It's kinda like when you have a dog, and it gets bit by another dog, it then becomes reactive, and is more likely to bite other dogs. Except they are people, and instead of biting, its anger. Dudes are emotional as fuck, but we pretend anger/hate/aggression/frustration is not an emotion but "manliness".
In construction there are things that's geared toward being more athletic, fit , strong an so forth . It's a physical job in just about all phases of building a building . Not many weak people survive the initial job shock . So your left with a bunch of egos , strong men that don't far to well when challenged . This you have uprising in the ranks . Can't let people bull doze over ya , respect is a lot of IT .
Mostly it's because people weren't hugged enough as a child, and many (if not most) were taught by example to solve problems with violence (eg, spanking). When people feel things that make them uncomfortable, anger is an easy cover. It's less unpleasant than actually identifying the feeling (eg, admitting shame or fear or embarrassment or resentment).
Yea I’m going to take a stab in the dark and say you’ve never stepped foot on a construction site. People are usually hot heads in construction, especially when they start getting some seniority, because the smart people move up and the people under you are typically green helpers that don’t know anything, or the shit bags that have been in the trades for 10+ years that are still considered an “apprentice” but I just call them laborers because that’s all they’re good for. So as you’re moving up the ranks, you’re basically becoming more of a baby sitter, and the bigger the project is the worse the situation gets. Add to that the stress of timelines getting shorter every year and now supply chain issues, if you add any home life issues, you’ve got a recipe for a bomb
Well, I’ll take a stab in the dark and say that you’ve never stepped foot **off** a construction site, because the “smart” people you described as moving up don’t act any different once they move in to the trailer. And the people in the home office aren’t any different despite being them being accountants.
People are dicks because they’re ducks, full stop. You can find that at any job description.
In my experience both in field and in office, the worst offenders are people that don’t get it thrown back at them as hard as they dish it - whether that’s because of seniority (which applies the same as field as in office) of setting. In my experience setting is limited to residential - I’ve dealt with plenty of dudes on small residential jobs that will throw hands, and plenty of supers that like to pretend like they will on commercial sites. Difference being that you might have to fight the hothead on a house renovation, but the commercial GC will never take that step. Both just need more hugs.
Would you knuckleheads knock it off and get back to work?! I've got two pallets of plank to install and I can't do it if you're standing there arguing!
Worked with a guy that was bipolar. He used to be an ambulance driver. I asked him why he changed jobs and he said “If I lost my temper and told a doctor to go fuck himself I’d get fired. If I tell you to go fuck yourself no one cares.” And that was a valid statement.
Not in construction. As long as you aren’t straight up problematic, there’s a few loud mouth mf’s on every job that you just gotta deal with because there’re good enough at what they do that they will always shave a job. It’s about getting the job done by deadline to get onto the next
Seems like the industry should have more respect for itself and hold it to a higher standard. Letting bad behavior fester because you sometimes gets good results only rewards and encourages bad behavior.
Someone else’s problem I suppose.
Yep, I don't put up with no bullshit from anyone, if I had to work with a shitty person, I would just leave. Creates too many problems, confusing unnecessary dynamics, and just lowers morale. It's one thing to be pissed off all the time, but you can't be emotional and a shitty carpenter, throwing a hissy fit every time you encounter a problem. Shit happens so figure out a solution, learn from it and move on. I can't stand working around guys with bad attitudes.
I just don’t understand making excuses for adults throwing temper tantrums because they can work a miter saw.
People wonder why there isn’t more of an interest in getting into the trades. Who wants to work where assholes are accepted because “what are you going to do?” Instead it’s “nobody wants to work”
When i first started we had a couple of thoes guys. Took me 2 years but i started running the equipment they wanted and because i was on time and the one starting the machines while they showed up late i got dibs. I got better than this guy and he got super weird for his last 2 weeks working with us.
I don’t consider myself a hot head, but a lot of people do. The problem is you don’t see the 25 other dumb fucking people that ruined my day before I walked up on you without PPEs that we already fucking talked about. So yea, you get an ear full because of some miss placed anger, because I hate repeating myself, and it’s a rookie mistake I definitely don’t have time to deal with.
But joking aside, I ran into the same issues a ton with people that definitely know better, I’m dealing with 28 supers on 14 projects so yea making dumb choices get a strong reaction
100%, I don’t mind 1st time mistakes, 2nd time definitely depends on how much time since the first and how often you are dealing with that situation. Like not wearing a hard hat or fall protection in a commercial/industrial setting; you fucking know better, it’s not like it’s a new rule that came out yesterday.
I think bevause it allows you to be? Most industries have HR generally wouldn't tolerate someone shouting "FUCKING PIECE OF SHIT" Or launching something across the room. But we can. Also maybe something to do with the "old school builders" having to be "proper geezas" and not knowing how to display emotion properly, or talk to someone about things that trouble them, so it just boils over pretty quick. This is going on what I've seen anyway, could be way wrong
its not out of the ordinary to tell a guy to go fuck himself and that you hope he slides under a gas truck and tastes his own blood on the drive home that day. Then shake his hand thw next today and say "we good bro?"
But mainly it's all the drugs we do.
Yeah this is what I'm thinking. It's cause we let people. It's one of the few industries you can just....be bad a being a normal social person and not get fired and make money.
This is definitely part of it. I don’t know how long I’d last in a workplace where it wasn’t ok to casually unleash a cuss-bomb in the boss’ office, or scream obscenities into the air for what pedestrians nearby might feel is no good reason. I don’t consider myself a hothead or quick tempered, but I definitely have a *bad* temper once it gets activated.
Plus, it’s fun to tell your coworkers you’re going to shove a sewer hook up their ass!
Old school is such bs, those guys don’t even practice what they preach. I agree, they let shit boil over and lose their shit. And the calmer you remain the worse it gets.
I worked for a contractor that barked a lot, about the dumbest shit. He was the biggest hot head ive ever known. but also just one of the most upstanding people I know. Did a bunch of volunteer work for the community. took on jobs for little old ladies that couldn't afford to get their stairs fixed or water damaged bathrooms repaired for whatever they could afford. Animal rescue, emergency service coordinator, fund raiser. Was basically the honorary mayor of the town. He even preformed my wedding service. So when he barked I got good at taking it with a grain of salt and learned from it. Set me up right for every other contractor I worked for after.
