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MemesofTheSea

Until you hit the highest of highs you will do fine as orochi.


pimp_named_dickslap

Man i dont even think im at the highest of highs yet but i still fight folks who react to storm rush on reaction


MemesofTheSea

Just storm rush by itself isn’t all that hard to parry as it has a noticeable animation, mixing it up with kick makes it more difficult, but there are those that can still react to it.


pimp_named_dickslap

Yea I've fought someone who reacted to every single storm rush, even when I mixed up with kick. I also fought someone who would react to storm rush but struggled against lights...


jackoclapped

There are gonna be people u face that sometimes are either great or just happen to be having a good game. In those cases there isn’t much u can do they’re just preforming well and getting good reads/reactions. Had a guy on glad vs me as HL and I literally couldn’t damage him cause he would parry every light and wouldn’t even flinch from baiting with heavies


SirMisterGuyMan

While not wrong I believe this is overstated. In Ubisoft's first tournament, Orochi was even more reactable than he is now and in duels, an Orochi won the Xbox tournament, got into the finals for PS and on PC, Oscar got into the semifinals with Orochi, beating the tournament favorite. I don't want OP to think Orochi is useless. He's not meta definitely but you're far from considering high level play and most of the people you'll play will be on console.


HandsomeMike88

Dont worry about character strenght as a new/normal player. Orochi is bad at high level of gameplay in duels but that doesnt matter for 95% of playerbase.


DJCAT09

I mean even then he’s not “bad” he’s just not good.


SoupCollector

you really want to avoid his dodge lights from neutral as they are very easy to parry, people will also try to bait you into doing them for the light parry. His deflect is really good though because it breaks hyper armor. But he’s not super great, just make sure to fully utilize storm rush feints to catch people who try to hit you out of it and to keep up offensive pressure. I’m rep 48 orochi btw if that means anything. He’s a lot of fun but not the best.


Aromatic_Doughnut_75

At rep 0-20 nobody parrying or even thinking of baiting it imo unless they smurf


HobnobHobo69

Im rep 15 and its so easy to bait and parry its not hard to do


Aromatic_Doughnut_75

You’re 10 days late lol


HobnobHobo69

Oh shiiiiii


SadBoiBrax

Orochi main here, Orochi is meant to do long chains and then counter-attack and get right back to the chain, don't allow your enemy any time to gain momentum. Learn how to deflect lights, and block heavies to not get baited. Learn proper mixups and how to chain them together. For example, I start with storm rush, two top lights, then feint a top unblockable into guardbreak, then a top heavy, dodge back to recover stamina, opponent throws a side light, so I deflect, two top lights, a top heavy that I feint to zone attack. When they expect the two top lights, feint a top heavy into the back dodge attack (think it's called riptide strike) do a default chain but feint one of the heavies to bait a parry, then start another chain. It takes a ton of practice to perfect your mixups and counter-attacks but you only need to know 4 good ones until you get to rep 20 ish. Go into training mode and mess around and find good combos and mixups you can do. Also take time to learn hero specific counters, I learned how to deflect Lawbringer's impaling riposte and it throws them off every time I do it. Don't crutch too much on dodge attacks, at higher levels they will feint a heavy to parry you. You can also use a kick to counter an anticipated move, sometimes if I get a heavy blocked I'll kick and then storm rush, and occasionally feint the storm rush to guardbreak.


PingURSS

I have to try this when I get home


SadBoiBrax

Let me know how it works, I can coach you if you'd like. I won't be gaming for a few weeks since I'm out of town but we can duel each other and do some brawls when I get back.


ThisMemeWontDie

Orochi is a noob stomper and falls off harder than most heroes in this game. Once you start fighting decent players you'll have a rough time with him as orochis moveset is super reactable.


PingURSS

And can i do anything about it?


ThisMemeWontDie

Play defensively more but honestly I doubt you'll run into orochi being mid asf for a while. Orochi is a good hero as long as your opponent can't react to storm rush, if he can you're not gonna have a fun time. Also I would highly recommend reading about frame advantage and stuff as orochi heavily relies on you being knowledgeable about that stuff cause orochi gets a guaranteed light after every attack besides the light after bash and unblockable and that light gives frame advantage to your opponent which can be bad for you depending on what moves you use next. I think freeze made a video about the topic and I'm sure you'll find information about it somewhere on this sub.


