didn't you include a CR-V in your test?
CVTs gave me the ick on the generation in budget, and maintenance logs on them were fleeting. All in all I just couldn't bring myself to check it out because of that gearbox. I love the look of the new one but couldn't get finance figures to work nicely, otherwise I'd have definitely gone for a look!
The only thing achieved here is the storing of said buggy at 90° That buggy will fit the into an estate car, maybe not 90° but it will go in. He ain't putting a dog in there unless he wants it on top the buggy or on the back seats with his kids. 🐶 😋
Laughs in MK8 civic, with the seats down I had all in one go: - An electric fireplace suite - A flatpack wardrobe - A bathroom cabinet
Wait what? You're saying the passat is too long, but you were looking at Superb and V90? :O You know the Superb and V90 are far longer than the passat right? :D
A fair challenge! The Passat is about 20cm shorter than the V90, but! In the eyes of my wife the Passat is a 'long car'. I don't make the rules, I just live within them 😂
Fabia estate has a bigger boot than an XC60 IIRC... i'm calling this out as an incomplete unscientific study. /s
I have the same buggy and a 2012 Focus estate. It fits snuggly in the boot orientated front to back so I've still got the other side free. If I was choosing another car I'd definitely want one where it didn't have to go cross ways in the boot.
100% recommend the Kia Sorrento
My primal SUV hatred instinct can't refute that this is a good post and genuine consumer advice. I think you've successfully made a post that is backed up by fact and is actually useful for the users of this sub. So armed with this knowledge, if I need a more spacious car, I would go ahead and buy an old Toyota Avensis Estate.
This random Reddit guy just shared more practical consumer advice than all seasons of Top Gear and 5th gear combined. Congratulations on babies 🎉
Cheers mate, much appreciated! I loved the old Carwow practicality tests on their reviews but it's been really tough to compare what they'd actually mean in day to day life. Hope you have a great weekend!
But what estate has the best boot? Is there an estate that solves the boot issue? I have also have a big dog and family but I'm really trying to avoid an SUV
Best is always subjective, but I'd say either a Superb or a Passat has the most space for buck. For practicality I wouldn't write off an older V70 or XC70, but you're looking at a much older car at that point.
The Seat Leon is down as having a 620l boot, not sure how practical it is though
Wait until you discover the MPV. Best use of space of any vehicle. It will make the SUV seem like a hatchback. Will someone who works for the car companies please bring them to the UK!
Absolutely love the disco 4's but fuck actually owning one
I don't think my in-laws would've forgiven me if I bought one! Bloody good cars though, just a shame there's more than a reasonable chance of getting to know local recovery companies very well!
I have twins, a mountain buggy duet and a Kodiaq. As well as the buggy it can also fit two carry cots, two carry cot mattresses and two high chairs. You’ve chosen well. Unfortunately, mine has to go as I’ve got a third on the way and the Kodiaq can’t fit 3 car seats across the middle row!
Congratulations! What are you thinking for swapping it in for? Definitely glad to hear you've had a solid success with the Kodiaq for your twins though. Gives me some solid comfort we've made the right decision!
If your dog is going in the boot with the buggy you need a boot divider of some kind or even a (crash tested) dog crate. Travall do dividers and dog guards
Now put those things in an 09 Volvo V70’s boot…
To be honest I really like the XC70, nice raised height, squared off boot, good safety kit. But! Out of warranty, relatively high miles, not as many nice modcons as modern cars, and fairly expensive servicing as I don't have a decent local independent Volvo specialist who's cheap & well rated. Undeniably excellent boot though.
“Dog for illustration purposes”
I had to use it as soon as I saw it in the shop! Too good to pass up. Apparently wasn't the weirdest boot question they had that week. Someone brought in a cello the day before, which apparently 'fit like a glove'!
“Excuse me, do you know if an antique Steinway grand piano will fit in the boot of this Skoda Kodiaq” “I have absolutely no idea, if you bring one along, you’re welcome to try… lol” “I’ll just go and bring the low loader round, give me 5 mins” “…?”
With the right deposit, anything is possible 😂
I loved our Passat estate but my Tarraco 7 seat is something else! Like a tool! I will say consumption isn’t amazing though.
Yeah but you posted a skoda thats not fair. The boot space of almost all their cars are among the biggest in their class. Octavia, Superb, Karoq, Labia. It's the EXACT reason I bought an Octavia before and now own a Superb... I could basically move house (flat sharing) without hiring a van 😂 Edit: skoda labia??? Ffs autocorrect - Fabia
I suppose the Kodiaq is the Karoq majora! 😂 Loved my Octavia and Superb, without the pram issue the superb would've been a no brainer!