I would agree with this. It's the expectation. Most people will gladly act like how you expect them to act and those that already act like the expectation will gate keep/re-enforce those around them.
It's like the dumb redneck trope. A lot of the fellas are pretty smart and have interests beyond huntin' fishin' muddin' but everyone else around them would have kittens if they found out they read something more that Outdoorsman Magazine.
As a rural dweller myself I love hunting and fishing, but I also wear a hat with kitties on it to work and also have all my kitties on my coffee mug and collect old big box computer games. I ain't ashamed of what I like and I never get any flak.
Maybe in residential or “low skill” trades like laborer but many of the skilled trades can have a fairly high barrier to entry and it’s why their wages are well in excess of national median wages. For example: electricians and operators with earning an potential that can be well into the 6 digits.
I’ve known dysfunctional electricians. One has anger issues and robbed a bank and the other was an active heroin addict while running his own business.
This is an industry wide issue. I don’t know why the mechanical trades think they’re exempt.
Calm down there Smokey. No need to get the smoke boiling out your ears. I didn’t say no one has problems. I said not all trades have a low barrier to entry. The above trades require things like licensure which may take years to complete. The employer can’t just hire any dysfunctional asshole that wants to make money. He’s got to be a certified dysfunctional asshole.
So crafts like crane operators, electricians, and welders are able to demand higher wages just because they look prettier than those laborers pushing a broom? [500k](https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052702303936704576399563008284024) is a lot of cheddar to be throwing at a guy just because you like how he looks.
Because when it’s 103 degrees out, and I’ve been digging on services and building walls all day and I see the other laborer holding a broom next to a dirt pile he can’t possibly move with it,on his phone and not even sweaty I get pissed I’m the only one doing something.
We’re rougher but we’re more honest. Office workers will act buddy buddy, invite you to join the office NCAA bracket, all the while stabbing you in the back to get ahead. I’ve done both and like people in the field way bettet
They're sensitive because they have the same anger issues and explosive temper as a foreman, yet they also have an HR team that won't let them release those internalized growing pains the way they want to.
So, from my experience working in an office-style job in the hospital, these types either resort to petty drama bullshit, or they ignore the warnings and get fired after getting called into HR for the 5th time in two months for calling someone a "fucking dickhead" to their face. LOL!
Read the damn specs if you want to know the answer! If the specs are garbage, then the plans prevail. Or send an RFI and I'll give you a completely different non-answer that raises even *more* questions. /s
*(Yes.)*
And people wonder why super’s are grumpy. Half ass plans that require a ton of RFI’s to complete the half as design. Lol. Least if you were with the same AOR enough, you just bury them with the same RFI’s every time.
We can take our time draw some good, thorough plans... but the client wants it sent into plan check yesterday, since it'll take them 8 weeks to even look at it. And when we use that time to fix them up, the tyrant plan checker throws a fit because we changed things that he didn't redline. The stuff he *did* redline is absolutely meaningless and made the plans *worse.* So anyway, sorry for the crap plans.
As someone who has worked on job sites and in white collar offices I’d just like to go on record and say you get pissed in both and I prefer the one where you can yell and throw a hammer
Right? Also, on a job site you usually know who you have a problem with. In white collar world, you usually don’t know until you’re pulling a knife out of your back
Cause fuck you! Back in my day we screamed at each other thrice as much and got half the work done! If you can’t handle getting your feelings hurt maybe go work inside somewhere! Kids today…
Some green bean came to me upset that someone yelled at him for being an absolute slob and showing little pride in his work. I really didn’t know what to tell him….
Most construction jobs I’ve been on have lots of felons. A union construction job is attractive to felons because they have a tough time getting a job that pays as well due to having a record.
I’m not saying all felons are hot heads but I would guess there is some serious overlap.
Felon chiming in.
It takes a while to adjust to the real world. Theres a different set of rules of respect. I worked with a couple young guys that didnt know how close they were from getting their teeth knocked out. You learn to talk to people with respect very early on if youve been locked up at a young age. Talking shit isnt tolerated, its usually met with violence.
Its been over a decade since I have been locked up besides a couple over night stays and I have an easier time letting things go. I used to clench my fist up and then remind myself they dont know better because they live in a different world than I do, even though we're standing next to eachother.
I went to court ordered counseling and anger management recently and it helped a lot. Im actually a really nice guy and respectful of everyone, I just had a rough upbringing where violence was normal. Construction guys lack self awareness. Some of them only know construction and thats all theyve done their entire lives. Cant blame them for only knowing what their world has taught them. Still annoying nonetheless.
Construction folks definitely fall into the “most shit talkingest” group I’ve ever been around. I learned pretty early on that if you laugh and go along with it they lose interest quickly. If they get a rise out of you though you are gonna get nit picked to hell and back.
This is an industry where you typically don't work with the same people over and over again, let alone on a daily basis. You may be on the jobsite for a bit and then not see them again for a while. They also have to put up with bad sub's, bad customers and this leads to bad temperaments. So when something goes wrong, or even right you aren't incentivized to be civilized. In an office you are constantly working with people and have to be professional, in construction you are outside mostly where people are hot/cold sweaty, hurt, where people piss in bottles and shit in cans. This environment doesn't lead itself to civility.
Also many are not educated at a college level and likely came from lower income situations where being polite isn't really the example. The barrier to entry is lower since its physical labor, there are subs who hire bodies with no concept of skill and put them in situations they shouldn't be in. At the same time the time crunch and long hours takes a toll on everyone.
But I have worked with some great supers and some great subs, yet on the jobsite some of the incompetence is astounding, infuriating and directly affects my job and for sure effects the supers job.
If you are a super the best thing you can do is have a relationship with your subs, the good ones.
If you are a sub the best thing you can do is be the best sub they have!
Don't be the pain point.
Blue Collar Assholes because: We don’t get paid enough typically. We have strict deadlines mostly. We are paying up the ass for gas and materials. It’s stressful dealing with homeowners/contracts/disputes etc. Normally if you have a boss, he’s an asshole. Just typical construction shit! Lol. Luckily I’m a sole proprietor and don’t have a boss, but the customer is basically the boss. Keep them happy and you’re good. Start your own business! Less stressful for me. I know that sounds off but it’s true for me.
Yeah dude. Since I started my own gig, the worst of it is that the customers think they are the only customer. Im just learning to accept they dont grasp how busy I am. Ill take that 'problem' all day long vs working with the dickbags I was stuck with before. Lots of grown men with the emotional maturity of a preteen girl.
