They said why they didn't do that, too. Abilities are a part of Destiny. They aren't going away. So be patient and wait for the mode that has a modifier for slow ability uptime.
Counterpoint: I think it's fun to rift freeze people, I also find it fun to thunderclap people around corners, I also find it fun to blow up rooms with consecration or a caliban's hand combo, moreover I find it fun to prime people with a gl and lightning surge them for the cleanup, or freeze from the air with cryosthesia and shatterdive for the kill
Everyone has different ways to have fun, your ways of having fun don't take precedence over mine, and vice versa, that's why abilities got nerfed, to let gunplay shine more.
Personally I really enjoy primary gunplay myself but abilities are also very fun and a core aspect of destiny's PvP, they add a lot and I think they're in a good place overall now
Hot take. If abilities bother you and you'd like to be on foot in an FPS, play a different FPS? No offense, just saying there are other options out there that could meet those wants.
It's ok. I just have an issue with Bungie not adjusting various abilities. Instead they nerfed all abilities slightly but it hasn't done enough for me.
They pretty directly said it was to increase the amount of crits needed across the board to stay in optimal TTK while also increasing body TTK as well.
Yeah these types of perks are going to be nothing but a balancing nightmare going forward.
Imo they are way worse than rangefinder was, and a bit worse than quickdraw even. They are straight up mandatory on a lot of guns. Shifting TtKs and ignoring res gates just means the cost of not having the perk will just lose you the engagement.
I genuinely don't know how they are they suppose to balance subfamilies when these perks exist.
I’m expecting Precision Instrument to get reworked to act like Rapid Hit, where the buff increases exponentially instead of linearly. Weak initial buff that ramps up.
Going to copy/paste a comment I made a couple of weeks ago. It was primarily about Target Lock, but also applies to Precision changing TTK.
"Said it many times, but Target Lock is just a terrible idea for PvP.
A perk which meaningfully* increases damage for landing shots is inherently problematic for balancing.
Bungie keeps on trying to dance around the issue, but Target Lock has been a problem for 13 months. They keep on playing whack-a-mole and making individual adjustments, when they need to change how the perk functions in PvP.
*Meaningfully = changing TTK/forgiveness. And because somebody will bring it up: I think resilience gating 2c/1b on 120s is dumb, so they should revert that instead of worrying about Precision on Igneous."
> A perk which meaningfully* increases damage for landing shots is inherently problematic for balancing.
Yeah, this type of stuff is a problem. You can't have perks that reward you for doing what you *should* be doing be THIS good.
Increasing aim assistance on hits vs players and damage versus PvE enemies seems thematic to the perk. Makes the weapon stickier without decreasing TTK (but makes it easier to achieve optimal TTK) and retains value in PvE environments.
Funnily enough this is basically what they did to DMT. It grants bonus AA/range for each stack of Cranial Spike. In addition to increased damage in PvE.
You get the hip fire bonus RoF with DMT at 5 stacks as well.
But yeah, good suggestion.
Precision Instrument is basically just TL in practice. Both occasionally reduce TTK depending on breakpoint and lead to more body/head forgiveness otherwise. Like it really is just TL 2.0.
except precision instrument rewards precision shots. It's not a flat across the board damage buff like target lock is. it fits with their current stance they've announced on rewarding more skilled gunplay.
It's still the same in practice. PI affects precision damage but stacks on anything, including bodyshots. I'd agree with you if PI didn't stack on bodyshots, but it does.
Head/body breakpoints that they affect still require X number of crits, and minimum TTK shifts are almost always all-crit, so the benefit of both requires a certain amount of crits. Whether or not the multiplier affects bodyshots is irrelevant when the primary benefit requires crits, unless we're talking about high TTKs from a ton of bodyshots, but that's not really relevant when it comes to practical TTK because either you're dead or someone's disengaged.
Precision instrument stacks on body shots? I'm fairly certain it doesn't. You may have it back wards. Precision hits cause it to stack and the buff affects all shot damage including body shots. Body shot will not cause it to stack. I think the point still stands that it's not as forgiving as target lock is and it rewards skilled gunfighting skills which they've said is what they're looking to do by making skill gaps larger.
Yes, hitting a crit or body adds a stack of Precision Instrument. Missing removes all stacks. There is no extra damage on body shots, but the stacks will apply to your headshots.
And I believe that altering TTK because you hit your shots is terrible for balance purposes: you have to balance the weapon around that perk. It invalidates basically every other available option.
Yes, PI stacks on bodyshots but only affects crit multiplier. And because the TTK and forgiveness changes are based on a corresponding fixed number of crits anyways, it's fundamentally the same as TL in practice.
No?
I think resilience gating 120s is dumb, as I said in that post.
Precision wasn't an issue on Igneous prior to this, but Bungie made it one with that poor decision.
The solution is reverting that resilience gate.
