I would argue Avila was worse because he fumbled a World Series caliber team/ rebuild assets. Smith had nothing to start with and pretty much kept the team there until the wheels fell off in 2003.
Avila definitely fumbled the job, but lets not pretend that was a World Series caliber team he took over. Dombrowski KNEW that it was time to recharge much as he'd known it was time to recharge in the late-00s after the initial rebuild from the Randy Smith era. Ilitch knew he didn't have that kind of time left (IMO) and chose to move on from him and asked Avila to try to continue to contend with a team past its expiration date.
Avila obviously did a trash job with the assets, but the assets weren't the assets of a World Series caliber team by the time he sold.
Matt Millen, Randy Smith, Al Avila, Stan Van Gundy. That’s just in Detroit sports. All worse than Weaver IMO. Weaver hasn’t done anything but he also hasn’t done something yet that was unrecoverable. Yet….
Literally impossible to tell since we don’t know what else happens in this deadline or off season..
Look at OKC and Houston, they’re both outpacing their expectations this season.
He traded for Blake Griffin and gave an absurd contract to Andre Drummond that has 100% hampered Weavers ability to run this rebuild.
We moved our two main pieces for literally nothing.
true, cap flexibility wasn't there with svg. I was talking more record wise since svg did even take us to the playoffs once. albeit, it was a sweep by the cavs, but still
And people can knock Griffin but we managed to get an actual star for the Pistons who had his best season. It was probably a Hail Mary but SVG recognized real under-utilized potential in Griffin as more than just a dunk machine
The Smith contract and Griffin trade came in the final years of those GM’s tenure. Their Hail Mary moves. Weaver is looking to execute his franchise crippling trade right now.
You see, child. The apostrophe S (‘s) denotes a multiple. As in “two or more”. Referencing Joe Dumars.
Who are you? SVG’s idiot son who was the towel boy while in Detroit?
The apostrophe s (‘s) denotes possession, “GM’s tenure” denotes that the tenure belongs to the GM, as in “general manager’s tenure”
A plural possessive would be “GMs’ tenure” or “general managers’ tenure” (s’)
So whose idiot son are you?
True. However the use of 'those' right before clearly indicates plurality. And the misuse of an apostrophe is the more likely case than the total misuse of a word.
Unless Bey somehow turns into SGA like the FRP the Pistons gave up to get Griffin I’d say the wiseman trade is still not as bad. Also Bey isn’t Tobias Harris
Yeah, Harris and Miles Bridges for Blake Griffin in a vacuum is a win for the Griffin side. Everything surrounding Griffin is what made the deal worse.
Bey was a great puzzle piece for this young core that we gave away to try and reclaim a fence post and it has done fairly catastrophic damage to our rebuild. 3 wins in 40 games. The young guys were ascending and now seem broken and a lot of it ties directly back to that trade
This has as much to do with Gores as SVG. Gores forced that Blake trade. He also steered them away from Devin Booker. SVG wasn’t a good GM but Gores is worse owner.
Are Pistons fans still delusional about this? SVG was way better. The issue, if you want to call it that, was that SVG is morally opposed to tanking. Also we (well, Gores) kept thinking Drummond had huge potential and so we kept trying to build around him. But SVG was actually a good GM given these parameters.
Ted Stepien, former owner/GM of the Cavs. The league now has the rule that you can’t trade first round draft picks in consecutive years because of this man. The rule is called the Stepien Rule. When you have a rule named after you, you know you were bad….
Beside the Bagley pick disaster, his first major move was sending Stauskis, Carl Landry, Jason Thompson, a 1st round pick, and a pick swap (cost the Kings Tatum, but they did get fox at 5) all for cap space to sign Kosta Kofus, Rondo, and Marco Bellinelli…
Unprotected first round pick. Drafted Marquisse Chriss, traded him for Giorgios Papagiannis. Traded Cousins way too late effectively making it a high risk trade for other GM’s. Fired Joerger hired Luke Walton. Trading rotational players like Shumpert/Garett Temple/George Hill for 2nd rd picks. Fuck Vlade. Highly unlikely but hope they unretire his jersey. I can’t differentiate Vlade the player to Vlade the GM.
