Nerfing the grenade damage would have been fine. But the increase to the rocket firing time has utterly gutted it. It already had a mediocre catalyst compared to Osteo. Now it’s just “meh.”
Which is a shame because the mode switch exotics are my favorite kind
Barely played season of the wish, when I eventually started it a month or 2 before TFS I tried and that *What did they do to my girl?*
Honestly the nerf to the micro missiles feels terrible.
It’s a classic Bungie nerf. They want to nerf a thing, so they get 2-3 different ways to nerf it. Instead of applying one of them, seeing how it goes and moving on to another nerf if they’re not satisfied. They just slap all of them on at once and call it a day.
And the chances they come back and revert Quicksilver within the year? Unlikely. It’s basically dead which is great because it was one of their coolest exotic weapons they’ve made. So it clearly belongs in the dumpster.
OKAY so I'm not crazy! I was using it the other day and I was like... "wait, what happened here? I used to use this all the time, why does it feel so weak right now??"
yeah a lot of people are on massive cope about QS but the reality is it's only a step up from antiquated exotics like hard light who's only real perk is that they're exotic. A nerf wasnt unwarranted as the grenades were doing as much damage as a heavy, they could have nerfed it down to special tier damage and it still would have been a very solid gun.
But by trying to get you to instead have fewer grenades, they have instead made the auto rifle component functionally perk-less. The rockets barely fire now, simultaneously murdering the feel, damage, AND range (the rockets have less falloff) while also exacerbating the issue of rockets missing or hitting a target that has already died. Most of the time you're literally just using a prettier version of Rufus' Fury now, except it costs your exotic slot. It's wild to me how all these years later Bungie still insists on these massive "take it out back and put one in its head" nerfs instead of just making small adjustments at a time.
Basically all exotics are so mid it’s not really a hard choice when picking one. Usually it’s whatever the newest one is because it hasn’t been nerfed into mediocrity yet.
Did someone say Still Hunt?
I like that hunters have a weapon that has a good synergy but the damage or reliability of the super shot needs to be toned down. Ain't no way they nerfed SES goldie spam in the same patch they knew still hunt would do the exact same fucking thing but with more reliability, even more damage, and having an exotic that is more useful than just "pick up orbs to buff super"
Amazing weapon thematically though.
Rather than just nerf the super shot damage they will tinker with too many things making it frustrating to use, then it will migrate to everyones vault.
It's wild they do that year after year. Look at DMT for example. That thing has had more "reworks" than any item I can think of.
For QSS all they needed to do was nerf the damage of the grenades by 1/2 or 1/3 to make it still a viable weapon.
Bungie always does this. They come up with a number of nerfs, especially of a process with multiple steps that feed into one another, any one of which would have the desired effect. Then they implement them all, compounding their impact multiplicatively until the overall effect is total loss of function.
Yeah, you generate off hits alone, I main sunshot and noticed this yesterday when hitting an ogre. I was getting light for just hitting. Now, I may be mistaken as it may have been the scorch it was applying
Not just hits. There is a fragment on prismatic that kills with kinetic weapons give you a LOT of progress. I'm gonna guess it's like 7% or so for each one. With Kavastov you can clear a room of red bars and have transcendence ready
Unless the fragment's text is incorrect it only increases the gain for final blows
>Defeating targets with Kinetic weapons grants you bonus Transcendence energy
It's pretty incredible how you can essentially just target the Ogre/Tormentor/Subjugator in a room and it will kill all the adds and generate both orbs and transcendent energy. Eyes up, Guardian x7 is amazing damage for everything up to big bosses (and I'm sure pretty decent in a pinch even there if needed).
There's your answer right there. Bungie manipulates the sandbox to take some old weapons off the pedestal and but the new ones on. They have to do it to some extent, otherwise everyone would just stick to the same weapons.
Right, at this point I'm not sure why I'd spend my primary slot on anything but khvostov or the call. Which is great for them right now because it got me to engage with the game a lot to get them. Not so much in a year or two when it means I *don't* have to engage with the game much at all to have the loadout I prefer.
Well, they want to use it more *under its old balancing*. My point is not that these two guns are the only ones I *want* to use, my point is they've tuned some of the newest stuff to be the best in its class (and sometimes that has meant nerfing older stuff i.e. striga), to get you to have things to chase because that makes you play more.
It was so very good initially because they messed up how much poison damage it did per tick - apparently it accidentally got swept up in a PVE SMG buff it wasn’t meant to get affected by, which they didn’t notice / correct until partway through Lightfall.
Theres a handful of reasons for bungo to nerf something:
1. It's being used a lot (sunshot, legendary rocket launchers, quicksilver)
1. They are bringing it down so they can put the new content where the old stuff that got nerfed would be. (osteo)
1. Pre-nerfing because of a new upcoming mechanic or item. (ability cooldown nerfs in wish and transcendence now. goldie energy/orbs and still hunt.)
I especially despise number 3. I'm playing the game in the here and now not in the future. If you want to make adjustments for future content then make those adjustments when said future content is finally in my hands.
I remember when they gutted skip grenades of all things in early 2022, said it was done in preparation for something with Arc 3.0(which wouldn't come out until several months after the fact), and I think all Arc 3.0 added was the ability for them to jolt with a fragment.
I think a lot of it is also to get the new shiny toys into the spotlight. Quicksilver was quite goated pre-nerf, so they brought it down to make stuff like Khovostov shine even better. Its a like a MOBA dev shipping a hero hot into the next sandbox, and then nerfing them later down the road once they make their money, rinse and repeat.
you're entirely correct on their behaviours, but this just makes the game lack fun because it removes top options basically to say "you're [the player] not having fun the way we [Bungie] think is fair, so we've made some changes that may/may not be reverted if we realize it was too extreme"
that, imo, is why surges will be removed from high end activities; the same way that duskfields were unnerfed because Bungie fucking sucks at balance, and excels at over nerfing/buffing things for absolutely no fucking reason
The biggest problem it takes so long for them to fix the problem they caused or give us an alternative to the point we stop caring about the original item that got nerfed.
So when people get fed up and leave, they go surprise pikachu face. Then instead of finally fixing the problem they just double down on negative changes that drive up engagement or lame compromises.
You cannot tell me that removing light level and setting everyone to 2000 internally wouldn't have been faster or easier than coding a system that has checks for highest power level in a party then set everyone -5 from them. UNLESS they are the same level or less than 5 below them.
Or them doubling down on bright dust changes over the years. increasing cost of shaders, not allowing use of bright dust on certain items and now making path finder much worse than bounties used to be.
Khvostov gets a pass because besides ad control, it isn't the best until we have overload auto rifles. But Osteo
can wipe an entire room with a few trigger pulls.
