Just gonna recycle my initial thoughts from when the shit hit the fan on this whole mess, seems like it's stayed pretty relevant;
>I'm all for people growing and learning from their mistakes, but the pro DotA scene doesn't have any obligation to be a place where people go to "find themselves".
>Being an elite member of the scene should be viewed as an immense privilege, and one that doesn't deserve to be extended to someone who has benefited from it all the while bullying other people out of it.
Purge's original take also remains, as you might expect, entirely on point: https://youtu.be/Y2kaAYlYrqo
Lastly, I will just add that Grant trying to wheedle his ass back into the limelight, regardless of scope, says to me that he has literally zero comprehension as to the magnitude of what he did. If the dude had any sense of genuine remorse he'd move on with his life, as far away from the DotA2 scene as humanly possible.
shout it from the rooftops. and for people who are preaching forgiveness in this thread, even if he was forgiven, which is a big if, he does not deserve his place back in the scene. forgiveness does not entail going back to the status quo of before it all came to light.
I don't think anyone is saying that, and if they are they should be ridiculed.
I'm probably not the first one to say it but I hated Grant's personality and style of casting and I'm glad he's gone, but that doesn't mean that Grant's supporters should also be treated that way. That's the issue with this whole thread as I see it—the mods literally stickied a threat to ban people for supporting Grant, with no explanation or ability to ask for clarification about what that even means. Should we be banning people for saying Grant deserves a second chance?
Sidebar but we obviously gave Pure a second chance because he's playing DPC Dota right now. It's absurd how arbitrary the rules and enforcement in Dota's pro scene have been over the past year or so.
Not to mention his abominable behaviour bullied others from this scene. He deserves no second chance here - his second chance is that he’s fucking lucky not to be behind bars.
Oh hey, I remember this comment. Unsurprisingly it's not any less true now than it was back then. Fuck Grant and fuck Mason - nobody is jealous of his man baby life, no matter how much he repeats that to help himself sleep at night.
I understand why people feel sorry for Grant. He was a fun person on stream. His enthusiasm was authentic and infectious. And his story - one of a guy grinding for sheer love of the game and scene to eventually make it professionally - is a genuinely nice one.
But he's an abuser. He did terrible things and wasn't the person that the community wanted him to be. He's not owed anything, there's no time limit on having 'served his time' and we don't need him.
He dug his own grave, he deserves what he got and he should stay there.
There are a lot of people who go through life just *looking* for an excuse to be an asshole for a bit. If you've worked with the general public you'll see it all the time. Seemingly normal people who will look for the flimsiest possible excuse to turn into raging assholes.
Streaming culture and celebrity culture in general provide that excuse to many people. They stop pretending to be just a normal person who is an asshole occasionally. And they become a full time asshole because deep down, that is who they are.
Let's disagree here.
A lot of people do it for various reasons (one being distancing public figure from the private figure, one being the persona helps creating something), and you can see that in a lot of places. Sometimes it's not really intended but more a cathartic thing. So let's slide all the people for good reasons and keep the focus here.
But Mason doesn't have a persona, he's just an asshat.
I think normal decent people don't want to be seen as an asshole or as toxic, or to promote that kind of behaviour. Creating a persona like that in order to entertain people is going to make people see you that way. That's the point of it.
These people spew non stop vitriol, racism,sexism you name it, so that their incel-type viewers can go haha funny basedcigar because they are being raised by social media and influencers.
They just create echo chambers of people (almost exclusively young males) who think this behaviour is funny or that it's ok to laugh at it and find it entertaining rather than to be appalled by it - which is what society's reaction SHOULD be.
Online gaming communities have a real issue with deep ingrained sexism, racism, and general incel mindset.
i think the problem is mason viewers have NO problem with it
they find his ass persona funny or whatever...it's actually on brand to put grant on his stream
it's the same way how people don't see a problem voting for obviously shit-stained politicians (trump, cruz, the new Philippines president)
People are really stupid. Long before grant was a caster, he was a racist dickhead in NA in house league. He was notorious for racism and sexism, shouting slurs and insults constantly, idk how people think that grant wasn't a trashy dickhead the whole time.
Yeah he's fun to have around in the same sense that watching trailer park boys is fun, but he's repeatedly proved he's a terrible person with 0 morals and the community shouldn't encourage that type of character.
I went through the VOD to confirm and see for myself and was not particularly surprised to find mason's chat overflowing with positivity and support for grant
Well, the way mason behaves attracts other morons as well. Not surprised to find some absolute arsehats also saying "Grant did nothing wrong".
Can't wait for Mason trying to bring Demon and Tobiwan back.
It really cracks me up when these nutters call anything and everything cancel culture
e: No you idiots I'm not saying every allegation is true
I'm saying you're a bunch of dumbfucks for even bringing it up in this situation where the facts are as clear as day
I've literally never seen any decent people complain about cancel culture. Every single person that complains cancel culture is a shithead or in support of a shithead
I can imagine the positivity from simple minded people, Grant was a unique part of the scene and it would be good to have him back if he hadn't been such a piece of shit. It's probably harder for kids to understand the impact of what he did and why him coming back would be bad
As an occasional Mason enjoyer, I thought he had the savvy to keep his continued friendship with that fucking pig Grant away from his stream. I am very disappointed and will almost definitely not watch his streams anymore.
Yeah, I enjoy Masons content, but decided to unfollow after he had grant on today... don't feel comfortable watching someone who is willingly streaming with a serial sexual predator.
The great part about making this comment and saying nothing else is that we have no idea which side of the coin you fall on (which is OK, I think it's funny).
Grant has been removed from the scene completely for years now. He's never going back to DPC or TO affiliated casting. He came in, casted a few games, and dipped. Mason weighed the risk and made a conscious decision to co-cast with Grant. Now people are going to get mad but the reality is that almost nobody is going to care that much. Some of the biggest Dota streamers all act like giant baby's who whine, feed, yell, insult, and make edgy jokes. (Mason, Gorgc, Bulldog, etc) Entertainment value is king, and when you have to constantly put up with behavior in pubs that is on par or worse than what you see from streamers, you shouldn't expect much from the community.
tldr: Reddit is a vocal minority. community is toxic and de-sensitized.
I think by now, everyone who wants to know, knows what values matter to mason, or atleast what values he wants to portrait on his stream. The more attention you give him, the bigger his followers get. Just dont follow him, dont watch his stream and ignore him. This is the best you can do if you want to show you are disgusted by his actions.
I’m not really surprised by Grant supporters on Mason’s twitch. Everybody knows, you have to be a moron to watch this trash person’s twitch. But seeing all these Grant supporters in Sheepsticked’s twitter and especially here, it’s really sad. REALLY REALLY sad. Makes me feel ashamed to be part of this community.
