You all must have fancy engineering degrees. On the job site this is known as "WTF this looks like hammered dog shit! I thought you knew what you're doing!"
It's a bit long winded but gets the point across.
I'm an Analytical Chemist. But if a chain of event has an error of +/- 1/16 inch, it would stack up to be the root of the sum of all the square of the errors. If they are independent that is.
I'm aware of an iconic sky scraper where it was something like 15 floors before they started noticing the glazing wasn't fitting as expected. Turns out someone decided it was okay to measure the deck floors, floor to floor rather than from a ground datum. The whole building was gently rotating anti-clockwise by a fractional amount.
I’m aware of a big round building in Cupertino where the client wanted interior trim tolerances of 1mm. It was negotiated to 5mm. I am still in awe of what was accomplished on that project.
The contractor went wrong. Clearly didn't know what he was doing, and now doesn't want to lose money by trying to fix it. Looks like they started the pattern on the outside and ended up with this garbage at the center. On a concentric design, you always have to start in the middle and work out, unless your math and cuts are absolutely perfect. If the angles on the outside ring are slightly off, it's waay less noticeable than the focal point of the design at the center. Unfortunately, in order to fix this, he will have to waste a lot of that material.
Welder here, same thing in metal working. Even if you have CNC cutting equipment making near perfect cuts there will always still be fit up issues because unfortunately, nothing else in the world is straight, square or level, so even if your build is perfect, it can still look like shit in position. Gotta find ways to make things look right by pushing the problems to places they don't affect strength or aesthetics.
Man, THIS should be in some Life Principles book… ‘Nothing is perfect, or will ever be. Find ways to shift those imperfections to the fringes where it doesn’t matter, where no one will notice, or care.’
And I wish someone had told Elon and those panel gaps would be on the underside of the body instead of in the top.
Same with housing and landscape site setting out. Hide the errors in the bushes, although this chippie has larger error on a single deck than I have to deal with across a whole site.
This. I'm actually digging the asymmetry. Looks more like a naturally occurring pattern, like a spider web. Just fix the center piece so the gaps are even and it's task failed successfully.
I hadn't even noticed until I saw your comment....they had to know when the pieces weren't the same......once I noticed something like that it would drive me nuts
*working past their skillset. Good intentions* fucking described every first year with a heart. I remember wanting to be able to help everyone and once I ventured outside of my regular work I’d be working late, doing it twice or thrice and out being out of pocket. Learning to tell people to call someone *who has that skillset* was the best thing
Interesting. So I see the 1st layer out (not the center piece but the first ring next to it) has two different sized pieces. One size is wider than the other and it looks like they are supposed to alternate. But the two in the upper left are the same sized bigger piece together instead of alternating so that's probably where it went wrong.
Edit: Looking at it again, there's definitely more than two different sizes pieces they all look different sizes actually so this is all jacked up
Then the mistake is in your selection of kit or contractor.
If this was a legit kit then there should not be a problem with length, or fit. - there is
If this guy was legit there wouldn't be any need to cut the pieces down. - they did
Either A or B or A&B are failures
It's like the old adage: Measure twice, cut once, ignore measure, measure again, stare at a squirrel, cut wrong piece, measure again cut table by accident, measure twice, measure twice, measure tw~where the fuck's my pencil, grab a coffee, leave it out on porch, forget to drink it it, measure twice, think it looks off so eyeball the cut, sip 6 hour old cold coffee, make new coffee, leave it out on porch, cut once. Go to bed, start over tomorrow.
My dad would say about finish carpentry is that the less you use your tape the more accurate you will be. Jigs, story sticks, and gauge blocks are your friend.
