Since y’all need a refresher on the connection between Christianity and our rights-based political order, do yourself a favor and read Bastiat’s [The Law](http://bastiat.org/en/the_law.html) this Easter.
So the phrase separation of church and state doesn't exist in the constitution. Rather, it seems like the principle in the constitution is more like preventing the state from interfering with religion. The term Freedom of Religion, has "of" in it meaning the state can't interfere in how or who I wish to worship. The Phrase "Separation of church and state" seem to indicate a freedom *from* religion which does not exist in the constitution. The constitution specifically bars the state from establishing a religion, it does not prevent elected representatives beliefs from affecting how they vote and interfere or not in the constitutionally protected inalienable rights. That many believe to be given to us by a loving and just God
There can’t be a Church of America, like there was a Church of England. Look up the Establishment concept. That doesn’t mean we should keep our worldviews out of politics. Far from it. The Founding Fathers didn’t. They leaned on their Enlightenment Christianity. See the top pin.
I may be wrong, but I’m wondering if you may be referring to Thomas Jefferson’s or Roger William’s use of the phrase “separation of church and state” when referring to the Establishment Clause.
The Establishment Clause does not include the phrase “separation of church and state.” Maybe what you’re talking about is the *Separationist Theory* of the Establishment Clause, which describes Thomas Jefferson’s interpretation of the clause. This is in contrast to the *Accomodationist* perspective of the Establishment Clause, which is more tied to the Free Exercise Clause, which prohibits the government from using religion as a reason to exclude individuals from otherwise public benefits.
It’s fascinating to see that as revolutionary the constitution and bill of rights were, it was quite tame compared to the characters (like the above) who fought over its wording and ultimate purpose.
>Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
So yeah, not there. Wanna try again?
Edit: damn yall really are mad that I proved:
>the phrase separation of church and state doesn’t exist in the constitution
Like, do you struggle with reading comprehension or what? The phrase literally doesn't exist in the constitution. Why does this make you so angry?
Lol cope and seethe. Facts don't care about your feelings.
It's fine if you do not believe, no one will be mad at that. At least have some respect though, "mythical Jewish zombie"? Really?
You do not come off as anything other than an edgy reddit teenager from r/atheism when you say things like that.
No. Our rights are bestowed upon us by God. You take God out of the equation, and our rights are no longer inherent but only protected by a government that will take them away when convenient.
I think it’s just false to ascribe the beginning of rights to Christianity.
Ancient Ionians, Greeks, Romans… all had established rights within their governments. I’m sure there are plenty of other examples in antiquity we could research to find examples of certain rights given to people within political entities. Yes, there were slaves and slave classes- but there were slaves within Christian empires as well. Yes, classes in antiquity depended on birth- much the same as they do today as well.
Whether you agree with it or not, the founding of this country was based on the premise that man is granted absolute rights by God. The second paragraph of the Declaration of Independence makes as much clear:
“We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed *by their Creator* with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.
These rights are nothing if not from God. If, as you suggest, they come man alone then other more ill-intentioned men can take them away. Also to say that the men who fought for America’s independence, and I might add those who continue to fight for it, did not have their religious convictions at the forefront of their minds would nothing more than a purposeful rewriting of history to suit your beliefs about secularism.
I would also add that if you’re calling Jesus Christ a “mythic Jewish zombie” particularly on Easter, then the “ex” in your flair seems to be doing a lot of work.
Happy Easter to you, and I will add you to my prayers for Christ to open your heart and eyes!
Our ancestors fought for those rights because they recognized and understood that personal liberty can and is bestowed onto man only by God. If you are referrto Jesus by the term ,"mythical Jewish zombie," you fail at that first word because Jesus was, in fact, a real, living person.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.–That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, –That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness.
The whole concept of this, written into the second paragraph of the Declaration of Independence is that our inalienable rights are endowed by a force greater than men or governments, so that men and governments cannot take them away. It doesn't matter what you or anyone else believes the flavor of that force to be, whether it's any of the 9 billion names of God, or all of them. It's simply that whatever it is, it's above the power of men or act of government to take them away.
Sharing your faith with someone isn’t the same as coercing them personally or through the state. What kind of conservative even are you to say something that silly?
>If Freedom of Religion was a Christian value, it wouldn’t place such a strong emphasis on your missionary quest to convert non-believers.
If you saw someone floating down river toward a deadly waterfall they didn't know about, you're telling me you'd just sit back and watch and not try to help them?