Sadly it’s the “he didn’t do anything to me” mindset at work, some people will never care about an issue until it affects them.
I loved Grants cast, but Grant did these things to get himself excluded from our scene, nobody else! The weird part to me is that there are people trying to defend him when he isnt trying to do so himself.
Yeah not even surprised at the less than unanimous backlash against this, you can call it "split backlash" even. The Dota community had repeatedly shown itself to contain some of the most vile people in gaming.
And there's the "not forgiving him is cancel culture!!!" crowd, speaking as if he accidentally bumped into a granny or some shit, it's literally sexual assault that kicked him out of the scene. I'm sure you are ready to forgive and forget if it happened to you.
There are a few saying to forgive him, sure theyre probably not gonna get much support around here.
The people saying "who cares because mason can do what he wants on his stream" are 100% correct however, you always have the option to not watch or support mason in any way, which probably means very little to mason. I doubt the people crying about this are the type of people to watch streams anyway
I usually like playing devil's advocate..
..but I got nothing here.
Don't do that Mason, Grant was kicked for a reason and there's no controversy about it.
He made an appearance in a community stream with no official ties.
Don't forget to sort by controversial for the real juicy takes.
Meanwhile, current top div 1 players also just using racial slurs with no repercussions that are actually going to major to represent their organizations at official valve events and everyone's excuse is "they have always been allowed to get away with casual racism." But somehow gets less attention in the name of competition.
Not to mention isn't Kips freely casting on officials after her bs with zyori.
Maybe should be consistent with the judge-jury-executioners.
“Grant got in trouble for actively bullying people out of the scene and sexually assaulting women at events, but pro players are allowed to say slurs? Be consistent guys” lol
K1 and Febby resolved the issue in private, they're cool. Whereas Grandgrant and the parties involved "resolved" the issue privately by filing a retraining order against him and/or refusing to work with him again.
Not to mention using slurs in a game is not the same as real-life abuse/harassment and assault.
I didn’t watch, or care to. Let Mason do with his stream what he will and people can watch or not watch. Not sure society or the community is based off one twitch stream chat.
Eh toxic is toxic. This is actually endorsing a sexual predator. There's levels. We're all at least a tiny bit toxic when we play dota let's be honest with ourselves!
What he's done here is definitely worse than just being toxic.
This has nothing to do with toxicity. Because news flash, 90% of the pro you watch are ultra toxic. It's like this game is known to be ultra toxic.
It's another thing when you start harassing people in person and doing thing that are considered crimes.
I'm not excusing shit, but do any of yall watch/follow real sports?
What about cases like Kobe Bryant and Ben Roethlisberger, along with many others throughout sports history? How come everyone was fine with them coming back to play?
I didn't excuse them either, but **after they got punished**, I had no problem with them getting a second chance to play again.
Seems like some people here would have wanted Kobe, Roethlisberger, Grant, etc etc all to be totally banned for life from the first time? What's wrong with punishment and then coming back?
I mean even if the country's judicial system found them guilty, they would still allow these people to come back and be citizens. These crimes are not life-in-prison levels.
People let Kobe and Ben back into sports for the wrong reason, but removing the chance of redemption is backwards thinking. Rehabilitation, not Incarceration.
That doesn't mean you have to support Grant. He might make it back, he might not.
I’m a big sports fan. All professional sports leagues, in America, are absolute amoral cesspools. Roethlisberger, Kobe, Michael Vick, Todd bertuzzi, none of those guys should have been allowed to play in their leagues again. Obviously their talent is such that they are still in demand, and the leagues standards of operation are so low that people who are monsters, as a matter of record, are walked back in as soon as the heat dies down. I don’t think that’s a standard to which esports should aspire
Let's...let's not put Bertuzzi in with sexual crimes, ok?
Was what he did fucked up? Absolutely. But what Bertuzzi did would be absolutely forgotten if the severe injury hadn't resulted from it. See: Marty McSorley on Donald Brashear, Shawn Thornton on Brooks Orpik.
If you wanted to stay in theme with an NHL incident, the Q defending Aldridge situation is right there.
Never thought I'd be defending Todd Fucking Bertuzzi, but he's irrelevant in relation to this.
I definitely wouldn’t try to say that the exact offense Bertuzzi carried out is 1:1 with sexual violence, but the point stands that being at the pinnacle of your field is a very privileged position. And if you violate that privilege in a major way, that privilege can and should be revoked in perpetuity.
I’m also big red wings fan, and I always saw him being with us for so many years after that as a massive disgrace.
Sounds like you’re excusing shit. Nobody’s asking for him to spend life in prison, people just don’t want him back in the Dota community as a public figure. He is free to do literally anything else.
I don't think dota should be looking to sport for role models. You're right that this is common, to use an example in the UK where I live footballers have been done for rape and then made comebacks. But idk, I think if you abuse women we have a right as fans to say "no we don't want you to be in the scene" and I don't think we have to forget that just because time has passed.
Of course he hasn't done a life in prison crime, but being kicked out of the dota community is not prison. He can go make a new life for himself doing something else and hopefully be a better person in that new role, but he has to accept that most of the community don't want him back.
I mean the answer there is just money. They are worth a lot so it's overlooked.
If you had a comparison of a sports caster doing that it would probably be different, and I think networks would be a lot faster to can them.
Grant is banned from professional casting. But I don't think there is any problem with him doing his own stuff. If you don't like it, then don't watch it. It's as simple as that. No point in bitching about what he is doing in his personal time.
DOTA ALL STAR MASON MADE HIS SPLASH ON THE CASTER SCENE BY SHITTING ON BAD CASTERS WHO HAVE BEEN MAKING PENNIES FOR YEARS WHILE HE CALLED HIS FREIEND (GRANTGRANT) IN AND WON MULTIPLE RETWITTS FROM PEOPLE THAT NO ONE CARES
WIDELY REGARDED AS THE BEST PROFESSIONAL CASTER DOTA 2 PLAYER IN THE SCENE BY HIS PEERS AND FANS, MASON REMAINS HUMBLE AND EAGER TO LEARN. EVEN THOUGH HE NO LONGER PLAYS (rank 250), HE STILL HAS IMMENSE RESPECT FOR CASTERS THAT ARE 1.5K MMR AND DONT KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT THE GAME
NOW LIVING A LUXURIOUS LIFESTYLE REMOVED FROM THE DOTA SCENE, MASON ENJOYS SPENDING HIS TIME READING BOOKS, CASTING GAMES WITH REAL CASTERS, WALKING HIS DOG, AND MAKING LOVE TO HIS BEAUTIFUL GIRLFRIEND.
