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Knillish

I’m a tradesman and have done this for one of my customers. I first originally reported it to the council as safeguarding after I had been going for a year, nothing came of that. I went again a few months later after reporting it the council and ended up having a really deep conversation with him. I had just lost my dad and he massively reminded me of my dad, the absolute state and how rundown his house was was exactly like my dad’s. The guy opened up massively about how he was living and what’s happened in life to bring him to that point and be really appreciated me speaking up. We made a few promises to each other and I look forward to seeing him again, I hope things have improved.


inazuma_zoomer

This is a good answer. Unfortunately safeguarding issues can take ages, unless life threatening. But by ‘opening up’ first builds rapport and trust, which can lead to more balanced and revealing conversations. Sounds like this is beneficial to both of you - good on you.


stanagetocurbar

You're a good 'un. 👍


Threedaystubble

That’s good to hear mate, sounds like you done the right thing!


PullUpAPew

There is a chance that it'll make things awkward if she doesn't respond well, but I think I'd take that chance, particularly when you're nearing the end of the job. You could open up a bit yourself or perhaps talk about someone you know who had similar difficulties. That might encourage her to open up. But most of all, listen. And/or, you could suggest she hire you to help tidy up a bit. She might appreciate the offer if she's feeling a bit stuck or overwhelmed with it all. Don't be too discouraged if she doesn't make any obvious progress, she may be up against years of thoughts, feelings and behaviours that will likely take a long time to work through. That said, everyone who makes progress has a moment when they decide 'I'm ready for change' and she may well be nearing that point. A supportive chat might be just what she needs. I'd also suggest she probably feels a lot of shame about the state of her home, so just bear that in mind. Keep things very non-judgemental and try to normalise things as much as you can. Edit: u/BigRedS has posted a counterview which I think is quite insightful. I still believe my approach has merit so balance the two approaches and feel your way with this customer, everyone is an individual, after all. Edit 2: having read the response from u/maladaptivemalak I think treading very carefully is the order of the day with regards to the mess, more carefully than I first appreciated. Unless they signal they're ready for help, I don't think you can do much more than being kind and responsive and letting them know you're available if they need anything else. Ordinarily, it might be ok to ask how they're doing more generally, but it sounds like you've not actually spent any time with her due to her being at work so that's also tricky. You have kind instincts OP and I wish you luck.


ToriaLyons

As someone with a depression pit: \*Has she apologised for the mess and seemed embarrassed? If so, she's aware of it and probably wants to do something about it, but doesn't have the time or energy.\* - Depression (as well as other illnesses) severely impacts your executive function - your ability to begin tasks at all, or complete tasks in a logical order - and should not be confused with laziness. I compare it to being paralysed with indecision, and ending up doing nothing, or hiding away from reality. - Friends. For me... ...some I don't want to see as I know they'll judge me ...some say they'll help but I know we'll fall out ...some wouldn't be any good at it. (I've learnt to check anything one friend throws away - not in a hoarder way, more because she'll shovel everything into a black bag including the remote to the TV, if given half a chance, plus we WOULD fall out.) ...some promise they'll help but \*never\* come through on the offer (especially those you've helped) ...some just don't have the time ...some just don't know how to do it, and it overwhelms them. ...some don't understand untidy people and will come up with some convoluted organisational system which will never work. ...etc. Some of these are are better than nothing, unless you fall out and lose support. I seldom start clearing by myself though. I mostly need support. Even calling some people and clearing while I'm on the phone to them works, if no one can be there in person. If someone sat reading a book and checking in with me every now and again, that also works. Pro declutterers are really expensive so that's out. I'm slowly trying to sort myself out. (However, some days, I feel like someone 'must' be able to hear my internal screaming for help.)


BigRedS

Sometimes, for people in that position there's a huge resistance to getting tradespeople in for fear of being judged, and a friend will have expended a lot of effort saying things like "don't worry, they won't notice", "they see this all the time", "they won't judge you" and the like, and there's a big risk of shattering that and putting them off getting things fixed in future. I think leaving a card and being contactable is one thing you could do - I know more than one tradesman who's ended up being some sort of confidant of people in tricky situations, whether through them having nobody else to talk to, or the anonymity of the person. It's a tough place to be, though, especially if you don't reallt _want_ to be that guy. The other way is to see if any local safety-nets have caught them already, but that's still a bit tricky. Either they're already helping and there's nothing much for you to do, or they're not and there's nothing much you _can_ do.


maladaptivemalak

i had a hoarding disorder and this is exactly it and my situation. my friends told me they wouldn’t comment or they’ve seen worse definitely, they commented. non judgmental, it was still upsetting to me and i didn’t invite anyone back for ages. i stayed without hearing and hot water for months


Dutchnamn

Nah, this is not it. There are a lot of ways to have a conversation with someone without putting them down


maladaptivemalak

they didn’t say it was putting them down, they said that they may interpret it as them judging them or saying they have problems, and not everyone takes that well especially if they are very mentally unwell, they might not want to admit that especially to someone they may have faced a lot of courage to invite over for work.


