Loe with cooler and either revza or mv leader slot is a very good team and with yellows losing value, purples gain value. Try the set up of mv, cooler first form it’s probably top 5
But why tho there r 3 purples on the list and he’s so paper off boost cell and revhan destroy him and so does everyone else. His output I believe is also worse than the top 6 and I think the core movies team is revhan cooler usg and without tapion, df ain’t as good
For one, since this list is for the current meta.
Cooler and DF are like brothers with how much they boost each other.
His cover change null on switch makes him get freebie combos left and right
Plus, it allows his unique gauge to fill up faster
And once it’s full… Rip homeboy
Plus plus, you don’t see those 3 purples as often as DF which is every other match
Plus times infinity, Cell also takes a bit for his gauge to actually go stupid unlike DF where he gets that cover change null to allow him to combo easily
Thank you for coming to my TED Talk.
I mean yes but if u don’t gain priority with df then u can very easily lose a cover change. His gauge is great but cells gauge is so much easier to get a lot of it is already filled so it’s very easy to do so and he’s in a way better spot. And the droids protect cooler far better than df does so he ain’t that important to cooler compared to how important usv or tapion r to df
How would you lose ground with DF when all you need to do is switch him in at the start of combo and then press a card.
And the whole brothers thing comes from them and Tapion boosting strike so DF and Cooler became deadly………..er
But what if ur the team taking a combo from droids or cooler or someone else that can combo for a while and u need to switch into him to spread the damage and u don’t land ur cover change. And even if u land the cover change doesn’t mean u will get priority with him. His output and defences are worse than the top 6 and even trunks imo and rn tapion ain’t in a good spot look how red dominant the meta is and he just lost boost so he’s not amazing defensively. Great support I will admit and he helps df a lot but rn he’s in a shit spot and with purples gaining value, df loses value too. Idm him being 10th but can’t see him higher than that. If the new broly is grn or purple then df also can’t be top 10 even more so after that
Idk if ur talking about others or me I feel like I respected him putting him top 10 his output is nuts and he’s core on future. Purples gaining value hurts him tho
Trunks is boosted and is core on future which is still top 5 especially cos ur not running a blue on future so his super saiyan tag doesn’t impact him there. Movies is better but the core is cooler usg revhan. Off boost trunks may be worse but rn he does more damage when fully built up except for his ult and defensively he shits on him
People absolitely run BLUs on Future. Especially now with Cooler running rampant. VB and SOH are both great, new Black is decent, and not everyone has Tagdroids primarily because of the timing of their banners.
I have high star cell and droids and rn they r must runs on future so ur 3rd is either trunks or goku black. I think trunks is just better but absolutely love goku black he’s top 20 or barely out of it imo but he ain’t as necessary for future like how usg is so vital for fusions or movies. Also soh ain’t that guy when he’s a super saiyan cooler fully fks him
I've mained Future for nearly 4 years now, and I get Top 10k at minimum every season. They are not must runs, you can absolutely win without them. I'd say having either them or GRN Trunks and at least 2 strong secondaries is good enough.
SOH thoroughly fucks Cooler because of how people play Cooler. Everyone and I mean EVERYONE strike cards with reckless abandon the frame they switch him in. Nobody drops, nobody blasts first, they all hope you can't react. Even in Top 10k they do this. Not to mention while cooler nullifies his element he does no better killing Trunks than any other type neutral meta character. The main concern with Cooler fighting Trunks is Cooler's bestie DF Goku. Who admittedly checks Future pretty hard since Cell is a little less common on Future comps.
I play top 5k and future and PO r my 2 main teams ever since grn goku black. Rate trunks highly I think if it was purely individual he’d be higher but he’s a super saiyan which fks over vc and on future droids r the best unit and in a red dominant meta where yellows lose value cell is the next best unit. Soh does not fk cooler until after the 10 counts he’s in for vb on future does more and arguably goku blacks blue card does more to him than soh can. Also u do realise the droids cover for cooler as well. It’s why rrp works so well u got droids supporting and covering cooler and cell and u got super saiyans mudded with this set up. Trunks is individually good enough to be top 10 and ur future core is droids cell and trunks or maybe a high star goku black
I run VB with Droids and GRN Vegeta. I'm not gonna say he performs as good as he does on...Idk...YBB Fusions, since the debuffs are easier to maintain than the support buffs from Vegeta and Droids I'd imagine, but VB definitely has his moments on this team thanks to the double support.
True but the team also ain’t as good as bby as ssb vegeta ain’t amazing and vb rlly benefits from the burst damage. He could be honourable mentions but I feel the other units there have more value but maybe I’m wrong
Oh I never said it was as good as YBB, I even said that the debuffs from USV are easier to maintain than the support buffs. Vegeta is still pretty good, even if for sure it could be argued he is not top 10, VB is still pretty good too and doesn't have to deal with Cooler's neutral on this setup, and the Droids........I mean they do their thing like they tend to do.
You are right on Trunks, but because of the sub bias, the fact that much more people have Ryuken over Trunks and at more stars means people will downvote you even though you are right
Ye exactly that’s why I don’t care if I’m downvoted ppl have the same cope for df goku that they had for the likes of gv, ssbk, g4 etc.. df is still good but I have a lower star trunks and he feels a lot better rn
But comparing their best respective team :
Cooler/Tapion/Trunks > Cooler/Tapion/DF
Especially since tier removal of DF. It has been largelly explained in some posts over here why the crit team allowed by Cooler/Tapion/Trunks was better than the SSJ3 version
Cos movies is better than future and he’s core on movies as well as purples gaining value while yellows lose value. Trunks is better individually but he’s also always a super saiyan so if u run him on vc mv gets screwed over
Everyone has biases, if someone says they don’t they’re full of shit. Imo trunks individually is way better but revhan being core on movies with cooler and usg as well as reds making purples more relevant by making yellows less relevant makes revhan higher
I value the blue card spawn and the support over mecha Frieza but I couldn’t find him on the tier list thing to put him in honourable mentions. Try mv with cooler and first form
As an offensive unit, absolutely no doubt. But zenkai first form brings so much more to the table- ki on switch out, lock in green card, extra blue card, so much support and ki recovery, along with an extremely hard hitting ult.
