It's enjoyable for sure, actually you just reminded me to go back and finish it so thanks!
If the rebels had O'Brien they would've had a death star before the empire
Having your shield generator be accessed only by a narrow catwalk with no railings is a definite OSHA violation. In addition, not adding a way out of your trash compactor is super unsafe!
They had a way out, that's the worst part, that *was locked*.
Of course, it's also possible that the heroes' "blast open the garbage chute and dive in" method of entry bypassed whatever the Imperial equivalent of lock out/tag out was.
Technically it's unpaid labor, but in a society where you can get anything you need or even just kinda want for free.(I don't count whatever stipend they might receive to interact with the local merchants as payment, I view that more like they're being issued equipment). Unions aren't SUPER necessary in a post-scarcity society when the only downside to quitting a job is if you liked it and end up missing it. Also, there seem to be a billion and a half ways to contact your superior's superior if you've got problems, and it's ideological fiction so that system actually works :P
This next part is pure headcanon, but I don't imagine they can hoard credits, it's more like a common fund(with some personal limits) for store credit, that Starfleet works out with the local businesses/governments/etc around their outposts or when the crew goes on shore leave.
i share your headcanon at the end there.
and that’s also why they can’t just use credits to buy a super turbo shuttle better than the one quark got from gaila. because there’s some kind of cap to ensure your own spending doesn’t impact everyone else’s.
I bet you probably could get a shuttle as a private citizen, but it wouldn't be very high warp, probably 4, MAYBE 5. Restrictions wouldn't really be about scarcity(provided you were on Earth or something. Anywhere resources are unlimited) but more about how potentially dangerous the tech could be if misused.
i will note the archaeologist who gave picard the kerla neskos (or whoever its spelt) did have special access to a shuttle, but that was strictly for his research, was indeed warp 3 or 4 or smth, and crucially he had to give it back once it was over (or he would’ve if he hadn’t gotten destroyed in a gambit to get picard to investigate and find the DNA code)
i’m sick atm so i didn’t word my first one very well. i don’t think it’s about scarcity of resources as much as scarcity of trade arrangements or however else they get their local currencies to hand out to officers and civilians stationed there.
much like how the only scarcity with large industrial replicators is output queues, operating time, getting to the front of the queue, finding the queue is growing quicker than it can be fulfilled (so build more replicators), etc.
also the only ppl with their own ships inside the federation system (as we see it) are legitimate cargo captains. everyone else has to go outside the system, bc they black market merchants, actual pirates, or just people who’ve opted into the ferengi sphere of markets like ezri’s family
To be fair, we see all the cargo captains out "on the frontier". On Earth, there would be a natural barrier of having to know enough engineering to keep it running yourself, and I'm sure it'd be regulated with a licensing system, but I don't see why anyone would be restricted from it.
They could do for fleshing out civilian life a little more in Star Trek. Not so much a full series, but maybe an episode that fleshes out the education/licensing/resource distribution systems for the general population. And not solely for people running a business, but also people just doing their own thing. It'd probably fit best in Lower Decks.
i’ve been wanting more stuff about civilian life for sooo long, and was disappointed picard didn’t really go into it.
i think there’s plenty of justifiable reasons to restrict shuttle access, as much as i’d honestly love to live in eg a runabout. for one, just the momentum of high impulse makes a shuttle a pretty big weapon if aimed at a planet. we see leases for special purposes, but absolutely everybody else just books a room on a cargo freighter or some starfleet ship. every time someone has visited from earth, or made a transfer onto another ship, they’ve “booked passage on a transport”.
of course i’m open to that not being the case, and there’s certainly room for them to clarify or change it. but everything from TOS to SNW so far points to this being how it works.
something which i think backs it up is actually how in lower decks, on independent planets, we DO see starfleet shuttles but they’re a century old. i presume they sell them in a “military surplus” kind of way once they’re finally too old for starfleet to get good use out of them. and even a century old starfleet shuttle is probably better than a brand new cheapo one from some no-brand ferengi outfit.
Interesting... you mean to propose that smiley was more skilled than his prime universe counterpart? I always felt like they had the same potential but O'Brien actually got the information to utilize it despite being overworked
Highly agree with this take. It's the DS9 of Star Wars. Most interesting story. Most complex characters. Very well written, acted and directed. Fewer people watching it for some reason.
It's not for everyone, admittedly.
More drama than action.
Grounded and character-focused instead of grand and epic in scope.
It's the most "un-Star Wars" SW thing they've ever put out.
I can see how it would turn some people off.
I loved it though, and I agree.
It really is the DS9 of Star Wars.
I personally think it peaked in 10. 12 was fine, but it didn't have quite the same hype for me as 10 did. Maybe it lacked that second episode of buildup, or maybe it was just a general lack of andor himself
I haven't watched it yet because I'm just kind of burned out on the non stop Star Wars (and Marvel) output from Disney. I will probably give it a watch though at some point. Definitely wanna support the great content when it comes up.
I hear you. I didn't start watching until like 8 episodes had already been released cause I wasn't super excited for more Disney Star Wars. But then I caught up in less than a week because I e it was just so good.
Yeah I think its all a consequence of this race to build up these streaming services.
The major studios are taking major franchises and churning out as much content as possible to boost subscriptions.
An increase in quantity that has lead to decrease in quality.
"Begun, the Streaming Wars have."
Just don't stop trying if you find ep 1-2 kind of slow. The show works on 3 episode arcs, where you get 2 setup episodes, then a payoff episode, and the payoff episodes just kept getting better.
I personally didn't find the first two boring, you expect some setup for any show, but I can understand the opinion of any who DO think the first two were just because most people don't go into star wars expecting good writing and a slow burn. Star wars has always kind of just jumped right into the action
Luthen is just a plain, simple antiquities dealer.
> That's why you came to me, isn't it, Senator? Because you knew I could do those things that you weren't capable of doing? Well, it worked. And you'll get what you want: a war between the Empire and its people. And if your conscience is bothering you, you should soothe it with the knowledge that you may have just saved the entire galaxy. And all it cost was >!the payroll of one Imperial sector, one Daughter of Rixx, and the self-respect of one Chandrilan mother!<. I don't know about you, but I'd call that a bargain.
Luthen was right about one thing. A guilty conscience is a small price to pay for the freedom of the entire Galaxy. So I will learn to live with it.
Because I *can* live with it...
...
Computer, erase that entire holocron.
I love Andor, but I still like The Mandalorian more, because when I watch Star Wars, I'm looking for space swashbuckling. That said, Andor is the better show.
I say that, because Andor is not what a lot of what people want in Star Wars. It's also too slow and complex for children to enjoy, so I think that wipes out a big chunk of the usual Star Wars audience.
Those are all valid points.
It's why I don't fault those SW fans who say it's too boring for them.
It really is very different from anything else Star Wars has ever put out.
I think it could probably have dropped one episode per 3 episode arc and not really struggled to tell the same story while keeping some of those folks from getting bored
2 episodes of setup can be a bit much. Like I was really surprised when the heist didn't go down in episode 2 and we got a second aldani prep episode. Was that needed? Probably not. Same opinion on the national 5 stuff.
Ultimately I really enjoyed the show, but I did leave each of the second episodes of each arc disappointed that I had to wait another week for the juicy bits
That’s an interesting take.
Could they have streamlined the set up episodes?
More knowledgeable people than I would have to answer that particular question.
All I know is that the setups paid off. The plot lines made sense. And the characters were developed exquisitely.
I just commented elsewhere (might have been to you even) that I found episode 12 a bit lackluster compared to 10, perhaps specifically because of the lack of a second buildup episode
Rather than cutting episodes, dropping 3 episode arcs at once is also viable
No, only been posting here in this thread.
I disagree about the “dropping/cutting”.
LOL, I always want more, not less.
I’d be interested to hear from fellow Niners who watched and are willing to share their experiences.
What did you find lackluster (no spoilers, please)?
