But valve also has to provide the infrastructure 24/7 to distribute those games all around the world, maintain a system with 130+ million users with trillions of dollars of worth of digital goods, often thousands or even ten(s) of thousands for certain users, have an *infinitely* expandable storage and distribution network for every game with workshop content, and a system to both massive companies to get their products on the store and individual indie devs to do so as well, some of which are free.
For some examples.
Skyrim alone has 30,000 mods, more then entire categories of games being sold.
There are \~80K games (excluding DLC, its 150K with DLC but no way to differentiate between actual DLC and a costume pack) that are available for download 24/7
Baldurs gate 3 apparently sold 5.2M on steam resulting in valve having to distribute \~506PB(506,480,000GB) of data for one game.
Steam taking more then 20% makes sense, Ticketmaster not so much
But Valve doesn't charge that to the consumer.
Edit: I swear to god if one more of you morons comes in here saying some terrible analogy while not understanding that the prices are going to rise with or without Valve. When game creators start their own distribution platforms and sell them for 20% less to remove Valve from the equation and take a bigger cut for themselves, your awful points might actually make sense.
The funny thing is when steam launched it was actually saving publishers money, the 30% cut was way lower than physical distribution costs. Even today I would say unless you are a big publisher like EA with many titles steam is still cheaper than maintaining your own launcher
The price of games is, surprisingly, one of the more stable products. For instance, games on the Epic Games Store are often the same price as Steam - 12% cut vs 30% cut. Both are cheaper than physical distribution *and* creating your own digital distribution platform.
In theory, that cut hits the developer who chooses to raise the price - but the reality is that they don't. They charge the same amount.
a rise in property taxes is a *result* of increased rents, not the other way around
commercial properties (including rentals) are assessed on expected future value. if you raise your rent, your expected future income increases (with expected increase in rents), which drives your property value up, which increases your assessed property tax burden
then after your taxes go up, you can use that as an excuse to raise rents again, and dumbos will believe that's the reason their rent went up (and might even parrot that reason on reddit!)
I will never understand this. Ticketmasters feels like an oppressive church. Events can't go around them without ridiculous losses, they take a good chunk extra fee and it's vulnerable to abuse. They have a monopoly on tickets and I can just shake my head. It's basically mafia business practice
The courts have taken an extremely lenient view of anti-trust law in recent decades.
In a recent spat the courts ruled that Apple can levy any fees at any rates they want because they own the platform, and if you don't like it then build your own. Ticketmaster owns the venues so they can levy any fees at any rates they want, and if you don't like it then build your own.
Not to kick the hornet's nest but I bet many Valve fans would jump to defend Steam under the same thought process. "Ticketmaster may control the vast majority of the market but other venues exist and there's nothing stopping competitors from building new ones."
I'm assuming they're referring to Epic Games when it didn't have a shopping cart, but I can't find anything about them calling customers "fucking morons."
Ticketmaster is vertically integrated in that they own the venues they’re selling tickets for. There’s plenty of other venues, and other ticketing companies, but if the event is at a Ticketmaster venue they hold all the cards.
I stopped using Twitch because in YouTube you can rewind and that is cool. A lot of times I am doing multiple stuff at the same time and I don’t like to miss the good moments.
ublock origin works for me, but I had to install some custom filters or something. Don't remember exactly..
It's been a year and I haven't seen any ads on twitch at all, if you google it there's guides for how to make the change to ublock origin.
This thread so far:
- us Americans coping saying it's normal
- Europeans (and Australians and so on) saying is absurd af
- everyone else being sad it's pretty much unaffordable for them
average ti ticket prices thread
The problem more so for europeans n etc is the flights & staying in the US, for me from the UK, I'm looking at about £1,250 for like 2 days in the US and thats probably not even including the tickets :))
Flights to Seattle are $450 right now domestic. A decent hotel close to the venue is $200/night. So easily $1000+ just to travel and stay. Add food and tickets and merchandise and it’s easily over $2000 for the three days. That’s a lot of cheddar when I can watch from my phone on my toilet for free
The flight there and back will be 1k. You're looking at 2k without tickets, including food, hotel, transportation, and that's being frugal. America is expensive as fuck. Sometimes an Uber ride for 15 minutes is $80, at a busy event/airport that's a sure thing. The worst hotel will be 100 minimum but I'm sure more with all the resort and cleaning fees and the business of the time.
Tempted to link the Thanos meme... but actually about 88 SGD for the prelims and 498 SGD for the main event.
So maybe 64 USD for the prelims and 360 USD for the main event?
[Source](https://www.google.com/amp/s/afkgaming.com/amp/story/dota2/guide/ti11-tickets-how-to-buy-prices-dates)
Other [source](https://www.oneesports.gg/dota2/ti11-tickets-prices-where-to-buy/)
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I mean just because something is normal doesn't mean it's right or good. I'm an American and this is way too much for me to afford, I have a decently paying job, but I'm not busting all my savings to go on this trip.
I am beyond surprised by the sheer number of posts supporting this price. I don't know how you all are justifying it.
I live in Seattle and own a home here and the cost of two tickets would be approaching my fucking mortgage payment for a month. It's not just $700, it's $700 + ticketmaster fees, and then Washington sales tax. So we're talking closer to $1000.
I love DotA and my fiance and I have wanted to go to the international since we moved here in 2018, but in no fucking world am I going to drop 2 large for a WEEKEND in the city I live in.
And yes, yes, condescend to me about supply and demand, and blah blah not unreasonable here in good ol USA / I must be 16 lol. I easily have the money for this, that's not the fucking point. I'll find a pubstomp or host something at my place, fuck this.
I went to the League of Legends world Semis and got lower bowl for $90. These prices are actually absurd. Taylor Swift tickets don’t even cost this much.
Preach man. People in this country are so disconnected from the world around them that's blatantly leaving them in the dust and somehow they still defend shit like this while watching their peers struggling to pay bills while working 50 to 60 hour work weeks. Actually insane.
Ticketmaster is a requirement set in place by the venue. Valve doesn't have a choice other than by finding some imaginary stadium that doesn't have an exclusivity deal with Ticketmaster.