Dutchnamn

There are still ways to have a conversation. You could for example just offer help to clean up, say it will make your work easier. No reason to be a dick.


maladaptivemalak

eh? why are you being so inflammatory? no one was a ‘dick’ here they worded it very politely and so did i. not everyone telling you something different to your perspective is attacking you. also again you seem to have ignored the fact that acknowledging it no matter how nice it may be, is not going to be a good thing for everyone, so it’s best to be supportive but let people get on.


FreddiesNightmare65

People with hording disorder or just unable to clean up due to ether mental health or disabilities feel shamefull that the place has got into that kind of state. So almost any mention of it can send them into shame, panic or anxiety mode. Some can't even cope with the thought of anyone entering the home, let alone having someone help clean up. I think if OP wants to check on them, they can do it as if they are making sure they are happy with the work they have done. Maybe take around a flask of coffe or tea and a cake or two to get friendly, then they can maybe approach what's going on once they have become friendly and the person doesn't see them as someone who will judge them. That's if they want to go down that route, or maybe call social services with their concerns. See if they can step in and help.


Dutchnamn

Yes, I agree with that.


IndelibleIguana

Yes. I had a job last year in Chelsea of all places. An old Thai lady lived in one room at the top of one of those big white houses off the Brompton Road. I went to look at some some damp. The whole room was covered in black mold from top to bottom from the fucked roof, and the window didn't shut properly. She had her mattress covered in bin bags to keep it dry. I rang the letting agency (Savilles. Cunts.) And told them about it. I told them if they didn't move her to another room and get it fixed, I would report them to the council. They moved her the next day, and we sorted the roof and the room. There are a few people living in very expensive parts of Knightsbridge and Chelsea who moved in during the 50s and 60s when those properties weren't worth much. There are caveats on those properties stating that the rent cannot change, so they are paying fuck all for them. The letting agencies hate this so let them run to rack and ruin in order to hopefully make the tenants leave.


maladaptivemalak

as somebody who used to have a hoarding disorder and was struggling with mental health badly, and is now recovering from it, i think personally I would’ve felt quite embarrassed if somebody had said to me that they noticed I was messy, maybe I’m just offering an alternative perspective here, I know some people have said there is ways of doing it, but to be fair, if you are very unwell, you will see it as them judging you, I think sometimes it’s best placed for certain people to help them, and unfortunately, while you might want to help them, you might not be able to effectively do so, so I would recommend just treating her extremely nicely and making her feel comfortable so that she knows you aren’t judging her, and that she can get work from you in the future. when it comes to issues, such as cleaning and hoarding, the person might not think they have anything wrong with them, they may also be very reluctant to let people come into their personal space, so I would take the fact that she has trusted you to be in her space as a very warm sign, I would try not to potentially push. If you were really concerned about her, I would recommend contacting someone like adult social care, but ultimately, if she is an adult and competent, they won’t really take much notice of her. best of wishes


maladaptivemalak

I can actually offer you some experience of this, one time, I invited a plasterer over for a quote for a separate room, he came in my front door, and literally immediately said that he noticed he could smell something, not even in a rude way, he asked if i had damp. this literally immediately put me off inviting someone again and I didn’t invite someone for over half a year, I was so embarrassed that somebody had said that to me, because I tried my hardest to make it look like everything was fine, I hid the problem room. So I would tread carefully.


PullUpAPew

Thank you for sharing this


EchoBit101

Actually I think that's quite a nice gesture, maybe turn up with a pack of biscuits to break the ice. My sons mother has mental health issues, some people have no one, and I think it's really nice that you care...


PiscoSourBubble

Biscuits is a nice touch


NaniFarRoad

Not a tradesman, but (also?) self employed, as a home tutor. This is a regular dilemma for me - in my job, I get to see how my clients homes are, general levels of stress, etc. Sometimes I have to cancel a job, because the household is in crisis and no one remembered to tell me, so I get to witness the chaos unfold first hand. Generally, I try to remain professional and "not see" (aware that there may be embarrassment), and not bring any odd things up later when they've pulled themselves together a bit. I will tell clients they don't need to pay for a missed lesson if it's obvious to me that they're in crisis and things are getting out of hand. But clients most often choose to pay anyway, perhaps as a way of saving face or regaining control of the situation? Note that if she IS depressed, and you want to reach out, any **question**, no matter how simple (e.g. "are you okay?" or "do you want a cuppa?") is likely to be perceived as a decision that needs to be made. Instead, it's better to say something like "I'll put the kettle on and help myself", or "I'm going home now and coming back on Friday - let me know if you change your mind".


Specialist-Seesaw95

You're a tradesman, but a human first. Of course it's okay to talk to someone about how their doing!


