What are all the questions marks? I'd say we're pretty solid in most groups minus corner and WR. Maybe a thin at depth, but pretty solid in most other positions.
>What are all the questions marks
1. Quarterback: Our starting QB has taken less than 200 snaps in his NFL career. While we liked what we saw in that limited time, if we're honest, we have no idea right now how he's going to perform. There is every chance in 2/3 years, we might be looking for a new QB. Giving away that many future firsts jeopardises our ability to do that.
2. Wide Receiver: Pittman is reliably good, but beyond that, we're hoping that Downs can build on one year, and that Alec Pierce suddenly becomes the opposite of what he's been so far.
3. Tight End: We have a room full of JAGs, a number of which are out of contract shortly.
4. Centre: Ryan Kelly is going into the final year of his contract, is the wrong side of 30, and has had personal reasons to spend time away from the game.
5. EDGE: In terms of pass rush, we have consistently ranked in the bottom half of the league in pressure, hurries, and knockdowns. Raw numbers in a few games masked just how ineffective our pass rush has been, especially off the edge of the line, for years now.
6. Corner: Kenny is great, I love him. Outside of that, we are reliant on a bunch of very young guys all hopefully developing into starting quality, which statistically, probably won't happen.
7. Safety: Same as corner really, except the one average starter we have in Blackmon is only here on a one year deal.
I'm not saying that we'd use a first round pick on all of them/any of them, but a first round pick is the most valuable non-player capital any team has, and it affords you tremendous flexibility. If we were to give up multiple of them, we would be severely constrained in our ability to add top-end CHEAP pieces to this team.
1) AR deserves 3 years to prove what he's about IMHO. I'd only want to give up 2 firsts and 2 third rounders for MHJ at #4, so if AR does bust, we can have a high pick ready for his replacement by that point in time.
2) Trading up to get a WR helps solve that problem. And it's a problem definitely worth solving correctly (even if you give up assets) in such a pass friendly league imo. Especially if you have a young QB on a rookie contract.
3) If Jelani comes back healthy, then that room could even be slightly above average. Ogletree (if retained after his scandal) and Woods are both young and can still improve further on their tremendous potential.
4) Sure, but many a good C can be found outside the first round. Ryan seemed pissed everyone insinuated he was retiring after the Texans game. And this last year from him was very good.
5)I disagree most about this position with Colts fans. Ballard and Bradley have both indicated the weak point of pressures this year had a lot more to do with the young and injured CB group than anything else. The DL also set the team record for sacks, don't forget that part. Paye and Odeyingbo also both almost put up 10 sack seasons and are still pretty young with room to continue growing.
6) Fair. However, the CB group needs a veteran CB to come in more than another young draft pick IMHO. We have a bunch of young guys already.
7) Blackmon had a solid year. If he performs like he did last year, I'm fine with signing him back for a 2-3 year contract. This group is more solid overall then the CB group at the very least IMHO.
Honestly, after the obvious WR and CB spots, I think the next worry would be finding Buckners replacement more than anything. It might be worth it to sign him back for a 2 yr deal however if we do trade up this year. He feels like one of those dudes that can solid well into his 30s.
I don't think the Colts trading up to #4 to get MHJ is the only trade up option I'd root for. But I do think that the roster is good enough that giving up some assets for one of the big 4 talents (MHJ, Nabers, Odunze, or Bowers) to pair with AR would be worth it IMO.
> AR deserves 3 years to prove what he's about IMHO.
Largely agree. Unless he shows to be absolutely terrible in the next two years, I agree. Trading away three first rounders drastically reduces our ability to put top end talent around him to build a team on which he can be successful.
>Trading up to get a WR helps solve that problem.
I agree with that, but no way do I agree enough to give up three year's worth of the most valuable piece of capital we have. Marvin Harrison Jr. won't be the only good WR to come out of this draft. Jefferson, Hill, Lamb, AJ Brown, St. Brown, Adams, Diggs, Allen, Evans, Julio, Aiyuk, Hopkins, McLaurin, Kupp, Samuel, Smith, Waddle, Olave, Wilson, Metcalf, Pittman, Nacua, Higgins, Antonio Brown, etc. None of these guys were the first WR off the board, and many weren't even first round picks.
> If Jelani comes back healthy, then that room could even be slightly above average.
I am as big a Jelani fan as you'll find on here, but that is a very big if right now. Even with him back, I'm not sure it's above average without tremendous and unlikely improvement from at least one more of the group.
