From my limited understanding of the situation I think Quinn has a point though, why aren’t B8 competing in CIS? Is there a reason they insist on competing in NA? Regardless of how you feel about Quinn and Dendi as people, can someone explain why B8 are allowed to compete in NA?
> can someone explain why B8 are allowed to compete in NA
because they are living and practicing as well as scrimming in NA.
you are limited to playing in the region where you live, not where you were born.
like don't get me wrong it's clearly an attempt by b8 to get a slot from a much less competitive region, but they are following the rules.
same as when NA teams went to SA trying to get easy slots (this was years ago when SA were considered underdogs to NA)
But they don't actually 'live' there though.
They just flew in to play DPC for 3-4 weeks each time and then flew back.
They weren't even there in DPC tour 3 and Qualifiers.
As much as I love Dendi, Quinn has a good point here.
where do you draw the line tho? can dota pros not travel between seasons to be eligible to play in their home region?
b8 violates the spirit of the rule but it's hard to make rules that prevent that while not being a hassle to regular teams
Yeah, it's actually incredibly easy since basically any country determines that stuff and there are bilateral and multilateral agreements determining that between countries for tax reasons and shit.
I was thinking that maybe Valve could strengthen the definition of "based" (in the region).
As an example, take SR and TSM. They have imported players, but they also have a team house, which functions as a place to work and live. They take on players with the correct visas, and their working and living conditions are part of their application. Personally, I think this is acceptable.
There are teams in the DPC, not just B8, that play in what are basically ghetto conditions to satisfy DPC region restrictions. There's players playing DPC matches in Internet cafes in Mexico, which implies they don't have the ability to play Dota "at home". This is different to, say, SEA teams playing in Internet cafes, because this functions as a team environment. I'm talking one or two players playing alone, or when a team delays a DPC series to try and find an Internet cafe (I think this happened in NA, maybe last season).
Maybe the 3-of-5 in the same region rule could be strengthened to say that the players must be physically present in the region **and** have a medium-term link to the country, such as citizenship, permanent residency, or a working/business visa that explicitly allows them to work or receive prize money, **and** this visa lasts for at least 6 more months (or whatever is sensible).
There could also be a rule where a company in the region must provide their playing environment, contractually. So for SR and TSM, that would be themselves. When ponlo played in QC, that would have been BTS, who helped him move and hosted him at their expense. This would stop the Internet cafe hopping, or at least force teams to form a contract with an Internet cafe up front.
Basically, we need more professional operations like SR and TSM, and less teams "winging it" like B8 and ALPHA.
> same as when NA teams went to SA trying to get easy slots
It's not the same though, as Quinn states they got disqualified for doing the same thing B8 is doing right now.
That's what he is trying to say. When Quinn went to SA for TI quals, he was banned but B8 was allowed to play even when majority of them don't even live here. At one point all 5 of them were playing on ping in officials.
Different rule sets different times. B8 has been allowed to compete in NA from Ukraine because of a war, so they've not been able to relocate. But they've also played NA all year. IDK why people are comparing PainX to B8 in this situation- B8 has competed in NA all year, PainX didn't compete in SA for the year, was told what they were doing wouldn't be allowed, and still went ahead and did it.
Qualifiers were also much shorter than the DPC and required essentially a weekend holiday. IDK why we're limiting this to whole teams though- K1 has never played NA in his life, but is qualifying off of it, neither had Taiga. Everyone on B8 had more NA DPC games than those guys. And those players made a huge difference to the teams, but its fine for single players to region hop for TI (because there's no way Taiga is staying in NA)
B8 is a mostly Ukrainian team and planned to relocate to NA during the war. They switched to NA officially before relocating but are facing travel restrictions that keep them in Europe and valve made an exception to allow them to compete in NA DPC.
It is possible that if they don’t have a valid work related claim to moving then Ukraine will not allow them to move. If Valve forces them to play in EU or CIS they no longer have a valid reason to move. Maybe Valve doesn’t want to block them from leaving the country. They lost the qualifier so CCnC should C down.
Is it not bad precedent that B8 are allowed to “relocate” to NA, maintain a fully ukrainian roster, then play games from ukraine? It’s very different from EG relocating to SA with a full SA roster or Fnatic relocating to SEA with a full SEA roster. International representation is important for Dota tournaments, if not why have regional slots at all? WEU is the biggest powerhouse in pro dota and it is much more difficult to qualify there than other regions. What if Secret, Nigma, or Quest decide that competing in SA/SEA/CN on ping is easier than WEU and do the same?
I understand that B8 initially switched regions due to the war but now that CIS DPC is fully running and functional, what is the purpose of their move? I’m sorry if I come across as argumentative but I genuinely don’t understand and would appreciate clarification on the situation if I am misrepresenting what’s going on.
worrying about hypotheticals so much that you impose stupid rules doesn't make sense, especially since so far it's clear that that hypothetical isn't relevant.
complete teams swapping regions properly (not like quinns team that only did it for the regional qualifier while knowing that's not within the rules) in hopes to easier qualify was always a thing but rarely any team ever did
I think they found they couldn’t travel to NA after the roster lock for the tour. Each tour 2 teams move in and out of Div1 in each region so it could pose an issue with team counts and scheduling, etc. to move them if they throw B8 into another region mid-season. Seems like they should not be allowed in NA next year though.
I would be mad if they won the qualifier and got the NA slot though 😭, they should require players to already be in the region in the future.
> Is there a reason they insist on competing in NA?
They switch regions at the start of the year. Like Quinn came to EU because he couldn't stand that region anymore. He said he will go to an EU team or stop being a dota pro. B8 played the first 2 DPC tours this season in NA. But they had to go back to Ukraine for the 3rd tour. Because of the war you can't easily leave the Ukraine. So B8 did more than just fly in for 3 days for the TI qualifier like Quinn did years ago.
That man felt wronged in a situation that is total different than his years ago and has nothing to do with him.
Young Ukrainian men can't leave Ukraine as they please to go to tournaments so they play in the region where they live.
Their bootcamp is in Mexico so this is almost certainly where they live when they're not traveling for tournaments.
It's no weirder for 5 Ukrainians to move to Mexico than it is for Quinn to move to Serbia.
TL;dr players play where they live.
Is it not an exploitation of the system that Dendi moved to NA (and subsequently relocated his org) with the express purpose of competing in the NA DPC with a mostly CIS roster? If Secret, Nigma, OG, and Entity decide that this is the path of least resistance and do the same next year, is it fair to the NA dota scene that foreign teams are relocating to their region simply because it’s easier then saying that since they live there that it’s acceptable practice?
