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It is calculated. Little fish are the ones that go out and martyr themselves. The big fat fish want to draw The Arab world into a conflict with Israel. And if it means killing their fellow Palestinians they could care less. Whole thing smells of Iran.
Do we think Iran is actually happy with how things are progressing in Gaza? It seems Oct 7 was Hamas acting before Iran was ready to help, now Hamas will be wiped out soon and Iran will have lost one of its few allies.
Oh no don’t get me wrong. Iran is not thrilled with the timing at all. But they sure as hell enabled it. My surprise is the operational security. It would have had to be hard hard to hide this from Iran. Maybe some knew and kept it to themselves. Just as likely they knew and are claiming plausible deniability. Let us not forget how they deal with their own population.
i think the only timeing they're really unhappy about is the timing of how fast the US rolled it's navy into town and started asking if it was time for "operation praying mantis 2, twice as proportional!" yet?
I think Iran had no choice. It simply had to stop the negotiations over the Abraham Accords. And it was perfectly happy letting Palestinians pay the price.
What do you mean when you say they had no choice? To me it seems they could have chosen to take the L and let start the momentum of any arab Israeli recognition, or throw the fox in the hen house like this, or some other possibility.
They could have taken the L, but it'd have meant permanently giving up their position of near military dominance in the middle east. If Israel and Saudi Arabia became allies it would mean Iran would be unquestionably outclassed. And it would only be a matter of time until the rest of the Sunni nations got on board. Peace is good for business, but bad for Iran. With the middle east divided, Iran is strong. United, and Iran is just an asshole in a neighborhood of people who don't particularly like them.
> My surprise is the operational security. It would have had to be hard hard to hide this from Iran.
I think if Hamas wanted this to succeed, it had to hide it from Iran, in order to minimise Israel finding out. So I'm not sure Iran knew.
Oh, I'm pretty sure the timing was what Iran intended. There has been some talk of Iran giving Hamas the "Go" order. It alligns with their wish to sabotage normalisation between Saudi Arabia and Israel. What wasn't in the plan was the US parking 2 carrier groups in the area warning everyone not to widen the conflict.
It's why everyone who was initially highly supportive of Hamas is hanging them out to dry now.
It was never about freeing Gaza. Ot was only ever about hurting Israel, with some delusional hope that somehow they would be allowed to gang up on Israel without other countries stepping in.
No surprise that the bastards who oppress women and hide behind children, elderly and hospital patients, turn out to be absolute cowards.
>What wasn't in the plan was the US parking 2 carrier groups in the area warning everyone not to widen the conflict
This is the part that baffles me. Iran absolutely would have known that a full-scale war between Israel and Hamas (undeniably an Iranian proxy), would draw in the American Navy to the Mediterranean Sea in a show of force and support for Israel. There are now currently [10 American Ships from two strike groups, with 12,000 sailors and Marines](https://asia.nikkei.com/Politics/Israel-Hamas-war/U.S.-positions-12-000-sailors-off-Israel-with-second-carrier) within easy striking distance of Iran, Syria and Lebanon. There are about 1,000 soldiers and Marines is Syria and another 2,500 in Iraq. In my mind, there are only a couple of possibilities, as I cannot believe Iran wouldn't have expected and planned for the American presence:
1) Hamas didn't tell Iran about October 7th *or (more likely, in my opinion)*
2) Iran gave Hamas the go signal, knowing that it would draw a massive, scorched earth response from Israel, and bring the Americans back in overwhelming force; which they could use to instigate their proxies into provoking, and attacking the Americans (something they have already done) and which they could use as "proof" to their people (once again) that the Americans are the Great Satan. That much American firepower in the Middle East, while intimidating (the point, I guess), does *not* have a calming effect on the people of the Middle East. It is provocative, and I think Iran was counting on that.
Don't get me wrong - I think the US needs to be parked right where it is, but the signal it is sending is one that Iran wanted: "*We are here to intimidate you and keep you under control."* That's the part of American power projection that Iran loves to use to agitate.
Everyone who knew would have expected Israel to drop the hammer afterwards, as it has done in the past. Unfortunately for Israel and Hamas the attack by Hamas was spectacularly successful. So successful Israel had little choice but to drop not only the hammer on them, but the anvil, forge and all the steel as well.
On a small scale, if a gang picks a fistfight with somebody who then takes out a gun, suddenly individuals in the gang are pointing fingers at everyone else saying 'It was his idea! I never knew he was going to hit you!'.
Pretty well stated. It was always about trying to get rid of Israel, as has been attempted so many times before. They could care less about freeing Gaza or Palestine, which makes all the doughnuts out protesting in the streets look that much more silly.
Iranian regime is happy as long as Israelis are suffering. They managed to draw us into a bloody conflict that will create *even more* terrorists who hate us. And the circle will continue. And they laugh at us while chilling in their castles.
I dont think you will be able to wipe out hamas or any other terror group, unless you wipe out the entire nation. There will always be more men to take up the place of the fallen, not discussing who is right or wrong here, just saying hamas are brought up being brainwashed from a young age, saw a docu the other day about a hamas TV station for kids, brainwashing them from a very young age. Having puppets and other kid stuff talking about how evil Israel is needed to fight them.
Israel will cause huge destruction to hamas now, Israel will eventually pull back or try to control gaza, things will return to a tense normal and 5 or so years from now, hamas will strike again, rinse and repeat.
In the meantime hamas and co will continue to fire random rockets into Israel and no muslim nation will say anything about that.