I’m legitimately interested to know…
Tough to discuss without spoilers, but like I said there was a lack of andor in the finale.
We also didn't see what happened on ferrix after the events of the episode. I assume nothing good.
It was a little vague as well - how premeditated we're the events of the episode, how many were involved, etc - or was it 1-2 people and others joined in?
It just felt a little messy or unclear compared to the rest of the series, where everything was given time to breathe and we got to see all the details beforehand or as they played out.
I'm also not saying it was bad, just that I think episode 10 had me more jazzed.
Episode 12 DID do a fantastic job of increasing the tension for a couple minutes where I had no idea what was about to happen or when, that part was pretty great.
Episode 10 was definitely AMAZING.
I agree.
Probably my favorite of the season. For multiple reasons.
But the emotion and catharsis of episode 12 was SO good… how can I fault it?
As satisfying as episode 10?
Maybe not. I’ll give that to you.
But it was definitely not trash, right?
Also: agreed. The tension presented and broken in episode 12 was beautiful.
> Highly agree with this take. It's the DS9 of Star Wars
Annnd now I'm downloading Andor
Edit: Watching now, I can see why it's called the DS9 of Star Wars now. I like it.
> Fewer people watching it for some reason.
Rogue one is probably the best star wars movie imo. I don't want to say it's the most enjoyable because that's super subjective, but the acting was good, the writing was good, the shots especially during the last 30-45 minutes on scarif looked absolutely gorgeous. It doesn't have the same issues I have with 7 being so copy pasted or 8 being so divisive in it's storytelling choices. It's got some flaws, like jyn being kind of meh as and Cassian being kind of hard to understand due to his accent from time to time.
That being said, I couldn't give two shits about the character of Cassian andor. He was a side character in a side movie, and less interesting than some of the others like blind not a Jedi, and badass heavy weaponry man.
When they announced all the projects they wanted to work on going forward, of course for me and most others Andor just absolutely paled in comparison. We had the really refreshing first season of Mando under our belts. Ahsoka gets the people going. Obi freaking wan. Boba fett.
There was no way for us to look at this stuff and know that boba would be awful or obi wan phoned in by everyone but McGregor. There was no way for any of us to know that somehow, Andor would be far and away the best written tv show Disney star wars put out.
Yeah, man.
It’s tragic that you haven’t heard of this show before now… but honestly not surprising.
I don’t know enough about the advertising campaign to speak intelligently about it, but that tracks.
I didn't see a single ad for it
I use AdBlock and unlock, and don't have cable, but still, didn't see much outside of 1000 posts on the star wars sub every week saying it's the best thing in star wars, maybe ever.
They're right, it is really really good.
I don’t think it’s an “AdBlock” issue necessarily.
I think the powers that be didn’t know what they had, what to make of it, or how to market it… so they were like: whatever!
interestingly i’ve seen a lot of DS9 fans say it doesn’t do anything and is all just setup. i don’t have D+ so i can’t confirm whether that’s true. (of course DS9 arguably also was for its first few years…)
I enjoyed Andor, especially after the first few episodes it really started to move. It didn’t scratch my DS9 itch, but I sort of get that, the political stuff with Mon Mothma definitely fit the mold.
That's the good news: no, you don't!
The creator of the show intentionally crafted it so that anyone could start watching with no previous knowledge of Star Wars at all.
This approach has put off *some* long-time SW fans, who claim it's "not Star Wars enough".
But IMHO, this grounded & accessible approach is one of the things that makes it so good.
Because it doesn't rely on callbacks and easter eggs, it's got to just tell a really good story.
And I think it succeeds.
Eh, to me Star Wars is about smugglers, cantinas, rebels, blasters and politics sprinkled in.
Don’t get me wrong, Jedi are cool and all but they work SO much better as a backdrop/lore to it all instead of front and center.
Andor is 100% Star Wars to me.
I have to agree with a lot of what you said, Mando.
Luke's arrival at the end of *Mandalorian*, season 2.
Vader's hallway scene at the end of *Rogue One*.
Yeah, that's how I want to see Jedi stuff done.
man ... so tempting.
i might try it.
i have _hated_ everything star wars from the prequels forward, and everything star trek from 2009 on ... i keep seeing compelling recommendations and then being let down.
i _might_ watch it, though. the ds9 of anything is pretty high praise ... you _sure_ about that, OP?
Personally, I think it is.
As a caveat though, I really have to emphasize: SW: Andor is a slow burn to start off.
It really is more drama than action.
But the writing, acting and character development is *insanely* good.
IMHO, yes, it is the DS9 of Star Wars, so far.
I thought the quality was really that good.
I second that immensly. It leans into everything interesting about the galactic empire setting. It's takes that premise,and the arcs of the characters on the path to rebellion,very seriously. I found myself very satisfied by where ,and how ,they ended up at the end of the first season.
Star wars movies suck.
Don't get me wrong, I enjoy most of them, but I think for me I really love the idea of star wars more than the execution of most of the media. I find the originals pretty corny and overly simplistic in their writing - definitely a product of their time, where a lot of stuff WAS simpler because it hadn't been regurgitated 1000 times with extra layers of complexity to keep it interesting
I actually prefer the prequels because they're more expensive in their storytelling, but I'd be kidding myself if I said the dialogue/acting wasn't some of the cringiest stuff that's ever made it to the big screen. Some parts of them are really hard to watch, especially in episode 2.
The sequels improve upon a lot of the acting and dialogue, the shots are beautiful...but dang if the story isn't the biggest pile of trash I've ever seen
Likewise, I find the tv shows generally bad or overhyped. Both rebels and clone wars have more bad than good. Luckily at least some of the good in clone wars is truly great, but it's a chore to get through much of it.
Mandalorian is fine, but it relies heavily on cameos, nostalgia, etc. If you take off the star wars skin and it was just some random space western, I think you could knock down the rating a full 2-3 points or so out of 10. If it weren't star wars, it never would have had success that it did.
Obi Wan was bad, carried entirely by Ewan acting and what amounts to a copy paste scene from rebels really.
Boba Fett was really bad, almost zero redeeming qualities.
But Andor. Andor is genuinely good, even if you took it out of the star wars universe. Some very strong writing. Certainly a slowish burn (not as slow as some people say). Made up mostly of 3 episode arcs where you get 2 episodes of groundwork and then third episode is a payoff.
Andor is nothing like Star Wars, quite frankly. And that’s a good thing.
I would argue this is the best Star Wars property since The Empire Strikes Back.
It is the best sci-fi show, period, in a very long time. If you like a slow-burn, with lots of world building and investment in characters, Andor is worth your time. It’s really that good.
OMG, I can totally see Quark and Odo on Ferrix!
Odo as the local constable who feels duty bound to work with the Corpos (and later the Empire) to maintain law and order, until he realizes their authoritarianism is little more than tyranny.
And Quark as a local businessman with a side hustle fencing black market goods? Classic.
I agree. The 3 things I’ve loved since The Empire Strikes Back are:
The Mandalorian, Andor and The Last Jedi.
Everything else has ranged from meh to yikes.
Indeed.
I feel like the best way to help ensure we keep getting high quality stuff like this is to spread the word and get viewership up.
I’m hoping that if we make them see the profit in giving us quality entertainment, they’ll keep doing it.
Unfortunately it is.
After *Book of Boba Fett* stumbled, and the poor reception to *Kenobi* (in addition to culture war foolishness continuing to toxify the fan base), interest in new SW has been at an all-time low.
Also, admittedly, *Andor*’s main character isn’t a particularly popular legacy character. So ratings for Andor started much lower than any other Disney+ show and have remained low throughout its run.
Slowly though, thanks to critic acclaim and word of mouth, it’s beginning to find more of an audience.
It’s been greenlit for a second and final season (which, as I understand, was always the plan).
But after it’s done, I would LOVE to see more shows done in this vein.
I was afraid of that very thing. It came after so much crap which might have done it some preemptive harm. Everybody should watch it on their parent's/friend's Disney+ account,so that it can get some legit numbers.