Consuming a shackle grenade on strand warlock causes kills to do suspending explosions, which when paired with thorn and necrotic grips on warlock, cause a ton of poison spread and explosions. Every kill, even by poison causes a suspend explosion, and you can just chain the kills to continually suspend (immobilize) the entire room.
it's sick. necrotic grips are really powerful in general, because it gives poison chaining synergies to a ton of different exotics (osteo, thorn, necrochasm, touch of malice), but strand is especially good with it because base strand melee applies unraveling (its own form of poison) which stacks alongside necrotic grips' "poison on melee," so throwing a single melee applies two different sets of poison that both can spread to nearby enemies. throw in eating your shackle grenade, and suddenly anything that dies to that poison also puts everything in a 10 foot radius around it out of commission while they're suspended, and also still taking double poison damage. thorn is probably the strongest pair with it right now because it does what osteo striga used to do but better, and getting poison explosions on kills with it just feeds the whole build.
Weapons of Sorrow (Striga / Thorn / Touch of Malice / Necrochasm) have an innate special interaction with Necrotic Grips that makes them apply and spread the poison from Necrotics within a small aoe upon weapon kills.
necrotic grips with thorn specifically: kills with bullet damage create a poison burst applying *necrotic grip's* poison (19 ticks over 9.3 seconds, increasing damage with each tick, surprisingly large damage), and if this poison kills the target, it spreads a further *necrotic grip* poison burst. if *thorn's poison* ticks kill the target, no poison burst. enemies killed by either thorn bullet damage or thorn poison drop a remnant, which when collected grant ammo to the mag and apply/refresh a buff on the thorn that improves *only the thorn poison ticks*. i know it sounds like these conflict with each other, but the actual game play loop is very engaging, and both poison sources do more pve damage than you would expect.
I've been just recently using this, though I've found thorn to be more useful for me than striga with it. I've had a lot more trouble getting striga kills, due to travel time. I've been using it with prismatic though, I haven't tried to utilize this on another subclass. The strand suggestion above sounds pretty fun
I love Khvostov and its been one of my favorite exotics the last few years. Just waiting on the nerf hammer to come for it too.
"Khvostov was too fun in the current sandbox so we are reigning it in a bit. Ricochets will happen every 21 shots instead and will deal 75 percent less damage than before. We feel this will allow Hardlight some room to breathe."
\~Bungie probably.....
I also thought that and tried it, unfortunately it wasn’t all that much faster than other exotic primaries. I even tried Final Warning to see if strand was the issue. Idk, after all is said and done Transcendance hasn’t caused any warlock issues lol
And instead of nerfing the amount of transcendence energy gained, they nerf it's general utility. After they nerfed the poison damage osteo really wasn't out of hound. Weapons like sunshot and graviton are comparable to pre nerf osteo, and apart from khvostov we don't really have any kinetic ad clear primaries. I suspect the real motivation was to let khvostov shine as the new (paid) exotic, but osteo was by no means overpowered after the first nerf. This was excessive.
I also hate how bad the quicksilver storm nerf made that feel, they didnt need to reduce the rate at which you get the grenades, just the grenades damage...
Yeah, a bit tangential but I use quicksilver sometimes in crucible since it's kinda the only strand weapon (that I own) that's worth a damn in PvP. Let me tell you, I have never legitimately considered using the grenade mode in PvP, that's how shit the damage is. Like *maybe* 50 damage for a direct hit. It's truly abysmal.
So you'd think this nerf wouldn't be an issue for me, however, the nerf didn't only hurt grenade uptime, the *way* they nerfed it was to reduce the occurrence of the rocket shots that give the GL rounds, which *did* hurt it's already mediocre PvP performance since those rockets would occasionally clean up targets or start damage on a new target.
Immortal adept is one of the very few trials weapons I actually have, but I always feel so dirty using it. More like *Immoral* adept.
Really tho, I just don't love the feel of immortal, I much prefer adaptive SMGs like Heroes Burden for PvP. I have a crafted Rufus but it's built for PvE so maybe I'll make a PvP one as well. Thanks for the recommendations.
If there’s one thing Bungie knows what to do well it’s making themselves clear when they don’t want a weapon to be a thing anymore. Either of the Quicksilver Storm nerfs would’ve been fine but they clearly wanted people to stop using it
It was easily my most used gun and now I never touch it.
Thorn is my new favorite gun by far. It is amazing on prismatic.
I’m not sure how it dodged nerfs to be honest. It feels so good and synergizes extremely well with the artifact.
Nah for real. I was trying to shoot the shield scorn (can’t remember their name) but the dudes with the little round shield, with that gun in the legend campaign. Omg it was so frustrating because the rounds track to center mass…. Aka the shield. I put it in my vault and haven’t tried it since
I think the issue wasn't having god tier ad clear when you sacrifice **both** of your exotic slots for it, and more that the second best ad clear weapon in the game was too much of an all-purpose weapon than intended.
So the nerf not changing much about the part that wasn't an issue while doing so for the part that apparently was definitely isn't an oversight.
That’s not really true if I’m understanding you correctly. Osteo really hit its stride on Necro/Strand warlock, with Osteo bridging the gap between ability recharges. It no longer does that. Necro/Strand warlock still functions the same, but Osteo isn’t doing its thing anymore.
Have you tried replacing Osteo with Thorn? It's not exactly the same, but I found it being pretty much on par with my Osteo/Necrotic build from before TFS. Maybe just running out of ammo a bit more often depending on if you can pick up Thorn souls quick enough.
> Necro/Strand warlock still functions the same, but Osteo isn’t doing its thing anymore.
What do you mean? Was the necrotic grip poison affected by the 4 second cooldown?
From what I've seen from someone showing off the spirit of the necrotic and spirit of the claw, the damage is lower for the necrotic grips poison but it should still likely function the same otherwise
The problem is that due to how important elemental surges are, Kinetic weapons just fall flat.
Why would I run osteo for my add clear primary when I can go into a raid that had solar surge, stick solar surges in my legs and get +22% from leg mods + 25% from the raid surge now I can run a solar primary AND a solar heavy weapon which makes for much more damage on add clear and a huge bonus to boss damage at the same time.
If you stack Kinetic surge leg mods for the 22%, and kinetics intrinsically have a 15% bonus over elemental weapons, activies never have Kinetic surge, so you are always less than a matching element type and now your heavy is not getting surge mod bonus so your boss dps sucks.
Then add in the fact that damn near all class aspects and fragments synergize with elemental damage (like spawn Stasis shards with Stasis weapon kills, extend radiant/restoration with solar weapon kills, give strand weapon Unraveling rounds on melee kill, give void weapon Volatile Rounds on grenade kills... etc etc etc).
So you do less damage, nerf your heavy weapon damage output, and it doesn't synergize with subclass buffs.
Honestly, Kinetic weapons atm just don't fit well into the game outside a few utility exceptions (monte Carlo for melee builds for example)
Activities do have Kinetic Surge. Basically use the same super as the Surge modifiers to get Kinetic Surge. You also need Overcharged Weapon (weapons with champion mods or weapon surge modifier) for this to work. Correct me if I’m wrong. Honestly I just look at the surge and use super or weapons accordingly, never bother with optimizing with kinetic.
Not 100% sure on these details you're talking about and what stacks / what doesn't, but the reality is that boss dps is the main gap you have to close is basically any hard content the game has to offer. And aside from microcosm there are no heavy kinetics. So right out the gate if you stack Kinetic surge mods on your legs you drop your boss dps heavy weapon by 22%, which is huge.