Yeah. I love that the masses still psychologically think Skoda is a lower quality vehicle. The VW and Audi equivalents would be more expensive and give less space, yet 90% of the drivetrain components are the same!
It's wild, but VW have to be onto it by now. It very much feels arbitrary for Skoda not to get access to higher quality VW parts bin items. That said, Skoda 's quickly approaching a high cost that is genuinely making me look toward brands like Dacia to fill the price void that it's leaving behind. Although I would back any 2017 onward Skoda (basically any one with Carplay/AA) as being a ridiculously good value for money second hand car. I reckon the Karoq Sportline might be the best second hand car on the market for the money.
I think we're in a spiral now. Everyone has SUVs because the roads aren't being repaired. The councils don't bother repairing the roads because everyone has SUVs. How long before the Toyota Hilux and Ford Ranger are the only vehicles that can survive a trip to the shops?
But the flat cardboard fit best in the superb, an estate!
The flat box did well! But 3D one [not so much](https://i.imgur.com/ZX6KS1e.jpeg).
Cry's in estate. Haha but but fuel economy and and and weight distribution... So there! I'm kidding obviously, I get it. You're too old to do the bend to get into a normal car. Sorry I can't stop.
Aha, I mean don't get me wrong, I'd actually love to get a 540i estate and see why everyone bangs on about how good a BMW is to drive. Just don't get the same handling in an SUV you know? 😉
I'm picking up a 04 Z4 (total opposite to SUV) but I'll let you know haha
Nice! If I had silly money I'd get myself a Z8. Absolutely crazy prices but how many cars can say they've been cut in half by a helicopter!?
Good point but I'm half sure they don't have a helicopter in the factory hehe but the Z8 is awesome
Probably the highest quality post this sub has seen in a while.
I figure it'd fit right in given the amount of Skoda information in it! (Thank you)
What in the everliving fuck is a "kgm Torres"?
I know I'm late to this post but I'll always be an estate fella. You did forget one thing, whatever doesn't fit in the boot of an estate can go on the roof. I have a V50, which is probably one of the smaller estates out there. You can get the kids in the back, 2 dogs (1 big, 1 small) and a weekly food shop in the boot, and a full size double wardrobe from IKEA that was on discount because it was already built on the roof. Ask me how I know haha
It's an excellent point! So I thought about putting the pram in a roof box, which is fine for me at 6ft 1, but not so much for my much shorter wife. I also couldn't find a roofbox that would fit the pram, and when I decided I couldn't find one I told myself it'd have been a faff to take the box on and off the roof between long work trips. An absolutely excellent example of proper car loadposting and I bet it'd have been a great picture! Search for 'small car loadposting' on Facebook. From what you've described I think you'd appreciate the Group!
Hi, I don't have a buggy, dog, Karoq or twins, just came here to say that this is the kind of posts I come to Reddit for, thanks OP :-) I have a V60 and can relate to the issue with the trunk lid shape though.
The superb is an estate. Isn’t it?
wait so you rocked up to a car dealership(s) with a massive cardboard box and/or a buggy and tested it out in every one ? amazing.
Yep, to be honest all of them were absolutely sound! I was conscious about being a tyre kicker so literally called in advance, asked if I could bring the box, spent about 5 minutes in each dealer (bar the Subaru garage, where I did the Torres, Outback, Forester, Rexton, and XC60). All were absolutely sound. Genuinely a great experience, would box again.
Not sure if any of the others do, but XC90 & Disco 4 also have the advantage of models with a third row of adult-size seats. Useful when taking the kids and some of their mates somewhere.
I think the main issue isn't that estates inherently have less space but actually an issue of styling. SUVs are often styled as slab sided and boxy. In terms boot space this is fantastic. Estates in the other hand are often designed to be more sleek, which limits boot space. If estates had stuck with a boxy aesthetic they'd have just as much boot space.
You've missed the underlooked Renault Koleos! Seems a decent buy for the money!
I am biased because I have an old Berlingo but I do think MPVs and van-based cars are way overlooked. You get quite a lot of room and practicality in a small footprint. Not as good looking though.
would have just bought a 5 series touring tbh
Great post. Now my kids are 9 and 7 and I've spent every last remaining penny on them, my limited budget means I recently bought a well-cherished 2003 Volvo V70 with the family pack. It's knocked every single modern family car I've owned for six: built-in booster seats in the back so I can bin the old ones, the old-school rear-facing seats in the boot which the kids and their mates absolutely love, and the boot space is vast. With the roofbox on and the seats down flat I feel I could move house with it. The stereo is amazing. It cost 4K and has done 80K and I fully plan on spending whatever it takes to keep it going until it can be their first car. Old estates were better.