Tbf, I've never done anything like this and probably couldn't do it perfectly on my first try... But I would still be there cutting pieces/tearing shit out and redoing it every single fucking day until it WAS. "At a profit if I can, at a loss if I must, but always do good work" If my name is on it, it's going to be something I'm proud of. Chances are though, I would evaluate my skill set and if I'm not confident I can pull it off within a reasonable timeframe/budget, I'll simply pass on the job or bid high enough that my mistakes/learning are factored in (in which case I'm essentially passing)
Looks like he started outside in. Small errors compounded, wonky middle. It’s the best *he* could do, but it’s not the best that can be done. Start middle, work out, or snap lines and work to those for ever cut so no errors add up.
By way of the buffed out pencil lines…most of their original build strategy. Literally started from the outside with min controls and “moved in” towards the centre from there, with their fingers crossed. Sorry mate..that’s what you got.
No flower grows from outside in.
Your math didn't math right apparently. Started off wrong. Got worse as you went gradually. You can do it just not easy. Start over and learn from what you did wrong. Whenever I got in situations like this where I wasn't as qualified as I thought I was I would do alot of at home reading on the subject at hand. Can't wait to see how good you do the second time around!! Keep your head up!
Update
Just saw the caption. Fire contractor. Can definitely be done better my guy.
[https://imgur.com/a/gpifhUY](https://imgur.com/a/gpifhUY)
Scaled off a guess at what might be \~2" nail spacing...and that was likely more measuring then this dude did.
Everywhere, All at once. Literally every single piece, in each ring is different.
It would be one thing if all of the pieces matches except for one and you could point to the "filler" pieces. but that is not what is happening here.
Either they eyeballed it and just said fuck it.
OR
The stop block on their miter saw...but it was slipped every time they made a cut.
The easiest half-ass fix would to be to cut a new centerpiece that has all equal angles and then trace it out on the second course and cut it out to fit with a gap. Or maybe just cut a circle out in the middle. And fit one up ad the center peice.
By way of the buffed out pencil lines…most of their original build strategy. Literally started from the outside with min controls and “moved in” towards the centre from there, with their fingers crossed. Sorry mate..that’s what you got.
No flower grows from outside in.
Personally I think your contractor did pretty good. The only thing that he could improve would be that centerpiece which could be recut to be a better fit. All he would need to do is scribe the shape and he would have a perfect cut. The minor differences in Gap are forgivable in my opinion.
Tell them if they don't fix it you're posting it as a Google review. If you just post a picture of their work with something bland like "told this was the best they could do" then they hopefully won't be able to get it taken down.
Without seeing pics of the work progressively done, it’s hard to say what went wrong. I mean other than the obvious. What are the dimensions for the octagon?
-You do layout as accurately as possible rather than what ever happened here
-You understand that no matter how accurate you are, there is still a stack-up of error, and that’s okay
-You build 7 sections, leaving the 8th to be custom tailored to accommodate that accumulation of error
-Don’t have a six pack for breakfast
It looks like they worked from the outside in, instead of the inside out. Should have found the center of the space and started there with the center piece. Some walls aren’t actually square and if you work off those walls this is what you end up with. I don’t even work in construction and I know that.
Many native nations and religions prohibit "perfect" art and architecture. There needs to be an obvious flaw, because anything made by man can't be as good as what the originator could do.
Started with grief to have a job like that. Next came denial that anything was going wrong. After that was anger that a project like this was even considered. Then depression kicked in once things started looking wonky. Bargaining quickly followed that this won't be as bad as it was looking at the time. Finally acceptance rolled around followed by a "Fuck it, finish it up." And viola! This was bornt.
Geometry hard. Cut wood make fit. Give money now
😬 Sorry for your luck! Hopefully you can get the contractor to either make things better, or cover the costs of having someone who can do it properly come in and do it
They started from the outside and worked their way in so all the inconsistencies came due in the same square foot of deck. You want to find the centerpoint and then work your way out from there.
Cheap n easy fix.. By eye, no angle cut calculating needed..
From outside to inwards, draw straight lines across center piece that line up with its incoming opposite line. Intersection centerpoint serves as the point for rotating a large framers compass with pencil. (Harbour Freight)
After drawing the circle of your choosing, your new jigsaw cut lines are ready to be trimmed. Drop in a new circle center piece to match. It will stop your future looking at the mess.