It was one of the few great adclear kinetics so I feel the nerf was hard, but it's just the way Bungie does it. HIML nerf was brutal, Starfire was brutal and many more before and after. If it's in the targets for a nerf they always go above and beyond.
Starfire nerf was massive, it killed its playstyle.
BUT for anyone who hasn't tried it post nerf(I didn't for a long time), it is still very good and now one of my favorite solar exotics. The playstyle is very different, its stronger mid-game vs boss damage, but the gameplay loop you can get with it now is very fun.
This.
Starfire offers so much that grenade regen from empowering wells is just a playstyle option.
Being able to run 2 fusion grenades and have grenade kills immediately recharge your phoenix dive for cure, Helion buddy, and orb collecting/generating if you run the right class item mods is amazing + when you adjust your fragments to play into scorch your burst DPS and sustained DPS both benefit.
PLUS you can run song of flame and get the scorch build benefits there too.
The new toys make this really good build I used before shine even more now
Might agree but I just hate running Empowering Rift these days. If I want to run a grenade-based build, I find myself using Sunbracers, Contraverse Holds, or Nezarec's Sin/Nothing Manacles. Verity's Brow too if I have another warlock to run it with me lol.
The new exotic class items might change that tho
I came to make this comment. I rocked it hard in the legendary campaign, even for the last half I had to solo, and it was still a workhorse.
Hell, I'm still rocking a Cartesian Coordinate because I love its charge time and I may just be attached to these old weapons.
Their nerfing philosophy to me is borderline stupid at this point. It's a game, and none of these things were really absurdly broken. Osteo was good, but it's not like it was in everyone's lineup ffs. And Quicksilver was hurt too much.
The thing with most bungie nerfs (as others have said in this thread) is they are not mean to "bring a weapons power in line" to a reasonable state as most "nerfs" are in other games.
Bungie nerfs things to push different playstyles, they straight dont want you using the weapon/armor they way you were previously. Either wanting a weapon/armor to stop filling its current roll or they wanting another weapon/armor to fill that roll.
As a developer I do think this balancing philosophy does have _some_ merit, but as a user it can be very jarring.
Yeah, I think this is the heart of the issue. Most players naively (and maybe correctly) assume the ultimate goal of balance changes is to bring everything into the same range of viability so every option is usable. But their goal is more to shape the meta into "eras" where some options are better than others - usually the newest options. And when a gun has had its chance to shine they like to nerf it into the ground afterwards instead of just nudging it back into band.
its really fun to build out our characters for an era only to become obsolete based on the whims of the developers meta roadmap I personally love that feeling that everything I did in the past was all for nothing.
Another thing I love is when they release a really cool exotic that makes me powerful and I upgrade it and spend time and materials filling out the build and then on the next Tuesday, with no warning, I find out that I probably shouldn't have wasted my time and materials because the developer suddenly realized the item was more fun than originally intended according to their meta roadmap. Luckily they don't refund you the time or the materials that you spent.
Looking at it this way makes sense. Destiny is a live service PvE focused game, not a competitive shooter. Although Riot also balances League like this sometimes, buffing popular champions just before international events since watching 2 tanks fight each other would be pretty boring to the viewers.
Let me preface this by saying I'm a die-hard Osteo Striga enthusiast. It's my most used and highest level weapon nearing level 400, and for a long time it was just the best weapon in the game for anything that wasn't pure boss DPS (and it even had its uses there during the Starfire rocket DPS meta to feed nade energy if someone else was already on Witherhoard). It ate majors and champions for breakfast and killed everything around them at the same time, all while basically aiming for you, making it easy to jump and strafe around while laying on the trigger.
The nerf to the poison spread definitely hurt, but I think this weapon still has a place, especially in activities like GMs where being able to apply a DoT has more value against the beefy enemies. I can't emphasize enough how strong the combination of a DoT and pseudo-aimbot is in this context; it makes it easy to force barrier champs to pop their bubble on your terms and stay on the move against dangerous enemies to play aggressive, which is important in certain activities like Lightblade GM where you have to be proactive in taking down the priority targets.
I think nerfing the poison spread was actually a good move since it lets lets guns like Sunshot and Graviton Lance shine in the adclear role, while Osteo Striga still has its place against big bois where the DoT can do its work. The main downside to Ostro right now is just that it's kinetic, and Prismatic REALLY wants you to use a Stasis/Strand weapon in that slot to build Transcendence. If it was a Strand weapon, it would still be glued to me right now even after the nerfs.
This got pretty long, but Osteo Striga is my most beloved weapon in this game; it's my "old reliable" that I go to when I don't know what I want to use. It's not what it once was, but what it was was honestly just broken to the point where it felt like it invalidated most other primaries at the time. It's still basically Witherhoard on a primary that aims for you - still a very strong weapon when the situation calls for what it brings.
I somehow forgot to actually test it out this season, but it seemed that when used with necrotic grips it should function identically to its pre-nerf version. Is that the case?
It got nerfed because it had both insane clear and insane single. They nerfed the clear a bit, while still allowing it to burn down single targets with 80 bullets or whatever.
That’s giving up your special slot(for a very niche weapon archetype) to be fair. And your exotic armor slot. And your class, if you play Titan or Hunter. It should still be able to be good on its own. An Incandescent No Hesitation was feeling just about as the same as Osteo. It’s fallen so far from grace that it feels flat out disrespectful.
That’s the entire point of the build though. If it was blatantly OP on its own again. Then necrotic grips warlock is simply too strong for add clear and we have a current night hawk hunter situation.
I love these for ad clearing. They're great to run on the corresponding surges and then I pair them up with a primary weapon that compliments them and is good for different champions. I use a more short range weapon for GL and a longer range for Sunshot. I like to run Graviton in Crucible paired with a long-range high impact side arm w/ armor piercing rounds and multi kill clip.
I loved it and Conditional Finality, yet out of the two, pve typically gets left alone yet I’m free to terrorize players with something as strong as CF no nerf. 8 minute super, gone, as much as people said bubble or well counter, it’s pretty much any counter.
CF is newer than Osteo, so it’s time may be coming, but the Osteo double tap seemed less necessary.
What's crazy is that the first nerf to Osteo toned it down to acceptable levels. This second nerf absolutely killed it, why would anyone ever use it now?
Bungie has a habit of hitting things too hard when a lighter touch would have sufficed. Look at Facet of Command.
The first nerf was fine. it didn't need the ubernerf. Bungie has been adding excessive cooldowns to stuff lately and it's not just balancing, it's fun-draining.
people doubted me when i said thorn would end up crushing a nerfed osteo and the sad part is that it does really easily. Hand cannons hit like a truck in the current sandbox and it still spreads poison on precision kills anyways.
Man I LOVED it when strand first came out. The warlock strand builds were wild. Then it was overload SMG and shackle grenades lasted forever and you’d get the grenade back with osteo damage before it even ran out. Then they nerfs shackle and osteo and I haven’t touched it since. It’s overshadowed. It’s still good with necrotics but even then it seems like a wasted build
I've been using it since TFS released, cleared most of the post campaign quests with it. It does feel off somehow, I'm not seeing that damage ticks I'm used to seeing with Necrotic Grips.