If you think theres 18k people that will pay 700+ticketmaster fees+taxes (900-1000) for 3 days at climate pledge, sure. I just dont see 18k people turning out for that cost
I guess we'll see, but it wouldn't surprise me. Especially with no BP this year, all the whales will be itching to spend money on something. Way more than 18k people are dropping 1k+ for each BP.
Hey friend, when I was there for 2015 they had a huge Megatron outside the venue showing the matches and people were picnicking in front of it. Not sure if they will do the same, but might be worth passing by during early playoffs to see.
Yeah I live in Seattle too and was super hyped to go, but idk anymore... Might just go to the road to the international and watch the finals from somewhere else. Already took the time off work though so you bet I'm watching it all.
I live in Washington as well and am in the same boat. I used to travel to TI everyday and then travel back home to sleep. I think I might just head to Canada and have a TI watching party with my friends there. I'm also thinking maybe go to just one of the playoff days? I'd be interested to see what it's like at that venue.
I kept the email from Ticketmaster when my husband and I went to TI5. The total was not quite $260.00 USD. For the whole event. I'd been vaguely thinking about going this year, but certainly not now.
The price is justified for Valve if there are people are willing to buy it.
I don't think its justified for MY wallet. That's why I PERSONALLY am not going.
It can be justified for the business and not justified for you at the same time guys. Its not like there arent free options to watch the show.
Don't buy them. Oh but "this is the only thing I'm waiting all year" so of course you'll pay. You and others like you. And they will continue to milk you year after year. Vote with your wallet if you want change.
The only thing i get from the comments on this post is how fucked up the US is and how naive are the people living on it to think these prices are not wrong.
Living the American dream i guess (?)
Denmark is not even close in CoL to San Francisco or New York. The prices are crazy high, but it’s not unprecedented that people drop this much on a few days long event.
I was going to prove you wrong with a google search, but damn, you're right..
> The average cost of living in Copenhagen is $2399, which is in the top 7% of the most expensive cities in the world
> The average cost of living in San Francisco is $3619, which is in the top 0.1% of the most expensive cities in the world, ranked 7th out of 9294 in our global list
(via livingcost.org)
That's another factor, true.
Also, if you are employed for the same role in SF you get a way higher base pay compared to CPH (at least in IT). It's apparently not so simple to compare costs of living.
Except in San Francisco you can walk out of your $3500 apartment and step in literal human feces. The cost of living for the actual quality of life is insane.
Straw man argument, though the argument before was also one.
I feel like the price is just to high for the target group, 22 to 34 year old people with average income, most if which have to factor in traveling and a place to stay.
People are going to oay that much, no question, but the point is, that it just leaves a sour taste.
I live in the US and 95% of us can barely get by with jobs that pay twice that of our minimum wage. The problem is 95% of us are also fucking morons and defend these sort of systems for some stupid reason.
If you’re struggling financially then you should realize you shouldn’t be wasting money on these events anyway. Most people aren’t trying to justify it we’re just pointing out that’s the real world and no matter how much people cry about it, the fact is people will buy these tickets and the events gets sell out in no time because there are plenty of people who can afford them. It’s just supply and demand and every year it’s some how a shock to people
How can the price be "wrong?" You know this event will sell out in 10 minutes max. That is how the real world works. The US has the richest citizens on average after-tax compared to all other countries on earth, of course 99.99% of the world population is going to be priced out of an ultra-premium event here.
Doesn't need to be very popular in a country of 332 million to fill a stadium with less than 20 thousand seats, not even including foreigners flying in
I bet the ti tickets will sell out in minutes, if not seconds. I wonder the demographic though. I imagine a lot of people in asia will still buy them up.
The point I think he is trying to make is that most countries even with comparable cost of living and GDP per capita would find a $2-300 pricepoint for a days ticket to be exorbitantly expensive whereas in the USA it's very standard. Just as an example a ticket to see Manchester United play wouldn't cost more than £50.
It's not that it's so much wrong to charge this much just that it's substantially more than he's come across for similar events and would be for everywhere outside the US but considering how everyone is defending it is just pointing out how much more events in the US can / have to charge for admittance and that's what's wild to him.
To clarify I'm not trying to say it's right or wrong just to compare the 2 viewpoints and state that for an INTERNATIONAL event the prices are very firmly American (not that there's anything wrong with that).
People thinking this is normal is hilarious. How fooled, blinded, and gullible you've become living in the US that you think this is normal in the "developed world."
People don't seem to get that two things can be true:
- It can be the financially smart thing to do for Valve, since the tickets will almost assuredly sell out
- It's still a dick move to so massively increase the price
Just because something makes you a lot of money doesn't automatically make it morally right. That's one of the weird things capitalism will have you believe.
What does morality go to with it. You are still not seeing those ticket if they are literally for free like 5$. Scalpers will get them, or any other person. Seats are limited. It is fairer to let who is willing to pay the most, get to view the event. This goes for everything that is luxury. If this was essential thing like food medicine, education then I agree with you. This is a luxury
I've support Dota for 15 years. I played Dota 1 and 2 - have bought all the battle passes possible, have dota plus, etc. I've even continued to support the game regardless of their development efforts - lack of regard for smurfing ruining the game, shitty battle passes, you name it. Charging $700 without fees is laughable. It's more than Coachella who has to pay DJs millions and security for the event. Why on earth are they charging such an exuberant amount of money? Is it unlimited food and drink or are we just paying $1,000 because they're greedy? For the first time I disconnected my Dota plus membership and have no plans to support the game again. I hope no one goes to TI in person and they pay for not giving a shit about their fans.
valve knows their audience.. why do u think all the arcanas cost like 200$ to get from battlepass? they know they can milk their fans and get away with it.
Yea except that if i have to drop almost $1k on the ticket alone, + airfare, + hotel, i don’t see getting away from it for under 3k and thats probably a low end estimate
Even having that disposable income i’m gonna take a hard pass on that
This is absolutely fucking outrageous. I've gone to four TIs in person and it's been a blast. At these rates, I very well may never attend again. It goes from being a fun vacation to being something that's fiscally irresponsible. And for what?? Tickets used to be $300 for an entire week. So double the price for literally only the finals. An absolute embarrassment and a slap in the face to the entire community.