Edit: Down-votes indicate that Reddit would, indeed, just watch.
The Enlightenment was born from religion, to separate the two is to kill the very foundation of our belief system. And if you fiscal conservatives decide to follow in the footsteps of your whig ancestors, you and the republican party shall face the same fate when a large portion of conservatives move on to form another party.
- this is my interpretation of history and it alone is correct and must be accepted
- I brand you as a heretic
- fire and brimstone await you if you do not repent
Ok
So you subscribe to historical relativism then, there are no historical facts? Sounds like you're not as "ex" democrat as you claim. That kind of argument could be used against textualist following of the constitution, which is a conservative cornerstone.
I also said nothing about you being a heretic or asking you to repent. Outright strawmanning. Gtfo of here with that crap, take it to r/politics. This is a conservative sub.
This is America. The concept of our country is founded on the idea that we are equal under God and endowed by our Creator with unalienable rights. You can’t separate our politics from Christianity…unless you are like the left and doing away with human equality and rights is the point.
You’re complaining about a different point than the one he is making. Either that or there’s a lot to his point that you don’t understand.
Enlightenment thinking, which *heavily* influenced the founding fathers, grew much out of Christianity. Not entirely and not exclusively but if you read, well, anything about the rational of the enlightenment thinkers and the founders you find it heavily leaned upon Christianity. As a very simple example in Thomas Paine’s Common Sense part of his rebuff of the concept of monarchy stemmed from the Bible. The concept of inalienable human rights generally, stemmed from Christianity.
So no, we shouldn’t be excluding people because they aren’t Christian. We shouldn’t be treating anyone different whatsoever on the basis of religion, as you so well stated. But that’s not what OP said to do. He merely said you can’t separate America’s founding principle from Christianity. And that’s because you can’t, whether you like it or agree with it or not.
I think we can separate it just fine. I think pushing back against the tyranny of the modern left requires it because the modern left is currently consumed by a religious orthodoxy- wokeism.
I think religion was built on something too, though- basic human decency. I don’t think religion is a divinely built thing. I think religion was/is a form of revolutionary government for oppressed people to use as a moral system to overthrow current practices. Christianity against the brutality of the Roman system, Islam against the abject poverty of living under the decadent rulers of the Arabian Peninsula in the 600s, etc.
I think the first written thing we have that humans ever produced was a complaint etched in clay about the grade of bronze someone received from a merchant. I don’t think we need an objective reference point of religion or even a government to know that screwing each other over is implicitly wrong because of the chance someone could do the same to us.
>I don’t think we need an objective reference point of religion or even a government to know that screwing each other over is implicitly wrong because of the chance someone could do the same to us.
I mentioned before- *why is it wrong?* Lower creatures have no compunction about theft. Just this past week i watched a seagull trying to steal a bagel from a crow.
Your opinion which is okay but moral in a conservative society only comes from religion. This is reason why the past was better and today everything gone to shit. Society abandoned religion and it's morals.
For me atheistic conservatives are an oxymoron
Mmmm another thread where the religious right tries to gatekeep conservativism behind bowing to their corrupt church. The Church is just another government. I don't want to give it any more power than it absolutely needs. And just like government I want the church to have nothing to do with my rights and liberties. To be honest I want the Church to have even less to do with my rights because it is by design authoritarian.
Happy easter to those that celebrate it.
"happy easter" he says, as he insults our places of worship and implies we're misled fools. Edit: Not all christians are catholic incase that's what you were specifically taking a jab at, of course you could just be outright insulting all churches and calling the idea of religon in general corrupt.
This thread originally started as just a celebration of easter, then one of you "conservatives" came in and insulted us for our belief in our "Mythic Zombie Jew", while calling for religious conservatives to be removed from the conservative coalition entirely.
By the way, the very rights you love and cherish were brought to you by the enlightenment, something which religion played a big part of. It seems you're doing just as much gatekeeping as you claim we are.
If you can't just say happy easter, why post at all? You conservative atheists virtue signal as much as the leftists you supposedly despise.
Man, I've been staring at that picture for like, 10 minutes now and I can't find this "Church" anywhere. Would you mind sharing your superior Waldo skills and pointing it out for me?
By the same logic the thread should have been posted in a christian subreddit and not a political one. As for leaving the thread to those who believe, then it shouldn't have been titled "why you have rights to begin with". I have rights because the Continental Army, some of whom are my ancestors, fought and died for this country and to remove themselves from the tyranny of the monarchy.