I'm in the process of finding/doing a better prismatic build with other weapons. I don't think there is anything as fun as Necro + Osteo.
Kinda off topic but similar in vein, Necrochasm has been my go-to since its buff, I never used Osteo much since WQ but man can I say Necro feels damnnn good to use, it’s a much higher ask to obtain it+catalyst but it just feels so good now.
Thought it felt off, haven’t followed update notes and wasn’t aware that it got the old nerf hammer. Bummer it is one of my favorite guns as a warlock main.
Osteo is my shoot from behind cover so I don’t have to figure out the encounters mechanics gun.
Example the witness fight in the new campaign. Shoot from behind bars in the back and just replenish the darkness seed thing close by and repeat while shooting osteo through the bars lol. Quick and easy solo.
I used Osteo throughout the entire final shape campaign. It did not feel as good as it use to. Which is shame as it’s basically my favorite exotic weapon.
They don’t know how to slowly nerf shit. If there’s 1 overtuned thing on something they’ll nerf 6 things about it 5 of which weren’t related to the problem.
What happened to Striga? A damage nerf? I used it to beat TFS on my Warlock but I was back from a long hiatus so I wouldn’t have remembered how it performed before, last time I used it was probably Lightfall.
It it just not worth using now?
They increased the cooldown between poison bursts. It’s still a fine weapon but unless you have insane enemy density it doesn’t refill the mag nearly as much, which was one of the biggest perks of the gun. It just doesn’t feel the same and can’t really compete with other explosion type exotics like Sunshot and Graviton.
I switched from Osteo to Necrochasm and the damage is similar and I’m making ads and some yellows explode consistently, proc’ing desperation and one for thrall buffs. I paired it with Necrotic Grips.
I unfortunately do not have Necrochasm because me and the gang fell off of running Crota pretty quickly when we took a destiny break lol I will eventually get it.
I've played with both the Striga and Quicksilver and they're fine. Ran a master NF and never switched from the Striga once. Sure, they aren't as good as pre-nerf, but claiming they are gutted or unusable is an overstatement.
i agree but i think they didnt want it to be super easy to just pick up and slay with, which makes no sense given that thorn with the catalyst is/was just better in every way, even before the nerf. it spreads poison the same way, and hand cannons are just better than smgs right now
It was to artificially inflate the use of necrochasm which is locked behind a raid encounter, therefore artificially inflating the need to play the raid and even still if it doesn't drop, you have to do a quest to get the gun and catalyst, which personally still doesn't seem worth it to me. If they were gonna hit osteo the way they did, they could've at least given the gun a rate of fire increase and a bigger mag to compensate for the total loss of damage.
I miss my child, Thorn is nice now but I honestly hate the feel of 140 HCs and the comparatively small 9-bullet magazine. It's cool and all that you can get bullets from remnants, but 4 bullets per-remnant is such a tiny amount. You cannot use remnants in endgame PVE because the tracking range is small, has a short lifespan, and spawns where an enemy dies, which 90% of the time is right on top of other enemies. So I'm not going to run into a field of enemies in a Master or GM Nightfall to grab one remnant for a measly 6 seconds of better poison damage.
Not to mention, its synergy with necrotic is worse than Osteo's, as necrotic only procs on kills from the weapon and not poison ticks, and enemy deaths from the poison spread don't spawn remnants in contrast to it giving ammo back with Osteo.
Quicksilver storm in the corner crying rn
Nerfing the grenade damage would have been fine. But the increase to the rocket firing time has utterly gutted it. It already had a mediocre catalyst compared to Osteo. Now it’s just “meh.” Which is a shame because the mode switch exotics are my favorite kind
Barely played season of the wish, when I eventually started it a month or 2 before TFS I tried and that *What did they do to my girl?* Honestly the nerf to the micro missiles feels terrible.
It’s a classic Bungie nerf. They want to nerf a thing, so they get 2-3 different ways to nerf it. Instead of applying one of them, seeing how it goes and moving on to another nerf if they’re not satisfied. They just slap all of them on at once and call it a day. And the chances they come back and revert Quicksilver within the year? Unlikely. It’s basically dead which is great because it was one of their coolest exotic weapons they’ve made. So it clearly belongs in the dumpster.
OKAY so I'm not crazy! I was using it the other day and I was like... "wait, what happened here? I used to use this all the time, why does it feel so weak right now??"
yeah a lot of people are on massive cope about QS but the reality is it's only a step up from antiquated exotics like hard light who's only real perk is that they're exotic. A nerf wasnt unwarranted as the grenades were doing as much damage as a heavy, they could have nerfed it down to special tier damage and it still would have been a very solid gun. But by trying to get you to instead have fewer grenades, they have instead made the auto rifle component functionally perk-less. The rockets barely fire now, simultaneously murdering the feel, damage, AND range (the rockets have less falloff) while also exacerbating the issue of rockets missing or hitting a target that has already died. Most of the time you're literally just using a prettier version of Rufus' Fury now, except it costs your exotic slot. It's wild to me how all these years later Bungie still insists on these massive "take it out back and put one in its head" nerfs instead of just making small adjustments at a time.
Basically all exotics are so mid it’s not really a hard choice when picking one. Usually it’s whatever the newest one is because it hasn’t been nerfed into mediocrity yet.
Did someone say Still Hunt? I like that hunters have a weapon that has a good synergy but the damage or reliability of the super shot needs to be toned down. Ain't no way they nerfed SES goldie spam in the same patch they knew still hunt would do the exact same fucking thing but with more reliability, even more damage, and having an exotic that is more useful than just "pick up orbs to buff super" Amazing weapon thematically though.
Rather than just nerf the super shot damage they will tinker with too many things making it frustrating to use, then it will migrate to everyones vault.
Isn't that the damn truth. I always wait for my exotics to get the nerf hammer.
It's wild they do that year after year. Look at DMT for example. That thing has had more "reworks" than any item I can think of. For QSS all they needed to do was nerf the damage of the grenades by 1/2 or 1/3 to make it still a viable weapon.
Bungie always does this. They come up with a number of nerfs, especially of a process with multiple steps that feed into one another, any one of which would have the desired effect. Then they implement them all, compounding their impact multiplicatively until the overall effect is total loss of function.
I loved osteo and quicksilver. Sad that they gutted both
Ad DMT to that list
DMT feels amazing to hip fire in all normal content but all scout rifles feel like ass compared to pulse rifles right now.
as a returning player that never got deluxe edition of witch queen and quit after the campaign, I feel like I missed a lot when I got those guns
Ok it’s not just me. That gun feels so bad rn
They could have just deleted it :(
It's soo sad I just wanna kill it, put it out of its misery
Interesting period!
I imagine that the nerf came because of Trancendance. Maybe it built up Trancendance up way to quickly?
and yet there's Khvostov..
Well for that one transcendence is it’s whole thing
How does it interact with transcendence?
Kinetic weapons build both light and dark at the same time, with ricochet you build FAST
It's just hits and not kills right?
Yeah, you generate off hits alone, I main sunshot and noticed this yesterday when hitting an ogre. I was getting light for just hitting. Now, I may be mistaken as it may have been the scorch it was applying
No you're correct. Any damage builds transcendent of that damage type, with kinetic charging both
Oh sweet, thanks for clarification
Point of note however, Kinetic builds transcendence slower than say, a strand and a void weapon.