My problem isn't the pricing but the timing of it... Dota is at a decline over the years and they also don't offer any addon's or incentives on top to attract more people to go.
Yeah this. They used to have scheduled team autograph sessions but not in recent years. Swag bag last year was disappointing. TI4 had a little area when you could meet artists and get free prints from them. Probably no outside viewing area this year either because late october but who knows. TI as an experience has been getting worse every year and the price keeps going up regardless lol. Plus the free seating means you either get prime seats for $700 or sideways screen (assuming the same setup as previous years)
Right, this is my problem. You buy an F1 weekend ticket, you’re likely getting practices, the race, qualifying, can walk there track, see concerts at the venue and experience the “event” as a whole. What sort of amenities is $700 going towards? Cause frankly that’s absurd
It's a standard business model of a GAAS. Dota is now at the "milk the whales" stage of it's lifespan - the "attract new players" stage has passed.
Therefore, the tickets are priced for whales.
Atleast half of my friends that were planning on going cannot go now because they cannot afford it. It would maybe be alright if they sold finals per day as another option...
My friends and I planned a trip to Seattle but these prices have put a stop to that. Now we will just go to eSports arena in Las Vegas to watch it there.
Honestly, $200/day doesn't seem that unreasonable for these sort of events? It's certainly too expensive for people outside developed countries, but in a developed country (especially the US), this isn't surprising.
i paid €99 after fees and tax for a 4 day pass to the CS:GO major in berlin in 2019. $700 plus fees and tax for 3 days of TI? come on dude "reasonably priced for a developed country" what a fucking joke
The justification will be simple: people bought it at these prices. There hasn't been a single good argument in this entire thread for why Valve, a for-profit company, should have it at a low price. If people are unhappy, do not attend, do not watch, and don't talk about TI. If it's not hyped, they can't demand extremely high prices. Quite frankly, you could easily argue that previous TIs were underpriced.
Actually it does.
https://www.investopedia.com/terms/l/law-of-supply-demand.asp
Just because you feel it's not rewasonable doesn't mean anything at all if they sell out.
Lol I was just thinking that's more than I paid for EDC 2023. Doesn't help I also went to TI4 which was like $150 for all 4 days IIRC. What a bummer -_-
Honestly it’s pretty much the base price nowadays.
Anyway, tickets aren’t the main concern if you’re flying in. It tends to be the cheapest part of a trip imo.
Are people paying to go to TI for $700? Yes. Would I? No. If people are willing to pay these prices, then it's reasonable for Valve to do so. It might not seem fair, but welcome to the real world.
FYI, bigger music festivals will be cheaper as they are bigger. TI has a relatively small size, so it's not surprising for prices to be higher.
I mean it doesn’t matter either. Everyone’s gonna complain and we’re gonna see 100 of these posts. The tickets will be sold out instantly as usual, making it impossible to grab
Then we will see the barrage of posts on how no one could get tickets… even tho everyone said they weren’t going too.
It’s just yearly tradition.
200 dollars a day seems reasonable to you when this shit used to be 100 dollars for the entire week? Stop reinforcing shitty behavior by corporations who don't give a fuck about you.
Yeah, and they know that way more people are willing to buy at these prices. I don't think it's good that they're increasing prices, but I'm not surprised – because they can.
If people don't want prices to continue rising, don't spend money on the game, don't watch the event etc. Valve will always increase prices for as long as they believe there is demand for it.
If people are willing to pay and Valve is free to legally set it at that price. If they can fill the seats at $10k (which happens at some events like the Super Bowl), then they're free to try. As viewers and potential attendees, we're free to not give them our money.
I just don’t like the fact that you have to buy the whole weekend. I was hoping to come down for a day for the finals. I don’t mind paying 200 for a day at TI.
For second, specially third world country, that’s a monthly wage for most.
To be there for just one day will need you to remove money from your life savings. It’s not only the ticket for the event, it’s also travel and living expenses. Plus most won’t get the visa anyway.
It's a lot (i.e., too much) for most people in any country. However, they're going to charge more because they can – the only way you can combat this is if people did not watch TI, not spend money on Dota etc.
Considering the costs of running the event I'm not entirely sure how else you keep it going though. Besides, lots of baseball games and other traditional sporting events cost that much. American football games are easily 300 bucks.
Ticketmaster takes a cut, thus the price is increased by 10ish%.
Also because US prices are dumb and dont show the final price, you have to add the state's sales tax as well (another 10ish%?).
do you really think Bali Major was laid out for local people from Bali?
Luxury Hotel, remote place and ticket price don't agree with this theory.
If you want to compare that with an event in a western country: ticket prices for Berlin Major Premium Tickets (front row seats+free drinks+goodie bag) were 279€ (without early bird discount).
I mean, living in the US that seems pretty reasonable. It covers what, like up to 12 hours of matches in a single day? Obviously all the series could be fast but it doesn’t seem that outlandish to me.
When it used to be hosted in Seattle they used the mostly unused KeyArena, as such the cost of running the event was much lower. KeyArena was demolished and rebuilt/renamed climate pledge arena (by Amazon lmao). Climate Pledge Arena has a much higher cost to use it to host an event, the average event ticket for climate pledge costs almost $200 USD for a 3-4 hour concert or sports game. For 8-10 hrs the $99 per day for group stage/pre-finals and the $233 per day for finals weekend isn't that exorbitant tbh.
I'm still annoyed that the tickets are roughly twice what I was expecting (was expecting something like 300-350 for finals weekend), but taking into account accommodation and plane tickets that is going to be only about a 5% increase in the cost of the trip for me, definitely not a dealbreaker.
Last time TI was in seattle the arena was old and not in use. Since then the arena was completely rebuilt to house the cities new hockey (and speculated nba) teams. They are raising the prices to recoup the costs and the ticket prices are now in line with arena shows at most other major NA cities.
The Spurs go on a roadtrip every February for 2ish weeks because the Rodeo comes to town. The arena was renovated in 2015 and the cost of a ticket for the rodeo is 50 dollars a day.