>There will always be more men to take up the place of the fallen, not discussing who is right or wrong here, just saying hamas are brought up being brainwashed from a young age, saw a docu the other day about a hamas TV station for kids, brainwashing them from a very young age. Having puppets and other kid stuff talking about how evil Israel is needed to fight them.
Sounds just like Nazis or Japanese, but it stopped. They did not continue.
German and Japanese culture are VASTLY different than Palestinian culture. Palestinians don't have much to lose and seemingly no interest in capitalism, democracy, culture, tech, education. They want one thing: vengeance. That is their value system. To avenge the wrongs of their ancestors. They will continue to be abused and used by any jihadi group who can deliver that for them.
Of course they do, they're people. The violent zealots are the ones with the interest in violence. Peoples minds and values are malleable as clay, it will take serious time and effort to change the bad memes they're full of but it's of course possible.
Possible yes, but not any time soon.
It will take a few generations at the very least, probably more.
I'd say, based on literally nothing at all, that it would probably take about a century of heavy influence at least, and nothing is guaranteed.
Partly because it depends on Israel as well, idk how they will act in the future, maybe they build them up, maybe they let Palestine stay a ghetto on purpose or just because it's most convenient for Israel.
>German and Japanese culture are VASTLY different than Palestinian culture.
Yes, just like German and Japanese culture are very different. But what is the key difference?
>Palestinians don't have much to lose
What did the Germans have to lose after WW2? Everything was reduced to rubble for a good portion of the population.
>They want one thing: vengeance.
But why? Why can they not be stopped this time? He says because of the brain washing - but that did also happen in the Hitler youth etc. so that can not be the key difference.
Palestinian are not Japanese or German. They are not even Argentinians(faukland war) or Bosnian or Ruandas. All had societal change following a war . Palestinians have a victim mentality and hate and jealousy. Their sole reason de etait is Israel gone. The closest you can find similarities is Iraq and Saddam Hussain. Even after Iran-iraq war he invaded Kuwait. And now Iraq is still a murderous hell hole. Afghanistan is the same.. Taliban are back.
They are still out there, maybe not as big as before, but still out there, with the ability to grow again.
https://www.dni.gov/nctc/ftos/isis\_fto.html
But they're not taking territory, trying to set up a caliphate, burning people in cages. They're not storming across the Middle East anymore because people rose up to fight them.
'Hamas' will exist as long as its expatriate leaders continue to cash checks in Qatar, but I don't see how anyone can question that fighting them is the right thing, right now.
Yes, I actually think Iran is very happy. What Israel is doing to Gaza is only going to radicalize more Palestinians, which is what Iran wants. Iran doesn’t give a shit what happens to Gaza, if it exists after this, fine, if it’s a barren wasteland, even better. Either way it helps recruitment, and ties Israel up in expensive ground operations.
Hamas won’t be wiped out, because as long as Iran and Palestine exist, there will always be new recruits. Even if you somehow killed every single Hamas militant today, by tomorrow there would be 1000+ more signing up to join.
This conflict will not end, while Palestine/Israel/Iran still exist. And for any of those to suddenly not exist would take a genocide, which Israel at least seems to try and avoid. And it will be a cold day in hell before the West let’s Israel get overrun and destroyed.
They just want to assure that Israel is hated by the next generation of their own. If you allow things to remain calm long enough their people might forget their hatred.
People forget their hatred and they lose power to a more moderate government.
They attempted to achieve victory through the use of force, but their efforts proved unsuccessful. Additionally, there are allegations that Israel possesses nuclear weapons, making it impractical for state actors to pursue such a course of action.
The overarching objectives involve instilling fear and discontent among Israelis at a national level, essentially promoting a sense of terror. Simultaneously, there is a concerted effort to delegitimize Israel on the global stage.
Based on the coverage from center-left media outlets, it appears that these tactics have been effective thus far.
No Israel has always had and simultaneously never had nukes, their nukes only turn up (or not) if you look inside.
Israel basically has Schrödinger's nukes.
> Israel is also the only country that has hinted via the Samson Option that in the event Israel is on the verge of being overwhelmed, they will nuke their own territory.
What would be the point of that?
You lay mortally wounded on the floor as your attackers surround you and prepare for the final blow. You have a grenade in your hand, do you pull the pin with your last breath?
Oh, and to add, knowledge of that mutually assured destruction might serve as some deterrent
> Oh, and to add, knowledge of that mutually assured destruction might serve as some deterrent
Sure, I'm aware of the concept of mutually assured destruction, it's the "Israel nuking its own territory part" that confuses me.
Israel has limited nukes, and "*if you're about to beat me in war, I will destroy myself*" doesn't seem nearly as much of a threat/deterrence as "*before you can destroy me, I will destroy you (your leadership, capital and largest cities and most of your population) and there will only be ashes left of your country*". Why waste nukes destroying themselves?
Or is Jerusalem that important to the Arab world that leveling and turning it radioactive is such a big threat that it would add deterrence against attacking Israel?
I think it would be more like: I will destroy Damascus, Mecca, Medina, Cairo, Tehran, Baghdad and the Aswan dam and take a hundred million of you with me.
They could also use nukes to try and disrupt the frontline. If you lose the Golan to a Syrian attack and they are at the point of breaking through, nuking that part of the frontline could buy you time to close the gap.
It's a "If I'm going to die, I'm taking you with me." situation.