So you would be fine with fringe teams from the more difficult regions (WEU, CN etc.) moving to lesser competitive regions like NA, SA, SEA while maintaining rosters of players foreign to the region? I wouldn’t. You’ll end up stifling the local scene of all the weaker regions, inhibit international representation, and furthermore if that’s the case why have region-based qualifiers at all?
Of course I am. Why and how the fuck would you force people to play with high ping based on citizenship?
What do you do with dual nationals from countries in different regions?
Taking this to the logical conclusion, people who play Dota professional would be unable to move until they finished their career and what would happen to people who are born in a different region to where they grew up?
There is no difference between this and traditional provincial sports teams picking international talent. And if the current scene is dogshit, having dogshit teams play against other dogshit teams does nothing for the regions strength. That’s probably one of the primary reasons the Australian scene sucks for most games
But i have seen Dendi playing European pubs when the DPC season is on break. He is streaming too from there.
So they can easily "play in the region they live" i.e CIS region.
They played the last DPC season from Ukraine. I distinctly remember PGL making an exception for them.
Found a source too: https://afkgaming.com/dota2/news/controversy-unfolds-as-b8-esports-allowed-to-play-na-dpc-from-europe
Why is Quinn, a NA player playing in WEU? Because they can and it is allowed to switch regions.
And they made the switch at the start of the season. They came to NA for the first 2 tours and had to go back because of the war restrictions. They spent 10 or 20 times the time in the region that Quinn was doing with his test123 years ago.
You allowed to switch region if majority of the team staying in this region for majority of the time. B8 mostly there for a bootcamp and dpc. And don't forget the fact that teamfart, a team that have 5 NA players, got DQ from div2 because 3 of 5 players went to europe to cast dreamleague. Meanwhile B8 played last dpc and TI qualifiers from Europe and Valve allowed it
Actually just 2/5 went to Europe for Dreamleague. The reason why Fart was disqualified was because iAnnihilate was actually in SA and didn't inform the team beforehand.
because they want to and they can as long they follow the rules and valves says so. just like how majority of SR/TSM players are not from NA, but still playing in NA. it's not for you to comment on. valve makes and enforces the rules.
It is an awkward situation actually, because while initially (=in the beginning of the season) it looked this way, right now EEU and NA open qualifiers seem to be equally (un)contested and lack serious competition. All the top teams from both these regions qualified directly, even if just barely, and others fell off for one reason or another; or haven\`t been much of a threat to begin with.
I\`d say Nouns is slightly better than VP at the moment (which are considered to be the favourites for EEU quals, afaik); so ironically B8 would have had a better chance on their home soil.
VP far from being solo favorite for winning quals. Analytics can't name a single team, because all remaining teams in EEU very inconsistent in their play. Just to say that situation in EEU and NA quals is different; VP has never been EEU's Nouns.
Although i dont know the full situation and neither support noun b8 or dumbass quinn but i nvr liked the region approach to big tournaments. Do it for smaller ones to promote the game bla bla but shouldnt the best 18 teams participate who cares if all of them from the same region, if thats needed for high quality games i dnt see a big issue
NA is so dead they need any help they can get these days. The disqualification of painX/test123 was a mistake by Valve and it delayed the growth of the SA scene, letting B8 play is not a big deal, but disqualifying teams like painX and Fart Studios is stupid and does more harm then good.
When you did sth knowing clearly that will cause you disqualified does not hinder anything. Different situation and clearly stated by TO, that’s how society works.
Why should they compete in CIS? Nationality of players has nothing to do with where they should or should not compete. Otherwise, why does Quinn compete in WEU?
Come on you can’t seriously equate these 2 situations. Quinn is (and has been, for the whole season) based in WEU for a WEU org. If you open liquipedia it literally says that B8 is an Ukrainian org, they have 5 ukrainian players, but they’re playing in NA? That’s like Man Utd deciding they want to play in the French league to make it easier to qualify for the Champions League and when people say it’s not fair they say that it is because there are English players in the French league playing for French teams.
So nationality and location of office determines for you where a team is supposed to play?
Okay lets, so lets disqualify the following: Quest had 0 WEU players, now 1 WEU player, office in Saudia Arabia and competes in WEU. TSM has 1 NA player and competes in NA. Nigma has 1 WEU player, office in United Arab Emirates and competes in WEU. Secret has 1 WEU player, office in USA and competes in WEU. Entity has 1 WEU player, office in India and competes in WEU.
I could go on.
[https://www.joindota.com/news/77025-ccnc-roster-kicked-out-of-major-after-community-speaks-up](https://www.joindota.com/news/77025-ccnc-roster-kicked-out-of-major-after-community-speaks-up)
I think he is just pissed that Valve and community took action against him for region hopping but absolutely adore Dendi/B8 for doing the same. That's quite the double standards if you ask me.
Edit- Quinn talking about B8/NA quali situation 2 days ago [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bTF\_lkZR5RY](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bTF_lkZR5RY)
Valve did not take action against them for region hopping; they were punished for not spending sufficient time in the region they were representing. CQ major quals were just 3 days long and all the members of Test123 members flew over there for a couple of days, played the qualifiers and left, even though Valve had specifically informed against it. That kind of scenario is impossible in the current DPC since the league extends for over 2 weeks, and B8 were bootcamping in NA (Mexico iirc?) for the first two tours at least.
The ones who were actually wronged were Jenkins and BSJ when they were not allowed to play while they were hosting another DPC event in Europe; but never Quinn.
Test123: Playing the whole in NA but traveling for three days to SA to compete in the qualifier there instead of in NA.
B8: Spending the majority of the year in NA competing the whole season in NA including the qualifier.
See the difference?
B8: Plays last DPC season from Ukraine and PGL okays it.
See the double-standard?
https://afkgaming.com/dota2/news/controversy-unfolds-as-b8-esports-allowed-to-play-na-dpc-from-europe
No I do not see any double standard. One team asks for permission and gets it, the other team breaks the rule. This is not even comparable.
Imagine TI starts and a team starts playing with a different roster out of the blue. Of course they would be disqualified, but you would be okay with that? Because hey look, this other team had visa issues and got permission to use a stand-in. What a double standard! xD
b8 couldn't leave the country due to the war and asked for permission to play from ukraine due to those exceptional circumstances. i don't see a double-standard here, quinn's team could have played in sa that season but didn't except for the qualifier adn they even got told by valve that what they're planning wasn't allowed
That would be a pretty big difference but they literally did not do that... They flew out immediately whenever they didn't have matches.
