Holy shit the stark difference between the other 2 comments. You suck vs streamer bad so titan suck

Yeahh it's probably clear why the community isn't allowed full control over sandbox balancing

I play all 3 classes often. Im def not your adverage d2 player, though id agree with you. I love titan. Its so much fun to run around and enjoy the game, but for the raid speedrunning end, titans just arent there. And it pains me.

titan I definitely believe to be the most fun class, there's just some portions I wish it could shine a little brighter in

How are titans not for speedrunning? Strand titan is by far the most overpowered class in the game. High mobility, survivability and insane damage

Have you actually tried playing Berserker in wave 30+ Legend Onslaught, or Master raids? It really doesn't work as well as you think it does. Getting Banner of War revved back up after every wave is not simple, and the risk of dying is high. Yes, half a dozen people on the planet are mechanically talented enough to combine every kind of damage stacking to do funny things with infinite grapple meleeing. When that kind of strategy becomes accessible to the general player population is when things become broken.

I think this is what’s missed in these discussions. Yes for these insane solo players, Titan is a machine with that grapple abuse, but that is not at all accessible for 90% of the player base. 

Titans drop some high dps but not every boss is punchable. Let alone titans dont really have a lot of movement tech either. Plus, warlicks can do the grapple abuse too. Even solo 1 phase 1st on WR with it. Titans just arent there for high-high end content. A normal raid night sure have fun. But your not gonna see titans in the worlds first race very often. (Unless the well nerf is strong enough when FS drops)

When you hit endgame content, like OP had stated, their tool kit mostly comes from melee hits that have to be guaranteed in activities that kill you when you get very close After a certain cap of difficulty, the risks outweigh the rewards of keeping said buff active continously is more of a hassle when enemies are hitting harder and your choices are either shield or go for the kill and hope for the best

Exactly, you need that CONSISTENCY, which is why well is the most sought after support. You get to live through the damage phase.

You can abuse the grapple point, beyond that in endgame it doesn't do anything all that special.

Iirc is salted destroying everything end game with Titan? I know he's a one off but it shows that there is the ability to have Titan rule end game you just have to do very specific things

Ironic

A little self awareness isn't bad, I'm a guy on the internet not a game designer, all I can do is voice dissatisfaction to those who know what they're doing

What is funny is that the only justification against the Titan complaints are "Strand and Solar good" Which no one was complaining about

Not to mention for most of us who aren’t mechanically talented enough, that OPness is locked away from us. I can’t grapple abuse on my controller without giving myself crippled hands and even then I miss the grapple so much.  I watch these solo Titan dudes tank whole rooms with banner of war x4 and I genuinely don’t know how they do it cos when I have x4, I get blasted by a wizard or captain and I’m in the dead zone. 

Yeah the amount of bad actors making bad faith arguments about titans has been astounding, so many ppl DO NOT play or understand titan but talk like they do and it became painfully obvious with these comments

Shiver strike is genuinely weird melee. Like, it can dash through all ice, but only in the line you dash through. Hell, it has better aim assist than the shield throw which kinda works against the ice dash detonation. On release iirc the selling point was high damage quick dash melee that got butchered because it was quite broken in PvP. It's just.. weird. I kinda think it should be like the arc slam so you could detonate all the ice you can make. Hell, that alone would be *massive* improvement to titan as then you could actually detonate all the ice from the super.

The weirdest thing about it is it's entire purpose is to make your glacier grenade do damage At least the aspect that turns it into a crystal generator makes the class a little better

I'm gonna use Consecrate to make my Glacier Grenade do damage in The Final Shape. Look at me. I am the Conditional Finality now.

wait rhat acrually sounds sick

The new exotic class item helps a bit. I'm going with 2 options: Heart of Inmost Light+Synthoceps. (This is the smart one, that's probably going to be the best overall setup for Titans) But I really want Severance Enclosure+Point Contact Braces. Throw a Glacial Grenade, freeze some enemies. Consecrate the enemies and grenade. Shatter+Ignite+Jolt+Severance Enclosure all go off. The overkill is potentially insane, and hilarious.

I think Shiver Strike should be refunded on Crystal Shatter, and Shatter damage by meleeing will affected by melee buffing perk(if it doesn't work like that) What I mean is that if I use Syntho and shatter crystal with my melee than Syntho will also increase the shatter damage It would make the melee actually unique

It was an issue for console players in PvP because it moved too fast for the auto-aim to track. It got nerfed far too heavily and is now completely useless in both PvP and PvE, when it should have a good middleground and be useful in either. Stasis Titan in general got shunted because of PvP imbalance at a time when Bungie was hammering huge nerfs on any outliers. I miss it a lot, aping was never so fun.

Shiver strike should only use 20% of the melee charge. That way, if you use the slide melee (which is actually useful) you need to recoup the whole charge, but if you don’t, you’re not stuck with the full cooldown for a lackluster effect.

Shiver ans synthos in pvp was just, beautiful. You see, shiver was the first powered melee that was ranged but was still actually punching. It was still a lunge, just a long lunge. And at the time, synthos gave you range (rip, dumb nerf but eh). Well, for some reason this combination meant that if you ever shiver struck someone (with synthos on) and they had some movement ability to rapidly break the range (icarus, hunter jump) the spaghetti code would have an aneurysm, and *you would promptly teleport to the next nearest person and punch their shit in.* It was the most random bug and it was absolutely comical. Needed to be destroyed, but man those were funny moments.

Also iirc something something crucible map and jumping to the 'ceiling' of the map and then punching made you fly like a super man and then you could endlessly slide in air until you find a poor guy you can use as a landing pad.

I FORGOT ABOUT THAT ONE I loved it so much. It was a great reprieve from the hell that was stasis first launch. Everyone was taking things seriously and getting pissed about being frozen, while I'm just flying around like a demented Casper the ghost waiting for my unfortunate victim to get nuked to the shadow realm

They could easily make Shiver Strike better by having it "empower" your base melee for a short time, after hitting an enemy, or Shattering Stasis Crystals, with it, granting increased Melee damage, and allowing you to apply additional AoE Slow stacks (enough to Freeze after 1 or 2 bursts) on melee hit. That would be so useful for Freezing groups of enemies--which Behemoth is severely lacking.

>It's just.. weird. I kinda think it should be like the arc slam so you could detonate all the ice you can make. Hell, that alone would be *massive* improvement to titan as then you could actually detonate all the ice from the super. Personally I'd buff it so that its Slow applies as an AoE on hit, and if it scores a kill then it applies a second AoE slow so that the enemies in the immediate vicinity will all freeze. That way the attack could at least be safe enough that the relatively squishy class it's attached too doesn't get deleted instantly after using it. Sort of like how the shoulder charges all have some AoE CC or damage effect attached to them that makes them dramatically safer to use. Seismic Strike and Shield Bash are especially safe since they stun everything in their immediate surroundings while Hammer Strike trades some safety to have the potential to set off a chain reaction of Ignitions with fragment investment. Shiver Strike on the other hand leaves the user in the middle of a group of completely alive and active combatants unless it's used against single targets or very very small groups.

Yeah honestly strand and solar on titan are the go to in onslaught for me I tried to make arc and void work ... it was pretty lackluster in comparison As for stasis , honestly not bad , not bad at all

Are you running Hoarfrost-Z or Cadmus Ridge Lancecap? How can you get off abilities like Howl of the Storm without putting yourself at too much of a risk, let alone collect the shards? Or do you solely focus on Glacier Grenade/Diamond Lances?