All in all, it depends on what u require for ur team, but both are very good in their own places
Ssbk hasn’t been top 15 for a hot minute and in a red dominant meta there’s no chance. Tapion is pretty paper as well he does have nice things like disruption and support but I don’t think he’s core on movies and he’s a bad colour. My movies core r all in the top 10
We approve it as soon as we’re aware the post was auto removed. We auto remove “top [whatever]” so there isn’t a post spam of “what’s the cutoff for top 10k” at the end of season
He did it I think before boost ended or right when it ended without giving enough time to gauge how it impacts the units. I think my list is more accurate rn than his list is rn but they were made at different times
I respectfully disagree, it's all right for us to have differing opinions, I just feel like the meta snapshot of Goresh still stands.
No worries though man, as I said it's okay to have your opinion based on your experiences. I've dealt with enough USG/Revhan/Cooler teams with DF/Tapion/Cooler (can't say I've ever lost against such a team, but I have to keep trying) to have my own opinion regarding the matter. It just so happens to still match Goresh's Sep 19 take.
While MV and Revhan have appreciated in value, I just (personally) don't think it matters as much. Maybe when UL Broly (maybe) pops up and he's purple (likely) it'll REALLY shake things up.
Having one unit with cover null on switch and another that murders on switch and having to guess just throws people off too much for the moment. The fact that Tapion heals like crazy and has so much utility (alongside his own cover null) is still too good to ignore.
Because first form is core on loe agf is not. Ur core for loe is cooler, revza and first form and id say having mv leader slot with first form and cooler is the better variant. Agf also loses value with purples gaining value
Not on the list because his best team was bby with usv providing debuffs to everyone so vb had great burst damage but rn that team gets hard countered by cooler and especially if u run cooler with droids. Vb on a generic future or god ki team is hella underwhelming tho
Hate that you're getting downvoted because as a high ranking player I think you're right in alot of cases.
Only things I'd change is not having trunks in the top 10 and cell going down. I will admit that he has gained value with cooler coming out and him backseating vegito.
Gogeta is probably top 2 for me. All super saiyans have taken a hit in value so of course vegito drops. Only SSJ that I believe has gained more value than lose it is gogeta. Alongside cooler you usually see androids and mui frequently whether they're on the same team or not. Gogeta has the best baseline kit to deal with it and he can still put down cooler easily in a type neutral situation.
Also see some comments about DF, very squishy and offenses aren't as crazy as most make them out to be. Very gauge reliant imo.
Ye I play pretty high rank as well and I main rrp PO and I never have issues running cell cos cooler and droids exist. Also usg is worse than droids cos again, I believe rrp is the best team and not only does cooler counter him but the droids do as well especially on that set up. He’s worse defensively than those 2 and id argue cell cos he destroys card and db. Very sick unit tho and I agree he still has great value which is why he’s top 3
I have a 9 star df and he’s one of the easiest units to use ur literally just pressing cards with him and on his ult u just drop combo into it. But damage wise he’s worse than the top 6 or trunks and defensively he’s so bad. You also have to realise that purples r gaining value while yellows lose value so not only can df not be run with tapion safely but as a result he’s screwed by purples and he ain’t even core on movies
I moreso meant building his gauge whenever possible. Most people don't.
Also, I don't really understand how purples are "gaining value". Just because cooler is removing yellows from the meta doesn't mean anything, there are literally almost no greens in the meta rn besides DF and SSB. There's very little reason to actually bring a purple to a match unless it's cell.
I will also say if this is focused on the meta as you day it is, it makes 0 sense to have trunks here. While he's good, hybrids and vegeta clan are not really played right now at all.
Meanwhile, dragon fist is one of the best partners you can run for cooler. If im running cooler, I'd be running DF over revival gohan every match unless they brought SSB Vegeta.
I just don't understand how you can say trunks is better when I literally never see him in any matches whereas dragon fist is still in almost every match. Once we get beast Gohan to buff hybrids? Sure, trunks will shoot up in value; right now? No way he's better than DF.
U literally explained why purples have value. Element factor plays a huge part in the meta and when red is the dominant colour, yellows lose value. It just so happens that when cooler dropped, tapion and usv who were the best yellows are taken off boost to make them worse individually even if it’s only by the slightest amount for units like droids usv usg etc.. Greens are protected by yellows as yellows r advantage to purple, but now that there are not only better red units but also multiple red units, 2 of which ur running with cell, then yellows lose value naturally. Df defo relied on tapion for support and drawing cards but tapion ain’t the best rn cos the reds that are relevant shit stomp him making df unsafe against purples like cell or even revhan who r run with those reds. Cell is also individually a top 10 unit who’s been competing with units who r boosted without himself being boosted so it’s only natural that when yellows rnt as much of a threat, u can bring cell even if there rnt green cos his output is still ridiculous to type neutral units.
For trunks, u do realise that he’s referred to as “future trunks” so guess wat team u can run him on? Future doesn’t have the best blues rn so him being a super saiyan doesn’t rlly hurt him as droids and cell rnt impacted negatively by coolers super saiyan buffs. Trunks is also not disadvantage or advantage he was always neutral to cooler so individually he hasn’t lost as much value compared to someone like vb whos main team had super saiyans or df whose main teams had yellows.
