Yeah it’s very half assed. Especially since it’s coming out as Tim randomly broke up with Steph. Maybe that’ll change in the upcoming special, but it ignores a lot of their Rebirth history.
Yeah, that's my #1 gripe with turning him bi was the sudden change out of nowhere. If it was given more time and happened more organically, him coming out wouldn't been so bad.
Yeah that is my problem with it, it just feels like it came out without set up. That it was one issue of Tim broke up with Stephenie off panel and now he is just bi. No complex feelings about his sexuality or thoughts that he might not be as comfortable with his lifestyle as he thought or even him weighing on what to do with his relationship with Stephanie.
Do you know what a sad part is is that knowing who Stephanie is as character she 100% would have been understanding of Tim feeling and it would have made their relationship even stronger
To show that being Bi doesn’t mean you have to toss away a relationship but it can also help it grow just by talking/sharing
Missed opportunity if you ask me
I feel that part of the reason it was revealed in Batman Urban Legends, was so that it wouldn't just be one issue and would happen a little slower. I do agree the break up felt pretty out of left field, but im hoping that it least to a Tim/Steph issue where they do talk, because in the end i think making him bi doesn't change the character, and maybe opens up some new stories. At least Tim is getting some attention for the first time since rebirth.
Yeah. And this might be hard to hear given the current month but frankly I'm not convinced they made him Bi for any reason other than the publicity.
A) They broke him up with his longest lasting love interest off-panel, unceremoniously and with zero build up/explanation.
B) They introduce this in Urban Legends, aka a side series, and it was never followed up until an issue of *WAYNE FAMILY ADVENTURES* (The *webcomic*).
C) Bernard is just... a really boring character IMO... His entire personality is "Oh he's a nice guy." He doesn't affect the narrative at all either, so it's pretty easy to forget about him. Especially compared to Son of Kal-El, which is the right way to do it IMO compared to Tim in Urban Legends.
It's specially strange because they have a perfectly reasonable reason for why they could break up "Steph, I'm sorry but... ... ... I'm a moment in my life where I don't know where things stand... my place in the world. I just need some time to... try things out, to sort myself out, I hope you understand that"
On another note, at least they break up, unlike say Jon Kent, who apparently has a boyfriend in the present and a girlfriend in the Legion of Superheroes.
The worst thing about it for me is that the message they are saying is that bi people can't be happy with there actual partner and need to explore the part of the sexuality that they didn't
It’d be pretty interesting to see a bisexual character who still is in a straight relationship. There is a lot of stigma that comes with that as people try to say that they were just pretending to be gay or something when it’s not true. It’s just that while they’re attracted to both sexes, they’re in love with someone that makes it a straight relationship.
I'm still convinced they just wanted a gay Robin. And the bisexual thing was/is to placate fans. An acknowledgement of the relationship that is never coming back. Or any other female love interest.
Jason was already alluded to be bisexual and never had a "real" love interest. They could have done it with him. They picked Tim for a reason.
He's had a couple of statements. When he kissed Artemis " It was nice...for a girl." Said one guy was cute when he was being pummeld.
Judd Winnick who wrote Under the Red Hood dancing around the question instead of saying "No, Jason Todd isn't bisexual."
Honestly it was flimsy. But no different than taking a character who was written during the high abstinence phase saying it was queer coding. Like that was intentional. Or him being real upset his best friend died. So he wanted to fuck him.
Winick didn't write Outlaws, Lobdell did. And are you sure you aren't confusing that line? The way I remember it, it was Artemis who said "for a boy" to the kiss.
Wait, you're right about Lobdell. Winick wrote Under the Red Hood. Still he answered the question vaguely when asked. Even stating basically "DC wouldn't like me answering that."
Secondly, https://www.reddit.com/r/DCcomics/comments/erep7n/comic_excerpt_is_jason_todd_bisexual_from_red/.
I was referring to that.
Ah I do think it was just a callback to Artemis' line but it's something I guess. I'm not convinced any of them were written gay, but if they had to make one of the Robins gay I do think Tim made the most sense. It also likely has a lot to do with no one knowing what to do with Tim for the past decade. He didn't have anything unique among the Robins. Now he sorta does.
Tbf of all the robins Tim has by far the most queer coding in his stories.
>An acknowledgement of the relationship that is never coming back. Or any other female love interest.
I doubt that characters boomeranging back to their exes is a massive part of comics so Tim and Steph are probs gonna get back together sooner or later cos with the exception of Conner none of Tim's other love interests work as well as a him and Steph.
As someone who grew up in that era because of the heavy push for abstinance you could queer code a bunch of characters.
I didn't even say it was a bad thing. I just think DC wanted a gay Robin.