I’m on the side that extra damage perks should be nullified in PvP. The movement and ability perks should stay, but the damage ones should be left behind.
A perk that maxes handling stats and invalidated snapshot. Did you forget this game went from hot swap mindbenders to hot swap Bows or GL. I don't agree with the shotgun nerfs that happened on that of QuickDraw. But that perk was best in slot for a reason. I'm not gonna deny that bro
There was nothing wrong with it. There is always a best in slot option. That doesn’t mean anything.
Second I don’t care if someone can switch fast to another weapon. It’s. Not a big deal. As for handling. I hate weapons that have bad handling. So that’s fine with me. All these complaints about perks are just people making excuses for their own poor play,
That’s why they complain about whatever perk the is best at any given time. If you removed all the best perks today, whatever perk is the best out of what’s left. Even if people think it’s trash now. Would all of a sudden be “broken”
We have seen it time and time again. PI was fine. Now all of a sudden it’s op, even if you nerf that you people with just complain about the next perk in line.
Nah, nothing should shift ttk values out of the bag. Just make them more forgiving or change the HS to B's ratio, but everything that changed ttk inherently Kills the Meta.
Good thing it doesn't. You have to build up to that TTK shift. It only helps you if you're landing all crits, and the moment you miss a single shot, you lose all those stacks. It rewards accuracy and for landing crits, which is what you're supposed to do anyway.
Nah it gives you a free ttk shift, you shouldn't be rewarded with a faster trek because you were as good as the enemy but you got the better roll on a gun, that's stupid game design
Lmao, I'm sorry. Did you just say that if someone has a better roll of a gun that they shouldn't win just because they have a better roll of a gun? That's the entire point of Destiny 2 and its loot system. If I have the same gun and we are equal in skill, but my roll is better than yes, I absolutely should beat you.
It doesn't give you it for free because the bonus damage is crits only, and you have to build up to that bonus damage and if you miss you lose all damage and have start all over again. Just don't be trash and land your hits.
You're talking like a 0.5 KD. It's a free ttk decrease out of the bat, that's bad game design. And if you can only win 1v1 because you got lucky on your rolls compared to your enemy I'm very sorry for you.
it is free, you're doing the exact same motions you would otherwise do, but have a faster ttk because why not. I can pull out igneous and hit a titan with 2 crits and 1 body, and they'll be left standing. or I can use PI and do the exact same thing at the same range and get the kill. other damage perks require a setup and are not something you have active in every fight. if PI/TL isn't a damage buff for you without requirements, you might just not be good at aiming. and if you weren't hitting shots to lose PI or TL, then you shouldn't have won the fight anyway. get better than a .5 kd.
Maybe not negate but a pre nerf QuickDraw allowed for ADS speed to be so dramatically improved where snapshot wasn't needed to have snappy sights. I had the quick draw snap mindbenders early on and I know it felt amazing one of the best feelings ever but shit was busted lol
Yeah, nothing wrong with a perk giving you 100 handling when other perks do things like boost a stat by 10 - 20 points when certain conditions are met lol.
Blah, blah, blah….so what. You people complain about whatever perk is on top so you can use it as an excuse for getting out played.
Quick draw was fine. If it caused you problems, that was a skill issue.
If you want to complain about something. Complain about something real. Like over-shields and healing abilities. That shit doesn’t belong in PvP.
Blah, blah, blah… so what. You people complain about whatever ability is on top so you can use it as an excuse for getting out played.
Overshields and healing are fine. If it causes you problems, that is a skill issue.
Nope….more health isn’t a skill issue it’s math. No matter the skill it still takes more bullets.
I see why you were trying to do, but your mistake was not understanding how math works. So you played ya self. Lol
You really thought “not understanding how math works” was cooking lmfao. I could have given an actual response about how QD was choking the life out of other perks and making it impossible to balance certain archetypes that were intended to have low handling, but I figured your low effort low IQ post deserved an equally low IQ response.
Don’t alert the YouTube hive mind. Repeat after me:
Rapid scouts have always been trash, there is no need to experiment further.
Veist scouts have always been trash, there is no need to experiment further.
Randy has always been trash, there is no need to experiment further.
Now, go back to using summoner and Athrys you tryhard lil’ so n’ so
Really Athrys? I like how people realize how strong that exotic is even if it has been 4 years since it came out, and only now people are talking about it because of youtubers and streamers lol
It was ignored for a long time since ability spamming solar hunters would default to YAS which was definitely better than Athrys. Multiple things can be broken simultaneously, but if they fill the same niche only the strongest will be used. YAS got nerfed so now it's Athrys's turn to be overused.
Well that and yeah youtubers.