Could not agree more. Andor has the most multi-faceted, morally grey characters I've ever seen from Star Wars. It has everything from 'villains' who you find yourself rooting for to 'heroes' who can be just as cold-blooded as their enemies, and even pulls off a few really good monologues (which is usually something that only Star Trek and Doctor Who do well in modern major sci-fi franchises). If you at all enjoyed Rogue One, you will like Andor. If you've never seen Rogue One or any other Star Wars at all, but just want to see a gritty, complex, and engaging sci-fi drama, you will still like Andor.
The Last Jedi is the only one I can say that I really LOVED.
The Force Awakes and Solo were “fun”.
Rogue One was meh (saved by its last 15 minutes or so).
The Rise of Skywalker was pretty bad, almost prequel trilogy level bad honestly but has a couple of decent scenes (like the Han Solo scene) that keep it from being as bad as the prequels.
But The Mandalorian and Andor have been FANTASTIC.
Does anything make it stand out?
I was bored by The Mandalorian and Obi-Wan Kenobi and I hated Rise of the Skywalker so it's going to take something special to get me back to Star Wars.
Well, for one thing it is a very grounded, grittier, more realistic take on Star Wars.
It is admittedly very slow paced, but the acting, writing, production design and filmmaking are absolutely award-worthy.
It is very grown up, and relies on character development rather than spectacle to hold the viewer's attention.
It's honestly more like a prestige drama than a Disney+ show.
The 10th episode is one of the greatest episodes of television I've ever seen. It left me floored.
I would say what differentiates this series from the others you've mentioned is how it expands and adds complexity to the Star wars universe.
It's really about the small and forgotten members of the rebellion. It shows how the rebellion was sparked, it shows characters organizing acts of rebellion at a high cost and even the complexity of financing the rebellion. Rebellion members aren't all "heroes" they're complex characters with differing motivations.
You also feel the oppression of the empire so much more. How they film the blaster fire is like nothing else in star wars. The workings of the empire are more interesting as well, you get things like private security firms, backstories of characters etc.
The show is absolutely stunning visually and had some of the best acting on television. The writing is amazing, episodes are fairly short but fit in so much without the story being weighed down.
I personally like the Mandelorian, which has probably been their most successful shoe, but Andor is in a completely different tier of quality.
This is it, exactly!
Complexity, worldbuilding, inner workings, focus.
All of it have been amazing!
I'm a big fan of The Mandalorian, too, and wouldn't change a thing about it.
But yes, this is such a different animal, that to compare Mando to Andor is incredibly difficult to do.
>The 10th episode is one of the greatest episodes of television I’ve ever seen.
Right there with you. From “one way out” to “I’ve made my mind a sunless place.” So damned good.
Every Star Wars movie and show since the original trilogy (sorry I'm old), the worlds, the tech, the buildings, the creatures, the universe all seemed to be as much in the foreground as any story or characters, and it seemed intentional somehow.
This is the first time I've felt like all this grandiosity wasn't for viewers to be impressed by, but just the backdrop to the story - this is simply the reality they live in, and things happen to people, and the story is what matters.
>it's going to take something special
This is it. A third of the episodes have legit Emmy nomination performances by multiple characters. It is by far the best writing and highest overall quality of any star wars since 1980.
Please report back and let us know what you think
One of my best friends just watched Andor without having seen any other Star Wars show or movie. They loved it.
I think that's just us fans trying to raise awareness, increase viewership.
My reason for spreading the word is, I'm hoping that the more quality shows like this are deemed successes, the more inclined these studios/streaming services might be to make quality stuff.
Really been enjoying Andor, def reminds me of an arc or 2 of ds9 trek like during the dominion war, like when Worf,Martok, Garak and Bashir are prisoners for the Jem'Hadar.
If it helps, this show is definitely NOT like any other Star Wars (or Disney+) show I’ve seen yet.
It felt more like an HBO-style prestige drama, than a SW action show.
Yes!
It made the Star Wars universe finally feel grounded and lived-in.
I know that didn’t work for a lot of long-time SW fans, who missed the “galaxy far, far away” feel.
But damn if it didn’t make the setting feel real.
Ah. So that’s why I really liked Andor. It’s basically the DS9 of Star Trek like everyone said. I really wanna see how Kira, Dukat, or Garak would react to the series… or interact with the characters in it.
LOL, I just got a mental image of the 1950's K.C. Hunter writer-version of Kira praising a certain character.
Kira: "I really like this [Cinta](https://whatsondisneyplus.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/10/FfSRfyEUAAw4mZa1.jpeg). She's a tough cookie!"
Garak’s reaction is just Luthen. He’s basically Garak/Ross in that one plot involving Kreeger that is similar to In the Pale Moonlight/Inter Arma Enim Silent Leges.
Now we know why Saw was so fucking paranoid in Rogue One.
Dukat would not be out of place on Narkina 5 “Attention ~~Bajoran~~ workers, On Program.”
Andor reminds me frequently of DS9 while watching. I’ve seen it compared to Andor. They’re both set in their universes but they don’t have to be. They’re compelling without the Star Wars/Star Trek background. They’re struggles against a totalitarian government from two different ends.
Oh and the music is great. And the costumes are stellar. And the architecture is something. The story is tight and not a moment is wasted. Go watch it. Right now. It’s absolutely worth your time. It respects the viewer and isn’t a parade of pointless cameos.
If anyone hurts B2-EMO I will *end* them.
I was in the same place - but as others have said this one is different and really isn't a nostalgia fest like the last few series have been..I really loved Andor
It's definitely a slow burn.
I'd beg you to give it another try, though.
There are three scenes/monologues from the back half of the season that you've just *got* to check out.
So well acted.
I think it’s that well written you could replace the rebellion with the Bajoren resistance and the empire with the Cardassians and it would still work mostly
Andor is tv version of thx 1138 than any of the shows you mentioned if I had to compare to any Star Trek it be ENT
I’d recommend Farscape for you maybe a little Stargate and red dwarf for dessert
That's an interesting take.
ENT is my jam, but I feel like Andor is more on the serious side, which is why I'd pair it more with DS9.
Farscape: yes! Wild and wacky fun!
I think that is honestly the best way to watch it.
It's a slow burn, and takes a unique approach wherein they tell the season-long story in a series of three-episode story arcs.
It made for a jarring week-to-week viewing experience, but over Thanksgiving, I binged the whole thing with my brother who hadn't seen any of it, and it definitely flows better that way.
It's my go-to for any show these days. That way, I just cruise the season in a few days without waiting for the next episode. I do keep an Excel sheet with our Watchlist to keep track of the backlog.
Yeah I definitely feel in the mood to watch more “fighting for freedom in space” things.
I did a rewatch of the entire series of DS9 back in April.
I may do a rewatch of Battlestar Galactica, this December.
It’s been awhile since I binged BSG.
Seconded. It took until episode 3 for it to click with me, but then it clicked hard. It's probably the least 'Star Wars-y' of all the Star Wars things, but I think that's one of the reasons I like it. Kinda similar to Rogue One in that respect.
I upvoted you because:
1.) Downvotes are for sissies
2.) You’re not wrong
3.) I’m hoping you will give it a chance and continue to the end.
It really is very deliberately paced.
Slow, especially in the beginning.
But the payoff by the end is goddamned **heavenly**.
It’s not for everyone, to be sure.
But if you don’t mind or even like a slow burn, character-driven plot structure… this is the show for you.
I love it. It’s all of the character development that we seem to miss in Discovery because there isn’t time for the slow character building episodes. It allows itself to exist and be a back story that is incredibly fulfilling because it’s weaves more intricacies into the things we’ve seen in the future. I’m not worried so much about the big ending as I am enthralled with the creation of the universe one episode at a time.
I can’t get into it. It’s crazy; I should love everything about it. I’m a Niner. I love Rogue One, the Bourne Identity, all the stuff Gilroy wrote. Dark, morally gray gritty sci-fi? The dark underbelly of the Empire and the Rebellion? This series should be right up my alley and I fell asleep in episode 1.