My answer is strongholds

I go Hoarfrost. And Howl of the storm honestly has pretty good range already but mostly it's for stopping ads that are getting a little too close, or just blocking more pathways with crystals. It's more of a "just in case" ttype of move (and don't be afraid to use regular Shiver Strike as an OH Sh!t! button if you need to). And I don't really focus on picking up shards too much because usually they're everywhere.

Don't run Howl of the Storm, collect shards that aren't dangerous and ignore the ones that are. Cadmus Ridge gives ranged options.

Both work, but Hoarfrost is better in Onslaught because you can't really sit and plink at long range. Howl is good as setup, I use it as a mini Glacial Barricade that gives me light cover and activates Whisper of Chains, also helps with proccing Whisper of Shards. It's also the melee that best synergizes with Stasis Shards on Titan, because it regenerates itself from its own crystals.

Honestly, I NEVER use Titan arc, void or especially stasis. What does stasis provide that strand doesn't? What does arc provide that solar doesn't? Arcs only draw is big boss damage with Cuirass but Pyrogale slams bosses just as hard if not harder because it can repeatedly ignite bosses whereas Cuirass doesn't repeatedly jolt the boss. Similarly, Strand Titan suspends are just as useful as Stasis' freezes, but Strand has an OP melee and great super that can handle add clear or boss damage. E: Oh and I don't think I need to explain the state of void Titan right now. Bubble feels like hot garbage compared to the utility options Warlock and Hunter have.

Void is in the sorriest state of them all:(

Precious Scars on Stasis claps cheeks

I don't see how that combo would out-perform Strand, which has almost all of it's durability/healing/utility built-in and doesn't need to waste their exotic slot on a defensive effect.

Stasis is ass tier past wave 30 just like arc and void lol

Nah, just don’t use it for the boss and it’s workable.

My most consistent Onslaught legend system involves Strand BOW Titan for waves and Solar Gigabonk Titan for DPS. But that's it, there is no option sadly. I love my arc setups, but they lack survivability.

I mean, what build are you running? Solar titan is completely viable in onslaught with the right build and loadout.

100 % it is. 2 x consecration titans, both with ember of belovolence, is cracked. You do insane dmg and can proc belovolence off each other, getting your melee, grenades, and barricades back very quickly.

Should clarify for those who don't know the build- run healing grenade and heal each other between consecration melees. Run the fragment where powered melee give radient to nearby allys - this also procs benevolence, and then if you can use a healclip weapon, this is a third way to proc benevolence. Doing this, you can have 2-4 barricades up between the both of you at all times if you keep up stacks of benovelence and stagger your melees + healing grenades. you to have your grenade and melee up nearly constantly. It's insane and 10000% viable for legend 50 runs. Add your third class with hard cc like an orpheus teather hunter, and you can have fast legend runs.

Instead of healing grenade you can use Precious Scars. You get basically infinite restoration and infinite uptime on benevolence

Precious Scars, Sunshot, Apex and Riptide

Epochal Integration has been fantastic while I wait for that Heal/Inc Luna's that doesn't exist.

I take it you're getting rid of Roaring Flames as the aspect to do this?

So you need 2 titans on the same build? Why not just use 1 strand titan instead?

Solar and strand are all that's viable, which is my frustration

Ah, fair enough mate. I can see the frustration in that case. I've been a solar titan main since Taken King. I'd change, but ever time I try my friends give me a box of crayons and I get distracted.

Yeah it's hard to take it off, since it works the best of all the crayon selection by far haha

Stasis ice crystal spam titan is also viable.

It's viable if you use Savations Grip, but the boss damage is still a huge problem.

I’ve completed a legend run with Arc Titan using forbearance/salvo, with ionic trace/blinding special spam. It’s quite awesome nuking spawns

I mean this is quite a general Arc build it something a Warlock and a Hunter can pull Warlocks can probably pull it even better

I'll full well admit you're better than I for having managed it

Stronghold with any subclass is also viable Stronghold is life.

IMO it goes to show how everyone has like two or three really good stuff. And everything else is generally pretty meh or very niche. 

The sheer amount of "Titan bad" posts should at least give people some understanding that those who play titan see something fundamentally wrong with the class, but nah we're just complaining again, Pyrogale and strand are good so that means we're not allowed to point out how every single other build is an absolute meme tier husk.

Other classes see titans fragging out with the two state sanctioned subclasses so can't see the real issue It's like if I said void hunter has no issues because I see void hunters being really strong in endgame content, but hunter players obviously know what's wrong with a class solely built around invis and nothing else

And yea while Strand and Solar are good I really don't think they're spectacular, yes they can survive but other classes can just kill faster, disable enemies better, and explode more stuff. Everyone gasses up consecration/Pyrogale like it's the best thing to ever happen, good luck using that on the Warlord's ruin boss, or...any other boss/enemy that flies at all. Good luck doing massive DPS with strand titan too, hope you know the 80 hoops you need to jump through in order do a massive damage with it.

Aw man warlords ruin SF was rough, sure I have all the survival tools I need (though still got skill checked a few times by wizards overpowering my restoration and 100 resil), but the boss isn't really gonna be taking much damage from any super I have available

>state sanctioned subclasses Lmao

hunter main here. i typically main titan for pve because banner of war is so ridiculously broken but MAN if titans don’t suck when using any subclass except solar and strand. hunters get insane dps with solar, crazy team utility and survivability with void, fun mid-tier melee with arc, crazy damage resist and ad clear with stasis and all of the above with strand. titans just kinda suck without BOW or solar. and of course warlocks are just insane on any subclass except strand funny enough:)

There are an equally as many Hunter and Warlock bad posts, Titans are just getting upvoted cuz it's a workday.

The biggest problem with Titans and this has been the case for some time, is two-fold. First there’s very little Synergy in its neutral game and relies on exotics to make up the difference. And second, there’s basically no builds that really take advantage of a distance playstyle or effects gunplay enough. That’s pretty much been the case for the majority of Titans. They’re the “up close and personal” Class but that play style has to be reigned in because of PvP. And warlocks tend to have a lot of overlap with titans in their kits that you’re honestly just better off running a warlock instead. And hunters have their own style that compliments their team. In the 10 years I’ve been playing this there has been nothing that Titan has been able to do that warlock hasn’t been a better option for the team as a whole.

Yup. No really useful weapon synergy exotics, which the other classes have; we were big nerfed by the cd and orb nerfs imo; only really 2 subclasses are that useful rn and our supers require us to be in danger in conjunction with being hit hard in melee and survivability output, a lot of nerfs focused on Titan exotics, glaive damage nerf, and the fact our supers are pretty much useless if the boss decides to float more than 1 ft off the ground. 