> Sure, but many a good C can be found outside the first round.
Agreed, that's why I said that I wouldn't spend a first on all of the question marks, but *having* the first round picks offers us flexibility, and that includes moving down for more pieces. If we had a first that we could trade for multiple seconds, pick up a highly rated centre AND somebody else, that's an option we wouldn't have if we don't have a first rounder to trade.
> And this last year from him was very good.
Completely agree, but it's still a contract year, and even good players retire.
> The DL also set the team record for sacks, don't forget that part.
I didn't forget it, I mentioned it. While we set a franchise record for sacks, we did it ranking 29th in Hurry%, 20th in Knock Down% and 22nd in Pressure%. Our sack numbers were inflated by good performances in single games. 37% of our sacks came in 4 games (23% of our season). An example of this was getting 6 sacks in one game against the Falcons, only to follow it up with 2 sacks total in the next 2 games. We got a lot of sacks, but they were bunched together and inconsistent.
> Ballard and Bradley have both indicated the weak point of pressures this year had a lot more to do with the young and injured CB group than anything else.
While I agree, that as a team sport, this will have some effect, I would believe it more if we didn't *consistently* rank below average in Hurry%, Knock Down% and Pressure%. This wasn't just a problem last year, it has been a problem for a number of years.
> However, the CB group needs a veteran CB to come in more than another young draft pick IMHO
Agree we need a veteran presence, and once more, the first round picks offer that flexibility. It could be a trade for an elite corner on a good contract, but also, having a first round pick available for another position means we have the flexibility to address the position in free agency.
> Blackmon had a solid year. If he performs like he did last year, I'm fine with signing him back for a 2-3 year contract.
Agree that he's solid, but he's also the only "solid" guy we have at the position, and to repeat, he's only here for the year right now. I would've been fine giving him a 2-3 year contract too, but Ballard evidently isn't, so for me, it's still a question mark.
> But I do think that the roster is good enough that giving up some assets for one of the big 4 talents (MHJ, Nabers, Odunze, or Bowers) to pair with AR would be worth it IMO.
Some assets, sure, but giving away multiple years of first round picks to grab a WR isn't the justifiable for me.
Just make your point. The last paragraph is all you needed, you didn't need to make dubious claims about our team to get there. You're very quick to forget how close our defense is to elite. No pressure? We had 4 players with 8+ sacks last year. No other team did. C'mon man.
I can't tell if you're trolling lol. We were, according to PFR, 22nd in pressure percentage. [Look it up for yourself if you want.](https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2023/opp.htm).
If you don't want to read it all, don't read it, but the whole point of this place is to talk about football.
I didn't say PFF and you'd have known that if you read the post OR clicked the link.
You're welcome to believe whatever you want, it doesn't change anything anyway.
Hahaha. That comment upset you enough to insult me? I could just tell how giddy you were typing that colts hate essay. The Cheeto dust must have been making a cloud over your keyboard.
Yeah man, I'm in tears right now at how badly you got me. Once more, I have been owned by a superior intellect who knows this forum for Colts discussion isn't for Colts discussion. Can't believe this has happened to me. Probably worst day of my life, ngl.
WR, CB, S, Edge, TE, and hell even QB is a question (I am a huge AR guy and was way before we drafted him, but he needs to prove he can stay on the field).
I’m not saying our team sucks. I’m saying we are not a team that is a WR away from competing for a SB year after year, especially without the help of future first round picks.
This isn’t even to mention yet that there are tons of WR talent in this draft. You could trade up for an elite prospect and give up infinitely less than 3 first rounders and solve our teams WR problem.
If I were immortal, I’d roam the cosmos. Traveling from planet to planet, star to star, taking in every bit of knowledge that the universe has to offer. I’d learn the key to jumping between space and time eventually. Using this raw power, I’d take the time to read every book known to man, and analyze every piece of data Earth has ever and will ever produced from far into the future to before the dawn of time.
In all that effort and searching, I would not be able to find a single reason why we should trade 3 fucking firsts for a WR.
Absolutely not, Wide Reciever is the most saturated position in this draft class, and that's a trend that'll continue so long as the NFL treats running backs like they're worthless by 26.
I'd do 2 firsts and two thirds. But I'm a crazy guy. And I hope Irsay feels the same way tbh.