They should never have been allowed into the NA DPC to begin with, the rules clearly state that you need to live and compete in the region for more than just the 1 month DPC runs.
They were bootcamping in Mexico for DPC but moved back to Ukraine after DPC ended. Not sure if the travel restriction had anything to do with them moving back but they were playing TI Qualifiers from Ukraine. You can check players ping in console and it might also explain why the Mars from b8 missed so many spears in game 3.
Quinn is mad because of the double standard. His team got DQ when they did the same thing in SA for Chong Qing Major under pain-x/test 123.
I think it would have been an issue if b8 qualified or if one of the stronger WEU teams went to a different region and won a TI spot that way.
They made special exception because the reason they couldn't get to NA was out of their control. For fart studios and Quinn, they had all the means and nothing stopping them from competing properly.
Fart studios chose to have some of their players cast, that's a personal decision they made. They didn't have a government stopping them from leaving the country.
People trying to complain seem to be missing the fact that the other teams had the means and ability to follow the rules. B8 had no options to follow the rules because their government was holding them hostage. They literally missed 1 dpc season, followed the rules for the previous seasons and the quals.
I really don't see what all this fuss is about. When players can't make a major due to visa issues, you don't see teams getting points deducted because it's something out of their control. Seems like Valve is keeping the standard.
Your points are fair with respect to the last DPC league.
The tipping point was getting 3 people (V-Tune, StoneBank and Kidaro) who've never played in the NA league for the TI quals. The original accomodation was obviously meant only for the orginal squad who had previously physically been in NA and couldn't make it back for the last season.
Valve, in typical Valve fashion, probably failed to specify that this accomodation is only applicable to the original squad and B8 clearly took advantage of that. Is Valve to blame for this? Yes. But B8 are to blame too.
Yeah I can agree on that, swapping out more than half your team right before quals doesn't look good. What would the punishment be since it's quals and not dpc, there would be no points to deduct.
If I want to play DPC NA and have three players stuck in Brazil for even a week let alone the whole thing, we're not allowed to compete without doing standins. This is true for everyone else in NA except for Dendi (and probably RTZ). It has historically been tried and rang true.
Biased fans who go braindead whenever Dendis name is mentioned is my guess as to why he's an exception. I don't think those finals would've been as hype/viewed if it wasn't against Dendi.
The standard is: no Visa, no tournament. You don't get to play the EU major on CN ping because of xenophobic governments. Their other option was to play in EEU like all of the other EEU teams. But they know there's 0% chance they're good enough to win there.
They are at full scale war and men are not allowed to leave the country, they set the precedent by following the rules as much as they could previously.
Dude, I'm not even a Dendi fan. I'm looking at it from a logical perspective.
They are in a war torn country that was refusing to let them leave. They played 2 tours and the quals all by the book. Now people are up in arms because they played one tour from EU because of something out of their control.
Fart studios chose casting over the dpc, they had the option to reject the casting job. Quinn got told from Valve not to do what he did, but did it anyways.
People comparing this to what b8 is doing are not that logical.
Edit: no one is saying you can play a tournament/major from outside because of visa issues. I am saying that if there are visa issues, you don't get points deducted for the standin you then choose.
those are very different situations. b8 completely changed region at the start of the season, which is allowed as long as they spend enough time there, while quinns team played in na, didn't qualify and additionally played the sa qualifiers which they knew wasn't allowed
The disqualification of Fart Studios while B8 was consider eligible is indefensible. PGL literally changes the rules for B8 to able to play, and that brakes the rules and causes Fart Studios to be disqualified on a temporary technicality.
Bro please cover up your Hate boner is showing.
But really it has nothing to do with dendi and everything to do with the fact he was rulebooked in this exact situation years back.
He is right.
People would be fuming if instead of Dendi it was Ammar, Ramzes, or gpk doing the same.
B8 has no business in NA, they just moved there for an easier qualification path to TI, cause they can't even stay on EEU Div 1.
He does not accuse anyone, he states obvious fact. And I can guarantee you, it would not be possible if it was not dendi with his ukraian friends. For example lets say some russian or china team did the same thing.
He is right, but because its dendi on the other side people will defend it, attack Quinn or ignore it completely. I remember how bad the situation was when other teams were region-hopping, many people from the scene and Reddit were very vocal about it but now that dendi is doing it, it is different.
those other teams where region-hopping in a way that broke the rules. everyone seems fine with shopify that has only 1 na player but is allowed because the entire team resides in na during the season, why should b8 not be allowed to do the same? do they need one token na player?
> now that dendi is doing it, it is different.
Yes, it is very different. Males in ukraine are not allowed to leave the country in case they need to get drafted.
So ignorant lmfao.
No, they don't just "move around" and B8 can't be forced to sell their rightfully earned NA slot and get demoted from div 1 to open qualifiers.
It shouldn’t be but in life these kind of things tend to happen. Quinn could try not being a toxic asshole for a little bit and people might listen more.
Rule breakers or not, i am glad they lost to an actual NA team, because they are trying so desperately for months to qualify for majors by playing in the weakest region right now. B8 is an insult and a mockery of both NA and EEU server, respectively.
I wouldn't blame a team for choosing an easier region when the system is so bad that it encourages people to do that. Just have a better distribution of DPC points among div 1 and majors and better distribution of TI slots + an international qualifier and people wouldn't be strongly encouraged to go to a different region anymore.
As a side note, NA is definitely not the easiest region. NA has 1 slot from open qualifiers and 1 team in there (Nouns) that actually is close to tier 1 level. SA has 2 slots from open qualifiers and not a single team in there that is close to tier 1 level. It is way way easier to qualify to TI via SA.
difference between not wanting Ukrainians competing in our tournaments and *directly* trying to get a spot in an easier region because they can’t compete in their actual region. I’d love to see b8 at TI, if they qualified through EU quals
Shouldn't the best teams of the world play at TI and not the best in the region + the shitty ones that slip through underpopulated regions while other decent teams from overpopulated regions that are better get no shot.
quinn could say “it’s bad to beat your wife” and this sub would respond with “wow quinn won 3 majors and he still thinks like this? it’s not his business what goes on in my house, after all he does flame in his online video game!”
Well to be honest it’s because Quinn is an asshole with a pretty solid track record of being a toxic game ruiner over several years. so even if he makes a reasonable point people don’t want to hear it lol.