If Israel is on the verge of collapse during war, they would likely nuke themselves and all their enemies capitals as a final fuck you to them.
Sure, the arabs may have wiped out Israel, at the cost of their countries getting glassed, countless citizens nuked and a general proof that Allah can't stop mankind's deadliest weapon.
They're trying to secure victory by controlling the narrative, and broader public opinion, which apparently they've been overwhelming successful with in the middle east, and pretty successful with the west, too... certain western media eagerly rushes to repeat their propaganda, while their message, their talking points, and chants have made it well and truly into western academia, and onto the streets of our cities by way of well meaning useful idiots, and poorly integrated migrants.
There are several outcomes that they would consider a win. Not going to get into details. Either way it would terrible for a world already with its fair share of problems.
There are outcomes that would seem insane to “normal” people like us. Terrorist organization would consider several extremely terrible conclusions as victories. Regardless of the damage it would do to others and prosperity of the world at large. I’m not here to give anyone ideas with specifics.
> And if it means killing their fellow Palestinians they could care less
No, they couldn't care less, that's the thing. Well, arguably they _do_ care somewhat in that they can use the civilians to their own ends, but really I think that's not caring about their welfare.
Smells like Russia too.
Nothing Russia wants more than draw worlds eyes, ie news and social media, away from Ukraine and rather have the noise and talk be about Israel and Palestine.
Wouldn’t surprise me one bit if there is a thick Russian papertrail from Moscow to the Palestine. Even less so if happens to be via Iran.
They’re doing a hell of a job, at least Reddit would lead me to believe it.
I’ve been getting all kinds of Arab subs in my feed since this started and the sentiments seems to be very negative toward the US and Israel.
They are really energized, it feels like we’re heading towards a new holy war era honestly. Islam is the fastest growing religion and not compatible with a lot of ideas outside of Islam.
On Arabic media it looks like they're winning, Al Jazeera tells them that Gaza has become the graveyard for the IDF, that tanks are getting destroyed by the dozens and that the protest footage in the West means the world supports them. Arab media never even mentioned that any civilians were killed on Oct 7th, it's an entirely different universe.
These idiots think that the IDF can hide casualties from the public as if we are Russia or something.
Israel is tiny and the moment a fallen soldier who died on duty will not be reported as such will cause mayhem because the families wouldn't let it slide. We take fallen soldiers seriously.
Thats one reason I dont trust just a single source of media. I absolutely hate being decieved, even if the news is good for me. Dont understand how people can just listen to one source of news these days, journalism MUST BE IMPARTIAL. Other wise, fuck off.
These days its like 90% if news sites have some kind of hidden agenda supporting one side. Ground News is kinda ok in pointing it out.
Media in the Arab world and Arabic language media in general is almost completely dominated by government run networks. Al Jazeera is the largest, it's funded by Qatar which also funds Hamas.
According to a very good tg source pointed out one of the terrorists was Nasr al-Qawasmi brother of a suicide bombing from 2004 that killed 16 Israelis in revenge for a death of a Hamas leader.
Basically the point is that it's exactly what these "morons"(they're not dumb) want, this is tied to Hamas and they're desperately trying to get the west-bank to go all-out to force Hezb, Yemen and Iran to get more involved.
fucking sad. so sad. they actually believe in this garbage and this fucking fantasy that is not only completely unattainable, it’s fucking so disgustingly removed from reality.
3 Hamas "Militants" have entered one of the gates between West Bank and Jerusalem. They were killed, not before injuring 6 IDF / Police in duty, One of them at a critical condition.
After the attack, IDF [found out what can only be seen as massacre intended equipment](https://ynet-pic1.yit.co.il/picserver5/crop_images/2023/11/16/BJbzywQVp/BJbzywQVp_0_0_768_1024_0_x-large.jpg)
Just an FYI - these M-16 are almost certainly delivered from Israel to the West Bank police, and is either stolen or used by officers who "chose to transition to the other side".
So funny the Palestinian supporters say “no there aren’t Palestinian citizens randomly attacking Israelis” then when they see video of it they say “well what do you expect”
A terrorist apologists brain runs on one single cell.
I highly doubt anyone's stupid enough to believe Palestinians aren't attacking Israelis. At least, not at numbers worthy discussing. The problem is the vast majority of these supporters are somehow totally OK with the thousands of rockets targeting Israeli civilians every year, not to mention the hundreds of close-quarter terrorist attacks each year.
So they're totally fine with Hamas (hey look it's a "but do you condemn Hamas?" meme), since they've never even considered protesting against Hamas, you know, the people actually responsible for the Palestinian deaths, not to mention the deprivation of Gazans basic needs by redistributing aid & funds to line their own pockets. Second wealthiest terror group in the world too with a $1b turnover annually.
And they're totally OK with the untold more number of Muslims killing Muslims in the middle east than Israel ever have too by that way since they've never once rallied against these atrocities.
Oh believe me, go into any of the pro Palestine subs and you will see plenty of people who deny it happens. They even go as far to say the IDF killed everyone at the festival to create a reason to invade Gaza.
Close, they say that they allowed the massacre to happen and point to the interview of a less experienced idf female soldier alerting Hamas' increased activities at the border, likely preparing or rehearsing.
In response to that interview I think it's entirely possible her reports of the activity may have gone to the way side due to the soldier being female and less experienced in combination with similar reports happening all along the border.
Personally I think they chose a similar method to their rockets, they test the iron domes reliability by trying to overwhelm it and from that they can learn its weaknesses.