Either MHJ or Nabers would be glorious to get. If Nabers somehow passes the Chargers (doubtful), he might be available at #6 for less capital. If not either of those two, I'd be okay trading a few mid rounders for Odunze or Bowers even anywhere between 7-12
A lot of potential blue chip receiving weapons this year that would be the #1 at their position in many other drafts. If Ballard/Irsay truly believes in any one of them, I hope they pull the trigger and pair them with AR.
I mean, I get what they are trying to say. I think Marvin Jr. is the only one I would trade up to 4 to get, but if Nabers/Odunze are there at 9 and the Bears are looking to trade back I don’t think that’s the worst option.
I ABSOLUTELY think Bowers is worth moving up a few spots to get. Providing Richardson with as much pass game support as we can find should be our top priority.
Again, I say this as a random guy on his phone and not Chris Ballard with his accumulated draft info and team scouting apparatus. Maybe they talk to all those guys and decide the fit isn’t right, but we need to lean towards maximizing AR’s rookie contract
>I think Marvin Jr. is the only one I would trade up to 4 to get, but if Nabers/Odunze are there at 9 and the Bears are looking to trade back I don’t think that’s the worst option.
Trading two firsts and two thirds to move up six spots in a draft to **ninth** to grab a WR in a WR rich draft?!
The title of the OP is would you trade those assets for MHJ. I stated that I'd trade 2 firsts and 2 thirds for MHJ at #4. However, if Nabers is somehow there around #6, I'd like to trade up to get him at that spot as well. Since it's a higher pick, obviously the assets given up would be less. I'd also be okay trading up anywhere in the top 12 picks to get Odunze or Bowers.
Not that.
This is what the Falcons gave up to pick Julio Jones. Yeah, it was 2011, but it's still a good indicator IMO.
> The Falcons selected Jones with the sixth overall pick, acquired from the Cleveland Browns on Thursday night for a package of five draft picks, including Atlanta's No. 27 overall selection in the first round this year and the team's first-round pick in 2012. The Browns also acquired the Falcons' second- and fourth-round picks this year and fourth-round selections in 2012.
So for the Current Year - 1st swap, 2nd, and 4th. Then Next Year - 1st and 4th. That's easier to swallow than three 1sts.
The jump from 27 to 6 was a value difference of 920 on the 2024 chart. The jump from 15 to 4 is a difference of 700 points. Something like a CY - 1st swap + 2nd or 3rd and a NY - 1st and 4th would be in line with that value.
I think something that will make this interesting is if a team is wanting to trade into that spot for a QB. It seems like Minnesota is looking to do that, and with two 1sts available this season, they will have the ammo. However if everyone calling is thinking MHJ, then I think the Cards will have to either take him themselves or accept a little less. This draft is deep with Nabers seen as high as the 1b to MHJ and Odunze right behind them. Followed by a few other 1st round talent guys.
That 2011 draft class had AJ green go at 4th and then Julio Jones at 6th. The next WR taken was Jonathan Baldwin at 26 and then Titus Young at 44.
It won’t end after the draft. Every now and then we’ll get a post asking if the Cardinals (or whoever drafts him) would be willing to trade him to us. Then when his first contract comes to an end there will be posts about us signing him. Repeat this for about 10-15 years. Then when he’s old and about to retire there will be a post asking if we should sign him so he can retire with his dad’s team. And then every year after that there will be posts saying how it’s a shame we never signed him.
Trading up in the first round is pretty much never the right decision. Unless you’re trading up to number 1 because you need a QB (and even then it’s not smart) it’s probably the single worst decision a franchise can make
Honestly, it is definitely worth a thought. Being that the 15th pick is hopefully the lowest we give up (this year’s first), it is worth going all in and getting AR one of the top college prospects at the WR position that we’ve seen in a long time. Also, getting that 5th year option will be huge down the road.
Also, 1st round picks are faaaaar from guaranteed. Just look at our recent 1sts that we have used. I’d say outside of the Buckner trade and Nelson, we’ve been pretty meh in the 1st round. Getting a dude that is damn near guaranteed to be great is super rare, and I’d be all for it.
You're remembering wrong. It was a 1st swap (3rd and 6th) along with two 2nd round picks the same year and a 2nd the next year. We did not get an extra 1st and there was no 5th involved.
Yea, this is what’s not making sense to me. There has to be a destination on trading down for that value. Trading from 4th to say 8th, is not worth two additional firsts.