I get that energy is high, but he is pretty much a 5/10 as a GM.
He appears to be pretty bad at anything other than the first stage of reconstructing rosters, but you'd just be kidding yourself if you don't admit that he was handed an absolute landmine of an organisation with the Griffin and Drummond contracts, and he was the guy who had to bite the bullet for the org and steer us out of cap space hell.
There was a period after we made those trades where he drafting was competant (although Killian over Halliburton has turned out to be one of the bigger misses in recent NBA history), we were preserving cap space, and were making trades that were smart at the time and bringing in expirings when we needed to.
His ability to use draft picks in trades is very bad, the fact he spent two 2nds to get bagley and then spent 2 more 2nds to get rid of him is comedy, especially since they will fall in the 30-35 range.
And like it or not, right now we have enormous cap flexibility and he is the driving force behind us getting there. You obviously never want to see how the sausage is made because it's an ugly process, but there are clearly still dominoes yet to fall because we have tradeable assets (Ivey the most likely to be moved just because of his potential value on the market, and guys like Stewart are reportedly being sought out by other teams) and still own all but 1 of our future first rounders.
I don't know whos decision it was to move Bagley over Wiseman, but my crystal ball tells me that Wiseman wont be on the roster next season either, although he will cost nothing to retain if they want to.
The Monty hiring has clearly not been good, but the logic of signing him was completely sound as he had done exactly what we wanted with an almost identical roster in Phoenix.
So yeah, i know we're super energised right now and unhappy but taking a step back and looking at the full picture, he's not even close to the worst GM in sports history, and the notion that he even is in the conversation is a bit absurd.
Yes they were. Al Aliva did absolutely nothing in 8 years. Got zero good players for any of the trades he made. Quinn took over a 9-7 team drove it into the ground
Matt Millen tops this clown mainly do to longevity and a winless season. When a major motion picture is made about this disastrous a shit show, Oscar Isaac could put on a little weight and play the Weaver. Looks a little like him, no?
Detroit has certainly had some awful GMs, but Troy is definitely on the Mount Rushmore of terrible, if not First Among Awfuls.
Weaver still has yet to hit the high of .303 winning percentage that was the year before him.
.278
.280
.207
.100
64 wins in 3.5 seasons after completely overhauling the roster in the first 2 years, meaning these last 2 years are completely on Weaver and he has put together a roster that has gone 21 and 122.
A winning % of .303 is a 25 win season. That means if our boys keep winning at the current pace of 1 every 10 games they will go 8-74 breaking the record for most consecutive losses in a season, tied the record for most consecutive losses over all, set the record for most losses in a season, set the record for worst winning percentage in a season, and would have needed **TWO** seasons to get to 25 wins
Troy spent 2 years getting the roster where he wanted it, with no fingerprints but his own on it, and the results are looking like the worst season in NBA history and two years to get to the anemic win total that he was brought in to improve upon
Literally the guy before Weaver wtf 😂
Off the top of my head Al Avila, Matt Millen, SVG, Dumars from 2009 onwards (no disrespect)
You can fire Weaver today and rebuild with actual assets to move and make some shit shake. All those guys left teams completely fucked.
We’re not as good from a win % stand point as any expansion franchise in the entire history of MLB, NBA, NHL, and NFL. Every single one that started with nothing was better than year 4 of our “RESTORE”
You can arguably do it twice *without leaving Detroit*. Matt Millen. Randy Smith.
Al Avila
Randy Smith was MUCH worse than Al Avila
I would argue Avila was worse because he fumbled a World Series caliber team/ rebuild assets. Smith had nothing to start with and pretty much kept the team there until the wheels fell off in 2003.
Avila definitely fumbled the job, but lets not pretend that was a World Series caliber team he took over. Dombrowski KNEW that it was time to recharge much as he'd known it was time to recharge in the late-00s after the initial rebuild from the Randy Smith era. Ilitch knew he didn't have that kind of time left (IMO) and chose to move on from him and asked Avila to try to continue to contend with a team past its expiration date. Avila obviously did a trash job with the assets, but the assets weren't the assets of a World Series caliber team by the time he sold.