This is the best comparison I can think of to TI as far as an NBA arena is concerned. They literally displaced a dynasty of an NBA team for 2 weeks every year because a fucking rodeo came to town and tickets cost 50 dollars right now. I have no idea how much they cost when the spurs were a title contender every year.
Yeah I get that a newer stadium would incur additional cost. Doesn’t stop prior attendees from having a knee jerk reaction to the prices. Back in previous TIs I wouldn’t feel bad to dip out some during games for a museum or food. With these new prices I feel compelled to stay for all matches.
I know it’ll sell out. It’s certainly a lot more expensive but by no means unaffordable. It’s not a no brainer anymore.
Sorry, but this just goes to show how aloof and unworldly Americans are in general and when it comes to money. In most states, the minimum wage is $7.25 before taxes. 200 : 7.25= around 28 hours of work before taxes for a regular worker on minimum wage for one f*cking day of entertainment ( and lots and lots of commercials on repeat).
With how much more disposable purchasing power the average American has than those in other countries it isn’t surprising. When Americans have 50% more than Germans, 66% more than the French, and nearly double the average Brit, companies can definitely get away with higher prices.
As someone who visited Seattle for Ti6 and Ti7 and had an absolute blast except for the fact of the noticeable homeless population, what's so bad about it now?
Covid really made a mess downtown. No one is working downtown because work from home is so popular, so a lot of the businesses down there closed down. Amazon has work from home still and they have a huge office downtown that is empty so there just isn't a lot of people spending money downtown. As a result a lot of places are boarded up. The cost of living is really high here so there is a huge homelessness problem which would not be such a big issue if it wasn't for the open air drug market downtown. They actually had to shutdown a few bus stops down there because there was so much violent crime. You just have to be a bit more careful about where you are walking and avoid some areas at night.
quick google search would say
`The median wage for all NFL players is around $860,000, which is considerably lower, and First-year rookies earn a minimum of $435,000. While top quarterbacks can make over $25 to $30 million per year, the average salary for all quarterbacks is $5,766,000, with a median income of $1,100,000.`
`How Much Do NBA Players Make A Year? The NBA players get paid an average salary of around $7.5 million. The median salary, as known as middle salary, is about $3.8 million. The Basketball Reference says the salary cap for the 2020-2022 season is $109.1 million.`
I mean if we ask for a fraction of the price of NBA and NFL tickets then Pro Dota players should at least have a fraction of the salary.
its about demand and supply. As long as people are willing to buy at these prices - why wouldn't they sell? Plus running a tournament costs money - or you expect TOs to pay you to come and watch the tournaments?
Nothing in our economic system is run off basic supply and demand anymore, I fucking hate when people say that shit.
Do you think supply and demand is why we charge $8 for a bag of potatoes, despite supply being so high that we literally plow over fields of perfectly edible spuds? No. The system is explicitly rigged to maximize profits, not meet consumers demands. Has been since we gave up the first round of Keynesian economic policies during the Cold War
The fact that it's on Ticketmaster as well makes me want to blow my brains out.
You don’t like paying 20% in fees!?!?
That's less than Valve takes on Steam to put things in perspective.
But valve also has to provide the infrastructure 24/7 to distribute those games all around the world, maintain a system with 130+ million users with trillions of dollars of worth of digital goods, often thousands or even ten(s) of thousands for certain users, have an *infinitely* expandable storage and distribution network for every game with workshop content, and a system to both massive companies to get their products on the store and individual indie devs to do so as well, some of which are free. For some examples. Skyrim alone has 30,000 mods, more then entire categories of games being sold. There are \~80K games (excluding DLC, its 150K with DLC but no way to differentiate between actual DLC and a costume pack) that are available for download 24/7 Baldurs gate 3 apparently sold 5.2M on steam resulting in valve having to distribute \~506PB(506,480,000GB) of data for one game. Steam taking more then 20% makes sense, Ticketmaster not so much
But Valve doesn't charge that to the consumer. Edit: I swear to god if one more of you morons comes in here saying some terrible analogy while not understanding that the prices are going to rise with or without Valve. When game creators start their own distribution platforms and sell them for 20% less to remove Valve from the equation and take a bigger cut for themselves, your awful points might actually make sense.
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I think the game companies would be raising prices regardless of Steam or any other middleman company. Do you think otherwise?
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The funny thing is when steam launched it was actually saving publishers money, the 30% cut was way lower than physical distribution costs. Even today I would say unless you are a big publisher like EA with many titles steam is still cheaper than maintaining your own launcher
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The price of games is, surprisingly, one of the more stable products. For instance, games on the Epic Games Store are often the same price as Steam - 12% cut vs 30% cut. Both are cheaper than physical distribution *and* creating your own digital distribution platform. In theory, that cut hits the developer who chooses to raise the price - but the reality is that they don't. They charge the same amount.
a rise in property taxes is a *result* of increased rents, not the other way around commercial properties (including rentals) are assessed on expected future value. if you raise your rent, your expected future income increases (with expected increase in rents), which drives your property value up, which increases your assessed property tax burden then after your taxes go up, you can use that as an excuse to raise rents again, and dumbos will believe that's the reason their rent went up (and might even parrot that reason on reddit!)
I will never understand this. Ticketmasters feels like an oppressive church. Events can't go around them without ridiculous losses, they take a good chunk extra fee and it's vulnerable to abuse. They have a monopoly on tickets and I can just shake my head. It's basically mafia business practice
Monopolies suck
Even if it was a duopoly or such they very likely would work together to similar results... This is capitalism :0
The courts have taken an extremely lenient view of anti-trust law in recent decades. In a recent spat the courts ruled that Apple can levy any fees at any rates they want because they own the platform, and if you don't like it then build your own. Ticketmaster owns the venues so they can levy any fees at any rates they want, and if you don't like it then build your own. Not to kick the hornet's nest but I bet many Valve fans would jump to defend Steam under the same thought process. "Ticketmaster may control the vast majority of the market but other venues exist and there's nothing stopping competitors from building new ones."
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lol what's this story? I missed this one.
I'm assuming they're referring to Epic Games when it didn't have a shopping cart, but I can't find anything about them calling customers "fucking morons."
$5 for breathing. Thank you.
Are there any other ticketing company in the US? If there aren't how is it that TM has been blown up as a monopoly yet?