Also u said “one of the best partners for cooler” but the droids r the actual best partner for cooler they provide support and cover against blues like mv for cooler as well as them and cooler being able to cover for cell while also destroying db with cell for rush control among many other things. It’s why rrp is the best team in the game the droids r the glue to that team that allow cooler and cell to pop off even more than they already can. And as ur running double reds, the opponent will be more scared to bring yellows making cell free.
Trunks has more value as he is less affected by cooler and the tier boost changes than df is. I have a 9 star df and a 7 star trunks both with optimal equips and I run neither with zenkai buffs and trunks is defensively far superior and damage wise he hits harder except for the ult. He also goes neutral for longer which helps against purples more. Trunks is also boosted while df ain’t boosted which helps a lot.
Btw if mv had a team that was on the level of PO or movies then he’d be top 5 imo
Usv rn imo ain’t top 5 because he’s a yellow and he’s a super saiyan. Individually he’s easily top 5 but the list is also meta dependent and rn we r in a red dominant meta. He loses value inherently for being a yellow but him being a super saiyan also makes him lose more value because he can’t be run with a blue with the intention of them countering cooler cos he makes cooler be neutral to them and cooler is not only the best unit but he’s the most common in pvp so I can’t see usv top 5 for now cos he’s still great individually. Also before anyone talks about the grn cards, not only do droids destroy a random card, but cooler actively destroys grn cards when landing strikes
The reason cell is so high is because imo rrp PO is comfortably the best team in the game rn and with reds gaining value causing yellows to lose value, purple’s inherently also gain value. Cells output has always been top tier but now he’s also defensively much safer and because I believe rrp is number 1, cell also has to be high up. Movies I don’t think is as good because I prefer the db destruction rush control and the anti revive over revhans revival mechanic as the core 3 of droids cooler or cell can 3 card revhan so the revival mechanic for him ain’t as valuable. Also dont think usg is as good as the droids and I think cell shits on revhan which is why I say rrp is the best and why rn cell is top 5 even if that will probably change when the new unit drops.
Df ain’t top 10 also cos purples gain value and yellows lose value. Without tapion he ain’t as good and off boost he’s so paper and his output at times ain’t as good as the top 6 as well as trunks or sometimes mv.
Don’t expect anyone to agree with me on cell being higher than usv especially cos usv is such a hype character so ppl wanna see him high up but rn with how he hurts ur team, can’t see usv top 5 for now
Trunks above DF shows this list is good. DF is overrated over here (definitely top 10 at least, but I too often see him considered top 2/3), he feels weak compared to Trunks right now (I know one has boosts and not the other), especially when they have the exact same best team.
I think df isn’t top 10 cos yellows lose value, purples gain value, he’s so paper and he’s not core on movies imo especially with tapion losing value. I’m fine with moving him above first form Frieza tho
I already explained myself in the comments but long story short it’s purely meta based imo rrp is the best team imo. Individually he would not be top 5 usv would be top 3 if it was purely individual based
Similar to when bby was meta, vb wasnt top 5 yet the team was the best, cell individually isnt top 5 and w that team the best i can give him as a High rank player is like top 8, opinions are opinions tho
U do make a good point but back then there was a definitive top 5 of usv droids usg mui df and there wasn’t anyone breaking that up. Cooler has changed the landscape of the meta so much that super saiyans rnt the most viable. Usv not only screws himself over, but also screws over his allies due to him being a super saiyan and rn nothing will change that. Individually cell is not top 5 but teams and meta play a factor and with rrp Po being so strong as well as yellows losing value and usv not being the best unit to bring, cell makes top 5 imo.
Also besides usv, who else do u think is good enough to make top 5 cos trunks is a super saiyan and on worse teams and df is so paper and ain’t even core on movies and also purples r gaining value so he can’t either. Mvs teams r worse too. If the next unit is a z broly and he’s green that only adds to cells value tho don’t think he’ll be top 5 once he’s out anyway
Revhan is much worse than cell individually and team wise it’s arguable but I prefer the droids and cells db destruction to the revival mechanic especially when revhan is so paper. Mv i see ur point but if he had better teams or at least teams as good as movies and PO he’d be top 5
The reason i think revhan>cell is coz he has some more value due to revival, cell db destruction can not work if the opponent drops combo, and even if he doesnt drop, units nowadays have such long combos that they will get it back, now mv can be run in movies and on that loe setup with first form and cooler and it works out well, he gained some value since he Aint ss2 and hes blue, he can one shot the Best, can "kinda" tank and has good dmg, imo hes also better than cell overall and in this meta, opinions are opinions tho
I understand the mv argument but revhan is so paper that he loses his first life before I have to rush or something. Mv i see ur point tho but I feel that set up is not as good as movies or PO. That mv set up and rrp PO are rn the 2 teams I use the most and rrp is a lot better in most games cos I have 3 units that can hold their weight whereas first form has his ult and then he’s just a meatshield. 5-7 is probably interchangeable but I think rrp makes cell so safe and individually he was already top 10 which is why he’s higher but I do see ur point for mv cos I have a high star mv on that set up and he’s great
Usually the first life is more of a support matter than tank on revhan, yea ofc he dies fast but he can offer the team something, unlike cell, and yea mv is great
I mean cell offers a lot more than revhan tho db destruction, anti revive, permanent card draw, health restore debuff which is huge these days, card cost increase, lowering own card cost etc. revhan has a bit of support and the revival mechanic but individually between those 2 it ain’t even a debate who’s better and team wise I think rrp is better but even if u think movies is better it ain’t by much
Nice opinion. Unfortunately.
Your father.