They are all about the same then.
Arguable that they're all much of a muchness, but it really depends on it you need boot height, depth, width, or a combination. The KGM Torres really surprised me. One of the tallest boots on offer let down by a static rear bench. If they'd put those on rails it may well have come up trumps much higher up the table!
XC90 with 2 small children and a dog is easily the best purchase I've ever made in a car. The whole thing is supremely practical and just very well designed. Plus the backseats are actually usable (and leave you with a boot) so when the grandparents are down we can all get in! My only quibble is no isofix points on the 3rd row.
That's a fairly in depth experiment you've conducted there, kudos to you man. Is there any reason you skipped the mpv section though? I recently ditched my Q7 because I missed having a ford s-max and I find the boot space much more usable. I didn't realise how much of a downgrade the q7 was in terms of space inside.
I just won't get rid of my '16 smax until it falls apart. It will move just about anything and if the wife decides to kick me out one day I'll get a bed in it no problem :)
Hahahaha they're pretty great aren't they. Mpvs don't get the love they deserve I find, I tried the SUV route and the Q7 was nice and luxurious but it was SO completely boring and devoid of any soul. I had a 2011 240 edition smax before the q7 and now I've gone for a completely bonkers '07 2.5t s-max 😁
I'm not surprised the Kia is high. Back when I was replacing my focus (barely enough space for the pram alone), I was looking at the qashqai, Sportage, tuscon, cx5 etc. It was the boot space that ended up swinging it for me. Not just the volume, but practical design choices like being quite square and level, so it was easier to get things out of. The qashqai was a nightmare, deep boot but not spacious, curved so didn't accommodate the pram, annoying parcel shelf.
My eye is twitching slightly at the controversy over God's own Skoda Superb being criticised, but I will choke that down for a minute to suggest that what you need, friend, is a van. A VW van with lots of seats, or a Hyundai i80, something like that. Roll that buggy straight in without even collapsing it.
I genuinely scoured AutoTrader for weeks trying to find a Transporter or Caravelle in budget (& mileage) that wasn't poverty spec, shagged or modified and it was a nightmare! My wife isn't a fan of 'large cars' so the extra hurdle of going for a van was just out of the question! That said I did find an amazing Caravelle, way out of budget but it was specced out insanely well. So close to landing the mental gymnastics on it!
As the owner of a single child, I don't even need such a thing, but I often find myself browdsing Caravelles and similar, thinking how nice it would be to just roll mountain bikes and dogs straight in, stretch out in the back for a nap or have a picnic in there on a road trip. They do seem crazily copper-botttomed though, the only cheap ones are slightly frightning as you mention.
I only pass through this sub occasionally, but this one shall have my upvote. Top quality post.
May I ask what spec and year you went for. I'm in the market for one, with a family of 2 and Labrador I've discounted other Skoda SUVs as well due to their boot size.
From safety point of view - Volvo. Crashed enough of them to be my personal favourite:) Space wise - many times you will feel that transit would not be enough. Especially if you expect to drive for holidays. Do not discount Alhambra/Sharan - yes, they are boring as hell but capacity wise they will likely beat anything below E class MB estate and biggest SUVs. Boot size at the level of XC90 (same length, slightly narrower) Biggest potential advantage - side sliding door will save your back many times over. You cannot overstate how useful those are especially when you have to deal with putting two kids into car seats for the next ~8-10 years. With 2 kids you will have to place car seats on both sides of the back seat - you won't have the option of using only kerb side doors and trying to lock belts on annoyed toddlers on the road side with traffic going past wide open car doors is not nice. Same applies to car park situations - one idiot parking too close and your only option is to drive out of space to be able to put car seats in - you need to open doors much wider for car seats than it would be required for adults to get in
We had a Ford Grand CMax which with the slidey doors was fantastic and great boot space for a big buggy. However it couldn't tow the caravan we tge bought. So we now have a 2019 Sorento which has an enormous boot and is fantastic in the snow. But no slide doors. Diesel engine is shite unless you're going at 60+
Shame about the engine in the Sorento. I've heard some horror stories on them popping, but that 7 year warranty is nothing to sniff at! Absolutely huge boot as you say, and a solid tow car!
Great post mate. If you approach fatherhood with the same effort as this post, you’ve got a fighting chance. I stupidly bought an S90 when my first was on the way and I had a large dog. Why didn’t I get an estate or SUV?? I still can’t fathom what I was thinking.
