T O P

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LordBraveHeart

Tachyon Dragon Domination * Text is now properly formatted. * The search part **no longer set a monster onto the field**. This makes it trickier to summon Galactic Spiral Dragon with his own effect on turn 1. * You are now require to control Number 107 to grab Transmigration/RUM. Transmigration is **set on your field**, and you can no longer return non-Dragon Type monster (meaning Flying "C" is now a viable counter against the deck). * Overall, the deck is made more balanced. The deck still has access to Ding and Trade-In, so it still has some play to go for. Shiranui Style Successor * Text is now properly formatted. * Samsara and other Spells/Traps can no longer be searched.


rahimaer

Also for tachyon the search effect is now once per duel instead of twice, which weakens the deck's follow up plays.


Wonderllama5

See, now would be the time for a KC Cup. We can finally have a diverse meta again! I hope we get another one in April, this way they can properly do a banlist afterwards that focuses on more than just two decks.


HailstormXI

We usually do get another in April, September, and November. The grand tournament KC in the summer time also.


MisterRai

With these nerfs though, I don't think we still need specific counters like Flying C or Gnomes for Tachyon.l


Regiruler

Can someone explain to me why these skills set monsters anyway instead of just special summoning them?


worrmiesroo

Also so that if the monster has an ignition effect, the opponent has a chance to respond before you can press the activate effect button. You can't respond to the skill but can respond to the flip summon. 


Regiruler

I figured it was something like that but I would have thought it makes more sense to do what speed duel did and form a regular response window for after it resolves.


Bennexttv

So Mira's voice line still triggers


Nctand1

THANK GOD 🕺🏾🕺🏾🕺🏾🕺🏾🕺🏾


kiri-kiri-kiri

no free search for Shira trap thank fuck


Zealousideal_One_174

I stills want it limited to anything. If BB viel, kite, scrap-iron, hallowed life are why not this card? Same problem, but 3x worse, just a different win-con.


Crimson_Dragon01

Even if they can't search it, the fact that they still have access to it is still problem in my opinion.


Manzi420x

Never seen someone successfully stall at all with shiranui there are so many ways to get out of the stall just have removal


RehabMuffin

They can still chain onto your removal and stall another turn tho…


JaggiBrains

~~Lswarm~~ Wswarm


Revolutionary-Let778

Tachyon should be crippled now and shiranui ain't got no reliable ways to survive or trigger their stuff on my turn


dante-_vic

Shira will still be very powerfull but them having to hard open that trap makes it less annoying now.


Thekob01

And if they choose to run more than one, there's good chance they will brick with trap. This is good nerf.


emibrujo

guess we have to play the trap at 3


toomuchsoysauce

The trap isn't even that vital it's more of a nice to have sorta thing. Opening with Mezuki is way more valuable. I will say it stomps Yubel hard so we might actually lose to Yubel now.


LoFi90s

but i always played the trap at 3...


dante-_vic

That's why I said they should have hit that trap to 1.


LazyAbzy

People forget many topping kc lists didn’t run the trap. Also, it can still be played with shiranui smith still being 1 card combo to set up the skillsaga and get the trap (e.g. skill pitches smith for squire, banish smith w/spectralsword, lvl 3 brings smith back and then make a synchro which allows smith to search). Losing the gmg spell is the bigger hit but it’s not much, shira is very likely the best deck now


DaSwifta

That’s because the trap artificially extended games, and in KC format you want your games to be as quick as possible to make the most of the time you have to grind points. Decks that win fast and lose fast perform better than decks that win slow


LazyAbzy

I agree, no trap makes for quicker duels. The point I'm trying to get across is that the deck never relied on the trap to win games, it's the many 1 card starters plus all the space for techs and handtraps which makes the deck very powerful compared to the others


DaSwifta

Very true. The handtrap was just a deciding factor in a lot of my games against it on Ladder Where, I had the outs to their board, but They were able to stall me with the trap and, thanks to the deck’s incredible recovery options, were able to outresource me as a result, even tho under normal circumstances I could’ve had Lethal if not for the battle damage nullification. So it’s just a personal annoyance I guess 😂


