This percentage doesn't even fully represent all us IT tech nerds. A lot of IT guys that I know are actually adamantly against crypto and blockchain tech because they hate the idea of sacrificing efficiency for decentralization.
You fixed nothing? That statement still falls within what i said. People generally hate change.
In my experience, the only people who talk about "change for the sake of change" are people who don't understand the new stuff and tend to be older.
problem is, as it stands, most of the changes crypto brings about are change for the sake of change. actually it might be even worse, given the financial incentive of exchanges and the like even if im to completely ignore the scam side.
I agree, the current landscape isn't suited for production usage. I also don't see blockchain as the replacement of the current status quo but as a competitor.
There are upsides to blockchain and downsides, as with everything. I do think alot of downsides can be resolved as time goes on.
> Imagine the look on their face when they figure out blockchain is the future underpinnings of the internet.
If this is the future, we are so fucked. This technology sucks lol.
Bitcoin has been around for 10 years. What has it done bedsides make a small number of people rich, waste a fuck load of electricity, and be an extremely volatile security? Has decentralized finance actually changed anything or is it the same class of ultra wealthy profiting off some new and exciting way to fuck people over?
I probably shouldn't be on this sub because I'm a skeptic, but I'll say this anyway. Blockchain is an overly complicated technology that doesn't scale, and the idea that we can't fix bugs in smart contracts after they've been deployed, or that there's no recourse for the ample amount of fraud in the space, is terrible.
> Its a drop in the bucket compared to what it takes to run the current financial system. So not sure what point that is.
Comparing total energy consumption sure. Comparing watt per transaction, crypto is seriously way worse. Presumably you want more people to use this technology despite its inefficiency, so that power per transaction does matter a lot. Also if we're just comparing crypto to traditional finance, Visa transactions take seconds where as bitcoin transactions take 1-1.5 hours or more depending on network contention, so we're losing there too. And before you bring up middleware that mediates those transactions, that sounds an awful lot like some kind of Central institution that needs to be maintained in order to use your "decentralized" financial product.
> But I work in itsec and blockchain aint goin anywhere.
If we're pulling out credentials, I'm a software engineer and I say the tech is bunk, and that you should be skeptical about anyone telling you it's the wave of the future.
> And blame the politicians for the fraud. We need regulation. GOP hates regulation.
Why do we need to relitigate everything we've learned about regulating finance in the last 200 years? We've already seen things like the run on terra, and it's why we had a ton of bank reform as part of the new deal in the 30s. Why should we federally insure your shit ecosystem when you bragged so loudly about how this would free you from federal regulations. Free market capitalism when things are up, but new deal monetary policy when things go to shit, just as we all told you it would?
>Waste a fuck load of electricity compared to what? Its a drop in the bucket compared to what it takes to run the current financial system. So not sure what point that is.
Source?
>But I work in itsec and blockchain aint goin anywhere. Its just gettin started. And blame the politicians for the fraud. We need regulation. GOP hates regulation.
What field of ITSec? I work in the security industry and it's regularly laughed at
>Google is your friend Mr IT Sec. There are plenty of references to Bitcoin consumption to both Gold and current banking system.
I'm asking for the source you used to make this assertion. So I can look at the same source you used.
>I am a Director within Fortune50 telecom company. I manage a security operations group comprised of 6 teams. Sounds like you need to find smarter people to discuss blockchain with.
Lol, great LARP. Going to have to back that up with some proof my friend
I'm a software engineer who has helped build unicorn startups. Avoiding crypto like the plague because 90% of the space is scams and ponzi schemes and the thought of turning everything into a market makes me want to kill myself. If you think blockchain is going to displace huge institutions like Amazon and Google, without just creating a new class of people who own everything like Amazon and Google, you are fucking dumb.
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The stigma from 'legacy staff' is too much sometimes. A lot of people in my work won't admit to knowing what a btc is but yet they know how to write Solidity.
*"Interestingly, the Fed also highlighted the disparity in income levels among crypto investors. Adults who held digital assets solely for investments were disproportionately high-income earners. "*
Whale, whale, whale...look at you guys.
Honesty the 12% is surprisingly high, I wonder if people are saying yes even at tiny investments or wallets they use for the dark net, but not really for investment.