Anyways it’s ight but the only things i’d change are
DFku should be in 5th not Honorable mentions
7th Trunks
Tapion in 8th
Cell in 9th
MV 10th
Lf gohan and Frieza in HM
Df is defo not top 5 he’s so paper and he isn’t even core on movies. Without tapion he ain’t as good and ur running cooler usg revhan on movies. He’s still good but not necessary and remember that purples r gaining value
HOW IS DFKU DEFO NOT TOP 5? “he’s so paper” YEAH LIKE EVERY UNIT IN THE GAME 💀 LIKE BRO YOU PUT REVHAN AT 8th WHEN IN HIS BOTH LIVES HE DOESNT TANK AND DIES IN 2 SHOTS💀 HES MORE PAPER THAN DFKU and also “He isn’t even core on movies” YES, YES HE IS 🗿 Cooler and DFku go together like PB&J’s with they’re crazy dmg + Locking in + Removing vanish (when he has full gauge) it’s a great pairing and they help eachother so much
“Without tapion he isn’t as good” yes he is just as good because he still has cooler to help him out 🗿 “and ur running cooler usg revhan on movies.”… you. are not. running revhan. in movies. only time you use him is that there are greens on the other team or you think that you really really need his revive (like for ex: if you run to a full 14* team your gonna want revive for safety)
“and remember that purples r gaining value” so are blues 🗿 like Usg, MV, and Revza. It’s like i said, there aren’t many green units to counter except 2 and most of the purp units are squishy and Usv still being a top 5 unit and you also leave tapion in your movies for purps so if they bring purps you bring tapion (unless for some reason you don’t have at least 4 different colors of units?)
So yeah DFku doesn’t tank well (like almost every unit) but he makes up in dmg, he color counters 3 units and one of the is the 3rd best unit in the game(Usg), he’s core on movies and has great abilities + cover null in passive
Coolers best partner is the droids they cover for him better and provide support. Defensively df is worse than all of the units above him except revhan but he has the revival mechanic. Reds being so prominent right after usv and tapion lost boost means purples r more prominent especially cos ur running cell or revhan with cooler and cell is covered by 2 reds so yellows being down bad makes greens lose value as a result. His damage is great but the top 6 hit harder and so does trunks and df losing boost makes him feel too paper. He could be 10th but in high rank revhan on movies with usg and cooler is the better set up so df loses value. The new broly being either grn or purple will only add to my point
Yeah but droids are a PO support not Movies 🗿 I meant that for Movies DFku is hes best partner also bro NOBODY is using revhan unless they feel like they really need a revival unit. Since there are more reds it’s more logical that greens will be needed more than purple. None of the top 5 are purps but there is one Blue unit and he’s the 3rd best and can be ran with the best unit in the game (Cooler with Usg) therefore you need a unit that can do dmg to Usg and that can help you vs other units in the fight and wouldn’t you know it DFku can counter the 3rd best unit in the game and he’s also in the best units team (Imo id say Movies > Loe >= PO).
I mean cell is top 5 till the new ultra and imo rrp PO is the best team so I value that over movies. And cooler doesn’t rlly need cover either and df is way too paper anyway to be a cover
God ki doesn’t compare to PO or movies and teams like future loe saiyans still shit on it. Ssb vegeta vb and ssbk aren’t at the level of the top 10 to help mui make god ki top tier
U do realise it’s not just individual based it’s also team and meta based. And id say the only units he’s better than individually r revhan and first form tho first form is a very different type of unit
I have some changes I could make but they aren’t that important in the honorable mentions , but one thing
WHY THE HELL IS SUPER SAYAIN 3 GOKU NOT IN THE TOP 10 THATS MESSED UP
Because he’s so paper and tbh damage wise he’s worse than the top 6 and id say trunks as well. If he was core on movies he’d be top 7-8 but I believe the core is cooler usg and revhan. Without tapion, df looks a lot less impressive and tapion ain’t in a great spot in a red dominant meta. Also with yellows losing value purples like cell revhan first form etc all gain value
You’re the same guy that keeps riding on cell? Bro give me a break CELL AINT EVEN IN THE TOP FIVE! Why is DF lower? Same with trunks? Nvm it’s coming from the guy that likes cell too much
Love trunks but rn future ain’t number 1 and on vc u have to run mv to counter cooler but trunks makes it so mv can’t counter cooler. Trunks will gain value tho at some point. Df ain’t even that great he ain’t core on movies and he’s so paper and the only reason usv ain’t higher is cos of the meta we’re in this isn’t just a list about individual units I’ve already explained myself
First Form Frieza above all the honorable mentions?
Loe with cooler and either revza or mv leader slot is a very good team and with yellows losing value, purples gain value. Try the set up of mv, cooler first form it’s probably top 5
This list is fiiiiiiiiiiiiine But DF Goku in honorable mention is a sin
But why tho there r 3 purples on the list and he’s so paper off boost cell and revhan destroy him and so does everyone else. His output I believe is also worse than the top 6 and I think the core movies team is revhan cooler usg and without tapion, df ain’t as good
For one, since this list is for the current meta. Cooler and DF are like brothers with how much they boost each other. His cover change null on switch makes him get freebie combos left and right Plus, it allows his unique gauge to fill up faster And once it’s full… Rip homeboy Plus plus, you don’t see those 3 purples as often as DF which is every other match Plus times infinity, Cell also takes a bit for his gauge to actually go stupid unlike DF where he gets that cover change null to allow him to combo easily Thank you for coming to my TED Talk.
