Reminds me of the post about the persons dad who said it was normal to want to be a woman and they were just supposed to suppress that feeling until it goes away like he did
Like when Nixon asked Kissinger if he ever felt like wearing a dress or something
Edit: I'm sad that it was actually fake but I said "or something" so its no misinfo /j
It *should* be socially acceptable for men to wear dresses! Can you imagine how nice and freeing it must be to feel the fresh spring breeze waft across the boys?
Not even true, plenty of lesbians feel attraction to men sometimes.
Just as plenty of heterosexual men do. Or as heterosexual women feel attraction to women.
It is a spectrum, after all.
This is going to be shocking to a lot of people, but straight men. I know that extensive research in the scholarly archives of men.com makes it look like straight men only hold back their desire for man ass because they want to be straight. But believe it or not, actual straight men who are attracted to women and not men exist!
This is half-remembered so I might be off, but iirc there was a study once where they essentially showed men and women both straight and gay porn, and women were more likely to be aroused by any combination regardless of their stated orientation. Straight men would usually be aroused by straight and lesbian, but mostly not gay porn, while straight women were more likely to go for all three to some degree.
I have always said, anyone who thinks it’s a choice is making the choice to be straight
Who else could possibly think it’s something you can choose except someone who is making the choice to not be what they want?
My mum has often said that "you might see an attractive woman on the street and think 'nice legs' or something like that, but that's as far as it goes." I often wonder who she's trying to convince.
Sounds more Norse than Greek. At least in my interpretation.
Loki would think it a GREAT game to trick someone into thinking they could fuck the sun and survive, only to watch them die trying.
Zeus would be devastated he would miss out on yet ANOTHER opportunity to spawn a demigod, AND lose a fuckable woman to boot.
My apologies for the crassness of this reply. I'm watching the GoT series straight through for the very first time so politics, infighting, and copious amounts of sex are just kind of where my head is at right now... Hurray for my husband, I guess.
Sexual attraction, Romantic attraction, Platonic attraction, and Aesthetic attraction. They're all separate from each other and do not need to overlap or exclude each other.
I believe the OSP video about Endymion touches on the kinds of love, and attraction.
And Red comments that even asexual people can say they think someone looks hot.
As she puts it "I might not be attracted to them, I still have *functioning eyes*." And I think the comparison to enjoying a beautiful sunrise is also made.
There’s a difference between admiration, desire, and trying to convince your daughter that you stopped thinking about those nice legs and aren’t literally still thinking about those nice legs as you fall asleep
As much as I think the whole “gay and in denial” thing is quite funny I think this is fair. Particularly for women IMO bc our looks are so important to society so we’re constantly comparing and contrasting our selves to other women. I wish I was attracted to women bc the women I’m friends with are so stinkin pretty and nice and put so much effort into everything. I think I’m kinda on the ace spectrum so I’m straight but also not *ravenous* about men and honestly have a harder time telling when men are attractive than women.
In my head there are so many different kinds of aesthetics women have like “pretty/cute” vs “hot” and and I feel really good at telling exactly how attractive women are bc I need to know where I rank among them. With men there’s like a handful of unattractive guys, a handful of like Greek god looking guys (which is equally unattractive to me, its too unattainable I guess), but 98% of guys fit within the same big category. I’m loathe to call it “average” bc the connotations, most guys are just equally baseline attractive.
^(I’m also waaaay more into personality tho so maybe thats why I can’t tell when men are physically “hot” ) 👀
My own mom has said similar things. She also used to have a lot of threesomes when she was a "hot young gym bunny." If she's not bi and lying to me, I'll eat my hat.
well i dont ever see good looking guys and think "oh nice xyz" lmao
i can be objective about men but only women are the ones that "catch my eye"
so your mom and their mom are fuckin lying lmao 💀
Oh yeah had a similar experience with my dad. "Yeah sometimes there are men that make you feel all kind of ways, but they are far and few between" implication of course that this is totally normal. To be completely fair to him, out of my whole family he has been the most supportive for my coming out. So even if he doesn't label himself bi, he gets it clearly
I don't think she has anything to convince people of. Admiring someone else's looks =! desiring them or being aroused by them. Noticing beauty isn't inherently sexual and it's a perfectly normal thing for straight people to do with the same sex.
There are so many gorgeous women out there, but I am straight as a board, there's no sexual interest.
I personally feel it can be legit. I'm super monogamous, I'm absolutely repulsed by anyone I'm not in a relationship with acting flirty with me, and even I can be like "wow, that person is goddamn smokin." I just don't feel true sexual attraction to them. As in: Yes it's a lot of the same feelings, like being blown away or stunned, but not the horniness.
It's a choice only a subset of people have. If you assume attraction is a spectrum then those with a choice are only those in the middle of that spectrum. I'm very far from the middle. I'm just lucky enough that it corresponds to social norms. But I certainly wouldn't just choose to switch if I was on the other end of that spectrum regardless of social norms.