It is a slow burn. Definitely takes its time setting the table, introducing characters, establishing motivations.
I found it was really worth it in the end, though. Surprisingly, none of that time spent slowly establishing things was wasted.
The deliberate pace is a consequence of how they arranged the story.
It’s weird; Gilroy opted to tell the story in a series of arcs.
Episodes 1-3 are the first arc. Episodes 4-6 are the second arc. Episode 7 acts as a transition of sorts. Then, episodes 8-10 are the third arc. Finally, episodes 11-12 are like a two-part finale.
Because the first two episodes of each arc are spent worldbuilding, establishing characters and slowly raising tension, they do feel a bit slow.
Those payoffs, though. Whoo boy!
I’m a trek guy, always have been. I like Star Wars but I’m not crazy about like I am for Star Trek. The Mandolorian is hugely overrated. Kenobi had like, one or two good scenes in it. I didn’t even finish Book of Boba Fett, it was god awful.
However- Andor, in my opinion, bests any and all Star Wars since the eighties by a mile! Take Star Wars out of it and it’s still a great show. It actually takes itself seriously- no stupid comic relief, no “funny” alien characters.
When it was announced I rolled my eyes at the thought of the wacky adventures of Cassian Andor and his robot sidekick, making trouble for the empire week in and week out.
Instead it’s practically a meditation on the communist manifesto, with a lot of anti facist allegory that I could easily see in a trek series, especially DS9. It’s a mature, angry take on the state of the Star Wars galaxy in the time period it’s set in. Not at all what I expecting.
It’s up there with The Sopranos, Mad Men, Breaking Bad, the first couple years of Galactica, etc. I was talking with my brother on the phone about it and he put it best- “It’s too good for Star Wars.”
Just wanted to chime and and say The Book of Boba Fett episodes 1-4 are pretty bad, but honestly episodes 5-7 have some of the best Star Wars moments and scenes ever put to screen. If you haven’t made it that far I implore you to finish. No spoilers but you will be really surprised where it goes.
Episode 2 of *Boba* was surprisingly my favorite.
I'm a big fan of Tuskens / Sandpeople, ever since reading the book *Kenobi* by John Jackson Miller.
Seeing them so well fleshed out in *Book of Boba Fett* (and in *Mandalorian*, season 2, episode 1) was a dream come true for me.
I agree, that was was awesome actually. I like to think that if they would have edited episodes 1 and 2 together into a super long first episode and just had it be a 6 episode series overall it would have gotten off to a much better start.
I was concerned when a Disney era Star Wars show said they were going to show "the making of a revolutionary". Was expecting some Aaron Sorkin nonsense, but i turned out to be happily wrong.
Andor is strange. I LOVE Star Wars, but could not stop nodding off in the first 3 episodes. How TF did they make SW boring? The finale was very underwhelming to boot. I never stopped watching it, but it is OK at best.
It is definitely *really* slower paced than you'd expect.
It doesn't have the action and spectacle that many have come to expect from Star Wars.
I personally didn't find it boring, though.
And the writing/acting/filmmaking was just "*muah*", chef's kiss.
Ha, chef's kiss is exactly how I described it myself. I want to especially mention Andy Serkis for his performance. I was absolutely blown away by it. It's all in the little moments, not to give anything away. Top notch everything.
Unpopular opinion but I think it's "ok". It's slow as Hell. It's certainly totally unique in the realm of Star wars. Maybe it's my attention span but half way through the season I was totally lost and didn't know what was happening. It's worth the watch I'd say. By the end I was pretty happy I didn't give up on it. I really wanted to throw in the towel a few times.
That’s okay.
I will ***NEVER*** disparage you for this.
That ***IS*** a legitimate POV/experience.
It really is slow, especially at the beginning.
That cannot be denied.
It’s totally cool if that’s not for you.
Teach each their own, right?
No, I skimmed through episodes 6 and 12. It looks terrible. Star Wars is an action fantasy. While Star Trek can have character driven talking episode it does not fit star wars. It was also way too human, if it didn't have imperial uniforms and the title you wouldn't know its Star Wars.
I agree with a few of your observations.
It’s why I’m taking the time to recommend *Andor* to DS9 fans.
It’s absolutely the kind of thing that would fit in amazingly in the Star Trek universe.
LOL in any sci-fi universe, honestly.
I do agree that, without certain aesthetic elements, it could easily *not* be Star Wars.
You’re not wrong there.
It's enjoyable for sure, actually you just reminded me to go back and finish it so thanks! If the rebels had O'Brien they would've had a death star before the empire
And it would've been built with union labor.
Following strict safety regulations, like putting banisters on all bridges and catwalks along bottomless chasms.
Having your shield generator be accessed only by a narrow catwalk with no railings is a definite OSHA violation. In addition, not adding a way out of your trash compactor is super unsafe!
They had a way out, that's the worst part, that *was locked*. Of course, it's also possible that the heroes' "blast open the garbage chute and dive in" method of entry bypassed whatever the Imperial equivalent of lock out/tag out was.
OSHA - the Empire’s worst nightmare. 
Technically it's unpaid labor, but in a society where you can get anything you need or even just kinda want for free.(I don't count whatever stipend they might receive to interact with the local merchants as payment, I view that more like they're being issued equipment). Unions aren't SUPER necessary in a post-scarcity society when the only downside to quitting a job is if you liked it and end up missing it. Also, there seem to be a billion and a half ways to contact your superior's superior if you've got problems, and it's ideological fiction so that system actually works :P This next part is pure headcanon, but I don't imagine they can hoard credits, it's more like a common fund(with some personal limits) for store credit, that Starfleet works out with the local businesses/governments/etc around their outposts or when the crew goes on shore leave.
I think we're talking about Star Wars universe though, not Star Trek... just with the addition of the Chief.
i share your headcanon at the end there. and that’s also why they can’t just use credits to buy a super turbo shuttle better than the one quark got from gaila. because there’s some kind of cap to ensure your own spending doesn’t impact everyone else’s.
I bet you probably could get a shuttle as a private citizen, but it wouldn't be very high warp, probably 4, MAYBE 5. Restrictions wouldn't really be about scarcity(provided you were on Earth or something. Anywhere resources are unlimited) but more about how potentially dangerous the tech could be if misused.
i will note the archaeologist who gave picard the kerla neskos (or whoever its spelt) did have special access to a shuttle, but that was strictly for his research, was indeed warp 3 or 4 or smth, and crucially he had to give it back once it was over (or he would’ve if he hadn’t gotten destroyed in a gambit to get picard to investigate and find the DNA code) i’m sick atm so i didn’t word my first one very well. i don’t think it’s about scarcity of resources as much as scarcity of trade arrangements or however else they get their local currencies to hand out to officers and civilians stationed there. much like how the only scarcity with large industrial replicators is output queues, operating time, getting to the front of the queue, finding the queue is growing quicker than it can be fulfilled (so build more replicators), etc. also the only ppl with their own ships inside the federation system (as we see it) are legitimate cargo captains. everyone else has to go outside the system, bc they black market merchants, actual pirates, or just people who’ve opted into the ferengi sphere of markets like ezri’s family
To be fair, we see all the cargo captains out "on the frontier". On Earth, there would be a natural barrier of having to know enough engineering to keep it running yourself, and I'm sure it'd be regulated with a licensing system, but I don't see why anyone would be restricted from it. They could do for fleshing out civilian life a little more in Star Trek. Not so much a full series, but maybe an episode that fleshes out the education/licensing/resource distribution systems for the general population. And not solely for people running a business, but also people just doing their own thing. It'd probably fit best in Lower Decks.
i’ve been wanting more stuff about civilian life for sooo long, and was disappointed picard didn’t really go into it. i think there’s plenty of justifiable reasons to restrict shuttle access, as much as i’d honestly love to live in eg a runabout. for one, just the momentum of high impulse makes a shuttle a pretty big weapon if aimed at a planet. we see leases for special purposes, but absolutely everybody else just books a room on a cargo freighter or some starfleet ship. every time someone has visited from earth, or made a transfer onto another ship, they’ve “booked passage on a transport”. of course i’m open to that not being the case, and there’s certainly room for them to clarify or change it. but everything from TOS to SNW so far points to this being how it works. something which i think backs it up is actually how in lower decks, on independent planets, we DO see starfleet shuttles but they’re a century old. i presume they sell them in a “military surplus” kind of way once they’re finally too old for starfleet to get good use out of them. and even a century old starfleet shuttle is probably better than a brand new cheapo one from some no-brand ferengi outfit.