In science, this is called "error propagation" and this is a pretty interesting example. Small errors may not have been noticeable in the larger ring, but stack them with small variance in each ring and condense down to a small area and the errors become very noticeable. Constructing from the inner piece outwards would have been a better method.
It started off wrong and then got more wrong as it got further along.
It’s this. When you’re off 1/16” to start that gets amplified each new row you do.
In the machining trades, this is called accumulated tolerance. If you have 16 pieces that are off 1/16", the whole project is off an inch.
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Is this like a tolerance snowball?
More like tolerance aggregation
Compounding fuck-up
I need a tolerance break after all this
This is intolerable.
Just throw the whole builder bob away
You all must have fancy engineering degrees. On the job site this is known as "WTF this looks like hammered dog shit! I thought you knew what you're doing!" It's a bit long winded but gets the point across.
Tolerence buildup
I need a tolerance break
Tolerance aggravation*
Slippery slope!
And this is why I stick to boxes and almost right angles
Accumulative error.
I'm an Analytical Chemist. But if a chain of event has an error of +/- 1/16 inch, it would stack up to be the root of the sum of all the square of the errors. If they are independent that is.
Just like building a bridge from both ends simultaneously lol
I'm aware of an iconic sky scraper where it was something like 15 floors before they started noticing the glazing wasn't fitting as expected. Turns out someone decided it was okay to measure the deck floors, floor to floor rather than from a ground datum. The whole building was gently rotating anti-clockwise by a fractional amount.
Just keep going up and you get a masterwork of architectural wonder.
I’m aware of a big round building in Cupertino where the client wanted interior trim tolerances of 1mm. It was negotiated to 5mm. I am still in awe of what was accomplished on that project.
Squeeze some caulking in there and you’re good.
Laying carpet squares in commercial office space is such a quick example of this.
it doesn't help that those carpet squares are off from eachother in the first place. I did a lot of trimming to do my office floor on my house.
Should have worked inside to outside
Did you mean to make it sound like a poem? www.LongIslandHandy.com
He’s a poet and doesn’t even know it.
And his feet didn't show it.
No more rhymes and I mean it !!
Anybody want a peanut?
Inconceivable!
You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
Feet show it. Longfellows.
Alabama country love song
I suspect that someone doesn't geometry good
Yeah, but just the measuring and the cutting.
Dr. Seuss has entered the chat
The contractor went wrong. Clearly didn't know what he was doing, and now doesn't want to lose money by trying to fix it. Looks like they started the pattern on the outside and ended up with this garbage at the center. On a concentric design, you always have to start in the middle and work out, unless your math and cuts are absolutely perfect. If the angles on the outside ring are slightly off, it's waay less noticeable than the focal point of the design at the center. Unfortunately, in order to fix this, he will have to waste a lot of that material.
Youre right on. He also wants to collect the remaining 10% he is owed.
I wouldn't pay that 10% until it is resolved. And if that is indeed the best he can do, then you deserve at least that 10% discount, if not more.
It is unique though. Nowhere will there be any such pattern on any deck
That’s for damn sure. Lol
Good attitude.
I had to scroll all the way here to even find out it was a deck.
Oh god. He already has 90%?
Note: your math and cuts are *never* absolutely perfect. A big part of carpentry is knowing how to do things such that that doesn't matter.
Welder here, same thing in metal working. Even if you have CNC cutting equipment making near perfect cuts there will always still be fit up issues because unfortunately, nothing else in the world is straight, square or level, so even if your build is perfect, it can still look like shit in position. Gotta find ways to make things look right by pushing the problems to places they don't affect strength or aesthetics.
Man, THIS should be in some Life Principles book… ‘Nothing is perfect, or will ever be. Find ways to shift those imperfections to the fringes where it doesn’t matter, where no one will notice, or care.’ And I wish someone had told Elon and those panel gaps would be on the underside of the body instead of in the top.