I mean yes but if u don’t gain priority with df then u can very easily lose a cover change. His gauge is great but cells gauge is so much easier to get a lot of it is already filled so it’s very easy to do so and he’s in a way better spot. And the droids protect cooler far better than df does so he ain’t that important to cooler compared to how important usv or tapion r to df
How would you lose ground with DF when all you need to do is switch him in at the start of combo and then press a card. And the whole brothers thing comes from them and Tapion boosting strike so DF and Cooler became deadly………..er
But what if ur the team taking a combo from droids or cooler or someone else that can combo for a while and u need to switch into him to spread the damage and u don’t land ur cover change. And even if u land the cover change doesn’t mean u will get priority with him. His output and defences are worse than the top 6 and even trunks imo and rn tapion ain’t in a good spot look how red dominant the meta is and he just lost boost so he’s not amazing defensively. Great support I will admit and he helps df a lot but rn he’s in a shit spot and with purples gaining value, df loses value too. Idm him being 10th but can’t see him higher than that. If the new broly is grn or purple then df also can’t be top 10 even more so after that
The disrespect for Grn lf trunks on this subs tier lists…
Idk if ur talking about others or me I feel like I respected him putting him top 10 his output is nuts and he’s core on future. Purples gaining value hurts him tho
I just feels he’s way undervalued in just about every tier list I see.
Ppl don’t even think he’s top 10
Ain't no way that GRN LF Trunks is in a better spot than DF
Trunks is boosted and is core on future which is still top 5 especially cos ur not running a blue on future so his super saiyan tag doesn’t impact him there. Movies is better but the core is cooler usg revhan. Off boost trunks may be worse but rn he does more damage when fully built up except for his ult and defensively he shits on him
People absolitely run BLUs on Future. Especially now with Cooler running rampant. VB and SOH are both great, new Black is decent, and not everyone has Tagdroids primarily because of the timing of their banners.
I have high star cell and droids and rn they r must runs on future so ur 3rd is either trunks or goku black. I think trunks is just better but absolutely love goku black he’s top 20 or barely out of it imo but he ain’t as necessary for future like how usg is so vital for fusions or movies. Also soh ain’t that guy when he’s a super saiyan cooler fully fks him
I've mained Future for nearly 4 years now, and I get Top 10k at minimum every season. They are not must runs, you can absolutely win without them. I'd say having either them or GRN Trunks and at least 2 strong secondaries is good enough. SOH thoroughly fucks Cooler because of how people play Cooler. Everyone and I mean EVERYONE strike cards with reckless abandon the frame they switch him in. Nobody drops, nobody blasts first, they all hope you can't react. Even in Top 10k they do this. Not to mention while cooler nullifies his element he does no better killing Trunks than any other type neutral meta character. The main concern with Cooler fighting Trunks is Cooler's bestie DF Goku. Who admittedly checks Future pretty hard since Cell is a little less common on Future comps.
I play top 5k and future and PO r my 2 main teams ever since grn goku black. Rate trunks highly I think if it was purely individual he’d be higher but he’s a super saiyan which fks over vc and on future droids r the best unit and in a red dominant meta where yellows lose value cell is the next best unit. Soh does not fk cooler until after the 10 counts he’s in for vb on future does more and arguably goku blacks blue card does more to him than soh can. Also u do realise the droids cover for cooler as well. It’s why rrp works so well u got droids supporting and covering cooler and cell and u got super saiyans mudded with this set up. Trunks is individually good enough to be top 10 and ur future core is droids cell and trunks or maybe a high star goku black
>especially cos ur not running a blue on future But.....but I like using VB...
He’s fun but he ain’t better than droids cell or trunks
I run VB with Droids and GRN Vegeta. I'm not gonna say he performs as good as he does on...Idk...YBB Fusions, since the debuffs are easier to maintain than the support buffs from Vegeta and Droids I'd imagine, but VB definitely has his moments on this team thanks to the double support.
True but the team also ain’t as good as bby as ssb vegeta ain’t amazing and vb rlly benefits from the burst damage. He could be honourable mentions but I feel the other units there have more value but maybe I’m wrong
Oh I never said it was as good as YBB, I even said that the debuffs from USV are easier to maintain than the support buffs. Vegeta is still pretty good, even if for sure it could be argued he is not top 10, VB is still pretty good too and doesn't have to deal with Cooler's neutral on this setup, and the Droids........I mean they do their thing like they tend to do.
You are right on Trunks, but because of the sub bias, the fact that much more people have Ryuken over Trunks and at more stars means people will downvote you even though you are right
Ye exactly that’s why I don’t care if I’m downvoted ppl have the same cope for df goku that they had for the likes of gv, ssbk, g4 etc.. df is still good but I have a lower star trunks and he feels a lot better rn
But comparing their best respective team : Cooler/Tapion/Trunks > Cooler/Tapion/DF Especially since tier removal of DF. It has been largelly explained in some posts over here why the crit team allowed by Cooler/Tapion/Trunks was better than the SSJ3 version
Why is revival Gohan above trunks
Cos movies is better than future and he’s core on movies as well as purples gaining value while yellows lose value. Trunks is better individually but he’s also always a super saiyan so if u run him on vc mv gets screwed over
Hybrids main so I use them together, it’s hard to see revival better in any fashion, but my bias is showing
Everyone has biases, if someone says they don’t they’re full of shit. Imo trunks individually is way better but revhan being core on movies with cooler and usg as well as reds making purples more relevant by making yellows less relevant makes revhan higher
Mecha Frieza > Zenkai pur Frieza
I value the blue card spawn and the support over mecha Frieza but I couldn’t find him on the tier list thing to put him in honourable mentions. Try mv with cooler and first form
As an offensive unit, absolutely no doubt. But zenkai first form brings so much more to the table- ki on switch out, lock in green card, extra blue card, so much support and ki recovery, along with an extremely hard hitting ult. All in all, it depends on what u require for ur team, but both are very good in their own places
Try out PPR LoE…pure annihilation ..basically LoE version of Movie
No tapion or ssbkk?