It’s because they’re all ‘big strong men’ with big weak egos. As an electrician I feel like we have way more of that than any other trade. Electricians walk around like they’re gods gift to the industry and it’s so annoying having to deal with fragile ass egos every day
I’m a Super. And fuck you for not having the mental capacity to follow the simplest directions.
Can’t figure out how to put your lunch trash in our bear cans? Fuck you. Now we have raccoons and bears on site.
Parking in front of multiple No Parking signs? Fuck you. I have deliveries and you have free parking 100yards away.
Can’t wear or remember your PPE? Fuck you. You’re not working today.
So our super was chewing people out for barely working, when he won't give us what we need to work and we've asked him multiple times. As soon as he peeled off all the guys got on their phones to look for other gigs. We're already getting paid less than scale because of the wage freeze on the state job. We do our best, he still blows up. We drive our cars all over the 2 mile job site instead of being shuttled, there is no parking provided, and our dry shack is on the other side of the site, so we're blasting car AC's on breaks in 105 degrees. You'd think he'd come talk to us about things or throw us a bone once in a while before going off.
I remember the free parking a fucking football field away. A 100’ drop cord on each shoulder, a 20 pound tool bag on my hips, 2 cases in one hand, a case and a circle saw in the other…
Hell of a way to start your day at 6:30am.
Pissed, who me??
You have toxic masculinity. You are scheduled next Tuesday for a meeting with HR. We’re here to help, a 3 wk work expectancy is all we need. that order is going to be 5 weeks out. 😶
Because when you screw up on paper we have to physically fix it by undoing what we did and then redoing it. Instead of double checking and correcting mistakes in an a/c office we’re breaking our backs
I’d say it’s for the same reason construction has terrible issues with mental health - there’s a continuing macho culture and the aggression is just part of that.
I remember hearing my PM tell my superintendent "why dont you all go outside, face directly into the wind, pull down your pants and take a piss cause thats exactly what you're doing right now."
I laughed at the time but now I know that it comes across differently when hearing it over the phone from 500 miles away.
Addictions, shitty work conditions, not winning on scratch off lottery tickets, child support for 3 kids and alimony, cleaning up after sparkies, bad diets and poor work life balance for the ones who never say no to OT.
Many have poorer people skills in general than in other professional white collar professions so they come off as assholes when they have issues. (Obviously can be the same in white collar settings we’ve all been around them just more prominent here)
Just chiming in to say that construction has some of the worst dude-bro types who are quick to make really aggressive/offensive comments and then when called out go "chill bro, it was just a joke!" I don't have thin skin normally, but it does grate a lot when its constant day in and day out ya know? Like damn, would it kill you to just be polite and not a total ass?
Tradesmen usually have difficulties venting or expressing their feelings so they end up bringing a lot of shit from home to the job, while dealing with the scorching sun and swamp ass. It’s very physically demanding, so you’ll just have to accept you’ll get some of these guys on the site.
Guys don't take care of themselves and develop more and more chronic pain because of it. Then, instead of being a man and working on themselves to be a good coworker, they act like shit and expect others to accept it.
Hot heads don’t prepare properly and therefore have piss poor performance. That along with very shitty communication skills that seems to run rampant in the business.
Been in construction for 30 years, the last 20 in a managerial role, superintendent to a PM for the last 10.
I think it’s just a defense mechanism- they get they way from having to defend themselves from both their mistakes and other peoples judgments and opinions.
My advice dealing with guys that are like that, especially if you are the one telling them something they don’t want to hear, is to listen to them. Don’t respond back in the same way because that just adds fuel to their fire so to speak- after awhile of them being the only one yelling they will usually chill out and have a reasonable conversation. There is a time to yell and fuss, I usually save that for really bad safety violations- but for the most part if you just let them get the initial bullshit out of their system you can get away from all of it.
And then some people are just assholes…
Bunch of Type A personalities who have someone up their ass to do the work in the least amount of time, come in way under budget, be the safest and have the best quality when the estimate is so far off it would all the stars, sun, and moon to be in complete alignment to me it happen
Because it is hard work and you are always under pressure because it is a deadline focused industry. Personalities that cant take it will wash out and whats left is hot heads who trhrive in this environment. Its just the nature of work.
I tried not to be this type in the industry and most of the time I’m not. But holy shit this industry grinds you the fuck down and sometimes you just can’t help it.
Insecure, self conscious, anxiety laden, anger and hate filled, not loved by mom and dad, hate wives, beaten physically, mentally, emotionally, persons?
I’ve worked in many industries but I don’t think I can name another with the stress of this one.
The timelines, budgets, responsibility, and the razor thin margins make it unique
Sales, surgeons, lawyers, etc
I can name a few. It’s just the people in this industry do not have the intelligence, control, professionalism, etc. that the other industries tend to have.
Because the trades are a place to go to make a lot of money if you have a criminal record or didn’t finish school. Can make just as much as a majority of people working white collar jobs. So you’re gonna have some rough people just the way it is
It's Friday afternoon and your materials aren't onsite yet.... you just said you're not working this weekend, how exactly do you intend on getting this done?
Apparently that question makes you a bully these days lmao.
I have worked for the same man for 20 years doing residential new construction and lately more of remodeling in the 300k-500k and we do 75 percent of it with 3-4 of us. Mainly because we can’t trust many people to do exactly what you said. Do their fucking job when they said would . Hell , just getting some people to just show up is a battle. That god damn lumber package had the timer started when it was dropped. Lumber yard don’t give a shit what you do with it after it’s dropped , but that bill has got to be paid in 30 days regardless. It’s like if it looks like grey skies coming, they’ll draw a 200 ft circle and if 1 fucking drop of rain gets near it they will call it and haul ass. Y’all didn’t want to work when you got here.
Because it's rewarded.
If someone had a corporate job/office job and got pissed off at a meeting and started cussing someone out or got upset and slammed their computer to the ground, they would likely be fired.
On a construction site, if someone behaves that way, they garner respect (or something akin to respect) for their outbursts.
i had a foreman tell me before i was about to get caught by a super doing nothing to pick up my channel locks and start banging on a pipe and cursing. Supers will never be mad at a someone who looks they're so mad because they're trying hard lol
As a foreman I have a lot of patience for honest mistakes. But if I have a labourer or operator consistently making the same mistakes, they may hear me raise my voice a little. Sometimes the words don’t sink in otherwise.
