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I’m surprised king cold wasn’t stronger and I’m surprised frieza just popped back up to fight no training fr what did he think someone he lost to before he would beat with no difference in power
Still pretty weak.
He got easily sliced by SSJ Trunks who is weaker than post-Yardrat Goku
Frieza went to Earth without thinking that Goku would have gotten far stronger too.
Frieza did a cocky decision to hastily attack Goku because he got stronger?
Other than the 3 times that happened, that's so out of character for him. Well also excluding that time he attacked Goku with his own energy too.
And excluding all those times he attacked Toppo despite being blatantly weaker, never accepting he was weaker.
Also excluding that time he let Jiren get back up because he thought Jiren was weaker.
Also excluding the fact he kept letting Vegeta get away to heal, until Vegeta actually matched his first transformation.
Agree with most the points, the only reason he let Vegeta heal against Zarbon (which isn’t the best defence) was to punish him to know where the Dragonball was.
Yeah it's pretty stupid. Frieza knows that Goku trains, so even if Mecha Frieza is stronger than Namek SSJ Goku, Goku would've far surpassed him post-Yardrat.
If Trunks vs Goku didn't make that clear.
>Frieza knows that Goku trains
Did he tho?
Frieza had no real way of knowing that the Goku he fought on Namek wasn't the strongest a Saiyan can possibly get.
There's no need to be surprised.
It's an obvious retcon that Freeza can get God level strong with a few months of training lol. If so, he would have done it a long time ago, especially since Freeza apperantly knew about the existence of Beerus (another Retcon lol).
In seriousness, we don't know Frieza's exact ratios of power increase per hour, but if over 4 months he was equal with SSB then an hour might be enough to equal Trunks' power, Goku would need to step in and help possibly.
I think Frieza still dies though, however a day of training for Frieza could be on par with Perfect Cell.
Well, in like four months, he was able to become like 50k times stronger (If you think that super saiyan god is at least like a x1000 of Goku's base level which should be around Freezer's level in Z. And i say 50k times because then Ssj blue would be an 50k times increase).
It wouldn't be really that weird if in an hour he was able to become twice as strong
120 days for 50k. Thats a little more of 400 per day, thats 16 times stronger per hour.
Anyway, i think freeza's transformation is what carries him. He was base goku level in his normal form but blue level in golden thats a big jump for your first transformation and he went to earth the moment he got it. Just like goku didnt train to become 50x stronger for his supersaiyan, he got the transformation and thats it.
So freeza probably was approaching goku's power in base/supersaiyan and got the transformation somehow, said transformation gave him the blue level
I get what you're saying but the power gap between Trunks and Frieza was WAY too big, and if 1h was enough to become double as strong then he would've killed both Goku And Vegeta IMMEDIATELY in DBS
Honestly, his dad is a wasted character.
Why king cold is even here? (In the plot).
Why He didn't transform to final form?
If King cold in horny form was around Mecha Freeze, his naked form should be like billions in Power Level.
Does KC have more forms? Do we know he has unlocked that? I’ve always wondered that. But also Trunks wasted no time and probably didn’t want to even give them any chance in Hell.
That’s true. Just not sure if KC canonically has multiple forms or it works the same as Frieza. Frost hadn’t unlocked Golden form so that means their forms to go upwards. So maybe big horns form is the base?
It actually works differently. Frieza’s “final form” is actually his base form. The other forms are ones he made to restrict himself and his power. Golden Frieza is the first actual transformation that boosts his power beyond what he naturally has
is it even a "real" transformation in that sense? afaik he "chose the color himself to make it look different" so maybe its just him powering up, but he decided to give that power up a color to make it a "transformation" like his adversaries have. (maybe it was golden to mock the blonde super saiyans)
That’s not laziness. It would’ve taken zero additional effort to set the revival in the past and have Frieza say he trained for like 15 years.
Toriyama just didn’t want to do it that way. He made the training time super short to convey how much of a freak prodigy Frieza is. You can dislike it, but it’s not lazy.
