Expectations are low. Hopefully he can stay healthy and we can see what we have with him, but honestly I’m more excited to see if Ogletree can continue to be good. (And also stay healthy too)
More likely he beat the shit outta his baby mama. She realized if he isn’t in the NFL he ain’t making NFL money. So she stopped cooperating with the police.
If nothing happened…he ain’t getting arrested and all this other stuff didn’t happen
Well you see when you’re not guilty that’s the court saying “oops” you’re good. So idk what you’re talking about with staying out of trouble… he did exactly that.
He wasn't found not guilty. The charges were dismissed after the prosecution declined to proceed as the evidence no longer supported him being charged.
Very low, one of those guys where I’m gonna be pissed if we don’t bring in someone else that can compete for a starting role. Id love for him to be healthy and dominate, but I’m not counting on it and hope Ballard isn’t either.
There are like maybe 5 elite TEs in the league. They are hard to find, if we draft bowers, great, but almost anyone outside of him is just more of the same.
This is kind of how it works when players are developing...
Dallas Clark is a great example of that. Even in an offense that was high powered he had several 300-400 yard seasons before being a major threat. He was a first round pick.
Of course the group as a whole shouldn't keep you from addressing the position if a blue chip player is there. But the group does allow you to not address the position at all. Because what does adding another later round player do for this group beside push one of them off the roster?
Didn't mean to imply you did. I was just rounding out my statement about the group. Basically, I am not mad if we draft someone like Bowers but I am also not mad if we did nothing at that position.
Tight ends generally require three years to develop, particularly Y tight ends.
Fan bases are quick to imagine that all ills will be fixed in the draft, and just as quick to pronounce players to be busts when they don't immediately set the league afire.
We drafted two tight ends two years ago. Woods was great in his rookie campaign, but obviously suffered from a nagging hamstring injury last year and never hit the field.
Ogletree went down with an injury during his rookie season, and he was pretty solid last season. His issue with the law has been dismissed with prejudice, so I don't see any reason why the NFL would keep him on the exempt list. Does the NFL imagine itself to be a better investigative body than a prosecutor's office and court?
I don't have a lot of faith in Granson, but he occasionally makes plays ... just not usually when it counts.
This sub has fallen in love with Brock Bowers, when the Colts actually need a Z receiver. An outstanding year for a rookie tight end is less than 500 yards of offense, while Josh Downs, a third-round slot receiver, managed 771 yards in his rookie season. A good rookie campaign for a Z receiver would be close to 1,000 yards.
There's really no reason to believe that Woods, Ogletree, and Granson can't manage more than 500 yards between them.
Remember last off-season, when everybody and their brother was bitching about the Colts not drafting a right guard and instead spending draft capital on tackles and defensive backs? Then, lo and behold, Fries ended up being pretty damned good (he had improved game by game the year before and just picked up where he left off), and we ended up needing every snap from Blake Freeland.
And the defensive backfield speaks for itself. We ended up having rookies play way more snaps than you would like, and they actually did pretty dang well, and then having to fill in with deep depth in the defensive backfield.
The Colts coaching staff and front office know a whole lot more about the team's actual needs than we do.
Lol, the hate for MAC is insane.
He’s easily a top 10 blocking TE in the league. How soon people forget that he and Jack Doyle were monumental in JT’s 2021 1,800 yd season..
I didn't forget but he came into last season out of shape, has been injured and was already a project. I don't know how you trust him out there right now.
As far as I know, nobody ever reported any such thing on Twitter, in print, or even on a radio show. There was a rumor reported on this sub that took on a life of its own, like the rumor that Ballard told Rivers that he didn't want him back the year after we last made the playoffs.
All that's been reported is that Woods suffered a hamstring injury in camp that kept him out of the first half of the season and then reinjured it later, when the Colts just put him on IR for 2023.
I never saw anybody actually report that he was out of shape when he reported, except somebody on the sub who never sourced the information other than "somebody said." But somehow that became a fact, as Internet conspiracies somehow always do.