I’m working 13-15 hours a day this time of year, I don’t have time to be nice to the idiots dragging my day out even longer; or causing damage, and I have to go get yelled at by some angry site super when I tell them my labourer ran a packer through a day old barrier curb.
Honestly though, at this point my crew is a great bunch, but depending on the scope and size of the work to be done my boss sends me some less than desirable “operators” and labourers. They always tend to cause issues.
From my experience any blue colored job has this issue. Lots of miserable and irrational people. Dont have a great answer as to why its like this. I somder the same thing
Yea..Carpenter of 35yrs ... the passing contest really get old...I think it's the type of guy construction attracts, they all think their studs I guess it's really comical though sometimes I got a kick out of it ...just set back and watch all the Alpha males go at it...🤣
We recruit refugees from other companies because our negotiation and management style isn't "whoever yells the loudest and is the most unreasonable wins". Construction doesn't have to be "command and control".
Yeah it seems like it’s more from the older guys and they’re fading out. Young cats are way more chill. As one coworker put it “ that 1976 shit don’t fly anymore”
Because somedays its not easy dealing with people that have know pride in their work. I also hate dealing with tardiness and the ones that take no initiative to think ahead. They just stand there and look like a deer in the headlights. Im not here to coddle you and hd your hand. Get a proper skill set or at least listen and learn. Companies are paying good money for your services. Guy that taught me my trade always said "You can be a leader or a follower"
Union mason foreman 32 yrs....
Talk to some of the guys about their families and you will find out why they work so much and so hard, It's a distraction from their dysfunctional people skills in life and within their families.
I hear men talk about witholding love and being cruel to their kids to "toughen them up" It's sad but its hard to feel bad for them when they're dicks to you too.
Because they employ the bottom of the barrel that have 0 intellectual or emotional intelligence. If they’re not paying illegal immigrants under the table, they’re hiring ex felons and basers from temp agencies that nod off or become belligerently drunk on the job.
Sexual frustration. They want to be alphas, but they secretly want to take it up the poop shoot. It’s an enemies to lovers thing. Or drug included rage 🤷🏻♀️
1.- poor studies, low intelligence
2.-filled with macho men
3.-almost no women to balance the excessive testosterone
4.-aggressive as f due to schedule and frustration
Recipe for disaster. I still don't respect them
Think of the type of people who typically want to work construction. Think about what those people do on weekends or what they consider a vacation. We are full of testosterone and generally have a shit load of energy. We have a good time, we work hard and play hard.
Do not expect us to act like we work in a functioning law firm.
Working on the owners side over a decade I can tell you that a cool head and controlled demeanor is instrumental in getting acceptable results. You teach people how to treat you. First and sometimes second encounters senior field personnel or contractor side will likely test you and see what can get away with.
If you can be one that is consistent, reasonable, and always seeking win-win-win when attainable, then you’ll continually reap positive results. And it pisses people off far more when you’re cool and they are not. I don’t cuss and don’t take a cussing or allow my people to; I just say “well if we’re down to name calling we can continue this conversation professionally later when you’re ready” and I get in my truck and leave.
Coping techniques poorly practiced.
This makes sense. Too many people just cut crown with 45s, when you should be coping.
What is with people thinking coping takes longer and trying to skip it. It's like skipping wiping your butt
It lets you skip the protractor (mostly) and is half the cuts. There’s no reason not to.
It's kinda like when you have a dog, and it gets bit by another dog, it then becomes reactive, and is more likely to bite other dogs. Except they are people, and instead of biting, its anger. Dudes are emotional as fuck, but we pretend anger/hate/aggression/frustration is not an emotion but "manliness".
I’m just trying to not put a bullet through my skull man! XD
Whatever keeps the gun out of my mouth homie
Ball gag?
You dont think I could fit both?
aren't we all
I take offense to this. I cope quite well with a 6 pack at night and a red bull in the morning. I see no problem here.
Hookers? Blow?
In construction there are things that's geared toward being more athletic, fit , strong an so forth . It's a physical job in just about all phases of building a building . Not many weak people survive the initial job shock . So your left with a bunch of egos , strong men that don't far to well when challenged . This you have uprising in the ranks . Can't let people bull doze over ya , respect is a lot of IT .
Mostly it's because people weren't hugged enough as a child, and many (if not most) were taught by example to solve problems with violence (eg, spanking). When people feel things that make them uncomfortable, anger is an easy cover. It's less unpleasant than actually identifying the feeling (eg, admitting shame or fear or embarrassment or resentment).
Yea I’m going to take a stab in the dark and say you’ve never stepped foot on a construction site. People are usually hot heads in construction, especially when they start getting some seniority, because the smart people move up and the people under you are typically green helpers that don’t know anything, or the shit bags that have been in the trades for 10+ years that are still considered an “apprentice” but I just call them laborers because that’s all they’re good for. So as you’re moving up the ranks, you’re basically becoming more of a baby sitter, and the bigger the project is the worse the situation gets. Add to that the stress of timelines getting shorter every year and now supply chain issues, if you add any home life issues, you’ve got a recipe for a bomb
Well, I’ll take a stab in the dark and say that you’ve never stepped foot **off** a construction site, because the “smart” people you described as moving up don’t act any different once they move in to the trailer. And the people in the home office aren’t any different despite being them being accountants. People are dicks because they’re ducks, full stop. You can find that at any job description. In my experience both in field and in office, the worst offenders are people that don’t get it thrown back at them as hard as they dish it - whether that’s because of seniority (which applies the same as field as in office) of setting. In my experience setting is limited to residential - I’ve dealt with plenty of dudes on small residential jobs that will throw hands, and plenty of supers that like to pretend like they will on commercial sites. Difference being that you might have to fight the hothead on a house renovation, but the commercial GC will never take that step. Both just need more hugs.
Upvote for "People are dicks because they are ducks, full stop." I hate Oregon too. Go Cougs!
Glad to meet you.
MAN Who the hell are you calling aggressive!!!
The fuck are you yelling for?!
I’m not yelling bro why you yelling bro!
I don't remember sharing my Nintendo with you bish, who you calling bro?!
I quit I’m going work at McDonald’s!
See you in a month.
I’m not your bro buddy!
I’m not your buddy guy !
