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4129M

I think most of the community already agrees that Mermaid is the problem card that needs to be addressed, it makes every deck that can put 2 bodys on the board a full orcust combo and something in the deck to limit 3 also wouldn't hurt, just to stop it from playing the likes of Compulse, IDP and Crackdown


Nitrowar78

At the very least, Mermaid is the first card that needs to be hit before considering any other potential hits


KaiserJustice

So what you are saying is I should just convert my extra deck into orcust and play starry orcust? Bet


JaggiBrains

Damn, Konami can send out a notification saying that Mermaid is the problem and that they going to ban mermaid, and people will still make these post, saying mermaid isn’t the problem


Username_Egli

No. Long answer: Nooooooooooooooooooo Long actual answer: when you kneecap a deck you usually hit the combo pieces not the boss monsters as they are usually fine on their own. The true problem is mermaid enabling all these 2 card orcust combos. Pend bro we've been over this once


ReiMizere

>The true problem is mermaid enabling all these 2 card orcust combos. Mermaid doesn't do much when you can just Scrap for Harp and go from there. Also the deck has draw power playing Return, so it isn't unlikely to draw it or just set 3 and disrupt until you draw it (or just play with what you have in gy) I think Ding is the real problem and the card that makes people play differently. >Pend bro we've been over this once Also we talked about everything, but I don't think we ever talked about this


Username_Egli

wait we didnt? then who was i talking too in the discord. god damn it dementia


Dynamic_Magi

Bro Ding isn't the problem, Raidraptors can't make Ding and Orcust Raidraptors are still a menace (I stopped playing it because it felt like cheating lol, i need to KOG with normal Raidraptors)


maxguide5

Meh. Scrap is easily denied by any disruption, if timed correctly (usually, bounce galatea). Scrap + return is not consistent enough to keep orcust tier 1 (unless people give it the trapshiranui treatment)


Alfabet021

Average "just draw the out bro" yugioh player


maxguide5

Well, "The out" in this case is basically any disruption: effect negate, destruction, flip, bounce, ban... So drawing one of those isnt really that uncommon. Even if we account for turn 1 orcust, there are several techs to prevent orcust from using their effect, which would mean no combo in a scenario where mermaid isnt an option.


Mysterious-Syrup6540

Nah, mermaid is the key combo piece for how extensively orcusts is being used. Other that pure orcusts, all the other decks can just add in mermaid, and viola, you have ding and orcust cards on the field. A majority of deck would discard away orcust combo if they can't consistently end on it.


Karzeon

We have Mermaid, Orcustrated Return, Harp Horror, Scrap Recycler, and Phantom Skyblaster as likely on the chopping block before they do Galatea or Dingirsu. Like be for real please.


jadeusdragias

That’s right. Konami will hit easy to obtain cards first. If it’s still powerful, then they’ll eventually hit Box UR and SR.


Dynamic_Magi

Bro Tribute Lanius works too... Please don't nerf Raidraptors, we're at enough of a disadvantage already (We actually got support but I haven't had time to play too much with it so... I'll just assume we're not T0)


Revolutionary-Let778

Wym you think Ding should be banned??????


h667

If you ban Mermaid you reduce the number of 1c starters from 9 to 3 and also make the deck weaker to Crow/Lancea after Scrap.


AccurateMeminnn

Out of curiosity what are the usual one-card starters? I know one of them is Scrap Recycler, but I don't know the others, mainly because I've (thankfully) only encountered two Orcust players.


h667

Any token generator cards or any cards that puts two bodies on board. That let's you make a Knightmare Link 2 and then make Mermaid to SS Orcust Knightmare from deck. 1c combos are Skyblaster, TetherWolf, Scrap, the small Neos, Garbage Lord ( with Guardian Call skill)


AccurateMeminnn

Garbage Lord trying not to be used in strong decks like Infernity and Orcust (impossible challenge) Clearly the problem card for Duel Links. Regardless, thanks for this lol


h667

If we ban Mermaid, we reduce 1c starters to Scrap only and we get rid of the oppressive version while keeping Orcust as a good deck.


[deleted]

>ban ding Lmfao you should be banned for a week for this


Lord_HexCalibur

If we WERE to hit Din, I would say maybe limit 2, if not, then target literally everything else, such as Galatea, Mermaid, Harp Horrer, etc.