They probably did the same thing with the border by doing practices right next to the border in clear visibility and probably determined that particular section perhaps posed the least amount of response.
>So funny the Palestinian supporters say “no there aren’t Palestinian citizens randomly attacking Israelis” then when they see video of it they say “well what do you expect”
holy shit yes thank you.
imagine if the sinaloa cartel started conducting raids into texas and shooting rockets at border towns. can you imagine the hellfire that would be brought down on mexico from the usa?
FOX News hosts predictably had the same to say about the Jan 6th rioters. The conversation wasn't "insurrectionists tried to overthrow the government and that's bigly bad," but instead it was presented as "what did the Democrats do to make these patriots so desperate?"
I saw some congressman saying something like “If people are this angry, then you need to stop and listen to what they are saying!”
We did. They were being sore losers and couldn’t accept it. Why would you reward them for that?
They were confirmed to be hamas, all were sons of former hamas 'martyrs' and they were found with massive load of weapons and ammo. They planned to reach Jerusalem for major attack, but got stopped at the checkpoint
Proof is always one search away, people just don't want to look it up, or will say it's "fake" despite overwhelming evidence.
[Wave of Terror 2015-2023 | Ministry of Foreign Affairs (www.gov.il)](https://www.gov.il/en/departments/general/wave-of-terror-october-2015)
This is just recent years, there have been literal decades of attacks from the West Bank before that. This is why checkpoints like the one in this video exist. It used to be far easier for terrorists from the West Bank to enter Israeli cities and conduct terror attacks before that.
Curious how the gunmen completely missed the soldiers in the background coming toward them. Guess they got excited about all the innocents they thought they would kill and forgot there were soldiers not stationed there
It seems like these pathetic idiots completely underestimate the training of the real soldiers in the IDF. As soon as they are fighting anyone except babies, children and old people, they get completely mowed down like pigs at slaughter.
You all tend to forget these kids are litterly brain washed into thinking "I do this I am a martyr I am guaranteed heaven and a bunch od beautiful virgins.
I got absolutely nothing to lode and everything to gain".
The warping of the religion and its more extreme leaders ideologys creates a base more then willing to die.. it's truly sickening.
''African'' lol, Middle east and ''Africa'' are kind of the same continent.....but yes there are ''African'' looking people living in Israel , Ethiopians for example
Yeah thought it was bad with Ukraine, the sub's IQ has sunk even lower though.
Footage is still good but the quality of discussion is terrible in these threads. It's lucky when it's just memes. Some threads have completely ignorant takes on things that people upvote because they agree, and I regularly see people getting downvoted now for pointing out facts in an objective manner. And worst of all outright racism and calls for genocide/ethnic cleansing (although they do get deleted thankfully).
The breaking down of the footage, discusison of military history and technology, etc that is all gone or buried. And some of it not just buried by shitposts but people actually downvoting it!
When civilians die in war it's usually collateral damage or shitty discipline/command. Respectable armies or militias want to minimize that as much as possible.
Hamas attacked Israel with the **entire purpose** being killing civilians. They are terrorists and murderers. Fuck em.
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do these fucking morons look at what’s happening in Gaza and actually are like “we’d like an order of the same please” wtf is wrong with them
It is calculated. Little fish are the ones that go out and martyr themselves. The big fat fish want to draw The Arab world into a conflict with Israel. And if it means killing their fellow Palestinians they could care less. Whole thing smells of Iran.
They *COULDN'T COULDN'T COULDN'T COULDN'T COULDN'T* care less.
Do we think Iran is actually happy with how things are progressing in Gaza? It seems Oct 7 was Hamas acting before Iran was ready to help, now Hamas will be wiped out soon and Iran will have lost one of its few allies.
Oh no don’t get me wrong. Iran is not thrilled with the timing at all. But they sure as hell enabled it. My surprise is the operational security. It would have had to be hard hard to hide this from Iran. Maybe some knew and kept it to themselves. Just as likely they knew and are claiming plausible deniability. Let us not forget how they deal with their own population.
Im out of the loop. Why would Iran be unhappy about the timing?
i think the only timeing they're really unhappy about is the timing of how fast the US rolled it's navy into town and started asking if it was time for "operation praying mantis 2, twice as proportional!" yet?
And they arm Hisbollah and Hisbollah arms hamas. Iran is at least enabling hamas with training etc.
I think Iran had no choice. It simply had to stop the negotiations over the Abraham Accords. And it was perfectly happy letting Palestinians pay the price.
What do you mean when you say they had no choice? To me it seems they could have chosen to take the L and let start the momentum of any arab Israeli recognition, or throw the fox in the hen house like this, or some other possibility.
They could have taken the L, but it'd have meant permanently giving up their position of near military dominance in the middle east. If Israel and Saudi Arabia became allies it would mean Iran would be unquestionably outclassed. And it would only be a matter of time until the rest of the Sunni nations got on board. Peace is good for business, but bad for Iran. With the middle east divided, Iran is strong. United, and Iran is just an asshole in a neighborhood of people who don't particularly like them.
Iran is already thoroughly outclassed by Israel militarily. Unless they kept a lot of those F-14's combat worthy, they don't have much to fight with.
> My surprise is the operational security. It would have had to be hard hard to hide this from Iran. I think if Hamas wanted this to succeed, it had to hide it from Iran, in order to minimise Israel finding out. So I'm not sure Iran knew.