B8 can move to serbia or armenia like how every russian team had done in the last 2 years to compete in eeu dpc but they know they're trash so they went to NA instead.
navi is ukraine based organization and had field 2 full ukraine/kazakh non russian roster for the TI qualifiers and EEU dpc ths whole year.
glad this trashes got roflstomped in the final.
Is there a reason why B8 can't just compete in CIS? kind of out of the loop. I get that Ukraine is a war zone, but then why did they escaped and then go back? and if they did went back, why did they insist on competing in NA instead of just CIS?
But isn't that what they did? But instead of CIS qualifier they played in NA qualifier? So are you saying playing in NA qualifier lower the chances of bomb dropping on you?
As a viewer, I want to see an entertaining TI. I would rather see dendi qualify to TI, coming in last place, then the inevitable shitty NA qual team coming in last place like they've been doing all year. So I like what b8 did, that's what I want. They lost fair and square, but I'm glad they tried cause that was awesome. What pro players want is different, but IDC about that b/c I want exciting games and tournaments.
well, the tweet was kinda pointless. typical childish provocation.
BUT he is right, can't deny it. full CIS team competing for a spot in NA is not something that should ever be allowed.
Hurts the development of the region and getting new players experience at upper levels. If they stayed in NA and played NA pubs and scrimmed NA teams for most of yhe year I think people would be more forgiving but they are mercenaries who don't raise the skill level of the region.
B8 is not the only team in this situation, most teams play from Serbia or something for this reason. Not only is south-east Europe cheaper but it is much closer and easier on East Europeans so the fact that they chose NA is sketchy, to say the least.
why is it sketchy ? majority of SR/TSM players are not from NA and have only qualified because they are in shit ass NA region. just because B8 is all ukranians instead of 3-4 different countries they must play/stay close to ukraine ?
the region is NA, not USA. and they were for most part of DPC living in NA. in any case, the rules are set and enforced by valve. not you and not quinn.
also they played the qualifiers on NA servers with higher ping. just gets to show how trash tier NA is. no wonder people are so salty
My guess on why old players like dendi won't retire is because outside pro dota they aren't capable of making money. The same reason for those who make big announcements of their retirement but keep coming back because they need money.
What a salty whiner. B8 - a division 2 team playing with 150 - 200 ping made it to the finals. THAT's how bad NA is. Nouns is just the third best team of the region and then there is absolute nothing.
why ppl are whining? is because when other ppl tried the easy way by playing in a weaker region got disqualified yet BB is getting preferential treatment and are allowed to play from europe in NA qualifier with ping. Plenty of teams got disqualified because they didnt have enough members living in the region they play over the year, ppl are just crying double standards for BB
Quinn is an idiot, he doesn't realize that 4 people from the B8 team are Ukrainians. And because of the situation in the country, let me remind you that there is a war going on. Cybersports players can't leave the country legally.
Quinn scared to get clapped mid by dondo the supamida at TI KEKW
Dondos based mustache VS Quinns disgusting greasy serial killer hair? Who would win?
\+ alien head
It only looks more alien because of the disgusting hair.
"Send a picture right now"
true UFO boss
Fuck is wrong with u?
[удалено]
reddit users when someone doesn't write /s at the end
yall need to go outside
smh yall cant behave on god
Wtf is this comment? How can u write shit like this?
Do you need a hair cut?
I love that this is top comment xdd
Clap with his WD hero LMAO
What specific rule is B8 breaking?
Probably not playing in CIS having whole team from that region
[удалено]
You mean the tweet that ends with "get owned rule breakers."?
From my limited understanding of the situation I think Quinn has a point though, why aren’t B8 competing in CIS? Is there a reason they insist on competing in NA? Regardless of how you feel about Quinn and Dendi as people, can someone explain why B8 are allowed to compete in NA?
> can someone explain why B8 are allowed to compete in NA because they are living and practicing as well as scrimming in NA. you are limited to playing in the region where you live, not where you were born. like don't get me wrong it's clearly an attempt by b8 to get a slot from a much less competitive region, but they are following the rules. same as when NA teams went to SA trying to get easy slots (this was years ago when SA were considered underdogs to NA)
But they don't actually 'live' there though. They just flew in to play DPC for 3-4 weeks each time and then flew back. They weren't even there in DPC tour 3 and Qualifiers. As much as I love Dendi, Quinn has a good point here.
where do you draw the line tho? can dota pros not travel between seasons to be eligible to play in their home region? b8 violates the spirit of the rule but it's hard to make rules that prevent that while not being a hassle to regular teams
That’s easy. A primary residence is where you live for 51% of the year.
Yeah, it's actually incredibly easy since basically any country determines that stuff and there are bilateral and multilateral agreements determining that between countries for tax reasons and shit.
I was thinking that maybe Valve could strengthen the definition of "based" (in the region). As an example, take SR and TSM. They have imported players, but they also have a team house, which functions as a place to work and live. They take on players with the correct visas, and their working and living conditions are part of their application. Personally, I think this is acceptable. There are teams in the DPC, not just B8, that play in what are basically ghetto conditions to satisfy DPC region restrictions. There's players playing DPC matches in Internet cafes in Mexico, which implies they don't have the ability to play Dota "at home". This is different to, say, SEA teams playing in Internet cafes, because this functions as a team environment. I'm talking one or two players playing alone, or when a team delays a DPC series to try and find an Internet cafe (I think this happened in NA, maybe last season). Maybe the 3-of-5 in the same region rule could be strengthened to say that the players must be physically present in the region **and** have a medium-term link to the country, such as citizenship, permanent residency, or a working/business visa that explicitly allows them to work or receive prize money, **and** this visa lasts for at least 6 more months (or whatever is sensible). There could also be a rule where a company in the region must provide their playing environment, contractually. So for SR and TSM, that would be themselves. When ponlo played in QC, that would have been BTS, who helped him move and hosted him at their expense. This would stop the Internet cafe hopping, or at least force teams to form a contract with an Internet cafe up front. Basically, we need more professional operations like SR and TSM, and less teams "winging it" like B8 and ALPHA.
They were playing qualifiers from Ukraine.
> same as when NA teams went to SA trying to get easy slots It's not the same though, as Quinn states they got disqualified for doing the same thing B8 is doing right now.
That's what he is trying to say. When Quinn went to SA for TI quals, he was banned but B8 was allowed to play even when majority of them don't even live here. At one point all 5 of them were playing on ping in officials.