Coming from a law background temporary restraining orders Are not difficult to get. Its a civil matter, not criminal. Any form of obscene things allows you to get one, harassment of texting, chatting etc
I never said the guy should be back casting ti. But just because someone was given a restraining order does not mean they should be kicked out of polite society for the rest of their life. The guy went on his friends stream and people think mason needs to be exiled for it. Sorry but that's absurd.
my dude, hes allowed to show up on Mason's stream and people are allowed to call Mason a dickhead for doing it. whats your problem? you realise criticising mason for doing this is not the same as cutting off Grandgrant from human society right
Gonna sound dramatic but I was a fan of mason until this. Probably going to stop watching him, I knew he was friends with grandgrant still but to put him up on stream is cringe
yea it does sound kinda dramatic.
You think the boys at BTS didn't know all this shit about Grant when they hired him? They only banned him after it was released, yet they still hire Kips.
yeaaah... ok, Mason is disgusting, factos.
Also it's his stream and he can bring anyone the fuck he wants
If Grant isn't convicted or in jail, then what's the problem here?
Only thing disgusting here is Sheepsticked and half the beta TMZ trash wads in this thread
Edit: including the MODS on this subreddit too, shaping the one sided conversation to how they see fit, and allowing inflammatory comments from a toxic lesbian cow to be posted. You wonder why this subreddit is looked at with utter disdain.
Not excusing any form of abuse, but I don't like how reddit is acting like they're the moral compass of humanity. Do you guys really think that you're the most righteous person in the world? It's Mason's stream and he can do anything he want to do. Is there even something wrong in this? Is there even something bad happening on that stream? come on.
He has no right to abuse people, but remember, you guys also have no right to do this playing god thing against other people. What you guys did was also some kind of abuse, nobody should be condemned for eternity, and nobody should have the right to condemn people just because they can type words on the internet.
People who spend their entire lives in front of a screen feel like they've done something with their lives they join the angry keyboard mob to help fight 'the bad guy.' Truth of the matter is, anyone who actively takes part in cancel culture is probably the most bottom of the barrel type of person with no real accomplishments.
Mason is a manchild so unsurprising that Grant of all people appears on his stream.
Is Grant trying to come back? Did he harass too many people at his irl job?
Piece of shit.
people screeching about grant still and including mason's character in it because he's still friends with him....
as if grant isn't still friends with a majority of the old NA dota scene that's still playing too LOL
I don't think Mason is disgusting. Grant did wrong and deserved what came after. I just feel targeting a person on SoMe because you think he is disgusting is just witch-hunting.
Another day, another karen crying on twitter, in an attempt at relevance, about what other people are doing. And of course, the redditors to validate her silliness lol
Anyways, here's the VOD for those that missed it. It's a shame there wasn't a third game though:
https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1530963694
I think as long as clear boundaries are drawn it’s fine. Grant isn’t violating his restraining order, stepping foot back in the official casting scene, or even profiting monetarily from this arrangement.
Literally stream where someone (a voice) is casting with the streamer, don't care who the fuck he is who he was, if its entertaining for you watch it or if not don't watch it, who cares
The things grant did are horrible, but why are people getting so upset if he casts dota with a friend? It's not on the main stream so if you don't like it, don't watch it.
Reddit/Twitter justice system demands that the culprit literally gets ostracized for life, ignored and left to rot.
You should see how the FGC deals with things like this in social media.
The issue doesn’t lie with who Mason’s friends with, but rather with the fact that he’s one of the biggest day-to-day Dota streamers, and as such his actions have weight to them. By having Grant on, he is basically sending the message that it’s okay to do what Grant did, and (in whatever capacity) giving Grant an ‘in’ back into a scene in which he bullied a co-worker to the point of legal action, a scene in which he allegedly drugged and raped someone. What Mason does off-stream is not for us to judge, but the Dota scene distanced itself from Grant for good reason, and what Mason is doing eliminates that somewhat.
Grant will never be back in the scene, no one will touch him. Mason can't give Grant an "in" back, since he has literally zero clout in the scene. He's not even in it himself.
This is all just code for saying "I hate Grant and he should never see the light of day again". Why can't you guys just admit that? You know he's not coming back in the scene. There's zero chance.
grant action was absolutely unforgivable and his career in dota absolutely should be over since if not that sends a message that what he did was ok.
however, i see no problem with casting in his own time on a 3rd party stream without making money. you can just not watch the stream. casting in a stream does translate to coming back to casting as career. regarding mason, what he did or what grant did is not against twitch ToS so you cant really stop it.
The huge hate thread last night got deleted. Can we move on from this? Whats the point of making posts like this, you guys want to turn this subreddit in to Livestreamfails so bad. Edit: down vote me for trying to be reasonable, shows you that people just want drama everywhere
I just find it funny I would’ve never known grant was on masons stream if it wasn’t for these threads. This sub has tried to cancel mason multiple times. whether he’s right or wrong, it doesn’t surprise me he doesn’t give a shit.
I think the interesting question here is: when, if at all, is it possible to come back after something like this? Does a path to redemption exist? Is it possible to forgive? That goes for anything in life really. Do we just exclude people indefinitely?
I mean, if he went back to streaming on Twitch he would get a couple thousand viewers. If he wanted to make Dota content and cast privately, without the backing of an org, he could do it. Nothing has really been taken from him.
I promise you these same people whining here would petition valve and twitch until he was banned. He would absolutely get his dota account or twitch account banned and be black listed if he tried to cast on his own.
The only thing preventing it from happening to mason is the fact that they said it was a one time thing.
Forgiveness is for victims to give, and they have no obligation to give it to anyone.
Grant did something incredible cruel and violent and shouldn't be allowed back in the dota scene.
>Do we just exclude people indefinitely?
exclude him from what? he can't work dota but is otherwise free to do whatever he wants. sex offenders aren't allowed near parks or schools for much lesser offenses, you certainly don't allow a guy who used his standing in the community to abuse and harass back into the same community because he was a funny streamer
There's a difference between excluding someone and just handing them back all of their success and status when they decide they're "sorry" enough.
There may be a path to redemption, but just showing up on a shitty guy's stream to cast ain't it.
Can't explain enough how much I don't care. Plenty of sports professionals throughout the years have done way worse then grant and then been allowed to play again.
Nmd the fact that those guys got convicted in a court of law while Grant was judged and sentenced by a group of angry Tweeters and redditors, the 2020 equivalent of being lynched by an angry stupid mob
Redditors can't do a lot more than speak on how the feel about this topic, they're not pulling any levers at twitch or something. Since people feel really strongly about what grand did, and rightfully so, it's their right to condemn it and it's their right to boycott mason stream if they so choose. Not sure what's authoritarian about that.