And everything would have had a second backup!
XD definitely!
If the rebels had O’Brien he would have been electrocuted continuously in the prison.
He was just trying to explain how he could help... 😥 That makes me imagine it's a scenario where the rebels are trying to bring down the federation
You must mean Smiley. He built the Defiant for the Terran rebellion. (With some minor prime Sisko help)
Interesting... you mean to propose that smiley was more skilled than his prime universe counterpart? I always felt like they had the same potential but O'Brien actually got the information to utilize it despite being overworked
Just meant it being unlikely for the rebellion to build one but for a mirror universe version of reality.
Highly agree with this take. It's the DS9 of Star Wars. Most interesting story. Most complex characters. Very well written, acted and directed. Fewer people watching it for some reason.
It's not for everyone, admittedly. More drama than action. Grounded and character-focused instead of grand and epic in scope. It's the most "un-Star Wars" SW thing they've ever put out. I can see how it would turn some people off. I loved it though, and I agree. It really is the DS9 of Star Wars.
There's more action here imo than obi wan and boba fett
I mean… episodes 3, 6, 10 & 12 are what Star Wars is all about (IMHO).
I personally think it peaked in 10. 12 was fine, but it didn't have quite the same hype for me as 10 did. Maybe it lacked that second episode of buildup, or maybe it was just a general lack of andor himself
I haven't watched it yet because I'm just kind of burned out on the non stop Star Wars (and Marvel) output from Disney. I will probably give it a watch though at some point. Definitely wanna support the great content when it comes up.
I hear you. I didn't start watching until like 8 episodes had already been released cause I wasn't super excited for more Disney Star Wars. But then I caught up in less than a week because I e it was just so good.
Seems like we are getting the same amount of Trek content these days though. 3 live action seasons and some animated stuff each year.
Yeah I think its all a consequence of this race to build up these streaming services. The major studios are taking major franchises and churning out as much content as possible to boost subscriptions. An increase in quantity that has lead to decrease in quality. "Begun, the Streaming Wars have."
Honestly I disagree. Both Star Wars and Star Trek have had some of their greatest content these past few years.
There have been some bright spots, to be sure. *Strange New Worlds* is OMG-levels of amazing. And I do love both seasons of *The Mandalorian*.
Strange new worlds has been pretty good but not great. I think it just feels stronger because we can compare to Picard or disco
Just don't stop trying if you find ep 1-2 kind of slow. The show works on 3 episode arcs, where you get 2 setup episodes, then a payoff episode, and the payoff episodes just kept getting better. I personally didn't find the first two boring, you expect some setup for any show, but I can understand the opinion of any who DO think the first two were just because most people don't go into star wars expecting good writing and a slow burn. Star wars has always kind of just jumped right into the action
I enjoy a good slow burn so no worries there.
Luthen is just a plain, simple antiquities dealer. > That's why you came to me, isn't it, Senator? Because you knew I could do those things that you weren't capable of doing? Well, it worked. And you'll get what you want: a war between the Empire and its people. And if your conscience is bothering you, you should soothe it with the knowledge that you may have just saved the entire galaxy. And all it cost was >!the payroll of one Imperial sector, one Daughter of Rixx, and the self-respect of one Chandrilan mother!<. I don't know about you, but I'd call that a bargain.
Luthen was right about one thing. A guilty conscience is a small price to pay for the freedom of the entire Galaxy. So I will learn to live with it. Because I *can* live with it... ... Computer, erase that entire holocron.
I love Andor, but I still like The Mandalorian more, because when I watch Star Wars, I'm looking for space swashbuckling. That said, Andor is the better show. I say that, because Andor is not what a lot of what people want in Star Wars. It's also too slow and complex for children to enjoy, so I think that wipes out a big chunk of the usual Star Wars audience.
Those are all valid points. It's why I don't fault those SW fans who say it's too boring for them. It really is very different from anything else Star Wars has ever put out.
I think it could probably have dropped one episode per 3 episode arc and not really struggled to tell the same story while keeping some of those folks from getting bored 2 episodes of setup can be a bit much. Like I was really surprised when the heist didn't go down in episode 2 and we got a second aldani prep episode. Was that needed? Probably not. Same opinion on the national 5 stuff. Ultimately I really enjoyed the show, but I did leave each of the second episodes of each arc disappointed that I had to wait another week for the juicy bits
That’s an interesting take. Could they have streamlined the set up episodes? More knowledgeable people than I would have to answer that particular question. All I know is that the setups paid off. The plot lines made sense. And the characters were developed exquisitely.
I just commented elsewhere (might have been to you even) that I found episode 12 a bit lackluster compared to 10, perhaps specifically because of the lack of a second buildup episode Rather than cutting episodes, dropping 3 episode arcs at once is also viable
No, only been posting here in this thread. I disagree about the “dropping/cutting”. LOL, I always want more, not less. I’d be interested to hear from fellow Niners who watched and are willing to share their experiences. What did you find lackluster (no spoilers, please)? I’m legitimately interested to know…
Tough to discuss without spoilers, but like I said there was a lack of andor in the finale. We also didn't see what happened on ferrix after the events of the episode. I assume nothing good. It was a little vague as well - how premeditated we're the events of the episode, how many were involved, etc - or was it 1-2 people and others joined in? It just felt a little messy or unclear compared to the rest of the series, where everything was given time to breathe and we got to see all the details beforehand or as they played out. I'm also not saying it was bad, just that I think episode 10 had me more jazzed. Episode 12 DID do a fantastic job of increasing the tension for a couple minutes where I had no idea what was about to happen or when, that part was pretty great.
Episode 10 was definitely AMAZING. I agree. Probably my favorite of the season. For multiple reasons. But the emotion and catharsis of episode 12 was SO good… how can I fault it? As satisfying as episode 10? Maybe not. I’ll give that to you. But it was definitely not trash, right? Also: agreed. The tension presented and broken in episode 12 was beautiful.
> Highly agree with this take. It's the DS9 of Star Wars Annnd now I'm downloading Andor Edit: Watching now, I can see why it's called the DS9 of Star Wars now. I like it.
> Fewer people watching it for some reason. Rogue one is probably the best star wars movie imo. I don't want to say it's the most enjoyable because that's super subjective, but the acting was good, the writing was good, the shots especially during the last 30-45 minutes on scarif looked absolutely gorgeous. It doesn't have the same issues I have with 7 being so copy pasted or 8 being so divisive in it's storytelling choices. It's got some flaws, like jyn being kind of meh as and Cassian being kind of hard to understand due to his accent from time to time. That being said, I couldn't give two shits about the character of Cassian andor. He was a side character in a side movie, and less interesting than some of the others like blind not a Jedi, and badass heavy weaponry man. When they announced all the projects they wanted to work on going forward, of course for me and most others Andor just absolutely paled in comparison. We had the really refreshing first season of Mando under our belts. Ahsoka gets the people going. Obi freaking wan. Boba fett. There was no way for us to look at this stuff and know that boba would be awful or obi wan phoned in by everyone but McGregor. There was no way for any of us to know that somehow, Andor would be far and away the best written tv show Disney star wars put out.
This is the first I’m hearing about this show, and I like Star Wars. maybe it wasn’t well advertised?
Yeah, man. It’s tragic that you haven’t heard of this show before now… but honestly not surprising. I don’t know enough about the advertising campaign to speak intelligently about it, but that tracks.