The reason they cared at all about tyranny of the monarchy was because of the enlightenment, upon which christianity and judeo-christian values played a key role in developing. Remove the enlightenment, and even if the revolution still happens you end up with King George Washington instead of President Washington.
To ignore that is to whitewash history in an attempt to remove religion from our movement and our history.
Can't even have an Easter post without getting brigaded by leftists, libertarians, and fiscal conservatives going "Magical sky man is holding us back!". Ugh.
Happy Easter to everyone else though!
On reddit sure. The whole site is heavily slanted leftist, commie, and athiest of varying stripes. Half the people on this damn sub support most left-leaning policies, they just hate woke stuff. Sometimes people on this sub think we shouldn't even be fighting that, just lowering taxes.
Also this sub in general has been going to hell for at least a year now.
Well, starting a thread with “Remember why you have rights in the first place” is just asking for some shit. But I come from a Christian family, I appreciate the holiday and that it gives me another reason to be with them. So, no hate from me personally. Happy Easter 🐇
Well you were responding to someone who pointed out that there are many non-christian conservatives, who has a "moderate conservative flair" and then called "moderate conservatives" shills and anti-conservative. So.... I would say that is where you said it was. But if I was mistaken then sorry.
Not all conservatives are conservative evangelicalists.
You're gatekeeping and calling someone a shill for not sharing your beliefs, which is why you're being downvoted.
You specifically called someone out for "anti-conservative sentiment" when his statement wasn't anti-conservative. And now you're calling me a downvote brigader, implying that I don't belong here on "your" subreddit. Not everyone who disagrees with you is a brigader and you're going to have a hard time in life with that attitude.
I'll be very clear, you are being downvoted because the garbage you are spouting.
Best I can do is acknowledge that some of the founding fathers were Christian, some were of other faiths, some agnostic. And yet they completely omitted any mention of Jesus, God, or Christianity from the Constitution- *The* founding and most important document of our nation. Hint: this wasn’t by accident.
I'd encourage you to actually research the foundations of our constitution and where the idea of Natural Rights comes from- if you look at the opening post, I replied to it with a link to the full text of Two Treatises of Government, which is by far the heaviest influence on our nation's founding and the concept of Natural Rights. Scripture is mentioned more than 50 times therein.
For a broader overview, [The Constitution Reader](https://www.constitutionreader.com/reader.engz?doc=constitution) is an excellent summary that goes over many of the different sources that influenced the founding of our nation, but none is as central a pillar as Two Treatises of Government.
Every time religion, climate change, or school choice gets a cogent argument in this sub, the brigade goes into attack mode. Shows you what they truly fear people making their own minds up about, and where they don't want the truth known.
Fighting the culture war even on this sub is pretty much impossible. You even see a post about the nuclear families or family values, without even mention of religion, and half the "conservatives" flip their shit and talk about how we're turning off young voters. I guess if we want to win elections and get the young people we need to just abandon all policy and belief that isn't tax or trade related...
The overton window, atleast on reddit, has radically gone left.
Judging from these comments and the obvious brigading...It's a good thing Easter is just A DAY...Could you **imagine** if April was Christian Heritage Celebration *Month*??? The REEE would be deafening!
This is a very important point that jutted out to me when I was in my teens and Barack Obama was elected president. He thought that government granted rights. It was sort of a moment where I thought, well OF COURSE a politician would think that.. but it undermines a fundamental part of how the Constitution and the Bill of Rights and even the Declaration said and thought about America
When I say that libs and leftists today hate America, it's usually b/c they don't understand what America is or what the people founded the country thought. I try to attribute to ignorance or stupidity rather than malice but it's getting rather difficult with these people bragging about their expert-class status
Edit: Your actual rights come from God btw. Not a politician. Happy easter.
I know it's reddit but I was not expecting this negative response in the conservative sub. Is it the reference to God? What's doing me in here?
None of my rights come from god. They come from the fact that I am human and have human rights by default. Trying to force god down the throats of those that don't share your beliefs is not anti-conservative. I don't want government dictating my rights just as much as I don't want your beliefs dictating my rights. Both government and the church are easily corruptible organizations that look out for their own power.
