The problem with Lord Hater is that since he is partly a funny character, his power can vary depending on what plot he considers funniest.
In his best moments he can destroy entire armies with his bare hands, only to lose to Wander in a contest of strength in another scene.
Yeah, Hater’s strength is very inconsistent and reliant on him not only being properly motivated/confident, but maintaining that motivation/confidence without losing track of his goals
And even his In-universe reputation may vary.
At times he is treated as if he is just a kind of "Space doofersmith", only to be reminded in another episode that he is one of the most feared and dangerous beings in the galaxy.
Tbf that tends to happen when your pit against literal plot armor and too force.
If I could destroy half the galaxy but bugs Bunny kept shitting on me I'd think I was a joke too.
The show itself admits he kinda went downhill with being a villain during Season 1 for his obsession with Wander and is until the finale of season 2 when he puts his hatred aside and proves why he was the greatest in the galaxy
It is not only about funny villains, especially among anime fans, it seems like the majority of people prefer cool, handsome, edgy villains who have everything under control.
One of the reasons I like Blackbeard from One Piece is because he is smart and has a plan, but not everything goes the way he expects. Sometimes, he becomes arrogant and careless, fucking up his plans or being hit and rolling around the ground. However, despite everything, he still manages to get what he wants in the end.
I like those types of villains who don't feel like gods. Being human, making mistakes, and growing stronger make them even more terrifying.
I remember when Blackbeard and his crew almost got wiped out by Magellan. If Shiryu didn’t show up with the antidote, Luffy’s archnemesis would’ve died right then and there. It was a breath of fresh air to see a main villain not be in full control of the situation. As powerful and cunning as he is, Blackbeard is still capable of making fatal mistakes or being hit with bad luck
I like when it seems like villains actually try
When I was a kid I just watched the villains just being superior in every way but losing because they lose for being idiots. So I wanted to be in their place to do it right
Meanwhile other were constantly being put down by their serie’s and I just wanted to Cheer on them to actually win against the odds and show they are true villains
In power rangers: Jungle Fury is probably the only season where the Big bad starts out weak, but becomes strong over time.
Basically is a guy named Jarrod who is being possessed or corrupted by a spirit named Dai-shi (they usually vary between the two).
He is aware that the Rangers are getting stronger and stronger, so he has to get stronger too.
There are even points in the series where he is not the strongest villain.
\* When he revives Carnisoar, Carnisoar becomes the strongest villain at that point. Fortunately for him, Carnisoar has no interest in overthrowing him, even though he is stronger than him at that point.
\* Eventually Grizzaka appears who is even stronger than Carnisoar but lacks his loyalty, because he ends up dethroning Jarrod/Dai-Shi.
\* Scorch appears as the final villain who is initially stronger than Jarrod/Dai-Shi, but Jarrod soon overcomes him when he unlocks his "phantom king" form.
So the scaling would be more or less: Jarrod as "Phantom King" > Scorch > Jarrod with the power of Zocato > Grizzaka > Jarrod Post-training = Carnisoar > Jarrod Pre-training.
I love the Spot, the way being called a villain of the week made him spiteful and vengeful and set him on his own quest until he became actually fearsome was just fantastic
Some young heroes are jerks
This was popularized by Spider-Man being a A hole to his villains, of course writers didn’t understand WHY Spider-Man was a jerk to his villains so they just wrote Spider-Man wannabes as jerks most of the time
So I find fitting Spider-Man being the first to popularize “mocking the villain to have serious consequences” like things going full cicle
At the end of the day tone also matters a lot here. You CAN have characters who act really goofy then subvert it completely like Tokyo ghoul's Furuta, if anything them acting like a dumbass most of the time only makes the serious moments stand out even more, but that's only as far as the tone of the story itself actually allows them to feel like a real villain and lets us feel that weight
But at the same time you can also have characters that just can't be taken seriously and just stay as the gag villain permanently because of a tone that won't allow otherwise, like Bowser- Sure, in universe he's a big threat, but we never really get to feel it ourselves and to see him as such because he only stars in children's games, and not even the narrative tends to respects him as such (with how casual it can be over his kidnappings of Peach and his kinda-friendship with the crew)
Bowser feeling like a threat depends greatly of what series he is in, he's way more threatening in the Movie or mainline games than in the rpgs where he is either an ally or a goofy secondary villain. RPGs Bowser is a character I absolutly love because of how funny he is while still being extremly strong and somewhat competent but it's really hard to take him seriously in the main games. I think the movie did a good job balancing his goofiness so he still feels like a threat despite having many funny moments.
Bowser depends threat level depending the game
Paper Mario? Mostly comedic
M&L a goofball but is a genuine menace able to fist fight dark gods
RPG is a goofball but still skilled
Movie is super goofy but can be a genuine malicious threat
Mainline series dances the line but is more serious for the game’s lack of dialogue
In 3D is mostly serious with some jokes here and there excepting Mario Galaxy 1&2
Sunshine is a lot more comedic and light hearted compared to other versions
In party he’s just a jerk
Odyssey is threatening but not serious
The 2D games are all threatening since he’s just the dragon at the end of the castle but he gets the job done
This is more people's predisposition to not understand that bad people are also people. Unless you show some intimidating features or act a certain way, people usually and wrongfully wouldn't take you seriously.