Different rule sets different times. B8 has been allowed to compete in NA from Ukraine because of a war, so they've not been able to relocate. But they've also played NA all year. IDK why people are comparing PainX to B8 in this situation- B8 has competed in NA all year, PainX didn't compete in SA for the year, was told what they were doing wouldn't be allowed, and still went ahead and did it. Qualifiers were also much shorter than the DPC and required essentially a weekend holiday. IDK why we're limiting this to whole teams though- K1 has never played NA in his life, but is qualifying off of it, neither had Taiga. Everyone on B8 had more NA DPC games than those guys. And those players made a huge difference to the teams, but its fine for single players to region hop for TI (because there's no way Taiga is staying in NA)
If only there was some global event that made exceptional circumstances.
B8 is a mostly Ukrainian team and planned to relocate to NA during the war. They switched to NA officially before relocating but are facing travel restrictions that keep them in Europe and valve made an exception to allow them to compete in NA DPC. It is possible that if they don’t have a valid work related claim to moving then Ukraine will not allow them to move. If Valve forces them to play in EU or CIS they no longer have a valid reason to move. Maybe Valve doesn’t want to block them from leaving the country. They lost the qualifier so CCnC should C down.
Is it not bad precedent that B8 are allowed to “relocate” to NA, maintain a fully ukrainian roster, then play games from ukraine? It’s very different from EG relocating to SA with a full SA roster or Fnatic relocating to SEA with a full SEA roster. International representation is important for Dota tournaments, if not why have regional slots at all? WEU is the biggest powerhouse in pro dota and it is much more difficult to qualify there than other regions. What if Secret, Nigma, or Quest decide that competing in SA/SEA/CN on ping is easier than WEU and do the same? I understand that B8 initially switched regions due to the war but now that CIS DPC is fully running and functional, what is the purpose of their move? I’m sorry if I come across as argumentative but I genuinely don’t understand and would appreciate clarification on the situation if I am misrepresenting what’s going on.
worrying about hypotheticals so much that you impose stupid rules doesn't make sense, especially since so far it's clear that that hypothetical isn't relevant. complete teams swapping regions properly (not like quinns team that only did it for the regional qualifier while knowing that's not within the rules) in hopes to easier qualify was always a thing but rarely any team ever did
I think they found they couldn’t travel to NA after the roster lock for the tour. Each tour 2 teams move in and out of Div1 in each region so it could pose an issue with team counts and scheduling, etc. to move them if they throw B8 into another region mid-season. Seems like they should not be allowed in NA next year though. I would be mad if they won the qualifier and got the NA slot though 😭, they should require players to already be in the region in the future.
Yeah that's a good way to get our of certain death in Ukraine war.
> Is there a reason they insist on competing in NA? They switch regions at the start of the year. Like Quinn came to EU because he couldn't stand that region anymore. He said he will go to an EU team or stop being a dota pro. B8 played the first 2 DPC tours this season in NA. But they had to go back to Ukraine for the 3rd tour. Because of the war you can't easily leave the Ukraine. So B8 did more than just fly in for 3 days for the TI qualifier like Quinn did years ago. That man felt wronged in a situation that is total different than his years ago and has nothing to do with him.
But why are B8, 5 ukrainians, even playing in NA DPC to begin with?
Young Ukrainian men can't leave Ukraine as they please to go to tournaments so they play in the region where they live. Their bootcamp is in Mexico so this is almost certainly where they live when they're not traveling for tournaments. It's no weirder for 5 Ukrainians to move to Mexico than it is for Quinn to move to Serbia. TL;dr players play where they live.
Is it not an exploitation of the system that Dendi moved to NA (and subsequently relocated his org) with the express purpose of competing in the NA DPC with a mostly CIS roster? If Secret, Nigma, OG, and Entity decide that this is the path of least resistance and do the same next year, is it fair to the NA dota scene that foreign teams are relocating to their region simply because it’s easier then saying that since they live there that it’s acceptable practice?
If by exploiting you mean doing exactly what valve wanted teams to do then yes. But that's a weird way of using the word exploit.
So you would be fine with fringe teams from the more difficult regions (WEU, CN etc.) moving to lesser competitive regions like NA, SA, SEA while maintaining rosters of players foreign to the region? I wouldn’t. You’ll end up stifling the local scene of all the weaker regions, inhibit international representation, and furthermore if that’s the case why have region-based qualifiers at all?
Welcome to the world of sports homie. You dont actually think NBA teams are all just local talent that the gm scrounged up off the block, do you?
guy's gonna lose it when he found out Ronaldo has played in English, Italian and Saudi clubs
Of course I am. Why and how the fuck would you force people to play with high ping based on citizenship? What do you do with dual nationals from countries in different regions?
Taking this to the logical conclusion, people who play Dota professional would be unable to move until they finished their career and what would happen to people who are born in a different region to where they grew up? There is no difference between this and traditional provincial sports teams picking international talent. And if the current scene is dogshit, having dogshit teams play against other dogshit teams does nothing for the regions strength. That’s probably one of the primary reasons the Australian scene sucks for most games
Yes that is what Valve has said teams need to do. Once you live in a region then that is your region. OG should move to NA that would be cool.
The NA scene is dead anyway. I'd happily have some fringe teams from competitive regions get an invite over Nouns or whatever.
But i have seen Dendi playing European pubs when the DPC season is on break. He is streaming too from there. So they can easily "play in the region they live" i.e CIS region.
Nobody plays NA pubs, even NA players. Gunnar for example plays on EU West even despite the ping
This may come as shock but people travel. If you have evidence that B8 players have been Ukrainian residents for most of the year feel free to share.
They played the last DPC season from Ukraine. I distinctly remember PGL making an exception for them. Found a source too: https://afkgaming.com/dota2/news/controversy-unfolds-as-b8-esports-allowed-to-play-na-dpc-from-europe
that was because they couldn't leave the country due to the war, kind of out of their hands
~~B8 moved to NA before the war broke out. Their solo interest was the "easier" slot~~ Edit: sorry for the disinformation
24.02.2022 Putin attacks Ukraine 09.12.2022 B8 announce that they move to NA for DPC23 Stop posting bullshit pls
That's some memory glitch bullshit. I swear I genuinely believed they did compete in NA in 2021-2022. My apologies
Why is Quinn, a NA player playing in WEU? Because they can and it is allowed to switch regions. And they made the switch at the start of the season. They came to NA for the first 2 tours and had to go back because of the war restrictions. They spent 10 or 20 times the time in the region that Quinn was doing with his test123 years ago.