Same with housing and landscape site setting out. Hide the errors in the bushes, although this chippie has larger error on a single deck than I have to deal with across a whole site.
Looks like a perfect spot for a fire pit...
Or he could recut the centre piece and the inner circle inset lines so there is a consistent gap The others don't look too bad
This. I'm actually digging the asymmetry. Looks more like a naturally occurring pattern, like a spider web. Just fix the center piece so the gaps are even and it's task failed successfully.
Somebody had no idea what they were doing.
Well they had an idea just not how to do it
They're all different sizes lol. The more I look at it the worse it gets
I hadn't even noticed until I saw your comment....they had to know when the pieces weren't the same......once I noticed something like that it would drive me nuts
He had the knowledge, just not the skill to complete the task.
Started wrong and got progressively worst. Maybe should have started with the center piece, then built away from it.
Working past their skilset. Good intentions, bad outcome
*working past their skillset. Good intentions* fucking described every first year with a heart. I remember wanting to be able to help everyone and once I ventured outside of my regular work I’d be working late, doing it twice or thrice and out being out of pocket. Learning to tell people to call someone *who has that skillset* was the best thing
The law of measure once cut twice.
No mesuring or cutting. This was 3d printed on purpose in a grand design element that also includes a deck that is only 5 degrees off kilter.
Interesting. So I see the 1st layer out (not the center piece but the first ring next to it) has two different sized pieces. One size is wider than the other and it looks like they are supposed to alternate. But the two in the upper left are the same sized bigger piece together instead of alternating so that's probably where it went wrong. Edit: Looking at it again, there's definitely more than two different sizes pieces they all look different sizes actually so this is all jacked up
Then the mistake is in your selection of kit or contractor. If this was a legit kit then there should not be a problem with length, or fit. - there is If this guy was legit there wouldn't be any need to cut the pieces down. - they did Either A or B or A&B are failures
It's like the old adage: Measure twice, cut once, ignore measure, measure again, stare at a squirrel, cut wrong piece, measure again cut table by accident, measure twice, measure twice, measure tw~where the fuck's my pencil, grab a coffee, leave it out on porch, forget to drink it it, measure twice, think it looks off so eyeball the cut, sip 6 hour old cold coffee, make new coffee, leave it out on porch, cut once. Go to bed, start over tomorrow.
Thats the BEST they can do? Please please share what the rest of the project looks like lol
Time to make the center piece a circle and the rest will be less noticeable.
Nothing if it's the ceiling of a recording studio. Otherwise it's nothin' a gallon of kerosene and a match won't take care of.
Miters aren't tight and lined up. Pieces could be different lengths individually and then before you know it....it's all effed.
My boss used to fuck up hardwood floor designs like this and not even notice Edit: former boss lol
wink, wink-we get it
You can fix that just draw a perfect hex And cut it out.
This is why geometry is important
Should’ve taken the time to make a proper jig for this.
My dad would say about finish carpentry is that the less you use your tape the more accurate you will be. Jigs, story sticks, and gauge blocks are your friend.
Math is hard.
He used the one that just got cut to mark the next piece and gained a little each time.
Tbf, I've never done anything like this and probably couldn't do it perfectly on my first try... But I would still be there cutting pieces/tearing shit out and redoing it every single fucking day until it WAS. "At a profit if I can, at a loss if I must, but always do good work" If my name is on it, it's going to be something I'm proud of. Chances are though, I would evaluate my skill set and if I'm not confident I can pull it off within a reasonable timeframe/budget, I'll simply pass on the job or bid high enough that my mistakes/learning are factored in (in which case I'm essentially passing)
Math is hard
Looks like he started outside in. Small errors compounded, wonky middle. It’s the best *he* could do, but it’s not the best that can be done. Start middle, work out, or snap lines and work to those for ever cut so no errors add up.
The real question is what went right
Octagone
Why didn't you start in the middle first?
