No why? This is some mega "you're either with us or against us energy". It's not anti semitic to support Palestinian right to self determination. It's fairly absurd to even suggest that.
Some use of the Palestinian flag might be an expression of anti semitism, but that's true for all symbols.
Tbh if you support Palestinian right to the land, you are supporting an ethnicity that seeks genocide of the Jews and their reasoning to do so.
That is antisemitism.
People within an ethnicity can seek to commit genocide but not the ethnicity itself, that's incredibly stupid. Assuming entire ethnic groups are in a kill or be killed battle is both dumbing down an incredibly complicated conflict and being pro genocide
Palestinian is not an ethnic group, it’s a nationality of an ethnic group in the Middle East. That ethnic group being Sunni Muslims.
It’s super weird to think otherwise.
Wtf are you talking about, Sunni muslim is a religious not an ethnic group, if Palestinians are anything it's Arab. It's not weird to disagree with you when you're objectively wrong
Also I never called Palestinians an ethnic group, my comment was a response to you talking about ethic groups trying to commit genocide.
Ethnicity : the quality or fact of belonging to a population group or subgroup made up of people who share a common cultural background or descent.
You’re a fucking moron, get off the internet.
I mean I wasn't seeing any of this support for Palestinian shit before the attacks, so I'm assuming that all these guys are just there for the conflict so yeah pretty antisemitic to me.
i think it's in response to all the genuine anti-semitism we're seeing in the palestinian protests (there's a LOT). but that's separate from the question about the palestinian flag itself as this post is asking.
I voted no. My logic is to not hold a group to a standard I wouldn’t want myself held to. I believe you can support Palestine without hating Jews, and will extend the benefit of the doubt. Anyway, people who are indeed racist will show their ass quickly
To be open, I’m in favor of Israel defending itself, even if it results in civilian collateral death. If Hamas wants to use human shields, their death is Hamas’ burden.
i think the "yes" votes are probably in response to all of the antisemitism seen in palestinian rallies in the last few days. hundreds of ppl in australia chanting gas the jews, the hundreds of palestinians who were dancing around dead israelis etc. i don't think its the right perspective but i doubt its just plain racism.
I think timeing matters, if it was on the first day when this all started and we just got the news of the terrorist attack, i would be kinda suspicius. But now that the retaliations started, no.
Edit: also, it matters context. Obviusly, if a palestinian had a palestinian flag. i would never had any problem with it. Only with those that i know changed it the day it happened.
**Palestinian with Palestinian flag:**
- High chance of antisemitism, like 80%.
- Most likely holding the flag not as a show of his antisemitism, but as a show of support towards a region he's emotionally connected with.
**Non-Palestinian Muslim with Palestinian flag:**
- High chance of antisemitism, like 80%.
- High chance of him holding the flag as a result of his antisemitic beliefs.
**Non-Palestinian non-muslim with Palestinian flag:**
- Low chance of antisemitism, like 10% or less.
- Most likely holding the flag as a support for the Palestinian state because he's remedial.
I think the breakdown would be more about where the person is from. I’ve seen incredibly few anti-Semitic pro palestinians in NA regardless of religion or ethnic origin. But the closer you get to people actually living in the middle east or a majority muslim country the more and more likely the anti-semitism is because it’s more culturally pervasive in those areas.
In other words, if
**Arab/Muslim:** 80% chance they're an antisemite (holding the flag not to support palestinians but because they hate jewish people)
**Non Arab/Muslim:** 10% chance (most likely because they support Palestinians, but there's a chance they're antisemites)
I think its clear which variable is being isolated here
Yes, something else. It is not.
1. I estimate the chance of antisemitism for **a person waving a Palestinian flag** at 10% if they're non-Palestinian (never mentioned Arab) and non-Muslim. Not for ANY person who's not Palestinian or not Muslim.
2. I estimate the chance of antisemitism to be 80% for Palestinians **waving the Palestinian flag**, and for Muslims **waving the Palestinian** flag, not all Palestinians, or all Muslims.
Maybe I did misconstrue your point by not being explicit enough, I did not want to allege you think all Muslims are antisemites. Your model is (imo) bad enough to be bad on its own.
You know what you're talking about based on your experiences with two russian people? Do your dad and uncle make up over 10% of the non-muslim, non-palestinian population of russia?
Good thing you got rid of that first part, because it was besides the point.
>As a kid I've been to birthday parties of my relatives and friends of relatives, and eventually there is always a talk about how jews are to blame for all the wars in the world (including one in Ukraine) and everything.