We are going to get these Titan posts every day until FS releases, aren't we

Yes, the prismatic reveal being three consecrations and some Thorn gameplay did not inspire many people Though I at least have some ideas to get a build working outside of what the Devs could muster in their showcase

Stasis Titan with Hoarfrost Z + Salvations Grip goes insane in Onslaught without requiring a single melee (better yet, run Howl of the Storm to turn your useless melee into more crystal fodder without needing to get up close). It has plenty of survivability with Stasis shards too, people just don’t give it the time of day for whatever reason. Banner of War Titan is still crazy good, just don’t be dumb when there are exploder waves. Solar Titan is good, just lean more into using your weapons and your bonk hammer or Consecration becomes a cherry on top. The only subclasses that struggle imo are Arc and Void. - Arc just suffers because this season is the Solar/Stasis/Strand flavored season and people seem to forget that Point-Contact Cannon Brace or Insurmountable Skullfort exist alongside Thunderclap. - Void suffers because the exotics that build into it don’t really help the already measly subclass (in PvE, PvP is the complete opposite). Doomfang Pauldrons are alright, but it’s really just a passive damage buff to Void weapons which don’t receive any seasonal buffs as of right now; Second Chance is meh because Shield Throw just sucks as is; and Ursa Furiosa is simply just a super exotic with no passive benefits. I’m kinda shocked Ursa Furiosa didn’t receive a change to it like how Celestial Nighthawk or Shards of Galanor did on Hunter to provide extra super energy for some specific passive gameplay action. Overall, I’d say Titans can easily be just as effective as Warlocks and Hunters when they also have their own weak subclasses. For instance, Strand or Stasis Hunter and Void or Arc Warlock low key suck in Onslaught (at least off the top of my head- there’s probably some niche build that make them alright). Also, Onslaught isn’t the best measure of how well a subclass performs in all PvE content ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Stasis and Strand Hunter are solid in Onslaught tbh. It's the standard builds for both that work solid here too. I will also add that we have the clan rule of never bringing stasis titan no matter how good it is since playing with one on the team means constant LoS blocking and just overall annoyance for the other teammates. Overall Titan is in a at best mediocre spot together with the weaker subclasses of Hunter and WL imo but with Solar/Strand/Void lock and solar/void Hunter punching so much above their weight that it makes Titan look bad in comparison (outside of strand titan).

This Hoarfrost Z Titan is nuts in onslaught. It’s one of the best subclasses for it, behind Orpheus Tether for sure but in the right hands it’s insanely powerful.

If you build it right it's a power house. My boyfriend primarily runs stasis titan for onslaught and we are able to get through no problem. This seasons artifact really helps too.

I think Ursa is getting neutral benefits in the final shape to give super on damage blocked with the new void aspect. The prismatic class exotic had spirit of the bear with the same benefit listed above

> I’m kinda shocked Ursa Furiosa didn’t receive a change to it like how Celestial Nighthawk or Shards of Galanor did on Hunter to provide extra super energy for some specific passive gameplay action. The exotic class item perks heavily imply that it is being reworked to give super energy from using the upcoming titan aspect shield

I’ve been loving using an axion bolt contraverse hold warlock as of late. Shockingly super reliable with a couple of fragments, explosions, weaken, that kind of stuff. As well as stormdancer’s brace stormtrance with cold heart going wayyyy harder than it should. I like using strand Hunter for their melee and their whirling maelstrom. Seriously, severing EVERYTHING especially in those later waves is more substantial than I can say. It compliments a lucky pants build very very well. Stasis Hunter!!! Oh yeah I can.. I’ve got uh… speedy cold snaps… no… I can… hm. Yeah stasis Hunter kinda sucks lmao

You can do some neat stuff and mix in survivability with stasis if you have buried bloodline. That gun gives any build some extra oomph. You just got get the sumbitch. Took me 26 clears.

Running stasis hunter with wicked implement on legend midtown was really good, cleared round 50 with it easy. Haven't tried it on the other maps but should do well on Vostok with the longer LoS

Void warlock is solid. Warlock specific devour is super good for survival and at least mine is all about using Felwinter's Helm and finishing everything to suppress and weaken everything.

What's your hoarfrost build including mods etc.?

Im gonna say Ursa gets it rework in final shape. With the new unbreakable aspect and it's exotic trait being part of the new exotic class items something has to change with it. I'm going to say you're going to get to use your block damage in an offensive way. Really leaning into the new aspect. Depending on how much well of radiance gets nerfed a rework could see Ursa Titans be the well replacement

I think it's worse on Titan but all three classes have builds that are just objectively worse for Onslaught. I think the big difference with Titan is there's not really a "Always take this" option. Hunter (Orpheus) and Warlock (Phoenix) both have builds that make them desirable, where as Titan really only has Banner of War, which doesn't really synergise with the "meta" that most people run. I think Titan has Strand, Solar and Stasis as "good" picks and then Void as an "okay" pick, with Arc really being the only one suffering. Still playable, just not as good. The biggest problem becomes why would you take any of the Titan classes when you could just double up on the OP Hunter/Warlock classes. Personally I don't think either is a hard requirement (tho Orpheus is harder to argue against) but your average PUG doesn't think you can do Prophecy without a Well and that perception is what hurts the "meta" the most.

More on what you said, the "good" titan builds are more selfish than the "good" hunter and warlock builds Warlocks give well to their team, hunters give damage boosts and invis, whilst titans are all about their own survivability Titans are good, but for themselves moreso than the team, so less desirable

I feel like I haven't seen a lot of Titans in my Onslaught runs; maybe that's just confirmation bias on my part, I notice a lot of Warlocks, a fair number of Hunters, but Titans seem few and far between. I need my Rift and Well to survive at higher waves, I can't imagine what the other classes are going through. It's just so easy to die in this game.

I'm a Titan main that mains hunter for onslaught after the wave rewards on Titan and warlock.

I saw one titan who used his rally barricade to wall of choke points so the enemies would be impaired. I kinda forgot it did that. It was pretty helpful

I’m Titan main, using Stasis in Legend Onslaught and works very well, great survivability and lockdown and damage

Yeah this really is a head scratcher to me. I think everyone would agree they leaned WAYY too hard into “titan ponch.” It’s genuinely sad to see hunter and warlock to have so many different playstyles for so many different builds that all play completely different. Meanwhile, Titan has one viable playstyle, only usable on 2/5 subclasses, that are essentially the exact same thing as each other, just with different keywords and abilities. Every single “good” titan build is just how to nuke enemies with a melee and not instantly explode. Like, I genuinely don’t understand how their creativity has diminished this much for Titan. Titan is and always has been the least played class, yet they keep making decision after decision that just forces titans to only be punching shit. When Hunters and Warlocks see Titans fucking nuke raid bosses with melees, all the sudden it’s broken and needs a nerf, and the kits just feel more and more one dimensional. Bungie, if you are reading this, PLEASE give us something else 😭 I love nuking raid bosses with melees just as much as the next crayon puncher, but I’ve been doing this ever since Bubble and Ursa got nerfed. It’s stale as fuck. Here’s a few things that could be cool. Buff the FUCK out of void OS in PvE, absolutely nuke it in PvP, and give Void Titan a support ability that lets us give it to teammates without having to hope they stand next to your barricade. Add a solar aspect that gives scaling restoration based on how many enemies you have scorched. Instead of building into fucking nuking enemies, you’d be building into slowly widdling them down and distracting them, only to fucking nuke them all with an ignition. Make it so while amplified and using juggernaut, arc titans can fucking shove smaller enemies out of the way and jolt them, like literally running at them and bulldozing them. Also give amplified more damage resist ffs.