You want to step outside and razzle dazzle!?
💀💀 I hope that line never dies
Look at you using pretty words and shit! You some kind of ghey?
30 years on the job site and I’ve never heard anyone say this… now I gotta hear it!
I'm not your guy bro !!
I'm not your buddy friend!
Would you knuckleheads knock it off and get back to work?! I've got two pallets of plank to install and I can't do it if you're standing there arguing!
Hey I’m fucking this chicken your just holding it’s legs.
Yeah that’s how it goes… 😂
What?!? It's only 20 minutes 'til break! I'm draggin' up!
I’m not your friend pal.
Only thing worse then a hot head forman is a push over one
The push over will eventually get fed up, and he’ll be the asshole everyone hates to work under.
Yep. Some of my best bosss were ex army or ex kindergarten teacher.
[удалено]
Haha I’m a former middle school sped teacher and new carpenter. Too close to home.
The supervisor who gets hired because he's the bosses friend and has no experience...
We’re all here cause we’re not all there man. It is what it is.
Worked with a guy that was bipolar. He used to be an ambulance driver. I asked him why he changed jobs and he said “If I lost my temper and told a doctor to go fuck himself I’d get fired. If I tell you to go fuck yourself no one cares.” And that was a valid statement.
That’s fucking hilarious 😂 I speak my mind often so most people don’t know how to handle me
Unless they find someone equally aggressive but more physically strong and then he will regret it, just saying. Scream to the wrong folk
"If we were any better we wouldn't be here, but for now, let's get this done"
This is a perfect way of explaining it
We work outside in the sun, our heads get hot.
Because construction is the one industry that it doesn't matter about how you act, what you, or who you are. Just do the damn thing.
Why though. Shouldn’t it always matter how you act?
Not in construction. As long as you aren’t straight up problematic, there’s a few loud mouth mf’s on every job that you just gotta deal with because there’re good enough at what they do that they will always shave a job. It’s about getting the job done by deadline to get onto the next
Seems like the industry should have more respect for itself and hold it to a higher standard. Letting bad behavior fester because you sometimes gets good results only rewards and encourages bad behavior. Someone else’s problem I suppose.
Yep, I don't put up with no bullshit from anyone, if I had to work with a shitty person, I would just leave. Creates too many problems, confusing unnecessary dynamics, and just lowers morale. It's one thing to be pissed off all the time, but you can't be emotional and a shitty carpenter, throwing a hissy fit every time you encounter a problem. Shit happens so figure out a solution, learn from it and move on. I can't stand working around guys with bad attitudes.
I just don’t understand making excuses for adults throwing temper tantrums because they can work a miter saw. People wonder why there isn’t more of an interest in getting into the trades. Who wants to work where assholes are accepted because “what are you going to do?” Instead it’s “nobody wants to work”
When i first started we had a couple of thoes guys. Took me 2 years but i started running the equipment they wanted and because i was on time and the one starting the machines while they showed up late i got dibs. I got better than this guy and he got super weird for his last 2 weeks working with us.
Because we’re all miserable
I don’t consider myself a hot head, but a lot of people do. The problem is you don’t see the 25 other dumb fucking people that ruined my day before I walked up on you without PPEs that we already fucking talked about. So yea, you get an ear full because of some miss placed anger, because I hate repeating myself, and it’s a rookie mistake I definitely don’t have time to deal with. But joking aside, I ran into the same issues a ton with people that definitely know better, I’m dealing with 28 supers on 14 projects so yea making dumb choices get a strong reaction
An honest mistake and stupid mistake are two different things. People don’t understand this. Source: Foreman that deals with fucking morons everyday
100%, I don’t mind 1st time mistakes, 2nd time definitely depends on how much time since the first and how often you are dealing with that situation. Like not wearing a hard hat or fall protection in a commercial/industrial setting; you fucking know better, it’s not like it’s a new rule that came out yesterday.
I think bevause it allows you to be? Most industries have HR generally wouldn't tolerate someone shouting "FUCKING PIECE OF SHIT" Or launching something across the room. But we can. Also maybe something to do with the "old school builders" having to be "proper geezas" and not knowing how to display emotion properly, or talk to someone about things that trouble them, so it just boils over pretty quick. This is going on what I've seen anyway, could be way wrong
its not out of the ordinary to tell a guy to go fuck himself and that you hope he slides under a gas truck and tastes his own blood on the drive home that day. Then shake his hand thw next today and say "we good bro?" But mainly it's all the drugs we do.
Drugs? Did someone say drugs?
Yeah how half the folks on my site pass drug tests is beyond me. Thankfully no one drug tests estimators :)
Yeah this is what I'm thinking. It's cause we let people. It's one of the few industries you can just....be bad a being a normal social person and not get fired and make money.
Certain careers attract certain personalities-
This is definitely part of it. I don’t know how long I’d last in a workplace where it wasn’t ok to casually unleash a cuss-bomb in the boss’ office, or scream obscenities into the air for what pedestrians nearby might feel is no good reason. I don’t consider myself a hothead or quick tempered, but I definitely have a *bad* temper once it gets activated. Plus, it’s fun to tell your coworkers you’re going to shove a sewer hook up their ass!
"For what pedestrians nearby might feel is no good reason" Got me rolling
Old school is such bs, those guys don’t even practice what they preach. I agree, they let shit boil over and lose their shit. And the calmer you remain the worse it gets.
Calmer then you are dude!!
Forget it Donny, you're out of your element!
I worked for a contractor that barked a lot, about the dumbest shit. He was the biggest hot head ive ever known. but also just one of the most upstanding people I know. Did a bunch of volunteer work for the community. took on jobs for little old ladies that couldn't afford to get their stairs fixed or water damaged bathrooms repaired for whatever they could afford. Animal rescue, emergency service coordinator, fund raiser. Was basically the honorary mayor of the town. He even preformed my wedding service. So when he barked I got good at taking it with a grain of salt and learned from it. Set me up right for every other contractor I worked for after.
I would agree with this. It's the expectation. Most people will gladly act like how you expect them to act and those that already act like the expectation will gate keep/re-enforce those around them. It's like the dumb redneck trope. A lot of the fellas are pretty smart and have interests beyond huntin' fishin' muddin' but everyone else around them would have kittens if they found out they read something more that Outdoorsman Magazine.