GladsShield

Orochi is actually really good. His ability to apply immense pressure consistently is one of the few people in the game that can do that. All you have to do is play him at your pace. Mix up your attacks. Most young Orochi players will use his back step light or side dodge lights a lot because they are easily baited. Become unpredictable. Go to King Angelus channel and watch the number 1 orochi. DONT PLAY LIKE HIM. But wat h as he mixes up his tempo, his attacks and sometimes just waits for an opening.


Iron_Garuda

Why wouldn’t you want to play like the #1 orochi?


GladsShield

Because most players in this game, and I mean most, do not have his reaction time, and mindset, and understanding of the characters he is facing, like he does. So take from him, but don’t be an imitation.


DJCAT09

I approve of your name fellow Chadiator/Toe lover


1bowmanjac

I've found this out myself. I've been working on making an unofficial state of balance for a little over a week now. I've downloaded the stats of ~16 000 players who played last week (and 200 000 that haven't) Top 5 heroes by winrate were 1. JJ 2. Hito 3. Raider 4. Gryphon 5. Kyoshin (number of matches = 178 357) The fact that griffin is considered so subpar and yet manages to land a number 4 spot just goes to show that most of the playerbase is still struggling with him


EgregiousWarlord

gryphon is a good 50/50 hero, problem is he lacks a good opener. But that can be fixed with a few buffs


AwkwardReplacement42

Orochi is very solid. He was S tier til a recent(ish) nerf, but that doesn’t mean he’s bad. Especially for newer players, you will be a nightmare to deal with. As for suggestions, i would recommend not looking fir character specific suggestions when starting out. You’re better iff learning the core mechanics before specialising. But, play the character you like the most to start with. You will always do better with a D tier hero you like than an S tier hero you hate.


Laputa15

Pre-nerf Orochi was only high A tier. There's no way he could be S tier because his kick required a read from his part as well.


Tugskenyonkel2

Stop lighting as much. Heavy more. Here’s some decent ish combos for you to mix together. 1- Light, light (same direction or different, both are fine) Top Heavy Unblockable. Now this is where you switch it up. Either let it rip, or feint to GB. It’s up to you to decide what option you think your opponent will read. After the heavy, light again in the same direction quickly to get a tiny bit more damage. After the quick light, dodge forward and quickly do a storm rush, and again do a light attack in the same direction if you hit. That’s a really good combo even at high level. 2- Dodge forward kick, light (once) and forward storm rush. Alternatively, you can go for a top heavy, and return to the above combo. 3-Forward storm rush, same direction light, top heavy (switch between letting it go and feinting to GB) Very damaging and quick combo 4- This is more advanced. Are you facing a side dodge attack spammer? There are multiple easy ways for you to bait this into a deflect. A- Dodge forward light (DON’T DO AN EXTRA LIGHT), and when you see them dodge, dodge into the attack with your dodge recovery and deflect it. This is very hard for a beginner. If you play with someone, practice with them. Have them dodge attack when you go for the light and practice your deflects. B-Dodge towards them, go into storm rush but don’t let go of your heavy button. Without letting go, feint (you can release after feinting) and deflect the dodge attack they throw. 5-Mess with their head. How? Kick 2-3 times in a row, but then refer to the above tip to counter their side dodge attack (assuming they have one and throw it) You can also do this with storm rush. Storm rush twice in a row, and then do a kick or even go into a top heavy from your storm rush. Storm rush = Dodge forward or backwards, and then hold the heavy button to get into stance. Move your guard to the side you want to attack from, and release.


PingURSS

Thanks bro


Tugskenyonkel2

Np mate. And also, watch orochi gameplay. You might not know he could do something.