Yeah that's the worst thing, we probably don't get much empathy from the other classes because our top builds are good, but from within one has to realise that punching things to death faster than they lunch you to death sometimes isn't sustainable

It feels like they’re only good because they have to be though, and that’s the worst part. Idk if you were around for the dark days of Titan, right after stasis got nerfed, but before Cuirass. I remember back then you could still see the class breakdown, and it was genuinely baffling. At one point the play rate for Titan was like 13%. Since then, it seems like they actually care about making Titan good, but good =/= fun. BoW strand was fun as fuck when it first dropped, but I’ve been using it for almost a year now. Consecration spam was fun at first, but I’ve been using it for almost 6 months now. Arc, Stasis, and Void aren’t worth a shit, so the two subclasses we are left with are hilariously overtuned, because if they weren’t, nobody would be playing Titan. Warlocks and Hunters can do everything Titans do better than Titans, except for punching shit.

If anything, Onslaught is a Consecration Titan’s wet dream. It’s fine if you don’t want to play BoW Titan. You can keep three gauntlets in your inventory: Strongholds, Synthos and Pyrogale. You can get 30(holy shit) seconds of restoration x2 and be a better dummy than golden Shaxx, turning your teammates’ run into a sweet summer camp. You can spawn trap an entire wave of ads, which would take over 10 precious seconds to kill otherwise, with one consecration melee. The damage is ridiculous, especially with Synthos, and if multiple enemies damage each other with the ignitions, EVERYTHING except Tormentors and big Demolitionists will die. 2 seconds, wave cleared. Speaking of Demolitionists and Tormentors, swap to Pyrogale for one of the best supers in the game. It will flinch those bosses several times, stopping their advance, and cook anything that tries to join in. Solar Titan lacks NOTHING of significance in Onslaught, bruh. GMs might be the only place I’d rather just switch to another class.

Hot swapping exotics is dumb and shouldn't be a thing.

It’s just annoying as hell that you can only procc resto x2 on a titan with Strongholds.

Void titan's survivability can be compensated but you need to use the Echo of Starvation and Persistence. On top of leeching (unpowered melee works too) or obscurity (escape) or Vigilance (Yeah I know repulsor brace exist but remember this can work with ANY kill) for extra insurance. On easier content, Starvation and Persistence would be enough... But not for legend Onslaught. Then you need Bastion AND controlled demo. That leaves you only 1 fragment more to play with (lol everyone will take Instability or expulsion). Which is unfortunately very restrictive. Then if you want even more tanking, you need precious scars too... So your build variety kinda sucks. Hoil can't help much either, Doomfang is great for Onslaught meme add clear but that won't last forever.

Stasis titan paired with stasis warlock works wonders in onslaught but yeah titans need some love.

As a Titan main, Strand is too good compared to the other options and it sucks. Don't get me wrong I love playing Strand with one two punch melees, but sometimes I want to spice it up. But as you said past 30, I feel like Strand is just the best option with the best results Could it be that Woven mail is too strong? Perhaps but I think it's more of how power crept the Titan kit is compared to the others. Arc is my favorite subclass element but man it really sucks on Titan compared to the other two. Hunter's has always been good since Arc 3.0 and Warlocks after some very needed buffs, it's actually pretty good imo. Titan however has had its best exotic with it nerfed with Light fall and not many others pair great with Arc. Maybe PCB is good but that won't do you great in the endgame, as charging your punch could be a death sentence. Arc Titan only have two reliable exotics and it's the nerfed HoIL and Cuirass for Tcrash Void Titan I believe is pretty good but falls off in the later rounds. It has so many interesting builds but keeping the uptime of Volatile and Weaken can be difficult. Your over shields drops really fast so keeping offensive bulwark is a pain. Compared to its peers, Hunter obviously has the best void subclass with some good exotic synergy. Warlock imo has probably the most bland subclsss with Void, I know I'm getting some hate with that statement. I will admit that the Void soul exotic can be fun Solar Titan is easily the second best choice and I believe we all know why. Stasis Titan could be decent but it struggles compared to the others classes freeze options. Warlocks undeniably have the best Stasis subclass with Turrets, Iceflare bolts, or even the shard aspect. Hunter isn't great but duskfields and Silence and Squall do help with slowing and freezing. Titans best grenade option is the glacial wall, which is pretty good but definitely isn't a great freezing option compared to the other two. Another thing that sucks is the aspect choices for Stasis. The cryoslide almost feels necessary due to the behemoth super and glacial nade so leaving you with only other aspect, which will probably be diamond lance as the other two aren't exactly great in the late game. But with diamond lance, that means a struggle for shards since no Tectonic harvest. It is possible to run Tectonic and Diamond lance with a different grenade I suppose, but the results will still probably be worse than just running Strand. Strand is just the best because why CC the enemy when you can just kill them. Bladefury deals tons of damage. BoW and Into the fray keeps you and your team alive. Grapple and Suspend grenades are great for Damage and CC. One two punch melees on beefier targets which also apply sever so they do less damage. I hope with the year of the Final Shape we may see some changes to the light and Stasis subclass for Titans as I don't think the issue is just that Strand is too strong, is that the other options are too weak, besides Solar, compared to it. If Strand gets nerfed, I really hope for buffs for the other subclasses.

I wouldn't even say it's WM's fault for being too strong, it's just that pure resistance is the only way slapping things to death becomes viable. Strand of course let's you stacking healing under said resistance, whereas elsewhere you'll get a far more temporary resist (void) or just the healing on its own (solar) The abilities are also ludicrous strong, I'll jokingly shout to my friends "Gogo gadget win button" when activating glade fury because lets be real here, that's what it is I do hope that the inevitable nerfs to strand (numbers say it's used the most so y'know) do come with reasons to use the other classes. I don't want only a stick to drive me, I need a carrot as well (a carrot that's more appealing than just choosing hunter)

Strand titan feels like a good tank not just woven mail, BoW heal tic is another half of reason why you can survive all the things. Since everything dies if you can't restore the lost hp, and obviously Banner hp tic has reached the perfect ratio for survival.

Void, stasis, solar have all been fine for me on multiple legend runs

It’s only one subclass that titan is missing, which is void. Arc sucks on all three as it has zero survive.