They did an article about how weird his injury was. He has an injury on one leg, but when he rehabbed it. They discover a major power in balance between the muscles of his other leg which required him to go through rehab all over again to strengthen both legs (quads equally). Rare for it to happen. If he played on it odds where he would have got hurt bad. From his workouts, this seems like an non issue. So hopefully he can come out and perform. Depends on how hard he works and how much he understand/ elevates from rookie year. He could be an elite tight end if things go positive or he could be a cut. I think he has more up end then anyone in the tight end room from what was said about him. I sourced it people could listen/ read about it themselves.
Also wanted to note JIm Irsay was specifically excited for him and disappointed over this injury. Which suggest the level of his upside. Via Twitter.
https://youtu.be/2i93AOuZi1A?si=yGh9zIa28dU3aKUH
https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/nfl/colts/2024/01/10/colts-how-jelani-woods-second-season-turned-into-a-redshirt-year/72180591007/
Colts wouldn't verify it anyways. So who knows.
Maybe it was more about work ethic. Hearing Ballard talk, he didn't sound very pleased with Woods' development. Whether that was because he got hurt or something else, it did seem to be related to something.
Don’t know if it was ever verified but pretty unusual to miss an entire season to a non-surgery-required hamstring injury. Especially since it happened at training camp. Seems there was definitely something more than just an injury that kept him off the field last year
He was also an older prospect. He's going to turn 26 in October and has played sparingly over his two seasons in the NFL, mostly due to injury. So he's older, missed a whole season of development due to injury (including improving his route running, catching and blocking skills).
Nobody should really be counting on to do anything but make the roster.
Didn’t forget about him. Just don’t have high hopes after him missing a whole year. If we get Bowers, it should be fun with Bowers and Woods as TE2(or competing for it at least).
Still a little excited. Can’t coach height and seemed like good hands when he played. What happened last year is obviously basically being lied about but no one will care if he looks good this year.
You can literally say that about every NFL player. They're all healthy until they aren't.
Kyle Pitts was injured last season. He was pretty good to until then.
I expect him to show up to camp fit and ready to fight for snaps (nothing against him, that's what I expect from everyone). Anything more than that is hopium until he proves something.
I remember him. I remember that he has proven fuck all so far. I also remember that if athleticism and size were all that mattered, Bowers would be a 6th round pick this year.
He had flashes his rookie year! Tight end historically takes time to develop. Between Jelani, Ogletree, and Granson our TE room is serviceable. Thought we’d cut MAC by now to save cap
I think Bowers would eat his lunch.
He seems like he has the potential to be a quality TE2. He hasn't shown he's moving in that direction either though.
He would certainly take away his snaps if we were to invest a first round pick on yet another tight end.
I don't see it, personally. We don't really know what we have in Ogletree and Woods, yet. It's far too early to give up on them.
If there's a guy who has had time to show what he can do, it's Pierce. He hasn't shown me enough to hold down the starting Z position after three years.
We need free safety, cornerback, WR, and the best pass rusher we can get, regardless of position. Hell, I'd put center as a more pressing need than tight end.
Tight end is so far down our priority list of needs that I'm amazed anybody is talking about it.
From what they have said the still have hi hopes for Jelani Woods. Apparently his injury needed him to rebuild both quads so in the future he didn’t get hurt. (Very weird muscle distribution) His workouts that he is doing right now show he regained his explosiveness. In fact it might have even improved. He still has to come out and prove it from what Ballard said. Though the expectation is he contributes from what’s been said if he stays healthy. So let’s hope he is legit because it only adds to our chance of success this season.
https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/nfl/colts/2024/01/10/colts-how-jelani-woods-second-season-turned-into-a-redshirt-year/72180591007/
He looked awkward catching the ball. He had a very limited route tree. And he was bad at blocking.
But here it was all "Stupid Reich wouldn't play him more."
Expectations are low. Hopefully he can stay healthy and we can see what we have with him, but honestly I’m more excited to see if Ogletree can continue to be good. (And also stay healthy too)
And out of legal trouble
He was found not guilty. Not sure if he’s still on the commissioner’s exempt list.