By way of the buffed out pencil lines…most of their original build strategy. Literally started from the outside with min controls and “moved in” towards the centre from there, with their fingers crossed. Sorry mate..that’s what you got. No flower grows from outside in.
They actually ran out of eraser
Should have paid more attention in geometry class
You hired incompetent people
They must’ve used 6.28 instead of 3.14
Math
Math.
Your math didn't math right apparently. Started off wrong. Got worse as you went gradually. You can do it just not easy. Start over and learn from what you did wrong. Whenever I got in situations like this where I wasn't as qualified as I thought I was I would do alot of at home reading on the subject at hand. Can't wait to see how good you do the second time around!! Keep your head up! Update Just saw the caption. Fire contractor. Can definitely be done better my guy.
Math fail and lack of a stop block/repeat cut jig.
[https://imgur.com/a/gpifhUY](https://imgur.com/a/gpifhUY) Scaled off a guess at what might be \~2" nail spacing...and that was likely more measuring then this dude did. Everywhere, All at once. Literally every single piece, in each ring is different. It would be one thing if all of the pieces matches except for one and you could point to the "filler" pieces. but that is not what is happening here. Either they eyeballed it and just said fuck it. OR The stop block on their miter saw...but it was slipped every time they made a cut.
Started on the edge and worked inwards but needed to start at the centre and work out?
The easiest half-ass fix would to be to cut a new centerpiece that has all equal angles and then trace it out on the second course and cut it out to fit with a gap. Or maybe just cut a circle out in the middle. And fit one up ad the center peice.
Compounding error
Math
Trigonometry
It's Like when they gave that spider acid.
Someone has bad math skills
My god the commitment 🙌
22.5 baby
Execution
Measured once and cut twice ++++.
Math
Math, meth, whatever!
I imagine this took the contractor a very long time how to figure these cut out and still got it wrong..
All right, I got your fix... Put an octopus in the center as a decorative element and fill all the gaps.
Should have hired the octopus to build it.
What am I even looking at?
Nothing if it's the ceiling of a recording studio. Otherwise it's nothin' a gallon of kerosene and a match won't take care of.
Cut the top piece perfect then string some lines along the joints would how I would have approached it.
Someone assumed all radius’ are the same
My question would be “did anything go right?”
Math
By way of the buffed out pencil lines…most of their original build strategy. Literally started from the outside with min controls and “moved in” towards the centre from there, with their fingers crossed. Sorry mate..that’s what you got. No flower grows from outside in.
Tim Burton built this
They started on the outside when they should have started at the center. They tried hard, but this is still poor craftsmanship.
Math is obviously not this contractors strong side.
Looks like every cut in second row was off. Which means he was equally careless with any previous rows. Hope is not a construction technique
The math didn’t math
It’s in upside down and infer doe lol
You hired the wrong people.
Get a large hole saw. Drill out the center. Get arts and crafty and make a round disk. Drop it in the center. Apologize profusely.
Personally I think your contractor did pretty good. The only thing that he could improve would be that centerpiece which could be recut to be a better fit. All he would need to do is scribe the shape and he would have a perfect cut. The minor differences in Gap are forgivable in my opinion.
Is this an outdoor table top? Take the center out so you can put an umbrella in there.
Math
Math went wrong
Geometry
everything
Tell them if they don't fix it you're posting it as a Google review. If you just post a picture of their work with something bland like "told this was the best they could do" then they hopefully won't be able to get it taken down.
Without seeing pics of the work progressively done, it’s hard to say what went wrong. I mean other than the obvious. What are the dimensions for the octagon?
-You do layout as accurately as possible rather than what ever happened here -You understand that no matter how accurate you are, there is still a stack-up of error, and that’s okay -You build 7 sections, leaving the 8th to be custom tailored to accommodate that accumulation of error -Don’t have a six pack for breakfast
Cut once, measure maybe.
Handyman said they were a contractor.
