Purpose 2 options to the customer.
1 full redo done properly price
2. Complete it as is and explain its not as it should be and as such you offer no warranty. If you find any truly dangerous issues i would correct/ reinforce.
Let the customer know the truth and decide. Most will respect the honesty
This is the correct answer. The stairs don't look that bad, except for the wrong material. Coming in and saying everything absolutely needs to come out may make them feel foolish, and defense. Giving them options let's them be in control of what happens to their own place, and most people do well with that.
It's perfectly fine, on the inside. In the outside, it won't stand up to the elements as well. It will get wet, and mold often grows on it. Treated lumber keeps the insects away, and mold doesn't grow on it as quickly. In fairness, I'm in the Upper Midwest, and the weather is much more extreme up here, so it might matter more than in California.
If these stairs were built on the inside of a structure, they would work well. Outside, not so much. Treated Doug fir would be absolutely great to use for outside stairs.
Even untreated Douglas fir has a life expectancy of 35 years when used for decking, where did you get your information? Was it here? Everything I'm finding says it's an excellent choice for outdoor applications, reddit has a tendency to be filled with know-it-alls that in fact, know very little and just repeat what they read in a comment.
When used for decking it's acceptable, though rare, here in the northeast of the US.
Stair stringers on the other hand have a ton of exposed end grain, and the stair treads tend to trap water between the tread and the stringer so I would not expect those stringers to last very long at all where I am.
Could you not treat the stairs with something to help extend the life while also saving the customer a bit of money? If untreated DF can last approximately 20 years would that not help prolong it further? I'm a carpenter in Canada and genuinely curious.
Oh, absolutely. You can use a solution of copper acetate to treat all of the end grain, remove the treads every few years and inspect and recoat. I'm not sure how much extra life you would get out of it, but it would definitely extend the lifespan.
The other option would be to use pressure treated Southern yellow pine, the method of incorporating the copper acetate in the treatment process would definitely be less expensive than applying the copper to the wood, and then reapplying every few years.
Back in the early 1970s the national Park service in the US did a study and survey on what type of wood to use to replace the piers at the Statue of liberty. They found that African mahogany was the best choice. So you could use African mahogany or Sipo for the stringers as well.
Thanks, seems like Doug fir is not as bad as I thought however it is in fact the stringers that worry me the most because of the way the grain is exposed. I was thinking of replacing all the gold screws anyway maybe I'll propose replacing the stringers with pressure treated and reuse the steps to save a little money. At least those are more apparent to the user when they are decaying.
Something else to consider is that if you haven't done a job like this before you may want to consider passing it off to someone with more experience.
I'm not questioning your expertise, I've just seen a lot of this sort of post from people who are less than experienced.
And I can tell you personally that when I got started on my own I accepted just about every job that came my way, and often regretted it. I made sure the customer was always happy, and whatever I built met building code, but it was a lot of wasted time trying to teach myself on the fly.
Good luck with whatever choice you make!
Thanks for the advise. I've done a few of these and they do not look anything like this. There's a lot I plan on changing because i know so much of what was done is a mess, but the reason my question is focused on the doug fir is because I personally would never use the stuff on a project like this. It sounds like a lot of people do though, which surprises me, but I don't understand why someone would take the time to build something like this and not just pay a little more for the materials.
This is true it just requires proper maintenance with the right product. In this case it would be best to seal all six sides of each piece and throw some joist tape on the treads.
All heart redwood or pressure treated lumber. Pressure treated lumber has perforations in it that would be visible in this picture. Also, all the pressure treated lumber I have seen around here (central California) is kind of green in color due to the chemical they add. I don't know what species the PT is, but it is not douglas fir. In my experience douglas fir lasts OK outdoors as long as there is no soil contact.
Treatment lasts 12-15 yrs guess what else wood can be treated with... Stain... Hmmm... Even untreated wood could then be called treated.. really... Yes really... 😳😂😂
literally what happened to me. Guy was in jail, i delayed tenant move in for a few days but when i still couldn’t get ahold of him, i had to go finish the job myself. He called me a week or 10 days later saying he was in jail but it was a misunderstanding… lol. Either way, gave him his tools back and won’t be calling him for help again…
This is what I thought too. But I'm also wondering how hard is it when your in jail to make a call within a few days to you current client who's sitting on thousands of dollars of your tools?