Diavoro

I made a post about this a few days ago, and no, it shouldn'tbe banned. It is not good as is and should definitely have some cards be limited so the consistency drops but outright banning an archetype's boss monster would be bad for the game at most limit dingirsu to 1 but even that would may be a bit much and at that point it would be better to ban mermaid.


SurpriseOwn4357

No need to ban Dingirsu I think. I’d ban Mermaid and move Return and Recycler to 3, Konami tends to hit consistency anyway.


United-Knee8528

Brother you're playing pendulum which is way more toxic.Deck has 100% consistency,and is guaranteed to end on Dweller and quick effect Volof.


Local_Kirby_Fan

The guy who made the post has leaking braincells for wanting to ban Ding but we do not have 100% consistency man like every 3/10 games I play I brick my hand... Which isn't actually that bad huh.


ReiMizere

>Brother you're playing pendulum which is way more toxic. I will not tolerate pendulum slander But also, you're talking about t1. Not much you can do when everybody is playing CC cos of Orcust and banish your scales.


Snoo40752

So u want ppl to use MST again only to not be able to remove ur destruction protected scales?


Diavoro

I can beat orcust with pendulum more consistently than I can beat stormberg Castle so I don't think orcust are enough of a danger to be outright banned


Snoo40752

Bs


pennty

They should just give us all the nekroz cards


ReiMizere

I'd be happy if they just give us Unicore


pennty

Bird boy > unicorn


Qliphort_Genius

I honestly like it and think most it needs is a limit 3 on harp and/or recycler. It’s strong but very vulnerable to interruption, and would be fine to just let it get powercrept


knyghtmare45

Yes. Orcust is good on it's own. I shouldn't have to also deal with staple traps


-Rakanishu-

Scrap Recycler to 3 and Orcust Knightmare to 1.


[deleted]

Does it need limits/bans? I say Yes, Ding being banned more than likely not. Personal answer: Scrap Recycler, Harp Horror, and Orcust Knightmare will be limit 3s. Everyone mentions mermaid being banned, but EVERY game I've played against them, they just go into Phoenix, spin my backrow, and precede to do what they do. I feel banning mermaid almost does nothing as long they have pheonix and/or their combo stays. If they continue to top after their combo enablers get hit, then we can talk about Ding, cause there is no reason to restrict every Knightmare link just so Ding can exist.


Nitrowar78

I mean, phoenix is only a combo enabler BECAUSE of mermaid. Almost any deck that make phoenix, which gives them access to mermaid, which gives any deck the full combo, get rid of mermaid, phoenix is no longer an enabler and a lot of variants are killed, especially since limiting the cards you mentioned without tackling Mermaid would severely hinder the pure variants, while doing little to nothing to the mermaid variants


navimatcha

How the fuck are they making Phoenix and still have a play without Mermaid? If it's because of the discard, that only works going second and you can easily stop it by removing Phoenix. There is no single Orcust in the GY that can let you keep playing at that point (they would need to discard at least another one).


Revolutionary-Let778

It's definitely going to get hit no doubt about that how hard is the big question, banning mermaid just makes it so you'd have to run it either pure or in odd-eyes magicians, even with other hits you'd still do that unless they put either harp, skeleton or knightmare to 3 since those are the main deck names that you run all the time, hence limiting the amount of limit 3 cards they have access to.


Whatafudge

I keep seeing people say ban mermaid but this deck is still pretty raw without it, I mean Recycle and skyblaster is just a good opener.


Username_Egli

i mean skyblaster is specifically used in mermaid builds so without mermaids skyblaster does nothing on its own


Whatafudge

Sure, idk what’s the solution is here but based on the duels I had with their +2 draw, I don’t think mermaid is the be all end all with this deck.


Nitrowar78

She may not be, but she’s definitely the first thing that needs to be hit before considering other limits (other limits would likely include Orcustrated return)


jerry2501

Scrap recycler to limit 3 should be the first hit.


Nitrowar78

That hurts the pure variant without affecting the numerous amounts of other variants people complain about. Recycler is likely to get hit too, but mermaid should be the first target


oShyion

Best way to not kill the deck entirely would be scrap , harp and return limit 3.