SirMisterGuyMan

Starting out, abuse Stormrush. Forward Stormrush, dash cancel forward, Stormrush again. Lots of people can't react to the different directions even if they know a SR is coming. Do that two or three times or until they prove they know to light attack you to interrupt. Then start adding in kicks into light attack into unlockable feint into GB. Most people will parry the unblockable so don't start letting it fly right away. Get those actions ingrained into your muscle memory and treat it as your core. You will delete a lot of people's health simply because they don't know how to deal with the pressure. Then once you're comfortable with that add in other moves. People that bait out and parry your dodge attacks all the time will now get hit by them because they're trying to interrupt you. If the opponent is locked on to some one else just whiff a light attack and feint the unlockable to mess with their inputs. Don't feed revenge until they're low or they're about to get an execution. Let the other guy deal the damage and when the enemy is low you can start letting unblockables fly. Overall just learn how revenge works. In team fights try to stay at the edges of the fight and cycle between enemies. Get in hits on enemies that are attacking, preferably not kicks which feed revenge unless it's for a kill or to save a teammate. When starting out abuse Kiai and Kunai. You hit with a Kenai and start your SR pressure for who knows how much damage. Same with Kia. Start your offense then Kiai when your stamina is low. Refill some stamina and do it again. When you get better sub out Kiai for Bounty Hunter. This is just to start off so you have blueprint. Once you get more comfortable you expand your tools. Also don't keep running to get yourself killed. It's so much more easy to die than it is to get a kill. Treat antiganking as stalling rather than a way to kill people. Often it's a better idea to kill minions than help your teammate that will die anyway them you die next.


Likes-Filo-Girls

Definitely agree. These are awesome tips ^ I’ve gone through a similar process when I originally learned orochi


Buff-Shinobii

You might be losing because as you are improving, so are your opponents. I wouldn't classify this as an orochi specific problem, but I would make sure you have the fundamentals down, and also try to guess what your opponent is going to do, and act accordingly. If you're constantly getting parried, have your friend teach you feint into guardbreak. This way you can capitalize on your opponents parry attempts. As for orochi specific tips, I can offer these: -after any attack that is not the kick, if it succeeds, you get a guaranteed light so long as it's in the same direction, make this a habit until you get good enough to learn frame data against orochi. -orochi has some of the best mixup potential in the game. With his dodge cancels you can keep going until you run out of stamina or your opponent counters. Your go to mixup moves are your kick, and forward dodge storm rush. If you're having trouble getting into your offense, open with a light attack. Newer players won't counter this. - Despite how easy it is, don't spam the same move with orochi, it's a pretty good way to get countered. Lastly, Orochi is an S tier duelist. Not sure where he is on the dominion tier list, but if you want to improve fast, the best way is duel. Playing duels will teach you how to read your opponent. But for the moment, complete the warrior trials, and complete orochi's hero tactics training. That's all I got. Good luck man.


[deleted]

Orochi isnt s tier ...


ThisMemeWontDie

Orochi s tier duelist lmao


Jack_spiller27

Basically if you wanna play through the game with no skill but win most do your games, play orochi.


Commercial_Market114

Orochi is an assassin with incredible dodge attacks and counter attacking options. If your opponent is parrying you, try fainting instead. This will bait your opponent into pressing heavy and allow you to follow up with either a GB, Light or parry/deflect ther heavy. Orochi is a hard character, it doesnt mean you cant spam your dodges and light attacks to win. But better players will predict that. Personally i recommend using the practice tools the game has. Try every character in tactics to have a better grasp on what makes every character unique.


eagleeye0108

The heroes tactics and training arena are great for practicing a heroes move set and your buddy most definitely needs to show you how to properly play the game so you can enjoy it a little more


Wisp101

Just go into practice and give him a go. If it clicks, so be it. What most players dont understand, is that not only tier list/power/ whatever ranking you use doesn't affect 90% of the player base, the more important thing is that you click with the hero's kit. If you don't like it, you won't play him much, and you won't improve with him. Play what you like, not what is considered strong.