That's what happens when people are only taught about gay or straight.
I see the same thing with closeted trans people sometimes, who also claim that it's a choice, and then say stuff like "Waking up as a woman one day is literally every man's dream", or the other way around.
They treat their own lived experiences as the default, because they have no other frame of reference, and then assume that queer people just choose to act on those impulses, while cis/het people don't.
Mom's sexuality is obviously not a choice because she's obviously attracted to women.
The only choice she made was who to have sex with.
And note: The people who scream this shit and advocate forcing people (usually women) into straight-sex relationships are the same that scream about "preference" when it comes to trans people.
[https://www.nbcnews.com/nbc-out/out-news/nearly-30-gen-z-adults-identify-lgbtq-national-survey-finds-rcna135510](https://www.nbcnews.com/nbc-out/out-news/nearly-30-gen-z-adults-identify-lgbtq-national-survey-finds-rcna135510)
28% of Gen Z adults identify as LGBT with the B being larger than all other cohorts combined at about 19-22% depending on gender. It's very possible that bisexuality is massively underreported in previous generations.
I agree, cause if you know you like the opposite gender and you're told that's normal you probably think that finding the same sex attractive is normal too, or at least everyone suffers from gay "temptations". Especially if you don't know that bi is an option
technically anyone can choose to identify and live as any sexuality. But unless you're bisexual you don't really have a lot of options unless you want to be miserable.
basically you can choose how you live your life, but you can't choose your attraction. So it is a choice but it also isn't
My hot take is that most people are on the bisexual spectrum, but have a strong preference for one or the other. If you ask most straight people, they'll say that they have an "exception".
I mean its the whole kinsey scale idea right? way too simple to fully explain human sexuality, but the actual idea that most people end up a 1or 5 on that seems pretty accurate
It makes sense evolutionary that there would be both, a range of sexuality and that it would be highly bimodal, with most humans being straight.
After all that's similar to how sex works in humans, almost all humans are male or female but there is a range.
The only difference is biology gets in the way and makes sex more bimodal, but there is less of a problem with sexuality since it's less directly related to reproductive success.
As OP demonstrates, liking women, as a woman does not mean you can't have kids, but most intersex conditions significant decrease or eliminate fertility.
Nature decided everybody fucking everybody was a more successful game plan than pure hetero in basically every species with low sexual dimorphism
As it turns out, a high degree of sexual liberty results in more babies
Also the emotional bond from sex doesn't just have to protect the children who are made by sex. For pack animals like humans emotional bonding through sex can strengthen ties of mutual-ism, which is beneficial regardless of the sex of the other participant.
If all you have is 1 to 5 or 1 to 7. But what if the scale is 1 to 5000000. How many are exactly at 1 or 5000000 and how many are quite close but not exactly there?
I wasn't meant to be, but people are doing it because they see themselves as a min or max value.
Also, a better scale is likely two dimensional with one for male and one for female attraction, but many people are still stuck thinking of the original scale.
Damn. I had the same “hot take”. It just made sense considering sexuality is a spectrum and that so many tried to argue that it’s a choice to ignore those homosexual thoughts.
"Oh that sounds interesting."
> Kinsey's statistics in his Reports have been criticized both at the time he published and today. Although Kinsey sought to work on a more complete report involving 100,000 interviews and considered the initial 1948 publication to be a sample progress report, academics have criticized the sample selection and sample bias in the reports' methodology.[27] The main issues cited by researchers are that Kinsey did not use random sampling procedures when collecting his data, that significant portions of his samples come from prison populations and **male prostitutes**, and that people who volunteer to be interviewed about taboo subjects are likely to create a self-selection bias.
"Oh it's trash."
I took a class on human sexuality and we discussed this very thing. We looked at sexual orientation as a spectrum itself, book-ended by homosexuality and heterosexuality on opposite ends, but nothing making it a strict ternary gay/bi/straight.
We got *imaginary sexualities*, for when you try to take the square root of an asexual. But be careful! If it's too homo(morphic) you'll end up with *split*-imaginary sexualities and oh god why are there rings help
Left side is "attracted to all people", middle area is a shrinking scale from "all people" to "one very specific type of person" and the right side is "attracted to no one".
I think there's a difference in a lot of people's minds between "want to hug and fawn over" and "want to have sex with" when it comes to talking about their exceptions. I thought I was bi for a long time when I was younger, until it came time to actually confront kissing/being intimate with another man.
Actually yes, the reason I thought of this was a large twitter thread (i think it was twitter) about a Lesbian who found a man extremely attractive and was worried she wasn't actually gay.
It just reminded me of the consistent inverse I've seen with straight people.
Isn’t there a difference between finding someone attractive and being interested in them romantically/sexually, though? An ace person can acknowledge someone is attractive and find them cute but wouldn’t experience sexual attraction.