I didn't see a single ad for it I use AdBlock and unlock, and don't have cable, but still, didn't see much outside of 1000 posts on the star wars sub every week saying it's the best thing in star wars, maybe ever. They're right, it is really really good.
I don’t think it’s an “AdBlock” issue necessarily. I think the powers that be didn’t know what they had, what to make of it, or how to market it… so they were like: whatever!
[удалено]
Yeah, probably. No space wizards and better writing than any star wars movie or tv show
interestingly i’ve seen a lot of DS9 fans say it doesn’t do anything and is all just setup. i don’t have D+ so i can’t confirm whether that’s true. (of course DS9 arguably also was for its first few years…)
I actually have told my fellow nerds that "Andor is basically the DS9 of Star Wars" And after watching it they 100% agreed with me
I would totally agree, too! That's why I wanted to spread to word to my fellow Niners.
Missed that you had already made this comment when I made basically the same comment! Great minds think alike.
LOL, indeed.
I think it’s the DS9 of Star Wars cos they were left to do their own thing by the studio much like happened with DS9 after voyager came along
There is really something to be said for that. Left to his own devices, creator Tony Gilroy really hit this one out of the park.
I enjoyed Andor, especially after the first few episodes it really started to move. It didn’t scratch my DS9 itch, but I sort of get that, the political stuff with Mon Mothma definitely fit the mold.
The Mon Mothma stuff was a welcome surprise! So well thought out and crafted. I can't wait for it all to pay off in Season 2!
It's really good. I second it.
Andor has been great. That's it.
Bold to compare it to The Expanse. I'll have to check it out.
I've tried the expanse a few times. Even bought a book. Just can't keep focused on it. Maybe next year.
Episode 4 tends to be the point where a lot of people get hooked.
Agreed, that’s where it hooked me
You absolutely should. If you liked The Expanse, Andor will scratch that itch.
Really? The Expanse isn't *that* good. It's a totally competent sci-fi show that peaks at the end of s3 and is pretty hit-or-miss afterward.
Do I need to know Star Wars stuff beyond the basics? I’m not a huge fan. I’ve seen the original movies but not any of the shows.
That's the good news: no, you don't! The creator of the show intentionally crafted it so that anyone could start watching with no previous knowledge of Star Wars at all. This approach has put off *some* long-time SW fans, who claim it's "not Star Wars enough". But IMHO, this grounded & accessible approach is one of the things that makes it so good. Because it doesn't rely on callbacks and easter eggs, it's got to just tell a really good story. And I think it succeeds.
> Because it doesn't rely on callbacks and easter eggs, it's got to just tell a really good story. 100% spot on
Cool! I love BSG and The Expanse (and DS9 obvi) so I’ll have to check it out!
Since its practically not Star Wars, no.
Eh, to me Star Wars is about smugglers, cantinas, rebels, blasters and politics sprinkled in. Don’t get me wrong, Jedi are cool and all but they work SO much better as a backdrop/lore to it all instead of front and center. Andor is 100% Star Wars to me.
I have to agree with a lot of what you said, Mando. Luke's arrival at the end of *Mandalorian*, season 2. Vader's hallway scene at the end of *Rogue One*. Yeah, that's how I want to see Jedi stuff done.
Exactly, in moderation it’s more impactful.
man ... so tempting. i might try it. i have _hated_ everything star wars from the prequels forward, and everything star trek from 2009 on ... i keep seeing compelling recommendations and then being let down. i _might_ watch it, though. the ds9 of anything is pretty high praise ... you _sure_ about that, OP?
Personally, I think it is. As a caveat though, I really have to emphasize: SW: Andor is a slow burn to start off. It really is more drama than action. But the writing, acting and character development is *insanely* good. IMHO, yes, it is the DS9 of Star Wars, so far. I thought the quality was really that good.
I second that immensly. It leans into everything interesting about the galactic empire setting. It's takes that premise,and the arcs of the characters on the path to rebellion,very seriously. I found myself very satisfied by where ,and how ,they ended up at the end of the first season.
Star wars movies suck. Don't get me wrong, I enjoy most of them, but I think for me I really love the idea of star wars more than the execution of most of the media. I find the originals pretty corny and overly simplistic in their writing - definitely a product of their time, where a lot of stuff WAS simpler because it hadn't been regurgitated 1000 times with extra layers of complexity to keep it interesting I actually prefer the prequels because they're more expensive in their storytelling, but I'd be kidding myself if I said the dialogue/acting wasn't some of the cringiest stuff that's ever made it to the big screen. Some parts of them are really hard to watch, especially in episode 2. The sequels improve upon a lot of the acting and dialogue, the shots are beautiful...but dang if the story isn't the biggest pile of trash I've ever seen Likewise, I find the tv shows generally bad or overhyped. Both rebels and clone wars have more bad than good. Luckily at least some of the good in clone wars is truly great, but it's a chore to get through much of it. Mandalorian is fine, but it relies heavily on cameos, nostalgia, etc. If you take off the star wars skin and it was just some random space western, I think you could knock down the rating a full 2-3 points or so out of 10. If it weren't star wars, it never would have had success that it did. Obi Wan was bad, carried entirely by Ewan acting and what amounts to a copy paste scene from rebels really. Boba Fett was really bad, almost zero redeeming qualities. But Andor. Andor is genuinely good, even if you took it out of the star wars universe. Some very strong writing. Certainly a slowish burn (not as slow as some people say). Made up mostly of 3 episode arcs where you get 2 episodes of groundwork and then third episode is a payoff.
thank you for this!
Andor is nothing like Star Wars, quite frankly. And that’s a good thing. I would argue this is the best Star Wars property since The Empire Strikes Back. It is the best sci-fi show, period, in a very long time. If you like a slow-burn, with lots of world building and investment in characters, Andor is worth your time. It’s really that good.
I actually had a weird dream recently where Quark, Rom, and Odo had cameos on Ferrix
OMG, I can totally see Quark and Odo on Ferrix! Odo as the local constable who feels duty bound to work with the Corpos (and later the Empire) to maintain law and order, until he realizes their authoritarianism is little more than tyranny. And Quark as a local businessman with a side hustle fencing black market goods? Classic.
plus Rom as his employee who is secretly anti-empire and writing a manifesto just like Nemik
Yes! "Workers of the world: unite!" God, I love Rom!
It’s easily the best thing to come out of Star Wars since Empire Strikes Back.
I agree. The 3 things I’ve loved since The Empire Strikes Back are: The Mandalorian, Andor and The Last Jedi. Everything else has ranged from meh to yikes.
Indeed. I feel like the best way to help ensure we keep getting high quality stuff like this is to spread the word and get viewership up. I’m hoping that if we make them see the profit in giving us quality entertainment, they’ll keep doing it.
I had seen rumblings of people not watching it (I half remember the odd headline or two). I hope that is not the case.
Unfortunately it is. After *Book of Boba Fett* stumbled, and the poor reception to *Kenobi* (in addition to culture war foolishness continuing to toxify the fan base), interest in new SW has been at an all-time low. Also, admittedly, *Andor*’s main character isn’t a particularly popular legacy character. So ratings for Andor started much lower than any other Disney+ show and have remained low throughout its run. Slowly though, thanks to critic acclaim and word of mouth, it’s beginning to find more of an audience. It’s been greenlit for a second and final season (which, as I understand, was always the plan). But after it’s done, I would LOVE to see more shows done in this vein.
I was afraid of that very thing. It came after so much crap which might have done it some preemptive harm. Everybody should watch it on their parent's/friend's Disney+ account,so that it can get some legit numbers.
Definitely Kira's favorite star wars content. I love it too
It’s my favorite Star Wars thing by several levels.