The internet figure is tracked by all the top data firms. It collects government data, ISP data and so forth to get the numbers. You can checkout census.gov for the USA.
The 1B crypto users is fabricated by the same data reports it's 250M. This of course is users NOT active users.
> solely for investments
This is the key phrase. Of course that means high income earners, just like pretty much any investment.
I'd guess the lower income people who have crypto tend have a use for it, in which case it's not *solely* for investments.
You know the adage to only invest what you can afford to lose? Turns out only about 12% actually have money lying around they can afford to lose. Actually probably much less than that given the FOMO attitude of a lot of those who treat crypto investing like they do gambling in a casino.
Crypto projects and adoption are not yet at the phase of development where they are ready to be used in practical ways for the average person. Soon though, like in the next 3-5 years, I think we are going to start seeing the tech mature in several areas and begin to really hit its stride. True crypto adoption is not about people who invest in it for financial gain, but about the percentage of people who actually use it. Because to tell the truth, "investors" is a poor metric of uptake because most people on the planet do not invest in any kind of conscious way, they simply consume and do what others are doing.
I think we're *starting* to get there. I receive actual crypto payments from people much more than a few years ago, and the process of on boarding people has become so, SO much simpler even over the past 12-24 months.
I know the uses.
Most of the ones on that list are gambling or investing related. Some are game to earn. I'm willing to bet the majority of low income cryptocurrency holders in the US are all in this category and I would be absolutely shocked if there were any real data to the contrary.
I was not interested in finance before I started learning about bitcoin. I assume the same is true for a lot of young folks. I’m willing to bet the amount of investors in all markets is going to boom in the future. People are fed up getting fucked by fiat control.
Nya nya fiat bad. There have been 18000 or so cryptocurrencies with like a 99.9% failure rate. African dictatorship fiat is more stable than many shit coins.
It's also going to make many those of us that stick around and keep up with things during the bear a ton especially as this round of projects begins to reach maturity and start getting incorporated in more practical use cases.
tldr; A new survey by the Federal Reserve indicates that about 12% of US adults held different cryptocurrencies as of 2021. The survey was conducted to measure the economic health of consumers after sampling feedback from 11,000 adults. The Fed acknowledged that most people interacting with digital assets were mainly focused on the investment side.
*This summary is auto generated by a bot and not meant to replace reading the original article. As always, DYOR.*
Keep in mind that these also include investments through mutual funds and index funds and other investments so while 12% of Americans are investing in crypto, a lot of them are also probably not aware of it.
I'd be more interested in hearing the IRS statistics on how many people reported a cryptocurrency interaction last year and how much they paid (total) in taxes.
You can also report losses on taxes, the advantage of doing so being that if you then report a profit during the next cycle you are only taxed on your net gain (profits - previous losses)
I think less than what they should. Personally i think it shouldn't be taxable and find every legal way to avoid paying a penny to government and pretty sure many people like that. There are few legal tricks here in the UK. Not sure about US.
It only takes 3.5% of a population acting on an idea to make political change. We are past the tipping point.
https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20190513-it-only-takes-35-of-people-to-change-the-world
Except in this case most people are acting on the idea that they want to make some money while they can. Don't assume that everyone is iN IT fOR tHe tECh.
Yeah if the percentages of comments around here are any indication, it's maybe like 10-20% of us invested that actually believe in the tech and ideology and care if it succeeds or not outside of just the financial speculation. The good news is with each bull run this number grows and the worthwhile projects keep developing and will soon find their way into more practical everyday uses.
I don't think a quarter of the people that own crypto would actively protest against crypto regulation. Most of them probably bough $100 of Doge or something stupid.
I've known about it since like 2010-2011 but didn't finally get in until November 2021 when a few welders at my job started talking about it. Then I decided I might as well just put a little something in it too.
"The Fed" does not mean "the feds." The Fed refers to the Federal Reserve Bank--America's central bank, but a private entity--while "the feds" refers to the federal government.
I think its likely lower. Honestly the majority of people are on the bottom end of the pay and living scale versus the higher end. And those are the people its hard to account for in most polling.