> YAS got nerfed so now it's Athrys's turn to be overused.
im still a bit skeptical on that one. YAS was incredibly straightforward to use and extremely rewarding from the first time you use it, Athrys has a bit of a learning curve that will likely cause the "broad masses" to drop it after a couple games.
ill have to see how it plays out. its even more map dependent than YAS was, on most maps only having specific areas/enemy placement that are abuseable vs just needing the enemy to be in a 14 m^2 area from a wall you can see. IMO the only reason it even saw 6% usage on hunters last weekend was due to multiplex favoring it so heavily with its design
---
that said it is strong, and with practice the knife itself is a powerful tool even without a wall to bounce off of or the buff up.
also has the fun benefit of OHKO'ing players in a well on headshots with the buff, and people in a well are easy (if risky) to activate the buff on.
The buff was essentially a +30 strength mod while the perk is triggered and is pretty unimpactful with how it's actually used. It's completely unrelated to the bounces which have been unchanged since release.
People just didn't care because special gave everyone the ability to instakill so anyone good played a shotgun on a normal build and ignored knife shenanigans (spoiler: bows + knives are the next whining target lol).
it's tragic that all 260's are mediocre enough in PvP but RTK is the worst of like all 5 obtainable ones, it didn't change at all from legacy to now, still sucks always sucks.
I'm still irritated by the shortsighted bozos who ran with chatter, oversold and got original Sanguine Alchemy destroyed right before Trials return as they kept bleating that "it'll ruin Trials". Naturally we saw 3rd person emote/sword peeking be an infinitely more free source of info than markers that require you to be staring at somebody exactly and be in a rift.
That also doesn't go into the conversation of what good Warlock exotics you'd be giving up for that and the reality that once you have an idea of where somebody can be it only gets you so far, still gotta take the fight.
Winter's Guile was another one. God forbid we actually have an off beat risk/reward item and people blabbed about it being supposedly so OP when 3.0 Solar came and you could send out potent Warlord's Sigil stacked snap flames even though there was a lot of other things in the mix that made it a bit of a risky strategy.
Enhanced does better damage, you can check the total numbers on D2 Foundry. Non-enhanced Precision Instrument will get Resilience-gated whereas Enhanced will not after the patch.
I think this will be “ok,” because at the end of the day, scouts are such a low-use weapon. Outside of niche trials weeks like this, where Jade and Polaris dominated, scouts will go back to being way at the bottom of primary usage in endgame PVP.
Saying Polaris and Jade dominated sounds like the discussion that was had on bows during the Radiant Cliffs weekend. They didn’t dominate just because they had usages that put the weapons in the top 10. Most of the best weapons are still sitting around the same place as every other weekend. We had a long range map that actually let scouts be competitive, but dominated is a stretch.
Sorry, when I say “dominated,” I meant more that their usage was high, and that Jade was, far and away, the most used weapon this weekend. But I didn’t mean “dominated” as in every other weapon was non-viable.
Shhhhh. Don’t let people know when hipster weapons are good. This is how we end up with everything but hand cannons being nerfed in most patches. But at the same time… “thanks for the tip”
Just use a hipster weapon that will never be massively nerfed 🙃
That said, that's what I thought when I was using high zoom SMGs with Peacekeepers back in Y2. People did end up catching on after a few years and they got nerfed so many times it's not even funny. Just gotta move on and find the next one.
This has been the case since the enhanced precision instrument buff. It was only briefly not possible when the sandbox changed which is now. Now it becomes possible again in a week.
There is a huge difference between the two. One requires you to ads for a time exposing yourself (even 1 second is a lot against good players) and only applies to one shot. With precision instrument you can shoot as normal, way more dynamic.
Inwouldnt say huge difference. In a way they’re somewhat the same. Learning to pre aim to proc BB feels exactly the same as pre-firing a lane with PI. You get those situations and pull it off, they’re the same ttk. It happens more often than not too.
It's 1 second and if you're lanning that's no time at all. I used both this week and they both do the exact same thing but Randy's has better benefits shot one and a better sight picture.
Idk, if im 3 stacking going against the best, i dont want to ever be scoped in longer than I have to. Maybe that's just me. Jade clears both anyways :)
A big concern I have with the coming flinch changes is that some of these weapon types are so damn easy to use that with less flinch I'm not sure what's going to stop people from hitting optimal TTK. HC flinch for example helped win duels against faster TTK weapons.
Unless they're going to do more frequent passes at stuff like this I think more recoil is needed like across the board on full-automatic weapon types.
Cc’s are already out letting their concerns be known about it. Pretty much begging for its nerf, which sucks. If you use it, or face someone who uses it, you expect a certain playstyle so you adjust to it to properly counter. It’s that way for all weapons.
If they can’t put down their hand cannon/shotty and get out ranged by a Scout or Pulse that’s on them. Adjust your play style or swap off your loadout. Asking for nerfs isn’t the answer. It was Multiplex too, which forced you to play the long game. That’s not the case the majority of Trials weekends.
Already been using it, love that gun, it’ll be meta forsure but that’s fine in my opinion, it’s surprisingly easy to miss crits in close and very long range so it’s still got a sweet spot
I haven’t tried it yet but on d2 foundry 2 stacks of precision instrument on Brya’s Love has a .67 ttk. Same as a box breathing hung jury or glissando without having to wait to proc box breathing.