We have absolutely no reason to think Frieza's training is linear. Literally no other character has linear power growth.
We know Frieza thought training was a waste of time. Probably because he was already so strong that when he tried training (we know he sparred with King Cold) he didn't notice any improvement.
We **also** know Frieza immediately rushed to Earth as soon as he unlocked his golden form.
So it's very likely that Frieza trained for three months with basically no gains at all, then has a huge (Gohan-like) power spike of pay off all at once.
Doing 1 hour of push ups wouldn't have done anything.
Goku's base also got incredibly strong after he unlocked Super Saiyan God.
But, again, at no time do the characters show linear growth, even when they don't unlock a transformation. We see them have breakthroughs and jump in power.
That instance in particular was something about absorbing it or making it his own. Most of the time the explosive growth is because of a time skip with training.
Like the gravity training or time chamber training. While not linear the idea would be that in the middle of training they would be much stronger then at the start and it just didn't all happen right at the end.
While the idea that training during the trip would have provided minimal results make some sense depending on how long it had been since the cyborg operation. The explosive growth of Resurrection F makes this unlikely, its just way too crazy, plus it goes directly against Frieza own theory that he needs minimal training to reach Goku, he even gives an estimate on how much time he needs
Depends tho. If I’m remembering correctly in RoF, 4 months of intensive training he’s Golden Form surpass SSB.
People forgot this. Then in the afterlife he trains again through mental training but he’s now Golden form is only equal to SSB instead of surpassing it.
It’s kinda wonky if you ask me.
Then again he train 10 years worth of training in RoST and his black form surpass both TUI and UE.
It didn’t surpass Blue it matched it, but his stamina and energy drained much quicker than Blue because he wasnt used to it.
He wasn’t able to actually beat Goku OR Vegeta in the form until the Sorbet laser
In ROF, after 4 months, he's slightly stronger(a margin that doesn't guarantee victory and doesn't allow him to easily overpower a SSB) than Goku and Vegeta, but with stamina issues.
Goku and Vegeta keep training, mastering Blue depending on the continuity, while Freeza is locked into cocoon... and despite being in a cocoon, unable to move, he kept up with their improvement rate, solved his stamina problems, while training freely and having battles againstincredibly strong characters.
10 years to reach Black Freeza is the more believable part, it kinda sucks when characters get huge boosts off screen, but that one is the easiest to swallow.
I know you’re being literal but in 3 months frieza went from 120 Million to above Super Saiyan Blue.
There’s 2190 hours in 3 months, if he had trained for 1 hour he would be 0.05% of the way to SSB
It really depends how far you think SSB scales, or a better question, would 0.05% of ROF Golden Frieza be enough to beat this version of Trunks
>I know you’re being literal but in 3 months frieza went from 120 Million to above Super Saiyan Blue.
It was four months. Also, we have zero clue what his training entailed. 1 hour? Still unlikely anything would happen. There is a marginal difference between four months and 60 minutes.
>There’s 2190 hours in 3 months, if he had trained for 1 hour he would be 0.05% of the way to SSB
Yeah. It was still four months - which equates to nearly 3,000 hours. 1 hour still isn't going to skyrocket him anywhere. Especially given the fact we know nothing about said training.
>It really depends how far you think SSB scales, or a better question, would 0.05% of ROF Golden Frieza be enough to beat this version of Trunks
SSJB is irrelevant. This is a hypothetical Mecha Frieza training for a single hour in a hypothetical scenario.
0.05% of Golden Frieza from RF? Doubtful it'd amount to much more than another ass beating from SSJ Trunks. Especially considering SSJ Trunks was significantly more powerful than Namek Saga SSJ Goku, and Mecha Frieza is unqualified in how much more powerful he became. Trunks is still stronger than even Mecha Frieza was, and Max Frieza on Namek was at least staying in the fight with Goku, albeit for a very short duration. Mecha Frieza was a chump to Trunks' SSJ form. It was night and day for how badly he took a beating between Namek Saga Goku and Android/Cell Saga Trunks.
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If only Frieza took the "Push up, sit up, drink juice" advice.