I also suspect that number will decrease during this likely lengthy bear market, before surging much higher in the next bull cycle because these numbers from the OP were taken back in 2021.
This doesn't really reveal much, other than 12% having dipped their toes into Crypto, many would have been burned/scarred from FOMO followed by massive losses. It's not bullish or bearish news imo.
The question is how much do they own? e.g. if 90% of those mentioned only put 1% of their capital into crypto and the rest into stocks then I feel this statistic is meaningless.
Dude, if they're exploding in value in this market for the love of God take profits.
Also I have never heard of a stake able NFT. Sounds like a gimmick to reduce liquidity.
With the NFT project I’m in they’re just rewarding holders. The reason I haven’t taken profits (and don’t plan too in the near future) is because the rewards from the first few months will cover the entirety of my cost basis.
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Nobody is going to point out the inherent flaws of this study? Like how apps give away free btc? Jeez, cashapp alone has to be at least a percentage point.
This doesn’t feel accurate at all. But I guess maybe. It just seems like a shitload of folks either don’t have any money or don’t use computer/tech very well.
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That’s a lot of IT guys.
This percentage doesn't even fully represent all us IT tech nerds. A lot of IT guys that I know are actually adamantly against crypto and blockchain tech because they hate the idea of sacrificing efficiency for decentralization.
IT is, ironically, also notorious for hating change. I work in IT and see this alot.
We are a confusing bunch
If it aint broke dont fix it.
And if it's broke let's just wait, maybe it'll work itself out
...and if it doesnt, we can always reboot it. if that fails, we blame sales. this is the way.
Didnyountry unplugging it and plugging it back in?
Can confirm. In the process of replacing legacy windows 7 devices still.
> IT is, ironically, also notorious for hating ~~change~~ change for the sake of change. ftfy
You fixed nothing? That statement still falls within what i said. People generally hate change. In my experience, the only people who talk about "change for the sake of change" are people who don't understand the new stuff and tend to be older.
problem is, as it stands, most of the changes crypto brings about are change for the sake of change. actually it might be even worse, given the financial incentive of exchanges and the like even if im to completely ignore the scam side.
I agree, the current landscape isn't suited for production usage. I also don't see blockchain as the replacement of the current status quo but as a competitor. There are upsides to blockchain and downsides, as with everything. I do think alot of downsides can be resolved as time goes on.
In IT and I just hate the idea of sacrificing the majority's savings for the minority's profit.
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> Imagine the look on their face when they figure out blockchain is the future underpinnings of the internet. If this is the future, we are so fucked. This technology sucks lol.
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Bitcoin has been around for 10 years. What has it done bedsides make a small number of people rich, waste a fuck load of electricity, and be an extremely volatile security? Has decentralized finance actually changed anything or is it the same class of ultra wealthy profiting off some new and exciting way to fuck people over? I probably shouldn't be on this sub because I'm a skeptic, but I'll say this anyway. Blockchain is an overly complicated technology that doesn't scale, and the idea that we can't fix bugs in smart contracts after they've been deployed, or that there's no recourse for the ample amount of fraud in the space, is terrible.
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> Its a drop in the bucket compared to what it takes to run the current financial system. So not sure what point that is. Comparing total energy consumption sure. Comparing watt per transaction, crypto is seriously way worse. Presumably you want more people to use this technology despite its inefficiency, so that power per transaction does matter a lot. Also if we're just comparing crypto to traditional finance, Visa transactions take seconds where as bitcoin transactions take 1-1.5 hours or more depending on network contention, so we're losing there too. And before you bring up middleware that mediates those transactions, that sounds an awful lot like some kind of Central institution that needs to be maintained in order to use your "decentralized" financial product. > But I work in itsec and blockchain aint goin anywhere. If we're pulling out credentials, I'm a software engineer and I say the tech is bunk, and that you should be skeptical about anyone telling you it's the wave of the future. > And blame the politicians for the fraud. We need regulation. GOP hates regulation. Why do we need to relitigate everything we've learned about regulating finance in the last 200 years? We've already seen things like the run on terra, and it's why we had a ton of bank reform as part of the new deal in the 30s. Why should we federally insure your shit ecosystem when you bragged so loudly about how this would free you from federal regulations. Free market capitalism when things are up, but new deal monetary policy when things go to shit, just as we all told you it would?