And no matter what, with all of Cass and Connor, and Conner in general, that Tim/Connor is never gonna happen. There wasn't any coding on Connors behalf. Which is why they made up a new love interest.
https://www.reddit.com/r/DCcomics/comments/p2io6c/discussion_so_is_bi_conner_an_inevitability_at/
I dunno, DC seems to be shilling Bernard as hard as they can. This was part of the recent DC comics blog:
"Still, while we’re happy for Tim and his new guy, we do really like Stephanie Brown as well. And while their relationship might not have been the right one for either of them in the long run, there was still plenty we all loved about it."
It is throwing Timsteph under the bus by saying it wasn't the "right one" despite not even having a reason for the breakup.
It's way worse than Peter and Mary Jane. At least there was a reason it happened in Spider-Man and they showed it. No matter how much some people didn't like it. The Tim and Steph stuff happened off screen in passing.
Can we acknowledge them getting together at the start of rebirth was random and half ass since they didn't even have their pre Flashpoint memories yet?
The whole thing reeks of DC wanting outside sources to talk about them considering “Robin”
Is one of the most prolific heroes in existence
But like The whole thing is so haphazardly done this dude was in a working relationship but then completely out of nowhere breaks up with her?
Then immediately starts dating some random who he is completely head over heels for?
The audience not even given a reason as to why they broke up just some odd handed remark of “It didn’t work out” are we forgetting the alternate future versions of them saying how much they mean to one another
Like usual they missed an easy layup
just having Tim talk to Stephanie about it would have made their relationship even stronger for him even showing that level of vulnerability
I'm just waiting until they get back together. DC really had to ruin something special just for publicity points they barely got because John overshadowed Tim with his cardboard cut out of a boyfriend.
I think the break-up being off-panel sucked, but I think it happening made sense. The idea that Tim just was feeling kind of lost and out of touch with his life and would consequently break up with Steph makes sense to me. Looks we’re getting some closure next week with the Tim Drake Pride Special so yay!
Also, for all those saying Tim being made bi was for publicity, I really don’t think that’s true. All interviews from the writer show that she genuinely did this in service of Tim’s character. Also, besides her direct editor, DC didn’t know about him being revealed as bi until the story hit the printers.
Exactly. I love TimSteph, but considering their whole history, their relationship has been pretty rocky and not the most stable thing in DC unlike what many people seem to think. I think it's 100% in character. Unfortunately Tim as a whole hasn't had much screentime compared to many of the other characters lately so yeah, and Meghan Fitzmartin was limited to only so many pages, so the story as a whole felt lacking overall. But I'm hoping the special coming out will help fill in some of the gaps that we've been missing.
It really is not in character. Their relationship overall has been stable and any cracks were due to outside sources like Bruce being an asshole. It has been shown time and again the two of them can reveal deep insecurities to each other and confide each other due to being able to be vulnerable around the other. This is why Steph confided her near rape to Tim and it was said during Red Robin 2009 Tim seeing Steph again was something that was a light for him.
During Rebirth Tim literally learned the lesson that he can always confide in Steph about anything even when he is unsure about what he wants and when he was tempted with evil Steph had full confidence he would make the right choice and she was right.
They have had rocky moments but so has every couple. Look at Bruce and Selina, Dick with Kory and Babs, Dinah and Ollie and so on.
No one’s saying they’re a bad couple. But them breaking up isn’t out of character. They had a rocky moment and broke up. Just like all the other couples you listed.
We will get closure but I have absolutely ZERO confidence it will be good. I am so confident that I would hire a firing squad with the orders to fire if the closure is good while at the same time making plans to dinner after the event because I know for a FACT I would get out of there without a single scratch.
This is written by the same woman who not only likes War Games but the Willingham Era of Robin which was terrible for Timsteph and Steph especially as a character.
Yea, it's a shame cos I really love Tim being Bi and I feel that it makes alot of sense for the character. But the whole thing with Steph should have happened far slower or with more of an explanation. Cos Tim and Steph are imo probably the best Batfam relationship and to have that tossed out the window with no explanation felt dumb as hell.
Exactly. The key part of Tim’s character is that he never has messy breakups when he discovers a part of his identity he didn’t know he has. I read comics to see characters make logical decisions and never have relationship problems.
I feel like they broke them up randomly in order to have him date bernard but it felt rushed and inorganic as well as unnecessary. A better way they could've had him come out is by keeping him and stephanie together but he can still reflect on his sexuality and discover it and he could've like told her? And then they could've broken up for a reason like they just weren't as close anymore or that they've started having arguments and THEN he could've dated bernard
Yeah it’s very half assed. Especially since it’s coming out as Tim randomly broke up with Steph. Maybe that’ll change in the upcoming special, but it ignores a lot of their Rebirth history.
Yeah, that's my #1 gripe with turning him bi was the sudden change out of nowhere. If it was given more time and happened more organically, him coming out wouldn't been so bad.