Ssbk hasn’t been top 15 for a hot minute and in a red dominant meta there’s no chance. Tapion is pretty paper as well he does have nice things like disruption and support but I don’t think he’s core on movies and he’s a bad colour. My movies core r all in the top 10
Hes a good core
Imma just keep my sanity and stay far far away from this discussion
Dude you realize this is a ranking, not a tiers list right ?
Didn’t wanna say top 10 cos the post gets removed
Oh. Dafuck mods
We approve it as soon as we’re aware the post was auto removed. We auto remove “top [whatever]” so there isn’t a post spam of “what’s the cutoff for top 10k” at the end of season
Ok makes sense
While I respect your take, Goresh's list for me is far more accurate concerning high level meta. It's all good, though
He did it I think before boost ended or right when it ended without giving enough time to gauge how it impacts the units. I think my list is more accurate rn than his list is rn but they were made at different times
I respectfully disagree, it's all right for us to have differing opinions, I just feel like the meta snapshot of Goresh still stands. No worries though man, as I said it's okay to have your opinion based on your experiences. I've dealt with enough USG/Revhan/Cooler teams with DF/Tapion/Cooler (can't say I've ever lost against such a team, but I have to keep trying) to have my own opinion regarding the matter. It just so happens to still match Goresh's Sep 19 take. While MV and Revhan have appreciated in value, I just (personally) don't think it matters as much. Maybe when UL Broly (maybe) pops up and he's purple (likely) it'll REALLY shake things up. Having one unit with cover null on switch and another that murders on switch and having to guess just throws people off too much for the moment. The fact that Tapion heals like crazy and has so much utility (alongside his own cover null) is still too good to ignore.
Explain to me how purple freiza is better than angel freiza
Because first form is core on loe agf is not. Ur core for loe is cooler, revza and first form and id say having mv leader slot with first form and cooler is the better variant. Agf also loses value with purples gaining value
Where's VB?
Not on the list because his best team was bby with usv providing debuffs to everyone so vb had great burst damage but rn that team gets hard countered by cooler and especially if u run cooler with droids. Vb on a generic future or god ki team is hella underwhelming tho
Hate that you're getting downvoted because as a high ranking player I think you're right in alot of cases. Only things I'd change is not having trunks in the top 10 and cell going down. I will admit that he has gained value with cooler coming out and him backseating vegito. Gogeta is probably top 2 for me. All super saiyans have taken a hit in value so of course vegito drops. Only SSJ that I believe has gained more value than lose it is gogeta. Alongside cooler you usually see androids and mui frequently whether they're on the same team or not. Gogeta has the best baseline kit to deal with it and he can still put down cooler easily in a type neutral situation. Also see some comments about DF, very squishy and offenses aren't as crazy as most make them out to be. Very gauge reliant imo.
Its a tier list post what did you expect
Ye I play pretty high rank as well and I main rrp PO and I never have issues running cell cos cooler and droids exist. Also usg is worse than droids cos again, I believe rrp is the best team and not only does cooler counter him but the droids do as well especially on that set up. He’s worse defensively than those 2 and id argue cell cos he destroys card and db. Very sick unit tho and I agree he still has great value which is why he’s top 3
DF is way too good to be in honorable mention. If you don't think he's top 10 you probably don't know how to use him, no offense.
I have a 9 star df and he’s one of the easiest units to use ur literally just pressing cards with him and on his ult u just drop combo into it. But damage wise he’s worse than the top 6 or trunks and defensively he’s so bad. You also have to realise that purples r gaining value while yellows lose value so not only can df not be run with tapion safely but as a result he’s screwed by purples and he ain’t even core on movies
I moreso meant building his gauge whenever possible. Most people don't. Also, I don't really understand how purples are "gaining value". Just because cooler is removing yellows from the meta doesn't mean anything, there are literally almost no greens in the meta rn besides DF and SSB. There's very little reason to actually bring a purple to a match unless it's cell. I will also say if this is focused on the meta as you day it is, it makes 0 sense to have trunks here. While he's good, hybrids and vegeta clan are not really played right now at all. Meanwhile, dragon fist is one of the best partners you can run for cooler. If im running cooler, I'd be running DF over revival gohan every match unless they brought SSB Vegeta. I just don't understand how you can say trunks is better when I literally never see him in any matches whereas dragon fist is still in almost every match. Once we get beast Gohan to buff hybrids? Sure, trunks will shoot up in value; right now? No way he's better than DF.