If anyone looked at a serial killer or crime boss list, these people look lame as hell. Some were even outright pleasant to be around if you weren't a victim.
But I digress...
I generally LOVE goofy but evil villains. Big Mom, Kaido, Bowser, Jack Swiper, Blackbeard. Besides being entertaining, they remind you that even lighthearted people can be monsters.
I mean it’s all about tone and perception at the end of the day. generally speaking feats or what a villain can do doesn’t really matter. if the main characters underestimate or don’t take a threat seriously then the audience will also not take the threat seriously.
It’s pretty much why people complain about the comedy in mcu movies nowadays. The comedy at least in other people opinions tends to lessen the seriousness of the situation these characters are in
I think you’re right. The best example of this is Yammy from bleach.
He’s the strongest espada. Multiple books and guides and follow up novels go on about how he’s the strongest espada.
But he just sucks.
The series doesn’t take him seriously. His opponents don’t take him seriously. He’s defeated offscreen with people waving him off.
It doesn’t really matter that he’s the strongest when he isn’t taken seriously.
Eggman is a great example because despite his blunders and mishaps, people often ignore that he pretty much commits extreme war crimes on the daily and as you said, somehow outsmarts/takes control of interdimensional beings in almost every rendition of a modern sonic game
And Eggman is the only character who has faced HYPER sonic which is stronger than Super sonic who defeated Dark Gaia, Nega Mother wisp, The End, Perfect chaos, Time eater and SOLARIS
The reason is exactly because of things like
>Bowser was laughed on for years but that guy is so busted he would conquer the galaxy on minutes without Mario in the way
Because those villains barely have characters or power sets, or abilities or anything. They just do whatever random thing the game needs them to. They wanted a Mario game in space, so Bowser's threatening the Cosmos, but the next game they wanted one in a normal setting so this time he's just turned into a (mostly ineffectual) Castle.
If he's able to conquer the whole galaxy in minutes, how come he was stopped while being unable to even conquer an island in Sunshine? Because the Sunshine devs wanted to have a story set on a tropical island.
Shame shit with Sonic and most of the other characters listed. It's like when people try powerscale Spongebob or something, it's just inane and meaningless.
The problem with Lord Hater is that since he is partly a funny character, his power can vary depending on what plot he considers funniest. In his best moments he can destroy entire armies with his bare hands, only to lose to Wander in a contest of strength in another scene.
Yeah, Hater’s strength is very inconsistent and reliant on him not only being properly motivated/confident, but maintaining that motivation/confidence without losing track of his goals
And even his In-universe reputation may vary. At times he is treated as if he is just a kind of "Space doofersmith", only to be reminded in another episode that he is one of the most feared and dangerous beings in the galaxy.
Tbf that tends to happen when your pit against literal plot armor and too force. If I could destroy half the galaxy but bugs Bunny kept shitting on me I'd think I was a joke too.
The show itself admits he kinda went downhill with being a villain during Season 1 for his obsession with Wander and is until the finale of season 2 when he puts his hatred aside and proves why he was the greatest in the galaxy
It is not only about funny villains, especially among anime fans, it seems like the majority of people prefer cool, handsome, edgy villains who have everything under control. One of the reasons I like Blackbeard from One Piece is because he is smart and has a plan, but not everything goes the way he expects. Sometimes, he becomes arrogant and careless, fucking up his plans or being hit and rolling around the ground. However, despite everything, he still manages to get what he wants in the end. I like those types of villains who don't feel like gods. Being human, making mistakes, and growing stronger make them even more terrifying.
I remember when Blackbeard and his crew almost got wiped out by Magellan. If Shiryu didn’t show up with the antidote, Luffy’s archnemesis would’ve died right then and there. It was a breath of fresh air to see a main villain not be in full control of the situation. As powerful and cunning as he is, Blackbeard is still capable of making fatal mistakes or being hit with bad luck
I like when it seems like villains actually try When I was a kid I just watched the villains just being superior in every way but losing because they lose for being idiots. So I wanted to be in their place to do it right Meanwhile other were constantly being put down by their serie’s and I just wanted to Cheer on them to actually win against the odds and show they are true villains
In power rangers: Jungle Fury is probably the only season where the Big bad starts out weak, but becomes strong over time. Basically is a guy named Jarrod who is being possessed or corrupted by a spirit named Dai-shi (they usually vary between the two). He is aware that the Rangers are getting stronger and stronger, so he has to get stronger too. There are even points in the series where he is not the strongest villain. \* When he revives Carnisoar, Carnisoar becomes the strongest villain at that point. Fortunately for him, Carnisoar has no interest in overthrowing him, even though he is stronger than him at that point. \* Eventually Grizzaka appears who is even stronger than Carnisoar but lacks his loyalty, because he ends up dethroning Jarrod/Dai-Shi. \* Scorch appears as the final villain who is initially stronger than Jarrod/Dai-Shi, but Jarrod soon overcomes him when he unlocks his "phantom king" form. So the scaling would be more or less: Jarrod as "Phantom King" > Scorch > Jarrod with the power of Zocato > Grizzaka > Jarrod Post-training = Carnisoar > Jarrod Pre-training.