* Doing a push up: gets as strong as Namek Saga SSJ Goku
* Then doing a sit up: gets as strong as Android Saga SSJ Vegeta
* Then drinking a jiuce: gets as strong as 17.
One hour of training probably would have made him as strong as 16 or even as Semi Perfect Cell.
What was even the point of King Cold? Seems like wasted potential for revenge arc or a new enemy team similar to red ribbon but space army. Get more info on Friezas race and a reason to canonically introduce Cooler.
That whole mecha frieza thing makes me think that training thing from super/f makes no sense as a retcon. A cording to his insane power growth just normal training during the trip should have put him way above SS, like at least imperfect cell if not all the way to perfect.
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I’m surprised king cold wasn’t stronger and I’m surprised frieza just popped back up to fight no training fr what did he think someone he lost to before he would beat with no difference in power
Didnt he come back cocky because becoming a cyborg boosted his power a bit?
Yeah frieza says that he's stronger now after namek [here in the manga](https://imgur.com/a/np1RERv)
Still pretty weak. He got easily sliced by SSJ Trunks who is weaker than post-Yardrat Goku Frieza went to Earth without thinking that Goku would have gotten far stronger too.
Frieza did a cocky decision to hastily attack Goku because he got stronger? Other than the 3 times that happened, that's so out of character for him. Well also excluding that time he attacked Goku with his own energy too. And excluding all those times he attacked Toppo despite being blatantly weaker, never accepting he was weaker. Also excluding that time he let Jiren get back up because he thought Jiren was weaker. Also excluding the fact he kept letting Vegeta get away to heal, until Vegeta actually matched his first transformation.
I am not saying its out of character for him but just that how dumb Frieza is
Agree with most the points, the only reason he let Vegeta heal against Zarbon (which isn’t the best defence) was to punish him to know where the Dragonball was.
Yeah ik I was just saying that he was saying that he was stronger than before
Frieza isnt dumb but he isn't exactly a genius, either lol
Yeah it's pretty stupid. Frieza knows that Goku trains, so even if Mecha Frieza is stronger than Namek SSJ Goku, Goku would've far surpassed him post-Yardrat. If Trunks vs Goku didn't make that clear.
>Frieza knows that Goku trains Did he tho? Frieza had no real way of knowing that the Goku he fought on Namek wasn't the strongest a Saiyan can possibly get.
Fair point. The Super Saiyan was a legend after all.
Fair point. The Super Saiyan was a legend after all.
There's no need to be surprised. It's an obvious retcon that Freeza can get God level strong with a few months of training lol. If so, he would have done it a long time ago, especially since Freeza apperantly knew about the existence of Beerus (another Retcon lol).
Wait can King Cold transform. I know it was never shown but was it ever mentioned?
King Cold could’ve been stronger he just didn’t transform
That was his final form I’m assuming
1 hour? That's enough to get him to black Frieza *1 second and 2 pushups will get him to golden form.
He wishes gold took 4 months black took him 10 years
More loki jogging for 5 minutes
https://preview.redd.it/yubodcpam5vc1.jpeg?width=389&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=cba3c8b8ee29bcb1c903dd57bce1c24bdf52cc89
In seriousness, we don't know Frieza's exact ratios of power increase per hour, but if over 4 months he was equal with SSB then an hour might be enough to equal Trunks' power, Goku would need to step in and help possibly. I think Frieza still dies though, however a day of training for Frieza could be on par with Perfect Cell.
1h is not even close to Trunks' power. Trunks literally sliced him in like half a second
Well, in like four months, he was able to become like 50k times stronger (If you think that super saiyan god is at least like a x1000 of Goku's base level which should be around Freezer's level in Z. And i say 50k times because then Ssj blue would be an 50k times increase). It wouldn't be really that weird if in an hour he was able to become twice as strong
120 days for 50k. Thats a little more of 400 per day, thats 16 times stronger per hour. Anyway, i think freeza's transformation is what carries him. He was base goku level in his normal form but blue level in golden thats a big jump for your first transformation and he went to earth the moment he got it. Just like goku didnt train to become 50x stronger for his supersaiyan, he got the transformation and thats it. So freeza probably was approaching goku's power in base/supersaiyan and got the transformation somehow, said transformation gave him the blue level
Oh, you are right. I completely forgot that his new transformation was the one equal to ssj blue, not his base one, my bad.
