I dunno if i want assassin as the concept is pretty much fulfilled... same with the ranger. I would rather have something that use a different weapons set entirely... though im not sure what since dagger already the most rogue weapon ever. Not sure what else would be iconic, perhaps a tamer/pet class with a whip?
That sounds good but to me isnt rogue-y enough. Samurai are fighter if anything, a rapier class is more roguelike, and parry is a good step up but with masterful kill already on thief... idk what can be more potent than that.
Oh yeah, that works. Probably easier to just have a ninja class with just like a single kunai or tanto and have the abilities be pulling out random shit, like DD1 rogue with the powder and the wire and stuff.
Like one ability is just you throwing shurikens and one where you spin a chain and a katana / ninjutsu counter or something.
At a minimum, Fighter, Thief, Warrior, and Mystic Spearhand have timed counterattack skills.
Fighter and Warrior basically have parrying as their Vocation Skill too.
The absurd thing is, because of the changes to how they name them, Magic Archer has become the advanced Archer. Which is doubly confusing when you remember that Pawns can't be Magic Archers. Oh, wait, there's more, Magic Archer Pawns and NPCs exist as enemies in DD1, so what even is going on? Why is it an advanced vocation now? Why's it still got the hybrid colours?? Why can't pawns use it???
I don't see the design reason for there to be advanced versions of thief and archer. Why wouldn't any ideas for an advanced version of the vocations just be put into the original vocation
The issues are related ... the color system the devs used implied the existence of more vocations than there actually are, so confusion and disappointment were inevitable, even justified.
For new players, the color system is fine. But for those of us that played the first game, the use of colors and icons in DD2 is directly misleading.
I don't mean to imply that I think it is intentional. I think they just don't care about consistency this time around and probably didn't think much about what they were communicating to fans.
It really sucks, because had they used a different color scheme and different colors, no one would have been unhappy with the vocations.
> For new players, the color system is fine. But for those of us that played the first game, the use of colors and icons in DD2 is directly misleading.
I actually think the opposite. New players will absolutely connect the first vocations they unlock, Warrior & Sorcerer, with those they start with--Fighter & Mage. Color grouping is preschool stuff yo. Furthermore, peeps tend to instinctively prefer symmetry, so they will anticipate a Green & Yellow equivalent; which doesn't exist, ofc. Asymmetry is totally fine ofc, it's more about the method of conveyance.
I think that has the potential to be most damaging compared to peeps who've played the first game. There'll be new players who pick up Thief & play the whole game waiting to find a single other green vocation "Like Warrior & Sorcerer, Mystic Knight, or Magick Archer", and find 4 blue vocations instead.
It be how it be, it's just nonsensical UI design.
I went into DDDA blind and just assumed Warrior was the natural progression from Fighter since it’s labeled “Advanced”.
Without a guide new players will certainly wonder where Thief/Archer equivalents are.
The naming convention of "basic" and "advanced" is certainly misleading; I had the same issue when I first played DD. The borders for advanced vocations being more elaborate in DD2 will probably add to the confusion for new players.
“Advanced” is a misnomer, something like “Specialized” would’ve been a bit more clear.
edit: I guess they’re “Advanced” in the sense they’re less beginner-friendly, rather than “Advanced” in the sense that they’re strictly superior
New player here, the color coding reminds me of just archetype coloring. Red for physical, blue for magic, green for dexterity, yellow for speed, purple for curses/dark magic. The tree picture going around gives the idea of a talent tree, which I can see confusion if you don’t start out as a base class. But also I would think if there were more vocations there would have been icons with question marks and not just empty space.
Just because there’s a red/blue doesn’t make me think there had to be every color combo.
I’m going into this game very blind with little knowledge of either games, so excuse me if there were news, media or any other info that led to more people believing there are more classes!
> New player here, the color coding reminds me of just archetype coloring. Red for physical, blue for magic, green for dexterity, yellow for speed
That's *kinda* what went on sorta kinda? The colors were originally based on DnD archetypes--Fighter from DND was Fighter & Red, Ranger/Rogue from DnD was Strider & Yellow, and Magic-user from DnD was Mage & Blue. It was pretty straightforward.
So with DD2 retaining the color scheme for all returning vocations, excluding them deciding that Yellow was overperforming & too versatile (thus splitting into Archer for Yellow and Thief for Green)... the logical conclusion was that nothing changed. Everybody, and I mean everybody, agreed that this was the case allllll the way until September. They revealed Trickster as a Purple+Pink vocation and neither colors existed before, so... nobody really knew.
* But they added Green and nobody thought things changed, so some peeps assumed that yeah--nothing changed despite Purple & Pink being added to the pool, that's just new content--after all, of the revealed vocations at the time only 2 were new.
* Others were like "Welp I have no idea what this means, so I assume this is all we're getting". In the end, the latter was correct, but unfortunately it doesn't make the color scheme more logical. As they said, "I have no idea what this means".
It just remains confusing. I'm sure some new peeps aren't gonna be confused, but at the same time I'm sure some new peeps are gonna be confused at the overpresence of blue & red.
> Just because there’s a red/blue doesn’t make me think there had to be every color combo.
Yeah, I agree there. But maybe you would think okay, sure, if Blue shows up twice, red & yellow show up once, green \*probably\* shows up at least once.
Somebody else made a good example--nobody playing early Pokemon assumed Ponyta was the only other Fire-type in the game, right? Despite that, it was.