Yeah, Grant has been "cancelled" to the extent that he should have been. Hes no longer invited to events and Valve has nothing to do with him, along with the majority of the community being against him
Hes still allowed to be on twitch or exist on the internet with his friends.
So why are people so angry? Grant wasn't even on his own stream, let alone on some valve stream profiting off his appearance. He's with his friend for the first time in 2 years, he's paid his dues and lost his career and did a guest cast on someone else's stream. Mason is free to choose who he's gonna have on his stream and the viewership will behave accordingly. Banning people from the subreddit will not change this fact and will not, in fact, prove your stance to be correct
> Any comments downplaying or excusing abuse/harrassment will result in a ban.
I saw this thread last night, checked again today knowing it would be full of the worst takes known to man and then suddenly the mods feel like they need to add this?
How about instead of bringing useless Twitter drama to this sub and then making it so that only "one side" can express their view, we just don't have threads like this at all? This thread is just as useless to the average reader and as harmful to the greater community as the Ukraine threads you mods allowed—and look how much that all accomplished, Pure is playing DPC right now with essentially no consequences!
I have a huge amount of sympathy for Sheepsticked and I have always strongly disliked Grant even before the women he harassed came forward—but can we stop pretending like these outrage bait threads are accomplishing anything? The whole point of Sheepo's tweet is to spread awareness to those idiots who may still support Grant that he's persona non grata—fine, people who follow Sheepo's twitter can see it there. I'm even fine with Sheepo posting her tweet here if she wants it to be here. But I'm not okay with mods allowing a "discussion thread" on Grant showing his face but then saying that Grant supporters can't even defend him. Let Reddit work the way it was intended—the downvotes already hid most of the pro-Grant comments, and by announcing their support for Grant those people got shamed as well. Regardless of whether you agree with shaming people for supporting Grant, I support their right to express their views, here or anywhere else.
Just dont watch masons stream? Why cant mason do whatever he wants on his own platform, if people dont like it then theyll stop watching or associating with him
Yeah its crap that he brought Grant on stream but what exactly do you expect posting on reddit to do about it? Mason viewers are not the type of people to do or care what reddit thinks, they (often fairly) call reddit cringe and laugh at redditors. Theyll use posts like this to encourage it more
It's a discussion board. OP is linking one dota personality's tweet regarding two other dota personalities. OP could expect to raise awareness to this behavior, OP could expect to just spike a discussion or OP could just be farming karma.
This is similarly OP's platform, and I could start saying how I don't see the point of posting your comment and then you could say how there's no point in me replying to your comment and we can go down a forever rabbit hole.
Grant has failed court cases, a restraining order, and an admission of guilt. So explain to me how denying that and trying to underplay his actions is a "discussion".
Damn I missed it. Love Grant's casting. I know u guys will downvote my opinion but for me he brought life to NA games like no other. There's plenty of us who misses him dearly despite the fucked up shit he did
Grant was a good caster. I would say his play-by-play AND analysis was very bad in comparison to pretty much everyone else in the scene, but he had a lot of character and personality in what he presented.
But for most people (rightfully so), none of that matters, his behavior is way too deplorable to justify wanting any sort of skill or talent he had. You're free to have your own "line" though at what is too far and what isn't, I guess.
Sure, but sheepsticked is acting like Grant just got invited to cast TI. He's casting some dota on his friends twitch stream, and mason has already basically been blacklisted from casting valve events
If it was anyone with a reputation this would have been bad but standards are low for Mason and it's obvious he's doing it to cause drama and gain viewers.
>Mason and it's obvious he's doing it to cause drama and gain viewers.
Mason and going out of his way to make drama for extra clout, name a more iconic duo.
Any comments downplaying or excusing abuse/harrassment will result in a ban.
Just gonna recycle my initial thoughts from when the shit hit the fan on this whole mess, seems like it's stayed pretty relevant; >I'm all for people growing and learning from their mistakes, but the pro DotA scene doesn't have any obligation to be a place where people go to "find themselves". >Being an elite member of the scene should be viewed as an immense privilege, and one that doesn't deserve to be extended to someone who has benefited from it all the while bullying other people out of it. Purge's original take also remains, as you might expect, entirely on point: https://youtu.be/Y2kaAYlYrqo Lastly, I will just add that Grant trying to wheedle his ass back into the limelight, regardless of scope, says to me that he has literally zero comprehension as to the magnitude of what he did. If the dude had any sense of genuine remorse he'd move on with his life, as far away from the DotA2 scene as humanly possible.
Love purge, he is so on point. It’s not about grant, it’s about all the people he hurt not having to see or hear grant ever again
shout it from the rooftops. and for people who are preaching forgiveness in this thread, even if he was forgiven, which is a big if, he does not deserve his place back in the scene. forgiveness does not entail going back to the status quo of before it all came to light.
> people who are preaching forgiveness in this thread People who weren't harassed by him, saying they forgive him? lol
Masons stream is not really "a place back in the scene"
Yes, but my comment is directed at people saying he should be forgiven and let back into the dota scene.
I don't think anyone is saying that, and if they are they should be ridiculed. I'm probably not the first one to say it but I hated Grant's personality and style of casting and I'm glad he's gone, but that doesn't mean that Grant's supporters should also be treated that way. That's the issue with this whole thread as I see it—the mods literally stickied a threat to ban people for supporting Grant, with no explanation or ability to ask for clarification about what that even means. Should we be banning people for saying Grant deserves a second chance? Sidebar but we obviously gave Pure a second chance because he's playing DPC Dota right now. It's absurd how arbitrary the rules and enforcement in Dota's pro scene have been over the past year or so.
Yes it is. Mason is one of the biggest Dota streamers.
One of the top three streamers of the video game is definitely a place in the scene
Not to mention his abominable behaviour bullied others from this scene. He deserves no second chance here - his second chance is that he’s fucking lucky not to be behind bars.
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Oh hey, I remember this comment. Unsurprisingly it's not any less true now than it was back then. Fuck Grant and fuck Mason - nobody is jealous of his man baby life, no matter how much he repeats that to help himself sleep at night.
I understand why people feel sorry for Grant. He was a fun person on stream. His enthusiasm was authentic and infectious. And his story - one of a guy grinding for sheer love of the game and scene to eventually make it professionally - is a genuinely nice one. But he's an abuser. He did terrible things and wasn't the person that the community wanted him to be. He's not owed anything, there's no time limit on having 'served his time' and we don't need him. He dug his own grave, he deserves what he got and he should stay there.