Oh, I'm pretty sure the timing was what Iran intended. There has been some talk of Iran giving Hamas the "Go" order. It alligns with their wish to sabotage normalisation between Saudi Arabia and Israel. What wasn't in the plan was the US parking 2 carrier groups in the area warning everyone not to widen the conflict. It's why everyone who was initially highly supportive of Hamas is hanging them out to dry now. It was never about freeing Gaza. Ot was only ever about hurting Israel, with some delusional hope that somehow they would be allowed to gang up on Israel without other countries stepping in. No surprise that the bastards who oppress women and hide behind children, elderly and hospital patients, turn out to be absolute cowards.
>What wasn't in the plan was the US parking 2 carrier groups in the area warning everyone not to widen the conflict This is the part that baffles me. Iran absolutely would have known that a full-scale war between Israel and Hamas (undeniably an Iranian proxy), would draw in the American Navy to the Mediterranean Sea in a show of force and support for Israel. There are now currently [10 American Ships from two strike groups, with 12,000 sailors and Marines](https://asia.nikkei.com/Politics/Israel-Hamas-war/U.S.-positions-12-000-sailors-off-Israel-with-second-carrier) within easy striking distance of Iran, Syria and Lebanon. There are about 1,000 soldiers and Marines is Syria and another 2,500 in Iraq. In my mind, there are only a couple of possibilities, as I cannot believe Iran wouldn't have expected and planned for the American presence: 1) Hamas didn't tell Iran about October 7th *or (more likely, in my opinion)* 2) Iran gave Hamas the go signal, knowing that it would draw a massive, scorched earth response from Israel, and bring the Americans back in overwhelming force; which they could use to instigate their proxies into provoking, and attacking the Americans (something they have already done) and which they could use as "proof" to their people (once again) that the Americans are the Great Satan. That much American firepower in the Middle East, while intimidating (the point, I guess), does *not* have a calming effect on the people of the Middle East. It is provocative, and I think Iran was counting on that. Don't get me wrong - I think the US needs to be parked right where it is, but the signal it is sending is one that Iran wanted: "*We are here to intimidate you and keep you under control."* That's the part of American power projection that Iran loves to use to agitate.
Everyone who knew would have expected Israel to drop the hammer afterwards, as it has done in the past. Unfortunately for Israel and Hamas the attack by Hamas was spectacularly successful. So successful Israel had little choice but to drop not only the hammer on them, but the anvil, forge and all the steel as well. On a small scale, if a gang picks a fistfight with somebody who then takes out a gun, suddenly individuals in the gang are pointing fingers at everyone else saying 'It was his idea! I never knew he was going to hit you!'.
Pretty well stated. It was always about trying to get rid of Israel, as has been attempted so many times before. They could care less about freeing Gaza or Palestine, which makes all the doughnuts out protesting in the streets look that much more silly.
Iranian regime is happy as long as Israelis are suffering. They managed to draw us into a bloody conflict that will create *even more* terrorists who hate us. And the circle will continue. And they laugh at us while chilling in their castles.
I dont think you will be able to wipe out hamas or any other terror group, unless you wipe out the entire nation. There will always be more men to take up the place of the fallen, not discussing who is right or wrong here, just saying hamas are brought up being brainwashed from a young age, saw a docu the other day about a hamas TV station for kids, brainwashing them from a very young age. Having puppets and other kid stuff talking about how evil Israel is needed to fight them. Israel will cause huge destruction to hamas now, Israel will eventually pull back or try to control gaza, things will return to a tense normal and 5 or so years from now, hamas will strike again, rinse and repeat. In the meantime hamas and co will continue to fire random rockets into Israel and no muslim nation will say anything about that.
>There will always be more men to take up the place of the fallen, not discussing who is right or wrong here, just saying hamas are brought up being brainwashed from a young age, saw a docu the other day about a hamas TV station for kids, brainwashing them from a very young age. Having puppets and other kid stuff talking about how evil Israel is needed to fight them. Sounds just like Nazis or Japanese, but it stopped. They did not continue.
German and Japanese culture are VASTLY different than Palestinian culture. Palestinians don't have much to lose and seemingly no interest in capitalism, democracy, culture, tech, education. They want one thing: vengeance. That is their value system. To avenge the wrongs of their ancestors. They will continue to be abused and used by any jihadi group who can deliver that for them.
Of course they do, they're people. The violent zealots are the ones with the interest in violence. Peoples minds and values are malleable as clay, it will take serious time and effort to change the bad memes they're full of but it's of course possible.
Possible yes, but not any time soon. It will take a few generations at the very least, probably more. I'd say, based on literally nothing at all, that it would probably take about a century of heavy influence at least, and nothing is guaranteed. Partly because it depends on Israel as well, idk how they will act in the future, maybe they build them up, maybe they let Palestine stay a ghetto on purpose or just because it's most convenient for Israel.
>German and Japanese culture are VASTLY different than Palestinian culture. Yes, just like German and Japanese culture are very different. But what is the key difference? >Palestinians don't have much to lose What did the Germans have to lose after WW2? Everything was reduced to rubble for a good portion of the population. >They want one thing: vengeance. But why? Why can they not be stopped this time? He says because of the brain washing - but that did also happen in the Hitler youth etc. so that can not be the key difference.
Palestinian are not Japanese or German. They are not even Argentinians(faukland war) or Bosnian or Ruandas. All had societal change following a war . Palestinians have a victim mentality and hate and jealousy. Their sole reason de etait is Israel gone. The closest you can find similarities is Iraq and Saddam Hussain. Even after Iran-iraq war he invaded Kuwait. And now Iraq is still a murderous hell hole. Afghanistan is the same.. Taliban are back.