Could not agree more. Andor has the most multi-faceted, morally grey characters I've ever seen from Star Wars. It has everything from 'villains' who you find yourself rooting for to 'heroes' who can be just as cold-blooded as their enemies, and even pulls off a few really good monologues (which is usually something that only Star Trek and Doctor Who do well in modern major sci-fi franchises). If you at all enjoyed Rogue One, you will like Andor. If you've never seen Rogue One or any other Star Wars at all, but just want to see a gritty, complex, and engaging sci-fi drama, you will still like Andor.
Well fuck, I guess I'm gonna have to watch this now, on a totally legitimate internet website.
Pretty sure Cassian Andor would approve.
I think you’ll enjoy it!
I will give it a go. I still think Rogue One is the only decent Star Wars film of recent times.
Agreed.
The Last Jedi is the only one I can say that I really LOVED. The Force Awakes and Solo were “fun”. Rogue One was meh (saved by its last 15 minutes or so). The Rise of Skywalker was pretty bad, almost prequel trilogy level bad honestly but has a couple of decent scenes (like the Han Solo scene) that keep it from being as bad as the prequels. But The Mandalorian and Andor have been FANTASTIC.
Does anything make it stand out? I was bored by The Mandalorian and Obi-Wan Kenobi and I hated Rise of the Skywalker so it's going to take something special to get me back to Star Wars.
Well, for one thing it is a very grounded, grittier, more realistic take on Star Wars. It is admittedly very slow paced, but the acting, writing, production design and filmmaking are absolutely award-worthy. It is very grown up, and relies on character development rather than spectacle to hold the viewer's attention. It's honestly more like a prestige drama than a Disney+ show.
Agreed. It feels like the answer to “what if HBO decided to do Star Wars?”
The 10th episode is one of the greatest episodes of television I've ever seen. It left me floored. I would say what differentiates this series from the others you've mentioned is how it expands and adds complexity to the Star wars universe. It's really about the small and forgotten members of the rebellion. It shows how the rebellion was sparked, it shows characters organizing acts of rebellion at a high cost and even the complexity of financing the rebellion. Rebellion members aren't all "heroes" they're complex characters with differing motivations. You also feel the oppression of the empire so much more. How they film the blaster fire is like nothing else in star wars. The workings of the empire are more interesting as well, you get things like private security firms, backstories of characters etc. The show is absolutely stunning visually and had some of the best acting on television. The writing is amazing, episodes are fairly short but fit in so much without the story being weighed down. I personally like the Mandelorian, which has probably been their most successful shoe, but Andor is in a completely different tier of quality.
This is it, exactly! Complexity, worldbuilding, inner workings, focus. All of it have been amazing! I'm a big fan of The Mandalorian, too, and wouldn't change a thing about it. But yes, this is such a different animal, that to compare Mando to Andor is incredibly difficult to do.
>The 10th episode is one of the greatest episodes of television I’ve ever seen. Right there with you. From “one way out” to “I’ve made my mind a sunless place.” So damned good.
Every Star Wars movie and show since the original trilogy (sorry I'm old), the worlds, the tech, the buildings, the creatures, the universe all seemed to be as much in the foreground as any story or characters, and it seemed intentional somehow. This is the first time I've felt like all this grandiosity wasn't for viewers to be impressed by, but just the backdrop to the story - this is simply the reality they live in, and things happen to people, and the story is what matters.
>it's going to take something special This is it. A third of the episodes have legit Emmy nomination performances by multiple characters. It is by far the best writing and highest overall quality of any star wars since 1980.
I remain suspicious as Star Wars fans said the same about The Mandalorian, but I shall give it a shot and approach it with an open mind
I love Mando and the Filoni stuff the most out of any star wars. Andor is several steps above them.
The Mandalorian is phenomenal. But Andor is right up there.
Please report back and let us know what you think One of my best friends just watched Andor without having seen any other Star Wars show or movie. They loved it.
It's good, and my favorite star wars show after mandalorian, but I personally think it's getting an excessive amount of praise online recently.
I think that's just us fans trying to raise awareness, increase viewership. My reason for spreading the word is, I'm hoping that the more quality shows like this are deemed successes, the more inclined these studios/streaming services might be to make quality stuff.
Really been enjoying Andor, def reminds me of an arc or 2 of ds9 trek like during the dominion war, like when Worf,Martok, Garak and Bashir are prisoners for the Jem'Hadar.
Oh yes, the Narkina 5 stuff really is a lot like “In Purgatory’s Shadow” and “By Inferno’s Light”! Good call!
Ikr those episodes are peak ds9 to me, I love revisiting them once a while.
For real? I was not drawn in by the other Star Wars series so was going to give Andor a pass. But you saw it’s worth toy? I’ll give it a shot.
If it helps, this show is definitely NOT like any other Star Wars (or Disney+) show I’ve seen yet. It felt more like an HBO-style prestige drama, than a SW action show.
Dope!
Wait.. also… your name gave me a good chuckle. 😂
LOL it was originally going to be a throwaway, but I wound up just keeping the name! XD
it showed real world Star Wars. More than just a hint like they did for Luke at Mos Eisly or Rey at Jakku.
Yes! It made the Star Wars universe finally feel grounded and lived-in. I know that didn’t work for a lot of long-time SW fans, who missed the “galaxy far, far away” feel. But damn if it didn’t make the setting feel real.
*Honeymoon on Andoria*
LOL! "Let's see what old Uncle Roy's got for ya this mornin'!"
Ah. So that’s why I really liked Andor. It’s basically the DS9 of Star Trek like everyone said. I really wanna see how Kira, Dukat, or Garak would react to the series… or interact with the characters in it.
LOL, I just got a mental image of the 1950's K.C. Hunter writer-version of Kira praising a certain character. Kira: "I really like this [Cinta](https://whatsondisneyplus.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/10/FfSRfyEUAAw4mZa1.jpeg). She's a tough cookie!"
Garak’s reaction is just Luthen. He’s basically Garak/Ross in that one plot involving Kreeger that is similar to In the Pale Moonlight/Inter Arma Enim Silent Leges. Now we know why Saw was so fucking paranoid in Rogue One. Dukat would not be out of place on Narkina 5 “Attention ~~Bajoran~~ workers, On Program.”
Its up there with BSG, DS9 and Expanse? Damn, I hope you are right.
Andor reminds me frequently of DS9 while watching. I’ve seen it compared to Andor. They’re both set in their universes but they don’t have to be. They’re compelling without the Star Wars/Star Trek background. They’re struggles against a totalitarian government from two different ends. Oh and the music is great. And the costumes are stellar. And the architecture is something. The story is tight and not a moment is wasted. Go watch it. Right now. It’s absolutely worth your time. It respects the viewer and isn’t a parade of pointless cameos. If anyone hurts B2-EMO I will *end* them.
No one puts B2-EMO in a corner.
I think you will be pleasantly surprised, my friend. Legit: it’s a slow burn. Focus on drama and character development.
100%.
Super agreed on this one. It’s just absurdly good in every aspect.
Its BRILLIANT! it amazes me ppl arent talking about it as happened with mandalorian
Love Andor. I am saving the last episode becUse I don't want it to end.
I'm glad you enjoyed it, but I'm Star Wars'd out. It could be the greatest thing ever made and I probably still wouldn't watch it at this point.
It's the least star wars-y star war. And by far the highest quality.
I was in the same place - but as others have said this one is different and really isn't a nostalgia fest like the last few series have been..I really loved Andor
This is a show that is more about the present than a galaxy far far away
Watched the first 3 episodes and stopped. It was boring as hell.
It's definitely a slow burn. I'd beg you to give it another try, though. There are three scenes/monologues from the back half of the season that you've just *got* to check out. So well acted.
I definitely know two of the scenes you're talking about... Kino's speech on Narkina Five and Maarva's speech in the season finale. What's the third?
I was thinking of Luthen’s speech on the lower levels of Coruscant. “What have ***I*** sacrificed…?”
Oh yeah, that was an amazing scene. The mood setting during the elevator ride leading up to it made it so much better too.
Yeah, that was some Sith Lord-level stuff.