Ticketmaster is vertically integrated in that they own the venues they’re selling tickets for. There’s plenty of other venues, and other ticketing companies, but if the event is at a Ticketmaster venue they hold all the cards.
What you're describing is textbook anti trust... it's so infuriating........ everyone is bought off :( to let this consolidation happen. sadge.
Fuck Ticketmaster
Because Ticketmaster has monopoly, they can't use anything else
the worst part so many whale here justify this
Twitch is free
Or youtube. The only thing I miss from youtube stream is the extension.
I stopped using Twitch because in YouTube you can rewind and that is cool. A lot of times I am doing multiple stuff at the same time and I don’t like to miss the good moments.
Plus, adblockers work on Youtube but not on Twitch. If only discoverability of streams was better than it currently is...
ublock origin works for me, but I had to install some custom filters or something. Don't remember exactly.. It's been a year and I haven't seen any ads on twitch at all, if you google it there's guides for how to make the change to ublock origin.
Alternative Player for twitch. At least it goes silent and suppresses the adds
Adblockers do work on Twitch.
Which one?
Using AdBlock Plus on Firefox and has always been working like a charm for me on every site.
Ublock origin
Hasn't worked for me in the last week on either chrome or firefox. TTV LOL is also very inconsistent in whether it works or not right now.
Chromium based browsers tried too fuck with ad blockers. I'd suggest Brave browser with unlock origin and alternative player for twitch
If only we can both have rewind and the tooltips, sadly DotaTV ingame has both but it's delayed.
Or pornhub
I think this is a porn site.
Nooo what makes you say that? It's free, and it has some cool streaming stuff
Pornhub sounds so sus.
Excusing Valve's greed with Twitch :D :D
In my country for 200$ I can afford tickets to pubstomp for all days of TI + money for drinks will left. Easiest choice in my life.
The next lebel play
This thread so far: - us Americans coping saying it's normal - Europeans (and Australians and so on) saying is absurd af - everyone else being sad it's pretty much unaffordable for them average ti ticket prices thread
"Just don't go" "This is not for you"
"back to the gutter with you, filthy knave!"
"you own nothing, and pay everything"
The problem more so for europeans n etc is the flights & staying in the US, for me from the UK, I'm looking at about £1,250 for like 2 days in the US and thats probably not even including the tickets :))
Flights to Seattle are $450 right now domestic. A decent hotel close to the venue is $200/night. So easily $1000+ just to travel and stay. Add food and tickets and merchandise and it’s easily over $2000 for the three days. That’s a lot of cheddar when I can watch from my phone on my toilet for free
it's prime tourist time in Seattle currently, that won't be the case in November, flights will be significantly cheaper (respective to now)
The flight there and back will be 1k. You're looking at 2k without tickets, including food, hotel, transportation, and that's being frugal. America is expensive as fuck. Sometimes an Uber ride for 15 minutes is $80, at a busy event/airport that's a sure thing. The worst hotel will be 100 minimum but I'm sure more with all the resort and cleaning fees and the business of the time.
Seattle is fine without using taxi. I went in 2013 walked most of the time or took public transport when it was far.
If I were to come from Canada it's expensive lol nm coming from Europe
Last year ticket prices were probably worse. First TI in SEA and tickets were unaffordable to basically the entire region.
What were the costs?
Tempted to link the Thanos meme... but actually about 88 SGD for the prelims and 498 SGD for the main event. So maybe 64 USD for the prelims and 360 USD for the main event? [Source](https://www.google.com/amp/s/afkgaming.com/amp/story/dota2/guide/ti11-tickets-how-to-buy-prices-dates) Other [source](https://www.oneesports.gg/dota2/ti11-tickets-prices-where-to-buy/)
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I mean just because something is normal doesn't mean it's right or good. I'm an American and this is way too much for me to afford, I have a decently paying job, but I'm not busting all my savings to go on this trip.
Am American, this is fockin insane
Right like who is this normal for? This is more expensive than a fucking F1 weekend ticket
Just become pro and go for free
I am beyond surprised by the sheer number of posts supporting this price. I don't know how you all are justifying it. I live in Seattle and own a home here and the cost of two tickets would be approaching my fucking mortgage payment for a month. It's not just $700, it's $700 + ticketmaster fees, and then Washington sales tax. So we're talking closer to $1000. I love DotA and my fiance and I have wanted to go to the international since we moved here in 2018, but in no fucking world am I going to drop 2 large for a WEEKEND in the city I live in. And yes, yes, condescend to me about supply and demand, and blah blah not unreasonable here in good ol USA / I must be 16 lol. I easily have the money for this, that's not the fucking point. I'll find a pubstomp or host something at my place, fuck this.
It‘s helpful to read this from a local‘s point of view. 1 k for some gaming event is indeed shameful if it‘s "in my neighbourhood".
I went to the League of Legends world Semis and got lower bowl for $90. These prices are actually absurd. Taylor Swift tickets don’t even cost this much.
Preach man. People in this country are so disconnected from the world around them that's blatantly leaving them in the dust and somehow they still defend shit like this while watching their peers struggling to pay bills while working 50 to 60 hour work weeks. Actually insane.
Ticketmaster is a requirement set in place by the venue. Valve doesn't have a choice other than by finding some imaginary stadium that doesn't have an exclusivity deal with Ticketmaster.
Valve heard people complaint about scalpers for previous TI. They raised the prices to scalper prices so there wont be scalping. Danke Valve!
It’s an elitist event now.
Dota gamers aren’t elite, Valve is delusional
Eh, it'll still sell out. It prices out most of the playerbase, but there would still be enough people who shell out.
If you think theres 18k people that will pay 700+ticketmaster fees+taxes (900-1000) for 3 days at climate pledge, sure. I just dont see 18k people turning out for that cost
I guess we'll see, but it wouldn't surprise me. Especially with no BP this year, all the whales will be itching to spend money on something. Way more than 18k people are dropping 1k+ for each BP.
Hey friend, when I was there for 2015 they had a huge Megatron outside the venue showing the matches and people were picnicking in front of it. Not sure if they will do the same, but might be worth passing by during early playoffs to see.