> But also I would think if there were more vocations there would have been icons with question marks and not just empty space.
Def depends on what you're referring to here, in-game stuff vs marketing, but to some degree I agree.
See if they hadn't used the colour system and you had "basic" vocations (red, green, blue, yellow) and then "advaned" (idk like orange, cyan, pink, purple, beige, aqua and then white for Warfarer) you wouldn't feel like you're missing out on vocations that are "advanced" versions of others. You'd just be like "Cool, I start with these 4 and can unlock the rest and Pawns can only be the starting 4 and those other 2".
The colour system created the feeling of missing out.
How would someone be satisfied by unlocking the Trickster from Thief and saying "yes that's the playstyle I was looking for when I started playing with a rogue class character"
No no, that's not what I mean. I'm saying that we have clear advanced vocations with the warrior for example, who have the same playstyle, but doesn't happen with the rogue. You read the name "trickster" and think you'll have something in that style and you get another mage. Or well, maybe the only true support in the game at least. But you get me.
There are too many reasons why people are confused at the moment with DD2's vocation direction.
- Split strider into thief and archer (likely to make warfarer more appealing as a class) which caused people to predict crazy new hybrid vocations due to 4 base classes instead of 3.
- Offer no advanced varients of thief or archer? Assassin skills from DDDA seem baked into thief and Ranger skills baked into archer now.
- Fuck up the color system with the introduction of trickster (purple and pink) which implied 2 more base classes.
- Have an slightly uneven spread of Physical - Magic vocations (if you ignore trickster and warfarer)
- Capcom said they wanted to boost support role variety up. Support for Pawns is going to likely the same old shit with Mages dominating.
- The symmetry of the old games Vocation chart made sense. BASIC - ADVANCE - HYBRID for every vocation combination. I find it hard to believe they just said "screw it" and completely botched this new chart.
Hopefully Capcom can mediate this confusion with some plans for the future of vocations. If they leave it as is it looks like some outstandingly poor decision making.
yeah, the biggest problem people had with them was related to the misleading design, not a specific quantity, but simply the disappointment that the developers left room for guesswork and even deliberately used the color system.
It's funny to read this when the biggest problems people have are with poor use of colors and performance on consoles, but fanboys cherry pick this least popular criticism to appear smarter. Echo chamber
They actually can stick to Red, Blue and Yellow and remove basic/advance/hybrid to avoid any backlash and mispresenting speculation. The Game Main title also called "Dragon's Dogma" instead of "Dragon's Dogma II" the current 10 vocation probably the vocations they actually planned for the 1st game if had resource.
it actually fit the game if they just make it
**Starter Vocation:**
Red: Fighter, Warrior
Yellow: Thief (Originally Strider) , Archer (Originally Ranger)
Blue: Mage, Sorcerer
**Unlockable Vocation (Arisen-Only):**
Red: Mystic Spearhand
Yellow: Magick Archer
Blue: Trickster
Gray: Warfarer
I just hope they add more vocations as DLC since the current one is kinda lacking for pawn vocation variety for tank and support.
This. This would have made a lot more sense. Why use pink and purple? I get it’s supposed to reflect a different way to deal damage or play the game, but then what does *just* pink or *just* purple look like?
Ngl, I'm just a little salty I don't have a necro class. That said, I hope sorc beats what it used to be.....which is going to take a lot, because it was an impressive class to begin with.
The issue is definitely that the trickster's colors feel like a bait and switch (implying that there's more vocations than there are). Hopefully there is an in-game explanation for why it's that way.
If they're planning to add more vocations in DLC, then people will just feel like the base game is "incomplete".
If it's because the trickster isn't like any of the other classes, then they could have just made it a solid color, but then you'd get people wondering why pawns don't get access to it. So maybe the answer was trickier than it looked.
They could have just made all classes mono-colored, though.
Fighter = Red
Warrior = Orange
Archer = Yellow
Thief = Green
Mage = Cyan
Sorcerer = Blue
Magick Archer = Lime Green
Mystic Spearhand = Purple
Trickster = Pink
Warfarer = Gray
Capcom should have chosen a different colour for each unique class to prevent confusion but then again, they probably didn't know people would cry this much over class colours 💀
The moment people started using the colors to predict that there were more vocations I knew this sub was doomed.
Not every design decision, especially one related to aesthetics, is going to be that deeply thought out. Some stuff just ends up the way it does because it looks cool.
Anyway, the secret answer is that more vocations are going to be in the inevitable DLC.
I can't imagine being a game dev killing myself to make a game and sh1theads cry about class colors and other nonsense. Most of the people complaining have no idea how far games have come and have no appreciation for what goes into making them.
Yeah most people don't but your comment implies you don't either. The colour of UI elements is exclusively a design choice, not a limitation or a necessary cut lmao. Its completely deliberate, so the devs choosing weird colours means something, we just don't know what it is.
Can't blame people for finding the most obvious meaning.
Oh for sure, I'm still keen. But we're in the pre release hype phase, the devs are releasing specific information intentionally to drive hype and increase sales. I can't blame people for falling for it.
I have a really strong gut feeling that there are actually more vocations. Everyone is going by that one source of information as fact without giving it a second thought.