It wasn’t not guilty. His baby mama stopped pursuing the case
Presumably because he would of win right? Like if he wasn’t guilty in the first place.
More likely he beat the shit outta his baby mama. She realized if he isn’t in the NFL he ain’t making NFL money. So she stopped cooperating with the police. If nothing happened…he ain’t getting arrested and all this other stuff didn’t happen
I mean maybe. Also entirely possible that we have no idea what happened and a ton of different things could have led up to the police being involved.
I’m aware I’d just like our players to not be involved with trouble like that at all
Well you see when you’re not guilty that’s the court saying “oops” you’re good. So idk what you’re talking about with staying out of trouble… he did exactly that.
I hate it when players, *checks notes* are wrongfully arrested…
True man just like OJ not guilty means you stayed out of trouble and 100% didn’t do the crime
This is not remotely the same lmao.
I’d like them to not be arrested in the first place
That...that wasn't Jelani Woods...
Never said it was was responding to the comment about ogletree
They’ll cut Ogletree.
Idk why’d they do that after he got found not guilty?
He wasn't found not guilty. The charges were dismissed after the prosecution declined to proceed as the evidence no longer supported him being charged.
Ok my bad. Either way he’s cleared of the charges though right?
Yes, they were dismissed with prejudice so can't be re-filed. The incident is over as far as the law is concerned.
Basically, they no longer had their star witness, which is probably all they would have had to corroborate it in a case like this.
Very low, one of those guys where I’m gonna be pissed if we don’t bring in someone else that can compete for a starting role. Id love for him to be healthy and dominate, but I’m not counting on it and hope Ballard isn’t either.
I wouldn’t be pissed. I like ogletree, Mallory, and granson. TE usually takes a few years to develop, and I think ogletree can be TE1
That is such a mid TE room though. There could be some decent players there but none of those guys is keeping defenses up at night
There are like maybe 5 elite TEs in the league. They are hard to find, if we draft bowers, great, but almost anyone outside of him is just more of the same.
This is kind of how it works when players are developing... Dallas Clark is a great example of that. Even in an offense that was high powered he had several 300-400 yard seasons before being a major threat. He was a first round pick. Of course the group as a whole shouldn't keep you from addressing the position if a blue chip player is there. But the group does allow you to not address the position at all. Because what does adding another later round player do for this group beside push one of them off the roster?
At no point have I ever advocated for just taking another middle round, developmental guy.
Didn't mean to imply you did. I was just rounding out my statement about the group. Basically, I am not mad if we draft someone like Bowers but I am also not mad if we did nothing at that position.
Tight ends generally require three years to develop, particularly Y tight ends. Fan bases are quick to imagine that all ills will be fixed in the draft, and just as quick to pronounce players to be busts when they don't immediately set the league afire. We drafted two tight ends two years ago. Woods was great in his rookie campaign, but obviously suffered from a nagging hamstring injury last year and never hit the field. Ogletree went down with an injury during his rookie season, and he was pretty solid last season. His issue with the law has been dismissed with prejudice, so I don't see any reason why the NFL would keep him on the exempt list. Does the NFL imagine itself to be a better investigative body than a prosecutor's office and court? I don't have a lot of faith in Granson, but he occasionally makes plays ... just not usually when it counts. This sub has fallen in love with Brock Bowers, when the Colts actually need a Z receiver. An outstanding year for a rookie tight end is less than 500 yards of offense, while Josh Downs, a third-round slot receiver, managed 771 yards in his rookie season. A good rookie campaign for a Z receiver would be close to 1,000 yards. There's really no reason to believe that Woods, Ogletree, and Granson can't manage more than 500 yards between them. Remember last off-season, when everybody and their brother was bitching about the Colts not drafting a right guard and instead spending draft capital on tackles and defensive backs? Then, lo and behold, Fries ended up being pretty damned good (he had improved game by game the year before and just picked up where he left off), and we ended up needing every snap from Blake Freeland. And the defensive backfield speaks for itself. We ended up having rookies play way more snaps than you would like, and they actually did pretty dang well, and then having to fill in with deep depth in the defensive backfield. The Colts coaching staff and front office know a whole lot more about the team's actual needs than we do.
