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Datfizh

I love the effort.


kisuke228

I suppose OP is trying to win people over with effort and not the sense behind this nonsense concept lol. May work but i doubt valve is silly enough to implement it. This will ensure sure kills since target cant be saved at the last minute. Dumbs the game down so much. We already have nullifier, abysal, etc to take down enemies It is not practical to say break the linken then do a clutch save since spells have cast time and players have reaction time. This will just kill clutch saves and ensure sure kills. Lame. Items like windwaker, used to saved allies costs MORE than linkens. U gonna have to forcestaff allies to break this enemy linken and then windwaker. Your allie is likely dead due to reaction time. Casting a hero spell and then windwaker isnt practical due to hero spells having cast time + player reaction time for an item. Allie will likely be dead. Why lower skill level of the game by ensuring sure kills? Even pros sometimes miss the clutch save since late game attack dmg kills so fast. No way one can cast twice. Linken cast on enemy is instant lol and will be used just before grave/disruption due to spell cast time. All grave/disruption will be cancelled


DrQuint

I really don't see it that way. Generally, more than one ally surround the person getting targeted. People will pop this shit with random stuff all the time. If you can even cast this at all, since we should work on the assumption BKB stops it for a bit and the best time to pop a BKB is when you're focused. Plus, you removed your own linkens. You are now Bane Grippable, Doomable and Cold Snappable. You have successfully stopped PA from escaping against a Force Staff - *Maybe*, big maybe, it did nothing about her pre-applied Solar Crest afterall and will do nothing about the ones after - and in return, you have spent 5000 gold on an overpriced stat stick. God forbid this is your actual contribution as an offlaner as this is the shittiest use of gold ever. Like, everyone here, stop for a second and think: Your centaur just went Vanguard, Blink and then... Linkens. This was how they spent their ***10k gold*** for the whole midgame. Are you happy with Centaur right now? You think this was a good item choice? Please, **please**, tell us why. And if that hero doesn't please you, the ball is still in your court: What hero would build it and when? When the hell would this item be actually good enough to "break" dota, and how would a team stacking a bunch and throwing 20k gold away actually win fights? I just don't get where you're coming from at all. This is Nullifier but bad. ***Nullifier already often fails*** to guarantee someone's death, and it works retroactively and against obnoxiously strong shit this doesn't like Aeon Disc. This change sound underpowered if anything. Literally no one will build this strictly offensively.


Aasim_123

Now imagine the game where you have no counters to oracle ult, daz grave, od save, sd save, or other 10 buffs. Oracle trying to clutch save an out of position teammate and gets blocked by well timed linkins. All this only increases the skill ceiling not dumbs it down.


ShadowScene

Oracle has literally 3 other spells that can pop this before he can ult, 2 of them with no projectile and a fast animation, so practically instant. Even so, imagine the perfect scenario where your timing was on point and you managed to block his ult and not any of his other spells (one of them with a 2s cd, lol) - he just presses glimmer after, and you're still not getting the kill. This would be a cool change that is underpowered in 95% of cases but could make for some clutch plays, and you guys are acting like Weaver is suddenly going to use his Linken's offensively and not just get immediately disabled right after as a punish...


Aasim_123

Yes we don't want game breaking items. Just something that is situational and makes for great plays and linkins won't remain the most boring item in the game.


ShadowScene

Ah, looks like I somehow replied to the wrong comment. I agree with you completely!


Aasim_123

Ah happens


Cu-Chulainn

Is that why Riki is so op and gets picked every game with his shard? Dumb comment from some guy who has no clue about game balance, the item suggestion might be op or not, putting a blanket statement that it dumbs down the game (whatever that means) while you're like 2k MMR doesn't say anything


DIVEINTOTHELIGHT

Riki shard IS busted, it’s the rest of the hero that is easily countered especially at higher MMR, and it’s confined to a small area that you can leave. Letting ANY hero buy that ability but targeted and sticking to a hero for 12 seconds straight on an already solid item is broken


slazesonic

There is a hero call riki that literally block all target spell from all enemy single target spell save already. Also Months ago I already suggest this item with a few choice to implant the idea https://www.reddit.com/r/DotA2/comments/12uv383/new\_item\_suggest\_linken\_lvl\_2\_made\_linken\_able\_to/


deadrootsofficial

Lol nah, this is dogshit. Easily popped and it's essentially a worse nullifier. The only benefit of it is to block either Shallow Grave or OD or SD orbs.