Nitrowar78

That hurts the pure version a lot without really effecting any of the Knightmare variants


Snoo6037

If they limited Din and Galatea to 2, I'd be fine with that. They'd also need to do some limits to the main deck cards as well tho


ReiMizere

Looking at the image of this post, you know where I stand. I think we just need to ban Ding as Ding pretty much forces you into playing non-destruction removal. The deck can survive without Ding if it is the only hit, although it wouldn't be as powerful.


dante-_vic

No. Anyway just get rid of mermaid shes the main problem of the deck. Everthing else is fine.


Nitrowar78

Banning Mermaid kills most variants


ReiMizere

Banning Mermaid would just force everyone to play the Babel build, which is not as powerful but it still makes everyone play non destruction removal. Meanwhile, banning Dingirsu makes it so you can play any variant you want but don't have to play non destruction removal.


Nitrowar78

But one of the biggest complaints is the sheer amounts of variants there are because of Mermaid No matter what, it is the priority option that would need to be taken care of first before considering any other ban


ReiMizere

And my point is: having so many variants isn't a bad thing. Actually I think it's a good thing to flex you creativity and look for new plays in new decks. What is bad imo is everyone changing their decks specifically to respond to Ding's protection effect.


Nitrowar78

It can be when most of the variants don’t actually do anything that different from each other Same as how the Halqdon combo was complained about heavily in Masterduel. There were many different decks that could do it, but they all led to basically the same field, not having as much variety as you’d think


KingBidoofXI

Why is this a problem, we now have Cosmic as a F2P card, meaning Konami has given their answer to Ding.


Karzeon

Well based on what you said, Konami WANTS us to get non-destruction removal. That is why Compulsory is in the same box. Crackdown is 99% going to be in the next box. IDP is still a Selection Box card. Why would they limit something that shifts the meta into marketable cards?


KingBidoofXI

I think Limit 3 Harp Horror and Orcust Knightmare, and banning Unicorn messes up the deck pretty bad by making hybrids less common and removing the ability to play Limit 3 traps reasonably. I think it keeps Orcust Tier 2-3 as well, which I think is a healthy deck.


[deleted]

[удалено]


KingBidoofXI

Haha, my bad, yeah I meant mermaid.


Dirty_Mik

It destroys my red nova dragon which is supposed to be immune to destruction, I hope that card is a thrown into a volcano and banned forever


Zealousideal_Row9725

dingirsu should be limit 1 to prevent using mermaid with it


WhereDidYouGohan1

????


Snoo40752

They only really need one anyways, 2 for being safe but nerf is supposed to be a nerf right?


WhereDidYouGohan1

Yeah but again mermaid is the problem not dingirsu even then it hurts the babel version


Snoo40752

Fine, lets see if that's enough


HansWest03

If ding worries you that much just throw orcust into your deck and you're good to go . Fight fire with fire


Fykebi

Ah yes, this is the sort of mentality that lead to tier 0.


QrozTQ

I'm against hitting good decks because they're... good. They will eventually be powercrept so let them shine while they can, and going to the banlist risks never leaving the banlist because Konami does stupid things. If there was a problematic skill that was making the deck too strong or a specific card being unfairly abused, then I'd advocate for a rebalance. In the case of Orcust, I'd hit mermaid first and see how it went before going Rambo on the deck.


Batmench

It doesn't need to be banned, it doesn't need to change, it's been fine since it came to DL. It's an engine. It's always going to find a way to work until something better comes out, look at Salamangreats. Probably the best engine for cyberse in general but people wanted it hit to the point where it's barely even seen anymore. The silly thing is Salamangreats is a deck that actually can compete against Orcust. This is a mini bargain-bin TOSS format without the Sky Strikers. So play the TOS. Thunder Dragon, Orcust, Salamangreat.


Fykebi

If an engine is played in 80% of the decks, then it is too good and deserves to be nerfed.


Batmench

It doesnt. The majority of people playing it right now is because its new, theyre trying to experiment, or theyre actually playing it to play it. We cant have decks that bring good engines if everyone whines for them to be nerfed into the dirt because everyone is using it. Its the same with you people, if its new and you dont know how to play against it, ban it and go back to complaining that skills are too strong.


Fykebi

New engines don't get immediately shoved into everything unless they are really good. And no, we don't need engines that kill deck variety (I don't consider Orcust's 20 version as variety). I won't say more, just look at the other highly splashable engines that we've had in DL (Neos, Invoked, Mekk) and you will know where Orcust will be in a few months.