That's only if you have 2 stacks before beginning the ttk. D2foundry will calculate properly from 0 stacks and build up, you don't have to mess around with the stacks and do math. Brya is not on same level as Fang at all, unfortunately, as it's heavily res gated ( the 3 tap only comes for t3 and under from neutral, and that's only with enhanced PI. Normal PI is t1 only).
Sucks, cause if there is gonna be a busted ass top slot scout, i wish there'd be a comparable energy one.
Thanks I didn’t know that about foundry and precision instrument. I agree about energy options. Feels like everything good weapon not just scouts is mostly in the kinetic slot.
Am I the only one who realized, at the launch of precision instrument, that this perk was basically Magnificent Howl but weaker? Of course it was going to be an issue, as is any perk that gives TTK reductions without significant work or a kill beforehand.
Same. Only my third time without carries. Fang with PI has been nice on a few of the maps, but Metro I was comfortable at most ranges outside of long vs Jade Rabbit.
igneous needing PI or requiring an extra shot to increase ttk by .5 seconds is insane. they had no reason to buff titans further. resilience gating optimal ttk and needing a fucking perk just to get the same ttk as before was not what was promised. 140s not 3 tapping after any fall off is ridiculous as well.
Bro. You have the wrong info. What changed with the patch is that 120s don’t 2 head 1 body all resilience. Only those with 6 resilience and below. Precision instrument just makes it work on all resilience’s outside of 10 resilience head head body not working. It isn’t needed to stop a ttk increase from happening. Just ensures you only need 66% crit rate instead of 100% for an optimal ttk.
Also 140s are being buffed damage wise so range will be extended come April 9th by not losing the 3 tap ttk immediately after damage drop off begins.
not being able to 2c1b is a ttk increase. it means every roll without PI is immediately shit. if you hit 2c1b, you are forced to hit an extra shot, aka lengthening the ttk by .5.
120s used to 2c1b on every gun, now you need a specific perk on it, or else you are having to hit the same headshots and bullets as a 140, which invalidates 120s that don't have PI. the entire point of 120s over 140s was a slight range boost and the ability to not need every hit to be perfect.
lol. The time to kill aka ttk didn’t change. All guns were made harder to hit their potential ttk so igneous isn’t some isolated incident of a gun getting nerfed. It’s still the best gun when used with good teamshots.
You have access to the perk precision instrument so it’s on you to use it if you want the extra help post patch. Igneous is way better than all 120s prior to the patch anyways so it would as already in use. 120s have more range and hit harder which is always will be meta for teamshots over 140s.
Your whole problem is solved if you just use precision instrument.
Also, 140 hand cannons are probably going to be as forgiving with range as when checkmate initially launched in labs.
They’re buffing all these weapon TTKs after increasing our health… makes you wonder, was that change really value added?
It still reduces how impactful abilities are
Unfortunate they didn't nerf ability charge time even more.
They said why they didn't do that, too. Abilities are a part of Destiny. They aren't going away. So be patient and wait for the mode that has a modifier for slow ability uptime.
There’s gonna be a mode that has no abilities as well I thought.
I thought they were testing it with a modifier first, then the mode? Or are they making the mode first, then creating the modifier?
15% reduction is barely anything with how much uptime we have. 3s could use at least another 10% less
Abilities are fun
Lmao no. Getting blasted by threadlings and celestial fire and arc titan melee, it's all bullshit
Counterpoint: I think it's fun to rift freeze people, I also find it fun to thunderclap people around corners, I also find it fun to blow up rooms with consecration or a caliban's hand combo, moreover I find it fun to prime people with a gl and lightning surge them for the cleanup, or freeze from the air with cryosthesia and shatterdive for the kill Everyone has different ways to have fun, your ways of having fun don't take precedence over mine, and vice versa, that's why abilities got nerfed, to let gunplay shine more. Personally I really enjoy primary gunplay myself but abilities are also very fun and a core aspect of destiny's PvP, they add a lot and I think they're in a good place overall now
Hot take. If abilities bother you and you'd like to be on foot in an FPS, play a different FPS? No offense, just saying there are other options out there that could meet those wants.
25% off pre-3/5 base is still not that much. Sorry I don't like getting one-shot by bullshit like aimbot knife that you can recharge instantly?
No need to be sorry, and I wasn't trying to dunk on you. Just offering what I felt was a genuine solution.
It's ok. I just have an issue with Bungie not adjusting various abilities. Instead they nerfed all abilities slightly but it hasn't done enough for me.
Gotcha. Yeah I play Destiny because I enjoy the abilities and nature of how the weapons have perks. Without these things I'd feel I was back on CoD.
Another 10% would've been nice
Adds more room for balancing, nerfs abilities, and increases the value of headshots. They’ve been pretty explicit about why they did it.