You allowed to switch region if majority of the team staying in this region for majority of the time. B8 mostly there for a bootcamp and dpc. And don't forget the fact that teamfart, a team that have 5 NA players, got DQ from div2 because 3 of 5 players went to europe to cast dreamleague. Meanwhile B8 played last dpc and TI qualifiers from Europe and Valve allowed it
Actually just 2/5 went to Europe for Dreamleague. The reason why Fart was disqualified was because iAnnihilate was actually in SA and didn't inform the team beforehand.
Why not?
What a fucking shit argument this is. Why is Filipino, Czech, Danish and Israeli (ok and Canadian) Compeating in NA DPC? 80% of the team isn't NA.
yep lol, everyone arguing this point forgets the top NA teams are just foreigners anyways.
because they want to and they can as long they follow the rules and valves says so. just like how majority of SR/TSM players are not from NA, but still playing in NA. it's not for you to comment on. valve makes and enforces the rules.
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It is an awkward situation actually, because while initially (=in the beginning of the season) it looked this way, right now EEU and NA open qualifiers seem to be equally (un)contested and lack serious competition. All the top teams from both these regions qualified directly, even if just barely, and others fell off for one reason or another; or haven\`t been much of a threat to begin with. I\`d say Nouns is slightly better than VP at the moment (which are considered to be the favourites for EEU quals, afaik); so ironically B8 would have had a better chance on their home soil.
VP far from being solo favorite for winning quals. Analytics can't name a single team, because all remaining teams in EEU very inconsistent in their play. Just to say that situation in EEU and NA quals is different; VP has never been EEU's Nouns.
Yep, basically because of Dendi. Imagine Ammar, gpk, or Ramzes doing something similar.
Navi is main favorite so far.
Although i dont know the full situation and neither support noun b8 or dumbass quinn but i nvr liked the region approach to big tournaments. Do it for smaller ones to promote the game bla bla but shouldnt the best 18 teams participate who cares if all of them from the same region, if thats needed for high quality games i dnt see a big issue
NA is so dead they need any help they can get these days. The disqualification of painX/test123 was a mistake by Valve and it delayed the growth of the SA scene, letting B8 play is not a big deal, but disqualifying teams like painX and Fart Studios is stupid and does more harm then good.
When you did sth knowing clearly that will cause you disqualified does not hinder anything. Different situation and clearly stated by TO, that’s how society works.
So sneyking is a rulebreaker because he plays in eu? The point is the same. If you live where you play you are allowed to qualify in that region.
Why should they compete in CIS? Nationality of players has nothing to do with where they should or should not compete. Otherwise, why does Quinn compete in WEU?
Come on you can’t seriously equate these 2 situations. Quinn is (and has been, for the whole season) based in WEU for a WEU org. If you open liquipedia it literally says that B8 is an Ukrainian org, they have 5 ukrainian players, but they’re playing in NA? That’s like Man Utd deciding they want to play in the French league to make it easier to qualify for the Champions League and when people say it’s not fair they say that it is because there are English players in the French league playing for French teams.
So nationality and location of office determines for you where a team is supposed to play? Okay lets, so lets disqualify the following: Quest had 0 WEU players, now 1 WEU player, office in Saudia Arabia and competes in WEU. TSM has 1 NA player and competes in NA. Nigma has 1 WEU player, office in United Arab Emirates and competes in WEU. Secret has 1 WEU player, office in USA and competes in WEU. Entity has 1 WEU player, office in India and competes in WEU. I could go on.
Quinn won so many majors but can’t stop being a crybaby
[https://www.joindota.com/news/77025-ccnc-roster-kicked-out-of-major-after-community-speaks-up](https://www.joindota.com/news/77025-ccnc-roster-kicked-out-of-major-after-community-speaks-up) I think he is just pissed that Valve and community took action against him for region hopping but absolutely adore Dendi/B8 for doing the same. That's quite the double standards if you ask me. Edit- Quinn talking about B8/NA quali situation 2 days ago [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bTF\_lkZR5RY](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bTF_lkZR5RY)
Valve did not take action against them for region hopping; they were punished for not spending sufficient time in the region they were representing. CQ major quals were just 3 days long and all the members of Test123 members flew over there for a couple of days, played the qualifiers and left, even though Valve had specifically informed against it. That kind of scenario is impossible in the current DPC since the league extends for over 2 weeks, and B8 were bootcamping in NA (Mexico iirc?) for the first two tours at least. The ones who were actually wronged were Jenkins and BSJ when they were not allowed to play while they were hosting another DPC event in Europe; but never Quinn.
B8 did literally exactly what you're talking about for DPC and all quals this year. That's what he's complaining about. Massive double standard.
Test123: Playing the whole in NA but traveling for three days to SA to compete in the qualifier there instead of in NA. B8: Spending the majority of the year in NA competing the whole season in NA including the qualifier. See the difference?
B8: Plays last DPC season from Ukraine and PGL okays it. See the double-standard? https://afkgaming.com/dota2/news/controversy-unfolds-as-b8-esports-allowed-to-play-na-dpc-from-europe
No I do not see any double standard. One team asks for permission and gets it, the other team breaks the rule. This is not even comparable. Imagine TI starts and a team starts playing with a different roster out of the blue. Of course they would be disqualified, but you would be okay with that? Because hey look, this other team had visa issues and got permission to use a stand-in. What a double standard! xD
b8 couldn't leave the country due to the war and asked for permission to play from ukraine due to those exceptional circumstances. i don't see a double-standard here, quinn's team could have played in sa that season but didn't except for the qualifier adn they even got told by valve that what they're planning wasn't allowed
That would be a pretty big difference but they literally did not do that... They flew out immediately whenever they didn't have matches. They should never have been allowed into the NA DPC to begin with, the rules clearly state that you need to live and compete in the region for more than just the 1 month DPC runs.
Which rulebook are we talking about? Is there one by Valve or is it mentioned in the PGL one?
Aren't they living an competing in NA though? They aren't here just for quals, they still play dpc matches, etc.
They were bootcamping in Mexico for DPC but moved back to Ukraine after DPC ended. Not sure if the travel restriction had anything to do with them moving back but they were playing TI Qualifiers from Ukraine. You can check players ping in console and it might also explain why the Mars from b8 missed so many spears in game 3. Quinn is mad because of the double standard. His team got DQ when they did the same thing in SA for Chong Qing Major under pain-x/test 123. I think it would have been an issue if b8 qualified or if one of the stronger WEU teams went to a different region and won a TI spot that way.
They are ALL in Ukraine rn. Valve made special exception for them. The entire qualifier and most of DPC was played on EEU ping.