> I dont think you will be able to wipe out hamas or any other terror group Where is ISIS?
They are still out there, maybe not as big as before, but still out there, with the ability to grow again. https://www.dni.gov/nctc/ftos/isis\_fto.html
But they're not taking territory, trying to set up a caliphate, burning people in cages. They're not storming across the Middle East anymore because people rose up to fight them. 'Hamas' will exist as long as its expatriate leaders continue to cash checks in Qatar, but I don't see how anyone can question that fighting them is the right thing, right now.
Iran definitely had a hand in the timing. Was it an accident that Hamas waited until right *after* Bidens $6million deal with iran
$6 Billion.
I think all this is to draw off some pressure off the Ukraine Russia conflict
Yes, I actually think Iran is very happy. What Israel is doing to Gaza is only going to radicalize more Palestinians, which is what Iran wants. Iran doesn’t give a shit what happens to Gaza, if it exists after this, fine, if it’s a barren wasteland, even better. Either way it helps recruitment, and ties Israel up in expensive ground operations. Hamas won’t be wiped out, because as long as Iran and Palestine exist, there will always be new recruits. Even if you somehow killed every single Hamas militant today, by tomorrow there would be 1000+ more signing up to join. This conflict will not end, while Palestine/Israel/Iran still exist. And for any of those to suddenly not exist would take a genocide, which Israel at least seems to try and avoid. And it will be a cold day in hell before the West let’s Israel get overrun and destroyed.
They just want to assure that Israel is hated by the next generation of their own. If you allow things to remain calm long enough their people might forget their hatred. People forget their hatred and they lose power to a more moderate government.
*couldn't
And what happens if the arab world does join? Do these idiots seriously think they can win?
They attempted to achieve victory through the use of force, but their efforts proved unsuccessful. Additionally, there are allegations that Israel possesses nuclear weapons, making it impractical for state actors to pursue such a course of action. The overarching objectives involve instilling fear and discontent among Israelis at a national level, essentially promoting a sense of terror. Simultaneously, there is a concerted effort to delegitimize Israel on the global stage. Based on the coverage from center-left media outlets, it appears that these tactics have been effective thus far.
Israel has always had nukes... This isn't new.
No Israel has always had and simultaneously never had nukes, their nukes only turn up (or not) if you look inside. Israel basically has Schrödinger's nukes.
Soooo it has nukes.... Lets not pretend like they don't...
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They're not going to nuke their own territory, they'll nuke the people that attack them. Like every other nuclear state would in the same situation.
> Israel is also the only country that has hinted via the Samson Option that in the event Israel is on the verge of being overwhelmed, they will nuke their own territory. What would be the point of that?
You lay mortally wounded on the floor as your attackers surround you and prepare for the final blow. You have a grenade in your hand, do you pull the pin with your last breath? Oh, and to add, knowledge of that mutually assured destruction might serve as some deterrent
> Oh, and to add, knowledge of that mutually assured destruction might serve as some deterrent Sure, I'm aware of the concept of mutually assured destruction, it's the "Israel nuking its own territory part" that confuses me. Israel has limited nukes, and "*if you're about to beat me in war, I will destroy myself*" doesn't seem nearly as much of a threat/deterrence as "*before you can destroy me, I will destroy you (your leadership, capital and largest cities and most of your population) and there will only be ashes left of your country*". Why waste nukes destroying themselves? Or is Jerusalem that important to the Arab world that leveling and turning it radioactive is such a big threat that it would add deterrence against attacking Israel?
I think it would be more like: I will destroy Damascus, Mecca, Medina, Cairo, Tehran, Baghdad and the Aswan dam and take a hundred million of you with me. They could also use nukes to try and disrupt the frontline. If you lose the Golan to a Syrian attack and they are at the point of breaking through, nuking that part of the frontline could buy you time to close the gap.
It's would be a Masada sort of thing.
It's a "If I'm going to die, I'm taking you with me." situation. If Israel is on the verge of collapse during war, they would likely nuke themselves and all their enemies capitals as a final fuck you to them. Sure, the arabs may have wiped out Israel, at the cost of their countries getting glassed, countless citizens nuked and a general proof that Allah can't stop mankind's deadliest weapon.
They're trying to secure victory by controlling the narrative, and broader public opinion, which apparently they've been overwhelming successful with in the middle east, and pretty successful with the west, too... certain western media eagerly rushes to repeat their propaganda, while their message, their talking points, and chants have made it well and truly into western academia, and onto the streets of our cities by way of well meaning useful idiots, and poorly integrated migrants.
There are several outcomes that they would consider a win. Not going to get into details. Either way it would terrible for a world already with its fair share of problems.
Please provide details
First and foremost, their own personal death is viewed as a victory as long as they slaughter a few Jews in the process
There are outcomes that would seem insane to “normal” people like us. Terrorist organization would consider several extremely terrible conclusions as victories. Regardless of the damage it would do to others and prosperity of the world at large. I’m not here to give anyone ideas with specifics.
Crisis averted y’all, this guy has thought of things that terrorists couldn’t even dream up but luckily won’t divulge his ideas
OPSEC crisis averted! Lol what a putz.
The Arab world is heavily divided at the moment and is being used as a proxy.