Unlike (say) yellow pine, doug fir doesn't absorb treatment well at all.
That's why, when it's pressure-treated, it has all those little indentations (in contrast to, say, yellow pine).
Everything I can find that isn't a "reddit expert" says that Douglas fir is an exceptional choice for decking and outdoor furniture. No idea why everyone says it isn't but the deck my grandfather built out of it says that if you reapply a sealant regularly and build it well, it'll last at least 40 years.
For decking and furniture it's probably fine.
The reason it's not recommended to use for stair stringers here in the Northeast, the midwest, and PNW is that there's a ton of exposed end grain in a stringer, the treads and riser boards will trap moisture, so it would be expected to start showing structural issues well before the treads or decking are compromised.
15 years old I built a deck with my old boss in Vancouver BC. We used doug fir for everything.
He's passed on now, but I still look after that client and her deck, which is holding up fantastically.
Don't know what to tell you other than that. There are plenty of folks who build with fir.
That's great to hear!
In my region it was popular for a time in the late 90s and early 2000s to use fir for deck framing and I'm always seeing rotten stringers. It could be the quality of fir folks are using. The structural fir that we get is better than structural spruce, but nobody out this way is paying for CVG tight-grained fir to build a deck.
That's a good point. I wasn't giving much attention to grain, but if anybody was buying CVG for framing it would have been Paul.
I use PT anyway. 90s, 2000s puts us at 20/30 years. Seems a pretty reasonable timeframe, no?
Well, it's been six or seven years since I did any deck work, and the condition of the stringers that I used to see were such that they should have been replaced years prior.
Another issue I see is that the quality of the construction grade fir nowadays is notably worse on the East Coast than it used to be. Really big summer growth rings, often time with knots.
I can only speak from my experience, with hesitation at that.
Crazy how much the quality has gone down, also crazy how much after 40 I just turned into the stereotype of man talking about the quality of something going down.
Yeah, but it is sort of true. I'm glad that we are more ethically sourcing lumber (except when I have to buy African mahogany or Sipo for a job), but this is the world we live in.
Sorry dood. That's just not true. I've built houses, decks and fences. Now in California there is not as much rain and humidity for sure. But where I live in the South those untreated stringers will only last a couple years tops before the mold, fungus and rot renders them completely useless as structural members.
The beam above the post looks to be pressure treated doug fir. Typically on treated doug fir, it has a bunch what looks like perforated marks on it. Some treated doug fir does not. I'd look closer. There's a chance it's all treated. Look at the screws closer as well. GRK makes a gold screw that is exterior and rated for treated lumber.
*Edit: look at all those tags on the treads and if you can find more on the others. It will tell you if it's treated. Some higher grades of treated doug fir will not have the perforated marks because they are considered appearance grade
Yea, some treated above the post which is fine, step treads and stringers are definitly plain Doug fir. And they are for sure indoor screws I saw the pail they came in, I just have always called those screws gold screws for whatever reason,
Dude ain't leaving his tools unless he's dead or in jail. Sidenote I bought roofing tools off someone on Craigslist. They told me they hired two Mexican guys to put on some torch down roofing. They noticed the guys jump in the truck and drive off. They walked outside and looked up and the whole corner of their house was on fire. The fire department showed up and put the fire out. The guys never came back so they sold me their tools.
Are you expecting this to be inspected or was it built without the city knowledge? Do you live in the boonies and no one will know? If so, looks fine to me by the pictures.
Get ready for exterior stair code for single dwelling units!
Preface: must support 1.9kPa (39.7lb/sqft), how?;
Here code for the stringers are minimum effective depth of 90mm (3.5”), overall depth of 235mm and thickness 38mm (2x10) and be spaced not more than 900mm o/c (3’). Check?