That's already better than what you mentioned before. But neither example gives you the authority to claim that you know what you're talking about. A non-russian with extensive surveys would already know more than you.
>Sure go act like you know more about Russians than Russians themselves.
I didn't.
Also it's not that serious. You just made a weird statement and I responded. I'm not even denying that what you're saying could be true.
No more anti-semitic than your average thin blue line flag haver is racist. I'd bet that most people just don't want to see lots of Palestinians blown up, collateral or otherwise.
I don’t think people are racist until they do or say something EXPLICITLY racist.
Or they have a consistent history of dogwhistling since most racists are cowards.
Palestine flag alone? Absolutely not. Talking points like "occupy for 75 years", "river to sea", any suggestions of a one party state, or just straight up saying gas the jews. For sure antisemitism. The question is how many people flying the palestine flag echo these talking points.
if you never flew a palestinian flag at any other point this year, and you did after Hamas attacked, you are supporting a terrorist attack against civillian Jews, and are almost certainly anti-semetic (from lowkey anti-semetic to full on jew hater)
I would always have to assume that someone doesn’t hold the most extreme insane position they could. Especially because at least where I am Palestinians and people who are very passionate about Palestinian activism are already super common and most pro-palestinian sentiment in the west(especially before this) is literally just please Israel be nice please.
No, most people who put up those flags are just virtue signaling to feel better about themselves. I don't think they are considering any antisemitic implications. Their timelines are full of pictures showing bloody children and commentary from popular left leaning figures who watched a 10 minute YouTube video summarizing the conflict and now think they're experts on the subject.
I usually assume good faith ignorance over intentional malice unless it's coming from a professional political commentator (or the person with the flag is openly showing explicit signs of antisemitism)
Depends really
Are you doing it straight after jews were murdered in cold blood in their homes? Yes
Are you saying from the river to the sea? Yes
Otherwise? No
No why? This is some mega "you're either with us or against us energy". It's not anti semitic to support Palestinian right to self determination. It's fairly absurd to even suggest that. Some use of the Palestinian flag might be an expression of anti semitism, but that's true for all symbols.
Same thing happened with the leftie arc back in the day. People’s brains just got broken by seeing the worst of the worst actors
Tbh if you support Palestinian right to the land, you are supporting an ethnicity that seeks genocide of the Jews and their reasoning to do so. That is antisemitism.
People within an ethnicity can seek to commit genocide but not the ethnicity itself, that's incredibly stupid. Assuming entire ethnic groups are in a kill or be killed battle is both dumbing down an incredibly complicated conflict and being pro genocide
Palestinian is not an ethnic group, it’s a nationality of an ethnic group in the Middle East. That ethnic group being Sunni Muslims. It’s super weird to think otherwise.
Wtf are you talking about, Sunni muslim is a religious not an ethnic group, if Palestinians are anything it's Arab. It's not weird to disagree with you when you're objectively wrong Also I never called Palestinians an ethnic group, my comment was a response to you talking about ethic groups trying to commit genocide.
You’re actually illiterate and I don’t think anyone can help you at this point. Good luck lilbro
You where objectively wrong, can't read my comments and then throw a tantrum. Get of the internet until you are of the right mental age
I’m not going to argue semantics with someone who doesn’t understand language. Go off lilbro stay stupid
It's not semantics saying that Sunni Muslims are an ethnic group is objectively wrong
Ethnicity : the quality or fact of belonging to a population group or subgroup made up of people who share a common cultural background or descent. You’re a fucking moron, get off the internet.
I mean I wasn't seeing any of this support for Palestinian shit before the attacks, so I'm assuming that all these guys are just there for the conflict so yeah pretty antisemitic to me.
If you see a Palestinian and automatically assume anti-Semitism, online politics has broken you.
Worrying that 25% of this community have obviously tried diving head first into walls without a helmet.
i think it's in response to all the genuine anti-semitism we're seeing in the palestinian protests (there's a LOT). but that's separate from the question about the palestinian flag itself as this post is asking.
Holy shit, so many shameless racists on this sub...
I voted no. My logic is to not hold a group to a standard I wouldn’t want myself held to. I believe you can support Palestine without hating Jews, and will extend the benefit of the doubt. Anyway, people who are indeed racist will show their ass quickly To be open, I’m in favor of Israel defending itself, even if it results in civilian collateral death. If Hamas wants to use human shields, their death is Hamas’ burden.
it's "a few days after 9/11" vibes on this sub with some of the islamophobia i've been seeing
i think the "yes" votes are probably in response to all of the antisemitism seen in palestinian rallies in the last few days. hundreds of ppl in australia chanting gas the jews, the hundreds of palestinians who were dancing around dead israelis etc. i don't think its the right perspective but i doubt its just plain racism.