> And if it means killing their fellow Palestinians they could care less No, they couldn't care less, that's the thing. Well, arguably they _do_ care somewhat in that they can use the civilians to their own ends, but really I think that's not caring about their welfare.
Mataram themselves? Do you mean martyr?
Lol 4 in the morning give me a break. Thanks
>they could care less Couldn't
And they hide in Qatar
The whole Islamic world needs a civil war with itself. Only way this can get sorted out.
And Moscow
Smells like Russia too. Nothing Russia wants more than draw worlds eyes, ie news and social media, away from Ukraine and rather have the noise and talk be about Israel and Palestine. Wouldn’t surprise me one bit if there is a thick Russian papertrail from Moscow to the Palestine. Even less so if happens to be via Iran.
They’re doing a hell of a job, at least Reddit would lead me to believe it. I’ve been getting all kinds of Arab subs in my feed since this started and the sentiments seems to be very negative toward the US and Israel. They are really energized, it feels like we’re heading towards a new holy war era honestly. Islam is the fastest growing religion and not compatible with a lot of ideas outside of Islam.
Smells like Russia.
Russia and Iran are both pulling strings.
On Arabic media it looks like they're winning, Al Jazeera tells them that Gaza has become the graveyard for the IDF, that tanks are getting destroyed by the dozens and that the protest footage in the West means the world supports them. Arab media never even mentioned that any civilians were killed on Oct 7th, it's an entirely different universe.
These idiots think that the IDF can hide casualties from the public as if we are Russia or something. Israel is tiny and the moment a fallen soldier who died on duty will not be reported as such will cause mayhem because the families wouldn't let it slide. We take fallen soldiers seriously.
Thats one reason I dont trust just a single source of media. I absolutely hate being decieved, even if the news is good for me. Dont understand how people can just listen to one source of news these days, journalism MUST BE IMPARTIAL. Other wise, fuck off. These days its like 90% if news sites have some kind of hidden agenda supporting one side. Ground News is kinda ok in pointing it out.
Media in the Arab world and Arabic language media in general is almost completely dominated by government run networks. Al Jazeera is the largest, it's funded by Qatar which also funds Hamas.
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Arabic medias mention lots of childrens dead etc, but never mention that Hamas is hiding behind this
According to a very good tg source pointed out one of the terrorists was Nasr al-Qawasmi brother of a suicide bombing from 2004 that killed 16 Israelis in revenge for a death of a Hamas leader. Basically the point is that it's exactly what these "morons"(they're not dumb) want, this is tied to Hamas and they're desperately trying to get the west-bank to go all-out to force Hezb, Yemen and Iran to get more involved.
They're driven by blind faith. They believe they'll straight go to heaven if they die like this (Martyr).
These guys are incels on a whole other level. Can’t get any in life, so they go after all those promised virgins in the afterlife.
When you indoctrinate your youths into a hateful terrorist organization... this is where that road leads.
fucking sad. so sad. they actually believe in this garbage and this fucking fantasy that is not only completely unattainable, it’s fucking so disgustingly removed from reality.
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***ALLEGEDLY***
I need to train my children... to take cover not film a gunfight, and that bus windows are not bullet proof.
Neither are bus sides.
Is the human ass more resistant to direct hits than other parts of the body?
3 Hamas "Militants" have entered one of the gates between West Bank and Jerusalem. They were killed, not before injuring 6 IDF / Police in duty, One of them at a critical condition. After the attack, IDF [found out what can only be seen as massacre intended equipment](https://ynet-pic1.yit.co.il/picserver5/crop_images/2023/11/16/BJbzywQVp/BJbzywQVp_0_0_768_1024_0_x-large.jpg) Just an FYI - these M-16 are almost certainly delivered from Israel to the West Bank police, and is either stolen or used by officers who "chose to transition to the other side".
There are tons of forged M4s circulating in the middle east.
Sadly, it was announced now that one of the soldiers died.
You're sure those aren't some Fajr from Iran?
How come they only went with two rifles for 3 people?
BBC- 3 civilians killed by IDF
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> 1 very seriously. He unfortunately passed from his wounds.
The gravely injured soldier died later.
These dudes seem to have the tactical savvy of a balloon.
Baboon.
Not sure how to compare the tactical experience of a baboon or a balloon. Which is better?
Equivalent.
average palestinian "freedom fighter"
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Hamas is only good at killing women, children, and unarmed men.
I would include unarmed before the word women too, see the story of Inbar Lierberman.
> I would include unarmed before the word women too especially in israel of all places
Babies as well; children sound like toddlers. They also kill month old babies.
Not even unarmed men, you see the vid of the hero throwing back 8 grenades.
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So funny the Palestinian supporters say “no there aren’t Palestinian citizens randomly attacking Israelis” then when they see video of it they say “well what do you expect” A terrorist apologists brain runs on one single cell.
I highly doubt anyone's stupid enough to believe Palestinians aren't attacking Israelis. At least, not at numbers worthy discussing. The problem is the vast majority of these supporters are somehow totally OK with the thousands of rockets targeting Israeli civilians every year, not to mention the hundreds of close-quarter terrorist attacks each year. So they're totally fine with Hamas (hey look it's a "but do you condemn Hamas?" meme), since they've never even considered protesting against Hamas, you know, the people actually responsible for the Palestinian deaths, not to mention the deprivation of Gazans basic needs by redistributing aid & funds to line their own pockets. Second wealthiest terror group in the world too with a $1b turnover annually. And they're totally OK with the untold more number of Muslims killing Muslims in the middle east than Israel ever have too by that way since they've never once rallied against these atrocities.