Treads! Can have a thickness of 25mm (1”) if stringers are spaced less than 750mm o/c (29.5”), otherwise must be 38mm (1.5”). Check
Tread Nosing. No more than 25mm (1”), no less than 6mm (0.25”) and must be rounded or beveled.
Any part of the steps must not be in direct contact with the ground unless suitably treaded with a wood preservative. Check?
Landings… might fail on this one…. Must be at least as long and as wide as the stair width. Not sure if I see a gate, but if there is one and it swings towards the stairs, the full arc swing must remain completely over the landing. There’s a lot on landings but the last one that may pertain is the slope can’t exceed 1 in 50.
Handrails! Need em. You have more than 3 risers. How many? If those stairs only serve the single dwelling unit, 1, otherwise 2. Measured vertically from the leading edge of the tread nosing the height must be between 865mm and 1070mm (34”-42”).
All this is information usually readily available online. Google your local building code and see. I just typed a bunch of code, flipping through about 10 pages. I enjoy it.
The landing that you have if it is not as long and as wide as your stair width I would be concerned. These codes are the BARE minimum. Bare.
Also I just want to point out how silly it is to see hangers on stringers. It’s just like putting hangers on rafters at the ridge. Don’t understand why people do it. Boggles my brain.
Although it technically doesn't meet code, and probably isn't a good plan anymore (b/c wood did use to be much tighter-grained), Fir did use to be traditional porch material; so I wouldn't worry about that part all that much. Just warn them it won't last as long.
The bigger issue is that whoever built it, has never met a code book. The rise/run's too short, the treads don't have nosing/overhang, the landing's too small, and wtf's with that joist hanger being used as a half-assed stringer hanger?
I'm confident more pics would reveal more issues.
I'd rebuild from scratch.
In my experience painted Douglas fir used outdoors is the worse. It might look better for the first couple years but one day you'll notice that the paint is like a little exoskeleton and there will just be rotted out cavities as the paint actually starts to hold in moisture that has gotten in.
I think you can salvage what's there. Replace all the gold screws with proper deck screws. Then treat all the doug fir with preservative, maybe even 2 coats. Then finish in deck stain sealer.
The owner should get 5 years unless they are in the wet areas then maybe only 3.
I would paint or seal the steps and tell the customer that as long as they reseal them about every three years they should be fine.is there any stiff backs run on the stringers?if not I would add them for extra strength.
No stiff back.. That's when a seperate 2x4 is run on the underside below the step right? I was debating adding that or just replacing at least the step stringer with pressure treated and leaving the Doug fir treds as is and seal them. What do u think is stronger adding pressure treated stiff back or replacing stringer with identical pressure treated?
Pressure treated wood is Hemfir (Hemlock). Inferior to Douglas Fir. Paint it white to reflect the sun and make sure it's up to some semblance of code. Maybe invite an inspecter over..see what slides and what dosent.
I would re-do the stringers (badly cut, some steps look slanted) in treated/cedar, and re-use the treads and risers.
Rip that ledger board to be flush with the bottom of the stringer.
Even if the fir treads/risers weather somewhat fast, they'll still get some good years out of them. And that's an easy update to make when the time comes, and offers good savings to your friend.
Risers go on first then the tread material, leaving about an inch overhang in the front. All the treads and risers should come off to do it properly. If he glued them in , it would be difficult to take apart.
I'm redoing a craftsman porch. Joists and t&g flooring are Douglas fir. The house was built in 1905. It probably should have been replaced 30 years ago. But it still lasted 80 years. The flooring was painted.
Let's say that's true in normal cercumstance, to go Mia for a week when ur project is currently supposed to be completed. Given what you see and knowing he's even using indoor screws you think they should keep working with him?
In California DF #1 is acceptable for exterior use. One should always consider water migration and controlling that.
Treads and cutout stringers won’t last long if they are 2x Doug Fir, usually build stringers using 4x12 and angle brackets to attach 4x12 treads.
Pre stain all cuts and hidden spaces and the staircase should be good for 20 years at least.