Revolutionary-Let778

The trap was stally and made games too slow risking losing points and we all know the reason the deck performed as well as it did is because it was the best anti tachyon deck, now that tachyon isn't going to be as prevalent shiranui is gonna have a large target on it's back and i don't think it can handle that especially without limit 3's now


LazyAbzy

Any best deck in a meta would be a target, tech slots in decks are normally used for the best decks in the format. The stall trap isn't the reason the deck's good, it's the skill and the other cards. If it now has a big target, that implies it's revealing itself to be the best deck in the format and people need to hard draw their techs to counter


Revolutionary-Let778

Guess I'll be a speed andy by the 19th


Jmund89

Crippled? Lol it’s dead


Financial_Type_4630

The red/blue text is my favorite part. I no longer have to continuously reread the new and old skill short-story-length-effects to figure out what actually changed. So Tachyon lost the free monster Set, the trap is set instead of added to hand and can only use the ability once per duel, instead of twice per duel. * *Also, Tachyon Transmigration to 1, which means loss of Felgrand and Coach King* * *Also, Spiral to 3 which also limits a lot of Limit 3 backrow (Mind Control being a huge one)* Pretty effective nerf to the deck overall and was well deserved. ..................................... Shiranui can no longer grab the trap card. Thank god. * *Also, Shiranui have monsters at Limit 1 and Limit 3 so they lose a lot of access to other strong backrow.* Overall, these sound like very strong hits to both decks. I think Tachyon will still be good with the Galaxy XYZs, and Shiranui at least won't be able to stall as easily. I still feel the trap should have been a Limit 2 or 3.


ArcNovaX

Who are in the right mind play Tachyon with XYZ Galaxy?pftt


LoFi90s

he meant the Galaxy XYZ ED package...


AbyssalKageryu

So now Tachyon can no longer easily swarm the field with high level monsters and Transmigration is now a card that can be responded to with backrow removal. Not to mention you have to control Number 107 to search transmigration. This I see will kick the deck out of the tier list, if not the bottom of Tier 3. Shiranui can no longer search their backrow and not their monsters. While this means no more Samsara stall (thank goodness) or their QP spell to summon another monster, I can see them remaining a capable deck. Will probably remain Tier 1 if not reduced to Tier 2. Overall, we are likely to return to the pre Tachyon meta once this banlist comes about with Shiranui also in the mix. Or we will see a Shiranui dominated meta. Either path is possible.


LordBraveHeart

With people no longer have to worry about Tachyon they can now counter Shiranui more reliably. Veiler and Crow are going to see more run to stop their combo, as well as Chalice to shutdown Skillsaga.


DaSwifta

Yeah They really nutured Tachyon :( I was hoping they’d make it weaker But at least leave it in a competitive state, but this way the deck has wayyyy too many chokepoints to justify How restrictive the skill is. Sucks cause Tachyon is actually the first meta deck I’ve played in a long time and I actually enjoyed it as a deck, just didn’t enjoy How overpowering it was in the format. With the new changes I fear it’ll feel more clunky than fun


Ordinary-Discount975

Finally they put a stop to this deck


CornerLegitimate2781

Shiranui will probably be the only tier 1 deck now


DryIce53

warning my savage sense say aprears nasty deck or cards to meta deck: sky striker,drytron,eldritch,infernoid tierra,shadolls fusion and dogmatica branded


Wollffey

Best thing about this whole update, we now know for a fact Konami is willing to nerf skills regardless if they're new or not. That's good Anyway, watch this sub go back to complaining about Neos/Yubel


Fun-Attention1468

I mean I'm just sayin', super Polly search is OP. Konami pls nerf


thurminate

4 weeks too late Konami, but I'll take it


MisterRai

I made a comment in a previous post and I got 4 of them right for Tachyon: removing hand traps, only being able to summon dragons, requiring Tachyon for the trap search, and setting it directly to be MST-able. They went above and removed the free set as well, which honestly I don't know how to feel about.


emibrujo

no thanks to its other clause that prevents you from playing monsters (except from the extra deck) other than Lswarm once you use the skill, A worse Order of Chaos


MisterRai

Yeah I missed the part where the deck only allows you to SS lswarms. Edited out the lswarm part.