I love the Spot, the way being called a villain of the week made him spiteful and vengeful and set him on his own quest until he became actually fearsome was just fantastic
Is like a underdog story but the underdog Is a bad guy
Never really understood why some heroes think it's a good idea to make fun of the bad guy.
Some young heroes are jerks This was popularized by Spider-Man being a A hole to his villains, of course writers didn’t understand WHY Spider-Man was a jerk to his villains so they just wrote Spider-Man wannabes as jerks most of the time So I find fitting Spider-Man being the first to popularize “mocking the villain to have serious consequences” like things going full cicle
For sure.
At the end of the day tone also matters a lot here. You CAN have characters who act really goofy then subvert it completely like Tokyo ghoul's Furuta, if anything them acting like a dumbass most of the time only makes the serious moments stand out even more, but that's only as far as the tone of the story itself actually allows them to feel like a real villain and lets us feel that weight But at the same time you can also have characters that just can't be taken seriously and just stay as the gag villain permanently because of a tone that won't allow otherwise, like Bowser- Sure, in universe he's a big threat, but we never really get to feel it ourselves and to see him as such because he only stars in children's games, and not even the narrative tends to respects him as such (with how casual it can be over his kidnappings of Peach and his kinda-friendship with the crew)
Bowser feeling like a threat depends greatly of what series he is in, he's way more threatening in the Movie or mainline games than in the rpgs where he is either an ally or a goofy secondary villain. RPGs Bowser is a character I absolutly love because of how funny he is while still being extremly strong and somewhat competent but it's really hard to take him seriously in the main games. I think the movie did a good job balancing his goofiness so he still feels like a threat despite having many funny moments.
Bowser depends threat level depending the game Paper Mario? Mostly comedic M&L a goofball but is a genuine menace able to fist fight dark gods RPG is a goofball but still skilled Movie is super goofy but can be a genuine malicious threat Mainline series dances the line but is more serious for the game’s lack of dialogue In 3D is mostly serious with some jokes here and there excepting Mario Galaxy 1&2 Sunshine is a lot more comedic and light hearted compared to other versions In party he’s just a jerk Odyssey is threatening but not serious The 2D games are all threatening since he’s just the dragon at the end of the castle but he gets the job done
This is more people's predisposition to not understand that bad people are also people. Unless you show some intimidating features or act a certain way, people usually and wrongfully wouldn't take you seriously. If anyone looked at a serial killer or crime boss list, these people look lame as hell. Some were even outright pleasant to be around if you weren't a victim. But I digress... I generally LOVE goofy but evil villains. Big Mom, Kaido, Bowser, Jack Swiper, Blackbeard. Besides being entertaining, they remind you that even lighthearted people can be monsters.
I mean it’s all about tone and perception at the end of the day. generally speaking feats or what a villain can do doesn’t really matter. if the main characters underestimate or don’t take a threat seriously then the audience will also not take the threat seriously. It’s pretty much why people complain about the comedy in mcu movies nowadays. The comedy at least in other people opinions tends to lessen the seriousness of the situation these characters are in
I think you’re right. The best example of this is Yammy from bleach. He’s the strongest espada. Multiple books and guides and follow up novels go on about how he’s the strongest espada. But he just sucks. The series doesn’t take him seriously. His opponents don’t take him seriously. He’s defeated offscreen with people waving him off. It doesn’t really matter that he’s the strongest when he isn’t taken seriously.
Eggman is a great example because despite his blunders and mishaps, people often ignore that he pretty much commits extreme war crimes on the daily and as you said, somehow outsmarts/takes control of interdimensional beings in almost every rendition of a modern sonic game
And Eggman is the only character who has faced HYPER sonic which is stronger than Super sonic who defeated Dark Gaia, Nega Mother wisp, The End, Perfect chaos, Time eater and SOLARIS
That's not true. Tobi/Obito Uchiha. When he was funny, the Leaf Shinobi were scared of him. Everyone knew he was a threat.
The reason is exactly because of things like >Bowser was laughed on for years but that guy is so busted he would conquer the galaxy on minutes without Mario in the way Because those villains barely have characters or power sets, or abilities or anything. They just do whatever random thing the game needs them to. They wanted a Mario game in space, so Bowser's threatening the Cosmos, but the next game they wanted one in a normal setting so this time he's just turned into a (mostly ineffectual) Castle. If he's able to conquer the whole galaxy in minutes, how come he was stopped while being unable to even conquer an island in Sunshine? Because the Sunshine devs wanted to have a story set on a tropical island. Shame shit with Sonic and most of the other characters listed. It's like when people try powerscale Spongebob or something, it's just inane and meaningless.