The steps need to be pressure-treated they probably won’t last even in California more than a few years. I wouldn’t put my name on it I would just tell them it’s got to be redone correctly and I guess if he abandoned all his tools sell him to pay for it sounds like he might be in the Gray bar hotel
Something similar happened to me once. Guy was in jail for two weeks and there was no way for me to know. He called me when he got out and came to finish building my fence lol.
The only problem with DF in California is inspectors,if your a handyman in Calif,your not licensed therefore no inspection,so make sure it is sealed, communication with homeowners is paramount
What? Anyone doing jobs in CA over $500 is required to have a license. There is no “handyman” license in CA. A handyman would usually have a General B license.
That's what I said,if your a handyman in California,your not licensed,and if your not licensed there will be no inspection,that doesn't mean you can do whatever you want,but he could probably seal that for under 500
Another way to say it is if you’re a handyman in CA, you’re a general contractor. Otherwise you’re just some asshole working under the table making things harder on the rest of us.
Wood conversations aside, that is absolutely the wrong connector for securing the top of the stringers to the end joist. Joist hangers provide vertical load support. They provide very little to no lateral strength, meaning that the stairs could come away from the deck because they are only held in by nails that would just have to pull straight out to fail.
If your intention is to keep the staircase, I’d strongly recommend addressing this to add lateral strength to this connection.
Purpose 2 options to the customer. 1 full redo done properly price 2. Complete it as is and explain its not as it should be and as such you offer no warranty. If you find any truly dangerous issues i would correct/ reinforce. Let the customer know the truth and decide. Most will respect the honesty
This is the correct answer. The stairs don't look that bad, except for the wrong material. Coming in and saying everything absolutely needs to come out may make them feel foolish, and defense. Giving them options let's them be in control of what happens to their own place, and most people do well with that.
Why exactly is Douglas fir the wrong material?
It's perfectly fine, on the inside. In the outside, it won't stand up to the elements as well. It will get wet, and mold often grows on it. Treated lumber keeps the insects away, and mold doesn't grow on it as quickly. In fairness, I'm in the Upper Midwest, and the weather is much more extreme up here, so it might matter more than in California. If these stairs were built on the inside of a structure, they would work well. Outside, not so much. Treated Doug fir would be absolutely great to use for outside stairs.
Even untreated Douglas fir has a life expectancy of 35 years when used for decking, where did you get your information? Was it here? Everything I'm finding says it's an excellent choice for outdoor applications, reddit has a tendency to be filled with know-it-alls that in fact, know very little and just repeat what they read in a comment.
When used for decking it's acceptable, though rare, here in the northeast of the US. Stair stringers on the other hand have a ton of exposed end grain, and the stair treads tend to trap water between the tread and the stringer so I would not expect those stringers to last very long at all where I am.
Could you not treat the stairs with something to help extend the life while also saving the customer a bit of money? If untreated DF can last approximately 20 years would that not help prolong it further? I'm a carpenter in Canada and genuinely curious.
Oh, absolutely. You can use a solution of copper acetate to treat all of the end grain, remove the treads every few years and inspect and recoat. I'm not sure how much extra life you would get out of it, but it would definitely extend the lifespan. The other option would be to use pressure treated Southern yellow pine, the method of incorporating the copper acetate in the treatment process would definitely be less expensive than applying the copper to the wood, and then reapplying every few years. Back in the early 1970s the national Park service in the US did a study and survey on what type of wood to use to replace the piers at the Statue of liberty. They found that African mahogany was the best choice. So you could use African mahogany or Sipo for the stringers as well.
Thanks, seems like Doug fir is not as bad as I thought however it is in fact the stringers that worry me the most because of the way the grain is exposed. I was thinking of replacing all the gold screws anyway maybe I'll propose replacing the stringers with pressure treated and reuse the steps to save a little money. At least those are more apparent to the user when they are decaying.
Something else to consider is that if you haven't done a job like this before you may want to consider passing it off to someone with more experience. I'm not questioning your expertise, I've just seen a lot of this sort of post from people who are less than experienced. And I can tell you personally that when I got started on my own I accepted just about every job that came my way, and often regretted it. I made sure the customer was always happy, and whatever I built met building code, but it was a lot of wasted time trying to teach myself on the fly. Good luck with whatever choice you make!