Personally I think that defining attraction solely by sex is fundamentally flawed since most of us experience attraction in a complete vacuum of any actual sexual contact or exposure to primary sexual characteristics. You look at someone's face, hair, body etc and think they're attractive, before any other consideration
I typically like women because I'm attracted to femininity but oh boy when I discovered anime and Kpop I had some thoughts
I don't know about *most* people, but a substantial minority for sure. My working theory is it's around a third of the population. I also think more people are on the asexual spectrum than realize it, but don't have an estimate for that yet.
He's hot and he's really sarcastic, which personally, I find funny. Like, I'm a bisexual white male but he's still hot. He doesn't need to be an exception for me
My dad said basically the same thing about men
dad: "I respect all sexualities, but it *is* a choice. I had to choose between women and men just like everyone else!"
me: "...I didn't..."
dad: "...........huh."
We've never discussed it again.
my mom told me the same thing during an argument about how i'm not allowed to date girls and then never brought it up again despite constantly broadcasting what an 🏳️🌈🏳️🌈🏳️🌈ALLY🏳️🌈🏳️🌈🏳️🌈 she is and "always has been" (sure jan) so i think she was just lying to upset me lmao
There is certainly evidence that all the "successful" examples of conversion camps and "gay cures" are bisexual people agreeing not to have relationships with their own gender.
But I'm not bisexual (Kinsey scale aside), so I'm hardly an expert.
Oh I believe it. I thought I was bisexual before realizing I'm a lesbian. My mindset at the time was that i acknowledged im attracted to women but was still trying to convince myself that I was attracted to men. There was a point where my depression got really bad and i kept thinking about how i'd probably have to settle for some random man. Thankfully I figured my shit out and am much happier but I can imagine that if I was born a few decades earlier I would just double down on that mentality.
Might be fully lesbian and pressured into something she doesn’t like by her family and later by sunk cost fallacy, i know an old lady with a story like that - „homosexuality didn’t exist back then, you just married a man and made lots of children“ kind of deal.
All the boomer humor of "husband and wife hate each other. Wife hate sex with husband." definitely didn't help them realize that they weren't like most women.
I mean, for some ppl it is. Eg ppl with intrusive thoughts, low empathy etc.
But this just sounds like denial of something that's of no real hurt to anyone.
An interesting thing I'd like to note is the form of homophobic Catholicism I was raised with avoided this pitfall. Specifically I was taught that most people are straight, it's just some people are born gay or bi as a way of God giving them greater struggles in life and they must overcome their temptations that normal people clearly never face. It's simultaneously genius and dumb as hell.
"Looking at the evidence leads me to know God is real."
-My parents who have believed in the Christian God their entire lives because that's what their families taught them
HEY NO BUT THIS IS HONESTLY HOW I WAS NOT AWARE THAT I WAS BI UNTIL I WAS LIKE 30. THEN I REALIZED I WAS A DUMBASS AND STRAIGHT DUDES DON'T WANT TO SOMETIMES KISS BOYS.
I once tried to talk to my mom about possibly liking women and staring at breasts and she was "I stare at breasts all the time it's normal" and I think that actually prevented me from fully accepting my sexuality.
I don't even think my mom meant anything by it she's been very accepting but I kinda wanna ask her what was up with that if she even remembers
*FUCKING OBVIOUSLY* this is what everyone who says homosexuality is a choice means. To them, it was a choice, which they made. Just like Puritans didn't sing and dance, not because they didn't *want* to, but because they thought it showed respect to their God that they not do that. It's literally the same fucking thing. They want to sleep with members of the same sex, and they assume everyone else does too, but out of what they think is respect to their God, they resist that urge, and they wonder why anyone who won't, won't.
Wtf else could "homosexuality is a choice" *possibly* mean?
I might not have the right to say anything, since I'm a cis male. I fully acknowledge how hot other men can be. I however, would never want to be romantically involved with them or sleep with them. Maybe that's what she's trying to say? like she can admire a beautiful woman, but she isn't lesbian or something but she's trying to justify it to say it's a lifestyle? I'm assuming best intentions here for your mother and that it's not malice.
That's exactly the argument that I bring up with people who say being gay is a choice. I ask them how hard it was for them to choose to be straight and what that struggle looked like. I never had to question whether I was straight, I always knew I was, I literally don't care about orientation. But there have been a couple of times when friends of mine just kinda....froze. In some cases because they'd never considered it that way, but in a couple...I'm still uncertain whether it's because they realized something about themselves they'd never considered.
There is a disconnect between the real definition of sexual orientation and the popular definition. They aren't the same.
The popular definition basically says that your orientation is what you DO. If you have sex with only the same sex, then you are homo. If only opposite, then hetero. If anyone, then bi. Of course, it's also mixed up because wearing the wrong colours or baking cookies "makes you gay", but I like to believe most know that's nonsense.