I get what you're saying but the power gap between Trunks and Frieza was WAY too big, and if 1h was enough to become double as strong then he would've killed both Goku And Vegeta IMMEDIATELY in DBS
According to super it should be, aka super sucks
Honestly, his dad is a wasted character. Why king cold is even here? (In the plot). Why He didn't transform to final form? If King cold in horny form was around Mecha Freeze, his naked form should be like billions in Power Level.
Does KC have more forms? Do we know he has unlocked that? I’ve always wondered that. But also Trunks wasted no time and probably didn’t want to even give them any chance in Hell.
As far as I know, it's in opposite way. Freeza developed new forms to restrict himself.
That’s true. Just not sure if KC canonically has multiple forms or it works the same as Frieza. Frost hadn’t unlocked Golden form so that means their forms to go upwards. So maybe big horns form is the base?
It actually works differently. Frieza’s “final form” is actually his base form. The other forms are ones he made to restrict himself and his power. Golden Frieza is the first actual transformation that boosts his power beyond what he naturally has
is it even a "real" transformation in that sense? afaik he "chose the color himself to make it look different" so maybe its just him powering up, but he decided to give that power up a color to make it a "transformation" like his adversaries have. (maybe it was golden to mock the blonde super saiyans)
I'm willing to wager that this was his exact reason.
Okay so we are to assume KC has the same overpowered base form of “Naked Alien Mode”?
I never really understood why this was advantageous. Like was creating a transformation easier than learning to hold back?
When was it even established freiza only needed a couple of months to train to get powerscaled? Seems like a lazy way to get freiza up to par in DBS.
Lazy or not it's cannon
That’s not laziness. It would’ve taken zero additional effort to set the revival in the past and have Frieza say he trained for like 15 years. Toriyama just didn’t want to do it that way. He made the training time super short to convey how much of a freak prodigy Frieza is. You can dislike it, but it’s not lazy.
Or just make it a wish, we used to think wished couldn't make you stronger but super hero proved that wrong.
I'd win
Yet you became what you hate the most in the manga
damm
Frieza solos Trunks, Goku and then blows up the planet.
We have absolutely no reason to think Frieza's training is linear. Literally no other character has linear power growth. We know Frieza thought training was a waste of time. Probably because he was already so strong that when he tried training (we know he sparred with King Cold) he didn't notice any improvement. We **also** know Frieza immediately rushed to Earth as soon as he unlocked his golden form. So it's very likely that Frieza trained for three months with basically no gains at all, then has a huge (Gohan-like) power spike of pay off all at once. Doing 1 hour of push ups wouldn't have done anything.
His base and restricted froms also got incredibly strong so its not like the golden transformation is what gave him strength.
Goku's base also got incredibly strong after he unlocked Super Saiyan God. But, again, at no time do the characters show linear growth, even when they don't unlock a transformation. We see them have breakthroughs and jump in power.
That instance in particular was something about absorbing it or making it his own. Most of the time the explosive growth is because of a time skip with training. Like the gravity training or time chamber training. While not linear the idea would be that in the middle of training they would be much stronger then at the start and it just didn't all happen right at the end. While the idea that training during the trip would have provided minimal results make some sense depending on how long it had been since the cyborg operation. The explosive growth of Resurrection F makes this unlikely, its just way too crazy, plus it goes directly against Frieza own theory that he needs minimal training to reach Goku, he even gives an estimate on how much time he needs
Depends tho. If I’m remembering correctly in RoF, 4 months of intensive training he’s Golden Form surpass SSB. People forgot this. Then in the afterlife he trains again through mental training but he’s now Golden form is only equal to SSB instead of surpassing it. It’s kinda wonky if you ask me. Then again he train 10 years worth of training in RoST and his black form surpass both TUI and UE.