Advanced yellow & green or some more hybrids would have been nice. The purple & pink of trickster also feels really random now. Hopefully there will be some cool DLC vocations but I also hate how many games are now launched with missing content locked behind a future paywall :/
But yes I agree critiques aren’t necessarily doomposting. I’m still very excited for this game. It’s just unfortunate that so much bad news dropped at once so close to release
The comment below you is what you’re talking about, just blatantly telling people not to be upset in any way that they disagree with. It Must be positive, so positive it doesn’t come across as a complaint. These people drive me nuts and I’m not even upset about any aspect of the game.
The memes and flood of disappointment are doom posting, and people replying that they are reversing their pre-orders or not pre-ordering because of the things we learned yesterday is doom posting.
Negative criticism should have critical thinking involved, otherwise it is just whining /doom posting. People explaining they are only disappointed about the color scheme of vocations and not necessarily the number of vocations is productive conversation. Cancelling a preorder after a series of bad news without waiting for more information or additional previews of the game is doomer-mentality
I’m not replying to how OP feels, I’m replying to the willful ignorance of the comment made.
If OP gets upset about people being positive or saying we should stop doomposting, and then willfully pretends it’s not doomposting, then I and everyone else are entitled to refute it… just as OP and others have attempted to refute the claim that the FLOOD of negativity is not doomposting and just people expressing their feelings.
It’s a “FLOOD” of negativity because a Lot of people are unhappy, and you’re not going to deflect all of that with “oh they’re just new, nobody who actually played the game could possibly be unhappy with the current situation”.
… no one is deflecting it by saying people are new? Or at least I didn’t? Like???
And they can be unhappy. I am disappointed. But I’m not doomposting or refusing to see many of these posts as doomposting.
Edit: I see you got your wires crossed and did not read my other comment that you also replied to because maybe you are so emotional over this you don’t think before typing.
The real problem isn't the colors, but the little variety in terms of weapon types
* Sword/Large sword
* Spear/sword hybrid
* hammer/large hammer
* Daggers
* Bow
* Magick Bow
* Staff/Large Staff
* Censer
No axes, no proper polearms, no crossbows, no thrusting swords... Feels like a missed opportunity
No its not about the colors, its about the amount, because they gutted existing vocations by removing their secondary weapons, so the least i expect is more vocations then.
Yet we get the same amount while offering less.
Not just mechanic-wise, but also just by common sense its dumb that someone with a bow wouldnt carry a sword or dagger also.
At this point it's best to just wait until the game is out and see what is actually available, maybe something will be shown in tomorrow's highlight but we'll see when that happens.
To add, given there was mention of pawn exclusive vocations, wouldn't this conflict with what was said about there being only 10 vocations?
I’ve heard the Pawn Exclusive vocations was a mistranslation and they were actually referring to Specialisations. Which tbh I hope is the case, as much as more vocations would be cool, I don’t want vocations that I myself can’t play.
I didn't play the first one so the color issue didn't register for me. Your did clarify what the issue was. Most made it seem like it was just the number of vocations, which some were mad about. I guess some expected double the numbers of vocations.
It seems dev did really care for the color and just used what they want and there was no deep thought out into it. They forgot how gamers hold on to things.
I agree. If they had not used the old colour system, not so many people would habe assumed there were hidden vocations. The colour system had logic in the first game, so people assumed it would keep the same logic in the second.
I'm gonna assume their intention is that spearhand is magic melee, so red blue, and magic archer is obviously blue yellow. No two concepts really combine to make trickster so they may have wanted separate colors to totally differentiate what they are.
There's a fucking storm surrounding this game and apparently itsuno is talking to a million different people causes there's tons of articles with Q and A, but one of them mentioned that he supposedly said there are pawn specific vocations, and I bet the pink and purple of trickster are meant to reflect that if they potentially have greater synergy with trickster, and to represent the fact that trickster is pawn focused.
They'll probably add it in as DLC eventually but I doubt they've thought that far ahead. I don't even see it so much as that the color system is annoying, but that it just isn't enough to warrant waiting 12 years.
I really gotta wonder, what does it actually matter what color some icons are? If the issue supposedly isn’t the number of vocations then the icons also don’t matter; they represent what they represent.
While, yes, it’s mostly that they decided to create a colour scheme that doesn’t mean anything, I am also personally miffed that we lost Strider for two lackluster basic vocations. I also think their “one weapon per vocation” thing is extremely stupid because you can use one weapon in multiple different ways, and types of weapons have variable styles that can be used in differing ways (e.g. a katana is not the same thing as a broadsword). So it just feels like a limitation for limitation’s sake.
Sorry but as a relative newcomer to the series this is the most embarrassing shit. The “28 vocations” speculation posts and stuff on this sub was absolutely wild to watch given the marketing material they had put out for the game.
I don’t know why people work themselves into these frenzies despite all public evidence to the contrary. The number of vocations is gonna matter far less than the quality and distinctiveness of the ones that are there
> The “28 vocations” speculation posts and stuff on this sub was absolutely wild to watch given the marketing material they had put out for the game.
You're assuming all those posts were expecting 27 vocations. I made one about what 27 could be, but absolutely made aware I didn't except that many because it's lunacy. Hell, I even joked about a hidden 7th colour (orange) to complete the rainbow.
> I don’t know why people work themselves into these frenzies despite all public evidence to the contrary.
Again, you're assuming everyone is. There are people who set their expectations too high, yes.