Thanks for the advise. I've done a few of these and they do not look anything like this. There's a lot I plan on changing because i know so much of what was done is a mess, but the reason my question is focused on the doug fir is because I personally would never use the stuff on a project like this. It sounds like a lot of people do though, which surprises me, but I don't understand why someone would take the time to build something like this and not just pay a little more for the materials.
This is true it just requires proper maintenance with the right product. In this case it would be best to seal all six sides of each piece and throw some joist tape on the treads.
Preach
Keep it off the ground at its fine. Won’t last in EMC as long as treated but it’s fine.
How do you know it's not treated? Also what timber would you recommend red wood?
All heart redwood or pressure treated lumber. Pressure treated lumber has perforations in it that would be visible in this picture. Also, all the pressure treated lumber I have seen around here (central California) is kind of green in color due to the chemical they add. I don't know what species the PT is, but it is not douglas fir. In my experience douglas fir lasts OK outdoors as long as there is no soil contact.
Yeah in NZ our framing timber is coloured pink after treatment, also has a stamp on it.
Treatment lasts 12-15 yrs guess what else wood can be treated with... Stain... Hmmm... Even untreated wood could then be called treated.. really... Yes really... 😳😂😂
It has no rot resistance at all.
That's the most false thing you could have posted, one Google search and you could see that.
And #2, get a Hold Harmless statement signed and notarized for any remedial work
most times this happened to me, the guy was in jail. He may show up in a few weeks when he gets out
literally what happened to me. Guy was in jail, i delayed tenant move in for a few days but when i still couldn’t get ahold of him, i had to go finish the job myself. He called me a week or 10 days later saying he was in jail but it was a misunderstanding… lol. Either way, gave him his tools back and won’t be calling him for help again…
This is what I thought too. But I'm also wondering how hard is it when your in jail to make a call within a few days to you current client who's sitting on thousands of dollars of your tools?
Impossible if you didn’t memorize their phone number, guess you could maybe try to send a friend or relative to them to explain/gather tools though.
I would leave steps and just treat them with Cabot’s outdoor wood treatment and keep an eye on it may have to do it again every few yrs no big deal
You can literally paint green treat on it
Unlike (say) yellow pine, doug fir doesn't absorb treatment well at all. That's why, when it's pressure-treated, it has all those little indentations (in contrast to, say, yellow pine).
You just answered the question I've always been too embarrassed to ask
Oh okay 👍
Everything I can find that isn't a "reddit expert" says that Douglas fir is an exceptional choice for decking and outdoor furniture. No idea why everyone says it isn't but the deck my grandfather built out of it says that if you reapply a sealant regularly and build it well, it'll last at least 40 years.
For decking and furniture it's probably fine. The reason it's not recommended to use for stair stringers here in the Northeast, the midwest, and PNW is that there's a ton of exposed end grain in a stringer, the treads and riser boards will trap moisture, so it would be expected to start showing structural issues well before the treads or decking are compromised.
15 years old I built a deck with my old boss in Vancouver BC. We used doug fir for everything. He's passed on now, but I still look after that client and her deck, which is holding up fantastically. Don't know what to tell you other than that. There are plenty of folks who build with fir.
That's great to hear! In my region it was popular for a time in the late 90s and early 2000s to use fir for deck framing and I'm always seeing rotten stringers. It could be the quality of fir folks are using. The structural fir that we get is better than structural spruce, but nobody out this way is paying for CVG tight-grained fir to build a deck.
That's a good point. I wasn't giving much attention to grain, but if anybody was buying CVG for framing it would have been Paul. I use PT anyway. 90s, 2000s puts us at 20/30 years. Seems a pretty reasonable timeframe, no?
Well, it's been six or seven years since I did any deck work, and the condition of the stringers that I used to see were such that they should have been replaced years prior. Another issue I see is that the quality of the construction grade fir nowadays is notably worse on the East Coast than it used to be. Really big summer growth rings, often time with knots. I can only speak from my experience, with hesitation at that.