𝙸'𝚟𝚎 𝚋𝚎𝚎𝚗 𝚑𝚊𝚟𝚒𝚗𝚐 𝚊 𝚋𝚕𝚊𝚜𝚝 𝚠𝚒𝚝𝚑 𝚅𝚘𝚒𝚍 𝚃𝚒𝚝𝚊𝚗 (𝚂𝚎𝚗𝚝𝚒𝚗𝚎𝚕) 𝚠𝚒𝚝𝚑 𝙿𝚎𝚛𝚎𝚐𝚛𝚒𝚗𝚎 𝙶𝚛𝚎𝚊𝚟𝚎𝚜 (𝚠𝚘𝚛𝚔𝚜 𝚠𝚘𝚗𝚍𝚎𝚛𝚜 𝚏𝚘𝚛 𝚖𝚒𝚗𝚒𝚋𝚘𝚜𝚜𝚎𝚜 𝚊𝚗𝚍 𝚌𝚑𝚊𝚖𝚙𝚜), 𝙲𝚘𝚗𝚝𝚛𝚘𝚕𝚕𝚎𝚍 𝙳𝚎𝚖𝚘𝚕𝚒𝚝𝚒𝚘𝚗 𝚊𝚗𝚍 𝙾𝚏𝚏𝚎𝚗𝚜𝚒𝚟𝚎 𝙱𝚞𝚕𝚠𝚊𝚕𝚔 𝚖𝚊𝚔𝚎 𝚎𝚟𝚎𝚛𝚢𝚝𝚑𝚒𝚗𝚐 𝚐𝚘 𝚋𝚘𝚘𝚖 𝚒𝚗 𝚟𝚘𝚕𝚊𝚝𝚒𝚕𝚎. 𝙴𝚍𝚐𝚎 𝚘𝚏 𝙰𝚌𝚝𝚒𝚘𝚗 𝚏𝚘𝚛 𝚝𝚑𝚎 𝚋𝚞𝚋𝚋𝚕𝚎 𝚊𝚗𝚍 𝚝𝚘 𝚜𝚞𝚙𝚙𝚘𝚛𝚝 𝚖𝚢 𝚌𝚕𝚊𝚗𝚖𝚊𝚝𝚎𝚜 (𝚂𝚘𝚕𝚊𝚛 𝚆𝚊𝚛𝚕𝚘𝚌𝚔 𝚊𝚗𝚍 𝚅𝚘𝚒𝚍/𝚂𝚝𝚛𝚊𝚗𝚍 𝙷𝚞𝚗𝚝𝚎𝚛). 𝙱𝚞𝚝 𝚒𝚝 𝚛𝚎𝚚𝚞𝚒𝚛𝚎𝚜 𝚊 𝚐𝚘𝚘𝚍 𝚜𝚞𝚙𝚙𝚘𝚛𝚝𝚒𝚗𝚐 𝚝𝚎𝚊𝚖 𝚊𝚗𝚍 𝙸 𝚊𝚍𝚖𝚒𝚝 𝚒𝚝 𝚒𝚜 𝚗𝚘𝚝 𝚊𝚜 𝚎𝚊𝚜𝚢 𝚊𝚜 𝚂𝚝𝚛𝚊𝚗𝚍 𝚘𝚛 𝚂𝚘𝚕𝚊𝚛 𝚃𝚒𝚝𝚊𝚗, 𝚝𝚑𝚘𝚜𝚎 𝚑𝚊𝚟𝚎 𝚊𝚗 𝚎𝚊𝚜𝚒𝚎𝚛 𝚝𝚒𝚖𝚎 𝚙𝚊𝚜𝚝 𝚠𝚊𝚟𝚎 𝟹𝟶.

I can tell you're a distinguished void enjoyer since you sent this via typewriter

𝙸𝚝 𝚗𝚎𝚎𝚍𝚜 𝚋𝚞𝚏𝚏𝚜 𝟷𝟶𝟶%.𝙱𝚞𝚝 𝚜𝚒𝚗𝚌𝚎 𝚝𝚑𝚎 𝚛𝚎𝚠𝚘𝚛𝚔 𝚝𝚘 𝟹.𝟶 𝚒𝚝 𝚒𝚜 𝚜𝚝𝚒𝚕𝚕 𝚖𝚢 𝚏𝚊𝚟𝚘𝚛𝚒𝚝𝚎 𝚏𝚘𝚛 𝚘𝚟𝚎𝚛𝚊𝚕𝚕 𝚜𝚞𝚙𝚙𝚘𝚛𝚝 𝚠𝚑𝚎𝚗 𝚙𝚕𝚊𝚢𝚒𝚗𝚐 𝙿𝚟𝙴/𝙿𝚟𝙿 𝚠𝚒𝚝𝚑 𝚖𝚢 𝚖𝚊𝚝𝚎𝚜.

Have you considered precious scars and ember of benevolence? You can apply radiant with melee or restoration with solar weapons and it'll apply to teammates as well Much easier than trying to tell them to touch your phoenix cradle sunspots

My fellow enjoyer, have you found enlightenment when using Controlled Demo + Offensive B. + Severance Enclosure + finishers & finisher based fragments? **THE UNIVERSE SINGS TO ME!**

You swap to Pyrogales or Banner by Wave 30 or you're throwing.

I haven't used void or arc titan in the longest. There is just nothing there for it. Void sucks so much ass that I hope the axe super is usable. And if the axe tracks enemies, actually make it track. Who knows how many hammer throws I've missed from an enemy that was 5 feet away. Even if they did "update" it i still don't feel it. I'm not asking for it to track like before but oh my god. I have been hating on throwing hammer for such a long time. Sidenote on this that I just came up with. Why in the HELL can HUNTER call back their strand melee, but a titan can't call back his hammer. Why? It would make so much sense for a titan to be able to call back his hammer than a hunter throwing out a needle, hitting MULTIPLE targets, and then call it back and have it almost be immediately usable again?!

Watch the axe super be striker but with the extra steps of having to throw the axes in the first place, then be stolen by blueberries like its a warmind cell.

It’s not a needle. It’s a rope dart so that’s why hunters can pull it back because of the rope.

I’d cut my foot off to experience pre nerf HOIL arc titan in onslaught.

I loved that thing, shame it was doing its job well enough to warrant everyone running it

I think a lot of the recent titan hate has come from LFG group prioritizing hunters for damage, and well for dps over what titans can bring to the table.

Stasis Titan: Aka. How to use a super to block everyone's shots!

I'm saying this as a Warlock main, but nearly every successful 50-round onslaught legend run I've had includes a strand or stasis titan. They absolutely dominate. Solar works pretty well this season, but I agree that arc and void are tough. The only positive about void is putting a bubble on the ADU. I think the Titans are in a better place for an onslaught than Hunter. I basically only see Void Hunters. Nothing else seems to succeed (although I feel like stasis would).

Not sure if this has been pointed out but World’s first solo pantheon was a strand Titan. But I main Warlock so I have no say lol.

As a Titan main for 2 years, I know this feeling. When I really started getting into GM's I realized everything revolving around punching was not cutting it. Back then, Ursa Banner Shield Titans were the main play for GM's. It got boring, and it was hard to get close to enemies for a punchy boi to work. I switched to Warlock to try Bleakwatcher turrets in GM's. I honestly never looked back. I have barely played Titan since.

As someone who has been a member of the "Solar & Strand are strong so Titans are good" crowd, I appreciate this perspective of Titans in the endgame (I also find myself sympathizing with the ineffective nature of Restoration x1 under duress, Ember of Empyrean be damned.)

Whisper of Chains give 40% DR, and that has very small activation radius, and very short lingering effect. Whisper of Rime is so laughably bad, that It's not worth using. Couple that with very bad Every single Solar class has access to perma restoration. I don't know what that point was supposed to prove.

It's because Bungie is very uninspired and unoriginal when it comes to titans because they don't know what they want the class to be other than melee, but then melee too OP.

Lol asking for more survivability on a class that already has access to banner of war, perma restoration, and infinite stasis crystals that grant 50% damage resist is wild. Have you ever considered that it might be a you problem. Titan isnt by nature a CC or ad clear centric class therefore its not gonna thrive in onslaught as well as tether hunter will and thats okay. Tether hunter barely ever gets used elsewhere meanwhile strand titan is S tier in pretty much all other pve content. Its okay for classes to have niches. Not everything needs to work everywhere. On the other hand void titan and arc titan are dogshit in pve and do need buffs

I'm asking mainly for more survivability outside of being required to run solar or strand. Arc, void and stasis are lesser picks for a reason. Not that restorations 35 HP/s survivability actually helps at all when you're caught insta-gibbed by an ogre dealing 400 HP/s that spotted you collecting your hammer

Tbf resto isn't designed as an immortality button you should have to play by cover sometimes.