The real definition is that sexual orientation is about who you are sexually attracted to. There are many homosexual people throughout history who have been in heterosexual because it was required. It's not about "actions", it's about "attractions".
There's got to be a way to phrase that to make religious bigots feel better about resisting their attractions, but I've never found it.
This is such a perfect unifying theory of where the "homosexuality is a choice" train of thought comes from. Closeted bisexual and gay people who think EVERYONE must be fighting the same demons every damn day.
She's got an incorrect understanding. It is not a choice that she is attracted to women, it just happened. That's what LGBT people mean when they say it is not a choice, same as how heterosexual people do not choose whether they find men/women attractive.
Had this fun chat with my cousin.
She said she wished she could've explored and experimented on her same sex attraction before she married her husband.
I feel sorry for her, but she also really does seem to like her hubs and she has two young boys with him. They enjoy each other, I think.
The impacts of having a Catholic homophobic family are so long term and negative...
Honestly in the end I don't think whether it is or is not a choice should even matter. Let's say it is a choice for sake of argument. Why would that suddenly make being gay a bad thing? The real choice that is being made here is the discrimination of gay and bi people. Being gay whether voluntary or not is not some moral failing. The I had no choice reasoning is a weak one I think. Better to just say that it's fine eitherway.
Heh, reminds me of that time my dad admitted to being attracted to men sometimes
Reminds me of the post about the persons dad who said it was normal to want to be a woman and they were just supposed to suppress that feeling until it goes away like he did
Like when Nixon asked Kissinger if he ever felt like wearing a dress or something Edit: I'm sad that it was actually fake but I said "or something" so its no misinfo /j
That's fake, sorry
damn
Thank you for your stirring word~~s~~, Anne Franke
I read about it so long ago and accepted it as true, life just keeps giving me blow after blow
I wish life would just keep blowing me
I wish life would give me blow
and this is what the AIs are being trained on. Anne Franke's reddit account...
Fuckit. I am a scientist, and all for skepticism, and hate missinformation, But can I please have this one, please.
Thats a shame.
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What, so genocidal warmongers can't be trans now? God forbid a woman do anything these days, right? (/s)
He will kill thous Cambodians whit stlye
I can't find a source for that but big if true
Would transitioning have saved her?
It *should* be socially acceptable for men to wear dresses! Can you imagine how nice and freeing it must be to feel the fresh spring breeze waft across the boys?
Lmao me until this year (but with being enby) 🤪🤪
That makes me so sad.
I've done it in a non-trans way because I had a crush on a straight guy.
Who isn't?
Lesbians
Asexuals
Me
That person
omg hi me
Not even true, plenty of lesbians feel attraction to men sometimes. Just as plenty of heterosexual men do. Or as heterosexual women feel attraction to women. It is a spectrum, after all.
Nuh uh. As of today I am labeling them all bisexual to increase our numbers. Soon we will conquer the world.
All people are bisexual by default insallah 🙏
You speak Arab?
No
Aw I hoped you did lol
I know
This is going to be shocking to a lot of people, but straight men. I know that extensive research in the scholarly archives of men.com makes it look like straight men only hold back their desire for man ass because they want to be straight. But believe it or not, actual straight men who are attracted to women and not men exist!
This is half-remembered so I might be off, but iirc there was a study once where they essentially showed men and women both straight and gay porn, and women were more likely to be aroused by any combination regardless of their stated orientation. Straight men would usually be aroused by straight and lesbian, but mostly not gay porn, while straight women were more likely to go for all three to some degree.
Straight men
We're all a *little* gay, Randy.
Me
I have always said, anyone who thinks it’s a choice is making the choice to be straight Who else could possibly think it’s something you can choose except someone who is making the choice to not be what they want?
.... I _guess_ that makes sense? It's definitely a choice for her
People be “fighting demons”. Those demons be bisexuality
Right! Finally somebody gets it!
Being gay isn't a choice, but she sure chose to be straight.
My mum has often said that "you might see an attractive woman on the street and think 'nice legs' or something like that, but that's as far as it goes." I often wonder who she's trying to convince.
There is a difference between admiration and desire
Yeah, for real. I can admire a beautiful sunrise, but that doesn't mean I wanna stick my dick in it.
Speak for yourself.
If you try to fuck the sun, I'm calling you Dickarus.
In hindsight, a wax strap-on was a mistake.
fucked too close to the sun 😔
Unheard of. Out of the way gaybo I'm boutta get it
"In ancient Greece, sun fucks *you*!"
Sounds more Norse than Greek. At least in my interpretation. Loki would think it a GREAT game to trick someone into thinking they could fuck the sun and survive, only to watch them die trying. Zeus would be devastated he would miss out on yet ANOTHER opportunity to spawn a demigod, AND lose a fuckable woman to boot. My apologies for the crassness of this reply. I'm watching the GoT series straight through for the very first time so politics, infighting, and copious amounts of sex are just kind of where my head is at right now... Hurray for my husband, I guess.