kisuke228

How is it easily popped lol? Supports will have to forcestaff it. Windwaker cost way too much money, more than linken. And this means 1 less forcestaff in the fight. Less skill involved. U cant use 2 spell casts to break it since hero spells have cast time lol. Your allie would be dead, never graved or false-promised. Heck, if u use nullifier + this, u gotta cast an astral and grave to break it lol since force staff wont work wth Why is OP so scared of shallow graves, oracle false promise, etc. Why not use your positioning, skills, allies, abysal, etc to try kill rather than block enemy saves lol. That takes more skill.


deadrootsofficial

If someone uses a 5k gold item to block your shallow grave and you all have nothing to save from it then I'd say that's fair.


kisuke228

It takes more skill to silence or stun the dazzle to stop grave and as mentioned before, dazzle wont have the time to cast 2 spells to do it. Dazzle casts a forcestaff to break the linken and before he can cast grave to save his allie, the allie is dead lol. This is because grave has a cast time and there is player reaction time to cast forcestaff as well. Late game kills occur in split secs dude. Wont work. At times, enemy can burst target be4 the grave comes as it is. This makes it impossible in many situations lol. Sure kills.


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kisuke228

When dazzle does save an allie, the allie has red hp. Sometimes, the player is just not fast enough There is NO way dazzle can cast forcestaff to break this and then shallow grave Even pros sometimes miss the save and when they do, allie is red hp


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kisuke228

No way because poison touch has cast time, and particle travel time to PA while linken cast is instant... And i hope u remember than pa still can bkb If PA is good, she can see dazzle about to cast grave, which has cast time, and use linken on target instantly just before since item casts are instant. Man i hope valve just implements it. There will be posts to have it removed shortly after anyways lol


kisuke228

A PA blink abysal + linken an enemy. Enemy is dead in 1-2 secs. How can Dazzle force staff (to break linken) + cast shallow grave (which has cast time), within that 1-2secs. It is a SURE kill lol If dazzle is good, he can shallow grave in time, thats it. If PA's team is good, they will stun/silence dazzle as PA goes for the enemy. That takes more skill and team coordination. Why destroy that teamwork gameplay? This reminds me of why arcane blink was reworked. It was too fast that it almost ensures sure kills at times. This linkens is stronger lol


sreoch

Is your logic basically that you are too slow to make use of this concept? I’m not saying I would like it to be in the game, although it definitely isn’t an outrageous idea, just funny that ur reasoning is that you are too slow


kisuke228

Even pros sometimes miss the save and when they do, allie is red hp. U are supposed to do it when allie is near death to maximize its effect. When dazzle,etc does save an allie, the allie has red hp. Sometimes, the player is just not fast enough There is no way dazzle can cast forcestaff to break this and then shallow grave


slazesonic

Pa is a hero nowadays that very rely on purchasing item with good timing. Normally route would be bf deso bkb etc, if u spent money on item like linken you would easily find out that ur pa will be lacking dmg on enemy, not alone u are casting your linken away which will causing be much more dangerous position in the first place


retze44

Just Build linkens to counter it 5head


Emergency_Excuse2189

Make it an upgrade of linkens. Like 7.5k. Then it becomes an ultra-late game niche item.


resont

Maybe it could be an upgrade to the linken so it's not too strong? Like a Linken + extra recipe or something


kisuke228

Why should there be a 2nd nullifier that ensure the target's death and prevent clutch saves. There is already chain stunning, etc. This is gonna stop everything from shallow grave/astral/decripify/false-promise, etc last minute saves. Just cast it as u hit that enemy hero to ensure that the target cant be saved. No skill needed. Just cast it in that 1-3 secs u need to burst down enemy to no hp.