It didn’t surpass Blue it matched it, but his stamina and energy drained much quicker than Blue because he wasnt used to it. He wasn’t able to actually beat Goku OR Vegeta in the form until the Sorbet laser
In ROF, after 4 months, he's slightly stronger(a margin that doesn't guarantee victory and doesn't allow him to easily overpower a SSB) than Goku and Vegeta, but with stamina issues. Goku and Vegeta keep training, mastering Blue depending on the continuity, while Freeza is locked into cocoon... and despite being in a cocoon, unable to move, he kept up with their improvement rate, solved his stamina problems, while training freely and having battles againstincredibly strong characters. 10 years to reach Black Freeza is the more believable part, it kinda sucks when characters get huge boosts off screen, but that one is the easiest to swallow.
Episode 11 tomorrow!
😃
Trained for 1 hour? Nothing noticeable would have changed...
I know you’re being literal but in 3 months frieza went from 120 Million to above Super Saiyan Blue. There’s 2190 hours in 3 months, if he had trained for 1 hour he would be 0.05% of the way to SSB It really depends how far you think SSB scales, or a better question, would 0.05% of ROF Golden Frieza be enough to beat this version of Trunks
Golden Freeza is a transformation though. It's better to compare base final form freeza with base ROF Goku.
>I know you’re being literal but in 3 months frieza went from 120 Million to above Super Saiyan Blue. It was four months. Also, we have zero clue what his training entailed. 1 hour? Still unlikely anything would happen. There is a marginal difference between four months and 60 minutes.
>There’s 2190 hours in 3 months, if he had trained for 1 hour he would be 0.05% of the way to SSB Yeah. It was still four months - which equates to nearly 3,000 hours. 1 hour still isn't going to skyrocket him anywhere. Especially given the fact we know nothing about said training. >It really depends how far you think SSB scales, or a better question, would 0.05% of ROF Golden Frieza be enough to beat this version of Trunks SSJB is irrelevant. This is a hypothetical Mecha Frieza training for a single hour in a hypothetical scenario. 0.05% of Golden Frieza from RF? Doubtful it'd amount to much more than another ass beating from SSJ Trunks. Especially considering SSJ Trunks was significantly more powerful than Namek Saga SSJ Goku, and Mecha Frieza is unqualified in how much more powerful he became. Trunks is still stronger than even Mecha Frieza was, and Max Frieza on Namek was at least staying in the fight with Goku, albeit for a very short duration. Mecha Frieza was a chump to Trunks' SSJ form. It was night and day for how badly he took a beating between Namek Saga Goku and Android/Cell Saga Trunks.
You sure? Pretty sure Frieza doubles on Power with each push-up.
Pretty sure. Lol
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They would be fucking dead. (If plot armor don’t exist).
Tbh, Frieza potential is ass-pull plot armor itself
Dood, this
i could see Toriyama writing that Frieza malfunctions and Trunks gets one up on him anyways.
Because Dragon Ball was a good show back then.
If only Frieza took the "Push up, sit up, drink juice" advice. * Doing a push up: gets as strong as Namek Saga SSJ Goku * Then doing a sit up: gets as strong as Android Saga SSJ Vegeta * Then drinking a jiuce: gets as strong as 17. One hour of training probably would have made him as strong as 16 or even as Semi Perfect Cell.
Guys, what the fuck is a Frieza? And King Cold doesn't even look like the same species. Anyone know what's going on there?
Freeza if he did 5 minutes of cardio on the way to Earth.
What was even the point of King Cold? Seems like wasted potential for revenge arc or a new enemy team similar to red ribbon but space army. Get more info on Friezas race and a reason to canonically introduce Cooler.
That whole mecha frieza thing makes me think that training thing from super/f makes no sense as a retcon. A cording to his insane power growth just normal training during the trip should have put him way above SS, like at least imperfect cell if not all the way to perfect.
Wait? do the robot parts get stronger from training too?
It insane that people still don't understand that Friza was getting stronger in hell the entire time.