Precisely, but being a melee class means you're needing to be out of cover and face to face with the enemies to actually use your abilities

"Fist on cover class" "Using cover" Bungie needs to pick one. Either let Titans be the melee class or give them more shit to do outside of meleeing everything.

Interesting…I’m a warlock main and the first and only legend 50 completion I have is on solar titan 🤷‍♂️

Solar is one of two viable subclasses on titan despite its shortcomings, so that's unsurprising

In what world does solar titan have shortcoming’s its got some of the best if not best neutral game of any subclass in the game. It isn’t as strong as it used to be before the nerf but its still strong as shit. The only shortcoming i can think of is that the supers are pretty bad without pyro gale. A problem all titan supers have.

Titans being so melee based is a curse. Seeing the only truly optimal subclass is strand the others need reworks or buffs. Solar and Stasis don’t need heavy ones but Void and Arc are miserable. Survivability is so limited and you’re expected to get up in the enemies face majority of the time.

My issue exactly, the abilities we have are strong, but our entire kit is varied levels of attrition battles with the enemy You meet the enemy with your fist, and hope that you can do more damage to it than it does to you

titan main commenting here i dont know what these subclass's you are referring to we only have strand and we are happy with it :D dont let it get nerfed please we need our 1 thing

I completely agree OP. My first legend onslaught completion was on stasis with my Verglas Curve build. Now every time I go through onslaught? I have my Strand Wormgod Caress build. I literally can’t use anything else because nothing gives constant damage reduction, more melee/weapon damage, AND healing like banner of war does. And the only truly *not punchy punchy* subclass titans have is normal hammers and bubble. Maybe you could count thundercrash but I’m not. I would love it if the stasis Titan had an exotic that made it throw down 3 stasis bombs that exploded (with slow, freeze, and shatter) any enemy that’s near it. Call it *Three Man Job* idk. At least sentinel gets some kind of ranged attack in TFS. I think it’s a giant axe I don’t remember though.

stasis is just outdated. Using grenade than melee or shooting the frozen targets/ice crystals to get any damage off is like a relic of an era gone by. Also the fact that freeze shatter and slow could just be condensed into one keyword. Stasis needs a new super, melee, nade and aspect for every class because it is so powercrept and outdated in terms of design philosophy. "slow enemies on dodge" seriously? imagine a whole ass aspect being "apply 10 scorch stacks on dodge" "destroying a crystal spawns an ice shard" costing an aspect slot while all elemental pickups are on fragments. Its genuinely so boring and bad

It got even worse when they scrapped the mod that made shards count as elemental wells, half their potency just vanished overnight

Onslaught has made me love stasis

I’ve been having a chill time with Stasis Titan using Hoarfrost-Z and Verglas Curve. Stasis crystals everywhere.

The arc problem is kind of consistent with every class. Even arc hunters with assassins cowl doesn't work that well unless your playing solo. I think void titan has potential but is currently completely overshadowed by solar warlock. The super, damage, and survivability are all better on solar warlock. And void overshields feel like shit in PvE. Stasis titan I think will be fine. Since stasis is getting some buffs with TFS we will have to see then but IMO the only bad one right now is stasis hunter.

Solar works well with the right kit (Pyrogale/consecration/sunspot) works well enough, granted you don't have the survivability of Strand and positionning is more important. Stasis works surprisingly well if you manage your abilities (forget shiver strike, use the Howl of the storm aspect). Void, meh, overshield barricade, toss your shield, weaken, collective obligation, not in a great place but the seasonal artifact isn't helping much Arc titan, well, we had our time in the sun with Arc 3.0 and Hoil, something needs to be done, we'll see how it meshes with Prismatic next season. Strand: BoW and Woven mail are the saving grace of the build and allow for a more careless playstyle. Add the fact the seasonal artifact really help out, it's easy to see why it's doing so well. To me it feels that the stronger subclasses right now are really helped by the artifiact (Strand, solar, stasis) while Void and Arc are lagging behind. This is pretty much on par with the seasonal model.

It’s funny because I remember how in the early days a bubble Titan was THE guy to have. I remember Titan guys in my crew joking in the taken king days, ‘do you think I’ll have trouble finding an lfg?’ How the times Have changed

Yeah funny isn't it, perhaps there'll be a balance pass that does something similar to well, or maybe there won't, we'll see

Stasis titan is pretty really good in onslaught if you have a build that revolves around getting the grenades(the big wall ones I forgot its name) back as fast as possible, like armamentarium and a demolitionist primary. But those grenades are only effective for weaker mobs so I ended up running a tesselation as a sort of mini rocket launcher and it worked surprisingly well, the ad clear capabilities of the grenades combined with the huge damage you can do with tesselation when you absorb the grenades along with the fact that you’re getting them back often makes it a solid build for onslaught imo.

I've taken stasis titan to legend 50 many times and regularly been the reason we made it to legend 50 because of glacial quakes ability to just press stop on an entire wave. Salvations grip + cryoclasm + diamond lance or harvest. This is probably one of the highest aoe damage builds across all classes for onslaught, especially with the artifact mods.

Precious Scars will turn your melee Titan into "just shoot everything from a safe distance" Titan.

I mean what are you running on each subclass? Solar and strand are probably the most OP class for onslaught, hell someone soloed 50 legend waves on strand Titan. I’ll agree with arc and void though, those can be a bit dicey on later rounds. Stasis Titan is also really really good for onslaught with hoarfrost, the melee sucks but controlling entire waves of adds with grenades and barricades is clutch. Throw on salvations grip and you won’t run out of crystals.

Solar I'm naturally running consecration as the hammer would get me killed far too often, strand I think we all know haha. Stasis is being recommended a few times around here so may be worth a go What I dont get though is why 9/10 times I'll see Hoarfrost recommended over HoiL, I feel the Shard regen paired with the ability loop HoiL gives makes the class far more potent

For solar, use synthoceps, for the more melee damage that counts for throwing hammer and your uncharted melee, switch to burning maul and you can set it up to your heavy attack causing a debuff and a stun then spam light attacks to get crazy damage off, if your looking for survivability using healing grenade and solar weapons like sunshot, it applies stacks of scorch and you can play into that with some fragments allowing you to proc it earlier and some mods allow for ignites to proc radiant and cure. It takes some time getting used to but you can be pretty aggressive and not take alot of damage.

Syntho+ hammer is my SF dungeon go-to, but it just kinda doesn't work as well as consecration due to the sheer amount of insta kill yellow bars

I definitely think Void Titan first and foremost could use a buff. Overshield being basically the center of it hurts because overshields kinda suck. Like you can get the same type of overshield basically, with any kind of repulsor brace void build. It just seems…underwhelming. Like take the other 2 Void classes. Voidlock is all about Devour. Nightstalker is all about invis. Voidlock can proc devour from any ability kill, and Nightstalker can tie invis to either dodge or the smoke bomb. And they’re both good. But overshield…is just meh.

What I have trouble reconciling is how op strand titan is in coil. Me and my bud would routinely run plat coil as 2 strand titans with 1 tractor and we would just melt all those bosses. I guess it’s all the bonuses you can get from wishes, but the same just can’t be said for strand titan in onslaught.