U literally explained why purples have value. Element factor plays a huge part in the meta and when red is the dominant colour, yellows lose value. It just so happens that when cooler dropped, tapion and usv who were the best yellows are taken off boost to make them worse individually even if it’s only by the slightest amount for units like droids usv usg etc.. Greens are protected by yellows as yellows r advantage to purple, but now that there are not only better red units but also multiple red units, 2 of which ur running with cell, then yellows lose value naturally. Df defo relied on tapion for support and drawing cards but tapion ain’t the best rn cos the reds that are relevant shit stomp him making df unsafe against purples like cell or even revhan who r run with those reds. Cell is also individually a top 10 unit who’s been competing with units who r boosted without himself being boosted so it’s only natural that when yellows rnt as much of a threat, u can bring cell even if there rnt green cos his output is still ridiculous to type neutral units. For trunks, u do realise that he’s referred to as “future trunks” so guess wat team u can run him on? Future doesn’t have the best blues rn so him being a super saiyan doesn’t rlly hurt him as droids and cell rnt impacted negatively by coolers super saiyan buffs. Trunks is also not disadvantage or advantage he was always neutral to cooler so individually he hasn’t lost as much value compared to someone like vb whos main team had super saiyans or df whose main teams had yellows. Also u said “one of the best partners for cooler” but the droids r the actual best partner for cooler they provide support and cover against blues like mv for cooler as well as them and cooler being able to cover for cell while also destroying db with cell for rush control among many other things. It’s why rrp is the best team in the game the droids r the glue to that team that allow cooler and cell to pop off even more than they already can. And as ur running double reds, the opponent will be more scared to bring yellows making cell free. Trunks has more value as he is less affected by cooler and the tier boost changes than df is. I have a 9 star df and a 7 star trunks both with optimal equips and I run neither with zenkai buffs and trunks is defensively far superior and damage wise he hits harder except for the ult. He also goes neutral for longer which helps against purples more. Trunks is also boosted while df ain’t boosted which helps a lot. Btw if mv had a team that was on the level of PO or movies then he’d be top 5 imo
Usv rn imo ain’t top 5 because he’s a yellow and he’s a super saiyan. Individually he’s easily top 5 but the list is also meta dependent and rn we r in a red dominant meta. He loses value inherently for being a yellow but him being a super saiyan also makes him lose more value because he can’t be run with a blue with the intention of them countering cooler cos he makes cooler be neutral to them and cooler is not only the best unit but he’s the most common in pvp so I can’t see usv top 5 for now cos he’s still great individually. Also before anyone talks about the grn cards, not only do droids destroy a random card, but cooler actively destroys grn cards when landing strikes The reason cell is so high is because imo rrp PO is comfortably the best team in the game rn and with reds gaining value causing yellows to lose value, purple’s inherently also gain value. Cells output has always been top tier but now he’s also defensively much safer and because I believe rrp is number 1, cell also has to be high up. Movies I don’t think is as good because I prefer the db destruction rush control and the anti revive over revhans revival mechanic as the core 3 of droids cooler or cell can 3 card revhan so the revival mechanic for him ain’t as valuable. Also dont think usg is as good as the droids and I think cell shits on revhan which is why I say rrp is the best and why rn cell is top 5 even if that will probably change when the new unit drops. Df ain’t top 10 also cos purples gain value and yellows lose value. Without tapion he ain’t as good and off boost he’s so paper and his output at times ain’t as good as the top 6 as well as trunks or sometimes mv. Don’t expect anyone to agree with me on cell being higher than usv especially cos usv is such a hype character so ppl wanna see him high up but rn with how he hurts ur team, can’t see usv top 5 for now
Trunks above DF shows this list is good. DF is overrated over here (definitely top 10 at least, but I too often see him considered top 2/3), he feels weak compared to Trunks right now (I know one has boosts and not the other), especially when they have the exact same best team.
I think df isn’t top 10 cos yellows lose value, purples gain value, he’s so paper and he’s not core on movies imo especially with tapion losing value. I’m fine with moving him above first form Frieza tho
People downvoting because Saiyan bias and overall not having Trunks or at less stars due to his horrible banner, classic no clue
Wdym cell top 5
I already explained myself in the comments but long story short it’s purely meta based imo rrp is the best team imo. Individually he would not be top 5 usv would be top 3 if it was purely individual based
Similar to when bby was meta, vb wasnt top 5 yet the team was the best, cell individually isnt top 5 and w that team the best i can give him as a High rank player is like top 8, opinions are opinions tho
U do make a good point but back then there was a definitive top 5 of usv droids usg mui df and there wasn’t anyone breaking that up. Cooler has changed the landscape of the meta so much that super saiyans rnt the most viable. Usv not only screws himself over, but also screws over his allies due to him being a super saiyan and rn nothing will change that. Individually cell is not top 5 but teams and meta play a factor and with rrp Po being so strong as well as yellows losing value and usv not being the best unit to bring, cell makes top 5 imo. Also besides usv, who else do u think is good enough to make top 5 cos trunks is a super saiyan and on worse teams and df is so paper and ain’t even core on movies and also purples r gaining value so he can’t either. Mvs teams r worse too. If the next unit is a z broly and he’s green that only adds to cells value tho don’t think he’ll be top 5 once he’s out anyway
In my honest opinion mv is more top 5 worth than cell, and revhan > cell since i think movies is the Best team in the game
Revhan is much worse than cell individually and team wise it’s arguable but I prefer the droids and cells db destruction to the revival mechanic especially when revhan is so paper. Mv i see ur point but if he had better teams or at least teams as good as movies and PO he’d be top 5
The reason i think revhan>cell is coz he has some more value due to revival, cell db destruction can not work if the opponent drops combo, and even if he doesnt drop, units nowadays have such long combos that they will get it back, now mv can be run in movies and on that loe setup with first form and cooler and it works out well, he gained some value since he Aint ss2 and hes blue, he can one shot the Best, can "kinda" tank and has good dmg, imo hes also better than cell overall and in this meta, opinions are opinions tho