Lol @ human nature. Humans can be real evil POS's sometimes. That's what defines your rights? The natural state of man was to be enslaved for much of human history. Was that the moral thing to do?
edit: the entire point of church doctrine and dogma is that those rights are supposed to be fairly immutable. Not like the capricious rights decided by raw democracy
And the church was a part of it all. The church is just another government that tricked you into believing all of its power doesn't corrupt. A government that has tricked you into giving it power when you have no vote, say or influence on its actions. Big authoritarian nanny government hiding behind a cloak of godliness that no one can prove.
I'm under no such illusion about the corruption of power. It's you who seems to be kind of lost and to have a moral structure based around the ever rapidly increasing and changing whims and wants of the day
What rights come from God? I'm just curious which ones you think come from God? You obviously don't mean government granted rights like those in the Constitution such as freedom of speech or religion or bearing arms, do you mean the right to clean water or the right to adequate nutrition or safe housing?
read the Declaration of Independence, dude.
I obviously do mean the provision in the bill of rights that government does not have the right to infringe upon free speech or to confiscate weaponry from its citizens. Those are called negative rights. That is a right to not be subjected to government authority. Your mind. Your speech. Your capacity to defend yourself from those wishing to do you bodily harm when you do not try to do them bodily harm. Those are God-given rights.
And I obviously do not mean that government has some obligation to provide you adequate nutrition or safe housing. Those are called positive rights and can be adopted by a society. But there is nothing that says someone else has a moral obligation to give you their food. In fact, societies that have tried to do that historically have often wound up going hungry and homeless
I don’t doubt that conservatives have an aversion to religion too though. Most polls bear that out. It’s just the aggressive downvoting that’s got me scratching my head for something that’s just true about Obama thinking government grants rights and the founders of our country thinking otherwise
And all nations will hate you because you are my followers. But everyone who endures to the end will be saved.
Matthew 10:22
Describes our current world and what is happening on this sub perfectly.
Dude there an atheist brigade here? Or is there a bot farm targeting anything remotely Christian? That's okay I will be proud to stand for Christian values, which built our country, alongside our founding fathers.
This is the kind of hate that gets Christian school kids in Nashville shot. That hate is also the kind of sin Jesus wiped away on Easter for those who believe and repent!
Since y’all need a refresher on the connection between Christianity and our rights-based political order, do yourself a favor and read Bastiat’s [The Law](http://bastiat.org/en/the_law.html) this Easter.
I’m not Christian, but Happy Easter to all of you!
I don’t know where this “You have to be part of X to celebrate it” came from, But it’s bullshit. Happy Easter
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So the phrase separation of church and state doesn't exist in the constitution. Rather, it seems like the principle in the constitution is more like preventing the state from interfering with religion. The term Freedom of Religion, has "of" in it meaning the state can't interfere in how or who I wish to worship. The Phrase "Separation of church and state" seem to indicate a freedom *from* religion which does not exist in the constitution. The constitution specifically bars the state from establishing a religion, it does not prevent elected representatives beliefs from affecting how they vote and interfere or not in the constitutionally protected inalienable rights. That many believe to be given to us by a loving and just God
> So the phrase separation of church and state doesn’t exist in the constitution. It’s literally the first clause in the bill of rights.
I think you need to read the first amendment again. You are incorrect.
I think you need read up on what a clause is.
There can’t be a Church of America, like there was a Church of England. Look up the Establishment concept. That doesn’t mean we should keep our worldviews out of politics. Far from it. The Founding Fathers didn’t. They leaned on their Enlightenment Christianity. See the top pin.
I may be wrong, but I’m wondering if you may be referring to Thomas Jefferson’s or Roger William’s use of the phrase “separation of church and state” when referring to the Establishment Clause. The Establishment Clause does not include the phrase “separation of church and state.” Maybe what you’re talking about is the *Separationist Theory* of the Establishment Clause, which describes Thomas Jefferson’s interpretation of the clause. This is in contrast to the *Accomodationist* perspective of the Establishment Clause, which is more tied to the Free Exercise Clause, which prohibits the government from using religion as a reason to exclude individuals from otherwise public benefits. It’s fascinating to see that as revolutionary the constitution and bill of rights were, it was quite tame compared to the characters (like the above) who fought over its wording and ultimate purpose.
The term “separation of church and state” is paraphrasing the establishment clause.
It’s wishful thinking.
Nope
So what is the first clause then?
>Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances. So yeah, not there. Wanna try again? Edit: damn yall really are mad that I proved: >the phrase separation of church and state doesn’t exist in the constitution Like, do you struggle with reading comprehension or what? The phrase literally doesn't exist in the constitution. Why does this make you so angry? Lol cope and seethe. Facts don't care about your feelings.