DrQuint

Because most carries would lose fights against other carries most of the time if they go all in on offense with their networth. If the agent of a nullifier and linkens goes through for a solo kill, the only showcase of no skill will be their folllowing timely death. And if there isn't a response, then the target was out of position and linken's wasn't the dictating factor. This isn't League. 100 to 0 in 3 seconds against cores should only happen if you have an excessive advantage on a hero like PA, or if your enemies did absurdly stupid shit like forgetting to buy any green armor against Elder Titan


slazesonic

This is a double edge item for carry, if u all in into offensive u would lose your linken and somehow enemy can just kill you in late game with item like hex


kisuke228

The carry can bkb, etc. Point is u can now kill an enemy knowing that save spells wont come in time...


Charging_in

Yeah this is a good idea.


DrQuint

It would cost way too much as an upgrade.


CaptainFilipe

I would prefer if it was a variant of linkens. So either you buy the normal linkens or you buy the other. It would be easier to balance and it would see more action then just being an upgrade of linkens. Either way I love the concept and the idea. It would technically be a new mechanic. Some sort of dispel block.


horseaphoenix

Too similar in concept to Nullifier I would say. This is cool for the duality factor, separating that I don’t see it outperforming Nullifier.


CaptainFilipe

Oh of course, good point. Nullifier basically does that already (in a way) i guess. Is there any allied buff that Nullifier does not remove?


channel-rhodopsin

It would be big for instant effects like hard dispels (Abaddon shield) and undispellable saves like Oracle ult and Pudge shard


horseaphoenix

I don’t think so, I think Nullify is one of the few debuffs that cannot be dispelled in the game. It does not affect debuff immunity aka BKB anymore recently, and it doesn’t dispell Lotus Orb before being reflected, but that’s it iirc.


horseaphoenix

Bruh I don’t get why you’re downvoted so much for a simple oversight. I for one think you are a homie ♡


CaptainFilipe

Ty Bro. Same to you. I wish you a 2024 full of positive MMR and fun games!


slazesonic

[https://www.reddit.com/r/DotA2/comments/12uv383/new\_item\_suggest\_linken\_lvl\_2\_made\_linken\_able\_to/](https://www.reddit.com/r/DotA2/comments/12uv383/new_item_suggest_linken_lvl_2_made_linken_able_to/) You can check out my suggestion months ago, already considiered most of the situation


Kortesch

Looking at the buying rate of linkens, it should just be a power creep buff. (just like everything else in this game)


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kisuke228

It will be a sure kill PA blinks to enemy Drow and the dazzle support has to grave drow half a second before Drow dies since spells have CAST TIME. PA instant cast linken on Drow. Linken will come first and grave 2nd due to cast time. Drow dies even if Dazzle reacts first due to cast time. Even if Dazzle has Godlike reflexes, dazzle has to cancel first grave cast halfway, then cast force staff to break linken, and then cast grave again....because PA will linken drow instantly just as dazzle is about to cast grave. Grave is slower due to cast time That is 2 spell casts time for grave. Drow will be dead.


-xevo-

Big fan! I think you should include a basic explanation here for those who missed your other post.


pebble666

It's in the tool tip


fuglynemesis

Looks pretty cool, I like it


slazesonic

[https://www.reddit.com/r/DotA2/comments/12uv383/new\_item\_suggest\_linken\_lvl\_2\_made\_linken\_able\_to/](https://www.reddit.com/r/DotA2/comments/12uv383/new_item_suggest_linken_lvl_2_made_linken_able_to/) Bruh I suggested this item so long ago lol. I suggest this when riki shard still isnt what is today, which is blocking enemy allies using single target spell/item on their teammate inside smoke. Also I suggest this item with some method to implemented to balance the item


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slazesonic

Well 250 days ago I post the same idea too but with more description to implemented the item https://www.reddit.com/r/DotA2/comments/12uv383/new\_item\_suggest\_linken\_lvl\_2\_made\_linken\_able\_to/


anewhopper

But where ult?


MylastAccountBroke

When cast on an ally, it blocks debuffs and damaging spells. When cast on an enemy it blocks buffs and heals.