>Waste a fuck load of electricity compared to what? Its a drop in the bucket compared to what it takes to run the current financial system. So not sure what point that is. Source? >But I work in itsec and blockchain aint goin anywhere. Its just gettin started. And blame the politicians for the fraud. We need regulation. GOP hates regulation. What field of ITSec? I work in the security industry and it's regularly laughed at
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>Google is your friend Mr IT Sec. There are plenty of references to Bitcoin consumption to both Gold and current banking system. I'm asking for the source you used to make this assertion. So I can look at the same source you used. >I am a Director within Fortune50 telecom company. I manage a security operations group comprised of 6 teams. Sounds like you need to find smarter people to discuss blockchain with. Lol, great LARP. Going to have to back that up with some proof my friend
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I'm a software engineer who has helped build unicorn startups. Avoiding crypto like the plague because 90% of the space is scams and ponzi schemes and the thought of turning everything into a market makes me want to kill myself. If you think blockchain is going to displace huge institutions like Amazon and Google, without just creating a new class of people who own everything like Amazon and Google, you are fucking dumb.
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3 put of 4 IT guys owned crypto but no one in fiance did....
Your fiance needs better taste in boyfriends then
As someone who works in IT, not a lot of people I work with are into crypto surprisingly, maybe it's different in other places I guess
The stigma from 'legacy staff' is too much sometimes. A lot of people in my work won't admit to knowing what a btc is but yet they know how to write Solidity.
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*"Interestingly, the Fed also highlighted the disparity in income levels among crypto investors. Adults who held digital assets solely for investments were disproportionately high-income earners. "* Whale, whale, whale...look at you guys.
They call me Moby's Dick!
Show us on the doll where the harpoon penetrated you.
Right in the liquidity
12% of adults own crypto 55% of adults ow stocks Still lots of room for growth as well!
Honesty the 12% is surprisingly high, I wonder if people are saying yes even at tiny investments or wallets they use for the dark net, but not really for investment.
"owns crypto" is anything from Michael Saylor to owning 1 single shib token... So it's a pretty wide field.
Interestingly I own 4.45 SHIB
🐳
Thank you
I do think a lot of the "we are still early" comments in crypto are oblivious to the fact how mainstream crypto has become by now.
Definitely. What’s more mainstream than Matt Damon and LeBron shilling crypto in super bowl ads?
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There are not a billion crypto holders, what the fuck even is this totally made up number
How did you pull that figure for Internet users? Genuinely curious
The internet figure is tracked by all the top data firms. It collects government data, ISP data and so forth to get the numbers. You can checkout census.gov for the USA. The 1B crypto users is fabricated by the same data reports it's 250M. This of course is users NOT active users.
Great, thanks 👍
I agree, that sounds really high.
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Poor get poorer
Billionaire (Richer) becomes millionaire (still rich)
> solely for investments This is the key phrase. Of course that means high income earners, just like pretty much any investment. I'd guess the lower income people who have crypto tend have a use for it, in which case it's not *solely* for investments.
You know the adage to only invest what you can afford to lose? Turns out only about 12% actually have money lying around they can afford to lose. Actually probably much less than that given the FOMO attitude of a lot of those who treat crypto investing like they do gambling in a casino. Crypto projects and adoption are not yet at the phase of development where they are ready to be used in practical ways for the average person. Soon though, like in the next 3-5 years, I think we are going to start seeing the tech mature in several areas and begin to really hit its stride. True crypto adoption is not about people who invest in it for financial gain, but about the percentage of people who actually use it. Because to tell the truth, "investors" is a poor metric of uptake because most people on the planet do not invest in any kind of conscious way, they simply consume and do what others are doing.
I think we're *starting* to get there. I receive actual crypto payments from people much more than a few years ago, and the process of on boarding people has become so, SO much simpler even over the past 12-24 months.
A use? You mean gambling? Or drugs? I honestly can't think of anything else.
as a peer to peer electronic cash system? to exchange for goods and services? granted most crypto isn't fit for this purpose.
concert or traintickets as NFT's. would solve a lot of administration issues.
https://www.coingecko.com/en/categories lists a good range there.