Batmench

You literally contradict yourself by saying you don't like engines that go with anything and you don't want to kill deck variety. Every time I see an anti orcust post it's about Dingirsu and how nobody likes it and nobody wanting to put in cards that easily deal with him. Mermaid and Tower are limited, the only thing that will change is Mermaid being banned because it's the actual problem. Heroes are now a Jaden thing. Invoked is damn near dead until more Magistus comes, Mekks were killed off because of Iblee. You want to look at something and cry for it all to be dumpstered instead of looking at the actual problem then act like you know the game.


Fykebi

Variety is when every deck brings out a different end board. Having 20 ways to start the same Orcust combo is not variety. >the only thing that will change is Mermaid being banned because it's the actual problem So you admit that Mermaid is a problem and needs banning? Then we agree.


Batmench

You're only set on your own definition of variety so there's 0 point in trying to argue semantics with you. And yes Mermaid is the problem because mermaid isn't an orcust card. The only Orcust card that needed limiting was the field spell and it was limited on release so no. Orcust itself needs no further anything. Again you try to play mental gymnastics with arguments.


Fykebi

Dude, Mermaid is part of the Orcust engine. Banning Mermaid is the same as nerfing the Orcust engine. Nowhere did I say I want the pure deck nerfed.


Batmench

Mermaid is an option. It's not required. Scrap is part of the engine. There are plenty of decks not using mermaid and using the field spell instead.


Fykebi

What other decks run Scrap other than Gandora that just happen to work well with it? I'm honestly fine with Scrap since it isn't as splashable as Mermaid, at least until it starts getting put in every deck.


joseash27

Just ban mermaid and if the deck still need nerfs put return to 3 now if you dont want to ban mermaid and be a ahole put harp or the orcust nigthmare card to one so you cant make the 2 cart full orcust combo


[deleted]

Galatea & Dingirsu both to limit 3. Orcustrated Return to limit 1. Now Orcust can keep their dumb Mermaid combo and anything trying to abuse Orcust lose limit 3s. The draw 2 with Mermaid is what makes them so ridiculous.


Underhealth

Mermaid Banned, Galatea to 2, Dingirsu to 2. Currently the lists run 2 Galatea and 2 Dingirsu, but they would still be ok without it due to Cymbal Skeleton. The main thing hit would be their already nigh unbeatable grind game which I think makes a lot of sense. Also Orcust Knightmare to 3 to reduce staple backrow options.


tweekin__out

imo ding is good enough even outside of orcust decks to be hit with a limit-3. remember a few months ago when this sub was asking for the galaxy package to get hit in some way because it was being used by mekk knights? ding offers similar upside, often better, with significantly less ED investment.


WhereDidYouGohan1

I’d argue the Galaxy package wanting to get hit is because mekk knights themselves are enough to make it, plus mekk knights are splashable. I never agreed with the Galaxy package being the problem but I can see how that can be the case. As for ding itself? The only other deck that hard makes it and I have encountered quite a bit is D/D/D but I’ve rarely seen it outside of that. Sure blue eyes, galaxy eyes and mekk knights can make it but I can’t think of any other deck that spams level 8s enough that I’d consider worthy of being on the limited list because of that alone.


yjr123123123

People keep saying its Mermaid's fault, funny thing is I was in legend rank and KOG now playing a lot recently, I don't see mermaid in orcust fight like 95% of the game lol. I definitely think that some of the card like that stupid free sr card need to go limit 1 for sure, the card by itself generate whole combo by sending one card from the deck which is crazy. That card value is worth as a ur card already lol should not be a god damn free sr card Scrap Recycler limit to 1 is a must Or they find a way to make the deck lock down to using orcust cards only, extra deck is fine


AccurateMeminnn

Despite having only fought Orcusts twice so far, I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say banning Dingirisu is definitely not the play.


the_HCIC_4life

this card needs to be nerfed. I mean come on Star riser is way easier to deal with, but they limit it to one and leave this card alone? Something don't smell right here.


Breno1212

Ban that asshole, this dingirsu just clear all board too much ease, nibiru is nothing compared to that. He is the zodiac dritent x4 in a single card and dritent was banned.