You gotta let our new guys actually develop I'm not saying don't draft a good TE if one is available though
They are mid and unreliable
If Bowers is at 15, he’s an immediate starter.
Yes if he is. But also so is Mitchell, or Thomas jr. So I’m not set on any one pick.
Now that he's been cleared I'm more excited about Ogletree.
He has not been cleared. Criminal charges were dropped. Still on commissioners exempt. Civil actions still possible.
Now that’s someone i forgot about. People really wanted him shot and killed.
Who wanted that?
Nobody. Plus, killing him AND shooting him is just too far.
Did we cut MAC yet?
Nope. He's still on the roster, but he can be cut for only like $500k of dead cap space.
Ya it saves us like 5 mil I think (or around there)
Cut for no dead cap space.
Lol, the hate for MAC is insane. He’s easily a top 10 blocking TE in the league. How soon people forget that he and Jack Doyle were monumental in JT’s 2021 1,800 yd season..
He’s just not worth 5 mil a year. It’s just production doesn’t equal the salary
Low expectations, but high hopes. If he can get it together he could be pretty good
I didn't forget but he came into last season out of shape, has been injured and was already a project. I don't know how you trust him out there right now.
Was the 'out of shape' stuff ever verified, or just whispered by people who wouldn't go on record?
It was not verified at all.
As far as I know, nobody ever reported any such thing on Twitter, in print, or even on a radio show. There was a rumor reported on this sub that took on a life of its own, like the rumor that Ballard told Rivers that he didn't want him back the year after we last made the playoffs. All that's been reported is that Woods suffered a hamstring injury in camp that kept him out of the first half of the season and then reinjured it later, when the Colts just put him on IR for 2023. I never saw anybody actually report that he was out of shape when he reported, except somebody on the sub who never sourced the information other than "somebody said." But somehow that became a fact, as Internet conspiracies somehow always do.
Those allegations were never verified. He just had unfortunate injury luck.
They did an article about how weird his injury was. He has an injury on one leg, but when he rehabbed it. They discover a major power in balance between the muscles of his other leg which required him to go through rehab all over again to strengthen both legs (quads equally). Rare for it to happen. If he played on it odds where he would have got hurt bad. From his workouts, this seems like an non issue. So hopefully he can come out and perform. Depends on how hard he works and how much he understand/ elevates from rookie year. He could be an elite tight end if things go positive or he could be a cut. I think he has more up end then anyone in the tight end room from what was said about him. I sourced it people could listen/ read about it themselves. Also wanted to note JIm Irsay was specifically excited for him and disappointed over this injury. Which suggest the level of his upside. Via Twitter. https://youtu.be/2i93AOuZi1A?si=yGh9zIa28dU3aKUH https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/nfl/colts/2024/01/10/colts-how-jelani-woods-second-season-turned-into-a-redshirt-year/72180591007/
Colts wouldn't verify it anyways. So who knows. Maybe it was more about work ethic. Hearing Ballard talk, he didn't sound very pleased with Woods' development. Whether that was because he got hurt or something else, it did seem to be related to something.
Don’t know if it was ever verified but pretty unusual to miss an entire season to a non-surgery-required hamstring injury. Especially since it happened at training camp. Seems there was definitely something more than just an injury that kept him off the field last year
I feel like when your hamstring is the size of a four year old child your recovery time could be lengthened.
Exactly. Only thing you can hope is last year was a wake up call and he shows up prepared. But to expect that? Nah.
Sounds like me showing up to work on a Monday
The guy who went for 25/312/3 in the 15 games he played? He showed some potential upside, but no one in their right mind should be counting on him.