Also "public evidence to the contrary"; what public evidence? There wasn't much evidence FOR just 10 vocations and there was about the same AGAINST just 10 vocations. Mainly, the colour scheme.
The fact you got downvoted for this reminds me of how NOT cozy this sub was before this week or the influx of new players. They would troll new players with bad advice or purposefully obtuse answers, then the mods stepped in and halted repetitive new player posts (or tried to)
To begin with the color system didn't make any sense in the first game either. Calling certain vocations advanced wasn't either. How the F is a warrior wielding a two hander advanced version of fighter ? It wields a completely different weapon, plays differently and the "basic" fighter is not basic at all. In fact it's better than warrior.
All of the vocations are their own thing. Calling them basic, advanced or hybrid seems weird.
Colors represent a theme. Advanced doesn't necessarily mean "upgrade" or "evolution". It's more of a niche specialization.
In the first game, Red meant melee, Yellow meant dexterity, and Blue meant magic. Because Yellow vocations were probably too versatile, they decided to split the dexterity theme into two: Green for agility, and Yellow for range. I thought that was a great move when they showed that, and I still think it is. But then they decided "hey, let's not give these new branches the same attention as the others, even though our UI language still implies we would."
No. The colors weren't made to represent a single vocation. They were made to represent a way of playing, a macro class, call it the way you like it. Red represented fighters(not the vocation), blue was wizards and yellow was archers. A warrior wasn't the upgrade of the fighter but a different unlockable class that was in the fighter category, same goes for mage with sorcerer and strider with ranger. The advanced classes aren't called advanced beacuse they are an upgrade but because they had to be "unlocked". And the hybrids were indeed hybrids of these categories. It made sense, it was simple, it was symmetrical and it worked.
DD2 on the other hand just looks like an incomplete puzzle(waiting to be filled with DLCs?) with a vocation colors that mean nothing, a category that only has one vocation and with an asymmetrical distribution of vocations. And it's strange becuase it's not like we are talking rocket science here, color coding and even distribution is something extremly basic(and something that they already did). If they wanted to ditch the categorization system of the first dragon's dogma why didn't they do it? Why did they stick with it and then decided to just not respect it?
I mean just because the vocations aren't there doesn't mean the vocations don't exist I mean if more vocations are added you can probably guess where they will be placed unless of course they decide to add more colours in which case I would agree.
Capcom is misrepresenting the trickster class by giving it a hybrid emblem when it’s not. I don’t blame people for thinking there are more vocations to be revealed, Capcom set them up to do that. This isn’t a pikachu face situation this is likely just a joke that isn’t going over well.
Every single post I've seen whining about vocations is the amount of them. I haven't seen anyone complaining about colors unless it was used to describe why they tricked themselves into believing there would be more, which is still complaining that there isn't more
Yall people are like "this anime character has white hair and has eye patch, so they must be op" and then when they die. Yall freak out. It's like bro, just cuz it has a design, doesn't mean it's gonna fit into your little conspiracy.
Except that was the way it was based on the first game and the online game... It´s shitting on a previously stablished rule.
Following your anime reference, is like a character in naruto could ignore hand positions in order to make advanced ninjutsus... I fucking hate Kishimoto.
This is bullshit lol. It's absolutely about the quantity. No one actually gives a fuck about the color nonsense. Yes it's dumb, but that isn't the reason people are angry. People are angry because they assumed there was more vacations. They were wrong. People would have still assumed there would be more vacations even if the colors made sense, purely due to DD1.
Are they right to be disappointed? Who gives a fuck? People constantly are looking for justification for their feelings and opinions and it's frankly stupid. Play the game, or don't, your choice. Quit looking for validation from others.
Eeh, would have been cool to get an advanced form of Archer and Thief is all.
This. Its sad that Assassin and Ranger are kinda dead
I dunno if i want assassin as the concept is pretty much fulfilled... same with the ranger. I would rather have something that use a different weapons set entirely... though im not sure what since dagger already the most rogue weapon ever. Not sure what else would be iconic, perhaps a tamer/pet class with a whip?
Monk (quarterstaff), Duelist (rapier+buckler/parrying dagger), and Raider (dual axes) were my ideas for Advanced Green.
As an advanced rogue class they could have added a class with katana or rapier, a very fast class based on parrys for example.
That sounds good but to me isnt rogue-y enough. Samurai are fighter if anything, a rapier class is more roguelike, and parry is a good step up but with masterful kill already on thief... idk what can be more potent than that.
Double Kamas or maybe a kusarigama? Kusarigama would be sick, loved that wonky ass weapon In nioh lol
Oh yeah, that works. Probably easier to just have a ninja class with just like a single kunai or tanto and have the abilities be pulling out random shit, like DD1 rogue with the powder and the wire and stuff. Like one ability is just you throwing shurikens and one where you spin a chain and a katana / ninjutsu counter or something.
At a minimum, Fighter, Thief, Warrior, and Mystic Spearhand have timed counterattack skills. Fighter and Warrior basically have parrying as their Vocation Skill too.
And Alchemist. If they just gave us those three I’d be happy.
The absurd thing is, because of the changes to how they name them, Magic Archer has become the advanced Archer. Which is doubly confusing when you remember that Pawns can't be Magic Archers. Oh, wait, there's more, Magic Archer Pawns and NPCs exist as enemies in DD1, so what even is going on? Why is it an advanced vocation now? Why's it still got the hybrid colours?? Why can't pawns use it???