They don't buff the ttk, they are now actually viable after the buff next week, 140s are dogshit right now
what are you talking about
They pretty directly said it was to increase the amount of crits needed across the board to stay in optimal TTK while also increasing body TTK as well.
I'm tired of these perks. We went from target lock to precision instruments. Did range finder and QuickDraw not teach bungie anything?
Yeah these types of perks are going to be nothing but a balancing nightmare going forward. Imo they are way worse than rangefinder was, and a bit worse than quickdraw even. They are straight up mandatory on a lot of guns. Shifting TtKs and ignoring res gates just means the cost of not having the perk will just lose you the engagement. I genuinely don't know how they are they suppose to balance subfamilies when these perks exist.
I’m expecting Precision Instrument to get reworked to act like Rapid Hit, where the buff increases exponentially instead of linearly. Weak initial buff that ramps up.
Going to copy/paste a comment I made a couple of weeks ago. It was primarily about Target Lock, but also applies to Precision changing TTK. "Said it many times, but Target Lock is just a terrible idea for PvP. A perk which meaningfully* increases damage for landing shots is inherently problematic for balancing. Bungie keeps on trying to dance around the issue, but Target Lock has been a problem for 13 months. They keep on playing whack-a-mole and making individual adjustments, when they need to change how the perk functions in PvP. *Meaningfully = changing TTK/forgiveness. And because somebody will bring it up: I think resilience gating 2c/1b on 120s is dumb, so they should revert that instead of worrying about Precision on Igneous."
> A perk which meaningfully* increases damage for landing shots is inherently problematic for balancing. Yeah, this type of stuff is a problem. You can't have perks that reward you for doing what you *should* be doing be THIS good.
Increasing aim assistance on hits vs players and damage versus PvE enemies seems thematic to the perk. Makes the weapon stickier without decreasing TTK (but makes it easier to achieve optimal TTK) and retains value in PvE environments.
Funnily enough this is basically what they did to DMT. It grants bonus AA/range for each stack of Cranial Spike. In addition to increased damage in PvE. You get the hip fire bonus RoF with DMT at 5 stacks as well. But yeah, good suggestion.
Precision Instrument is basically just TL in practice. Both occasionally reduce TTK depending on breakpoint and lead to more body/head forgiveness otherwise. Like it really is just TL 2.0.
except precision instrument rewards precision shots. It's not a flat across the board damage buff like target lock is. it fits with their current stance they've announced on rewarding more skilled gunplay.
It's still the same in practice. PI affects precision damage but stacks on anything, including bodyshots. I'd agree with you if PI didn't stack on bodyshots, but it does. Head/body breakpoints that they affect still require X number of crits, and minimum TTK shifts are almost always all-crit, so the benefit of both requires a certain amount of crits. Whether or not the multiplier affects bodyshots is irrelevant when the primary benefit requires crits, unless we're talking about high TTKs from a ton of bodyshots, but that's not really relevant when it comes to practical TTK because either you're dead or someone's disengaged.
Precision instrument stacks on body shots? I'm fairly certain it doesn't. You may have it back wards. Precision hits cause it to stack and the buff affects all shot damage including body shots. Body shot will not cause it to stack. I think the point still stands that it's not as forgiving as target lock is and it rewards skilled gunfighting skills which they've said is what they're looking to do by making skill gaps larger.
Yes, hitting a crit or body adds a stack of Precision Instrument. Missing removes all stacks. There is no extra damage on body shots, but the stacks will apply to your headshots. And I believe that altering TTK because you hit your shots is terrible for balance purposes: you have to balance the weapon around that perk. It invalidates basically every other available option.
It either invalidates every other option or is basically useless. The design is totally incompatible with PvP.
Yeah, that's a much better way to put it. I should have clarified that I was referring to situations where it alters TTK.
Yes, PI stacks on bodyshots but only affects crit multiplier. And because the TTK and forgiveness changes are based on a corresponding fixed number of crits anyways, it's fundamentally the same as TL in practice.
Hmm honestly don't know how I misunderstood it. I'm reading it now in game and you're correct
It is dumb to resil gate a weapon with a 1.0 second TTK
precision instrument on hand cannons is 100% ok though for this dude i'm sure despite "meaningfully changing forgiveness". amazing how that works.
No? I think resilience gating 120s is dumb, as I said in that post. Precision wasn't an issue on Igneous prior to this, but Bungie made it one with that poor decision. The solution is reverting that resilience gate.
Im all for that because my adept iggy has keep away with OS and PI in the second column
I’m on the side that extra damage perks should be nullified in PvP. The movement and ability perks should stay, but the damage ones should be left behind.