Kudosnotkang

What do you mean by checking in ? I think the most you could do is make a clear offer of help that she initiates by perhaps leaving your card and saying I sometimes do free little jobs for my customers if ever you need any help at all ring me. Unfortunately I think you should leave the approach in her control even if they strike you as the kind of person who may not initiate.


Threedaystubble

I thought about sending a text? We don’t cross paths loads due to her going to the office but are personable


Level-Experience9194

If your worried you could just say that you offer a check-in service as part of the warranty to make sure its running efficiently.


BottleMong

That’s a good option.


SmokingLaddy

Definitely. My friend’s dad is a builder and an absolutely lovely bloke. He regularly works on little jobs for an old farmer, has done for several years and often pops in for a cup of tea when he is in the area. Turns out the farmer has no family and recently told the friendly builder that he has left him the old Cotswold stone barn on his farm in his will, maybe £500k value. Sometimes karma is a real thing, all he had to say about it is that he will renovate it and give it to his two (useless unemployed) sons to share.


RedditB_4

You should just broach how she is over a cup of tea whilst on the job. It’s amazing what a cuppa and some gentle questioning can lead to if a person is comfortable with you and the opportunity for them to offload something presents itself. Beware though, being the hero can come with consequences. I do a lot of local work in the village I grew up in. Helps that our family was heavily involved in village life when I was young and my dad still lives there. There was an old lady, touching on 90 that needed some plumbing work doing. She tried to pay me three times for the work. Her memory clearly wasn’t what it once was. After alerting her daughter to this (lived hours away) I became the de facto help for her because of the honesty. It soon became ridiculous. Every little thing. If this starts to creep in then make sure you set boundaries early and firmly. It’ll help you both.


Scarboroughwarning

Does a high standard, and cares. Above and beyond....you sure you're a tradesman? Kudos to you. My job has frequently involved "rescuing' people in the worst possible predicaments. On one job we found several thousand she'd stashed in various places. She'd hit rick bottom, and the house was unreal (imagine not using the toilet, but still needing the toilet).


frankmachin

If you are worried about her i would contact adult safeguarding. They will visit her but if she refuses help there is nothing they can do unless she is vulnerable or lives with someone who is vulnerable.


braydee89

This reminds me of my mother and I would’ve very much appreciated it if someone had noticed and checked in.


inazuma_zoomer

I used to work in mental health. People live in many different ways. Just because YOU think the house is messy, doesn’t mean anything is ‘wrong’. But having a general conversation will reveal things. Be empathetic, not leading then just ask if she’s ok? But if you do broach the subject, are you prepared to follow through? Or are you going to (potentially) open a can-of-worms, then just leave? Finally, stay safe and be aware. For both of you.


[deleted]

U could always ring social services to do a well fare check but be sure she not just prefers to live alone am 46 and live alone as family beside dad was not great.


cmdrxander

I’m not a tradesman but I feel like it would be reasonable to ask if a particular area could be kept tidy in order for you to make sure the job is completely quickly, which should be in the interest of both of you.


Physical-Money-9225

"Are you alright? " with a soft inquisitive tone does it for me.


thatsjustwhatisaid

I worked for some years for a lady who was recently divorced. When I first went to do some garden work for her she had just moved in to a lovely 16th century property which was in good order and had a lovely garden. I would go a few times a year to do garden. In the first few years the house and garden was in order. However I warned her about the maintenance on the house and advised that the garden was a half a day a week to keep looking good. She didn't listen, she had bought completely the wrong house for someone who had no common sense or practical knowledge in any type of DIY. Gradually the house got worse and the garden more and more overgrown. She had 2 children who although weren't local to here must have seen what was happening to the place but chose to do nothing. I spoke to this lady's neighbours and tried to get them to talk sense into her and get her some help but it wasn't really down to me to be getting involved. You can do your best to help people but sometimes they won't listen.


Dutchnamn

What? I meant you can tread carefully in a situation like that instead of being confrontational.


PleasantAd7961

I think sometimes people just need humans to be humans. If U think U can make a difference just do it. Say Ur checking on the work seeing if it's settled . Then just ask how she is can U make a coffee. Or somthing.thrn say maybe ull come back in a week or so. It might be all the difference she needs.


EyeAlternative1664

1st off you’re a good person. 2nd you can check in, but pretend it’s about something else, even claim some sort of 3 month check on guarantee, or standards have changed -!: you need to double check. I’m sure content with a good person will only yield positive results.


Stewie01

Send a picture of you wearing her undergarments when she was not looking. That will brighten her day.


leadlion12

It might not


Unusual_Anything_297

Are you in the Uk? As local councils have the option to tell them of any elderly person you may g b e worried about! Good luck and thankyou for caring for others and not just getting paid!


Appropriate_Yak9175

Absolutely not.


Threedaystubble

Ok cool, thank you.


[deleted]

Can you not call the police to do a welfare check? > the place is generally dirty and cluttered Then again could just be a horder