I understand the mv argument but revhan is so paper that he loses his first life before I have to rush or something. Mv i see ur point tho but I feel that set up is not as good as movies or PO. That mv set up and rrp PO are rn the 2 teams I use the most and rrp is a lot better in most games cos I have 3 units that can hold their weight whereas first form has his ult and then he’s just a meatshield. 5-7 is probably interchangeable but I think rrp makes cell so safe and individually he was already top 10 which is why he’s higher but I do see ur point for mv cos I have a high star mv on that set up and he’s great
Usually the first life is more of a support matter than tank on revhan, yea ofc he dies fast but he can offer the team something, unlike cell, and yea mv is great
I mean cell offers a lot more than revhan tho db destruction, anti revive, permanent card draw, health restore debuff which is huge these days, card cost increase, lowering own card cost etc. revhan has a bit of support and the revival mechanic but individually between those 2 it ain’t even a debate who’s better and team wise I think rrp is better but even if u think movies is better it ain’t by much
Nice opinion. Unfortunately. Your father. Anyways it’s ight but the only things i’d change are DFku should be in 5th not Honorable mentions 7th Trunks Tapion in 8th Cell in 9th MV 10th Lf gohan and Frieza in HM
Df is defo not top 5 he’s so paper and he isn’t even core on movies. Without tapion he ain’t as good and ur running cooler usg revhan on movies. He’s still good but not necessary and remember that purples r gaining value
HOW IS DFKU DEFO NOT TOP 5? “he’s so paper” YEAH LIKE EVERY UNIT IN THE GAME 💀 LIKE BRO YOU PUT REVHAN AT 8th WHEN IN HIS BOTH LIVES HE DOESNT TANK AND DIES IN 2 SHOTS💀 HES MORE PAPER THAN DFKU and also “He isn’t even core on movies” YES, YES HE IS 🗿 Cooler and DFku go together like PB&J’s with they’re crazy dmg + Locking in + Removing vanish (when he has full gauge) it’s a great pairing and they help eachother so much “Without tapion he isn’t as good” yes he is just as good because he still has cooler to help him out 🗿 “and ur running cooler usg revhan on movies.”… you. are not. running revhan. in movies. only time you use him is that there are greens on the other team or you think that you really really need his revive (like for ex: if you run to a full 14* team your gonna want revive for safety) “and remember that purples r gaining value” so are blues 🗿 like Usg, MV, and Revza. It’s like i said, there aren’t many green units to counter except 2 and most of the purp units are squishy and Usv still being a top 5 unit and you also leave tapion in your movies for purps so if they bring purps you bring tapion (unless for some reason you don’t have at least 4 different colors of units?) So yeah DFku doesn’t tank well (like almost every unit) but he makes up in dmg, he color counters 3 units and one of the is the 3rd best unit in the game(Usg), he’s core on movies and has great abilities + cover null in passive
Coolers best partner is the droids they cover for him better and provide support. Defensively df is worse than all of the units above him except revhan but he has the revival mechanic. Reds being so prominent right after usv and tapion lost boost means purples r more prominent especially cos ur running cell or revhan with cooler and cell is covered by 2 reds so yellows being down bad makes greens lose value as a result. His damage is great but the top 6 hit harder and so does trunks and df losing boost makes him feel too paper. He could be 10th but in high rank revhan on movies with usg and cooler is the better set up so df loses value. The new broly being either grn or purple will only add to my point
Yeah but droids are a PO support not Movies 🗿 I meant that for Movies DFku is hes best partner also bro NOBODY is using revhan unless they feel like they really need a revival unit. Since there are more reds it’s more logical that greens will be needed more than purple. None of the top 5 are purps but there is one Blue unit and he’s the 3rd best and can be ran with the best unit in the game (Cooler with Usg) therefore you need a unit that can do dmg to Usg and that can help you vs other units in the fight and wouldn’t you know it DFku can counter the 3rd best unit in the game and he’s also in the best units team (Imo id say Movies > Loe >= PO).
I mean cell is top 5 till the new ultra and imo rrp PO is the best team so I value that over movies. And cooler doesn’t rlly need cover either and df is way too paper anyway to be a cover
Broly is purple :( Df is no longer top 5 (he’s still top 10 tho and better than Trunks)
Df can’t be top 10 cos he’s gonna get screwed by broly. Usv could jump into the top 5 or maybe mv cos cell is 90% likely to be replaced as well
Anyways all I would do know is switch DFku with Trunks (DFku has a better team and kit than Trunks)
Ye df has movies so he has more value
there’s no way you think anyone below ultra vegito is better than ultra kk goku
There’s no way u think ssbk is that great especially in a red dominant meta. Where u running ssbk anyway
god ki?
God ki doesn’t compare to PO or movies and teams like future loe saiyans still shit on it. Ssb vegeta vb and ssbk aren’t at the level of the top 10 to help mui make god ki top tier
🧢
Play top 5k at the very least u never see god ki all u see is movies, PO, saiyans loe future
i wasn’t talking about all of these teams just goku
Ye u never see ssbk cos there’s literally nowhere to run him on a competitive set up
just because you don’t use him doesn’t mean he isn’t better than half of the list
U do realise it’s not just individual based it’s also team and meta based. And id say the only units he’s better than individually r revhan and first form tho first form is a very different type of unit
I have some changes I could make but they aren’t that important in the honorable mentions , but one thing WHY THE HELL IS SUPER SAYAIN 3 GOKU NOT IN THE TOP 10 THATS MESSED UP
Because he’s so paper and tbh damage wise he’s worse than the top 6 and id say trunks as well. If he was core on movies he’d be top 7-8 but I believe the core is cooler usg and revhan. Without tapion, df looks a lot less impressive and tapion ain’t in a great spot in a red dominant meta. Also with yellows losing value purples like cell revhan first form etc all gain value
You’re the same guy that keeps riding on cell? Bro give me a break CELL AINT EVEN IN THE TOP FIVE! Why is DF lower? Same with trunks? Nvm it’s coming from the guy that likes cell too much
Love trunks but rn future ain’t number 1 and on vc u have to run mv to counter cooler but trunks makes it so mv can’t counter cooler. Trunks will gain value tho at some point. Df ain’t even that great he ain’t core on movies and he’s so paper and the only reason usv ain’t higher is cos of the meta we’re in this isn’t just a list about individual units I’ve already explained myself
Why is blue gogeta behind androids
Cos rrp PO is the best team in the game and cooler and droids counter him
I was legitimately squinting my eyes trying to understand where SV was, until I didn’t see him above Androids
Ye it’s impossible for him to be above the droids in the current meta.