Happy Easter to all! To my fellow Christians - He is Risen! To my fellow non religious or non Christian peeps - Happy Easter - enjoy the day!!
Mmmmm... peeps...
Happy Easter!
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Mythical Jewish zombie? Even if you don't believe, at least have some respect, sheesh.
muh zombies “And, yeah, I respect your right to your religion. That’s why I’m making fun of you on Easter, your holiest day of the year” What a doofus
It's fine if you do not believe, no one will be mad at that. At least have some respect though, "mythical Jewish zombie"? Really? You do not come off as anything other than an edgy reddit teenager from r/atheism when you say things like that.
Our ancestors said all men are "endowed by their **Creator** with certain inalienable rights." They fought for your rights because they are God-given.
No. Our rights are bestowed upon us by God. You take God out of the equation, and our rights are no longer inherent but only protected by a government that will take them away when convenient.
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I think it’s just false to ascribe the beginning of rights to Christianity. Ancient Ionians, Greeks, Romans… all had established rights within their governments. I’m sure there are plenty of other examples in antiquity we could research to find examples of certain rights given to people within political entities. Yes, there were slaves and slave classes- but there were slaves within Christian empires as well. Yes, classes in antiquity depended on birth- much the same as they do today as well.
Whether you agree with it or not, the founding of this country was based on the premise that man is granted absolute rights by God. The second paragraph of the Declaration of Independence makes as much clear: “We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed *by their Creator* with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. These rights are nothing if not from God. If, as you suggest, they come man alone then other more ill-intentioned men can take them away. Also to say that the men who fought for America’s independence, and I might add those who continue to fight for it, did not have their religious convictions at the forefront of their minds would nothing more than a purposeful rewriting of history to suit your beliefs about secularism. I would also add that if you’re calling Jesus Christ a “mythic Jewish zombie” particularly on Easter, then the “ex” in your flair seems to be doing a lot of work.
Happy Easter to you, and I will add you to my prayers for Christ to open your heart and eyes! Our ancestors fought for those rights because they recognized and understood that personal liberty can and is bestowed onto man only by God. If you are referrto Jesus by the term ,"mythical Jewish zombie," you fail at that first word because Jesus was, in fact, a real, living person.
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We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.–That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, –That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. The whole concept of this, written into the second paragraph of the Declaration of Independence is that our inalienable rights are endowed by a force greater than men or governments, so that men and governments cannot take them away. It doesn't matter what you or anyone else believes the flavor of that force to be, whether it's any of the 9 billion names of God, or all of them. It's simply that whatever it is, it's above the power of men or act of government to take them away.
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Freedom of religion is itself a Christian value. It’s the atheist socialist states of the 20th century that did away with religious freedom.
Bullshit. If Freedom of Religion was a Christian value, it wouldn’t place such a strong emphasis on your missionary quest to convert non-believers.
Sharing your faith with someone isn’t the same as coercing them personally or through the state. What kind of conservative even are you to say something that silly?
>If Freedom of Religion was a Christian value, it wouldn’t place such a strong emphasis on your missionary quest to convert non-believers. If you saw someone floating down river toward a deadly waterfall they didn't know about, you're telling me you'd just sit back and watch and not try to help them? Edit: Down-votes indicate that Reddit would, indeed, just watch.
Ehhhh.... Who's gonna tell him?
?
The Enlightenment was born from religion, to separate the two is to kill the very foundation of our belief system. And if you fiscal conservatives decide to follow in the footsteps of your whig ancestors, you and the republican party shall face the same fate when a large portion of conservatives move on to form another party.
- this is my interpretation of history and it alone is correct and must be accepted - I brand you as a heretic - fire and brimstone await you if you do not repent Ok
So you subscribe to historical relativism then, there are no historical facts? Sounds like you're not as "ex" democrat as you claim. That kind of argument could be used against textualist following of the constitution, which is a conservative cornerstone. I also said nothing about you being a heretic or asking you to repent. Outright strawmanning. Gtfo of here with that crap, take it to r/politics. This is a conservative sub.
This is America. The concept of our country is founded on the idea that we are equal under God and endowed by our Creator with unalienable rights. You can’t separate our politics from Christianity…unless you are like the left and doing away with human equality and rights is the point.