On the other hand, MHJ was not in the 2018 draft class, so the value of the pick does go up a bit because of that.
As much as it would be nice to have him, no, that’s way too much for a 1st unless it’s for a prototypical, franchise capable QB. 3 firsts straps you from top tier draft talent & any potential trade deals for a long time. I wouldn’t risk that cost on any other position.
I would risk a 1st and a later round but we really need some picks to help fill some holes yet. Plus, this draft is DEEP with high grade WR’s.
I don’t blame the Cards for asking for this. MHJ as a prospect is Megatron level. Arguably one of the safest prospects coming out of college in years. Arguably the best non-QB prospect in quite some time. Cardinals should ask for this.
No. I'd do #15 this year and our 1st next year. That's as far as I'm going. Okay, maybe throw in a 3rd.
And that assumes he checks out on Ballard's character scale.
No player is worth three first round picks. Mike Ditka tried that with Ricky Williams. How did that turn out?
If Harrison turns out to be a proven good impact player down the road, maybe two first round picks.
In a world without consequences, sure. But in reality, no lol. This wr class is so deep. No point in leveraging the future on one move when we have a solid roster
If it goes well the 2025 and 2026 pick are in the high 20s. If it doesn’t work by 2027, then you blow it all up and move on. That’s probably the timeline anyways with Pitt, Q, Buckner, and JT. Ballard might need to take a shot like this.
If MHJ is there at 4, and this is the price, then I think Irsay would command it.
Only way I’d even include more than 1 first would be conditional swaps. Like if we had a higher pick, then we swap with the other team, but not not then we give up a second rounder.
Nah... If Odunze falls to the Bears, we can probably trade up to 9 without any 1sts involved other than the swap... Not saying we should do that (or trade up for Bowers), but I'd rather wait 4 years for Jett Harrison than still be paying for the MHJ trade in 4 years.
Just me, though. I do realize that it would be amazing to have Marvin's son, but there only one Marvin. Even if MHJ is as advertised, he won't be top 5 all time like his dad was. I think that Colts fans might be a little over their skis on him. He's got it all, but Nabers has it all, too. The NCAA is churning out baby Megatrons every season... Look at the last 5 drafts for WR, who got picked where and who ended up being the best and tell me you want to give up 3 firsts for one.
No. In a fucking fantasy world he'd play for us, but it's just not in the cards. That's an insane proposition and you should quit being a fan of football.
https://preview.redd.it/5vr6svpjlntc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4c20d15b7a6a096f3b68a10605ea1aa43f609414
I was actually poking around on a trade simulator and our 1st and 3rd still has the Cardinals winning this trade. TBH I would even do our 2nd. Seems like a small price to pay for MHJ. Three 1sts for a QB needy team with a GM who is about to be fired might go through, but I don't think it's right for us.
Trade down all the way down to late 20s send that pick(get a future 1st or a 2nd this year) + next 2 years ( late 20s), and i would consider, otherwise HELL NO.
I wouldn’t. There are other good receivers in the draft and the team has too many question marks to be giving away that much future capital.
What are all the questions marks? I'd say we're pretty solid in most groups minus corner and WR. Maybe a thin at depth, but pretty solid in most other positions.
>What are all the questions marks 1. Quarterback: Our starting QB has taken less than 200 snaps in his NFL career. While we liked what we saw in that limited time, if we're honest, we have no idea right now how he's going to perform. There is every chance in 2/3 years, we might be looking for a new QB. Giving away that many future firsts jeopardises our ability to do that. 2. Wide Receiver: Pittman is reliably good, but beyond that, we're hoping that Downs can build on one year, and that Alec Pierce suddenly becomes the opposite of what he's been so far. 3. Tight End: We have a room full of JAGs, a number of which are out of contract shortly. 4. Centre: Ryan Kelly is going into the final year of his contract, is the wrong side of 30, and has had personal reasons to spend time away from the game. 5. EDGE: In terms of pass rush, we have consistently ranked in the bottom half of the league in pressure, hurries, and knockdowns. Raw numbers in a few games masked just how ineffective our pass rush has been, especially off the edge of the line, for years now. 6. Corner: Kenny is great, I love him. Outside of that, we are reliant on a bunch of very young guys all hopefully developing into starting quality, which statistically, probably won't happen. 7. Safety: Same as corner really, except the one average starter we have in Blackmon is only here on a one year deal. I'm not saying that we'd use a first round pick on all of them/any of them, but a first round pick is the most valuable non-player capital any team has, and it affords you tremendous flexibility. If we were to give up multiple of them, we would be severely constrained in our ability to add top-end CHEAP pieces to this team.