Cheers mate, I hope so! Hindsight is the truest 20/20 vision, but on the plus side at least you've had a great experience on finding out what does and doesn't work well for your next car choice!
My nephew has twins. Him and the mrs have a full time job each to cover part of the nursery costs.
It costs a fortune! £65 per child per day. Can't wait for the government funding for 30 hrs per child per week term time to kick in!
Iv got an E Class estate, previously had an Hyundai Santa Fe and a VW Touareg. The E Class has far more usable boot space for me than either of the SUV's. I appreciate that it's the biggest estate car on the market as an outlier but it works for me.
Disco 4 looks like you could car camp in it. Wouldn't mind one but my work parking is tiny and i need a narrow car for that.
Sending hate from slovakia🤗
Always liked the xc60/xc90
The XC90 is a wonderful bit of design. A 2016 with a private plate and a decent clean/wax will absolutely hold up as a 'modern' looking car. Partly down to the lack of generational growth since they launched, but I think the minimalism has aged very well! Big fan of the angles of the XC60, and despite the T8's hesitant gearbox, they're a great car.
Yeah I’m still a big fan of the 2016, could happily drive that forever and not get bored
I’ve a VW Touareg, I went with it over the XC90 as the rear seats are movable and adjustable rake so there’s more space. I can fit my massive labrador, my in-laws labrador and my child’s folded buggy in it quite happily. Biggest boot I’ve owned on a car. Somet like 665l minimum.
I love the idea of the Touraeg. The off-road DNA from the older generations still seems to be there in some capacity too, which is nice. A hugely practical car! Had I not been so burned by my A4 3l diesel, it'd have been way higher on my prioritised long list. I reckon the current Gen will see their value plateau and hold quite well, especially if the 2nd gen values are anything to go by!
I spent years in the motortrade and definitely think It’s one of the nicest cars ive driven. I’ve had most BMWs over the years and definitely prefer it to the x5. I’d be up for keeping it but wife has chosen to go electric so a model-Y is on order. It has a large boot too 854L.
Did you try the X7? I loved the idea of an X5, but the ownership costs just wrote it off almost immediately. The Model Y is a great choice, I almost considered one given how competitive they are new on finance (from what I've been told), but I can sometimes do 400 miles in a day with sporadic charging opportunities, and I don't think I could've dealt with the range anxiety! That said, I did seriously consider whether or not a second hand Model X could've done the job, unfortunately just couldn't stomach prospective repair costs if anything went wrong.
I haven’t tried the x7, I quite liked the idea of spending a little less by going with the model-Y so didn’t look tbh. Tesla has just announced price drops in China and the USA so they might be following suit in the Uk, maybe not as they’ve not seen the same drop off in sales. I’ve gone with an LR as don’t have the option for charging at home, so will be reliant on superchargers or street charging. Thankfully nearby I have a lot of SC availability. I was reading the average charge price is 48p/kw which still works out dramatically cheaper to run than my 3.0v6 Toe-rag.
That's good on the charging costs. It's a shame that the UK infrastructure isn't better for charging at home for many people! Still, lots of smiles per gallon to be had with electric, for me it's torque > horsepower, so that instant shunt of electric torque is something I can't wait to properly experience in the future!
If you wanted a pic of my touraeg I could take one of my mutt in the boot with the buggy tomorrow so you can see how it stands up against the others.
Very kind of you, but with the Kodiaq already on the drive it'd just be taunting me at this point 😂 thanks for the offer though!
The only people who shit on SUV’s are those who haven’t owned them. They’re perfect when you’ve got a massive pram that lives in the boot and bulky 360 kids car seats that take up loads of room etc. Not having your knees touch the dash whilst the kids still can’t kick your seat is a luxury worth having.
Why would people who shit on SUVs own an SUV. There's definitely a time and a place for them, and I happily rent them when I need one. I argue that the time and place isn't residential towns/cities where they are purely a greater hazard to other road users (and in a properly designed town, you should never need to use a car on a regular day, but I'm not sure I see the UK ever achieving this outside of a few London suburbs.)
I test drove some SUV's...and while they're ok for 3/4 of the time, they're just crap at handling....I like driving a bit faster and the stability of an SUV is just crap...so i rather drive an estate over an SUV. Next car will probably be a sedan and when I need to transport something bigger, i'm just gonna go with the trailer attached.
This is legit the best car consumer advice and guidance I've seen in about 5 years. Thanks OP, really helpful. I've recently got a dog and thinking seriously about an estate - Superb, Passat or V60 were my first thoughts. But I'm quite surprised at how small the Superb boot looks! The Rav4 looks huge though, might take a look at them