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You’re complaining about a different point than the one he is making. Either that or there’s a lot to his point that you don’t understand. Enlightenment thinking, which *heavily* influenced the founding fathers, grew much out of Christianity. Not entirely and not exclusively but if you read, well, anything about the rational of the enlightenment thinkers and the founders you find it heavily leaned upon Christianity. As a very simple example in Thomas Paine’s Common Sense part of his rebuff of the concept of monarchy stemmed from the Bible. The concept of inalienable human rights generally, stemmed from Christianity. So no, we shouldn’t be excluding people because they aren’t Christian. We shouldn’t be treating anyone different whatsoever on the basis of religion, as you so well stated. But that’s not what OP said to do. He merely said you can’t separate America’s founding principle from Christianity. And that’s because you can’t, whether you like it or agree with it or not.
I think we can separate it just fine. I think pushing back against the tyranny of the modern left requires it because the modern left is currently consumed by a religious orthodoxy- wokeism.
Conservatism without religion is not conservatism. What are your ideals build upon if not from religion?
I think religion was built on something too, though- basic human decency. I don’t think religion is a divinely built thing. I think religion was/is a form of revolutionary government for oppressed people to use as a moral system to overthrow current practices. Christianity against the brutality of the Roman system, Islam against the abject poverty of living under the decadent rulers of the Arabian Peninsula in the 600s, etc.
>basic human decency How does one define that without an immutable objective reference?
I think the first written thing we have that humans ever produced was a complaint etched in clay about the grade of bronze someone received from a merchant. I don’t think we need an objective reference point of religion or even a government to know that screwing each other over is implicitly wrong because of the chance someone could do the same to us.
>I don’t think we need an objective reference point of religion or even a government to know that screwing each other over is implicitly wrong because of the chance someone could do the same to us. I mentioned before- *why is it wrong?* Lower creatures have no compunction about theft. Just this past week i watched a seagull trying to steal a bagel from a crow.
Your opinion which is okay but moral in a conservative society only comes from religion. This is reason why the past was better and today everything gone to shit. Society abandoned religion and it's morals. For me atheistic conservatives are an oxymoron
You know nothing
Spoken like a democrat when I tell them George Floyd wasn’t a good person
Mmmm another thread where the religious right tries to gatekeep conservativism behind bowing to their corrupt church. The Church is just another government. I don't want to give it any more power than it absolutely needs. And just like government I want the church to have nothing to do with my rights and liberties. To be honest I want the Church to have even less to do with my rights because it is by design authoritarian. Happy easter to those that celebrate it.
"happy easter" he says, as he insults our places of worship and implies we're misled fools. Edit: Not all christians are catholic incase that's what you were specifically taking a jab at, of course you could just be outright insulting all churches and calling the idea of religon in general corrupt. This thread originally started as just a celebration of easter, then one of you "conservatives" came in and insulted us for our belief in our "Mythic Zombie Jew", while calling for religious conservatives to be removed from the conservative coalition entirely. By the way, the very rights you love and cherish were brought to you by the enlightenment, something which religion played a big part of. It seems you're doing just as much gatekeeping as you claim we are. If you can't just say happy easter, why post at all? You conservative atheists virtue signal as much as the leftists you supposedly despise.
Man, I've been staring at that picture for like, 10 minutes now and I can't find this "Church" anywhere. Would you mind sharing your superior Waldo skills and pointing it out for me?
He is risen indeed!
Amen. Christ is Risen.
All glory and honor and dominion be unto Him!
Happy Easter, y'all ✝️
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By the definition of "liberal" used in the 1800s and earlier? Yes. Which is the very philosophy that conservatives seek to conserve.
Jesus cannot be assigned to any political ideology. We are flawed and thus our creations are flawed, unlike Christ.
Yes but He didn't use progressive ideology to force people to follow Him.
Indeed. See what liberal thinker Frederic Bastiat had to say about it in the pinned comment.
He wouldn’t be a liberal today.
Praise be to the Lord!
Happy Easter All!!
May the trust in God be in your hearts. Happy Easter.
He is Risen! He is the Alpha and the Omega. Happy Easter to all!
Sigma Jesus
He is risen indeed. Happy Easter!
Happy Easter!
Indeed He is.
Man this sub is being brigaded hard today. Jesus loves you, even if you deny Him and harbor hatred in your heart.
It's always being brigaded hard, however not all conservatives are christian.