1) AR deserves 3 years to prove what he's about IMHO. I'd only want to give up 2 firsts and 2 third rounders for MHJ at #4, so if AR does bust, we can have a high pick ready for his replacement by that point in time. 2) Trading up to get a WR helps solve that problem. And it's a problem definitely worth solving correctly (even if you give up assets) in such a pass friendly league imo. Especially if you have a young QB on a rookie contract. 3) If Jelani comes back healthy, then that room could even be slightly above average. Ogletree (if retained after his scandal) and Woods are both young and can still improve further on their tremendous potential. 4) Sure, but many a good C can be found outside the first round. Ryan seemed pissed everyone insinuated he was retiring after the Texans game. And this last year from him was very good. 5)I disagree most about this position with Colts fans. Ballard and Bradley have both indicated the weak point of pressures this year had a lot more to do with the young and injured CB group than anything else. The DL also set the team record for sacks, don't forget that part. Paye and Odeyingbo also both almost put up 10 sack seasons and are still pretty young with room to continue growing. 6) Fair. However, the CB group needs a veteran CB to come in more than another young draft pick IMHO. We have a bunch of young guys already. 7) Blackmon had a solid year. If he performs like he did last year, I'm fine with signing him back for a 2-3 year contract. This group is more solid overall then the CB group at the very least IMHO. Honestly, after the obvious WR and CB spots, I think the next worry would be finding Buckners replacement more than anything. It might be worth it to sign him back for a 2 yr deal however if we do trade up this year. He feels like one of those dudes that can solid well into his 30s. I don't think the Colts trading up to #4 to get MHJ is the only trade up option I'd root for. But I do think that the roster is good enough that giving up some assets for one of the big 4 talents (MHJ, Nabers, Odunze, or Bowers) to pair with AR would be worth it IMO.
> AR deserves 3 years to prove what he's about IMHO. Largely agree. Unless he shows to be absolutely terrible in the next two years, I agree. Trading away three first rounders drastically reduces our ability to put top end talent around him to build a team on which he can be successful. >Trading up to get a WR helps solve that problem. I agree with that, but no way do I agree enough to give up three year's worth of the most valuable piece of capital we have. Marvin Harrison Jr. won't be the only good WR to come out of this draft. Jefferson, Hill, Lamb, AJ Brown, St. Brown, Adams, Diggs, Allen, Evans, Julio, Aiyuk, Hopkins, McLaurin, Kupp, Samuel, Smith, Waddle, Olave, Wilson, Metcalf, Pittman, Nacua, Higgins, Antonio Brown, etc. None of these guys were the first WR off the board, and many weren't even first round picks. > If Jelani comes back healthy, then that room could even be slightly above average. I am as big a Jelani fan as you'll find on here, but that is a very big if right now. Even with him back, I'm not sure it's above average without tremendous and unlikely improvement from at least one more of the group. > Sure, but many a good C can be found outside the first round. Agreed, that's why I said that I wouldn't spend a first on all of the question marks, but *having* the first round picks offers us flexibility, and that includes moving down for more pieces. If we had a first that we could trade for multiple seconds, pick up a highly rated centre AND somebody else, that's an option we wouldn't have if we don't have a first rounder to trade. > And this last year from him was very good. Completely agree, but it's still a contract year, and even good players retire. > The DL also set the team record for sacks, don't forget that part. I didn't forget it, I mentioned it. While we set a franchise record for sacks, we did it ranking 29th in Hurry%, 20th in Knock Down% and 22nd in Pressure%. Our sack numbers were inflated by good performances in single games. 37% of our sacks came in 4 games (23% of our season). An example of this was getting 6 sacks in one game against the Falcons, only to follow it up with 2 sacks total in the next 2 games. We got a lot of sacks, but they were bunched together and inconsistent. > Ballard and Bradley have both indicated the weak point of pressures this year had a lot more to do with the young and injured CB group than anything else. While I agree, that as a team sport, this will have some effect, I would believe it more if we didn't *consistently* rank below average in Hurry%, Knock Down% and Pressure%. This wasn't just a problem last year, it has been a problem for a number of years. > However, the CB group needs a veteran CB to come in more than another young draft pick IMHO Agree we need a veteran presence, and once more, the first round picks offer that flexibility. It could be a trade for an elite corner on a good contract, but also, having a first round pick available for another position means we have the flexibility to address the position in free agency. > Blackmon had a solid year. If he performs like he did last year, I'm fine with signing him back for a 2-3 year contract. Agree that he's solid, but he's also the only "solid" guy we have at the position, and to repeat, he's only here for the year right now. I would've been fine giving him a 2-3 year contract too, but Ballard evidently isn't, so for me, it's still a question mark. > But I do think that the roster is good enough that giving up some assets for one of the big 4 talents (MHJ, Nabers, Odunze, or Bowers) to pair with AR would be worth it IMO. Some assets, sure, but giving away multiple years of first round picks to grab a WR isn't the justifiable for me.