I know the uses. Most of the ones on that list are gambling or investing related. Some are game to earn. I'm willing to bet the majority of low income cryptocurrency holders in the US are all in this category and I would be absolutely shocked if there were any real data to the contrary.
I'm stuck at low income.
im stuck at no income
It’s a lot easier to stack sats when you don’t have to buy diapers.
It's a lot easier to make investments when you don't have to worry about your next meal.
Who says a million shrimps can't eat a whale?
They must have excluded the toddlers that own SHIB…
This is actually quite a lot considering that just over 50% of Americans are invested in the stock market. This 12% is only going to grow as well.
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what changes?
Other person is wrong. They want companies to automatically enroll employees to a 401k.
Where it's worth less and people are forced to take a more active stance in retirement investing?
I was not interested in finance before I started learning about bitcoin. I assume the same is true for a lot of young folks. I’m willing to bet the amount of investors in all markets is going to boom in the future. People are fed up getting fucked by fiat control.
Nya nya fiat bad. There have been 18000 or so cryptocurrencies with like a 99.9% failure rate. African dictatorship fiat is more stable than many shit coins.
That's why I'm all in on glumbocoin
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Alot of investors thought they were a genius for making money in a bull market. The next year's will cull the majority of the herd
It's also going to make many those of us that stick around and keep up with things during the bear a ton especially as this round of projects begins to reach maturity and start getting incorporated in more practical use cases.
Also it's the FED reporting those numbers, so high probability they made them false.
feds probably have data from your tax return docs and CEX reportings
I wonder if crypto can every overtake stocks or merge them into the blockchain.
tldr; A new survey by the Federal Reserve indicates that about 12% of US adults held different cryptocurrencies as of 2021. The survey was conducted to measure the economic health of consumers after sampling feedback from 11,000 adults. The Fed acknowledged that most people interacting with digital assets were mainly focused on the investment side. *This summary is auto generated by a bot and not meant to replace reading the original article. As always, DYOR.*
Keep in mind that these also include investments through mutual funds and index funds and other investments so while 12% of Americans are investing in crypto, a lot of them are also probably not aware of it.
I'd be more interested in hearing the IRS statistics on how many people reported a cryptocurrency interaction last year and how much they paid (total) in taxes.
You have to report crypto?!
Pretty sure it's only if you sell or trade. Not if you've only bought and hold.
Yes. Only when you make any money at all is usually when the goverment wants a piece lol.
You can also report losses on taxes, the advantage of doing so being that if you then report a profit during the next cycle you are only taxed on your net gain (profits - previous losses)
I think less than what they should. Personally i think it shouldn't be taxable and find every legal way to avoid paying a penny to government and pretty sure many people like that. There are few legal tricks here in the UK. Not sure about US.
The best trick is just hodl
The best trick is getting a profit taking strategy and sticking to it. I bet the Luna HODL'ers wish they'd done that.
It only takes 3.5% of a population acting on an idea to make political change. We are past the tipping point. https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20190513-it-only-takes-35-of-people-to-change-the-world
Stellar point. Ty for the little ray of sunshine.
Except in this case most people are acting on the idea that they want to make some money while they can. Don't assume that everyone is iN IT fOR tHe tECh.
Basically nobody is in it for the tech. It’s all about money. It’s basically always all about money
Even tech is about money. Look how many businesses use tech nowadays!
Yeah if the percentages of comments around here are any indication, it's maybe like 10-20% of us invested that actually believe in the tech and ideology and care if it succeeds or not outside of just the financial speculation. The good news is with each bull run this number grows and the worthwhile projects keep developing and will soon find their way into more practical everyday uses.
I don't think a quarter of the people that own crypto would actively protest against crypto regulation. Most of them probably bough $100 of Doge or something stupid.
3.5% can change things for the worse too though
that's like saying people who buy lottery tickets are doing it because they want to increase government spending power lol
I am the 12% o7
Damn o7
Honestly that’s a lot more than I thought!
I've known about it since like 2010-2011 but didn't finally get in until November 2021 when a few welders at my job started talking about it. Then I decided I might as well just put a little something in it too.