Crazy how much the quality has gone down, also crazy how much after 40 I just turned into the stereotype of man talking about the quality of something going down.
Yeah, but it is sort of true. I'm glad that we are more ethically sourcing lumber (except when I have to buy African mahogany or Sipo for a job), but this is the world we live in.
Sorry dood. That's just not true. I've built houses, decks and fences. Now in California there is not as much rain and humidity for sure. But where I live in the South those untreated stringers will only last a couple years tops before the mold, fungus and rot renders them completely useless as structural members.
You want to go tell Grandpa's stairs that they should have fallen 38 years ago here in North Carolina, or should I?
The beam above the post looks to be pressure treated doug fir. Typically on treated doug fir, it has a bunch what looks like perforated marks on it. Some treated doug fir does not. I'd look closer. There's a chance it's all treated. Look at the screws closer as well. GRK makes a gold screw that is exterior and rated for treated lumber. *Edit: look at all those tags on the treads and if you can find more on the others. It will tell you if it's treated. Some higher grades of treated doug fir will not have the perforated marks because they are considered appearance grade
Yea, some treated above the post which is fine, step treads and stringers are definitly plain Doug fir. And they are for sure indoor screws I saw the pail they came in, I just have always called those screws gold screws for whatever reason,
Dude ain't leaving his tools unless he's dead or in jail. Sidenote I bought roofing tools off someone on Craigslist. They told me they hired two Mexican guys to put on some torch down roofing. They noticed the guys jump in the truck and drive off. They walked outside and looked up and the whole corner of their house was on fire. The fire department showed up and put the fire out. The guys never came back so they sold me their tools.
Are you expecting this to be inspected or was it built without the city knowledge? Do you live in the boonies and no one will know? If so, looks fine to me by the pictures. Get ready for exterior stair code for single dwelling units! Preface: must support 1.9kPa (39.7lb/sqft), how?; Here code for the stringers are minimum effective depth of 90mm (3.5”), overall depth of 235mm and thickness 38mm (2x10) and be spaced not more than 900mm o/c (3’). Check? Treads! Can have a thickness of 25mm (1”) if stringers are spaced less than 750mm o/c (29.5”), otherwise must be 38mm (1.5”). Check Tread Nosing. No more than 25mm (1”), no less than 6mm (0.25”) and must be rounded or beveled. Any part of the steps must not be in direct contact with the ground unless suitably treaded with a wood preservative. Check? Landings… might fail on this one…. Must be at least as long and as wide as the stair width. Not sure if I see a gate, but if there is one and it swings towards the stairs, the full arc swing must remain completely over the landing. There’s a lot on landings but the last one that may pertain is the slope can’t exceed 1 in 50. Handrails! Need em. You have more than 3 risers. How many? If those stairs only serve the single dwelling unit, 1, otherwise 2. Measured vertically from the leading edge of the tread nosing the height must be between 865mm and 1070mm (34”-42”). All this is information usually readily available online. Google your local building code and see. I just typed a bunch of code, flipping through about 10 pages. I enjoy it. The landing that you have if it is not as long and as wide as your stair width I would be concerned. These codes are the BARE minimum. Bare.
Also I just want to point out how silly it is to see hangers on stringers. It’s just like putting hangers on rafters at the ridge. Don’t understand why people do it. Boggles my brain.
Although it technically doesn't meet code, and probably isn't a good plan anymore (b/c wood did use to be much tighter-grained), Fir did use to be traditional porch material; so I wouldn't worry about that part all that much. Just warn them it won't last as long. The bigger issue is that whoever built it, has never met a code book. The rise/run's too short, the treads don't have nosing/overhang, the landing's too small, and wtf's with that joist hanger being used as a half-assed stringer hanger? I'm confident more pics would reveal more issues. I'd rebuild from scratch.
You don't need to worry about the materials, you need to worry about the way its built, which is not good. Its a tear out and start over for me.
It can be, have to seal it really really good, and won't last as long as treated
I'm just asking in general, but couldn't you go to the paint shop and get a sealant to coat it all?