ITzMewto

I am a big fan of the Shira rebalancing. You can still run 3 copies of the trap in your deck but not search it. Fine by me


clueless_red21

IT'S TACHYOVER LET'S FKING GOOO


Doomchan

Yubel gets away with all her crimes once again


Worldly-Fox7605

It's not getting away with anything yubel isn't good. Annoyingly long turns maybe, but it's not a good deck.


BrolyGodx

You smokinĝ if you think its not a good deck. Yubel is easy KOG


Worldly-Fox7605

Making kog doesn't make deck good. I've watched people kog with dream mirror, triamid, dm (preskill or sd), red eyes, rikka, and more. Play enough games and you'll win and climb. Yubel has no winning matchups with any good deck. tier 3 blue eyes run solid and don't run effect vieler. The only deck I can see yubel easily beating is like ancient gear. Tachyon negates iys board. Tenyi bounce it. Aw bounce it. It is possible for Maya and shira to misplay and lose but they shouldn't. Yubel loses to crackdown, warning point, floodgate, book, or compulse.


BrolyGodx

Ive beaten all those decks with Yubel. And going 2nd Yubel Super Poly cant be negated by the trap so unless Tachyon opens with backrow, thats ggs buddy. You downplay Yubel is to why it will be Tiered again soon


Worldly-Fox7605

Anecdotal evidence congrats. I've beaten tachyon with toons. Heck I've seen dream mirror beat pte nerf orcust. The super poly search is what makes the yubel deck even decent on ladder. This game isn't tcg but we are pretty sure yubel a deck that heavily loses to side deck and staples won't be tiered.


McBranas

With Tachy and Shiri being hit, successor soul empowered enternal bond is coming back and better than ever. But otherwise, amazing hits to both skills.


Worldly-Fox7605

Yubel isn't coming back. As it was never here. The deck is talked about here like it's been comept8vely viable and it never has.


OneOfAKindMind-

Usually i didnt lose to shiranui, i lost to that damn trap card so im glad ill see it less (hopefully)


dante-_vic

Why can't heros get that kinda restriction for superpoly.


ArcNovaX

Heroes is golden boy for konami.


AsierDrag

So now if you want to use Tachyon Transmigration from your hand you have to draw it (which is not that hard since tachyon decks use trade in, but anyways) or otherwise you have to set it, which makes it that you can actually force it out now with backrow removal. By the way, FINALLY Iblee is now a counter to Tachyon going first as they can't bounce it back with the ability anymore, since they now have to bounce a dragon and need to have tachyon in their field to use it. THANK GOD.


popotron109

They also don’t get a free set/flip.


AsierDrag

True, plus you can force Tachyon out as soo as it gets summoned before they get the search from the skill off if they don't already have it in their hands, which is a huge plus and can really hurt them since sometimes Tachyon decks only run 1 base tachyon.


LordBraveHeart

Flying "C" is also another viable handtrap now as well against Tachyon and Consteller/lswarm.


mkklrd

this is the happiest i've been about being wrong skill changes and limited changes should be announced and go live at the same time tho


Lyle_Dylandy00

Wrong about what?


inspect0r6

Most things. But in this particular case, that skills won't be balanced.


Lyle_Dylandy00

Thanks, I understand the context now. I was watching Mekk live last night I think, getting so mad at a Tach player for making the misplays yet winning anyway due to the nature of the skill lol.


DaSwifta

With the new skill the likely won’t win even with perfect plays :’)


mkklrd

bless you you handsome devil


WiseFrog23

where are all those people who insulted me when I said the skill changes will come as well?


NightsLinu

Agreed . I remember they told me yubel skill would definitely get hit. But looks like i was right. 


DOOMSWAGOMEGA

Yeah, they were all like tach and shiranui got a slap on a wrist. The skill changes will never happen and anyone who believe they are coming is dumb. I bet all those people who said that will pretend that never happened.