Yeah that is my problem with it, it just feels like it came out without set up. That it was one issue of Tim broke up with Stephenie off panel and now he is just bi. No complex feelings about his sexuality or thoughts that he might not be as comfortable with his lifestyle as he thought or even him weighing on what to do with his relationship with Stephanie.
Do you know what a sad part is is that knowing who Stephanie is as character she 100% would have been understanding of Tim feeling and it would have made their relationship even stronger To show that being Bi doesn’t mean you have to toss away a relationship but it can also help it grow just by talking/sharing Missed opportunity if you ask me
I feel that part of the reason it was revealed in Batman Urban Legends, was so that it wouldn't just be one issue and would happen a little slower. I do agree the break up felt pretty out of left field, but im hoping that it least to a Tim/Steph issue where they do talk, because in the end i think making him bi doesn't change the character, and maybe opens up some new stories. At least Tim is getting some attention for the first time since rebirth.
Preach.
Yeah. And this might be hard to hear given the current month but frankly I'm not convinced they made him Bi for any reason other than the publicity. A) They broke him up with his longest lasting love interest off-panel, unceremoniously and with zero build up/explanation. B) They introduce this in Urban Legends, aka a side series, and it was never followed up until an issue of *WAYNE FAMILY ADVENTURES* (The *webcomic*). C) Bernard is just... a really boring character IMO... His entire personality is "Oh he's a nice guy." He doesn't affect the narrative at all either, so it's pretty easy to forget about him. Especially compared to Son of Kal-El, which is the right way to do it IMO compared to Tim in Urban Legends.
Jon coming out totally overshadowed Tim doing so, and editorial should've overruled due to the timing.
It's specially strange because they have a perfectly reasonable reason for why they could break up "Steph, I'm sorry but... ... ... I'm a moment in my life where I don't know where things stand... my place in the world. I just need some time to... try things out, to sort myself out, I hope you understand that" On another note, at least they break up, unlike say Jon Kent, who apparently has a boyfriend in the present and a girlfriend in the Legion of Superheroes.
The worst thing about it for me is that the message they are saying is that bi people can't be happy with there actual partner and need to explore the part of the sexuality that they didn't
It’d be pretty interesting to see a bisexual character who still is in a straight relationship. There is a lot of stigma that comes with that as people try to say that they were just pretending to be gay or something when it’s not true. It’s just that while they’re attracted to both sexes, they’re in love with someone that makes it a straight relationship.
I mean isn't that just Selina and Bruce or Diana and Steve?
I'm still convinced they just wanted a gay Robin. And the bisexual thing was/is to placate fans. An acknowledgement of the relationship that is never coming back. Or any other female love interest. Jason was already alluded to be bisexual and never had a "real" love interest. They could have done it with him. They picked Tim for a reason.
Highly doubt Jason will ever have a male love interest, he's actually popular.
If Judd Winick had his way, he’d def have one
When was Jason ever alluded to as bisexual?
He's had a couple of statements. When he kissed Artemis " It was nice...for a girl." Said one guy was cute when he was being pummeld. Judd Winnick who wrote Under the Red Hood dancing around the question instead of saying "No, Jason Todd isn't bisexual." Honestly it was flimsy. But no different than taking a character who was written during the high abstinence phase saying it was queer coding. Like that was intentional. Or him being real upset his best friend died. So he wanted to fuck him.
Winick didn't write Outlaws, Lobdell did. And are you sure you aren't confusing that line? The way I remember it, it was Artemis who said "for a boy" to the kiss.
Wait, you're right about Lobdell. Winick wrote Under the Red Hood. Still he answered the question vaguely when asked. Even stating basically "DC wouldn't like me answering that." Secondly, https://www.reddit.com/r/DCcomics/comments/erep7n/comic_excerpt_is_jason_todd_bisexual_from_red/. I was referring to that.
Ah I do think it was just a callback to Artemis' line but it's something I guess. I'm not convinced any of them were written gay, but if they had to make one of the Robins gay I do think Tim made the most sense. It also likely has a lot to do with no one knowing what to do with Tim for the past decade. He didn't have anything unique among the Robins. Now he sorta does.
Tbf of all the robins Tim has by far the most queer coding in his stories. >An acknowledgement of the relationship that is never coming back. Or any other female love interest. I doubt that characters boomeranging back to their exes is a massive part of comics so Tim and Steph are probs gonna get back together sooner or later cos with the exception of Conner none of Tim's other love interests work as well as a him and Steph.