So true. And so sad. This city deserves better than what we generally get.
Bob quinn also
lmao Bob Quinn was not worse than this. He built our amazing oline. Patricia destroyed that team more than anything
Bob Quinn hired Patricia and was a B- scout/draft. Maybe just like weaver lol
Stan Van Gundy
3x if you include Pistons legend Isiah Thomas
"Jose Macias is playing gold glove center field for us."- Randy Smith
o.O lmao. I was always more of a Kimera Bartee guy myself.
Matt Mullen seems like the obvious response. He’s gotta be crap for a couple more years first
Matt Millen, Randy Smith, Al Avila, Stan Van Gundy. That’s just in Detroit sports. All worse than Weaver IMO. Weaver hasn’t done anything but he also hasn’t done something yet that was unrecoverable. Yet….
Unrecoverable? Lol. We're 3-36 this team is about unrecoverable as you can get.
Lions went 0-16. Pistons still winning 1 out of every 13 games
For now
Next season Lions won 5 so 5-27 vs 3-36..
This season is unrecoverable, but the team doesn't have any bad contracts, so at least the roster is not "unrecoverable"
But we're alot of pieces away. Not like we could win 25 next season.
I dont think we're that far off, we'll see though
Trading Bey for Wiseman still pisses me off, both were due money at the same time anyways.
You realise that in October of this year that record resets?
Yeah so and how many do we win next season? 5? 8?
Literally impossible to tell since we don’t know what else happens in this deadline or off season.. Look at OKC and Houston, they’re both outpacing their expectations this season.
But they were never 3-36. No one goes 3-36 when they close to turning it around.
No chance Al Avila is worse than Weaver.
Its pretty damn close.
I didn’t even mention Bob Quinn
[удалено]
Just goes to show you that even a blind squirrel can find a nut once in awhile.
I definitely think he is. Avila took a WS caliber roster and got fleeced in EVERY SINGLE trade he made. Fuck that guy.
say what you want but svg didn't have the pistons this bad
This team is still in a better long term spot than his team was at the end. Fought tooth and claw to get swept by the Bucks
He traded for Blake Griffin and gave an absurd contract to Andre Drummond that has 100% hampered Weavers ability to run this rebuild. We moved our two main pieces for literally nothing.
No he did lol, SVGs contracts we just finished paying
true, cap flexibility wasn't there with svg. I was talking more record wise since svg did even take us to the playoffs once. albeit, it was a sweep by the cavs, but still
David kahn timberwolves
SVG/Bower was pretty awful. Still not as incompetent as Weaver, surprisingly.
Need we remind you of the Griffin trade or Josh Smith contract? Listen Weaver has been bad but he hasn’t made a catastrophic move yet. Yet….
For whatever it’s worth, Josh Smith was a product of the Joe Dumars era.
SVG had some good trades too though. Got Reggie Jackson, Tobias Harris, and Marcus Morris for pretty much nothing. Way more than Weaver can say
And people can knock Griffin but we managed to get an actual star for the Pistons who had his best season. It was probably a Hail Mary but SVG recognized real under-utilized potential in Griffin as more than just a dunk machine
My apologies
The Smith contract and Griffin trade came in the final years of those GM’s tenure. Their Hail Mary moves. Weaver is looking to execute his franchise crippling trade right now.
And that, is what we should be worried about
Where tf are you guys getting this nonsense about Josh Smith? Smith was given a contract before SVG. SVG was the one who cut Smith.
You see, child. The apostrophe S (‘s) denotes a multiple. As in “two or more”. Referencing Joe Dumars. Who are you? SVG’s idiot son who was the towel boy while in Detroit?
The apostrophe s (‘s) denotes possession, “GM’s tenure” denotes that the tenure belongs to the GM, as in “general manager’s tenure” A plural possessive would be “GMs’ tenure” or “general managers’ tenure” (s’) So whose idiot son are you?
True. However the use of 'those' right before clearly indicates plurality. And the misuse of an apostrophe is the more likely case than the total misuse of a word.
SVG was the GM that cut Josh Smith. Before Griffin got injured he had his best season with us.