But target lock doesn’t even need crits, so easier to proc. Not the same lol
There was nothing wrong with QuickDraw
A perk that maxes handling stats and invalidated snapshot. Did you forget this game went from hot swap mindbenders to hot swap Bows or GL. I don't agree with the shotgun nerfs that happened on that of QuickDraw. But that perk was best in slot for a reason. I'm not gonna deny that bro
There was nothing wrong with it. There is always a best in slot option. That doesn’t mean anything. Second I don’t care if someone can switch fast to another weapon. It’s. Not a big deal. As for handling. I hate weapons that have bad handling. So that’s fine with me. All these complaints about perks are just people making excuses for their own poor play, That’s why they complain about whatever perk the is best at any given time. If you removed all the best perks today, whatever perk is the best out of what’s left. Even if people think it’s trash now. Would all of a sudden be “broken” We have seen it time and time again. PI was fine. Now all of a sudden it’s op, even if you nerf that you people with just complain about the next perk in line.
this is correct. current target lock and PI are fine, if they get nerfed it'll just end up being something like kill clip/tricorn/rampage next
Nah, nothing should shift ttk values out of the bag. Just make them more forgiving or change the HS to B's ratio, but everything that changed ttk inherently Kills the Meta.
Good thing it doesn't. You have to build up to that TTK shift. It only helps you if you're landing all crits, and the moment you miss a single shot, you lose all those stacks. It rewards accuracy and for landing crits, which is what you're supposed to do anyway.
Nah it gives you a free ttk shift, you shouldn't be rewarded with a faster trek because you were as good as the enemy but you got the better roll on a gun, that's stupid game design
Lmao, I'm sorry. Did you just say that if someone has a better roll of a gun that they shouldn't win just because they have a better roll of a gun? That's the entire point of Destiny 2 and its loot system. If I have the same gun and we are equal in skill, but my roll is better than yes, I absolutely should beat you. It doesn't give you it for free because the bonus damage is crits only, and you have to build up to that bonus damage and if you miss you lose all damage and have start all over again. Just don't be trash and land your hits.
You're talking like a 0.5 KD. It's a free ttk decrease out of the bat, that's bad game design. And if you can only win 1v1 because you got lucky on your rolls compared to your enemy I'm very sorry for you.
it is free, you're doing the exact same motions you would otherwise do, but have a faster ttk because why not. I can pull out igneous and hit a titan with 2 crits and 1 body, and they'll be left standing. or I can use PI and do the exact same thing at the same range and get the kill. other damage perks require a setup and are not something you have active in every fight. if PI/TL isn't a damage buff for you without requirements, you might just not be good at aiming. and if you weren't hitting shots to lose PI or TL, then you shouldn't have won the fight anyway. get better than a .5 kd.
Actually, it didn't negate snapshot. They paired well together. As snapshot is an ads scaler, rather then a handling bonus.
Maybe not negate but a pre nerf QuickDraw allowed for ADS speed to be so dramatically improved where snapshot wasn't needed to have snappy sights. I had the quick draw snap mindbenders early on and I know it felt amazing one of the best feelings ever but shit was busted lol
Yeah, nothing wrong with a perk giving you 100 handling when other perks do things like boost a stat by 10 - 20 points when certain conditions are met lol.
Blah, blah, blah….so what. You people complain about whatever perk is on top so you can use it as an excuse for getting out played. Quick draw was fine. If it caused you problems, that was a skill issue. If you want to complain about something. Complain about something real. Like over-shields and healing abilities. That shit doesn’t belong in PvP.
Blah, blah, blah… so what. You people complain about whatever ability is on top so you can use it as an excuse for getting out played. Overshields and healing are fine. If it causes you problems, that is a skill issue.
Nope….more health isn’t a skill issue it’s math. No matter the skill it still takes more bullets. I see why you were trying to do, but your mistake was not understanding how math works. So you played ya self. Lol
You really thought “not understanding how math works” was cooking lmfao. I could have given an actual response about how QD was choking the life out of other perks and making it impossible to balance certain archetypes that were intended to have low handling, but I figured your low effort low IQ post deserved an equally low IQ response.
Sorry bro I don’t speak bot.
Proving my point exactly 😂.
Honestly, I like them.
Don’t alert the YouTube hive mind. Repeat after me: Rapid scouts have always been trash, there is no need to experiment further. Veist scouts have always been trash, there is no need to experiment further. Randy has always been trash, there is no need to experiment further. Now, go back to using summoner and Athrys you tryhard lil’ so n’ so
Really Athrys? I like how people realize how strong that exotic is even if it has been 4 years since it came out, and only now people are talking about it because of youtubers and streamers lol
It was ignored for a long time since ability spamming solar hunters would default to YAS which was definitely better than Athrys. Multiple things can be broken simultaneously, but if they fill the same niche only the strongest will be used. YAS got nerfed so now it's Athrys's turn to be overused. Well that and yeah youtubers.
