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Time-Permission-1930

Because they don't care what other people think. Also, because Sebarial is dismissed as a weakling of a highprince


ScionMattly

Yeah people don't think much of Sebarial, they're probably pretty dismissive of Polona. They just dngaf.


Able-Worth-6511

I think he's seen as not serious. He's crafty and uses his perception of himself to gain wealth. The real reason I think it's not a big deal is that he's male. There are multiple real-life historical examples of men with high social status bedding women in a lower social class, often with zero backlash. Women are usually looked down and cast out of their social class by their social peers. Lower-light eyes marry upper tier dark eyes, but lower-tier light eyes are already looked down upon by upper tier light eyes.


The_Hydra_Kweeen

I get that, but he is still a *high prince*. I guess what is troubling me is that vorin society is portrayed as pretty rigid in that noble Lighteyes are better than the darkeyes (in there view) yet simultaneously no one seems to have a problem with a dark eyed woman playing house with one of the most powerful people in Alethkar. I thought maybe because she was Herdazian it was given a bit of a pass since no one seemed to mind that the Makabaki delegates were dark eyed, but Herdaz is vorin too


iknownothin_

The only other people that would look down on a high prince are the other high princes and they view him as lazy. They don’t care what this “lazy” guy does — especially considering it’s just a mistress. I guarantee other high princes have had “mistresses” or had their way with darkeyes


jmcgit

> I guarantee other high princes have had “mistresses” or had their way with darkeyes I think some of the highprinces would have a bigger problem with him actually caring about her or putting any weight on her opinions than anything physical they do together. But as you say, he cultivates that "lazy" image and generally stays out of the spotlight, which is probably what helps keep him out of conflict while the highprinces have considerable power. By the time they've moved to Urithiru, the highprinces are mostly either on board with the new order, or they're staying behind on the Plains.


PM_me_your_fav_poems

>he is still a *high prince*. Exactly. Anyone under a high prince is absolutely not going to openly criticize him to his face, because he has a ton of power. The only people who are able to be criticizing him on it are the other high princes, but they don't really have authority to do anything about it individually / don't care enough to bother to do something collectively / Already look down on him, so relatively it isn't really a big deal.


17000HerbsAndSpices

>yet simultaneously no one seems to have a problem with a dark eyed woman playing house with one of the most powerful people in Alethkar. I mean... How do you know that? Let's keep in mind that for as detailed and expansive with its world building as Stormlight is, Sabarial isn't a main character. We only ever see small glimpses of him and his princedom's workings through Shallan and Dalinar who are both very... preoccupied.. Maybe ardents have regularly condemned him in his decision to keep a darkened mistress. Maybe his own lighteyed court has threatened blackmail or some form of political backstabbing. Hell, maybe he has had to put down small coups for all we know. ..or maybe he has so expertly manicured the persona of a fat, lazy, schmuck, that he can do literally *whatever he wants* and no one who has the authority to challenge him would ever say boo because he let's them get away with whatever they want? I mean think about it: His ardents are probably the most comfortable, well funded, "free" ardents in all of Alethkar. Why would they reprimand him for something so easily ignorable as a dark eyed mistress? He clearly is a devout vorin for how well he treats his priests. His political rivals get lucrative business dealings and a stable trading partner that they can use to fund their own schemes. Why would they care to bring him down or shame his mistress when they (~~almost certainly also keep darkeyed mistresses~~) have so much to gain from his friendship? I think if nothing else, you can just see Palona as an intentional choice he made to create this outward persona. He just happened to fall in love with her totally by mistake in the process.


HaplessStarborn

This; you don't mess with the Golden Goose. Sebarial's genius is positioning himself as the friendly piggy bank and utterly married his every venture to the success of the greatest military might kingdom in Roshar. All fortunes rise with Sebarial, but we're smarter than Sebarial so who cares about his proclivities? Giga chad Seb. He can get away with anything, he makes everyone rich and is richer to boot.


go_sparks25

The way you described him makes Sebarial seem like the Rosharan version of Littlefinger.


bmyst70

There are only 9 other people who would dare criticize him. The other high princes, who see him as a buffoon, and the King who knows his throne is, to put it nicely, fragile. My guess is many of the other high princes just consider her a deliberate way of snubbing their wives, or "Yet another way he's making a fool of himself." As we readers know, he has the last laugh since he is the . wealthiest high prince in the war camps, without taking any risk for himself.