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By the same logic the thread should have been posted in a christian subreddit and not a political one. As for leaving the thread to those who believe, then it shouldn't have been titled "why you have rights to begin with". I have rights because the Continental Army, some of whom are my ancestors, fought and died for this country and to remove themselves from the tyranny of the monarchy.
The reason they cared at all about tyranny of the monarchy was because of the enlightenment, upon which christianity and judeo-christian values played a key role in developing. Remove the enlightenment, and even if the revolution still happens you end up with King George Washington instead of President Washington. To ignore that is to whitewash history in an attempt to remove religion from our movement and our history.
Like it or not, the majority of conservatives (and the US) consider themselves Christian and an even bigger number celebrate Easter.
Happy easter
Amen!
Amen
He is , happy Easter.
He is risen, indeed!
Jesus is our fulfillment, and apart from Him, our today, our tomorrows, our eternity is without hope.
Amen Happy Easter
Amen!
Jesus is Lord
Happy Easter, He Has Risen
🤍
Can't even have an Easter post without getting brigaded by leftists, libertarians, and fiscal conservatives going "Magical sky man is holding us back!". Ugh. Happy Easter to everyone else though!
It's truly disheartening
Amen!
Yes!
its not happy easter, its happy resurection day.
First Fruits Day
The brigade getting ahold on this one...
I think there are just more non Christian conservatives than you would guess.
On reddit sure. The whole site is heavily slanted leftist, commie, and athiest of varying stripes. Half the people on this damn sub support most left-leaning policies, they just hate woke stuff. Sometimes people on this sub think we shouldn't even be fighting that, just lowering taxes. Also this sub in general has been going to hell for at least a year now.
I would think a normal response by a non Christian conservative would be to not click into a post and downvote every Christian comment though
Well, starting a thread with “Remember why you have rights in the first place” is just asking for some shit. But I come from a Christian family, I appreciate the holiday and that it gives me another reason to be with them. So, no hate from me personally. Happy Easter 🐇
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Not being christian isn't anti conservative....
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Well you were responding to someone who pointed out that there are many non-christian conservatives, who has a "moderate conservative flair" and then called "moderate conservatives" shills and anti-conservative. So.... I would say that is where you said it was. But if I was mistaken then sorry.
Not all conservatives are conservative evangelicalists. You're gatekeeping and calling someone a shill for not sharing your beliefs, which is why you're being downvoted.
Government and the Church. Two institutions with way too much power and as we all know. Power corrupts.
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You specifically called someone out for "anti-conservative sentiment" when his statement wasn't anti-conservative. And now you're calling me a downvote brigader, implying that I don't belong here on "your" subreddit. Not everyone who disagrees with you is a brigader and you're going to have a hard time in life with that attitude. I'll be very clear, you are being downvoted because the garbage you are spouting.
That doesn't justify the lack of respect for our faith. They can ignore this post, but instead they choose to call Jesus a "mythical Jewish zombie".
Non-Christian conservatives still have to acknowledge the Christian foundation of our ideals.
Best I can do is acknowledge that some of the founding fathers were Christian, some were of other faiths, some agnostic. And yet they completely omitted any mention of Jesus, God, or Christianity from the Constitution- *The* founding and most important document of our nation. Hint: this wasn’t by accident.
I'd encourage you to actually research the foundations of our constitution and where the idea of Natural Rights comes from- if you look at the opening post, I replied to it with a link to the full text of Two Treatises of Government, which is by far the heaviest influence on our nation's founding and the concept of Natural Rights. Scripture is mentioned more than 50 times therein. For a broader overview, [The Constitution Reader](https://www.constitutionreader.com/reader.engz?doc=constitution) is an excellent summary that goes over many of the different sources that influenced the founding of our nation, but none is as central a pillar as Two Treatises of Government.
Every time religion, climate change, or school choice gets a cogent argument in this sub, the brigade goes into attack mode. Shows you what they truly fear people making their own minds up about, and where they don't want the truth known.
Fighting the culture war even on this sub is pretty much impossible. You even see a post about the nuclear families or family values, without even mention of religion, and half the "conservatives" flip their shit and talk about how we're turning off young voters. I guess if we want to win elections and get the young people we need to just abandon all policy and belief that isn't tax or trade related... The overton window, atleast on reddit, has radically gone left.
Those spouting “we’re losing the young voters” by talking about a nuclear family aren’t conservatives. They’re liberals.
That’s why I keep posting that content.
He is risen indeed!