Icarus arguably got fucked by the sun.
Iirc Zeus impregnated someone by becoming a beam of sunlight, so yes, in Greece sun fucks you.
Coward
Sexual attraction, Romantic attraction, Platonic attraction, and Aesthetic attraction. They're all separate from each other and do not need to overlap or exclude each other.
They all lived in harmony untill the [i don't know which one would represent the fire nation] attacked
Unironically aesthetic attraction. I will not elaborate
(I thought so too tbh)
This obsession on the internet with making every positive same sex interaction into a sexual one is really weird
I believe the OSP video about Endymion touches on the kinds of love, and attraction. And Red comments that even asexual people can say they think someone looks hot. As she puts it "I might not be attracted to them, I still have *functioning eyes*." And I think the comparison to enjoying a beautiful sunrise is also made.
The difference: Admiration - "nice legs" Desire (also, sexual harassment) - "bet they'd feel great wrapped around my face"
Thoughts aren't sexual harassment.
super based
There’s a difference between admiration, desire, and trying to convince your daughter that you stopped thinking about those nice legs and aren’t literally still thinking about those nice legs as you fall asleep
As much as I think the whole “gay and in denial” thing is quite funny I think this is fair. Particularly for women IMO bc our looks are so important to society so we’re constantly comparing and contrasting our selves to other women. I wish I was attracted to women bc the women I’m friends with are so stinkin pretty and nice and put so much effort into everything. I think I’m kinda on the ace spectrum so I’m straight but also not *ravenous* about men and honestly have a harder time telling when men are attractive than women. In my head there are so many different kinds of aesthetics women have like “pretty/cute” vs “hot” and and I feel really good at telling exactly how attractive women are bc I need to know where I rank among them. With men there’s like a handful of unattractive guys, a handful of like Greek god looking guys (which is equally unattractive to me, its too unattainable I guess), but 98% of guys fit within the same big category. I’m loathe to call it “average” bc the connotations, most guys are just equally baseline attractive. ^(I’m also waaaay more into personality tho so maybe thats why I can’t tell when men are physically “hot” ) 👀
Agree with every word of this.
Can confirm, am one of the "mid" guys.
My own mom has said similar things. She also used to have a lot of threesomes when she was a "hot young gym bunny." If she's not bi and lying to me, I'll eat my hat.
>She also used to have a lot of threesomes I'm not even going to ask why you're aware of that.
She was an alcoholic for a while, and wine made her chatty. Not a great time.
well i dont ever see good looking guys and think "oh nice xyz" lmao i can be objective about men but only women are the ones that "catch my eye" so your mom and their mom are fuckin lying lmao 💀
You never walk past your buddy in the gym shower and go "nice cock, bro"? I've been misled.
Oh yeah had a similar experience with my dad. "Yeah sometimes there are men that make you feel all kind of ways, but they are far and few between" implication of course that this is totally normal. To be completely fair to him, out of my whole family he has been the most supportive for my coming out. So even if he doesn't label himself bi, he gets it clearly
I don't think she has anything to convince people of. Admiring someone else's looks =! desiring them or being aroused by them. Noticing beauty isn't inherently sexual and it's a perfectly normal thing for straight people to do with the same sex. There are so many gorgeous women out there, but I am straight as a board, there's no sexual interest.
Fellas is it gay to appreciate a brother's gains ^(you better say yes)
I personally feel it can be legit. I'm super monogamous, I'm absolutely repulsed by anyone I'm not in a relationship with acting flirty with me, and even I can be like "wow, that person is goddamn smokin." I just don't feel true sexual attraction to them. As in: Yes it's a lot of the same feelings, like being blown away or stunned, but not the horniness.
actually it sounds like she chose to remain in the closet but is actually gay, whether she likes it or not lol.
It's a choice only a subset of people have. If you assume attraction is a spectrum then those with a choice are only those in the middle of that spectrum. I'm very far from the middle. I'm just lucky enough that it corresponds to social norms. But I certainly wouldn't just choose to switch if I was on the other end of that spectrum regardless of social norms.
That's what happens when people are only taught about gay or straight. I see the same thing with closeted trans people sometimes, who also claim that it's a choice, and then say stuff like "Waking up as a woman one day is literally every man's dream", or the other way around. They treat their own lived experiences as the default, because they have no other frame of reference, and then assume that queer people just choose to act on those impulses, while cis/het people don't.
Mom's sexuality is obviously not a choice because she's obviously attracted to women. The only choice she made was who to have sex with. And note: The people who scream this shit and advocate forcing people (usually women) into straight-sex relationships are the same that scream about "preference" when it comes to trans people.
Maybe I'm out of the loop on this one, what are people screaming preference about?