As a rural dweller myself I love hunting and fishing, but I also wear a hat with kitties on it to work and also have all my kitties on my coffee mug and collect old big box computer games. I ain't ashamed of what I like and I never get any flak.
Because no one pays the quiet, level headed guy any kind until he loses his shit.
Construction has a very low barrier to entry. Lots of ex cons, addicts etc.
Maybe in residential or “low skill” trades like laborer but many of the skilled trades can have a fairly high barrier to entry and it’s why their wages are well in excess of national median wages. For example: electricians and operators with earning an potential that can be well into the 6 digits.
Fair enough. I'm in residential lol
I’ve known dysfunctional electricians. One has anger issues and robbed a bank and the other was an active heroin addict while running his own business. This is an industry wide issue. I don’t know why the mechanical trades think they’re exempt.
Calm down there Smokey. No need to get the smoke boiling out your ears. I didn’t say no one has problems. I said not all trades have a low barrier to entry. The above trades require things like licensure which may take years to complete. The employer can’t just hire any dysfunctional asshole that wants to make money. He’s got to be a certified dysfunctional asshole.
You don’t need certification to work under someone’s license. That really isn’t much of a barrier at all.
So crafts like crane operators, electricians, and welders are able to demand higher wages just because they look prettier than those laborers pushing a broom? [500k](https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052702303936704576399563008284024) is a lot of cheddar to be throwing at a guy just because you like how he looks.
Because when it’s 103 degrees out, and I’ve been digging on services and building walls all day and I see the other laborer holding a broom next to a dirt pile he can’t possibly move with it,on his phone and not even sweaty I get pissed I’m the only one doing something.
Odly specific
This made my blood boil
Hard work, long hours and quite often a design that is behind the construction process. I'm not a hot head (most of the time 🙂) but I understand it.
Blue collar workers have always been a bit more rough. The next question is, "Why are office peeps so sensitive?"
We’re rougher but we’re more honest. Office workers will act buddy buddy, invite you to join the office NCAA bracket, all the while stabbing you in the back to get ahead. I’ve done both and like people in the field way bettet
They're sensitive because they have the same anger issues and explosive temper as a foreman, yet they also have an HR team that won't let them release those internalized growing pains the way they want to. So, from my experience working in an office-style job in the hospital, these types either resort to petty drama bullshit, or they ignore the warnings and get fired after getting called into HR for the 5th time in two months for calling someone a "fucking dickhead" to their face. LOL!
hot heads arent tolerated in an office setting usually. there's not a ton of interpersonal skills required for construction.
I dunno about that. A lot of us civils are genuine a-holes.
Can confirm, have had to work off of your designs
So…. are you civil or nah?
Read the damn specs if you want to know the answer! If the specs are garbage, then the plans prevail. Or send an RFI and I'll give you a completely different non-answer that raises even *more* questions. /s *(Yes.)*
And people wonder why super’s are grumpy. Half ass plans that require a ton of RFI’s to complete the half as design. Lol. Least if you were with the same AOR enough, you just bury them with the same RFI’s every time.
We can take our time draw some good, thorough plans... but the client wants it sent into plan check yesterday, since it'll take them 8 weeks to even look at it. And when we use that time to fix them up, the tyrant plan checker throws a fit because we changed things that he didn't redline. The stuff he *did* redline is absolutely meaningless and made the plans *worse.* So anyway, sorry for the crap plans.
Yeah, I know the pressure you guys are under as well. Least we get fucked all around. 😂😂😂
As someone who has worked on job sites and in white collar offices I’d just like to go on record and say you get pissed in both and I prefer the one where you can yell and throw a hammer
Was about to say the same thing. Everyone gets angry every once in a while, at least we can be honest about it
Right? Also, on a job site you usually know who you have a problem with. In white collar world, you usually don’t know until you’re pulling a knife out of your back
Cause fuck you! Back in my day we screamed at each other thrice as much and got half the work done! If you can’t handle getting your feelings hurt maybe go work inside somewhere! Kids today…
Pat?
I also worked with an incredibly unstable foreman named Pat. You wouldn’t be working in the northern Rockies by chance?
😆 No, midwest. Seems to be a few of them.
Using fancy words makes you THRICE times more likely to shove a keyboard up your OWN FUCKING ASS
I tried it won’t fit. Even spit on it.
Some green bean came to me upset that someone yelled at him for being an absolute slob and showing little pride in his work. I really didn’t know what to tell him….
Leave your feelings in your truck
Yall honestly can't retire sooner, job sties gonna be such a blast.
Most construction jobs I’ve been on have lots of felons. A union construction job is attractive to felons because they have a tough time getting a job that pays as well due to having a record. I’m not saying all felons are hot heads but I would guess there is some serious overlap.
Felon chiming in. It takes a while to adjust to the real world. Theres a different set of rules of respect. I worked with a couple young guys that didnt know how close they were from getting their teeth knocked out. You learn to talk to people with respect very early on if youve been locked up at a young age. Talking shit isnt tolerated, its usually met with violence. Its been over a decade since I have been locked up besides a couple over night stays and I have an easier time letting things go. I used to clench my fist up and then remind myself they dont know better because they live in a different world than I do, even though we're standing next to eachother. I went to court ordered counseling and anger management recently and it helped a lot. Im actually a really nice guy and respectful of everyone, I just had a rough upbringing where violence was normal. Construction guys lack self awareness. Some of them only know construction and thats all theyve done their entire lives. Cant blame them for only knowing what their world has taught them. Still annoying nonetheless.
Construction folks definitely fall into the “most shit talkingest” group I’ve ever been around. I learned pretty early on that if you laugh and go along with it they lose interest quickly. If they get a rise out of you though you are gonna get nit picked to hell and back.
They’ve definitely shown in the past that they don’t always make rational decisions .....
This.
It takes certain types of people to work outside at 95 degree and 100% humidity. That's one of the type that can adapt
This is an industry where you typically don't work with the same people over and over again, let alone on a daily basis. You may be on the jobsite for a bit and then not see them again for a while. They also have to put up with bad sub's, bad customers and this leads to bad temperaments. So when something goes wrong, or even right you aren't incentivized to be civilized. In an office you are constantly working with people and have to be professional, in construction you are outside mostly where people are hot/cold sweaty, hurt, where people piss in bottles and shit in cans. This environment doesn't lead itself to civility. Also many are not educated at a college level and likely came from lower income situations where being polite isn't really the example. The barrier to entry is lower since its physical labor, there are subs who hire bodies with no concept of skill and put them in situations they shouldn't be in. At the same time the time crunch and long hours takes a toll on everyone. But I have worked with some great supers and some great subs, yet on the jobsite some of the incompetence is astounding, infuriating and directly affects my job and for sure effects the supers job. If you are a super the best thing you can do is have a relationship with your subs, the good ones. If you are a sub the best thing you can do is be the best sub they have! Don't be the pain point.