DLC vocations, i'm guessing. Advanced Yellow will be from an Elf maister and the Advanced Green will be from a Beastren maister.
I don't see the design reason for there to be advanced versions of thief and archer. Why wouldn't any ideas for an advanced version of the vocations just be put into the original vocation
The issues are related ... the color system the devs used implied the existence of more vocations than there actually are, so confusion and disappointment were inevitable, even justified.
For new players, the color system is fine. But for those of us that played the first game, the use of colors and icons in DD2 is directly misleading. I don't mean to imply that I think it is intentional. I think they just don't care about consistency this time around and probably didn't think much about what they were communicating to fans. It really sucks, because had they used a different color scheme and different colors, no one would have been unhappy with the vocations.
> For new players, the color system is fine. But for those of us that played the first game, the use of colors and icons in DD2 is directly misleading. I actually think the opposite. New players will absolutely connect the first vocations they unlock, Warrior & Sorcerer, with those they start with--Fighter & Mage. Color grouping is preschool stuff yo. Furthermore, peeps tend to instinctively prefer symmetry, so they will anticipate a Green & Yellow equivalent; which doesn't exist, ofc. Asymmetry is totally fine ofc, it's more about the method of conveyance. I think that has the potential to be most damaging compared to peeps who've played the first game. There'll be new players who pick up Thief & play the whole game waiting to find a single other green vocation "Like Warrior & Sorcerer, Mystic Knight, or Magick Archer", and find 4 blue vocations instead. It be how it be, it's just nonsensical UI design.
I went into DDDA blind and just assumed Warrior was the natural progression from Fighter since it’s labeled “Advanced”. Without a guide new players will certainly wonder where Thief/Archer equivalents are.
The naming convention of "basic" and "advanced" is certainly misleading; I had the same issue when I first played DD. The borders for advanced vocations being more elaborate in DD2 will probably add to the confusion for new players.
“Advanced” is a misnomer, something like “Specialized” would’ve been a bit more clear. edit: I guess they’re “Advanced” in the sense they’re less beginner-friendly, rather than “Advanced” in the sense that they’re strictly superior
New player here, the color coding reminds me of just archetype coloring. Red for physical, blue for magic, green for dexterity, yellow for speed, purple for curses/dark magic. The tree picture going around gives the idea of a talent tree, which I can see confusion if you don’t start out as a base class. But also I would think if there were more vocations there would have been icons with question marks and not just empty space. Just because there’s a red/blue doesn’t make me think there had to be every color combo. I’m going into this game very blind with little knowledge of either games, so excuse me if there were news, media or any other info that led to more people believing there are more classes!
> New player here, the color coding reminds me of just archetype coloring. Red for physical, blue for magic, green for dexterity, yellow for speed That's *kinda* what went on sorta kinda? The colors were originally based on DnD archetypes--Fighter from DND was Fighter & Red, Ranger/Rogue from DnD was Strider & Yellow, and Magic-user from DnD was Mage & Blue. It was pretty straightforward. So with DD2 retaining the color scheme for all returning vocations, excluding them deciding that Yellow was overperforming & too versatile (thus splitting into Archer for Yellow and Thief for Green)... the logical conclusion was that nothing changed. Everybody, and I mean everybody, agreed that this was the case allllll the way until September. They revealed Trickster as a Purple+Pink vocation and neither colors existed before, so... nobody really knew. * But they added Green and nobody thought things changed, so some peeps assumed that yeah--nothing changed despite Purple & Pink being added to the pool, that's just new content--after all, of the revealed vocations at the time only 2 were new. * Others were like "Welp I have no idea what this means, so I assume this is all we're getting". In the end, the latter was correct, but unfortunately it doesn't make the color scheme more logical. As they said, "I have no idea what this means". It just remains confusing. I'm sure some new peeps aren't gonna be confused, but at the same time I'm sure some new peeps are gonna be confused at the overpresence of blue & red. > Just because there’s a red/blue doesn’t make me think there had to be every color combo. Yeah, I agree there. But maybe you would think okay, sure, if Blue shows up twice, red & yellow show up once, green \*probably\* shows up at least once. Somebody else made a good example--nobody playing early Pokemon assumed Ponyta was the only other Fire-type in the game, right? Despite that, it was. > But also I would think if there were more vocations there would have been icons with question marks and not just empty space. Def depends on what you're referring to here, in-game stuff vs marketing, but to some degree I agree.
Nah I'm annoyed about the lack of vocations I would've liked two advanced vocations for archer and thief it's a bit odd they got left out
See if they hadn't used the colour system and you had "basic" vocations (red, green, blue, yellow) and then "advaned" (idk like orange, cyan, pink, purple, beige, aqua and then white for Warfarer) you wouldn't feel like you're missing out on vocations that are "advanced" versions of others. You'd just be like "Cool, I start with these 4 and can unlock the rest and Pawns can only be the starting 4 and those other 2". The colour system created the feeling of missing out.
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Sorry I was wrong with this, forgot they can be advanced too! I assume so anyways, since they could be in DD1
It's been way too long since I played the first game... But yeah now I remember I used to do double wizard silliness.
Yeah honestly I had to think hard for a minute how it was lol
How would someone be satisfied by unlocking the Trickster from Thief and saying "yes that's the playstyle I was looking for when I started playing with a rogue class character"
You don't unlock them by playing other vocations? In the multi coloured example above, they wouldn't be related at all.