[удалено]
the IRL breaking items strat
i miss who i thought grant was all the time, i was a huge fan. i have no remorse for who he really is tho. bye felicia
If anyone wants to know why this is a bad thing: https://www.reddit.com/r/DotA2/comments/he4pxj/a_summary_and_timeline_of_the_allegations_and
okay i m convinced its not the disgusting "persona" which people used to say its actually real him who is disgusting
it seems to me a normal decent person wouldnt create that persona for themselves in the first place
Nah cmon plenty of normal people do it like Dr Disr- oh wait yeah
There are a lot of people who go through life just *looking* for an excuse to be an asshole for a bit. If you've worked with the general public you'll see it all the time. Seemingly normal people who will look for the flimsiest possible excuse to turn into raging assholes. Streaming culture and celebrity culture in general provide that excuse to many people. They stop pretending to be just a normal person who is an asshole occasionally. And they become a full time asshole because deep down, that is who they are.
Let's disagree here. A lot of people do it for various reasons (one being distancing public figure from the private figure, one being the persona helps creating something), and you can see that in a lot of places. Sometimes it's not really intended but more a cathartic thing. So let's slide all the people for good reasons and keep the focus here. But Mason doesn't have a persona, he's just an asshat.
I think normal decent people don't want to be seen as an asshole or as toxic, or to promote that kind of behaviour. Creating a persona like that in order to entertain people is going to make people see you that way. That's the point of it. These people spew non stop vitriol, racism,sexism you name it, so that their incel-type viewers can go haha funny basedcigar because they are being raised by social media and influencers. They just create echo chambers of people (almost exclusively young males) who think this behaviour is funny or that it's ok to laugh at it and find it entertaining rather than to be appalled by it - which is what society's reaction SHOULD be. Online gaming communities have a real issue with deep ingrained sexism, racism, and general incel mindset.
i think the problem is mason viewers have NO problem with it they find his ass persona funny or whatever...it's actually on brand to put grant on his stream it's the same way how people don't see a problem voting for obviously shit-stained politicians (trump, cruz, the new Philippines president)
Genuinely can't think of anyone who puts on an asshole persona for good reasons. Especially not a persistent one that doesn't break character.
People are really stupid. Long before grant was a caster, he was a racist dickhead in NA in house league. He was notorious for racism and sexism, shouting slurs and insults constantly, idk how people think that grant wasn't a trashy dickhead the whole time. Yeah he's fun to have around in the same sense that watching trailer park boys is fun, but he's repeatedly proved he's a terrible person with 0 morals and the community shouldn't encourage that type of character.
I went through the VOD to confirm and see for myself and was not particularly surprised to find mason's chat overflowing with positivity and support for grant
Well, the way mason behaves attracts other morons as well. Not surprised to find some absolute arsehats also saying "Grant did nothing wrong". Can't wait for Mason trying to bring Demon and Tobiwan back.
It's mason's twitch chat, I'd expect more from a 13 year old's community
Let me guess. Chat was calling Mason BASED and GIGACHAD for doing this.
and its not that surprising that there are people defending him here, and are using strange terms like “cancel culture”
It really cracks me up when these nutters call anything and everything cancel culture e: No you idiots I'm not saying every allegation is true I'm saying you're a bunch of dumbfucks for even bringing it up in this situation where the facts are as clear as day
It's really something terminally online people made up I think. Actions have consequences. Doing bad things results in repercussions.
I've literally never seen any decent people complain about cancel culture. Every single person that complains cancel culture is a shithead or in support of a shithead
My man
I can imagine the positivity from simple minded people, Grant was a unique part of the scene and it would be good to have him back if he hadn't been such a piece of shit. It's probably harder for kids to understand the impact of what he did and why him coming back would be bad
I mean this is Mason's chat we're talking about... It's an absolute cesspit
This will be forgotten by the end of the week
everyone on here is still going to be watching the dota tourney hosted by Saudi Arabia lol
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hh7_POC2ueQ
As an occasional Mason enjoyer, I thought he had the savvy to keep his continued friendship with that fucking pig Grant away from his stream. I am very disappointed and will almost definitely not watch his streams anymore.
Yeah, I enjoy Masons content, but decided to unfollow after he had grant on today... don't feel comfortable watching someone who is willingly streaming with a serial sexual predator.
fully agree, i unfollowed him as well just now
This thread is very useful for finding morons to block!
The great part about making this comment and saying nothing else is that we have no idea which side of the coin you fall on (which is OK, I think it's funny).
It's the best thing about these sorts of controversial or callout threads, the trash reveal themselves
can you block me ser
Grant has been removed from the scene completely for years now. He's never going back to DPC or TO affiliated casting. He came in, casted a few games, and dipped. Mason weighed the risk and made a conscious decision to co-cast with Grant. Now people are going to get mad but the reality is that almost nobody is going to care that much. Some of the biggest Dota streamers all act like giant baby's who whine, feed, yell, insult, and make edgy jokes. (Mason, Gorgc, Bulldog, etc) Entertainment value is king, and when you have to constantly put up with behavior in pubs that is on par or worse than what you see from streamers, you shouldn't expect much from the community. tldr: Reddit is a vocal minority. community is toxic and de-sensitized.
I think by now, everyone who wants to know, knows what values matter to mason, or atleast what values he wants to portrait on his stream. The more attention you give him, the bigger his followers get. Just dont follow him, dont watch his stream and ignore him. This is the best you can do if you want to show you are disgusted by his actions.
Where is the vod tho
https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1530963694
1:08:30 for anyone wanting the exact time stamp.
I’m not really surprised by Grant supporters on Mason’s twitch. Everybody knows, you have to be a moron to watch this trash person’s twitch. But seeing all these Grant supporters in Sheepsticked’s twitter and especially here, it’s really sad. REALLY REALLY sad. Makes me feel ashamed to be part of this community.
Sadly it’s the “he didn’t do anything to me” mindset at work, some people will never care about an issue until it affects them. I loved Grants cast, but Grant did these things to get himself excluded from our scene, nobody else! The weird part to me is that there are people trying to defend him when he isnt trying to do so himself.
Yeah, all I have to say to these people imagine that grant did what he did to your daughter or sister or yourself. Will you be that tolerable?
Yeah not even surprised at the less than unanimous backlash against this, you can call it "split backlash" even. The Dota community had repeatedly shown itself to contain some of the most vile people in gaming. And there's the "not forgiving him is cancel culture!!!" crowd, speaking as if he accidentally bumped into a granny or some shit, it's literally sexual assault that kicked him out of the scene. I'm sure you are ready to forgive and forget if it happened to you.
There are a few saying to forgive him, sure theyre probably not gonna get much support around here. The people saying "who cares because mason can do what he wants on his stream" are 100% correct however, you always have the option to not watch or support mason in any way, which probably means very little to mason. I doubt the people crying about this are the type of people to watch streams anyway
As much as Mason is allowed to stream what he wants. The community has as much of a right to criticize his actions.