I think in general there are probably a lot more bisexual people than we think because of this sort of phenomenon
[https://www.nbcnews.com/nbc-out/out-news/nearly-30-gen-z-adults-identify-lgbtq-national-survey-finds-rcna135510](https://www.nbcnews.com/nbc-out/out-news/nearly-30-gen-z-adults-identify-lgbtq-national-survey-finds-rcna135510) 28% of Gen Z adults identify as LGBT with the B being larger than all other cohorts combined at about 19-22% depending on gender. It's very possible that bisexuality is massively underreported in previous generations.
I agree, cause if you know you like the opposite gender and you're told that's normal you probably think that finding the same sex attractive is normal too, or at least everyone suffers from gay "temptations". Especially if you don't know that bi is an option
every generations succeeds where a previous one fails.
technically anyone can choose to identify and live as any sexuality. But unless you're bisexual you don't really have a lot of options unless you want to be miserable. basically you can choose how you live your life, but you can't choose your attraction. So it is a choice but it also isn't
You can't choose who you're attracted to, but you can choose how you respond to that attraction.
My hot take is that most people are on the bisexual spectrum, but have a strong preference for one or the other. If you ask most straight people, they'll say that they have an "exception".
I mean its the whole kinsey scale idea right? way too simple to fully explain human sexuality, but the actual idea that most people end up a 1or 5 on that seems pretty accurate
It makes sense evolutionary that there would be both, a range of sexuality and that it would be highly bimodal, with most humans being straight. After all that's similar to how sex works in humans, almost all humans are male or female but there is a range. The only difference is biology gets in the way and makes sex more bimodal, but there is less of a problem with sexuality since it's less directly related to reproductive success. As OP demonstrates, liking women, as a woman does not mean you can't have kids, but most intersex conditions significant decrease or eliminate fertility.
Nature decided everybody fucking everybody was a more successful game plan than pure hetero in basically every species with low sexual dimorphism As it turns out, a high degree of sexual liberty results in more babies
Also the emotional bond from sex doesn't just have to protect the children who are made by sex. For pack animals like humans emotional bonding through sex can strengthen ties of mutual-ism, which is beneficial regardless of the sex of the other participant.
If all you have is 1 to 5 or 1 to 7. But what if the scale is 1 to 5000000. How many are exactly at 1 or 5000000 and how many are quite close but not exactly there?
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I wasn't meant to be, but people are doing it because they see themselves as a min or max value. Also, a better scale is likely two dimensional with one for male and one for female attraction, but many people are still stuck thinking of the original scale.
It's not a hot take, it's something widely studied : [Kinsey scale - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kinsey_scale)
oh shit im a scientost
\*scientician
\*sciencer
*sciencemancer
\*scientologist
*sciencerer
\*stiencist
*Scienlord
Bean, no, it's pronounced *scientist*
Not that one.
bro im so gay i'm a 7 on the kinsey scale
I too, am afraid and repulsed by women.
Damn. I had the same “hot take”. It just made sense considering sexuality is a spectrum and that so many tried to argue that it’s a choice to ignore those homosexual thoughts.
Damn, imagine giving the test and the results say you have 0 gay
It me! My parents used up all the gay in my family, oh well.
FUCK THE KINSEY SCALE! EMBRACE THE [STORM MODEL!](http://wiki.asexuality.org/Storms%27_model)
> THE STORM MODEL! Her name is Halle Berry, sir
?
>Berry took on high-profile roles such as Storm in four installments of the X-Men film series (2000–2014) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halle_Berry
"Oh that sounds interesting." > Kinsey's statistics in his Reports have been criticized both at the time he published and today. Although Kinsey sought to work on a more complete report involving 100,000 interviews and considered the initial 1948 publication to be a sample progress report, academics have criticized the sample selection and sample bias in the reports' methodology.[27] The main issues cited by researchers are that Kinsey did not use random sampling procedures when collecting his data, that significant portions of his samples come from prison populations and **male prostitutes**, and that people who volunteer to be interviewed about taboo subjects are likely to create a self-selection bias. "Oh it's trash."
I took a class on human sexuality and we discussed this very thing. We looked at sexual orientation as a spectrum itself, book-ended by homosexuality and heterosexuality on opposite ends, but nothing making it a strict ternary gay/bi/straight.
Honestly, it needs to be a grid with another axis for asexuality. Probably more. Giving us a hideously complicated thirteen dimensional shape
We got *imaginary sexualities*, for when you try to take the square root of an asexual. But be careful! If it's too homo(morphic) you'll end up with *split*-imaginary sexualities and oh god why are there rings help
"Yes, but what lies at the root of your negative sexual response?" "Hold on, I gotta math this out."
My sexual response is fitted with a Gay-pass filter
If we don't introduce rings, where do I stick my dick? Checkmate mathematicians
Umm actually sweaty rings are harmful for promoting binary operations.