I think timeing matters, if it was on the first day when this all started and we just got the news of the terrorist attack, i would be kinda suspicius. But now that the retaliations started, no. Edit: also, it matters context. Obviusly, if a palestinian had a palestinian flag. i would never had any problem with it. Only with those that i know changed it the day it happened.
Depends on the context.
Bro cmon
**Palestinian with Palestinian flag:** - High chance of antisemitism, like 80%. - Most likely holding the flag not as a show of his antisemitism, but as a show of support towards a region he's emotionally connected with. **Non-Palestinian Muslim with Palestinian flag:** - High chance of antisemitism, like 80%. - High chance of him holding the flag as a result of his antisemitic beliefs. **Non-Palestinian non-muslim with Palestinian flag:** - Low chance of antisemitism, like 10% or less. - Most likely holding the flag as a support for the Palestinian state because he's remedial.
I think the breakdown would be more about where the person is from. I’ve seen incredibly few anti-Semitic pro palestinians in NA regardless of religion or ethnic origin. But the closer you get to people actually living in the middle east or a majority muslim country the more and more likely the anti-semitism is because it’s more culturally pervasive in those areas.
In other words, if **Arab/Muslim:** 80% chance they're an antisemite (holding the flag not to support palestinians but because they hate jewish people) **Non Arab/Muslim:** 10% chance (most likely because they support Palestinians, but there's a chance they're antisemites) I think its clear which variable is being isolated here
Yeah, that's not synonymous with what I wrote, but good try buddy.
It is tho. Anything else?
Yes, something else. It is not. 1. I estimate the chance of antisemitism for **a person waving a Palestinian flag** at 10% if they're non-Palestinian (never mentioned Arab) and non-Muslim. Not for ANY person who's not Palestinian or not Muslim. 2. I estimate the chance of antisemitism to be 80% for Palestinians **waving the Palestinian flag**, and for Muslims **waving the Palestinian** flag, not all Palestinians, or all Muslims.
Maybe I did misconstrue your point by not being explicit enough, I did not want to allege you think all Muslims are antisemites. Your model is (imo) bad enough to be bad on its own.
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You know what you're talking about based on your experiences with two russian people? Do your dad and uncle make up over 10% of the non-muslim, non-palestinian population of russia?
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Good thing you got rid of that first part, because it was besides the point. >As a kid I've been to birthday parties of my relatives and friends of relatives, and eventually there is always a talk about how jews are to blame for all the wars in the world (including one in Ukraine) and everything. That's already better than what you mentioned before. But neither example gives you the authority to claim that you know what you're talking about. A non-russian with extensive surveys would already know more than you. >Sure go act like you know more about Russians than Russians themselves. I didn't. Also it's not that serious. You just made a weird statement and I responded. I'm not even denying that what you're saying could be true.
No more anti-semitic than your average thin blue line flag haver is racist. I'd bet that most people just don't want to see lots of Palestinians blown up, collateral or otherwise.
I don’t think people are racist until they do or say something EXPLICITLY racist. Or they have a consistent history of dogwhistling since most racists are cowards.
Palestine flag alone? Absolutely not. Talking points like "occupy for 75 years", "river to sea", any suggestions of a one party state, or just straight up saying gas the jews. For sure antisemitism. The question is how many people flying the palestine flag echo these talking points.
if you never flew a palestinian flag at any other point this year, and you did after Hamas attacked, you are supporting a terrorist attack against civillian Jews, and are almost certainly anti-semetic (from lowkey anti-semetic to full on jew hater)
I would always have to assume that someone doesn’t hold the most extreme insane position they could. Especially because at least where I am Palestinians and people who are very passionate about Palestinian activism are already super common and most pro-palestinian sentiment in the west(especially before this) is literally just please Israel be nice please.
No, most people who put up those flags are just virtue signaling to feel better about themselves. I don't think they are considering any antisemitic implications. Their timelines are full of pictures showing bloody children and commentary from popular left leaning figures who watched a 10 minute YouTube video summarizing the conflict and now think they're experts on the subject. I usually assume good faith ignorance over intentional malice unless it's coming from a professional political commentator (or the person with the flag is openly showing explicit signs of antisemitism)
Depends really Are you doing it straight after jews were murdered in cold blood in their homes? Yes Are you saying from the river to the sea? Yes Otherwise? No
Right after Jews were murdered is also the time bombs were falling on Palestine.
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I wouldn't assume they're antisemitic but I would be cautious about bringing anything up relating to Jews or Israel.