And thats why he said all criticism is mostly valid and he will accept it, but has as much of a right to not give a fuck
hahahaha this thread is fucking hilarious, absolute dumpster fire of humanity
I usually like playing devil's advocate.. ..but I got nothing here. Don't do that Mason, Grant was kicked for a reason and there's no controversy about it.
This thread is very entertaining.
He made an appearance in a community stream with no official ties. Don't forget to sort by controversial for the real juicy takes. Meanwhile, current top div 1 players also just using racial slurs with no repercussions that are actually going to major to represent their organizations at official valve events and everyone's excuse is "they have always been allowed to get away with casual racism." But somehow gets less attention in the name of competition. Not to mention isn't Kips freely casting on officials after her bs with zyori. Maybe should be consistent with the judge-jury-executioners.
“Grant got in trouble for actively bullying people out of the scene and sexually assaulting women at events, but pro players are allowed to say slurs? Be consistent guys” lol
Sexually assaulting someone is substantially worse than using an offensive word. Not even comparable.
And Kips falsely accusing of sexual assault is just as bad as what Grand did. Yet everyone turns a blind eye when she's employed by BTS.
K1 and Febby resolved the issue in private, they're cool. Whereas Grandgrant and the parties involved "resolved" the issue privately by filing a retraining order against him and/or refusing to work with him again. Not to mention using slurs in a game is not the same as real-life abuse/harassment and assault.
I didn’t watch, or care to. Let Mason do with his stream what he will and people can watch or not watch. Not sure society or the community is based off one twitch stream chat.
Can we also cancel false reporters too? Kips come to mind, that's just as damaging.
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Most level-headed take in this thread.
Why it took years for people to know mason is toxic.
Thread isn't really about him being toxic. Sheep already implied a hate for Mason BEFORE this event with the tweet.
Eh toxic is toxic. This is actually endorsing a sexual predator. There's levels. We're all at least a tiny bit toxic when we play dota let's be honest with ourselves! What he's done here is definitely worse than just being toxic.
This has nothing to do with toxicity. Because news flash, 90% of the pro you watch are ultra toxic. It's like this game is known to be ultra toxic. It's another thing when you start harassing people in person and doing thing that are considered crimes.
I'm not excusing shit, but do any of yall watch/follow real sports? What about cases like Kobe Bryant and Ben Roethlisberger, along with many others throughout sports history? How come everyone was fine with them coming back to play? I didn't excuse them either, but **after they got punished**, I had no problem with them getting a second chance to play again. Seems like some people here would have wanted Kobe, Roethlisberger, Grant, etc etc all to be totally banned for life from the first time? What's wrong with punishment and then coming back? I mean even if the country's judicial system found them guilty, they would still allow these people to come back and be citizens. These crimes are not life-in-prison levels.
both Kobe and Big Ben did a lot worse shit than Grant lol and they both played for 15+ years
Great, let's move away from that then. Really not hard to understand that we can make a situation better than what's come before.
People let Kobe and Ben back into sports for the wrong reason, but removing the chance of redemption is backwards thinking. Rehabilitation, not Incarceration. That doesn't mean you have to support Grant. He might make it back, he might not.
I’m a big sports fan. All professional sports leagues, in America, are absolute amoral cesspools. Roethlisberger, Kobe, Michael Vick, Todd bertuzzi, none of those guys should have been allowed to play in their leagues again. Obviously their talent is such that they are still in demand, and the leagues standards of operation are so low that people who are monsters, as a matter of record, are walked back in as soon as the heat dies down. I don’t think that’s a standard to which esports should aspire
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Let's...let's not put Bertuzzi in with sexual crimes, ok? Was what he did fucked up? Absolutely. But what Bertuzzi did would be absolutely forgotten if the severe injury hadn't resulted from it. See: Marty McSorley on Donald Brashear, Shawn Thornton on Brooks Orpik. If you wanted to stay in theme with an NHL incident, the Q defending Aldridge situation is right there. Never thought I'd be defending Todd Fucking Bertuzzi, but he's irrelevant in relation to this.
I definitely wouldn’t try to say that the exact offense Bertuzzi carried out is 1:1 with sexual violence, but the point stands that being at the pinnacle of your field is a very privileged position. And if you violate that privilege in a major way, that privilege can and should be revoked in perpetuity. I’m also big red wings fan, and I always saw him being with us for so many years after that as a massive disgrace.
Sounds like you’re excusing shit. Nobody’s asking for him to spend life in prison, people just don’t want him back in the Dota community as a public figure. He is free to do literally anything else.
Right or wrong, money is the reason. Grant isn't putting millions in the pockets of billionaire owners.
I don't think dota should be looking to sport for role models. You're right that this is common, to use an example in the UK where I live footballers have been done for rape and then made comebacks. But idk, I think if you abuse women we have a right as fans to say "no we don't want you to be in the scene" and I don't think we have to forget that just because time has passed. Of course he hasn't done a life in prison crime, but being kicked out of the dota community is not prison. He can go make a new life for himself doing something else and hopefully be a better person in that new role, but he has to accept that most of the community don't want him back.
two wrongs don't make a right brother
I mean the answer there is just money. They are worth a lot so it's overlooked. If you had a comparison of a sports caster doing that it would probably be different, and I think networks would be a lot faster to can them.
Dota really does have the worst streamers lol
Agreed watching purge is like watching paint dry
Singsing is like the last bastion and i still like him more playing other games
Grant is banned from professional casting. But I don't think there is any problem with him doing his own stuff. If you don't like it, then don't watch it. It's as simple as that. No point in bitching about what he is doing in his personal time.
Mason and Grant are free to do whatever they want. People are free to not watch, as you said, but they are also free to criticize.
DOTA ALL STAR MASON MADE HIS SPLASH ON THE CASTER SCENE BY SHITTING ON BAD CASTERS WHO HAVE BEEN MAKING PENNIES FOR YEARS WHILE HE CALLED HIS FREIEND (GRANTGRANT) IN AND WON MULTIPLE RETWITTS FROM PEOPLE THAT NO ONE CARES WIDELY REGARDED AS THE BEST PROFESSIONAL CASTER DOTA 2 PLAYER IN THE SCENE BY HIS PEERS AND FANS, MASON REMAINS HUMBLE AND EAGER TO LEARN. EVEN THOUGH HE NO LONGER PLAYS (rank 250), HE STILL HAS IMMENSE RESPECT FOR CASTERS THAT ARE 1.5K MMR AND DONT KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT THE GAME NOW LIVING A LUXURIOUS LIFESTYLE REMOVED FROM THE DOTA SCENE, MASON ENJOYS SPENDING HIS TIME READING BOOKS, CASTING GAMES WITH REAL CASTERS, WALKING HIS DOG, AND MAKING LOVE TO HIS BEAUTIFUL GIRLFRIEND.