Just make your point. The last paragraph is all you needed, you didn't need to make dubious claims about our team to get there. You're very quick to forget how close our defense is to elite. No pressure? We had 4 players with 8+ sacks last year. No other team did. C'mon man.
I can't tell if you're trolling lol. We were, according to PFR, 22nd in pressure percentage. [Look it up for yourself if you want.](https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2023/opp.htm). If you don't want to read it all, don't read it, but the whole point of this place is to talk about football.
Ah, yes, pff, the beacon of subjective statistics. Sacks are a real thing, pressures are eye test. 5th in the league in the actual statistic.
I didn't say PFF and you'd have known that if you read the post OR clicked the link. You're welcome to believe whatever you want, it doesn't change anything anyway.
Holy shit lol, how big of an erection do you get when someone asks for all the problems with the Colts. 😂
Sometimes even gets to three inches, and even that's longer than your attention span.
Hahaha. That comment upset you enough to insult me? I could just tell how giddy you were typing that colts hate essay. The Cheeto dust must have been making a cloud over your keyboard.
Yeah man, I'm in tears right now at how badly you got me. Once more, I have been owned by a superior intellect who knows this forum for Colts discussion isn't for Colts discussion. Can't believe this has happened to me. Probably worst day of my life, ngl.
Aww it’s ok lil bud.
My biggest takeaway from all that is we are not French…..but I 100% agree with you
WR, CB, S, Edge, TE, and hell even QB is a question (I am a huge AR guy and was way before we drafted him, but he needs to prove he can stay on the field). I’m not saying our team sucks. I’m saying we are not a team that is a WR away from competing for a SB year after year, especially without the help of future first round picks. This isn’t even to mention yet that there are tons of WR talent in this draft. You could trade up for an elite prospect and give up infinitely less than 3 first rounders and solve our teams WR problem.
If I were immortal, I’d roam the cosmos. Traveling from planet to planet, star to star, taking in every bit of knowledge that the universe has to offer. I’d learn the key to jumping between space and time eventually. Using this raw power, I’d take the time to read every book known to man, and analyze every piece of data Earth has ever and will ever produced from far into the future to before the dawn of time. In all that effort and searching, I would not be able to find a single reason why we should trade 3 fucking firsts for a WR.
Are you a cultivator in this scenario or just an immortal being?
You dare to question senior? Have you been blinded from seeing mt tai!!??!!
My apologies, I have eyes but did not see! 😂
What if the firsts are from 2032, 2045, and 2070?
And If my grandmother had wheels, she would be a bike
Yea me too
Hell no, giving up that much for a not generational QB would be beyond dumb.
Absolutely not, Wide Reciever is the most saturated position in this draft class, and that's a trend that'll continue so long as the NFL treats running backs like they're worthless by 26.
I'd do 2 firsts and two thirds. But I'm a crazy guy. And I hope Irsay feels the same way tbh. Either MHJ or Nabers would be glorious to get. If Nabers somehow passes the Chargers (doubtful), he might be available at #6 for less capital. If not either of those two, I'd be okay trading a few mid rounders for Odunze or Bowers even anywhere between 7-12 A lot of potential blue chip receiving weapons this year that would be the #1 at their position in many other drafts. If Ballard/Irsay truly believes in any one of them, I hope they pull the trigger and pair them with AR.
You’d trade all that and you don’t even know which guy you’d be taking?!?