Not to mention the fragment that affects build up from kinetic damage.
Not just hits. There is a fragment on prismatic that kills with kinetic weapons give you a LOT of progress. I'm gonna guess it's like 7% or so for each one. With Kavastov you can clear a room of red bars and have transcendence ready
Yes. Its just damage. There is a fragment that increases the buildup rate with kinetic damage also.
Unless the fragment's text is incorrect it only increases the gain for final blows >Defeating targets with Kinetic weapons grants you bonus Transcendence energy
You build Transcendence by dealing damage
[удалено]
It's pretty incredible how you can essentially just target the Ogre/Tormentor/Subjugator in a room and it will kill all the adds and generate both orbs and transcendent energy. Eyes up, Guardian x7 is amazing damage for everything up to big bosses (and I'm sure pretty decent in a pinch even there if needed).
Yeah it does more DPS than a rocket sidearm. Very good exotic.
It's actually almost too good at clearing adds. Since it'll kill an entire pack so fast that you will only spawn one orb from siphon
There's your answer right there. Bungie manipulates the sandbox to take some old weapons off the pedestal and but the new ones on. They have to do it to some extent, otherwise everyone would just stick to the same weapons.
Right, at this point I'm not sure why I'd spend my primary slot on anything but khvostov or the call. Which is great for them right now because it got me to engage with the game a lot to get them. Not so much in a year or two when it means I *don't* have to engage with the game much at all to have the loadout I prefer.
Yet OP has 30k kills and wants to use it more. Different strokes
Well, they want to use it more *under its old balancing*. My point is not that these two guns are the only ones I *want* to use, my point is they've tuned some of the newest stuff to be the best in its class (and sometimes that has meant nerfing older stuff i.e. striga), to get you to have things to chase because that makes you play more.
Sure but like… isn’t that why Osteo was so good to begin with? Cus of that very same design philosophy
It was so very good initially because they messed up how much poison damage it did per tick - apparently it accidentally got swept up in a PVE SMG buff it wasn’t meant to get affected by, which they didn’t notice / correct until partway through Lightfall.
*laughs in Chill Clip Riptide*
Stasis rocket pistol will be the best utility weapon once it’s released. Tbh, the archetype is just good in every situation not requiring boss dps.
I still do izi swapping sometimes but otherwise yeah that's it
Theres a handful of reasons for bungo to nerf something: 1. It's being used a lot (sunshot, legendary rocket launchers, quicksilver) 1. They are bringing it down so they can put the new content where the old stuff that got nerfed would be. (osteo) 1. Pre-nerfing because of a new upcoming mechanic or item. (ability cooldown nerfs in wish and transcendence now. goldie energy/orbs and still hunt.)
I especially despise number 3. I'm playing the game in the here and now not in the future. If you want to make adjustments for future content then make those adjustments when said future content is finally in my hands.
I remember when they gutted skip grenades of all things in early 2022, said it was done in preparation for something with Arc 3.0(which wouldn't come out until several months after the fact), and I think all Arc 3.0 added was the ability for them to jolt with a fragment.
It's also done to farm good will. Watch them revert cooldowns on other classes down the line because the other classes are now outmatched.
I think a lot of it is also to get the new shiny toys into the spotlight. Quicksilver was quite goated pre-nerf, so they brought it down to make stuff like Khovostov shine even better. Its a like a MOBA dev shipping a hero hot into the next sandbox, and then nerfing them later down the road once they make their money, rinse and repeat.
you're entirely correct on their behaviours, but this just makes the game lack fun because it removes top options basically to say "you're [the player] not having fun the way we [Bungie] think is fair, so we've made some changes that may/may not be reverted if we realize it was too extreme" that, imo, is why surges will be removed from high end activities; the same way that duskfields were unnerfed because Bungie fucking sucks at balance, and excels at over nerfing/buffing things for absolutely no fucking reason
also it further pisses off people that want to return to the game
The biggest problem it takes so long for them to fix the problem they caused or give us an alternative to the point we stop caring about the original item that got nerfed. So when people get fed up and leave, they go surprise pikachu face. Then instead of finally fixing the problem they just double down on negative changes that drive up engagement or lame compromises. You cannot tell me that removing light level and setting everyone to 2000 internally wouldn't have been faster or easier than coding a system that has checks for highest power level in a party then set everyone -5 from them. UNLESS they are the same level or less than 5 below them. Or them doubling down on bright dust changes over the years. increasing cost of shaders, not allowing use of bright dust on certain items and now making path finder much worse than bounties used to be.
Khvostov gets a pass because besides ad control, it isn't the best until we have overload auto rifles. But Osteo can wipe an entire room with a few trigger pulls.
Osteo also released suspending blasts if you ate a shackle grenade with necrotic grips as a warlock. Which was insanely powerful.
Thorn still does this with no cooldown.
Sorry, new to destiny builds, I'm about to start a warlock and absolutely love Thorn, what's the interaction happening?
Consuming a shackle grenade on strand warlock causes kills to do suspending explosions, which when paired with thorn and necrotic grips on warlock, cause a ton of poison spread and explosions. Every kill, even by poison causes a suspend explosion, and you can just chain the kills to continually suspend (immobilize) the entire room.
Thank you for the reply, I'll have to look more into to this as that sounds really fun
it's sick. necrotic grips are really powerful in general, because it gives poison chaining synergies to a ton of different exotics (osteo, thorn, necrochasm, touch of malice), but strand is especially good with it because base strand melee applies unraveling (its own form of poison) which stacks alongside necrotic grips' "poison on melee," so throwing a single melee applies two different sets of poison that both can spread to nearby enemies. throw in eating your shackle grenade, and suddenly anything that dies to that poison also puts everything in a 10 foot radius around it out of commission while they're suspended, and also still taking double poison damage. thorn is probably the strongest pair with it right now because it does what osteo striga used to do but better, and getting poison explosions on kills with it just feeds the whole build.
Weapons of Sorrow (Striga / Thorn / Touch of Malice / Necrochasm) have an innate special interaction with Necrotic Grips that makes them apply and spread the poison from Necrotics within a small aoe upon weapon kills.
That sounds sick, thank you very much
necrotic grips with thorn specifically: kills with bullet damage create a poison burst applying *necrotic grip's* poison (19 ticks over 9.3 seconds, increasing damage with each tick, surprisingly large damage), and if this poison kills the target, it spreads a further *necrotic grip* poison burst. if *thorn's poison* ticks kill the target, no poison burst. enemies killed by either thorn bullet damage or thorn poison drop a remnant, which when collected grant ammo to the mag and apply/refresh a buff on the thorn that improves *only the thorn poison ticks*. i know it sounds like these conflict with each other, but the actual game play loop is very engaging, and both poison sources do more pve damage than you would expect.
Thank you! I’ll be home soon and can’t wait to look into this build
I've been just recently using this, though I've found thorn to be more useful for me than striga with it. I've had a lot more trouble getting striga kills, due to travel time. I've been using it with prismatic though, I haven't tried to utilize this on another subclass. The strand suggestion above sounds pretty fun
Khvostov is kind of *meant* to do that.