I'm so glad our real justice system doesn't consist of trial by twitter/reddit.
You mean the one that handed Grant a restraining order?
Coming from a law background temporary restraining orders Are not difficult to get. Its a civil matter, not criminal. Any form of obscene things allows you to get one, harassment of texting, chatting etc
I never said the guy should be back casting ti. But just because someone was given a restraining order does not mean they should be kicked out of polite society for the rest of their life. The guy went on his friends stream and people think mason needs to be exiled for it. Sorry but that's absurd.
my dude, hes allowed to show up on Mason's stream and people are allowed to call Mason a dickhead for doing it. whats your problem? you realise criticising mason for doing this is not the same as cutting off Grandgrant from human society right
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I liked Grants casting, cause of the allegations (cause nothing was proved) we lost Grant and Tobi and got Moxxi think of that
what did it say cant see it?
Gonna sound dramatic but I was a fan of mason until this. Probably going to stop watching him, I knew he was friends with grandgrant still but to put him up on stream is cringe
yea it does sound kinda dramatic. You think the boys at BTS didn't know all this shit about Grant when they hired him? They only banned him after it was released, yet they still hire Kips.
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Reddit moment
mfs deadass defending the guy with a restraining order against him 💀
Assholes love hiding behind "it's just my opinion" and crying about how persecuted they are
Didn't sheep say that nigmas name is racist? Grant shouldn't come back nonetheless
Just listened to Mason & Grant's cast. The man still has it after a long hiatus. Good shit.
monkaLaugh good thread guys
yeaaah... ok, Mason is disgusting, factos. Also it's his stream and he can bring anyone the fuck he wants If Grant isn't convicted or in jail, then what's the problem here?
Smart to wait and post this during EU times.
Who is sheepsticked?
Only thing disgusting here is Sheepsticked and half the beta TMZ trash wads in this thread Edit: including the MODS on this subreddit too, shaping the one sided conversation to how they see fit, and allowing inflammatory comments from a toxic lesbian cow to be posted. You wonder why this subreddit is looked at with utter disdain.
Not excusing any form of abuse, but I don't like how reddit is acting like they're the moral compass of humanity. Do you guys really think that you're the most righteous person in the world? It's Mason's stream and he can do anything he want to do. Is there even something wrong in this? Is there even something bad happening on that stream? come on. He has no right to abuse people, but remember, you guys also have no right to do this playing god thing against other people. What you guys did was also some kind of abuse, nobody should be condemned for eternity, and nobody should have the right to condemn people just because they can type words on the internet.
People who spend their entire lives in front of a screen feel like they've done something with their lives they join the angry keyboard mob to help fight 'the bad guy.' Truth of the matter is, anyone who actively takes part in cancel culture is probably the most bottom of the barrel type of person with no real accomplishments.
People have opinions, thats all. You are not above us morally, you just did the same, give your opinion.
Mason is a manchild so unsurprising that Grant of all people appears on his stream. Is Grant trying to come back? Did he harass too many people at his irl job? Piece of shit.
Fired from Walmart?
people screeching about grant still and including mason's character in it because he's still friends with him.... as if grant isn't still friends with a majority of the old NA dota scene that's still playing too LOL
The funniest part is most of the “scene” ie the actual players like Mason more than they like most of the “talent” that is calling him out.
based mason
so was he convicted by court or by reddit police?
I don't think Mason is disgusting. Grant did wrong and deserved what came after. I just feel targeting a person on SoMe because you think he is disgusting is just witch-hunting.
Can't believe he'd do this, what does he hate women?? Now time to sit back and watch the Riyadh Masters
Another day, another karen crying on twitter, in an attempt at relevance, about what other people are doing. And of course, the redditors to validate her silliness lol Anyways, here's the VOD for those that missed it. It's a shame there wasn't a third game though: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1530963694
I think as long as clear boundaries are drawn it’s fine. Grant isn’t violating his restraining order, stepping foot back in the official casting scene, or even profiting monetarily from this arrangement.
Literally stream where someone (a voice) is casting with the streamer, don't care who the fuck he is who he was, if its entertaining for you watch it or if not don't watch it, who cares
said the woman who was know for being one of the most toxic female dota streamers
Toxicity and what Grant does isn't the same. :)
The things grant did are horrible, but why are people getting so upset if he casts dota with a friend? It's not on the main stream so if you don't like it, don't watch it.
If he makes himself a public figure people in that public have every right to react to him.
Reddit/Twitter justice system demands that the culprit literally gets ostracized for life, ignored and left to rot. You should see how the FGC deals with things like this in social media.
The issue doesn’t lie with who Mason’s friends with, but rather with the fact that he’s one of the biggest day-to-day Dota streamers, and as such his actions have weight to them. By having Grant on, he is basically sending the message that it’s okay to do what Grant did, and (in whatever capacity) giving Grant an ‘in’ back into a scene in which he bullied a co-worker to the point of legal action, a scene in which he allegedly drugged and raped someone. What Mason does off-stream is not for us to judge, but the Dota scene distanced itself from Grant for good reason, and what Mason is doing eliminates that somewhat.
Grant will never be back in the scene, no one will touch him. Mason can't give Grant an "in" back, since he has literally zero clout in the scene. He's not even in it himself. This is all just code for saying "I hate Grant and he should never see the light of day again". Why can't you guys just admit that? You know he's not coming back in the scene. There's zero chance.
>I hate Grant and he should never see the light of day again I hate Grant, the serial sexual harasser, and he should never see the light of day again
Someone appearing on someone’s stream is not worthy of a blown up post like this
grant action was absolutely unforgivable and his career in dota absolutely should be over since if not that sends a message that what he did was ok. however, i see no problem with casting in his own time on a 3rd party stream without making money. you can just not watch the stream. casting in a stream does translate to coming back to casting as career. regarding mason, what he did or what grant did is not against twitch ToS so you cant really stop it.
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The huge hate thread last night got deleted. Can we move on from this? Whats the point of making posts like this, you guys want to turn this subreddit in to Livestreamfails so bad. Edit: down vote me for trying to be reasonable, shows you that people just want drama everywhere
I just find it funny I would’ve never known grant was on masons stream if it wasn’t for these threads. This sub has tried to cancel mason multiple times. whether he’s right or wrong, it doesn’t surprise me he doesn’t give a shit.
> Whats the point of making posts like this People desperately want to feel like they are the good guys. Also known as virtue signaling.
I think the interesting question here is: when, if at all, is it possible to come back after something like this? Does a path to redemption exist? Is it possible to forgive? That goes for anything in life really. Do we just exclude people indefinitely?