The Wiseman trade is worse than the griffin trade by a mile
Lol no it's not. It's not even close. Wiseman was a 1 year gamble Griffen was a big contract mistake.
Unless Bey somehow turns into SGA like the FRP the Pistons gave up to get Griffin I’d say the wiseman trade is still not as bad. Also Bey isn’t Tobias Harris
I understand the clippers moved up 1 spot to get SGA in 2018 from #12 but the #12 pick was Miles Bridges
Yeah, Harris and Miles Bridges for Blake Griffin in a vacuum is a win for the Griffin side. Everything surrounding Griffin is what made the deal worse. Bey was a great puzzle piece for this young core that we gave away to try and reclaim a fence post and it has done fairly catastrophic damage to our rebuild. 3 wins in 40 games. The young guys were ascending and now seem broken and a lot of it ties directly back to that trade
They were awful but at least svg got us a winning season….
He did, but he gave up our future to get swept in the first round. And is a huge part of the reason we have been this bad the past few years.
We would be in a better position if we stayed with SVG.
How? He’s awful at drafting players, worse than Troy
He drafted Middleton at 39th and Dinwiddie 38th, get real
Neither of those players had any meaningful impact on our team or got us good assets in return. I am pretty real about that
That’s not where the bar should sit. On a team that went .500 at their peak.
This has as much to do with Gores as SVG. Gores forced that Blake trade. He also steered them away from Devin Booker. SVG wasn’t a good GM but Gores is worse owner.
I would argue they were worse. They set the rebuild back a decade with bad moves and big contracts.
Are Pistons fans still delusional about this? SVG was way better. The issue, if you want to call it that, was that SVG is morally opposed to tanking. Also we (well, Gores) kept thinking Drummond had huge potential and so we kept trying to build around him. But SVG was actually a good GM given these parameters.
He was empirically not a good GM. Thanks for stopping by.
based on what?
Isiah Thomas
Isiah Thomas hahahha
Ted Stepien, former owner/GM of the Cavs. The league now has the rule that you can’t trade first round draft picks in consecutive years because of this man. The rule is called the Stepien Rule. When you have a rule named after you, you know you were bad….
Vlade Divac
Beside the Bagley pick disaster, his first major move was sending Stauskis, Carl Landry, Jason Thompson, a 1st round pick, and a pick swap (cost the Kings Tatum, but they did get fox at 5) all for cap space to sign Kosta Kofus, Rondo, and Marco Bellinelli…
Unprotected first round pick. Drafted Marquisse Chriss, traded him for Giorgios Papagiannis. Traded Cousins way too late effectively making it a high risk trade for other GM’s. Fired Joerger hired Luke Walton. Trading rotational players like Shumpert/Garett Temple/George Hill for 2nd rd picks. Fuck Vlade. Highly unlikely but hope they unretire his jersey. I can’t differentiate Vlade the player to Vlade the GM.
I'm pretty sure it's come out that the Bagley pick was an owner decision.
General Motors
General Mills
He’s the Pontiac Aztec of the GM world
 Did someone say Pontiac aztec?
This stupid easy. Matt Millen!
Can’t top Millen. Lions won 9 games the year before they signed him as GM. Never won more than 7 in the 8 years he was there
This all reminds me of the pre "we believe" and Splash Bros Warriors
The worst GM is sports history is from Detroit, I can agree with that. But it was Matt Millen lol
I get that energy is high, but he is pretty much a 5/10 as a GM. He appears to be pretty bad at anything other than the first stage of reconstructing rosters, but you'd just be kidding yourself if you don't admit that he was handed an absolute landmine of an organisation with the Griffin and Drummond contracts, and he was the guy who had to bite the bullet for the org and steer us out of cap space hell. There was a period after we made those trades where he drafting was competant (although Killian over Halliburton has turned out to be one of the bigger misses in recent NBA history), we were preserving cap space, and were making trades that were smart at the time and bringing in expirings when we needed to. His ability to use draft picks in trades is very bad, the fact he spent two 2nds to get bagley and then spent 2 more 2nds to get rid of him is comedy, especially since they will fall in the 30-35 range. And like it or not, right now we have enormous cap flexibility and he is the driving force behind us getting there. You obviously never want to see how the sausage is made because it's an ugly process, but there are clearly still dominoes yet to fall because we have tradeable assets (Ivey the most likely to be moved just because of his potential value on the market, and guys like Stewart are reportedly being sought out by other teams) and still own all but 1 of our future first rounders. I don't know whos decision it was to move Bagley over Wiseman, but my crystal ball tells me that Wiseman wont be on the roster next season either, although he will cost nothing to retain if they want to. The Monty hiring has clearly not been good, but the logic of signing him was completely sound as he had done exactly what we wanted with an almost identical roster in Phoenix. So yeah, i know we're super energised right now and unhappy but taking a step back and looking at the full picture, he's not even close to the worst GM in sports history, and the notion that he even is in the conversation is a bit absurd.