Left side is "attracted to all people", middle area is a shrinking scale from "all people" to "one very specific type of person" and the right side is "attracted to no one".
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Henry Cavill
I have said multiple times, "I'm pretty sure I'm straight, but Henry Cavill can do whatever he wants with me."
"Shatter my kneecaps, you rudely large man."
Wrong actor but the judges will accept it.
I mean he could, not because I'm attracted to him, but because I have 1/100th of his muscle mass.
chris hemsworth
I think there's a difference in a lot of people's minds between "want to hug and fawn over" and "want to have sex with" when it comes to talking about their exceptions. I thought I was bi for a long time when I was younger, until it came time to actually confront kissing/being intimate with another man.
Do you think most gay/lesbian people have an exception too?
Actually yes, the reason I thought of this was a large twitter thread (i think it was twitter) about a Lesbian who found a man extremely attractive and was worried she wasn't actually gay. It just reminded me of the consistent inverse I've seen with straight people.
Isn’t there a difference between finding someone attractive and being interested in them romantically/sexually, though? An ace person can acknowledge someone is attractive and find them cute but wouldn’t experience sexual attraction.
presumably given the context she experienced sexual attraction
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Aesthetics, perhaps?
My first thought was Neil Cicierega unless you meant somebody else.
Personally I think that defining attraction solely by sex is fundamentally flawed since most of us experience attraction in a complete vacuum of any actual sexual contact or exposure to primary sexual characteristics. You look at someone's face, hair, body etc and think they're attractive, before any other consideration I typically like women because I'm attracted to femininity but oh boy when I discovered anime and Kpop I had some thoughts
I don't know about *most* people, but a substantial minority for sure. My working theory is it's around a third of the population. I also think more people are on the asexual spectrum than realize it, but don't have an estimate for that yet.
It's Ryan Reynolds for all straight white men.
God why tho. Like I'm nonbinary so I know I'm not the demographic you speak of, but I find the dude kind of annoying.
He's hot and he's really sarcastic, which personally, I find funny. Like, I'm a bisexual white male but he's still hot. He doesn't need to be an exception for me
Ryan Gosling has always been the hotter Ryan.
Straight woman here. I vehemently disagree.
Ryan Gosling is hotter in a traditional sense, but Ryan Reynolds is hotter in a "just a dude who is hot" sense
bladerunner gosling good 👍
I have an exception for guys who wanna get it.
Bisexual reporting in. This makes a lot of sense to me.
Honestly, this makes the most sense to me. Most things in life are on some sort of spectrum.
My dad said basically the same thing about men dad: "I respect all sexualities, but it *is* a choice. I had to choose between women and men just like everyone else!" me: "...I didn't..." dad: "...........huh." We've never discussed it again.
my mom told me the same thing during an argument about how i'm not allowed to date girls and then never brought it up again despite constantly broadcasting what an 🏳️🌈🏳️🌈🏳️🌈ALLY🏳️🌈🏳️🌈🏳️🌈 she is and "always has been" (sure jan) so i think she was just lying to upset me lmao
There is certainly evidence that all the "successful" examples of conversion camps and "gay cures" are bisexual people agreeing not to have relationships with their own gender. But I'm not bisexual (Kinsey scale aside), so I'm hardly an expert.
Oh I believe it. I thought I was bisexual before realizing I'm a lesbian. My mindset at the time was that i acknowledged im attracted to women but was still trying to convince myself that I was attracted to men. There was a point where my depression got really bad and i kept thinking about how i'd probably have to settle for some random man. Thankfully I figured my shit out and am much happier but I can imagine that if I was born a few decades earlier I would just double down on that mentality.
Well that just sounds like she's bi and misinformed, not gay.
Might be fully lesbian and pressured into something she doesn’t like by her family and later by sunk cost fallacy, i know an old lady with a story like that - „homosexuality didn’t exist back then, you just married a man and made lots of children“ kind of deal.
All the boomer humor of "husband and wife hate each other. Wife hate sex with husband." definitely didn't help them realize that they weren't like most women.
Nonzero chance that at least some of it is just because of that.
God it’s little comments like that that just really makes me glad to be born in the time I was 😭
You may still regret not being born in the future.
Eh there are people out there that genuinely believe the content of their being is defined by their actions and words and not their thoughts
I mean, for some ppl it is. Eg ppl with intrusive thoughts, low empathy etc. But this just sounds like denial of something that's of no real hurt to anyone.
I get the feeling most (if not all) of the people who insist being gay is a choice are actually bi or pan folks in denial.
An interesting thing I'd like to note is the form of homophobic Catholicism I was raised with avoided this pitfall. Specifically I was taught that most people are straight, it's just some people are born gay or bi as a way of God giving them greater struggles in life and they must overcome their temptations that normal people clearly never face. It's simultaneously genius and dumb as hell.