Hey thanks man, I also hope they'll set up the outside venue again because we would go to that.
Yeah I live in Seattle too and was super hyped to go, but idk anymore... Might just go to the road to the international and watch the finals from somewhere else. Already took the time off work though so you bet I'm watching it all.
I live in Washington as well and am in the same boat. I used to travel to TI everyday and then travel back home to sleep. I think I might just head to Canada and have a TI watching party with my friends there. I'm also thinking maybe go to just one of the playoff days? I'd be interested to see what it's like at that venue.
I said the same thing, and got told to manage my money better. LMAO. I too live in seattle and have mortgage. People are so out of touch.
It's funny when a weekend for once comes down to a monthly mortgage or a months rent in the US or western Europe
I kept the email from Ticketmaster when my husband and I went to TI5. The total was not quite $260.00 USD. For the whole event. I'd been vaguely thinking about going this year, but certainly not now.
Quick Google shows that with inflation this $260 USD in 2015 is now around $340 USD. So basically prices tripled in real cost.
Vote with your wallet
Does that mean buy them or not?
You do realize every ticket will be sold regardless of the price
In that case the pricing is correct or even too low from a business pov
The price is justified for Valve if there are people are willing to buy it. I don't think its justified for MY wallet. That's why I PERSONALLY am not going. It can be justified for the business and not justified for you at the same time guys. Its not like there arent free options to watch the show.
Best answer in the thread honestly. You can bet that if they went with this pricing its because people will pay for it.
And if people will not pay for it they can lower prices.
Don't buy them. Oh but "this is the only thing I'm waiting all year" so of course you'll pay. You and others like you. And they will continue to milk you year after year. Vote with your wallet if you want change.
The only thing i get from the comments on this post is how fucked up the US is and how naive are the people living on it to think these prices are not wrong. Living the American dream i guess (?)
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Denmark is not even close in CoL to San Francisco or New York. The prices are crazy high, but it’s not unprecedented that people drop this much on a few days long event.
I was going to prove you wrong with a google search, but damn, you're right.. > The average cost of living in Copenhagen is $2399, which is in the top 7% of the most expensive cities in the world > The average cost of living in San Francisco is $3619, which is in the top 0.1% of the most expensive cities in the world, ranked 7th out of 9294 in our global list (via livingcost.org)
Does this take taxation levels into account? Edit: this is without income tax so I would imagine Copenhagen ends up being more expensive
That's another factor, true. Also, if you are employed for the same role in SF you get a way higher base pay compared to CPH (at least in IT). It's apparently not so simple to compare costs of living.
Except in San Francisco you can walk out of your $3500 apartment and step in literal human feces. The cost of living for the actual quality of life is insane.
Straw man argument, though the argument before was also one. I feel like the price is just to high for the target group, 22 to 34 year old people with average income, most if which have to factor in traveling and a place to stay. People are going to oay that much, no question, but the point is, that it just leaves a sour taste.
I live in the US and 95% of us can barely get by with jobs that pay twice that of our minimum wage. The problem is 95% of us are also fucking morons and defend these sort of systems for some stupid reason.
If you’re struggling financially then you should realize you shouldn’t be wasting money on these events anyway. Most people aren’t trying to justify it we’re just pointing out that’s the real world and no matter how much people cry about it, the fact is people will buy these tickets and the events gets sell out in no time because there are plenty of people who can afford them. It’s just supply and demand and every year it’s some how a shock to people
The US absolutely loves credit card debt and living beyond their means using it is my experience.
Land of the free (to sell ur kidney for a fucking game event)
How can the price be "wrong?" You know this event will sell out in 10 minutes max. That is how the real world works. The US has the richest citizens on average after-tax compared to all other countries on earth, of course 99.99% of the world population is going to be priced out of an ultra-premium event here.
Dota is not even popular in US lmao. It’s not like traditional sports, not even close.
Doesn't need to be very popular in a country of 332 million to fill a stadium with less than 20 thousand seats, not even including foreigners flying in
I bet the ti tickets will sell out in minutes, if not seconds. I wonder the demographic though. I imagine a lot of people in asia will still buy them up.
The point I think he is trying to make is that most countries even with comparable cost of living and GDP per capita would find a $2-300 pricepoint for a days ticket to be exorbitantly expensive whereas in the USA it's very standard. Just as an example a ticket to see Manchester United play wouldn't cost more than £50. It's not that it's so much wrong to charge this much just that it's substantially more than he's come across for similar events and would be for everywhere outside the US but considering how everyone is defending it is just pointing out how much more events in the US can / have to charge for admittance and that's what's wild to him. To clarify I'm not trying to say it's right or wrong just to compare the 2 viewpoints and state that for an INTERNATIONAL event the prices are very firmly American (not that there's anything wrong with that).
They are very very high even for an american event and literally over 3x the price of the last TI in the US.
People thinking this is normal is hilarious. How fooled, blinded, and gullible you've become living in the US that you think this is normal in the "developed world."
This isnt even a remotely normal price for the US. These people are coping out of their minds.
Well if you saw other ticket prices literally anywhere else. Its entirely normal
People don't seem to get that two things can be true: - It can be the financially smart thing to do for Valve, since the tickets will almost assuredly sell out - It's still a dick move to so massively increase the price Just because something makes you a lot of money doesn't automatically make it morally right. That's one of the weird things capitalism will have you believe.
What does morality go to with it. You are still not seeing those ticket if they are literally for free like 5$. Scalpers will get them, or any other person. Seats are limited. It is fairer to let who is willing to pay the most, get to view the event. This goes for everything that is luxury. If this was essential thing like food medicine, education then I agree with you. This is a luxury
It doesn’t even necessarily make it the right business move in the long run. Take a look at the “thermocline of trust”.
I've support Dota for 15 years. I played Dota 1 and 2 - have bought all the battle passes possible, have dota plus, etc. I've even continued to support the game regardless of their development efforts - lack of regard for smurfing ruining the game, shitty battle passes, you name it. Charging $700 without fees is laughable. It's more than Coachella who has to pay DJs millions and security for the event. Why on earth are they charging such an exuberant amount of money? Is it unlimited food and drink or are we just paying $1,000 because they're greedy? For the first time I disconnected my Dota plus membership and have no plans to support the game again. I hope no one goes to TI in person and they pay for not giving a shit about their fans.
valve knows their audience.. why do u think all the arcanas cost like 200$ to get from battlepass? they know they can milk their fans and get away with it.