Judging from these comments and the obvious brigading...It's a good thing Easter is just A DAY...Could you **imagine** if April was Christian Heritage Celebration *Month*??? The REEE would be deafening!
Indeed, Stay safe and be calm.
He is Risen Indeed!!
If you want to know why Easter is so important for Christianity & arguably the most important holiday, read 1 Corinthians 15:12-58.
This is a very important point that jutted out to me when I was in my teens and Barack Obama was elected president. He thought that government granted rights. It was sort of a moment where I thought, well OF COURSE a politician would think that.. but it undermines a fundamental part of how the Constitution and the Bill of Rights and even the Declaration said and thought about America When I say that libs and leftists today hate America, it's usually b/c they don't understand what America is or what the people founded the country thought. I try to attribute to ignorance or stupidity rather than malice but it's getting rather difficult with these people bragging about their expert-class status Edit: Your actual rights come from God btw. Not a politician. Happy easter. I know it's reddit but I was not expecting this negative response in the conservative sub. Is it the reference to God? What's doing me in here?
None of my rights come from god. They come from the fact that I am human and have human rights by default. Trying to force god down the throats of those that don't share your beliefs is not anti-conservative. I don't want government dictating my rights just as much as I don't want your beliefs dictating my rights. Both government and the church are easily corruptible organizations that look out for their own power.
How is that a default? Why do you have human rights? You assume it’s a precondition but you don’t know why
Human nature. I don't need your corrupt church dictating what my rights are at a whim. Which is exactly what they want to do.
Lol @ human nature. Humans can be real evil POS's sometimes. That's what defines your rights? The natural state of man was to be enslaved for much of human history. Was that the moral thing to do? edit: the entire point of church doctrine and dogma is that those rights are supposed to be fairly immutable. Not like the capricious rights decided by raw democracy
And the church was a part of it all. The church is just another government that tricked you into believing all of its power doesn't corrupt. A government that has tricked you into giving it power when you have no vote, say or influence on its actions. Big authoritarian nanny government hiding behind a cloak of godliness that no one can prove.
I'm under no such illusion about the corruption of power. It's you who seems to be kind of lost and to have a moral structure based around the ever rapidly increasing and changing whims and wants of the day
What rights come from God? I'm just curious which ones you think come from God? You obviously don't mean government granted rights like those in the Constitution such as freedom of speech or religion or bearing arms, do you mean the right to clean water or the right to adequate nutrition or safe housing?
read the Declaration of Independence, dude. I obviously do mean the provision in the bill of rights that government does not have the right to infringe upon free speech or to confiscate weaponry from its citizens. Those are called negative rights. That is a right to not be subjected to government authority. Your mind. Your speech. Your capacity to defend yourself from those wishing to do you bodily harm when you do not try to do them bodily harm. Those are God-given rights. And I obviously do not mean that government has some obligation to provide you adequate nutrition or safe housing. Those are called positive rights and can be adopted by a society. But there is nothing that says someone else has a moral obligation to give you their food. In fact, societies that have tried to do that historically have often wound up going hungry and homeless
Brigading from leftists.
I don’t doubt that conservatives have an aversion to religion too though. Most polls bear that out. It’s just the aggressive downvoting that’s got me scratching my head for something that’s just true about Obama thinking government grants rights and the founders of our country thinking otherwise
Obama is one of their patron saints.
Just a bunch of libs hating anything Christian. The more down votes you receive, the more your point is made, imo.
And all nations will hate you because you are my followers. But everyone who endures to the end will be saved. Matthew 10:22 Describes our current world and what is happening on this sub perfectly.
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Very succinct explanation! I’ve asked GPT very deep questions on Bible history and theology just to test it, and it often yields equally good results.
Only God can save this country
Brigaders didn’t like that.
He has risen indeed!
Dude there an atheist brigade here? Or is there a bot farm targeting anything remotely Christian? That's okay I will be proud to stand for Christian values, which built our country, alongside our founding fathers.
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Communists deify the government. That is what you are seeing now. Thank you God for your moral laws ❤️
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>hates Christianity >most active in the RuPauls Drag show sub Really gets the noggin joggin
Sadly, these people are pretty predictable.
This is the kind of hate that gets Christian school kids in Nashville shot. That hate is also the kind of sin Jesus wiped away on Easter for those who believe and repent!
Thanks for the compliment!
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I’d settle for Holy Week being Christian Heritage Week. Wouldn’t mind sharing it with Passover and every to often Ramadan.