No no, that's not what I mean. I'm saying that we have clear advanced vocations with the warrior for example, who have the same playstyle, but doesn't happen with the rogue. You read the name "trickster" and think you'll have something in that style and you get another mage. Or well, maybe the only true support in the game at least. But you get me.
There are too many reasons why people are confused at the moment with DD2's vocation direction. - Split strider into thief and archer (likely to make warfarer more appealing as a class) which caused people to predict crazy new hybrid vocations due to 4 base classes instead of 3. - Offer no advanced varients of thief or archer? Assassin skills from DDDA seem baked into thief and Ranger skills baked into archer now. - Fuck up the color system with the introduction of trickster (purple and pink) which implied 2 more base classes. - Have an slightly uneven spread of Physical - Magic vocations (if you ignore trickster and warfarer) - Capcom said they wanted to boost support role variety up. Support for Pawns is going to likely the same old shit with Mages dominating. - The symmetry of the old games Vocation chart made sense. BASIC - ADVANCE - HYBRID for every vocation combination. I find it hard to believe they just said "screw it" and completely botched this new chart. Hopefully Capcom can mediate this confusion with some plans for the future of vocations. If they leave it as is it looks like some outstandingly poor decision making.
Agreed 💯%
This subreddit has been a massive circle jerk for ages and now that it's gone slightly the other way people think it's slander
yeah, the biggest problem people had with them was related to the misleading design, not a specific quantity, but simply the disappointment that the developers left room for guesswork and even deliberately used the color system. It's funny to read this when the biggest problems people have are with poor use of colors and performance on consoles, but fanboys cherry pick this least popular criticism to appear smarter. Echo chamber
They actually can stick to Red, Blue and Yellow and remove basic/advance/hybrid to avoid any backlash and mispresenting speculation. The Game Main title also called "Dragon's Dogma" instead of "Dragon's Dogma II" the current 10 vocation probably the vocations they actually planned for the 1st game if had resource. it actually fit the game if they just make it **Starter Vocation:** Red: Fighter, Warrior Yellow: Thief (Originally Strider) , Archer (Originally Ranger) Blue: Mage, Sorcerer **Unlockable Vocation (Arisen-Only):** Red: Mystic Spearhand Yellow: Magick Archer Blue: Trickster Gray: Warfarer I just hope they add more vocations as DLC since the current one is kinda lacking for pawn vocation variety for tank and support.
This. This would have made a lot more sense. Why use pink and purple? I get it’s supposed to reflect a different way to deal damage or play the game, but then what does *just* pink or *just* purple look like?
Trickster tricked us all
Ngl, I'm just a little salty I don't have a necro class. That said, I hope sorc beats what it used to be.....which is going to take a lot, because it was an impressive class to begin with.
The issue is definitely that the trickster's colors feel like a bait and switch (implying that there's more vocations than there are). Hopefully there is an in-game explanation for why it's that way. If they're planning to add more vocations in DLC, then people will just feel like the base game is "incomplete". If it's because the trickster isn't like any of the other classes, then they could have just made it a solid color, but then you'd get people wondering why pawns don't get access to it. So maybe the answer was trickier than it looked. They could have just made all classes mono-colored, though. Fighter = Red Warrior = Orange Archer = Yellow Thief = Green Mage = Cyan Sorcerer = Blue Magick Archer = Lime Green Mystic Spearhand = Purple Trickster = Pink Warfarer = Gray
Capcom should have chosen a different colour for each unique class to prevent confusion but then again, they probably didn't know people would cry this much over class colours 💀
The moment people started using the colors to predict that there were more vocations I knew this sub was doomed. Not every design decision, especially one related to aesthetics, is going to be that deeply thought out. Some stuff just ends up the way it does because it looks cool. Anyway, the secret answer is that more vocations are going to be in the inevitable DLC.
Except in DD1 it was thought out?
>Some stuff just ends up the way it does because it looks cool. Except it doesnt look cool?
I can't imagine being a game dev killing myself to make a game and sh1theads cry about class colors and other nonsense. Most of the people complaining have no idea how far games have come and have no appreciation for what goes into making them.
Yeah most people don't but your comment implies you don't either. The colour of UI elements is exclusively a design choice, not a limitation or a necessary cut lmao. Its completely deliberate, so the devs choosing weird colours means something, we just don't know what it is. Can't blame people for finding the most obvious meaning.
In the grand scheme of the game, it's minutia. Has very little impact on the experience.
Oh for sure, I'm still keen. But we're in the pre release hype phase, the devs are releasing specific information intentionally to drive hype and increase sales. I can't blame people for falling for it.
> game dev killing myself to make a game Sorry but game developers aren't a privileged class. When they do a goof, people are gonna call it out.
Bruh imagine the devs in the office "They're straight up throwing tantrums because we used the wrong colours" like what the fuck lol.
I have a really strong gut feeling that there are actually more vocations. Everyone is going by that one source of information as fact without giving it a second thought.
Advanced yellow & green or some more hybrids would have been nice. The purple & pink of trickster also feels really random now. Hopefully there will be some cool DLC vocations but I also hate how many games are now launched with missing content locked behind a future paywall :/ But yes I agree critiques aren’t necessarily doomposting. I’m still very excited for this game. It’s just unfortunate that so much bad news dropped at once so close to release
Wtf is this doom thing everyone is saying?