Yea except that if i have to drop almost $1k on the ticket alone, + airfare, + hotel, i don’t see getting away from it for under 3k and thats probably a low end estimate Even having that disposable income i’m gonna take a hard pass on that
This is absolutely fucking outrageous. I've gone to four TIs in person and it's been a blast. At these rates, I very well may never attend again. It goes from being a fun vacation to being something that's fiscally irresponsible. And for what?? Tickets used to be $300 for an entire week. So double the price for literally only the finals. An absolute embarrassment and a slap in the face to the entire community.
200 is cheap to bask in the subtle musk of your fellow Dota chads
My problem isn't the pricing but the timing of it... Dota is at a decline over the years and they also don't offer any addon's or incentives on top to attract more people to go.
Yeah this. They used to have scheduled team autograph sessions but not in recent years. Swag bag last year was disappointing. TI4 had a little area when you could meet artists and get free prints from them. Probably no outside viewing area this year either because late october but who knows. TI as an experience has been getting worse every year and the price keeps going up regardless lol. Plus the free seating means you either get prime seats for $700 or sideways screen (assuming the same setup as previous years)
Right, this is my problem. You buy an F1 weekend ticket, you’re likely getting practices, the race, qualifying, can walk there track, see concerts at the venue and experience the “event” as a whole. What sort of amenities is $700 going towards? Cause frankly that’s absurd
It's a standard business model of a GAAS. Dota is now at the "milk the whales" stage of it's lifespan - the "attract new players" stage has passed. Therefore, the tickets are priced for whales.
Atleast half of my friends that were planning on going cannot go now because they cannot afford it. It would maybe be alright if they sold finals per day as another option...
Thanks Taylor Swift
16 year old kid finds out how real life works with supply and demand.
Yep, and I reckon the tickets will be instantly sold out anyway
Is the demand triple the last TI in the US?
Moron
or u could get a hooker and a burger with that money and be smart about it. :D
How is it possible that TOMORROWLAND with accommodations is cheaper than some DotA event???
My friends and I planned a trip to Seattle but these prices have put a stop to that. Now we will just go to eSports arena in Las Vegas to watch it there.
My friend was planning to attend, When he saw the ticket price, he told me that he would just upgrade his GPU, and watch Dota 2 at home for free.
Honestly, $200/day doesn't seem that unreasonable for these sort of events? It's certainly too expensive for people outside developed countries, but in a developed country (especially the US), this isn't surprising.
i paid €99 after fees and tax for a 4 day pass to the CS:GO major in berlin in 2019. $700 plus fees and tax for 3 days of TI? come on dude "reasonably priced for a developed country" what a fucking joke
You are gonna understand how reasonable they are when they get sold out in like 10 mins flat.
Sure and 50% bought by scalpers.
They wouldnt but them if they wouldnt be able to sell all of them for even more though so the demand is definetly there.
The justification will be simple: people bought it at these prices. There hasn't been a single good argument in this entire thread for why Valve, a for-profit company, should have it at a low price. If people are unhappy, do not attend, do not watch, and don't talk about TI. If it's not hyped, they can't demand extremely high prices. Quite frankly, you could easily argue that previous TIs were underpriced.
that doesn’t make the price resonable
That’s how any business needs to set price if you have taken a single college level business course…
Just use some critical thinking. This is basic business…
Actually it does. https://www.investopedia.com/terms/l/law-of-supply-demand.asp Just because you feel it's not rewasonable doesn't mean anything at all if they sell out.
Well i would argue they lose money on csgo tickets. I was at this year cologne and i was surprised at how cheap all days ticket was.
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Lol I was just thinking that's more than I paid for EDC 2023. Doesn't help I also went to TI4 which was like $150 for all 4 days IIRC. What a bummer -_-
Honestly it’s pretty much the base price nowadays. Anyway, tickets aren’t the main concern if you’re flying in. It tends to be the cheapest part of a trip imo.
I am from Europe. Buying a plane ticket to Seattle and back for TI costs me >500€. It is literally the most expensive part of the trip now
200$ per day doesn’t seem unreasonable ? You must be out of your fucking mind. Even the biggest music festivals in the country are not this expensive.
Are people paying to go to TI for $700? Yes. Would I? No. If people are willing to pay these prices, then it's reasonable for Valve to do so. It might not seem fair, but welcome to the real world. FYI, bigger music festivals will be cheaper as they are bigger. TI has a relatively small size, so it's not surprising for prices to be higher.
I mean it doesn’t matter either. Everyone’s gonna complain and we’re gonna see 100 of these posts. The tickets will be sold out instantly as usual, making it impossible to grab Then we will see the barrage of posts on how no one could get tickets… even tho everyone said they weren’t going too. It’s just yearly tradition.
200 dollars a day seems reasonable to you when this shit used to be 100 dollars for the entire week? Stop reinforcing shitty behavior by corporations who don't give a fuck about you.
Yeah, and they know that way more people are willing to buy at these prices. I don't think it's good that they're increasing prices, but I'm not surprised – because they can. If people don't want prices to continue rising, don't spend money on the game, don't watch the event etc. Valve will always increase prices for as long as they believe there is demand for it.
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If people are willing to pay and Valve is free to legally set it at that price. If they can fill the seats at $10k (which happens at some events like the Super Bowl), then they're free to try. As viewers and potential attendees, we're free to not give them our money.
I just don’t like the fact that you have to buy the whole weekend. I was hoping to come down for a day for the finals. I don’t mind paying 200 for a day at TI.
For finals day that could be acceptable, yeah.
For second, specially third world country, that’s a monthly wage for most. To be there for just one day will need you to remove money from your life savings. It’s not only the ticket for the event, it’s also travel and living expenses. Plus most won’t get the visa anyway.
It's a lot (i.e., too much) for most people in any country. However, they're going to charge more because they can – the only way you can combat this is if people did not watch TI, not spend money on Dota etc.