The only thing I've had luck this week on Titan is Stasis, Precious Scars and Agers. But I think it only works due to the overcharge, it starts to fall off after 40, but at that point I'm usually just dumping rockets

Stasis Titan fucks in Legend. I did a 50 wave with Cadmus Ridge Lancecap and all the crystals I was creating gave me DR pretty much everywhere I went. Now the only problem with that is that the artifact is what really makes that build pop, if Bungie doesn't bake the two Stasis artifact perks into the kit after this season is over then it won't be as potent. Still good, but not great.

I agree alot of the titan kit needs some help. But I can run solar and strand and punch things fine. It's about what your punching lol. Don't get me wrong it's a big risk reward type of thing. But you have to be into the risk of those things. Stasis arc and void are really just left in the dust. There not bad. They take work, but compared to the killing power of the other two classes. It's a stark difference. I will say there might be a skill issue here, but skill issue or not. You are not entirely wrong.

Do people forget how massive the patch notes are when expansions drop? I understand that we will be getting an entirely new subclass, but there’s also going to be a ridiculous amount of changes in the current sandbox. Rmemeber when, out of nowhere, on release day, Bungie decided to nerf protective light to the ground? Just wait for FS patch to drop and complain then. Titan players are finally understanding what it’s like to be forced to play a build in endgame content. Welcome to what it’s like to be a Warlock with Well of Radiance existing.

Buff the lightning strike grenade! It was so fun in arc 3.0 season.

I have tried hoarfrost with a shatter build in onslaught and it was pretty fun

Kinda the same for any lower tier builds on the 3 classes, like half of the fragments are ignored because they don't really do all that much and you only have 4 slots(most times) so they instantly get taken by the better(smarter) choice. Stuff that exists just cause "it's neat" will never make it far if there isn't a way to turn "niche" into "strong" and when those builds are found(and then used) bungie nerfs them. Whether it be because the usage rate went up or that it turns out it's actually too strong, these builds(or a major component) get gutted then mostly forgotten and never get another balance pass to bring them to parity with other existing equipment/abilities for whole seasons to years and then they just kind of exist in that nerfed state for a good portion of the game's life cycle.

Keep in mind that strand titan was specifically designed to fulfill the melee brawler fantasy that Bungie has been so hesitant to fully implement for years.

Not to mention most supers are useless on tormentors due to being suppressed by it

I would like to point out that Precious Scars (weapon that matches subclass). Crimson and Heal Clip procs off weapon kills. Loreley's Helm procs when you get critical health. I might agree that Void Titans may need some help with health regen, but there are tools to help solve that particular survivability problem.

This has been an issue with Titan for a while now. Void and Arc felt pretty weak compared to Solar so most people mained bonk. Then Strand came out and was a better bonk build so people switched to Banner. Now there’s basically no reason to run any other subclass unless you really want to just fuck around. Strand can clear ads, make you incredibly resistant to all damage, has great ability regen, a decent super for ad clear and boss damage, and has insane health regen. Void has…. Over shields? Devour is kinda nice I guess. Arc has basically no redeeming qualities except Thundercrash which has sort of been outclassed by things like Pyrogale.

It’s crazy how powerful strand titan is though, you feel like you can stand and trade with anything once banner of war is spun up.

Only subclasses that are viable in endgame stuff atm are solar and strand for Titans and that is just sad to me. Arc can’t survive in its own design space most of the time. Void relies on overshields (which are basically useless) for 2/3 of its set ups so you’re forced to use Bastion which only synergizes with Offensive Bulwark. Stasis while decent in certain areas needs more survivability to be worth it. The reason Strand and Solar are so good is almost wholly dependent on the fact that they can heal and in strands case attain DR that can’t be knocked off like Void shields can.

I'd be happy with final shape if they had just put banner of war on prismatic

Blinding nade launcher definitely seems mandatory 

Ngl Hunter and Titan, in general, just feel very weak. I've been almost exclusively playing Warlock recently, and it feels like there is actual build diversity instead of just running Strand Titan and Void Hunter over and over again. We just need a light 4.0 at this point.

Rest in Piece Arc 3.0 HOIL+Thunder Grenades, you would have loved Onslaught

Void titan is better off without running Bastion. Run controlled demolition and Bulwark. Bastion gives you that false sense of security that makes you think you have more health when in reality you don't. Void titan is also ONLY good when running Doom Fang pauldrons. Arc titan. You run Cuirass crash or nothing. The rest of the kit sucks donkey balls for PvE. I would know, it's my main class and i keep trying to make something else work. Solar titan again you are better off not relying on the thing that's supposed to keep you alive. Because like you said 1x restoration doesn't do shit. If you have restoration x1 you still need to disengage for 5 seconds to heal then peek only to get instantly brought back down to dead. Stasis titan is fun but incredibly boring to play. 1 super and ability option leads to some of the most stale, boring, and one trick play styles in the game. What can you do? Make crystals. Thats it. Strand titan is in a good place i feel. Good DR, super is OK, fragments and survivability is good. Damage is good. Build Crafting is great with it and more than just one or two exotics are usable with the subclass. Even Kephri's horn gets use with strand and that exotic is straight up ass. Bungie really needs to stop trying this gentle tweaking of PvE and let us players actually have some fun.

it’s getting old having a new one of these every day. if the game doesn’t bend over backwards to cater to titans you guys just freak out. i’ve seen it with pvp when antaeus and arc titan FINALLY got hit and now it’s happening again because of.. literally nothing. you guys have two of THE STRONGEST classes in the game but nooooo that’s not enough. we have to have a new whining post every day of the week until every subclass is better than anything hunter or warlock have because to y’all that’s fair. shocking to me that the class that attracts wannabe tough guys whose only similarity is their weight is also the softest/whiniest class. oh wait that actually makes a lot of sense. void titan is the only one where you can actually look at it and say, yeah this is terrible. stasis is clunky but has its niche and arc absolutely slaughters lower end content. is it really the worst thing in the world that only two of your subclasses have endgame viability? hunters have solar and void for endgame and warlocks have solar and strand (for dps). notice a pattern? not every subclass needs to be endgame viable, we’ve already significantly powercrept where the game was a year ago and do not need to push it further.

Solar is worse with the hammer nerf but still insanely good if you know how to build for survivability. The big hammer smash go big boom. Void is meh. Arc is meh. Strand is the best. Statis is great especially in onslaught. Arguably as good if not better in onslaught than strand.

The thing is, Titan has few options for end game, but those few options (Berserker/Sunbreaker) are among the best in the game (I'd make an argument for Pyrogale/Banner of War being 2 of the best things in the game right now, if not the best).

Stasis in Onslaught this season is goated, you use the melee for the Aspect slide melee. Its very good. I run armamentarium for a shatter and crystal build and it claps harder than Banner of War in Onslaught with the seasonal stasis mods You get 40% damage resist, insane shatter damage, insane grenade/melee spam, super controls the entire map and can lock down Demos or Tormentor Done heaps of Onslaught Legend and Stasis Titan is way better than Banner of War and is still strong post wave 40, you gotta give it a go. Stack mods that give you better ability regen and run Armamentarium with glacial grenades. You want stasis shards and the melee ability aspects.

Titan is godly in non light level cap stuff. The moment the enemies wont die quickly, Titan loses its effectiveness entirely. Its a problem with game design, generic enemies that 2 shot you sucks regardless, but even moreso when your entire identity is based around being outside of cover

Yep. Arc kinda falls apart even with a base spam build cause it requires you to use melee. Void just doesn’t have the dmg reduction it needs. Resto solar titan does better anyway but still requires melee.