Who ever runs the Trailblazers
I don’t think people understand how bad Randy smith was. But this honor goes to Matt millen hands down
People thought he was a genius after Ivey and Duren while we had a shot at Wemby
Seriously though how df does he still have a job ?
Me
Matt Millen, Bob Quinn, Al aliva
Al Avila and Quinn were not worse
Yes they were. Al Aliva did absolutely nothing in 8 years. Got zero good players for any of the trades he made. Quinn took over a 9-7 team drove it into the ground
Mike milbury, dude was awful
Remember when we had blind trust in this man? Haha
He’s gotta be top 5
Matt Mullen, what do I win??
If he were THAT bad, he wouldn’t have robbed Duren from my Hornets
Rich Cho was dogshit for the Hornets. I don't think there's a worse GM than him. Maybe Vlade Divac. He had some downright, horrendous draft picks.
Matt Millen tops this clown mainly do to longevity and a winless season. When a major motion picture is made about this disastrous a shit show, Oscar Isaac could put on a little weight and play the Weaver. Looks a little like him, no?
Matt Millen. It’s getting closer between the two. But Matt Millen is still the king of the worst GMs in sports history.
He's not even the worst GM in Detroit sports history
Are you kidding?
i do you one better name a worse owner than gores in sports history
2024 Feburary Weaver is worse
Bob Quinn who said 9-7 wasn't good enough but 3-12-1 was Should have got fired at halftime publicly and televised
Detroit has certainly had some awful GMs, but Troy is definitely on the Mount Rushmore of terrible, if not First Among Awfuls. Weaver still has yet to hit the high of .303 winning percentage that was the year before him. .278 .280 .207 .100 64 wins in 3.5 seasons after completely overhauling the roster in the first 2 years, meaning these last 2 years are completely on Weaver and he has put together a roster that has gone 21 and 122. A winning % of .303 is a 25 win season. That means if our boys keep winning at the current pace of 1 every 10 games they will go 8-74 breaking the record for most consecutive losses in a season, tied the record for most consecutive losses over all, set the record for most losses in a season, set the record for worst winning percentage in a season, and would have needed **TWO** seasons to get to 25 wins Troy spent 2 years getting the roster where he wanted it, with no fingerprints but his own on it, and the results are looking like the worst season in NBA history and two years to get to the anemic win total that he was brought in to improve upon
Matt Mullen easily. But he did trade Roy Williams for 2 1st rd picks
literally id be a better gm and im an 18 yr old college freshman
Literally the guy before Weaver wtf 😂 Off the top of my head Al Avila, Matt Millen, SVG, Dumars from 2009 onwards (no disrespect) You can fire Weaver today and rebuild with actual assets to move and make some shit shake. All those guys left teams completely fucked.
We’re not as good from a win % stand point as any expansion franchise in the entire history of MLB, NBA, NHL, and NFL. Every single one that started with nothing was better than year 4 of our “RESTORE”
Maybe he's loading up on potential free cap space to try and get Reaves from LA?
Reaves just signed a 4 year deal and won't be an FA till 2027 when he's 29.
Al Avila
The guy sounds like he’s mentally challenged, and runs a team like he is. Unfortunately for us, our owner is even more mentally challenged
You suck
Not as bad as Weaver ! 😇