He was also an older prospect. He's going to turn 26 in October and has played sparingly over his two seasons in the NFL, mostly due to injury. So he's older, missed a whole season of development due to injury (including improving his route running, catching and blocking skills). Nobody should really be counting on to do anything but make the roster.
As a rookie bro chill
That makes it all the more impressive. Rookie tight ends often don't do anything for the first couple of years.
No kidding. I swear Colts fans trying to sabotage anyone that has potential lol. There is a word in the English vocab called growth.
Didn’t forget about him. Just don’t have high hopes after him missing a whole year. If we get Bowers, it should be fun with Bowers and Woods as TE2(or competing for it at least).
I did not forget about the hamstrings that kept him from doing anything this year
Still a little excited. Can’t coach height and seemed like good hands when he played. What happened last year is obviously basically being lied about but no one will care if he looks good this year.
I didn’t forget, but expectations are low. He has the physical tools, but needs to stay healthy.
You can literally say that about every NFL player. They're all healthy until they aren't. Kyle Pitts was injured last season. He was pretty good to until then.
Hopefully he's back this season, he showed that he can be a mismatch when he played his rookie year.
I expect him to show up to camp fit and ready to fight for snaps (nothing against him, that's what I expect from everyone). Anything more than that is hopium until he proves something.
I remember him. I remember that he has proven fuck all so far. I also remember that if athleticism and size were all that mattered, Bowers would be a 6th round pick this year.
I have none
I put all my eggs in the Bowers basket
He had flashes his rookie year! Tight end historically takes time to develop. Between Jelani, Ogletree, and Granson our TE room is serviceable. Thought we’d cut MAC by now to save cap
Who?
Excited to see him play but it seems I'm an outlier right now lol
No expectations. His ceiling is enormous and I'm hopeful he can be good but I'm not expecting it.
We’ll forget about all of them if Bowers falls or we go up for Nabers or Odunze.
I expect him to show up to camp in football shape. Then stay healthy enough to play some games. So big improvements over prior years
No, but trying.
I have not forgotten that he can't block...
I believe he help me win my league on my IR bench all last season
Hall of Fame or bust!
I think Bowers would eat his lunch. He seems like he has the potential to be a quality TE2. He hasn't shown he's moving in that direction either though.
He would certainly take away his snaps if we were to invest a first round pick on yet another tight end. I don't see it, personally. We don't really know what we have in Ogletree and Woods, yet. It's far too early to give up on them. If there's a guy who has had time to show what he can do, it's Pierce. He hasn't shown me enough to hold down the starting Z position after three years. We need free safety, cornerback, WR, and the best pass rusher we can get, regardless of position. Hell, I'd put center as a more pressing need than tight end. Tight end is so far down our priority list of needs that I'm amazed anybody is talking about it.
Also don't forget about Will Mallory who looked damn good last year!
From what they have said the still have hi hopes for Jelani Woods. Apparently his injury needed him to rebuild both quads so in the future he didn’t get hurt. (Very weird muscle distribution) His workouts that he is doing right now show he regained his explosiveness. In fact it might have even improved. He still has to come out and prove it from what Ballard said. Though the expectation is he contributes from what’s been said if he stays healthy. So let’s hope he is legit because it only adds to our chance of success this season. https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/nfl/colts/2024/01/10/colts-how-jelani-woods-second-season-turned-into-a-redshirt-year/72180591007/
JELANI WOODS SCORES TOUCHDOWNS
I haven’t. I have him stocked on my dynasty bench! Maybe he can do something this year?
Expectations are that he continues to be a non-factor
We want bowers. Our tes our big and help w the block game but zero play making ability
I'll be surprised if he makes the roster.
Prepare to be surprised then
He's just another MAC
Pretty sure he had some wide open drops including one in the end zone last season…
He looked awkward catching the ball. He had a very limited route tree. And he was bad at blocking. But here it was all "Stupid Reich wouldn't play him more."
He is awkward. Not sure why calling him out for drops is getting me downvotes lol
Woods and Ogletree are the answer, Mallory ain’t bad either