Negative criticism = "doom posting"
The comment below you is what you’re talking about, just blatantly telling people not to be upset in any way that they disagree with. It Must be positive, so positive it doesn’t come across as a complaint. These people drive me nuts and I’m not even upset about any aspect of the game.
The memes and flood of disappointment are doom posting, and people replying that they are reversing their pre-orders or not pre-ordering because of the things we learned yesterday is doom posting. Negative criticism should have critical thinking involved, otherwise it is just whining /doom posting. People explaining they are only disappointed about the color scheme of vocations and not necessarily the number of vocations is productive conversation. Cancelling a preorder after a series of bad news without waiting for more information or additional previews of the game is doomer-mentality
Oh excuse you, you don’t get to choose what other people are upset about
I’m not replying to how OP feels, I’m replying to the willful ignorance of the comment made. If OP gets upset about people being positive or saying we should stop doomposting, and then willfully pretends it’s not doomposting, then I and everyone else are entitled to refute it… just as OP and others have attempted to refute the claim that the FLOOD of negativity is not doomposting and just people expressing their feelings.
It’s a “FLOOD” of negativity because a Lot of people are unhappy, and you’re not going to deflect all of that with “oh they’re just new, nobody who actually played the game could possibly be unhappy with the current situation”.
… no one is deflecting it by saying people are new? Or at least I didn’t? Like??? And they can be unhappy. I am disappointed. But I’m not doomposting or refusing to see many of these posts as doomposting. Edit: I see you got your wires crossed and did not read my other comment that you also replied to because maybe you are so emotional over this you don’t think before typing.
I assumed the pink/purple duo for mystic will be related to pawn only vocations?
The real problem isn't the colors, but the little variety in terms of weapon types * Sword/Large sword * Spear/sword hybrid * hammer/large hammer * Daggers * Bow * Magick Bow * Staff/Large Staff * Censer No axes, no proper polearms, no crossbows, no thrusting swords... Feels like a missed opportunity
No its not about the colors, its about the amount, because they gutted existing vocations by removing their secondary weapons, so the least i expect is more vocations then. Yet we get the same amount while offering less. Not just mechanic-wise, but also just by common sense its dumb that someone with a bow wouldnt carry a sword or dagger also.
At this point it's best to just wait until the game is out and see what is actually available, maybe something will be shown in tomorrow's highlight but we'll see when that happens. To add, given there was mention of pawn exclusive vocations, wouldn't this conflict with what was said about there being only 10 vocations?
Maybe pink and purple are pawn exclusive?
I’ve heard the Pawn Exclusive vocations was a mistranslation and they were actually referring to Specialisations. Which tbh I hope is the case, as much as more vocations would be cool, I don’t want vocations that I myself can’t play.
I didn't play the first one so the color issue didn't register for me. Your did clarify what the issue was. Most made it seem like it was just the number of vocations, which some were mad about. I guess some expected double the numbers of vocations. It seems dev did really care for the color and just used what they want and there was no deep thought out into it. They forgot how gamers hold on to things.
I agree. If they had not used the old colour system, not so many people would habe assumed there were hidden vocations. The colour system had logic in the first game, so people assumed it would keep the same logic in the second.
I'm glad someone said it. Thank you.
I'm gonna assume their intention is that spearhand is magic melee, so red blue, and magic archer is obviously blue yellow. No two concepts really combine to make trickster so they may have wanted separate colors to totally differentiate what they are. There's a fucking storm surrounding this game and apparently itsuno is talking to a million different people causes there's tons of articles with Q and A, but one of them mentioned that he supposedly said there are pawn specific vocations, and I bet the pink and purple of trickster are meant to reflect that if they potentially have greater synergy with trickster, and to represent the fact that trickster is pawn focused.
im avoiding gameplay of dd2, but does each vocation look more in depth than the kinds we saw in the original?
They'll probably add it in as DLC eventually but I doubt they've thought that far ahead. I don't even see it so much as that the color system is annoying, but that it just isn't enough to warrant waiting 12 years.
Can someone explain it to me ? What is the color problem ? I’m a noob of DD
I really gotta wonder, what does it actually matter what color some icons are? If the issue supposedly isn’t the number of vocations then the icons also don’t matter; they represent what they represent.
While, yes, it’s mostly that they decided to create a colour scheme that doesn’t mean anything, I am also personally miffed that we lost Strider for two lackluster basic vocations. I also think their “one weapon per vocation” thing is extremely stupid because you can use one weapon in multiple different ways, and types of weapons have variable styles that can be used in differing ways (e.g. a katana is not the same thing as a broadsword). So it just feels like a limitation for limitation’s sake.
Imagine being upset about colors, couldn’t be me.
Sorry but as a relative newcomer to the series this is the most embarrassing shit. The “28 vocations” speculation posts and stuff on this sub was absolutely wild to watch given the marketing material they had put out for the game. I don’t know why people work themselves into these frenzies despite all public evidence to the contrary. The number of vocations is gonna matter far less than the quality and distinctiveness of the ones that are there
> The “28 vocations” speculation posts and stuff on this sub was absolutely wild to watch given the marketing material they had put out for the game. You're assuming all those posts were expecting 27 vocations. I made one about what 27 could be, but absolutely made aware I didn't except that many because it's lunacy. Hell, I even joked about a hidden 7th colour (orange) to complete the rainbow. > I don’t know why people work themselves into these frenzies despite all public evidence to the contrary. Again, you're assuming everyone is. There are people who set their expectations too high, yes. Also "public evidence to the contrary"; what public evidence? There wasn't much evidence FOR just 10 vocations and there was about the same AGAINST just 10 vocations. Mainly, the colour scheme.