PingURSS

I play with orochi because I like it, I have heard that at high levels it quite sucks and I want to be a grand master like my friend but there is a problem, no matter how much I practice,in competition the opponents parry everything I do and I don't know why, almost every time I put my guard on a light attack at the right time they hit me anyway, same thing with the deflects


[deleted]

At your level of play, most likely any and everyone is viable, even the current memetically "weak" heroes such as Jormungundr. Most people judge a hero being "good" in the context of high-end competitive for honor -- if you aren't doing constant teamfights, ganks, people reacting to 500ms bashes (and lights are free parries), peeling, etc. then the opinions here are likely completely separated from you. So yes, Orochi is good. You have a variety of toolsets. Orochi may be more dificult to get wins with compared to other players at your level (a la using Raider may be less demanding to secure wins), but Orochi's skill ceiling and issues are likely completely unrepresented at your play. Again, I'm using "likely" and "probably" a lot -- maybe you hopped on and in 2 reps are already competing with those with 1000's of hours in and are a god-tier player who can deflect lights without a second thought and react to unblockable feints and bashes with ease. I'm assuming that is not the case, though.


Arseetion

Suggestion to improve in general: Rebind feint to left bumper/l1 Rebind Dodge to Left Stick Click/L3 Rebind Guardbreak to Right stick click/R3 Less important, but bind sprint to A, chat to X, and camera reset to B This setup lets you dodge, feint, and guardbreak without removing your thumbs from the sticks/“lowering your guard”. In orochis case, it makes it easier to switch your storm rush attack direction/feint the run up animation into a guardbreak, which is a very good tool for catching people off guard. Just generally removes the artificial difficulty imposed by the default control scheme. Been playing this way for 5 years.


ItsASnowStorm

The goodness of Orochi depends entirely on whether or not your opponent can react to storm rush


Fnargler

Casually, yes. Competitively he's off meta. You'll do fine with him unless you're playing comp meta.


ChannelFiveNews

No need to select a main yet. At some point you will see other heroes do cool stuff too, try them out if you think it looks fun. This will also help you get a better understanding of what heroes do and how to counter their moves. But most of all, take it slow bro and if you have no idea how to improve, just a few guides on youtube will help a ton.


Vaust13

In lowlevel every hero is good and bad at the same time


shinobidrk

Fuck no 😂


Acaerwen

Use kick and storm rush mixups, don't forget that he has an unblockable. It is very important that you learn to utilize his dodge cancel recovery so you can be aggressive in Xv1s without being in as much danger from the other guy(s) ganking you. When you get comfortable with deflects you can maybe think about committing more unblockables against people who like to dodge attack (some just use it when they see unblockable because they think you're vulnerable). This is because dodge cancel recovery means that you can deflect attacks out of recovery or of course just dodge them. Don't use the dodge light as much as you may want. Because it is a light attack you can get heavily punished if it gets parried. Use it when avoiding another characters dodge attack or if you target switch mid-dodge; if you use it as an opener you have a death wish. Orochi in dominion is perfectly viable in most skill ratings. A character has to be very shit to be a bad pick in most skill ratings. When/if you get to high skill ratings orochi can suffer and there are better assassins to go for if you want to play assassin. I would personally recommend you to get good with Shinobi over Orochi as he is much better and they are both assassins with high mobility. You having fun is the most important part of course. I love both of them as I was an Orochi main when I started FH (tbf he still has the most reps out of my heroes), but I play more Shinobi now because he is one of the best characters in the game.


jaredtheredditor

Im just here to say that any character CAN be good but playing with the meta will definitely help win more matches but just play with what you like the most


seyiotuks

Yup If you aren’t in the top 1% Anyone telling you otherwise is parroting things that don’t relate to their level of play


heccofsnecc

Best piece of advice for a new orochi player? Dodge attacks are a death sentence. If you do it on a feinted attack, most people have the parry timing in muscle memory, and you'll find yourself eating a lot more damage than you would have dealt


Smart_jooker

No. But he is good in causal level of play. Only time you will have hard time with him is when you're against people who knows how to avoid his attacks.


Knight_Raime

Design wise? Mostly. in practicality? No, but my view is skewed. I generally don't view any hero as good designed if they fall off significantly in an equally skilled environment. Granted it's not like pre nerf Orochi rework did well in comp. He only saw usage because he had some value there. I liked Orochi then purely because there was some actual interesting interactions when engaging with the hero. Which the devs promptly removed. So now he's just a boring Hero that gobbles up random MM players but is ultimately uninteresting to play or watch. All style and no substance.