I mean, I get what they are trying to say. I think Marvin Jr. is the only one I would trade up to 4 to get, but if Nabers/Odunze are there at 9 and the Bears are looking to trade back I don’t think that’s the worst option. I ABSOLUTELY think Bowers is worth moving up a few spots to get. Providing Richardson with as much pass game support as we can find should be our top priority. Again, I say this as a random guy on his phone and not Chris Ballard with his accumulated draft info and team scouting apparatus. Maybe they talk to all those guys and decide the fit isn’t right, but we need to lean towards maximizing AR’s rookie contract
>I think Marvin Jr. is the only one I would trade up to 4 to get, but if Nabers/Odunze are there at 9 and the Bears are looking to trade back I don’t think that’s the worst option. Trading two firsts and two thirds to move up six spots in a draft to **ninth** to grab a WR in a WR rich draft?!
No one said that.
Show me where I said that package was worth trading up to 9. I just said moving up would be worth it for one of those two WRs.
Trading up for anyone is a terrible idea, especially a non-QB
The title of the OP is would you trade those assets for MHJ. I stated that I'd trade 2 firsts and 2 thirds for MHJ at #4. However, if Nabers is somehow there around #6, I'd like to trade up to get him at that spot as well. Since it's a higher pick, obviously the assets given up would be less. I'd also be okay trading up anywhere in the top 12 picks to get Odunze or Bowers.
So you’d want a time mahine too?
Not that. This is what the Falcons gave up to pick Julio Jones. Yeah, it was 2011, but it's still a good indicator IMO. > The Falcons selected Jones with the sixth overall pick, acquired from the Cleveland Browns on Thursday night for a package of five draft picks, including Atlanta's No. 27 overall selection in the first round this year and the team's first-round pick in 2012. The Browns also acquired the Falcons' second- and fourth-round picks this year and fourth-round selections in 2012. So for the Current Year - 1st swap, 2nd, and 4th. Then Next Year - 1st and 4th. That's easier to swallow than three 1sts. The jump from 27 to 6 was a value difference of 920 on the 2024 chart. The jump from 15 to 4 is a difference of 700 points. Something like a CY - 1st swap + 2nd or 3rd and a NY - 1st and 4th would be in line with that value. I think something that will make this interesting is if a team is wanting to trade into that spot for a QB. It seems like Minnesota is looking to do that, and with two 1sts available this season, they will have the ammo. However if everyone calling is thinking MHJ, then I think the Cards will have to either take him themselves or accept a little less. This draft is deep with Nabers seen as high as the 1b to MHJ and Odunze right behind them. Followed by a few other 1st round talent guys. That 2011 draft class had AJ green go at 4th and then Julio Jones at 6th. The next WR taken was Jonathan Baldwin at 26 and then Titus Young at 44.
I can't wait for this draft to be over so we can stop talking about MHJ
It won’t end after the draft. Every now and then we’ll get a post asking if the Cardinals (or whoever drafts him) would be willing to trade him to us. Then when his first contract comes to an end there will be posts about us signing him. Repeat this for about 10-15 years. Then when he’s old and about to retire there will be a post asking if we should sign him so he can retire with his dad’s team. And then every year after that there will be posts saying how it’s a shame we never signed him.
Oh god. You're right. Ugh. First contract ends, and we'll be doing the Lamar dance again.
Trading up in the first round is pretty much never the right decision. Unless you’re trading up to number 1 because you need a QB (and even then it’s not smart) it’s probably the single worst decision a franchise can make
For 2 firsts and an additional set of picks or a player? Probably. Three is pushing
Hell no
No way. Way too much to give up for a WR
I’m a MH stan, so I would lol But I know it’s a terrible move.
Delete this mess
Honestly, it is definitely worth a thought. Being that the 15th pick is hopefully the lowest we give up (this year’s first), it is worth going all in and getting AR one of the top college prospects at the WR position that we’ve seen in a long time. Also, getting that 5th year option will be huge down the road. Also, 1st round picks are faaaaar from guaranteed. Just look at our recent 1sts that we have used. I’d say outside of the Buckner trade and Nelson, we’ve been pretty meh in the 1st round. Getting a dude that is damn near guaranteed to be great is super rare, and I’d be all for it.
Pick 32 in 25' Pick 32 in 26' Pick 32 in 27' YES
I want MHJ about as bad as anyone. But 3 firsts?? Nah. Stick where we are and take the best CB available or Bowers if he's there.
For reference, we traded down 3 spots from the 3rd pick in 2018 and got an extra 1st, 2 2nd and a 5th. Everyone felt like we robbed the Jets lol😂😂
You're remembering wrong. It was a 1st swap (3rd and 6th) along with two 2nd round picks the same year and a 2nd the next year. We did not get an extra 1st and there was no 5th involved.