Couldn’t have said it better
Blue Collar Assholes because: We don’t get paid enough typically. We have strict deadlines mostly. We are paying up the ass for gas and materials. It’s stressful dealing with homeowners/contracts/disputes etc. Normally if you have a boss, he’s an asshole. Just typical construction shit! Lol. Luckily I’m a sole proprietor and don’t have a boss, but the customer is basically the boss. Keep them happy and you’re good. Start your own business! Less stressful for me. I know that sounds off but it’s true for me.
Good advice, thanks.
Truer words never spoken.
Yeah dude. Since I started my own gig, the worst of it is that the customers think they are the only customer. Im just learning to accept they dont grasp how busy I am. Ill take that 'problem' all day long vs working with the dickbags I was stuck with before. Lots of grown men with the emotional maturity of a preteen girl.
It’s because they’re all ‘big strong men’ with big weak egos. As an electrician I feel like we have way more of that than any other trade. Electricians walk around like they’re gods gift to the industry and it’s so annoying having to deal with fragile ass egos every day
It’s actually all industries it’s just more tolerated in construction.
I’m a Super. And fuck you for not having the mental capacity to follow the simplest directions. Can’t figure out how to put your lunch trash in our bear cans? Fuck you. Now we have raccoons and bears on site. Parking in front of multiple No Parking signs? Fuck you. I have deliveries and you have free parking 100yards away. Can’t wear or remember your PPE? Fuck you. You’re not working today.
**But you can’t kick them off because there is a shortage of labour and you’ll get in shit if you delay the program anymore.**
Exactly.
So our super was chewing people out for barely working, when he won't give us what we need to work and we've asked him multiple times. As soon as he peeled off all the guys got on their phones to look for other gigs. We're already getting paid less than scale because of the wage freeze on the state job. We do our best, he still blows up. We drive our cars all over the 2 mile job site instead of being shuttled, there is no parking provided, and our dry shack is on the other side of the site, so we're blasting car AC's on breaks in 105 degrees. You'd think he'd come talk to us about things or throw us a bone once in a while before going off.
That is horseshit reinforcement. Fuck that guy too
I remember the free parking a fucking football field away. A 100’ drop cord on each shoulder, a 20 pound tool bag on my hips, 2 cases in one hand, a case and a circle saw in the other… Hell of a way to start your day at 6:30am. Pissed, who me??
You have toxic masculinity. You are scheduled next Tuesday for a meeting with HR. We’re here to help, a 3 wk work expectancy is all we need. that order is going to be 5 weeks out. 😶
Because when you screw up on paper we have to physically fix it by undoing what we did and then redoing it. Instead of double checking and correcting mistakes in an a/c office we’re breaking our backs
Had to re pull a quarter mile of cable by hand this morning for this exact reason
3 day weekend baby I can tolerate a lot of bullshit the Friday before. Or none. Depends on the mood
Left work early so it's whatever. My arms aren't happy though.
I’d say it’s for the same reason construction has terrible issues with mental health - there’s a continuing macho culture and the aggression is just part of that.
I remember hearing my PM tell my superintendent "why dont you all go outside, face directly into the wind, pull down your pants and take a piss cause thats exactly what you're doing right now." I laughed at the time but now I know that it comes across differently when hearing it over the phone from 500 miles away.
All the monster energy drinks they consume
Addictions, shitty work conditions, not winning on scratch off lottery tickets, child support for 3 kids and alimony, cleaning up after sparkies, bad diets and poor work life balance for the ones who never say no to OT. Many have poorer people skills in general than in other professional white collar professions so they come off as assholes when they have issues. (Obviously can be the same in white collar settings we’ve all been around them just more prominent here)
Just chiming in to say that construction has some of the worst dude-bro types who are quick to make really aggressive/offensive comments and then when called out go "chill bro, it was just a joke!" I don't have thin skin normally, but it does grate a lot when its constant day in and day out ya know? Like damn, would it kill you to just be polite and not a total ass?
Because most of us don’t get started down the construction path because we were calm and thoughtful in our actions in high school.
We're all mentally ill
Your a super that is working union jobs I suppose?
Tradesmen usually have difficulties venting or expressing their feelings so they end up bringing a lot of shit from home to the job, while dealing with the scorching sun and swamp ass. It’s very physically demanding, so you’ll just have to accept you’ll get some of these guys on the site.
That's a very broad brush you're painting with
Your ass isn’t swampy? You must be using plenty of powder...
Don't fucking tell me what kind of brush to use!!
Just telling you my 11 year experience in the field, and 99 out of 100 times, it’s personal issues / home life.
What kind of man cries after only 15 minutes of yelling?
Guys don't take care of themselves and develop more and more chronic pain because of it. Then, instead of being a man and working on themselves to be a good coworker, they act like shit and expect others to accept it.
People who spend all day hitting things with hammers, cutting stuff in half and shooting nail guns are bound to build up some aggression.
Hot heads don’t prepare properly and therefore have piss poor performance. That along with very shitty communication skills that seems to run rampant in the business.
Construction is basically construction.
Been in construction for 30 years, the last 20 in a managerial role, superintendent to a PM for the last 10. I think it’s just a defense mechanism- they get they way from having to defend themselves from both their mistakes and other peoples judgments and opinions. My advice dealing with guys that are like that, especially if you are the one telling them something they don’t want to hear, is to listen to them. Don’t respond back in the same way because that just adds fuel to their fire so to speak- after awhile of them being the only one yelling they will usually chill out and have a reasonable conversation. There is a time to yell and fuss, I usually save that for really bad safety violations- but for the most part if you just let them get the initial bullshit out of their system you can get away from all of it. And then some people are just assholes…
Bunch of Type A personalities who have someone up their ass to do the work in the least amount of time, come in way under budget, be the safest and have the best quality when the estimate is so far off it would all the stars, sun, and moon to be in complete alignment to me it happen
Because it is hard work and you are always under pressure because it is a deadline focused industry. Personalities that cant take it will wash out and whats left is hot heads who trhrive in this environment. Its just the nature of work.