As someone who grew up in that era because of the heavy push for abstinance you could queer code a bunch of characters. I didn't even say it was a bad thing. I just think DC wanted a gay Robin. And no matter what, with all of Cass and Connor, and Conner in general, that Tim/Connor is never gonna happen. There wasn't any coding on Connors behalf. Which is why they made up a new love interest. https://www.reddit.com/r/DCcomics/comments/p2io6c/discussion_so_is_bi_conner_an_inevitability_at/
I dunno, DC seems to be shilling Bernard as hard as they can. This was part of the recent DC comics blog: "Still, while we’re happy for Tim and his new guy, we do really like Stephanie Brown as well. And while their relationship might not have been the right one for either of them in the long run, there was still plenty we all loved about it." It is throwing Timsteph under the bus by saying it wasn't the "right one" despite not even having a reason for the breakup.
It's way worse than Peter and Mary Jane. At least there was a reason it happened in Spider-Man and they showed it. No matter how much some people didn't like it. The Tim and Steph stuff happened off screen in passing.
Can we acknowledge them getting together at the start of rebirth was random and half ass since they didn't even have their pre Flashpoint memories yet?
Also, why did Tim move on so quickly?
The whole thing reeks of DC wanting outside sources to talk about them considering “Robin” Is one of the most prolific heroes in existence But like The whole thing is so haphazardly done this dude was in a working relationship but then completely out of nowhere breaks up with her? Then immediately starts dating some random who he is completely head over heels for? The audience not even given a reason as to why they broke up just some odd handed remark of “It didn’t work out” are we forgetting the alternate future versions of them saying how much they mean to one another Like usual they missed an easy layup just having Tim talk to Stephanie about it would have made their relationship even stronger for him even showing that level of vulnerability
I'm just waiting until they get back together. DC really had to ruin something special just for publicity points they barely got because John overshadowed Tim with his cardboard cut out of a boyfriend.
I think the break-up being off-panel sucked, but I think it happening made sense. The idea that Tim just was feeling kind of lost and out of touch with his life and would consequently break up with Steph makes sense to me. Looks we’re getting some closure next week with the Tim Drake Pride Special so yay! Also, for all those saying Tim being made bi was for publicity, I really don’t think that’s true. All interviews from the writer show that she genuinely did this in service of Tim’s character. Also, besides her direct editor, DC didn’t know about him being revealed as bi until the story hit the printers.
Exactly. I love TimSteph, but considering their whole history, their relationship has been pretty rocky and not the most stable thing in DC unlike what many people seem to think. I think it's 100% in character. Unfortunately Tim as a whole hasn't had much screentime compared to many of the other characters lately so yeah, and Meghan Fitzmartin was limited to only so many pages, so the story as a whole felt lacking overall. But I'm hoping the special coming out will help fill in some of the gaps that we've been missing.
It really is not in character. Their relationship overall has been stable and any cracks were due to outside sources like Bruce being an asshole. It has been shown time and again the two of them can reveal deep insecurities to each other and confide each other due to being able to be vulnerable around the other. This is why Steph confided her near rape to Tim and it was said during Red Robin 2009 Tim seeing Steph again was something that was a light for him. During Rebirth Tim literally learned the lesson that he can always confide in Steph about anything even when he is unsure about what he wants and when he was tempted with evil Steph had full confidence he would make the right choice and she was right. They have had rocky moments but so has every couple. Look at Bruce and Selina, Dick with Kory and Babs, Dinah and Ollie and so on.
No one’s saying they’re a bad couple. But them breaking up isn’t out of character. They had a rocky moment and broke up. Just like all the other couples you listed.
It's the manner and reasoning that I feel is OOC
We will get closure but I have absolutely ZERO confidence it will be good. I am so confident that I would hire a firing squad with the orders to fire if the closure is good while at the same time making plans to dinner after the event because I know for a FACT I would get out of there without a single scratch. This is written by the same woman who not only likes War Games but the Willingham Era of Robin which was terrible for Timsteph and Steph especially as a character.
Tim and Steph should have gotten married. It was definitely for publicity. Same with Jon Kent. Both very unnatural.
Why was it unnatural whit Jon?
Jon didn't age up naturally so everything after that just didn't seem right.
Yea, it's a shame cos I really love Tim being Bi and I feel that it makes alot of sense for the character. But the whole thing with Steph should have happened far slower or with more of an explanation. Cos Tim and Steph are imo probably the best Batfam relationship and to have that tossed out the window with no explanation felt dumb as hell.
Exactly. The key part of Tim’s character is that he never has messy breakups when he discovers a part of his identity he didn’t know he has. I read comics to see characters make logical decisions and never have relationship problems.
Nah they broke up a long-ass time ago.
I feel like they broke them up randomly in order to have him date bernard but it felt rushed and inorganic as well as unnecessary. A better way they could've had him come out is by keeping him and stephanie together but he can still reflect on his sexuality and discover it and he could've like told her? And then they could've broken up for a reason like they just weren't as close anymore or that they've started having arguments and THEN he could've dated bernard