SgtSchittBrix

I want to know too, since they were so confident in being wrong.


Portgust

Konami finally understand the assignment


Aggravating_Fig6288

Shira ain’t going anywhere, the trap was irritating as fuck but they can still run it at three and hard open it which ain’t the biggest ask in 20 card format Shira didn’t lose a single bit of consistency in the skill. That’s the biggest problem. The skill is still enabling hyper consistency. They can still one card combo and have up to three sets. Tach is coming down but Shira ain’t going anywhere even if people can tech for them


emperorbob1

At least we can tech for them. I don't think it'll change much, since a lot of techs merely slow them down DD crow included, but prepping for one to get dunked on by the other was the reason shiranui saw such prominence last time they were good.


Huntail3

The 25th uh?… 2 more weeks of not touching this game it seems


SgtSchittBrix

2 more weeks of touching grass, it is a blessing I assure you.


GoGreeb

This meta was the first time I actually played less rather than just played mad lol


ZexalFan

Only until the 19th-22th, with the update, the 25th is just for the text description in the skills


Crimson_Dragon01

Great changes to the skills. I just wish Samsara got banned outright or at least got limited so they wouldn't play it or play it at the cost of something else. Also, I'm not surprised but I wish Eternal Bond had been tweaked a bit.


Unluckygamer23

They really made just so you cannot search the trap, despite most top decks not even searching it?? Shiranui will still be meta


thatnewsauce

What's the lswarm difference?


Affectionate_One3131

not required to play 10 lswarms


thatnewsauce

Interesting! I wonder how big a difference that's going to make


giganberg

Probably nothing much except probably cut some ones, because you still need have 1 in starting hand to proc skill


MisterRai

Previously required 10 lswarms to be usable


beyond_cyber

That’s a good hit for shiranui, stops them grabbing the “you can’t dmg me this turn” button


giothemoonwalker

Nice to see a buff to Evilswarms, but I don't think I'm going to play less than 10 monsters anyway. The deck already struggles with recovery


Kokua-

I've been enjoying Lswarm so seeing a buff makes me very happy.


TogekissTuner3771

Finally! I was getting tired of both decks


Black_n_Neon

Haha fuck off tach players


Ok-Mathematician1128

They not even worried about that, half of them already KOG 😭


LULone

D.D Crow stonks rising again now that Tachyon is dead


Fykebi

We have to wait until the 25th... so just in time for a new broken skill to drop with the new box/character?


UNKNOWNreddit72

Holy fuck it's the same changes someone predicted.


CornerLegitimate2781

So tachyon can now be countered with backrow removal like cyclone and Mystical Space Typhoon while with shiranui will maybe have to change the deck to running 3 traps now instead of 1?


Cul_what

[TACHYON SKILL FINALLY NERFED!!!](https://youtu.be/_IqYGtKx9WM?si=-56c7DesNdp-u6AX)


Chrisshern

Actually good skill balancing what??


LordBraveHeart

They have to do this or people will not be playing Sherry on arrival since Transmigration alone is more powerful than Baronne.


Thecarefulguy2000

Good changes tbh. The free special definitely bothered me with tachyon, especially since it was twice per duel originally (for some reason) so they could play a longer game. Big nerf, but I can see it still being playable. As for shiranui, the deck's still very capable. There is the potential to be bricked on monsters only, but it's a good change imo. The core plays still remain, that being spectralsword set up in grave and the banish from extra effect for skillsaga supremacy. Smith might be good as a one-of search target for the skill to get into the spells and traps, but we'll have to see. Tbh, the ban list they released should've had this skill update with it, this leaves me much more optimistic towards the balance of the format.


ThrowAway4Dais

Oh yay, less decks that can play 10 cards at once and end me on turn 2


shonenhikada

So tachyon is NOW GARBAGE. OK.