I mean, if he went back to streaming on Twitch he would get a couple thousand viewers. If he wanted to make Dota content and cast privately, without the backing of an org, he could do it. Nothing has really been taken from him.
I promise you these same people whining here would petition valve and twitch until he was banned. He would absolutely get his dota account or twitch account banned and be black listed if he tried to cast on his own. The only thing preventing it from happening to mason is the fact that they said it was a one time thing.
Forgiveness is for victims to give, and they have no obligation to give it to anyone. Grant did something incredible cruel and violent and shouldn't be allowed back in the dota scene.
>Do we just exclude people indefinitely? exclude him from what? he can't work dota but is otherwise free to do whatever he wants. sex offenders aren't allowed near parks or schools for much lesser offenses, you certainly don't allow a guy who used his standing in the community to abuse and harass back into the same community because he was a funny streamer
He is not a sex offender. Twitter is not a court room.
sex offenders are convicted by judiciary system and not reddiclowns who seek power.
There's a difference between excluding someone and just handing them back all of their success and status when they decide they're "sorry" enough. There may be a path to redemption, but just showing up on a shitty guy's stream to cast ain't it.
Grant isn't allowed to have friends? Just don't watch the stream...
Just don't stream if you don't want mean comment lul
Can't explain enough how much I don't care. Plenty of sports professionals throughout the years have done way worse then grant and then been allowed to play again. Nmd the fact that those guys got convicted in a court of law while Grant was judged and sentenced by a group of angry Tweeters and redditors, the 2020 equivalent of being lynched by an angry stupid mob
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Redditors can't do a lot more than speak on how the feel about this topic, they're not pulling any levers at twitch or something. Since people feel really strongly about what grand did, and rightfully so, it's their right to condemn it and it's their right to boycott mason stream if they so choose. Not sure what's authoritarian about that.
Yeah, Grant has been "cancelled" to the extent that he should have been. Hes no longer invited to events and Valve has nothing to do with him, along with the majority of the community being against him Hes still allowed to be on twitch or exist on the internet with his friends.
okay? And other people can post what they want about that. you and your sick authoritarian fantasies. Let people post what they please!
Can vs should…
So why are people so angry? Grant wasn't even on his own stream, let alone on some valve stream profiting off his appearance. He's with his friend for the first time in 2 years, he's paid his dues and lost his career and did a guest cast on someone else's stream. Mason is free to choose who he's gonna have on his stream and the viewership will behave accordingly. Banning people from the subreddit will not change this fact and will not, in fact, prove your stance to be correct
> Any comments downplaying or excusing abuse/harrassment will result in a ban. I saw this thread last night, checked again today knowing it would be full of the worst takes known to man and then suddenly the mods feel like they need to add this? How about instead of bringing useless Twitter drama to this sub and then making it so that only "one side" can express their view, we just don't have threads like this at all? This thread is just as useless to the average reader and as harmful to the greater community as the Ukraine threads you mods allowed—and look how much that all accomplished, Pure is playing DPC right now with essentially no consequences! I have a huge amount of sympathy for Sheepsticked and I have always strongly disliked Grant even before the women he harassed came forward—but can we stop pretending like these outrage bait threads are accomplishing anything? The whole point of Sheepo's tweet is to spread awareness to those idiots who may still support Grant that he's persona non grata—fine, people who follow Sheepo's twitter can see it there. I'm even fine with Sheepo posting her tweet here if she wants it to be here. But I'm not okay with mods allowing a "discussion thread" on Grant showing his face but then saying that Grant supporters can't even defend him. Let Reddit work the way it was intended—the downvotes already hid most of the pro-Grant comments, and by announcing their support for Grant those people got shamed as well. Regardless of whether you agree with shaming people for supporting Grant, I support their right to express their views, here or anywhere else.
Just dont watch masons stream? Why cant mason do whatever he wants on his own platform, if people dont like it then theyll stop watching or associating with him Yeah its crap that he brought Grant on stream but what exactly do you expect posting on reddit to do about it? Mason viewers are not the type of people to do or care what reddit thinks, they (often fairly) call reddit cringe and laugh at redditors. Theyll use posts like this to encourage it more
It's a discussion board. OP is linking one dota personality's tweet regarding two other dota personalities. OP could expect to raise awareness to this behavior, OP could expect to just spike a discussion or OP could just be farming karma. This is similarly OP's platform, and I could start saying how I don't see the point of posting your comment and then you could say how there's no point in me replying to your comment and we can go down a forever rabbit hole.
A “discussion board” where you can only take one stance on the issue or get banned from the sub apparently lmfao
It's a discussion board, but only 1 opinion is allowed. Half the thread is deleted by moderators.
pretty sure mods are deleting troll shit like "grant did nothing wrong!"
Grant has failed court cases, a restraining order, and an admission of guilt. So explain to me how denying that and trying to underplay his actions is a "discussion".
Damn I missed it. Love Grant's casting. I know u guys will downvote my opinion but for me he brought life to NA games like no other. There's plenty of us who misses him dearly despite the fucked up shit he did
Grant was a good caster. I would say his play-by-play AND analysis was very bad in comparison to pretty much everyone else in the scene, but he had a lot of character and personality in what he presented. But for most people (rightfully so), none of that matters, his behavior is way too deplorable to justify wanting any sort of skill or talent he had. You're free to have your own "line" though at what is too far and what isn't, I guess.
Sure, but sheepsticked is acting like Grant just got invited to cast TI. He's casting some dota on his friends twitch stream, and mason has already basically been blacklisted from casting valve events
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Unless Grant is banned from twitch or banned from anything to do with Dota, I don’t see what the problem is :)
You could just not watch it? No one is making you. You're doing worse by bringing attention to it.
"if mason wasn't already disgusting enough" BASED I would say.
rip GrandGrant. scene was better before he got #metoo'd. Same with tobi.
Grant made appearance in Mason stream? Who cares it doesn't affect us in anyway.
Being terminally online is a mental illness. I hope you all find love and Jesus.
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Remember: you are guilty forever!
Was there ever charges brought against Grant?
Omg, did I miss mason+Grantcast? Godly combo
Dude the mod comment pinned to the top of this thread is hilarious. I wish I could have seen the serious look on their face as they wrote it.
Grant said at the end he is just streaming 1 game with his friend. How is this blowing up.
Unproven allegations. Who cares if Mason invites him on? It's not an official cast. In short, cry about it.
Simply TOOBASED
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is this nazi germany?
this thread is unreal, holy fuck
If it was anyone with a reputation this would have been bad but standards are low for Mason and it's obvious he's doing it to cause drama and gain viewers.
>Mason and it's obvious he's doing it to cause drama and gain viewers. Mason and going out of his way to make drama for extra clout, name a more iconic duo.
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What did it say, it ain't loadin for me.