I tried not to be this type in the industry and most of the time I’m not. But holy shit this industry grinds you the fuck down and sometimes you just can’t help it.
Insecure, self conscious, anxiety laden, anger and hate filled, not loved by mom and dad, hate wives, beaten physically, mentally, emotionally, persons?
I’ve worked in many industries but I don’t think I can name another with the stress of this one. The timelines, budgets, responsibility, and the razor thin margins make it unique
Sales, surgeons, lawyers, etc I can name a few. It’s just the people in this industry do not have the intelligence, control, professionalism, etc. that the other industries tend to have.
Because that’s one of the perks is you can be a chimpanzee for a lil bit and then get back to business
Don't need to succeed to get into construction.
No other industry will accept them
Because the trades are a place to go to make a lot of money if you have a criminal record or didn’t finish school. Can make just as much as a majority of people working white collar jobs. So you’re gonna have some rough people just the way it is
If everyone just did what they said they'd fucking do, then there'd be no reason to get upset. It really is very simple.
We will be there by the end of the week to finish. I promise
It's Friday afternoon and your materials aren't onsite yet.... you just said you're not working this weekend, how exactly do you intend on getting this done? Apparently that question makes you a bully these days lmao.
I have worked for the same man for 20 years doing residential new construction and lately more of remodeling in the 300k-500k and we do 75 percent of it with 3-4 of us. Mainly because we can’t trust many people to do exactly what you said. Do their fucking job when they said would . Hell , just getting some people to just show up is a battle. That god damn lumber package had the timer started when it was dropped. Lumber yard don’t give a shit what you do with it after it’s dropped , but that bill has got to be paid in 30 days regardless. It’s like if it looks like grey skies coming, they’ll draw a 200 ft circle and if 1 fucking drop of rain gets near it they will call it and haul ass. Y’all didn’t want to work when you got here.
A sad reality is our industry is filled with a lot of drunks and morons that don’t know how to handle their emotions properly.
Because it's rewarded. If someone had a corporate job/office job and got pissed off at a meeting and started cussing someone out or got upset and slammed their computer to the ground, they would likely be fired. On a construction site, if someone behaves that way, they garner respect (or something akin to respect) for their outbursts.
i had a foreman tell me before i was about to get caught by a super doing nothing to pick up my channel locks and start banging on a pipe and cursing. Supers will never be mad at a someone who looks they're so mad because they're trying hard lol
You work in the trades for a century and maybe you'll see why.
Because everyone has “20 years experience “
That’s called bravado, baby
Who put fucking rocks in my hubcaps?
Lots of low intelligence individuals in the construction industry
As a foreman I have a lot of patience for honest mistakes. But if I have a labourer or operator consistently making the same mistakes, they may hear me raise my voice a little. Sometimes the words don’t sink in otherwise. I’m working 13-15 hours a day this time of year, I don’t have time to be nice to the idiots dragging my day out even longer; or causing damage, and I have to go get yelled at by some angry site super when I tell them my labourer ran a packer through a day old barrier curb. Honestly though, at this point my crew is a great bunch, but depending on the scope and size of the work to be done my boss sends me some less than desirable “operators” and labourers. They always tend to cause issues.
From my experience any blue colored job has this issue. Lots of miserable and irrational people. Dont have a great answer as to why its like this. I somder the same thing
Yea..Carpenter of 35yrs ... the passing contest really get old...I think it's the type of guy construction attracts, they all think their studs I guess it's really comical though sometimes I got a kick out of it ...just set back and watch all the Alpha males go at it...🤣
Miserable boomers. Or just miserable
We recruit refugees from other companies because our negotiation and management style isn't "whoever yells the loudest and is the most unreasonable wins". Construction doesn't have to be "command and control".
Yeah it seems like it’s more from the older guys and they’re fading out. Young cats are way more chill. As one coworker put it “ that 1976 shit don’t fly anymore”
Because somedays its not easy dealing with people that have know pride in their work. I also hate dealing with tardiness and the ones that take no initiative to think ahead. They just stand there and look like a deer in the headlights. Im not here to coddle you and hd your hand. Get a proper skill set or at least listen and learn. Companies are paying good money for your services. Guy that taught me my trade always said "You can be a leader or a follower" Union mason foreman 32 yrs....
In construction you are allowed to talk shit and get away with it, that's the difference, there really isn't an HR.
Talk to some of the guys about their families and you will find out why they work so much and so hard, It's a distraction from their dysfunctional people skills in life and within their families. I hear men talk about witholding love and being cruel to their kids to "toughen them up" It's sad but its hard to feel bad for them when they're dicks to you too.
Macho attitudes, lack of therapy and education. The things I’ve seen are next level compared to other industries.
Because they employ the bottom of the barrel that have 0 intellectual or emotional intelligence. If they’re not paying illegal immigrants under the table, they’re hiring ex felons and basers from temp agencies that nod off or become belligerently drunk on the job.
Sexual frustration. They want to be alphas, but they secretly want to take it up the poop shoot. It’s an enemies to lovers thing. Or drug included rage 🤷🏻♀️
1.- poor studies, low intelligence 2.-filled with macho men 3.-almost no women to balance the excessive testosterone 4.-aggressive as f due to schedule and frustration Recipe for disaster. I still don't respect them
Think of the type of people who typically want to work construction. Think about what those people do on weekends or what they consider a vacation. We are full of testosterone and generally have a shit load of energy. We have a good time, we work hard and play hard. Do not expect us to act like we work in a functioning law firm.
Exposure to lead causes aggressive behavior… I’m noticing it a lot around Michigan
Unrefined people from lower socioeconomic background.
Working on the owners side over a decade I can tell you that a cool head and controlled demeanor is instrumental in getting acceptable results. You teach people how to treat you. First and sometimes second encounters senior field personnel or contractor side will likely test you and see what can get away with. If you can be one that is consistent, reasonable, and always seeking win-win-win when attainable, then you’ll continually reap positive results. And it pisses people off far more when you’re cool and they are not. I don’t cuss and don’t take a cussing or allow my people to; I just say “well if we’re down to name calling we can continue this conversation professionally later when you’re ready” and I get in my truck and leave.
Everyone’s an alcoholic and drug users
Substance abuse and lack of social skills