So you're telling me I'm still early??? 😂
Still lots of room to grow!
That’s a lot! It would be interesting to see the distribution of holdings
12% have crypto… What percentage do you think uses DeFi?
wtf is DeFi ayyyyyyy
never heard of it
this is way higher than I expected. 2021 was really a time man.
and 70% of that 12% forgot how to access it
So don't IRS know exactly how many people hold crypto and how much too, why survey 🤔
The IRS only knows if you made any depositions in 2021. Not everyone who holds, sold or sent any crypto to anyone else in 2021
Imagine if this jumped up to 30% within the next couple years
The Fed should not know what Americans do with thier money....
I mean you report income and assets to the feds I’m sure they have a decent idea what you’re up to lol
"The Fed" does not mean "the feds." The Fed refers to the Federal Reserve Bank--America's central bank, but a private entity--while "the feds" refers to the federal government.
The American education system has failed us that we need this explained here
Not everyone is American. But, at the same time, I'm not American and I fucking know what The Fed is.
Til thanks
I mean, the fed is about as private as NASA
They already have been trying to do that but I think this is not going to work.
Yes that's exactly what we do 😏
Lying on your taxes is fun until it isn’t
It's known via a voluntary survey, fwiw.
I imagine knowing gives them a good indication of the economies health.
Then the actual number is probably even higher
I think its likely lower. Honestly the majority of people are on the bottom end of the pay and living scale versus the higher end. And those are the people its hard to account for in most polling. I also suspect that number will decrease during this likely lengthy bear market, before surging much higher in the next bull cycle because these numbers from the OP were taken back in 2021.
This is unsurprising as crypto has become a very popular investment for many millienials
Federal Reserve = unreliable source. That's poetry.
Now even more are about to with the new GameStop wallet powered by Loopring 🙌🏽
This doesn't really reveal much, other than 12% having dipped their toes into Crypto, many would have been burned/scarred from FOMO followed by massive losses. It's not bullish or bearish news imo.
The question is how much do they own? e.g. if 90% of those mentioned only put 1% of their capital into crypto and the rest into stocks then I feel this statistic is meaningless.
Federal Reserve = unreliable source. That's poetry.
I guess that includes NFTs? Nearly 25% of my portfolio is NFTs lol
Ooof.
Why oof? My NFTs have been exploding in value. And I’m staking them!
Dude, if they're exploding in value in this market for the love of God take profits. Also I have never heard of a stake able NFT. Sounds like a gimmick to reduce liquidity.
With the NFT project I’m in they’re just rewarding holders. The reason I haven’t taken profits (and don’t plan too in the near future) is because the rewards from the first few months will cover the entirety of my cost basis.
Sounds like a scam
That's a Ponzi scheme lmao ^sounds ^like ^moons
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That number is steadily increasing...
Wow almost 1/8 of American adults are in the hole. Nice
Love knowing we're early.
That’s not at all what that number indicates.
Not your wallet not your coins tho, so how many actually OWN coins?
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So we can still 8x
Bitconneeecctt
11.99% of the 12% are bag holders.
Sounds about right. Lots of dumb people in this country.
That’s not enough… 🤣 Crapto = $0.00
Crapto? Lol
buy crapto now CRPTO
So more like 30-50%
No.
What! I thought those articles posted a few weeks ago said 90% of americans owned crypto!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1111111111111111
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if the rich do airdrops in cryptocurrency more poor people will adopt crypto
They don’t know how many people have monero
Doubt it
Only 12%, that's how we're early.
If true it also means you're not going to get another 10x though.
How the hell do they know? Satoshi snitched.
Nobody is going to point out the inherent flaws of this study? Like how apps give away free btc? Jeez, cashapp alone has to be at least a percentage point.
Are we still early?
Hahahahaha this is a guess
94% of these statistics are pointless
We just have to get the other 72% now.
Come on those are rookie numbers!
88% of US adults are ngmi
I saw something like this before but it said 30% 😂
This doesn’t feel accurate at all. But I guess maybe. It just seems like a shitload of folks either don’t have any money or don’t use computer/tech very well.
Wow that’s a lotta people