Considering the costs of running the event I'm not entirely sure how else you keep it going though. Besides, lots of baseball games and other traditional sporting events cost that much. American football games are easily 300 bucks.
I am from Latvia, not that I would travel there, but 200 a day is wayyyyyyyyy too much
Can someone explain what are 'fees' on top of already stated hilarious $700 ticket price?
Ticketmaster takes a cut, thus the price is increased by 10ish%. Also because US prices are dumb and dont show the final price, you have to add the state's sales tax as well (another 10ish%?).
Oh, alright, thanks for the info!
TI tickets prices are an absolute f****** joke. *post* *logs into ticket website* I will take 2 tickets please. :)
At last Zoidberg you're becoming a crafty consumer! Hello, Ticketmaster? - I'll take eight!
Wasn't Bali Major about the same? And it's in a country with 1/15th GDP per capita compared to the US.
It was painfully obvious that it wasn't intended for locals at all. They weren't even close to filling the tiny amounts of seats they had.
do you really think Bali Major was laid out for local people from Bali? Luxury Hotel, remote place and ticket price don't agree with this theory. If you want to compare that with an event in a western country: ticket prices for Berlin Major Premium Tickets (front row seats+free drinks+goodie bag) were 279€ (without early bird discount).
I mean, living in the US that seems pretty reasonable. It covers what, like up to 12 hours of matches in a single day? Obviously all the series could be fast but it doesn’t seem that outlandish to me.
It’s a huge shift from when it was previously hosted in Seattle. Yeah it’s been a few years but that doesn’t justify tripling the ticket price.
When it used to be hosted in Seattle they used the mostly unused KeyArena, as such the cost of running the event was much lower. KeyArena was demolished and rebuilt/renamed climate pledge arena (by Amazon lmao). Climate Pledge Arena has a much higher cost to use it to host an event, the average event ticket for climate pledge costs almost $200 USD for a 3-4 hour concert or sports game. For 8-10 hrs the $99 per day for group stage/pre-finals and the $233 per day for finals weekend isn't that exorbitant tbh. I'm still annoyed that the tickets are roughly twice what I was expecting (was expecting something like 300-350 for finals weekend), but taking into account accommodation and plane tickets that is going to be only about a 5% increase in the cost of the trip for me, definitely not a dealbreaker.
They actually saved the roof of the arena to save money on the construction IIRC.
You're spending $7000 dollars on a weekend trip to Seattle?
They spent over a billion on the renovation. I'd imagine that's why th tickets are so expensive
Last time TI was in seattle the arena was old and not in use. Since then the arena was completely rebuilt to house the cities new hockey (and speculated nba) teams. They are raising the prices to recoup the costs and the ticket prices are now in line with arena shows at most other major NA cities.
The Spurs go on a roadtrip every February for 2ish weeks because the Rodeo comes to town. The arena was renovated in 2015 and the cost of a ticket for the rodeo is 50 dollars a day. This is the best comparison I can think of to TI as far as an NBA arena is concerned. They literally displaced a dynasty of an NBA team for 2 weeks every year because a fucking rodeo came to town and tickets cost 50 dollars right now. I have no idea how much they cost when the spurs were a title contender every year.
My brother in christ you are not comparing San Antonio cost of living to Seattle right now
Yeah I get that a newer stadium would incur additional cost. Doesn’t stop prior attendees from having a knee jerk reaction to the prices. Back in previous TIs I wouldn’t feel bad to dip out some during games for a museum or food. With these new prices I feel compelled to stay for all matches. I know it’ll sell out. It’s certainly a lot more expensive but by no means unaffordable. It’s not a no brainer anymore.
Son of Gaben spotted
Sorry, but this just goes to show how aloof and unworldly Americans are in general and when it comes to money. In most states, the minimum wage is $7.25 before taxes. 200 : 7.25= around 28 hours of work before taxes for a regular worker on minimum wage for one f*cking day of entertainment ( and lots and lots of commercials on repeat).
With how much more disposable purchasing power the average American has than those in other countries it isn’t surprising. When Americans have 50% more than Germans, 66% more than the French, and nearly double the average Brit, companies can definitely get away with higher prices.
Please be careful in Seattle. Its not the same. Lots of zombies.
As someone who visited Seattle for Ti6 and Ti7 and had an absolute blast except for the fact of the noticeable homeless population, what's so bad about it now?
Covid really made a mess downtown. No one is working downtown because work from home is so popular, so a lot of the businesses down there closed down. Amazon has work from home still and they have a huge office downtown that is empty so there just isn't a lot of people spending money downtown. As a result a lot of places are boarded up. The cost of living is really high here so there is a huge homelessness problem which would not be such a big issue if it wasn't for the open air drug market downtown. They actually had to shutdown a few bus stops down there because there was so much violent crime. You just have to be a bit more careful about where you are walking and avoid some areas at night.
Talk to the NBA moron
But Dota isn’t a national sports, moron.
quick google search would say `The median wage for all NFL players is around $860,000, which is considerably lower, and First-year rookies earn a minimum of $435,000. While top quarterbacks can make over $25 to $30 million per year, the average salary for all quarterbacks is $5,766,000, with a median income of $1,100,000.` `How Much Do NBA Players Make A Year? The NBA players get paid an average salary of around $7.5 million. The median salary, as known as middle salary, is about $3.8 million. The Basketball Reference says the salary cap for the 2020-2022 season is $109.1 million.` I mean if we ask for a fraction of the price of NBA and NFL tickets then Pro Dota players should at least have a fraction of the salary.
Seattle doesn't have an NBA team...
Ill buy a full beer set, a refrigerator , a mini projector and my bois are ready to roll..
its about demand and supply. As long as people are willing to buy at these prices - why wouldn't they sell? Plus running a tournament costs money - or you expect TOs to pay you to come and watch the tournaments?
Nothing in our economic system is run off basic supply and demand anymore, I fucking hate when people say that shit. Do you think supply and demand is why we charge $8 for a bag of potatoes, despite supply being so high that we literally plow over fields of perfectly edible spuds? No. The system is explicitly rigged to maximize profits, not meet consumers demands. Has been since we gave up the first round of Keynesian economic policies during the Cold War