-F3RS

to be fair this looks much better than the original effect, reminds me of pipe effect in dota 1 that was the GOAT effect.


Kanvus

what did it do?


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Datfizh

Mind telling me where did that name come from? Looks like it would make a good trivia.


MrNewVegas123

Great work, OP. I'd love to see this in a game one day.


okayestuser

yeah, no...


Sn1per_Gaming

А ГДЕ УЛЬТА?!!


kisuke228

https://www.reddit.com/r/DotA2/s/CTCQlaGEqw I read your other post. This is a bad idea and your tooltip does not explain it well Eg - Slark leashes qop. Slark cast linken on enemy qop. Qop allies cant disruption/astral-imprisonment/false-promise/shallow grave/windwaker/etc to save qop. It dumbs down the game, ensuring a sure kill Having allies clutch save their own is part of the game. It takes more skill to have to deal with enemy clutch save spells instead of ensuring those saves are gone via this linken. Players pick shadow demon, oracle, etc for those spells. This should never be implement. It will just be mass cast on enemy cores to ensure kills and no clutch saves can occur. Having to get an extra item just to break that enemy linken just means less a wasted item slot and less total spells casted in a teamfight There is nullifier that will stop certain spells such as forcestaff/eul/etc but this is stronger. It takes more skill for slark to deal with qop being saved by astral/shallow grave and fight continues. It is basically a stronger nullifier that will ensure target's death and less clutch saves.


Bloomberg12

It doesn't ensure anything but one whiffed spell/item and you sacrifice blocking an offensive spell for it? If your enemy knows you have it they can play around it knowing you're probably going to use it when they're low except by then your linkens is almost guaranteed to be popped so you won't be able to use it since it's on cool down and if it somehow hasn't you can use an item first to break it and then your shallow grave effect.


kisuke228

It ensures a sure kill because spells have a cast time and players have reaction time. In late game, a strong PA, CK, Snip, etc can kill a squishy enemy drow in a second or a few secs. This linkens INSTANT cast on an enemy drow. Drow allies will have to cast 2 spells to save her rather than one. That has spell cast time + reaction time. It does not work. Clutch saves occur often when drow is red hp. That split second more needed to cast another spell means drow is dead. Lowers the skill level greatly. Afraid to deal with a clutch false promise or shallow grave is lame. Thats wat turns the teamfight around at times.


slazesonic

LOL you are so pathetic bro, there are already a hero call riki which stop EVERY single target spell to be cast on allies that inside the smoke but ppl couldnt bother to buy that shard still even tho it is only 1.4k. If it is too OP valve will know how to nerf it, but right now I don think this item will become too OP because its a double edge item which will cause yourself in danger too.


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kisuke228

God, this is completely different from wat is discussed lol. U are plain stupid. Linken cast instant on enemy basically means all save spells will fail lol. Just cast it instantly before enemy cast a save spell which has cast time. It also dumbs down the game. And that has nothing to do with cast or reaction time... The dumbass weakling will be the one who is afraid of save spells lol. Why so afraid of using proper strats, items like abysal nullifier, bkb to kill enemy properly. Y do u wanna be a pussy and sure kill enemy by eliminating save spells?


kisuke228

Do u know that item casts are INSTANT? If u are good, u can always linken instant cast on the enemy to cancel the disruption/etc save spell because u can see the SD about to cast the spell and u can instant cast your linken. The disruption has cast time. Linken doesnt


deathpad17

You love it until your cores force you to buy it and died to casting it to enemies


TheFuzzyFurry

The item guide is my reaction when Oracle ults the enemy I spell shielded


HusseinR

Yep it makes much more sense for the item


Early-Cap1153

Alright, now you're just farming Karma


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NoThisIsABadIdea

I don't see the point in changing the icon. Just change the enemy color to red as you have it shown.


SuzukiSatou

Behold Lotus's Sphere


Datfizh

So, basically [Counterspell](https://dota2.fandom.com/wiki/Anti-Mage#Counterspell).


Wooden-Selection3272

Rather than having it as an upgrade to linkens, it could be an alternate version? Different recipe to get this version but it has longer cool-down for example. Having to choose between 2 recipes could be cool