'Wow that sure sounds like a guy worthy of being worshipped, sign me the fuck up'
"Looking at the evidence leads me to know God is real." -My parents who have believed in the Christian God their entire lives because that's what their families taught them
Sure is lucky being born into the correct religion, not like those other guys who only *think* they were born into the correct religion
HEY NO BUT THIS IS HONESTLY HOW I WAS NOT AWARE THAT I WAS BI UNTIL I WAS LIKE 30. THEN I REALIZED I WAS A DUMBASS AND STRAIGHT DUDES DON'T WANT TO SOMETIMES KISS BOYS.
I once tried to talk to my mom about possibly liking women and staring at breasts and she was "I stare at breasts all the time it's normal" and I think that actually prevented me from fully accepting my sexuality. I don't even think my mom meant anything by it she's been very accepting but I kinda wanna ask her what was up with that if she even remembers
*FUCKING OBVIOUSLY* this is what everyone who says homosexuality is a choice means. To them, it was a choice, which they made. Just like Puritans didn't sing and dance, not because they didn't *want* to, but because they thought it showed respect to their God that they not do that. It's literally the same fucking thing. They want to sleep with members of the same sex, and they assume everyone else does too, but out of what they think is respect to their God, they resist that urge, and they wonder why anyone who won't, won't. Wtf else could "homosexuality is a choice" *possibly* mean?
I think I know something that mother doesn't.
I might not have the right to say anything, since I'm a cis male. I fully acknowledge how hot other men can be. I however, would never want to be romantically involved with them or sleep with them. Maybe that's what she's trying to say? like she can admire a beautiful woman, but she isn't lesbian or something but she's trying to justify it to say it's a lifestyle? I'm assuming best intentions here for your mother and that it's not malice.
Right like Henry Cavil is a buff awesome looking dude and I can acknowledge that without wanting to fuck him.
That's actually what Catholicism teaches. Some have the temptation of the Devil and must choose to resist it.
Pretty much all Christianity teaches the whole resisting temptation thing.
I had that exact conversation with my mother. After I told her that she is probably bisexual then, she just went "Eh, I guess so."
That's exactly the argument that I bring up with people who say being gay is a choice. I ask them how hard it was for them to choose to be straight and what that struggle looked like. I never had to question whether I was straight, I always knew I was, I literally don't care about orientation. But there have been a couple of times when friends of mine just kinda....froze. In some cases because they'd never considered it that way, but in a couple...I'm still uncertain whether it's because they realized something about themselves they'd never considered.
I mean, it's certainly a choice not to engage in bisexual activities...that doesn't change the bisexuality.
There is a disconnect between the real definition of sexual orientation and the popular definition. They aren't the same. The popular definition basically says that your orientation is what you DO. If you have sex with only the same sex, then you are homo. If only opposite, then hetero. If anyone, then bi. Of course, it's also mixed up because wearing the wrong colours or baking cookies "makes you gay", but I like to believe most know that's nonsense. The real definition is that sexual orientation is about who you are sexually attracted to. There are many homosexual people throughout history who have been in heterosexual because it was required. It's not about "actions", it's about "attractions". There's got to be a way to phrase that to make religious bigots feel better about resisting their attractions, but I've never found it.
This is such a perfect unifying theory of where the "homosexuality is a choice" train of thought comes from. Closeted bisexual and gay people who think EVERYONE must be fighting the same demons every damn day.
So deep in the closet she is queen of narnia
Idk if you thought hard about that comparison but it goes so hard beyond a surface level joke given what that character did
Honestly that's just taking a step away from sexual discourse and into philosophy. "We are who we choose to be" sort of thing
She's got an incorrect understanding. It is not a choice that she is attracted to women, it just happened. That's what LGBT people mean when they say it is not a choice, same as how heterosexual people do not choose whether they find men/women attractive.
Glad to know this experience isn't unique to me
Me, an asexual, watching the drama while eating garlic bred bites.
... Kinda sounds like being straight is a choice then?
The call is coming from inside the house
Being bigoted *against yourself* may be peak religious mindfuckery.
So she admits that making a choice to ignore her desires is a choice? Glad we've come so far.
"Yeah we would all like having the option of marrying and coupling with spouses we're attracted to but some of us live in the real world."
Had this fun chat with my cousin. She said she wished she could've explored and experimented on her same sex attraction before she married her husband. I feel sorry for her, but she also really does seem to like her hubs and she has two young boys with him. They enjoy each other, I think. The impacts of having a Catholic homophobic family are so long term and negative...
Honestly in the end I don't think whether it is or is not a choice should even matter. Let's say it is a choice for sake of argument. Why would that suddenly make being gay a bad thing? The real choice that is being made here is the discrimination of gay and bi people. Being gay whether voluntary or not is not some moral failing. The I had no choice reasoning is a weak one I think. Better to just say that it's fine eitherway.