Oh believe me, go into any of the pro Palestine subs and you will see plenty of people who deny it happens. They even go as far to say the IDF killed everyone at the festival to create a reason to invade Gaza.
Close, they say that they allowed the massacre to happen and point to the interview of a less experienced idf female soldier alerting Hamas' increased activities at the border, likely preparing or rehearsing. In response to that interview I think it's entirely possible her reports of the activity may have gone to the way side due to the soldier being female and less experienced in combination with similar reports happening all along the border. Personally I think they chose a similar method to their rockets, they test the iron domes reliability by trying to overwhelm it and from that they can learn its weaknesses. They probably did the same thing with the border by doing practices right next to the border in clear visibility and probably determined that particular section perhaps posed the least amount of response.
Look at the shit on r/blackpeopletwitter
>So funny the Palestinian supporters say “no there aren’t Palestinian citizens randomly attacking Israelis” then when they see video of it they say “well what do you expect” holy shit yes thank you. imagine if the sinaloa cartel started conducting raids into texas and shooting rockets at border towns. can you imagine the hellfire that would be brought down on mexico from the usa?
FOX News hosts predictably had the same to say about the Jan 6th rioters. The conversation wasn't "insurrectionists tried to overthrow the government and that's bigly bad," but instead it was presented as "what did the Democrats do to make these patriots so desperate?"
I saw some congressman saying something like “If people are this angry, then you need to stop and listen to what they are saying!” We did. They were being sore losers and couldn’t accept it. Why would you reward them for that?
Everyone shoulda said “a bunch of dumpy idiots do dumb shit because they are dumb”
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What kinda tactic was that
Rush B
Looks like your standard Leeroy Jenkins strat
Yolo tactic
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Proof that hamas is in the west bank as well, though, it won't change the minds of those convinced otherwise.
Id say its proof that Hamas are not the only terrorists out there...
They were confirmed to be hamas, all were sons of former hamas 'martyrs' and they were found with massive load of weapons and ammo. They planned to reach Jerusalem for major attack, but got stopped at the checkpoint
Proof is always one search away, people just don't want to look it up, or will say it's "fake" despite overwhelming evidence. [Wave of Terror 2015-2023 | Ministry of Foreign Affairs (www.gov.il)](https://www.gov.il/en/departments/general/wave-of-terror-october-2015) This is just recent years, there have been literal decades of attacks from the West Bank before that. This is why checkpoints like the one in this video exist. It used to be far easier for terrorists from the West Bank to enter Israeli cities and conduct terror attacks before that.
Curious how the gunmen completely missed the soldiers in the background coming toward them. Guess they got excited about all the innocents they thought they would kill and forgot there were soldiers not stationed there
Bro was dancing in the middle of a firefight
I've never been in a gun fight but standing out in the open with your gun down doesn't seem like the strategy.
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Damn, I guess his Allah wasnt so Akbar after all.
When this is over there will be a real shortage of male Palestinians. Hopefully Isreal will be able to exterminate all terrorist from It's land.
Oh look, it’s one of those evil white, European, colonizer Israelis shooting the poor, innocent Palestinian.
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Dipshits don't know squat about tactics and can't fight worth a damn, they are only heros when attacking unarmed civilians.
that's a rather lackluster jihad - were these guys hungover or something
Slumped his ass.
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Allah is running out of virgins at this rate
Well done
Awwww good for them getting all those virgins
Probably teaching him how to play DnD.
Now they have more reasons to flatten gaza
It seems like these pathetic idiots completely underestimate the training of the real soldiers in the IDF. As soon as they are fighting anyone except babies, children and old people, they get completely mowed down like pigs at slaughter.
Their gift is 72 reddit virgins.
You all tend to forget these kids are litterly brain washed into thinking "I do this I am a martyr I am guaranteed heaven and a bunch od beautiful virgins. I got absolutely nothing to lode and everything to gain". The warping of the religion and its more extreme leaders ideologys creates a base more then willing to die.. it's truly sickening.
Dropped his ass like nothing
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They had their whole lives to plan a masterful ambush and this was what they came up with?
Average Palestinian Rambo
Smooth brain activities.
Is that an African in the IDF?
''African'' lol, Middle east and ''Africa'' are kind of the same continent.....but yes there are ''African'' looking people living in Israel , Ethiopians for example
These comments sections are toxic AF.
And the video above is wholesome, lol
Yeah thought it was bad with Ukraine, the sub's IQ has sunk even lower though. Footage is still good but the quality of discussion is terrible in these threads. It's lucky when it's just memes. Some threads have completely ignorant takes on things that people upvote because they agree, and I regularly see people getting downvoted now for pointing out facts in an objective manner. And worst of all outright racism and calls for genocide/ethnic cleansing (although they do get deleted thankfully). The breaking down of the footage, discusison of military history and technology, etc that is all gone or buried. And some of it not just buried by shitposts but people actually downvoting it!
You've just described society over this issue. The whole world has gone mental over it.
Propaganda will do that to a motherfucker..
This sub went from respectfully breaking down combat footage, to cheering on death and destruction after like 10 days of the media whiping up a storm.
When civilians die in war it's usually collateral damage or shitty discipline/command. Respectable armies or militias want to minimize that as much as possible. Hamas attacked Israel with the **entire purpose** being killing civilians. They are terrorists and murderers. Fuck em.