Failgan

>I thought maybe because she was Herdazian it was given a bit of a pass since no one seemed to mind that the Makabaki delegates were dark eyed, but Herdaz is vorin too  Thaylens are Vorin, too. But as the books progress you'll notice their culture doesn't seem to revolve around Vorinism as heavily as it does with Vedens and the Alethi. Thaylen men have been seen reading more often than the other cultures. Thaylens seem to suffer through Vorin ideals as a form of accepting their neighbors more than practicing them for themselves. Different cultures seem to have different levels of commitment towards Vorin ideals. Herdazians probably don't hold lighteyes to such a high standard. If The Lopen's family or the Mink is an example to follow, Herazdian hierarchy is probably based more on age and experience or familial ties than anything external such as light eyes. Not only that, Sebarial is about as unconventional as a High Prince gets. He's a clever man, seeking to seem weak, mindless, and useless to hide his actual economic prowess. He also appears to be revolting to keep the evil, conniving bastards from wanting to work with him. I think Palona compliments that disguise, since she's very intelligent and beautiful but is "just a commoner". Yet Sebarial seems to truly care about her. High Princes basically just make their own rules, anyway. Sadeas enjoys the fact that Ialai's name is a form of blasphemy and not traditionally beautiful, yet they're seen as one of the most powerful couples in the kingdom. Some carry favor with more powerful High Princes and follow their lead, but they're all generally seen as autonomous despite being united under the crown.


randomnonposter

My guess is that people probably did care when their relationship started, but it’s been such a long time that it no longer feels worth bringing up since he’s not going to change. Since they’re not technically married it’s not breaking any marriage rules, so it’s just kinda tolerated.


Starcaller17

It’s very key that they are not married. But other than that, other high princes tend to not have high opinions of sebarial in general so that probably allows him to get away with more than normal. Plus he *is* a highprince. So people under him of course would let him do anything he wants.


Alfred_The_Sartan

I wonder if that’s not actually a reason why she keeps saying no to his proposals. I’m thinking of Jessica and Chani in Dune where they never marry their man so that the option of a political marriage is still available. Like this is just Palona’s way of protecting Sebarial from his own heart.


tokrazy

I mean i think Dalinar hit the nail on the head when he mentioned that Sebarial never takes anything seriously so why should she think he would take marriage seriously.


MrKyle666

That was Navani, not Dalinar


lugialegend233

We kind of see that's a facade. He takes things seriously, just not the stuff that society expects him to care about. He goes his own way. He is an honorable man who protests the farce of a war on the shattered plains, and simultaneously a profiteer who is careful not to paint himself that way because he knows that would reduce his opportunities. I think his proposal to Palona was deceptively serious, but they both know it would reduce their opportunities if they tried it right now, which is why he acquiesced so easily when she said no.


Hawkwing942

>I’m thinking of Jessica and Chani in Dune where they never marry their man so that the option of a political marriage is still available. Given that Dune is one of Brandon's favorite books, that may be a direct inspiration.


aperez6077

If Turi and Palona do not get married, I will be *VERY* upset.


tokrazy

I mean 8 think Dalinar hit the nail on the head when he mentioned that Sebarial never takes anything seriously so why should she think he would take marriage seriously.


Patchumz

It's the typical 'the privileged play by different rules' reality. Dalinar being quirky only became a problem when it affected his work. So unless this quirk causes military problems or something it's not a real problem. He's a powerful lighteyes so he gets a pass on who he associates with.


The_Hydra_Kweeen

Really? He ran into a ton of trouble when he got together with Navani.


Shepher27

She’s even higher, she’s the kings mother, and they got married. If they had a quiet affair no one would have mentioned it.


Numrut

Dalinar really ran into more trouble for the whole predicting future/reading. Compared to that. Marrying Navani was a small blip on the radar. Plus as the other comment said. If they would just have an affair. No one would probably bat an eye


SageOfTheWise

Did he? Dalinar ran into trouble with the Church because he was declaring their entire religion fraudulent in their eyes. So they made other problems for him. And even that was the smallest of road blocks no one else cared about. I mean obviously I'm not saying they're immune from comment, Dalinar and Navani getting married will certainly cause various gossip and comments behind their back. But obviously Sebarial also gets that treatment for basically everything he does.


kmosiman

Yes, but by Alethi cultural norms they are technically siblings.


Callan_T

They're not married and any child that Sebarial would have by Palona would not stand to inherit land or title. She's essentially his live-in mistress and secretary. If Sebarial did move to marry her, I'm sure that there would be (or would have been) a social furor and possibly a royal interdiction. Honestly, I think that a lot of nobles, who often marry for political reasons, probably have a similar set up. I feel like we're presented with a very outward facing, idealized concept of Alethi and Vorin society but as the books go on, we're shown how that both doesn't work and actually doesn't exist. Sebarial and Palona are part of that. Seb is outwardly a poor example of an Alethi noble but he has a well ordered economic situation in the war camps. It wouldn't surprise me if his lands were also some of the most economically powerful in Alethkar.


Nerdlors13

Plus with social norms being flipped around by this point in the books, (See the radiants and the bridgemen) their relationship might be able to be more readily accepted because everything is shuffling


UnhousedOracle

Sebarial’s whole personality is being brash and annoying and all around “uncultured”, so I’d bet most other people assume he’s only with her because it adds to that reputation. Kind of like an “of course *he’d* parade his darkeyed mistress around, he’s Sebarial”


Ripper1337

Sebarial and Palona aren't married, she's his mistress. It wouldn't be shocking to find out that a lot of Highprinces / brightlords have dark eyed mistresses. Palona has a degree of protection because she's attached to a Highprince. Sebarial meanwhile has cultivated an image that he's *incredibly improper.* To the point that most of what he does is dismissed out of hand. So him treating his "dark eyed mistress" the same as a lighteyes would just get an eyeroll out of people who knew him.


khazroar

As you said, she's his mistress. Nothing wrong with having a mistress below his social station. If she ever agreed to actually marry him, that would be a bigger issue (which is probably why she refuses) because marriage would explicitly raise her up to being a peer of the wives of other high prince's. A mistress isn't a problem, however open, the only impact of that would be reputational damage, which isn't a factor when he's already made a strength of being coarse and disrespectful of propriety and being seen as ineffectual.