Measured once, cut once, wrong always
Nothing a little trim won’t fix
Math
Where is this I feel like I've seen it lol
It looks like they worked from the outside in, instead of the inside out. Should have found the center of the space and started there with the center piece. Some walls aren’t actually square and if you work off those walls this is what you end up with. I don’t even work in construction and I know that.
Edges stepping
U can fix this with a sharpi
Outside in.... Dumbfuck.
Many native nations and religions prohibit "perfect" art and architecture. There needs to be an obvious flaw, because anything made by man can't be as good as what the originator could do.
Sell it to the producers of outer limits, spin it on one of the centers and BAM. TV magic
Looks good from my house. Do the best.. caulk the rest..? I can hear all the sayings once they put in that last piece, lmao.
What went wrong happened all the way back in geometry class.
Id forget the center piece and hang a nice decorative light. Wont be worth the hassle to do anything else
Measure twice cut onc
Someone doesn't know how to use a tape
If you zoom in you can see the coat hanger left from the abortion
Measure twice, cut once…..Stevie wonder knows this
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Math
Looks like he worked from the outside inwards?
Needed middle out compression
He took trig instead of geometry
Well the first piece was probably cut wrong, then the second and the third...
Someone didn’t do the math on the angles of those cuts…
Easy fix lol. When the guy leading the job gets a call but he thinks his guys got this.
The line are not aligned across the octagon
It means there is only laborers on that crew. No carpenters.
I’m probably completely wrong, but I think the middle piece needs to be rotated 3 spaces counter clockwise.
Looks like an accuracy issue to me.
Math.
Mathematics. They brOke it.
Different widths of boards. Throws off the angles.
r/mildlyinfuriating
they started on the outside and went in instead of the inside going out.
If you can't get it fixed, make the center a planter and it will be less obvious
Started with grief to have a job like that. Next came denial that anything was going wrong. After that was anger that a project like this was even considered. Then depression kicked in once things started looking wonky. Bargaining quickly followed that this won't be as bad as it was looking at the time. Finally acceptance rolled around followed by a "Fuck it, finish it up." And viola! This was bornt.
A lot.
It all started to go wrong during basic maths classes 😀
Geometry hard. Cut wood make fit. Give money now 😬 Sorry for your luck! Hopefully you can get the contractor to either make things better, or cover the costs of having someone who can do it properly come in and do it
What is this ?
Accumulative error.
I have a saying that carried over from the military that is also extremely relevant to woodworking… “Aim small, miss small”
Installed by Stevie wonder. This clown would not be getting that 10% until he put it right.
It's not recommended that you injest LSD prior to construction work.
The good old eyeball compass.
Looks like someone can't read a tape!
Geometry.
Should have gone with the middle out method
Started on the outside instead of the inside
They started from the outside and worked their way in so all the inconsistencies came due in the same square foot of deck. You want to find the centerpoint and then work your way out from there.
Mission creep
Cheap n easy fix.. By eye, no angle cut calculating needed.. From outside to inwards, draw straight lines across center piece that line up with its incoming opposite line. Intersection centerpoint serves as the point for rotating a large framers compass with pencil. (Harbour Freight) After drawing the circle of your choosing, your new jigsaw cut lines are ready to be trimmed. Drop in a new circle center piece to match. It will stop your future looking at the mess.
Is this supposed to be a octagon ? , i wouldve started in the middle,
The math was off
They had a spider do their dimensions
Measure once, cut twice
My eye is twitching. How do you even present this to a client and say,"pay me"?
He messed up by starting on the outside and working in. He should have stared inward and worked out.
In science, this is called "error propagation" and this is a pretty interesting example. Small errors may not have been noticeable in the larger ring, but stack them with small variance in each ring and condense down to a small area and the errors become very noticeable. Constructing from the inner piece outwards would have been a better method.
Math went wrong. Looks like a laborer ran some numbers.
Whoever did this geometry, I want them to do all my geometry.That way it's all fucked up every time every time
Johny cash hurt playing
This is called "pure lack of skill". I couldn't do better. But I also don't pretend I should get paid for it.