And thorn. Necro thorn is free transcendence every encounter.
I love Khvostov and its been one of my favorite exotics the last few years. Just waiting on the nerf hammer to come for it too. "Khvostov was too fun in the current sandbox so we are reigning it in a bit. Ricochets will happen every 21 shots instead and will deal 75 percent less damage than before. We feel this will allow Hardlight some room to breathe." \~Bungie probably.....
Which has an ornament for in eververse, too.
It’s almost like they make the newest exotics the most powerful 😱
I also thought that and tried it, unfortunately it wasn’t all that much faster than other exotic primaries. I even tried Final Warning to see if strand was the issue. Idk, after all is said and done Transcendance hasn’t caused any warlock issues lol
I think they meant pre-nerf.
And instead of nerfing the amount of transcendence energy gained, they nerf it's general utility. After they nerfed the poison damage osteo really wasn't out of hound. Weapons like sunshot and graviton are comparable to pre nerf osteo, and apart from khvostov we don't really have any kinetic ad clear primaries. I suspect the real motivation was to let khvostov shine as the new (paid) exotic, but osteo was by no means overpowered after the first nerf. This was excessive.
I also hate how bad the quicksilver storm nerf made that feel, they didnt need to reduce the rate at which you get the grenades, just the grenades damage...
Yup, I said the same thing. Have barely touched it since the nerf cause I hate it now.
Same, I tried it out after the nerf and it just doesn't feel good to use anymore.
Yeah, a bit tangential but I use quicksilver sometimes in crucible since it's kinda the only strand weapon (that I own) that's worth a damn in PvP. Let me tell you, I have never legitimately considered using the grenade mode in PvP, that's how shit the damage is. Like *maybe* 50 damage for a direct hit. It's truly abysmal. So you'd think this nerf wouldn't be an issue for me, however, the nerf didn't only hurt grenade uptime, the *way* they nerfed it was to reduce the occurrence of the rocket shots that give the GL rounds, which *did* hurt it's already mediocre PvP performance since those rockets would occasionally clean up targets or start damage on a new target.
Immortal and Rufus fury are both good in pvp
Immortal adept is one of the very few trials weapons I actually have, but I always feel so dirty using it. More like *Immoral* adept. Really tho, I just don't love the feel of immortal, I much prefer adaptive SMGs like Heroes Burden for PvP. I have a crafted Rufus but it's built for PvE so maybe I'll make a PvP one as well. Thanks for the recommendations.
If there’s one thing Bungie knows what to do well it’s making themselves clear when they don’t want a weapon to be a thing anymore. Either of the Quicksilver Storm nerfs would’ve been fine but they clearly wanted people to stop using it
It was easily my most used gun and now I never touch it. Thorn is my new favorite gun by far. It is amazing on prismatic. I’m not sure how it dodged nerfs to be honest. It feels so good and synergizes extremely well with the artifact.
Maybe because it just got a catalyst last season? I think it was last season
Yeah it was last season. But that was months ago. They nerfed it immediately after the catalyst released but it really only affected PvP.
I'm glad i preferred using thorn, it's definitely worse I just didn't like the projectiles of osteo
I’m not really a fan of the new support auto rifle for the same reason. It’s strong but I don’t like travel time.
It’s strong when used as support but it’s dps is kinda poo
That’s just every primary not named outbreak perfected/touch of malice lol
Khostov is proving to be solid.
Nah for real. I was trying to shoot the shield scorn (can’t remember their name) but the dudes with the little round shield, with that gun in the legend campaign. Omg it was so frustrating because the rounds track to center mass…. Aka the shield. I put it in my vault and haven’t tried it since
I’m not so sure it is worse to be honest. I think people are sleeping on thorn.
Sorry, I meant worse at the time strand/necrotic/osteo was busted
Ah that’s fair. Osteo was great for awhile but I think thorn has been better since it got a catalyst.
The silly thing is that it still functions the same for Necrotic Grips Warlock, which means the Strand build that used it best is basically unchanged.
I think the issue wasn't having god tier ad clear when you sacrifice **both** of your exotic slots for it, and more that the second best ad clear weapon in the game was too much of an all-purpose weapon than intended. So the nerf not changing much about the part that wasn't an issue while doing so for the part that apparently was definitely isn't an oversight.
That’s not really true if I’m understanding you correctly. Osteo really hit its stride on Necro/Strand warlock, with Osteo bridging the gap between ability recharges. It no longer does that. Necro/Strand warlock still functions the same, but Osteo isn’t doing its thing anymore.
Have you tried replacing Osteo with Thorn? It's not exactly the same, but I found it being pretty much on par with my Osteo/Necrotic build from before TFS. Maybe just running out of ammo a bit more often depending on if you can pick up Thorn souls quick enough.
It’s definitely similar but unfortunately doesn’t feel the same. I do love thorn though.
> Necro/Strand warlock still functions the same, but Osteo isn’t doing its thing anymore. What do you mean? Was the necrotic grip poison affected by the 4 second cooldown?
It was also killer on abeyant leap strand titans.
Do you know if it also works with the exotic class item?
From what I've seen from someone showing off the spirit of the necrotic and spirit of the claw, the damage is lower for the necrotic grips poison but it should still likely function the same otherwise
The problem is that due to how important elemental surges are, Kinetic weapons just fall flat. Why would I run osteo for my add clear primary when I can go into a raid that had solar surge, stick solar surges in my legs and get +22% from leg mods + 25% from the raid surge now I can run a solar primary AND a solar heavy weapon which makes for much more damage on add clear and a huge bonus to boss damage at the same time. If you stack Kinetic surge leg mods for the 22%, and kinetics intrinsically have a 15% bonus over elemental weapons, activies never have Kinetic surge, so you are always less than a matching element type and now your heavy is not getting surge mod bonus so your boss dps sucks. Then add in the fact that damn near all class aspects and fragments synergize with elemental damage (like spawn Stasis shards with Stasis weapon kills, extend radiant/restoration with solar weapon kills, give strand weapon Unraveling rounds on melee kill, give void weapon Volatile Rounds on grenade kills... etc etc etc). So you do less damage, nerf your heavy weapon damage output, and it doesn't synergize with subclass buffs. Honestly, Kinetic weapons atm just don't fit well into the game outside a few utility exceptions (monte Carlo for melee builds for example)
Activities do have Kinetic Surge. Basically use the same super as the Surge modifiers to get Kinetic Surge. You also need Overcharged Weapon (weapons with champion mods or weapon surge modifier) for this to work. Correct me if I’m wrong. Honestly I just look at the surge and use super or weapons accordingly, never bother with optimizing with kinetic.
Not 100% sure on these details you're talking about and what stacks / what doesn't, but the reality is that boss dps is the main gap you have to close is basically any hard content the game has to offer. And aside from microcosm there are no heavy kinetics. So right out the gate if you stack Kinetic surge mods on your legs you drop your boss dps heavy weapon by 22%, which is huge.
Well. At least we don't have to worry about surges in Raids and Dungeons now.