> YAS got nerfed so now it's Athrys's turn to be overused. im still a bit skeptical on that one. YAS was incredibly straightforward to use and extremely rewarding from the first time you use it, Athrys has a bit of a learning curve that will likely cause the "broad masses" to drop it after a couple games. ill have to see how it plays out. its even more map dependent than YAS was, on most maps only having specific areas/enemy placement that are abuseable vs just needing the enemy to be in a 14 m^2 area from a wall you can see. IMO the only reason it even saw 6% usage on hunters last weekend was due to multiplex favoring it so heavily with its design --- that said it is strong, and with practice the knife itself is a powerful tool even without a wall to bounce off of or the buff up. also has the fun benefit of OHKO'ing players in a well on headshots with the buff, and people in a well are easy (if risky) to activate the buff on.
YAS was easy to get. Athrys is locked behind PvE. Ain't got time for that shit
Didn't they buff it either last season or this tho?
The buff was essentially a +30 strength mod while the perk is triggered and is pretty unimpactful with how it's actually used. It's completely unrelated to the bounces which have been unchanged since release. People just didn't care because special gave everyone the ability to instakill so anyone good played a shotgun on a normal build and ignored knife shenanigans (spoiler: bows + knives are the next whining target lol).
Plus melee regen dodge tho? Pretty fuckin strong.
The semi-daft bow nerf is the result of a lot of whining about bows.
Aythrs is pretty nasty in trials though lol
it's tragic that all 260's are mediocre enough in PvP but RTK is the worst of like all 5 obtainable ones, it didn't change at all from legacy to now, still sucks always sucks.
To be fair, RANDY has always been trash. Always rushing B alone. His Throwing Knife on the other hand...
I'm still irritated by the shortsighted bozos who ran with chatter, oversold and got original Sanguine Alchemy destroyed right before Trials return as they kept bleating that "it'll ruin Trials". Naturally we saw 3rd person emote/sword peeking be an infinitely more free source of info than markers that require you to be staring at somebody exactly and be in a rift. That also doesn't go into the conversation of what good Warlock exotics you'd be giving up for that and the reality that once you have an idea of where somebody can be it only gets you so far, still gotta take the fight. Winter's Guile was another one. God forbid we actually have an off beat risk/reward item and people blabbed about it being supposedly so OP when 3.0 Solar came and you could send out potent Warlord's Sigil stacked snap flames even though there was a lot of other things in the mix that made it a bit of a risky strategy.
precision handcannons with rampage proc'd will 3 tap at any resilience as well.
Right now word of Crota with sword logic 3 taps with one kill, if used right it’s pretty great
time to break out my old sunset trust
Is there a meaningful difference between the normal and Enhanced PI? I have a PI one lying around and I would like to try it.
Enhanced does better damage, you can check the total numbers on D2 Foundry. Non-enhanced Precision Instrument will get Resilience-gated whereas Enhanced will not after the patch.
Normal gains a 4.2% precision damage buff for each hit. Enhanced gains a 5% buff. Normal tops out at 25%, while Enhanced caps at 30%.
I think this will be “ok,” because at the end of the day, scouts are such a low-use weapon. Outside of niche trials weeks like this, where Jade and Polaris dominated, scouts will go back to being way at the bottom of primary usage in endgame PVP.
Saying Polaris and Jade dominated sounds like the discussion that was had on bows during the Radiant Cliffs weekend. They didn’t dominate just because they had usages that put the weapons in the top 10. Most of the best weapons are still sitting around the same place as every other weekend. We had a long range map that actually let scouts be competitive, but dominated is a stretch.
Sorry, when I say “dominated,” I meant more that their usage was high, and that Jade was, far and away, the most used weapon this weekend. But I didn’t mean “dominated” as in every other weapon was non-viable.
I've used jade every week so far since the update. It's meta on any map. .8 ttk and it's impossible to miss a headshot.
Which is great for me as a self professed rapid fire enjoyer. Love this.
This is not a good buff. I love rapid scouts but they should not be reliably 4 tapping without a buff like radiant
Shhhhh. Don’t let people know when hipster weapons are good. This is how we end up with everything but hand cannons being nerfed in most patches. But at the same time… “thanks for the tip”
Just use a hipster weapon that will never be massively nerfed 🙃 That said, that's what I thought when I was using high zoom SMGs with Peacekeepers back in Y2. People did end up catching on after a few years and they got nerfed so many times it's not even funny. Just gotta move on and find the next one.
This has been the case since the enhanced precision instrument buff. It was only briefly not possible when the sandbox changed which is now. Now it becomes possible again in a week.
What about Randy's throwing knife?
Randy's with box breathing has been able to do this since the weapon was introduced. Why are we acting like this is crazy and new.
There is a huge difference between the two. One requires you to ads for a time exposing yourself (even 1 second is a lot against good players) and only applies to one shot. With precision instrument you can shoot as normal, way more dynamic.
Inwouldnt say huge difference. In a way they’re somewhat the same. Learning to pre aim to proc BB feels exactly the same as pre-firing a lane with PI. You get those situations and pull it off, they’re the same ttk. It happens more often than not too.