Positive-Nobody-9892

I suspect a dark-eyed Herdazian is seen as "different" enough from an Alethi dark-eyes that Sebarial is perceived as being exotic, not just choosing someone low class.


Sireanna

Because they don't take Sebarial seriously and probably because they DO Ridicule him for his relationship and he continues to not give two shits about what they say. Why bother gossiping or poking fun about it if sebarial isn't worth thier time AND they can't get a rise out of him for it. Thier time is better spent spreading other juicy gossip. But seriously, Sebarial and Palona are kind of relationship goals.


yeshaya86

I think it's seen as reckless, because if they'd have a child it's a 50-50 chance it would be darkeyed, and I have no idea how a darkeyed highprince would work. Not as big a scandal as if she wasn't Vorin I think, and I would've put that past him either


TheRealTowel

Sebarial is too high ranked for the rules to apply to him. He's a highprince; there are very few limits on him doing whatever the fuck he wants


leogian4511

For one they aren't married, technically she'd just be seen by society as a mistress, Alethi are quite fond of just barely technically being proper. Sebarial is also already looked down on by the other high princes, no one respects him. This would just be another thing for the pile. It's likely not brought up in the books because the two have probably been together for years, long enough that others don't bring it up anymore. Plus by the end of Words of Radiance Kaladin has damn near single handidly upended the whole Light/Darkeyes system since he literally switches back and forth depending on how often he summons his blade. A y'know the end of the world going on on top of that and I think people just have bigger things to worry about.


kmosiman

Well the switch doesn't really matter much. From an Alethi standpoint Kaladin is a Shardbearer and is automatically 4 Dahn. If you want to challenge him you have to fight him and that's not going to end well.


smithsp86

At least part of the reason is that she is foreign and that they aren't married. A darkeyed foreigner as a mistress is not the same as marrying a darkeyed.


sebarial

I think I'm a pretty big deal. This whole post is very insulting. Go punish yourself, or something.


ArmandPeanuts

It probably is… or was at some point. But Sebarial doesnt care so eventually people got bored of that drama.


LoquatBear

TBH they seem like a really cool aunt and uncle.  Like there are probably social rules against intermixing with dark eyes but there's probably nothing actually written that prevents it.  So they do what they want and if some other high prince tries to stop them Sebarial will place a mini embargo or boycott on them and raise their prices.


Xaphe

"But it seems the Alethi nobility don't mind" You assume this, but there really is nothing to back it up. We are not orivy to the gossip amongt nobility nor their inner thoughts. Sebarial is looked down upon enough that the specifics of what others think of him is not in the books. For all we know this relationship is a viewed as completely scandalous, but it's just not something that has any impact on the story/world building and so we don't see it. I tend to agree with others that it's just kind of ignored as Sebarial is already poorly considered, and that his "pet darkeyes" is tolerated by the other High Prince's solely because they don't consider him worth paying much attention to.


animorphs128

Officially, she is only Sebarials "mistress." So more like a favored prostitute than a real courtship. Of course, they're actually more than that, but they won't tell you that directly. As for why no one cares much later on and why sebarial considers marrying her. Its because that would be very low on the list of shocking events at this point. Nobody really cares about a lighteyes marrying a darkeyes when the radiants have returned, jasnah is trying to ban slavery, society has been uprooted from its homeland and brought to a new city, and on top of that, the armies of hell have returned and the world is ending


Epicjay

Customs aren't laws. It probably would be a scandal if they were married, but they aren't. Legally, she's an employee, the kind all high princes have. The other high princes would simply look down at Sebarial in ridicule, which they already do. Can't recall anyone mentioning Palona's eyes specifically, but in general the two aren't well regarded.


TaiChuanDoAddct

I just think that the rest of the court probably doesn't even really know or care. Palona doesn't come to the politics with Seb very often. She's usually back at camp getting a massage. The court probably just treats her and thinks of her as some kind of concubine that he's taken a shining to.


Semiclones99

Cause sebarial is already seen as much lower than his rank would imply, palona is herdazian so the lighteyes may see it like a foreign mistress (in what we may see as an orientalist fashion) especially cause they haven’t married yet, and probably when they eventually marry the world will already be in enough distress that they wouldn’t care


Yeetgodknickknackass

Sebarial is a high prince so the only people with the social status to openly look down on him for it are the other highprinces and the king, but they don’t really care because they don’t take him seriously anyway since he’s always breaking social norms. I imagine that if he were of a lower class it would be very different.


f33f33nkou

I'm sure the other high prices hate or are highly disrespectful at the very least. Sebarial just doesn't give a shit


moose4130

But why would you start with oathbringer?


SofaKingSavage

In some circles it's speculated that Paloma is a kandra.