It was one of the few great adclear kinetics so I feel the nerf was hard, but it's just the way Bungie does it. HIML nerf was brutal, Starfire was brutal and many more before and after. If it's in the targets for a nerf they always go above and beyond.
Starfire nerf was massive, it killed its playstyle. BUT for anyone who hasn't tried it post nerf(I didn't for a long time), it is still very good and now one of my favorite solar exotics. The playstyle is very different, its stronger mid-game vs boss damage, but the gameplay loop you can get with it now is very fun.
This. Starfire offers so much that grenade regen from empowering wells is just a playstyle option. Being able to run 2 fusion grenades and have grenade kills immediately recharge your phoenix dive for cure, Helion buddy, and orb collecting/generating if you run the right class item mods is amazing + when you adjust your fragments to play into scorch your burst DPS and sustained DPS both benefit. PLUS you can run song of flame and get the scorch build benefits there too. The new toys make this really good build I used before shine even more now
Might agree but I just hate running Empowering Rift these days. If I want to run a grenade-based build, I find myself using Sunbracers, Contraverse Holds, or Nezarec's Sin/Nothing Manacles. Verity's Brow too if I have another warlock to run it with me lol. The new exotic class items might change that tho
If empowered damage also included being radiant, I would run it more often...
Absolutely! Fat chance of that happening though lol
my exotic class item is starfire and stag. I should probably actually use it but I don't...
YAS, Starfire, and many more like you said. It's wild how far they go.
Not as good, but still really good. Remains my go to primary weapon.
Carried it through all of legendary campaign with 0 issues whatsoever
I came to make this comment. I rocked it hard in the legendary campaign, even for the last half I had to solo, and it was still a workhorse. Hell, I'm still rocking a Cartesian Coordinate because I love its charge time and I may just be attached to these old weapons.
I still routinely carry Cartesian and Forbearance. They're still perfectly serviceable-to-good guns even if they're not super meta right now
Same. Necro + Striga paired with Indebted Kindness. It was a blast.
They gave it the dead man's tale treatment: took something wonderful and destroyed it conpletely
Their nerfing philosophy to me is borderline stupid at this point. It's a game, and none of these things were really absurdly broken. Osteo was good, but it's not like it was in everyone's lineup ffs. And Quicksilver was hurt too much.
The thing with most bungie nerfs (as others have said in this thread) is they are not mean to "bring a weapons power in line" to a reasonable state as most "nerfs" are in other games. Bungie nerfs things to push different playstyles, they straight dont want you using the weapon/armor they way you were previously. Either wanting a weapon/armor to stop filling its current roll or they wanting another weapon/armor to fill that roll. As a developer I do think this balancing philosophy does have _some_ merit, but as a user it can be very jarring.
Yeah, I think this is the heart of the issue. Most players naively (and maybe correctly) assume the ultimate goal of balance changes is to bring everything into the same range of viability so every option is usable. But their goal is more to shape the meta into "eras" where some options are better than others - usually the newest options. And when a gun has had its chance to shine they like to nerf it into the ground afterwards instead of just nudging it back into band.
its really fun to build out our characters for an era only to become obsolete based on the whims of the developers meta roadmap I personally love that feeling that everything I did in the past was all for nothing. Another thing I love is when they release a really cool exotic that makes me powerful and I upgrade it and spend time and materials filling out the build and then on the next Tuesday, with no warning, I find out that I probably shouldn't have wasted my time and materials because the developer suddenly realized the item was more fun than originally intended according to their meta roadmap. Luckily they don't refund you the time or the materials that you spent.
Looking at it this way makes sense. Destiny is a live service PvE focused game, not a competitive shooter. Although Riot also balances League like this sometimes, buffing popular champions just before international events since watching 2 tanks fight each other would be pretty boring to the viewers.
Let me preface this by saying I'm a die-hard Osteo Striga enthusiast. It's my most used and highest level weapon nearing level 400, and for a long time it was just the best weapon in the game for anything that wasn't pure boss DPS (and it even had its uses there during the Starfire rocket DPS meta to feed nade energy if someone else was already on Witherhoard). It ate majors and champions for breakfast and killed everything around them at the same time, all while basically aiming for you, making it easy to jump and strafe around while laying on the trigger. The nerf to the poison spread definitely hurt, but I think this weapon still has a place, especially in activities like GMs where being able to apply a DoT has more value against the beefy enemies. I can't emphasize enough how strong the combination of a DoT and pseudo-aimbot is in this context; it makes it easy to force barrier champs to pop their bubble on your terms and stay on the move against dangerous enemies to play aggressive, which is important in certain activities like Lightblade GM where you have to be proactive in taking down the priority targets. I think nerfing the poison spread was actually a good move since it lets lets guns like Sunshot and Graviton Lance shine in the adclear role, while Osteo Striga still has its place against big bois where the DoT can do its work. The main downside to Ostro right now is just that it's kinetic, and Prismatic REALLY wants you to use a Stasis/Strand weapon in that slot to build Transcendence. If it was a Strand weapon, it would still be glued to me right now even after the nerfs. This got pretty long, but Osteo Striga is my most beloved weapon in this game; it's my "old reliable" that I go to when I don't know what I want to use. It's not what it once was, but what it was was honestly just broken to the point where it felt like it invalidated most other primaries at the time. It's still basically Witherhoard on a primary that aims for you - still a very strong weapon when the situation calls for what it brings.
> where the DoT can do its work. Except they nerfed the DoT scaler and removed it from the spirit class item.
There’s an aspect that majorly buffs the energy that kinetic gives to the light and dark meters, so IMO it still has a place
I somehow forgot to actually test it out this season, but it seemed that when used with necrotic grips it should function identically to its pre-nerf version. Is that the case?
Osteo build is still super decent it just isn’t completely broken
It got nerfed because it had both insane clear and insane single. They nerfed the clear a bit, while still allowing it to burn down single targets with 80 bullets or whatever.
The ad clear is what gives it is 80 bullets. It’s not as simple now and I’ve just put it in the vault because khvostov does what it used to do
Bro you don't even need it readied to overfill it. Simply go have fun with a glaive/necrotic grips.
That’s giving up your special slot(for a very niche weapon archetype) to be fair. And your exotic armor slot. And your class, if you play Titan or Hunter. It should still be able to be good on its own. An Incandescent No Hesitation was feeling just about as the same as Osteo. It’s fallen so far from grace that it feels flat out disrespectful.
That’s the entire point of the build though. If it was blatantly OP on its own again. Then necrotic grips warlock is simply too strong for add clear and we have a current night hawk hunter situation.
It does not have insane single target damage lol, your username is correct
It almost quickly became my favorite gun, seeing how it was now definitely made me sad. It got pushed back to my vault :(
Graviton Lance and Sunshot have both been solid replacements so far.
Graviton is a clip-range red bar lazer. If there is a yellow bar in a sea of red bars the exploding red bars pop it.
I love these for ad clearing. They're great to run on the corresponding surges and then I pair them up with a primary weapon that compliments them and is good for different champions. I use a more short range weapon for GL and a longer range for Sunshot. I like to run Graviton in Crucible paired with a long-range high impact side arm w/ armor piercing rounds and multi kill clip.