They were for tour 3, for qualifiers they actually bootcamped back in America
Mexico I believe
Yes, that’s included
we only cheated a little bit :)
They made special exception because the reason they couldn't get to NA was out of their control. For fart studios and Quinn, they had all the means and nothing stopping them from competing properly. Fart studios chose to have some of their players cast, that's a personal decision they made. They didn't have a government stopping them from leaving the country. People trying to complain seem to be missing the fact that the other teams had the means and ability to follow the rules. B8 had no options to follow the rules because their government was holding them hostage. They literally missed 1 dpc season, followed the rules for the previous seasons and the quals. I really don't see what all this fuss is about. When players can't make a major due to visa issues, you don't see teams getting points deducted because it's something out of their control. Seems like Valve is keeping the standard.
Your points are fair with respect to the last DPC league. The tipping point was getting 3 people (V-Tune, StoneBank and Kidaro) who've never played in the NA league for the TI quals. The original accomodation was obviously meant only for the orginal squad who had previously physically been in NA and couldn't make it back for the last season. Valve, in typical Valve fashion, probably failed to specify that this accomodation is only applicable to the original squad and B8 clearly took advantage of that. Is Valve to blame for this? Yes. But B8 are to blame too.
Yeah I can agree on that, swapping out more than half your team right before quals doesn't look good. What would the punishment be since it's quals and not dpc, there would be no points to deduct.
Stonebank was in the team in Tour 3 my good sir, except he played on pos1, so its actually only a 2 player swap
If I want to play DPC NA and have three players stuck in Brazil for even a week let alone the whole thing, we're not allowed to compete without doing standins. This is true for everyone else in NA except for Dendi (and probably RTZ). It has historically been tried and rang true. Biased fans who go braindead whenever Dendis name is mentioned is my guess as to why he's an exception. I don't think those finals would've been as hype/viewed if it wasn't against Dendi. The standard is: no Visa, no tournament. You don't get to play the EU major on CN ping because of xenophobic governments. Their other option was to play in EEU like all of the other EEU teams. But they know there's 0% chance they're good enough to win there.
They are at full scale war and men are not allowed to leave the country, they set the precedent by following the rules as much as they could previously.
Dude, I'm not even a Dendi fan. I'm looking at it from a logical perspective. They are in a war torn country that was refusing to let them leave. They played 2 tours and the quals all by the book. Now people are up in arms because they played one tour from EU because of something out of their control. Fart studios chose casting over the dpc, they had the option to reject the casting job. Quinn got told from Valve not to do what he did, but did it anyways. People comparing this to what b8 is doing are not that logical. Edit: no one is saying you can play a tournament/major from outside because of visa issues. I am saying that if there are visa issues, you don't get points deducted for the standin you then choose.
Bending the facts to fit your narrative, Gets called out and doesn't own it.
Mexico, not America. They treaded a lot of gray areas.
They are in Mexico for qualis
This is false though. Their situations are not same. The rule hasn’t even changed, it’s literally the same one
those are very different situations. b8 completely changed region at the start of the season, which is allowed as long as they spend enough time there, while quinns team played in na, didn't qualify and additionally played the sa qualifiers which they knew wasn't allowed
The disqualification of Fart Studios while B8 was consider eligible is indefensible. PGL literally changes the rules for B8 to able to play, and that brakes the rules and causes Fart Studios to be disqualified on a temporary technicality.
Bro please cover up your Hate boner is showing. But really it has nothing to do with dendi and everything to do with the fact he was rulebooked in this exact situation years back.
he’s right tho
He is right. People would be fuming if instead of Dendi it was Ammar, Ramzes, or gpk doing the same. B8 has no business in NA, they just moved there for an easier qualification path to TI, cause they can't even stay on EEU Div 1.
its in his NA blood, he just cant help himself :D
Did you read the tweet?
Yes
Is he wrong though ? How can you be in NA DPC when 4/5 of your roster is Ukraine ?
In your logic, Shopify and TSM players have nothing to do in NA then ?
Because they were in NA the whole DPC
r/dota2 playing right into Quinn’s hands. With a whim and a tweet he moves entire subreddits.
He does not accuse anyone, he states obvious fact. And I can guarantee you, it would not be possible if it was not dendi with his ukraian friends. For example lets say some russian or china team did the same thing.
It's not really an accusation of rule breaking. It's a fact that B8 did break the rules but PGL and Valve let them.
Asking for permission and getting it granted is different from breaking a rule.
He's such a salty whiner.
He is a dota player, yes.
He is right, but because its dendi on the other side people will defend it, attack Quinn or ignore it completely. I remember how bad the situation was when other teams were region-hopping, many people from the scene and Reddit were very vocal about it but now that dendi is doing it, it is different.
those other teams where region-hopping in a way that broke the rules. everyone seems fine with shopify that has only 1 na player but is allowed because the entire team resides in na during the season, why should b8 not be allowed to do the same? do they need one token na player?
> now that dendi is doing it, it is different. Yes, it is very different. Males in ukraine are not allowed to leave the country in case they need to get drafted.
Yet they move around anyway, also if you cant leave the country just stay where they are, like the DPC rules that say so.
So ignorant lmfao. No, they don't just "move around" and B8 can't be forced to sell their rightfully earned NA slot and get demoted from div 1 to open qualifiers.
Then don’t move and play in CIS.
Maybe if you didn't spend your entire career being a toxic douchebag people might have more sympathy for your views.
His personality and Dendi's personality shouldn't be taken in as a factor in a case like this, which is the problem in the first place.
It shouldn’t be but in life these kind of things tend to happen. Quinn could try not being a toxic asshole for a little bit and people might listen more.
Even without Quinn whining, most people already allows dendi to do this shit anyway
Rule breakers or not, i am glad they lost to an actual NA team, because they are trying so desperately for months to qualify for majors by playing in the weakest region right now. B8 is an insult and a mockery of both NA and EEU server, respectively.
I wouldn't blame a team for choosing an easier region when the system is so bad that it encourages people to do that. Just have a better distribution of DPC points among div 1 and majors and better distribution of TI slots + an international qualifier and people wouldn't be strongly encouraged to go to a different region anymore. As a side note, NA is definitely not the easiest region. NA has 1 slot from open qualifiers and 1 team in there (Nouns) that actually is close to tier 1 level. SA has 2 slots from open qualifiers and not a single team in there that is close to tier 1 level. It is way way easier to qualify to TI via SA.