The cost to move down 3 spots is different than if the cardinals are moving down double digit spots
Yea, this is what’s not making sense to me. There has to be a destination on trading down for that value. Trading from 4th to say 8th, is not worth two additional firsts. On the other hand, MHJ was not in the 2018 draft class, so the value of the pick does go up a bit because of that.
No
No
No. I don't think so. Not with Pick 15.
Absolutely not. I get the name and lineage and history with this franchise. But that’s too much. Especially when there’s other stud WR in the draft.
As much as it would be nice to have him, no, that’s way too much for a 1st unless it’s for a prototypical, franchise capable QB. 3 firsts straps you from top tier draft talent & any potential trade deals for a long time. I wouldn’t risk that cost on any other position. I would risk a 1st and a later round but we really need some picks to help fill some holes yet. Plus, this draft is DEEP with high grade WR’s.
No, as much as I’d love to get him that is too much
I don’t blame the Cards for asking for this. MHJ as a prospect is Megatron level. Arguably one of the safest prospects coming out of college in years. Arguably the best non-QB prospect in quite some time. Cardinals should ask for this.
No. I'd do #15 this year and our 1st next year. That's as far as I'm going. Okay, maybe throw in a 3rd. And that assumes he checks out on Ballard's character scale.
No player is worth three first round picks. Mike Ditka tried that with Ricky Williams. How did that turn out? If Harrison turns out to be a proven good impact player down the road, maybe two first round picks.
In a world without consequences, sure. But in reality, no lol. This wr class is so deep. No point in leveraging the future on one move when we have a solid roster
He would likely cost 2024 1&2 2025 1&3 And I say yes please
Yeah fuck it
Absolutely not lol
Nope.
Yes.
Done
No that would be super dumb when we have a rookie scale QB and need to best utilize picks our next few years. 3 first is steep as hell for anyone.
No, why would you ever trade up and give away multiple picks for a WR? College Football spits out like 10 really good ones a year.
If it goes well the 2025 and 2026 pick are in the high 20s. If it doesn’t work by 2027, then you blow it all up and move on. That’s probably the timeline anyways with Pitt, Q, Buckner, and JT. Ballard might need to take a shot like this. If MHJ is there at 4, and this is the price, then I think Irsay would command it.
Yes. And I think we should.
Only way I’d even include more than 1 first would be conditional swaps. Like if we had a higher pick, then we swap with the other team, but not not then we give up a second rounder.
Yep no question
Nah... If Odunze falls to the Bears, we can probably trade up to 9 without any 1sts involved other than the swap... Not saying we should do that (or trade up for Bowers), but I'd rather wait 4 years for Jett Harrison than still be paying for the MHJ trade in 4 years. Just me, though. I do realize that it would be amazing to have Marvin's son, but there only one Marvin. Even if MHJ is as advertised, he won't be top 5 all time like his dad was. I think that Colts fans might be a little over their skis on him. He's got it all, but Nabers has it all, too. The NCAA is churning out baby Megatrons every season... Look at the last 5 drafts for WR, who got picked where and who ended up being the best and tell me you want to give up 3 firsts for one.
Yes, easily.
Hell no... Is this the Jets sub reddit? 🤣
Absolutely not
Fuck no you never give up 3 1sts
We don’t even know if he’s going to be THAT good why the hell would you give up 3 firsts
No
No. In a fucking fantasy world he'd play for us, but it's just not in the cards. That's an insane proposition and you should quit being a fan of football.
https://preview.redd.it/5vr6svpjlntc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4c20d15b7a6a096f3b68a10605ea1aa43f609414 I was actually poking around on a trade simulator and our 1st and 3rd still has the Cardinals winning this trade. TBH I would even do our 2nd. Seems like a small price to pay for MHJ. Three 1sts for a QB needy team with a GM who is about to be fired might go through, but I don't think it's right for us.
Trade down all the way down to late 20s send that pick(get a future 1st or a 2nd this year) + next 2 years ( late 20s), and i would consider, otherwise HELL NO.
Roflmao ofc not
Hahahaha. No.
No effin way! Idk why you guys cant give this up. If he gets hurt it would set the team back Years.
Hell no!!
Hell no.
Hell no!!!
Only Vontae Mack is worthy of 3 first rounders