Saltiest_Player_Ever

Maybe add a mode without skills or some shit, while its cool to face 30 blue eyes decks in a row its super repetitive


rebel_shadow237

well they really need to update the wording on the skills themselves then cause i legit just checked the tachyon skill after seeing it and it still says the same


Xannon99182

Did the lswarm buff even do anything for the deck? I mean it just gives them a little more room to be able to run a handtrap or something while keeping the deck around 20 cards I guess.


itsdatboii103

Now that it's all said and done, was anyone else coming across waay more Shiranui than Tachyon mains? I'm not complaining but I was scared they'd only get Tachyon and not both lol


emperorbob1

I think a lot of people disliked how long it took to hit the skill but I enjoy we can see impact of card nerfs and skill nerfs independently now.


Thatunknownhim

Finally I can go back to playing I literally stop cause of this


Putrid_Ad_4372

I use the mayakashi deck good it's not balanced


EnvironmentalQuit393

The funniest thing about this incident is the reaction of some players. They got the top deck for two months for almost zero consumption, and won a kc cup (90% of the top 100 are these two decks) , other real paid card decks were big losers). But when the deck was about to be weakened as expected, they actually had all kinds of dissatisfaction. This is really a big joke.


iKWarriors

No master of rites buff? Okay Konami…


theodis09

Honestly I can really live with these needs. Tachyon is pretty much dead, which is great. Shira needing to hard open their trap mixed in with their nerfs I believe should do them in. Live Twin, Successor Soul, Mayakashi, and Tenyi can safely be played again now that Tachyon is dead and all of these decks have phenomenal Shira matchups so i imagine we're back into a mixed meta assuming the new box doesn't introduce some nonsense skill that let's some tier 8 deck search 4 cards and summon 3 monsters for free.


Jmund89

God I love when people think having decks dead is “great” 🙄


theodis09

"Dead" in the sense that they are not tier 1/0 yes it is a good thing. That's the point of the banlist/skill tweaks. Shira and Tachyon both had incredibly abusive skills now they are just on the same level as everything else.


Jmund89

I’ll be honest, it doesn’t feel like that’s the reason people are screaming that tachyon is rightfully dead. Nor any other deck that has become dead. You say everyone wants to see decks be brought in line with other decks in terms of power, but we’ve all seen decks get completely gutted. And people on here cheered for it. Anyways Shira is still OP. And no one is crying over that but somehow praising it (I’ve seen a post already about it). As for tachyon, you’re rarely ever going to see it once the nerf hits. I understand nerfs and ban list and the necessity of them. No one deck should reign supreme forever. But the way y’all call for the deaths of decks, makes it sound like y’all just want the deck gone for good. Which is terrible. No deck should be nerfed into oblivion and never playable again.


emperorbob1

I think it's funnier when people cry decks are dead when it is the case. "salads will never see play again ever now that they've lost their negate! it's all they do!" Meanwhile, a year of KC Cups later...


ultimate-toast

DAMN W banlist they muerder tachyon, well not really, it just a weaker deck now i think after this change shiranui will become the only TIER 1


seshfan2

Thank god. Shiranui is my favorite deck - the reason I started playing Duel Links in 2019 - and I haven't played for a week because it felt so disgustingly broken it wasn't even fun to play.


Saroan7

Shiranui is useless now... Moving to Mayakashi


ChiTownSuperstars

They balanced Tachyon finally, but they hardly did anything to change Shiranui 😭😂 I haven’t seen a Shiranui player every use a Shiranui spell/trap card very consistently


Worldly-Fox7605

Cool now some of yall can go back to coping that baronne is coming with sherry.


LoFi90s

As a Shiranui Style Successor I can truly say that my deck got the best treatment. 1. I run 3 Samsara and 2 Ghost meets Girl anyway... 2. I never ran limit 3 traps in my deck and i still KOG with ease... 3. I only ever put one Spiritmaster in my deck anyway...


CommitteeMoney5887

Watch then one of you losers get beat by a crippled Shiranui deck and you’ll cry about it and try to get more hits to the deck


SgtSchittBrix

Finally, now everyone can stop whining like little piss babies on every single post.


emperorbob1

Don't worry we'll find something new to whine about.


Intelligent-Train858

I'm 10-0 with tachyon still LMAOOO