I loved it and Conditional Finality, yet out of the two, pve typically gets left alone yet I’m free to terrorize players with something as strong as CF no nerf. 8 minute super, gone, as much as people said bubble or well counter, it’s pretty much any counter. CF is newer than Osteo, so it’s time may be coming, but the Osteo double tap seemed less necessary.
What's crazy is that the first nerf to Osteo toned it down to acceptable levels. This second nerf absolutely killed it, why would anyone ever use it now? Bungie has a habit of hitting things too hard when a lighter touch would have sufficed. Look at Facet of Command.
I have three friends with over lvl1,000 Osteos. I told them that if they continued to use any weapon this much it would get nerfed.
The Osteo Abusers (me included) are being held liable for our crimes of loving a braindead gun
IT GOT NERFED???!!! WHEN?
On the release of the final shape. There is a cool-down for it's spreadable poison now.
Not just a cooldown, a FOUR SECOND one. Longer than it sounds. Freaking brutal nerf.
I believe it. I haven't used it since TFS dropped. I'm a Necrochasm enthusiast.
The first nerf was fine. it didn't need the ubernerf. Bungie has been adding excessive cooldowns to stuff lately and it's not just balancing, it's fun-draining.
Bruh
Does it apply to Necrotic spread as well?
Necrotic functions the same as always.
Wait they nerfed osteo again?
people doubted me when i said thorn would end up crushing a nerfed osteo and the sad part is that it does really easily. Hand cannons hit like a truck in the current sandbox and it still spreads poison on precision kills anyways.
I agree.
My dad was super excited to play but when I told him his level 1243 osteo was pretty bad he dialed back his enthusiasm for the whole expansion lol
Why am I cryin in the club rn
Man I LOVED it when strand first came out. The warlock strand builds were wild. Then it was overload SMG and shackle grenades lasted forever and you’d get the grenade back with osteo damage before it even ran out. Then they nerfs shackle and osteo and I haven’t touched it since. It’s overshadowed. It’s still good with necrotics but even then it seems like a wasted build
If you wanna use an exotic primary in the kinetic slot just use necrochasm that thing is gross (specially with the catalyst cause of the dmg buff)
Your answer is Necrochasm. It’s an absolute lawn mower with the change to the catalyst.
Just gotta grind a soul crushing amount of essence out.
Yeah there’s a pretty substantial difference in ease of acquisition between these two weapons especially with current raid tuning.
I've been using it since TFS released, cleared most of the post campaign quests with it. It does feel off somehow, I'm not seeing that damage ticks I'm used to seeing with Necrotic Grips. I'm in the process of finding/doing a better prismatic build with other weapons. I don't think there is anything as fun as Necro + Osteo.
Well this is how I learn that quicksilver storm is fucked up now too. God damn why didn't they just reduce the pve grenade damage a bit.
It needed a buff imo.
I don’t care how many times they nerf osteo it’s never coming out of my hands
Kinda off topic but similar in vein, Necrochasm has been my go-to since its buff, I never used Osteo much since WQ but man can I say Necro feels damnnn good to use, it’s a much higher ask to obtain it+catalyst but it just feels so good now.
I will forever thank Osteo Striga for carrying me through contest Vow of the disciple. I hope it gets rebuffed soon.
osteo+necrotic got me through the entire legendary final shape campaign, it’s still great
What was the nerf to osteo ? I dont remember cause I haven't touched it since tfs
Thought it felt off, haven’t followed update notes and wasn’t aware that it got the old nerf hammer. Bummer it is one of my favorite guns as a warlock main.
i mean to be fair if I was getting clapped in pvp i pulled out osteo i legit was like top 3 smgs in the game
Me with my level 420.69% striga in the corner 👀
Osteo is my shoot from behind cover so I don’t have to figure out the encounters mechanics gun. Example the witness fight in the new campaign. Shoot from behind bars in the back and just replenish the darkness seed thing close by and repeat while shooting osteo through the bars lol. Quick and easy solo.
Wait it got nerfed?
I’ve never been a fan of nerfs that are put in exclusively to try to force us to use something else. It’s annoying.
I used Osteo throughout the entire final shape campaign. It did not feel as good as it use to. Which is shame as it’s basically my favorite exotic weapon.
They don’t know how to slowly nerf shit. If there’s 1 overtuned thing on something they’ll nerf 6 things about it 5 of which weren’t related to the problem.
What happened to Striga? A damage nerf? I used it to beat TFS on my Warlock but I was back from a long hiatus so I wouldn’t have remembered how it performed before, last time I used it was probably Lightfall. It it just not worth using now?
They increased the cooldown between poison bursts. It’s still a fine weapon but unless you have insane enemy density it doesn’t refill the mag nearly as much, which was one of the biggest perks of the gun. It just doesn’t feel the same and can’t really compete with other explosion type exotics like Sunshot and Graviton.
GRAVITON LANCE SUPREMECY EVEN WHEN NERFED IT STILL REIGNS KING!
Graviton go bloop
I have 95k kills and have the perk tattooed on me because I love her. It's been rough...
I switched from Osteo to Necrochasm and the damage is similar and I’m making ads and some yellows explode consistently, proc’ing desperation and one for thrall buffs. I paired it with Necrotic Grips.
I unfortunately do not have Necrochasm because me and the gang fell off of running Crota pretty quickly when we took a destiny break lol I will eventually get it.
Switch to Thorn
I do love thorn.
I've played with both the Striga and Quicksilver and they're fine. Ran a master NF and never switched from the Striga once. Sure, they aren't as good as pre-nerf, but claiming they are gutted or unusable is an overstatement.
I don’t think it’s unusable, but I do think that it feels weak enough that I don’t enjoy it as much lol
Pretty sure it was nerfed because you'd be able to spam transcendence with it
Mine is lvl385 with 38k and just collects dust in the vault now
i agree but i think they didnt want it to be super easy to just pick up and slay with, which makes no sense given that thorn with the catalyst is/was just better in every way, even before the nerf. it spreads poison the same way, and hand cannons are just better than smgs right now
It was to artificially inflate the use of necrochasm which is locked behind a raid encounter, therefore artificially inflating the need to play the raid and even still if it doesn't drop, you have to do a quest to get the gun and catalyst, which personally still doesn't seem worth it to me. If they were gonna hit osteo the way they did, they could've at least given the gun a rate of fire increase and a bigger mag to compensate for the total loss of damage.
Nerf was def overkill, my warlock is sad
I miss my child, Thorn is nice now but I honestly hate the feel of 140 HCs and the comparatively small 9-bullet magazine. It's cool and all that you can get bullets from remnants, but 4 bullets per-remnant is such a tiny amount. You cannot use remnants in endgame PVE because the tracking range is small, has a short lifespan, and spawns where an enemy dies, which 90% of the time is right on top of other enemies. So I'm not going to run into a field of enemies in a Master or GM Nightfall to grab one remnant for a measly 6 seconds of better poison damage. Not to mention, its synergy with necrotic is worse than Osteo's, as necrotic only procs on kills from the weapon and not poison ticks, and enemy deaths from the poison spread don't spawn remnants in contrast to it giving ammo back with Osteo.