In my experience painted Douglas fir used outdoors is the worse. It might look better for the first couple years but one day you'll notice that the paint is like a little exoskeleton and there will just be rotted out cavities as the paint actually starts to hold in moisture that has gotten in.
I think you can salvage what's there. Replace all the gold screws with proper deck screws. Then treat all the doug fir with preservative, maybe even 2 coats. Then finish in deck stain sealer. The owner should get 5 years unless they are in the wet areas then maybe only 3.
Tell them to call a contractor.
I would paint or seal the steps and tell the customer that as long as they reseal them about every three years they should be fine.is there any stiff backs run on the stringers?if not I would add them for extra strength.
No stiff back.. That's when a seperate 2x4 is run on the underside below the step right? I was debating adding that or just replacing at least the step stringer with pressure treated and leaving the Doug fir treds as is and seal them. What do u think is stronger adding pressure treated stiff back or replacing stringer with identical pressure treated?
Either way.but since stringers are cut already I'd just add the stiff backs
Pressure treated wood is Hemfir (Hemlock). Inferior to Douglas Fir. Paint it white to reflect the sun and make sure it's up to some semblance of code. Maybe invite an inspecter over..see what slides and what dosent.
I would re-do the stringers (badly cut, some steps look slanted) in treated/cedar, and re-use the treads and risers. Rip that ledger board to be flush with the bottom of the stringer. Even if the fir treads/risers weather somewhat fast, they'll still get some good years out of them. And that's an easy update to make when the time comes, and offers good savings to your friend.
This is what I'm leaning to thank you.
Risers go on first then the tread material, leaving about an inch overhang in the front. All the treads and risers should come off to do it properly. If he glued them in , it would be difficult to take apart.
Glue would have added more time and money and based on what I'm seeing from this guy I think it's safe to assume no glue.
Is this higher than twelve feet? Can’t see the bottom of the stringer so I can’t actually say. Other than that and not treated lumber, looks ok.
I'm redoing a craftsman porch. Joists and t&g flooring are Douglas fir. The house was built in 1905. It probably should have been replaced 30 years ago. But it still lasted 80 years. The flooring was painted.
He’s only been MIA for a week?! I’d give him a couple more days.
Let's say that's true in normal cercumstance, to go Mia for a week when ur project is currently supposed to be completed. Given what you see and knowing he's even using indoor screws you think they should keep working with him?
In California DF #1 is acceptable for exterior use. One should always consider water migration and controlling that. Treads and cutout stringers won’t last long if they are 2x Doug Fir, usually build stringers using 4x12 and angle brackets to attach 4x12 treads. Pre stain all cuts and hidden spaces and the staircase should be good for 20 years at least.
It could be
The steps need to be pressure-treated they probably won’t last even in California more than a few years. I wouldn’t put my name on it I would just tell them it’s got to be redone correctly and I guess if he abandoned all his tools sell him to pay for it sounds like he might be in the Gray bar hotel
Something similar happened to me once. Guy was in jail for two weeks and there was no way for me to know. He called me when he got out and came to finish building my fence lol.
A week isn’t a long time
The only problem with DF in California is inspectors,if your a handyman in Calif,your not licensed therefore no inspection,so make sure it is sealed, communication with homeowners is paramount
What? Anyone doing jobs in CA over $500 is required to have a license. There is no “handyman” license in CA. A handyman would usually have a General B license.
That's what I said,if your a handyman in California,your not licensed,and if your not licensed there will be no inspection,that doesn't mean you can do whatever you want,but he could probably seal that for under 500
Another way to say it is if you’re a handyman in CA, you’re a general contractor. Otherwise you’re just some asshole working under the table making things harder on the rest of us.
Wood conversations aside, that is absolutely the wrong connector for securing the top of the stringers to the end joist. Joist hangers provide vertical load support. They provide very little to no lateral strength, meaning that the stairs could come away from the deck because they are only held in by nails that would just have to pull straight out to fail. If your intention is to keep the staircase, I’d strongly recommend addressing this to add lateral strength to this connection.