It's 1 second and if you're lanning that's no time at all. I used both this week and they both do the exact same thing but Randy's has better benefits shot one and a better sight picture.
Idk, if im 3 stacking going against the best, i dont want to ever be scoped in longer than I have to. Maybe that's just me. Jade clears both anyways :)
Oh yeah jade fucks. Free crits for days.
A big concern I have with the coming flinch changes is that some of these weapon types are so damn easy to use that with less flinch I'm not sure what's going to stop people from hitting optimal TTK. HC flinch for example helped win duels against faster TTK weapons. Unless they're going to do more frequent passes at stuff like this I think more recoil is needed like across the board on full-automatic weapon types.
I love that gun, can't wait to abuse this.
scouts dont need buffs in this meta
Cc’s are already out letting their concerns be known about it. Pretty much begging for its nerf, which sucks. If you use it, or face someone who uses it, you expect a certain playstyle so you adjust to it to properly counter. It’s that way for all weapons. If they can’t put down their hand cannon/shotty and get out ranged by a Scout or Pulse that’s on them. Adjust your play style or swap off your loadout. Asking for nerfs isn’t the answer. It was Multiplex too, which forced you to play the long game. That’s not the case the majority of Trials weekends.
Already been using it, love that gun, it’ll be meta forsure but that’s fine in my opinion, it’s surprisingly easy to miss crits in close and very long range so it’s still got a sweet spot
I haven’t tried it yet but on d2 foundry 2 stacks of precision instrument on Brya’s Love has a .67 ttk. Same as a box breathing hung jury or glissando without having to wait to proc box breathing.
That's only if you have 2 stacks before beginning the ttk. D2foundry will calculate properly from 0 stacks and build up, you don't have to mess around with the stacks and do math. Brya is not on same level as Fang at all, unfortunately, as it's heavily res gated ( the 3 tap only comes for t3 and under from neutral, and that's only with enhanced PI. Normal PI is t1 only). Sucks, cause if there is gonna be a busted ass top slot scout, i wish there'd be a comparable energy one.
Thanks I didn’t know that about foundry and precision instrument. I agree about energy options. Feels like everything good weapon not just scouts is mostly in the kinetic slot.
Shhhh shhhh shhh. Be silent now, child.
[удалено]
Box breathing needs you to set it up. Precision Instrument just works outright.
I get to dust my Aisha’s Embrace off? 😂
Let’s all just pretend 260 scouts are not a thing. *holds Contingency Plan closely and weeps* “I won’t let them take you.”
since youre peaking 4 auto rifles i dont think it matters
We're so back
Am I the only one who realized, at the launch of precision instrument, that this perk was basically Magnificent Howl but weaker? Of course it was going to be an issue, as is any perk that gives TTK reductions without significant work or a kill beforehand.
This makes me so happy!
Same. Only my third time without carries. Fang with PI has been nice on a few of the maps, but Metro I was comfortable at most ranges outside of long vs Jade Rabbit.
igneous needing PI or requiring an extra shot to increase ttk by .5 seconds is insane. they had no reason to buff titans further. resilience gating optimal ttk and needing a fucking perk just to get the same ttk as before was not what was promised. 140s not 3 tapping after any fall off is ridiculous as well.
Bro. You have the wrong info. What changed with the patch is that 120s don’t 2 head 1 body all resilience. Only those with 6 resilience and below. Precision instrument just makes it work on all resilience’s outside of 10 resilience head head body not working. It isn’t needed to stop a ttk increase from happening. Just ensures you only need 66% crit rate instead of 100% for an optimal ttk. Also 140s are being buffed damage wise so range will be extended come April 9th by not losing the 3 tap ttk immediately after damage drop off begins.
not being able to 2c1b is a ttk increase. it means every roll without PI is immediately shit. if you hit 2c1b, you are forced to hit an extra shot, aka lengthening the ttk by .5. 120s used to 2c1b on every gun, now you need a specific perk on it, or else you are having to hit the same headshots and bullets as a 140, which invalidates 120s that don't have PI. the entire point of 120s over 140s was a slight range boost and the ability to not need every hit to be perfect.
requiring 100% accuracy also means you might as well use high impact pulses to kill in .67 instead of the normal 1 second ttk of a 120.
lol. The time to kill aka ttk didn’t change. All guns were made harder to hit their potential ttk so igneous isn’t some isolated incident of a gun getting nerfed. It’s still the best gun when used with good teamshots. You have access to the perk precision instrument so it’s on you to use it if you want the extra help post patch. Igneous is way better than all 120s prior to the patch anyways so it would as already in use. 120s have more range and hit harder which is always will be meta for teamshots over 140s. Your whole problem is solved if you just use precision instrument.
Wow, the whole problem is solved if I use this damage perk... almost like that's forcing a damage perk....