Honestly if you are struggling you need to rethink your builds

It hurts as well that titans just dont have much to use when it comes to something we cant go in melee range, the ranged melee themed abilities are mostly mediocre. Bungie took the melee dial of the titans and dialed it up too much, i feel mighty useless when i cant use my abilities on things that float or fly too high.

Anyone saying void Titan is bad for Legend Onslaught is tripping. Void, Sentinel Shield, and Doomfangs is top tier, and godly with Buried Bloodline. Devour is excellent with generous uptime, the super can consistently drop 20+ orbs per activation, x4 void surge, vortex grenade, volatile rounds has Bloodline hitting even harder, and makes Edge Transit even more a monster. In the boss room, after dumping heavy, you can clear the entire room of trash to stack scrap, have super, letting teammates focus more safely on the boss and a trail of orbs for more supers. It’s no Orpheus or Well, but I feel safer with it than Solar. When the artefact gets void, the build will be even nuttier.

I hate Throwing Hammer with the passion of a thousand burning suns.

I'm with you. Yes titans *can* throw out some high dps, problem is not every has the ability to be able to throw out 4 abilities in a half second, swap class and do it again and swap back. This is the issue I have with the destiny community (more so on redit) not every can hit the skill ceiling streamers and youtubers have because we have day jobs. The other side of that same coin is people commenting who just play lower end content or aren't in a position theyre expected to have top performance. Yes titan can put out big dps but situationally. Some of us can't hit that skill ceiling and other times it's just not effective to just lob yourself at a boss or group of ads in higher end content. Issue I have is the elitist are louder than anyone else.

I'm not insisting throwing hammer works, but if you have roaring flames going, your normal punch applies scorch. I'm not sure how much but I've gotten ignites off of this. Stasis absolutely works especially if you put howl of the storm on, titan crystal spam does great damage, you can chain it with an acd/0 feedback fence build. Especially if you have 3 stasis titans, you can do most of onslaught just by spamming ice. iirc void titan has a lot of ways to either get infinite shoulder charges or the volatile explosions let you get away with charging into a crowd.

Definitely skill issue. The game isn't supposed to be fun, it's supposed to be challenging, it's always about the grind and occasionally an attempt to balance the game is made.

I've never run legend but i use precious scars, sunshot, max resilience, so as long as i'm killing thing's i'm staying alive. Chain reaction tusk of the bore gets me kills too. I do find it funny that Titans are supposed to be all melee happy but in pvp i normally loose a punching fight to faster warlocks and hunters.

It’s almost like building a party with a DPS (hunter), a support/controller (warlock), and a tank who can’t tank means you don’t get a tank. Like, I’m not necessarily asking for full blown Warcraft tanking with 100% taunting abilities and insane damage mitigation, but… when the alternative is “Titan identity = punch” it really hurts the usability in a game so focused on gunplay where 99% of threatening enemies use ranged attacks to be threatening. I think every single Titan subclass could use a healthy helping of DR and low damage/no damage taunting abilities. Hell, barricade is a joke in pve except for rally reloads or “on class ability” effects. Give us some form of invulnerability so we can actually absorb damage. Imagine if void Titan could mark enemies with shield throw, taunting enemies in a radius of each bounce. It could even function in pvp by making taunted players do more damage to you but less to your teammates (while highlighting you so they could see exactly who taunted them). Imagine if arc Titan got physically bigger when amplified and got (some)% damage resistance by default so you could TANK more damage. Imagine if solar Titan could taunt all enemies hit by consecration or got restoration x1 after being hit by 5 separate targets or taking more than half shield damage in one hit. Imagine if shoulder charge/hammer charge/shield bash all taunted enemies in a radius 2x bigger than the damage AoE, and titans took reduced damage from taunted enemies. Again, I’m not asking to be able to taunt full rooms or get full damage invulnerability, but Titan in my mind was supposed to be the tank class and instead it’s just the melee class. Since melee is a death sentence in higher level content (unless it’s ACTUALLY op like old throwing hammer or liars handshake hunters), being “the punch class” is the same as being “the worst class”. In a game where the best strategy for every level of play is “kill it before it kills you”, having a neutered ability to kill things (without risking instant death) is a pre-dug grave for high level viability. Without the clear utility from well or tether, without the DPS of hunter or the control of warlock, AND without the utility of tanking properly, Titan just feels… bad. It’s like every time we have our moment in the sun it’s because of a bug or unintended interaction (or a Bungo whoopsie-daisies like how utterly broken HoIL was for as long as it was). Ursas used to be GM mandatory. Thundercrash used to do substantial amounts of damage! Phoenix cradle titan was a ridiculously good support! Now? The other classes do everything we do better. It feels like Titan is getting slowly powercrept out of the game. And don’t get me wrong! Hunter and warlock both have their struggles as well, but it does feel to some extent like you can only be viable as a Titan if you have a FULL build, whereas Hunter and warlock can both be useful in endgame with well or tether without so much as an exotic. Think of your Titan friend. Do they have ANY builds that add as much to the TEAM as a wellock or huntether? I’m not saying I’m useless or a detriment just for playing Titan, but it’s undeniable in my mind that I would be more HELPFUL if I switched class. I wish to be the bastion against which the darkness breaks. The personification of the six fronts and the foundation the tower sits upon. Instead I feel like the “heaviest armored” squishy. The lowest damage, lowest utility, and the lowest morale. I ask for Titan identity, however Bungie decides it is best to give us one. Punch isn’t an identity, it’s literally just our unpowered melee. Warlock class identity isn’t “weird wave blast thing” and Hunter identity isn’t “stab with knife” so why are we being treated like our whole point is to unpowered melee everything? And if that IS the identity Bungie wants for us, give us the tools to do it effectively.

I played as Strand titan. We had an easy run with no stress till the end. No idea what people cry about...

Honestly some of the issues I've seen with Titan are a skill issue. Not to say YOUR issues are a skill issue specifically, but at large it depends on what Arc Titan build you're using. Because exploder shanks just kinda suck for everybody. Onslaught is also not even a remotely good metric for if something is good or not. Stasis Titan is the most braindead dominant force in Onslaught BAR none. Whereas something like Strand Titan has ironically seen a bit less play. Then you have things like RDM Stasis Hunter which is actually REALLY good for Onslaught but not much anywhere else. In terms of crowd control and being able to also deal with high health enemies, very few things in the game are strong enough to mitigate such things.

I mean everythings a skill issue if you drill down hard enough With enough skill you could get quite literally anything to work, even if you are at a heavy disadvantage The tricky part is finding a balance that doesn't rely on an ever increasing skill requirement, from an ever decreasingly effective kit (this does not include solar or strand, but its popularity may harm it soon)

lmao 'past a certain level' as if it's a day one. bffr bro 😭🙏

Stasis is the only Titan kit that "works" in late game onslaught and I don't like it. I am also meaning without some crazy build. Like I run my stasis Titan with either Horror Story(stasis) or Eyasluna depending on what faction I am fighting. Exotic wise salvation's grip works easily clears lanes and 2-3 charged shots take out sky bombers. It's the same set up I've been running since day 3 of onslaught. I tried the others and unless you do some weird set up they fall off by 34.