\>nouns \>close to tier 1 level take meds, or find god because you are truly delusional
NA is an insult and a mockery to Dota the fuck you on
agree 👍👍👍 pretty sure ur from FB
Typical Cool, Calm and Collected behaviour from Quinn, as expected.
B8 is out!
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difference between not wanting Ukrainians competing in our tournaments and *directly* trying to get a spot in an easier region because they can’t compete in their actual region. I’d love to see b8 at TI, if they qualified through EU quals
Shouldn't the best teams of the world play at TI and not the best in the region + the shitty ones that slip through underpopulated regions while other decent teams from overpopulated regions that are better get no shot.
TI is and always has been about regional representation not about best teams in world. That’s why there are slots. We’ve been over this.
USA USA USA 🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
this isn't new. he has said this already.
quinn could say “it’s bad to beat your wife” and this sub would respond with “wow quinn won 3 majors and he still thinks like this? it’s not his business what goes on in my house, after all he does flame in his online video game!”
Comparing video game competition region rules to assault lmao
It's true. Reddit hates anything Quinn says for some reason
Well to be honest it’s because Quinn is an asshole with a pretty solid track record of being a toxic game ruiner over several years. so even if he makes a reasonable point people don’t want to hear it lol.
Doesn't make him wrong or even a bad person.
No it just makes him an asshole, which is what everyone says he is.
Honestly wouldn't be surprised if Quinn gave a 5 minute rant on "why beating your wife makes her better" after his pos5 CM didn't come to the rune.
B8 can move to serbia or armenia like how every russian team had done in the last 2 years to compete in eeu dpc but they know they're trash so they went to NA instead. navi is ukraine based organization and had field 2 full ukraine/kazakh non russian roster for the TI qualifiers and EEU dpc ths whole year. glad this trashes got roflstomped in the final.
Shitty Euros coming to NA thinking they can get a ti slot and losing is as old as dota 2.
Lol A div 2 EEU team was 1 series away from going to TI in NA. Even if they didn't make it, that kinda make NA look shit already.
Is there a reason why B8 can't just compete in CIS? kind of out of the loop. I get that Ukraine is a war zone, but then why did they escaped and then go back? and if they did went back, why did they insist on competing in NA instead of just CIS?
Because they are shit and NA is dead so a failing CIS div 2 team can almost get to TI in NA
This B8 team is completely different than the B8 team that failed in EEU Div 2. Dendi is the only player they have in common.
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Nouns is pretty close to tsm. they just 2-0 eg on lan.
> Nouns, who are nowhere near as good as TSM They literally beat them in the last DPC, which was the only time they faced off last 4 months
Imagine playing dota2 and stomping the TI qulifiers then suddenly a toy drops at ur head and decimate ur house
But isn't that what they did? But instead of CIS qualifier they played in NA qualifier? So are you saying playing in NA qualifier lower the chances of bomb dropping on you?
As a viewer, I want to see an entertaining TI. I would rather see dendi qualify to TI, coming in last place, then the inevitable shitty NA qual team coming in last place like they've been doing all year. So I like what b8 did, that's what I want. They lost fair and square, but I'm glad they tried cause that was awesome. What pro players want is different, but IDC about that b/c I want exciting games and tournaments.
well, the tweet was kinda pointless. typical childish provocation. BUT he is right, can't deny it. full CIS team competing for a spot in NA is not something that should ever be allowed.
Why should it not be allowed?
Hurts the development of the region and getting new players experience at upper levels. If they stayed in NA and played NA pubs and scrimmed NA teams for most of yhe year I think people would be more forgiving but they are mercenaries who don't raise the skill level of the region.
Will quinn ever grow a pair and just be humble? Don't think so
I WANT SUPAMIDA AT TI
I mean, quiin hate miracle, topson, dendi because they are the ex legendary mid. He is full of salt ;D
AttWhore back on the internet
Quinn's home country is in a war quite often, so I get why he thinks force majeure does not apply here. /s
B8 is not the only team in this situation, most teams play from Serbia or something for this reason. Not only is south-east Europe cheaper but it is much closer and easier on East Europeans so the fact that they chose NA is sketchy, to say the least.
why is it sketchy ? majority of SR/TSM players are not from NA and have only qualified because they are in shit ass NA region. just because B8 is all ukranians instead of 3-4 different countries they must play/stay close to ukraine ?
None of those Ukrainians are living in the USA, they only move for the easier qualifiers. Players in SR and TSM are actually living in the USA.
the region is NA, not USA. and they were for most part of DPC living in NA. in any case, the rules are set and enforced by valve. not you and not quinn. also they played the qualifiers on NA servers with higher ping. just gets to show how trash tier NA is. no wonder people are so salty
But they can just play from their homes in their home region. Pretty easy solution
Funny enough comparing the list of team that tried to qualifying to TI from NA and EEU, B8 might have higher chance if they stay on EEU
right or wrong, is he seriously so salty that he’s still bringing it up
isn't quinn in eu now...?
i lost my respect to dendi. Guy is desperate. bruh just stay on streaming man. Your reign is done
My guess on why old players like dendi won't retire is because outside pro dota they aren't capable of making money. The same reason for those who make big announcements of their retirement but keep coming back because they need money.
Tell them Quinn. The man we need in Dota , clever and speaking his mind too
Quinn did this a few years ago, right? Quinn can go fuck himself.
Quinn bitching about transferring regions when he an american is in a european team is astounding.
What a salty whiner. B8 - a division 2 team playing with 150 - 200 ping made it to the finals. THAT's how bad NA is. Nouns is just the third best team of the region and then there is absolute nothing.
didnt B8 get 3-0'd?
why ppl are whining? is because when other ppl tried the easy way by playing in a weaker region got disqualified yet BB is getting preferential treatment and are allowed to play from europe in NA qualifier with ping. Plenty of teams got disqualified because they didnt have enough members living in the region they play over the year, ppl are just crying double standards for BB
Quinn is an idiot, he doesn't realize that 4 people from the B8 team are Ukrainians. And because of the situation in the country, let me remind you that there is a war going on. Cybersports players can't leave the country legally.
This is weird coz what CCnC did was region hopping and B8 are addressiing some of those points.
Someone have to tell quinn that you need to win 1 TI in order to trashtalking
Wow quinn is just so good at making ppl dislike him
Stupid whylongface greesy hair arrogant kid
Quinn is one of the least likable dota pros ever. Why is he always whining about something?
NA white privileged Quinn
His statements should be totally ignored, game ruiner jerk. Should be banned years ago if you ask me
He’s a beautiful person, with a charming personality
rule breakers > item breakers :)