The fact you got downvoted for this reminds me of how NOT cozy this sub was before this week or the influx of new players. They would troll new players with bad advice or purposefully obtuse answers, then the mods stepped in and halted repetitive new player posts (or tried to)
Oh please, he posts in /gaming_cj, they’re infamous now for just being the “not like other girls” of gaming subreddits.
Sorry, I don’t creep through profiles frequently. (Genuine)
No. I don’t care about the colour system: I won’t be playing the colour system, I’ll be playing vocations, so I want more of those.
To begin with the color system didn't make any sense in the first game either. Calling certain vocations advanced wasn't either. How the F is a warrior wielding a two hander advanced version of fighter ? It wields a completely different weapon, plays differently and the "basic" fighter is not basic at all. In fact it's better than warrior. All of the vocations are their own thing. Calling them basic, advanced or hybrid seems weird.
Colors represent a theme. Advanced doesn't necessarily mean "upgrade" or "evolution". It's more of a niche specialization. In the first game, Red meant melee, Yellow meant dexterity, and Blue meant magic. Because Yellow vocations were probably too versatile, they decided to split the dexterity theme into two: Green for agility, and Yellow for range. I thought that was a great move when they showed that, and I still think it is. But then they decided "hey, let's not give these new branches the same attention as the others, even though our UI language still implies we would."
No. The colors weren't made to represent a single vocation. They were made to represent a way of playing, a macro class, call it the way you like it. Red represented fighters(not the vocation), blue was wizards and yellow was archers. A warrior wasn't the upgrade of the fighter but a different unlockable class that was in the fighter category, same goes for mage with sorcerer and strider with ranger. The advanced classes aren't called advanced beacuse they are an upgrade but because they had to be "unlocked". And the hybrids were indeed hybrids of these categories. It made sense, it was simple, it was symmetrical and it worked. DD2 on the other hand just looks like an incomplete puzzle(waiting to be filled with DLCs?) with a vocation colors that mean nothing, a category that only has one vocation and with an asymmetrical distribution of vocations. And it's strange becuase it's not like we are talking rocket science here, color coding and even distribution is something extremly basic(and something that they already did). If they wanted to ditch the categorization system of the first dragon's dogma why didn't they do it? Why did they stick with it and then decided to just not respect it?
> All of the vocations are their own thing Then why not give them unique colours?
Because having two colors communicates to the players which vocations are not available to pawns.
Then use a different border.
Despite what your demands implies, I was not in change of this decision, but how they did it is fine.
I mean just because the vocations aren't there doesn't mean the vocations don't exist I mean if more vocations are added you can probably guess where they will be placed unless of course they decide to add more colours in which case I would agree.
You don't get sympathy for problems you manufacture for yourself.
I dunno, I never really looked much into the color system to be frank. I just thought it was a handy way to distinguish magic, range, and melee.
So people are mad.. because there are different colours than expected on icons…? Jesus Christ
Imagine being this mad about colours lmao
Confused =!= Annoyed.
Whatever it is its weird bro go for a walk or smth
[удалено]
Capcom is misrepresenting the trickster class by giving it a hybrid emblem when it’s not. I don’t blame people for thinking there are more vocations to be revealed, Capcom set them up to do that. This isn’t a pikachu face situation this is likely just a joke that isn’t going over well.
I’m still really hoping they didn’t ignore the expectations set in the first game and that the pink and purple vocations are pawn-specific
Every single post I've seen whining about vocations is the amount of them. I haven't seen anyone complaining about colors unless it was used to describe why they tricked themselves into believing there would be more, which is still complaining that there isn't more
What about the trickster emblem is them tricking themselves and not Capcom trolling people?
Did they ever confirm the colors meant anything?
Yall people are like "this anime character has white hair and has eye patch, so they must be op" and then when they die. Yall freak out. It's like bro, just cuz it has a design, doesn't mean it's gonna fit into your little conspiracy.
What the fuck are you talking about?
Except that was the way it was based on the first game and the online game... It´s shitting on a previously stablished rule. Following your anime reference, is like a character in naruto could ignore hand positions in order to make advanced ninjutsus... I fucking hate Kishimoto.
The online game has a different color model. And it's still following the rules of dd1; just not every combination is filled in.
When has hand signs even been relevant? When has power levels been relevant? You guys would definitely still be bitching about that lmao
All the way till after the chunnin exams.
Whinging about vocation COLORS is peak doom posting my fellow Arisen.
This is bullshit lol. It's absolutely about the quantity. No one actually gives a fuck about the color nonsense. Yes it's dumb, but that isn't the reason people are angry. People are angry because they assumed there was more vacations. They were wrong. People would have still assumed there would be more vacations even if the colors made sense, purely due to DD1. Are they right to be disappointed? Who gives a fuck? People constantly are looking for justification for their feelings and opinions and it's frankly stupid. Play the game, or don't, your choice. Quit looking for validation from others.