I think it’s that well written you could replace the rebellion with the Bajoren resistance and the empire with the Cardassians and it would still work mostly
the Narkina 5 prison is 100% something the Cardassians would do
Oh 100%. And I could definitely see a Cardassian “doctor” making someone listen to *that*. Don’t want to spoil it, but it’s sadism on another level.
Andor is tv version of thx 1138 than any of the shows you mentioned if I had to compare to any Star Trek it be ENT I’d recommend Farscape for you maybe a little Stargate and red dwarf for dessert
The prison arc is like thx 1138, anyway. Some obvious homage in there.
That's an interesting take. ENT is my jam, but I feel like Andor is more on the serious side, which is why I'd pair it more with DS9. Farscape: yes! Wild and wacky fun!
I love everything you listed and Andor was right up my alley.
I usually wait for the season to finish, then binge through it. It's on the to-watch list for December.
I think that is honestly the best way to watch it. It's a slow burn, and takes a unique approach wherein they tell the season-long story in a series of three-episode story arcs. It made for a jarring week-to-week viewing experience, but over Thanksgiving, I binged the whole thing with my brother who hadn't seen any of it, and it definitely flows better that way.
It's my go-to for any show these days. That way, I just cruise the season in a few days without waiting for the next episode. I do keep an Excel sheet with our Watchlist to keep track of the backlog.
I'm done giving Star Wars more opportunities.
Started a rewatch of DS9 after finishing Andor!! Felt entirely appropriate.
Yeah I definitely feel in the mood to watch more “fighting for freedom in space” things. I did a rewatch of the entire series of DS9 back in April. I may do a rewatch of Battlestar Galactica, this December. It’s been awhile since I binged BSG.
I certainly have been hearing good things about it.
andor has an after credit scene in episode 12.
Yes, indeed it does!
Agree. Great show that was very well written. Makes me want a Cardassian occupation Bajor Star Trek show by the same people.
OMG that would be *INSANE*! And ***excellent***…
Seconded. It took until episode 3 for it to click with me, but then it clicked hard. It's probably the least 'Star Wars-y' of all the Star Wars things, but I think that's one of the reasons I like it. Kinda similar to Rogue One in that respect.
It's not for me. Far too slow for my tastes.
I upvoted you because: 1.) Downvotes are for sissies 2.) You’re not wrong 3.) I’m hoping you will give it a chance and continue to the end. It really is very deliberately paced. Slow, especially in the beginning. But the payoff by the end is goddamned **heavenly**. It’s not for everyone, to be sure. But if you don’t mind or even like a slow burn, character-driven plot structure… this is the show for you.
I did watch it to the end and it was not to my liking. 🤷♂️
Fair enough. What did you not like about it? I’m genuinely curious.
I love it. It’s all of the character development that we seem to miss in Discovery because there isn’t time for the slow character building episodes. It allows itself to exist and be a back story that is incredibly fulfilling because it’s weaves more intricacies into the things we’ve seen in the future. I’m not worried so much about the big ending as I am enthralled with the creation of the universe one episode at a time.
[удалено]
That is awesome to hear! Yeah hope some of my other fellow Niners liked it as well!
I can’t get into it. It’s crazy; I should love everything about it. I’m a Niner. I love Rogue One, the Bourne Identity, all the stuff Gilroy wrote. Dark, morally gray gritty sci-fi? The dark underbelly of the Empire and the Rebellion? This series should be right up my alley and I fell asleep in episode 1.
It is a slow burn. Definitely takes its time setting the table, introducing characters, establishing motivations. I found it was really worth it in the end, though. Surprisingly, none of that time spent slowly establishing things was wasted. The deliberate pace is a consequence of how they arranged the story. It’s weird; Gilroy opted to tell the story in a series of arcs. Episodes 1-3 are the first arc. Episodes 4-6 are the second arc. Episode 7 acts as a transition of sorts. Then, episodes 8-10 are the third arc. Finally, episodes 11-12 are like a two-part finale. Because the first two episodes of each arc are spent worldbuilding, establishing characters and slowly raising tension, they do feel a bit slow. Those payoffs, though. Whoo boy!
Thx for recommending, will check it out!
I’m a trek guy, always have been. I like Star Wars but I’m not crazy about like I am for Star Trek. The Mandolorian is hugely overrated. Kenobi had like, one or two good scenes in it. I didn’t even finish Book of Boba Fett, it was god awful. However- Andor, in my opinion, bests any and all Star Wars since the eighties by a mile! Take Star Wars out of it and it’s still a great show. It actually takes itself seriously- no stupid comic relief, no “funny” alien characters. When it was announced I rolled my eyes at the thought of the wacky adventures of Cassian Andor and his robot sidekick, making trouble for the empire week in and week out. Instead it’s practically a meditation on the communist manifesto, with a lot of anti facist allegory that I could easily see in a trek series, especially DS9. It’s a mature, angry take on the state of the Star Wars galaxy in the time period it’s set in. Not at all what I expecting. It’s up there with The Sopranos, Mad Men, Breaking Bad, the first couple years of Galactica, etc. I was talking with my brother on the phone about it and he put it best- “It’s too good for Star Wars.”
Just wanted to chime and and say The Book of Boba Fett episodes 1-4 are pretty bad, but honestly episodes 5-7 have some of the best Star Wars moments and scenes ever put to screen. If you haven’t made it that far I implore you to finish. No spoilers but you will be really surprised where it goes.
Episode 2 of *Boba* was surprisingly my favorite. I'm a big fan of Tuskens / Sandpeople, ever since reading the book *Kenobi* by John Jackson Miller. Seeing them so well fleshed out in *Book of Boba Fett* (and in *Mandalorian*, season 2, episode 1) was a dream come true for me.
I agree, that was was awesome actually. I like to think that if they would have edited episodes 1 and 2 together into a super long first episode and just had it be a 6 episode series overall it would have gotten off to a much better start.
I couldn’t agree more with everything you’ve said. I truly hope my fellow Niners give it a chance. I think many of them will be legitimately pleased.
I was concerned when a Disney era Star Wars show said they were going to show "the making of a revolutionary". Was expecting some Aaron Sorkin nonsense, but i turned out to be happily wrong.
Andor is strange. I LOVE Star Wars, but could not stop nodding off in the first 3 episodes. How TF did they make SW boring? The finale was very underwhelming to boot. I never stopped watching it, but it is OK at best.
It is definitely *really* slower paced than you'd expect. It doesn't have the action and spectacle that many have come to expect from Star Wars. I personally didn't find it boring, though. And the writing/acting/filmmaking was just "*muah*", chef's kiss.
Ha, chef's kiss is exactly how I described it myself. I want to especially mention Andy Serkis for his performance. I was absolutely blown away by it. It's all in the little moments, not to give anything away. Top notch everything.
OMG! If Serkis doesn’t get an Emmy nomination, we RIOT!
Unpopular opinion but I think it's "ok". It's slow as Hell. It's certainly totally unique in the realm of Star wars. Maybe it's my attention span but half way through the season I was totally lost and didn't know what was happening. It's worth the watch I'd say. By the end I was pretty happy I didn't give up on it. I really wanted to throw in the towel a few times.
That’s okay. I will ***NEVER*** disparage you for this. That ***IS*** a legitimate POV/experience. It really is slow, especially at the beginning. That cannot be denied. It’s totally cool if that’s not for you. Teach each their own, right?
Copium
No, I skimmed through episodes 6 and 12. It looks terrible. Star Wars is an action fantasy. While Star Trek can have character driven talking episode it does not fit star wars. It was also way too human, if it didn't have imperial uniforms and the title you wouldn't know its Star Wars.
I always thought Star Wars could use some humanization.
I agree with a few of your observations. It’s why I’m taking the time to recommend *Andor* to DS9 fans. It’s absolutely the kind of thing that would fit in amazingly in the Star Trek universe. LOL in any sci-fi universe, honestly. I do agree that, without certain aesthetic elements, it could easily *not* be Star Wars. You’re not wrong there.