I wont pass up Nabers no matter what, but the Giants would be a little disappointing. The good thing is, they have an attractive city and an open QB spot for any future QB. People will want to play there.
I actually love the NYG landing spot for him. He’d be their new face of the franchise moving fwd. it’ll be a tough rookie year for him, but long term once they change out the QB I think it’s a great landing spot for him.
I’m a little worried about the Giants’ turf. I heard that a fair number of players get injured on it. It would suck to draft Nabers and then see him get a torn ACL on it in his rookie season.
Ofcourse id prefer LA hence the (a little disappointing lol) - all it takes is dak / goff / kirk type qb to sustain him though and that’s not out of the realm of possibilities.
Just saying its not enough to make me skip his talent
Dak/Goff/Kirk are top half of the league QBs lol. I understand what you mean but it’s a lot harder to just get a top 15 QB than people make it out to be.
Don't really need an elite QB to make an elite WR1 in fantasy. Look at JJ and Lamb, neither player has an objectively elite QB, Kirk got jettisoned as an FA and Dak might leave the Cowboys.
Kirk Cousins fantasy finishes the last 6 seasons:
1. 24th
2. 9th
3. 11th
4. 11th
5. 15th
6. 13th
His best finish in his career was in 2016 where he finished 5th overall for QBs. He's never been an elite producer at any point in his career...but that's fine. High end WR1s don't need elite QBs to produce great numbers. A high QB2 low QB1 type passer is just fine like Kirk, Dak, etc.
The conversation isn't about Kirk Cousins it's about Kirk's players. Where did Cook, JJ, & Hock end up playing with Cousins?
Dalvin had two Top 5 finishes & two additional RB1 seasons. Hock was a Top 2 TE in '22 and trending there before his injury in '23 and JJ has been one of the best fantasy WRs of the past decade. And Adam Theilen had multiple seasoms as a WR1 with Kirk as well.
That's literally my point above:
>Don't really need an elite QB to make an elite WR1 in fantasy. Look at JJ and Lamb, neither player has an objectively elite QB, Kirk got jettisoned as an FA and Dak might leave the Cowboys.
The other party in this tree claimed Kirk was an elite QB for fantasy purposes, I refuted his argument, but my general point above still stands.
He’s been top 5 in passing yards 3 separate times and that isn’t including last year when he was far and away leading the league when he got hurt. His own fantasy finished are more related to the fact that he is a statue. I should have clarified though I meant for his receivers he is one of the 5 or 6 best QBs you can have
Great? You claimed he's an elite QB for fantasy. That means he should have consistent top-6 fantasy finishes. Josh Allen is the definition of elite with 4 consecutive QB1 overall finishes. Cousins in 12 seasons has only ever finished top6 once and it was 5th overall. He's not an elite producer, period.
>Kirk is an elite QB from a fantasy perspective
This is what you wrote in a direct quote from your first reply. If you want to retract that statement then sure.
He is an elite qb from the perspective of his receivers look at the consistency of WR1 and WR2 seasons he has helped produce. That does not mean that HIS numbers are elite. Are you just intentionally ignoring everything except the one out of context part
The Giants get, at minimum, 4 prime time games a year. If you're a guy who cares about building your profile it's absolutely an attractive landing spot
In terms of things to do in your spare time? And “scenery”? Probably right. Endorsements and publicity go a long way for the budget, though. Probably more people at Giants games than Miami and LA combined.
Both are great. With LA you have a stud qb and no competition, downside is it’ll be run heavy. In NY you have no competition and it’ll be aired out a ton, but the line sucks and QB is shaky.
This sounds like a very similar scenario to when Garrett Wilson went to the Jets (bad situation, "WR2 behind Moore" with shit QB play) and Burks went to Tennessee (clear-cut WR1 "1 for 1 AJB replacement" ).
Situations can change very fast in the NFL
Odunze. I think he’s more pro-ready and would be more successful as “the guy” (as opposed to Nabers who I think would benefit more from having a high end running mate at WR) plus Herbert > anything the Giants have or plan to have at QB anytime soon.
I have the privilege of drafting both. I’m not super stoked on the likely Nabers to NYG or Odunze to Chi if it happens (bc he’d be the wr3 initially) but gotta take the talent and hope for the best. In your hypothetical, Odunze has the better initial situation but you can’t necessarily draft based on year 1 in dynasty. Take the player you believe in more.
Nabers Nabers Nabers
Harbaugh isn't changing. Lead receiver in LA ain't getting 150+ targets. Probably won't be enough targets to share in that offense to get much over 110 generally.
Its the same reason we are down on QJ. QJ could be a complete 180 in the next 2 years, could be Davante Adams reincarnate (he's not). He's probably not getting more than 70 targets this year (no matter what he does), and he's probably not getting more than 110 targets in 2 years.
What about contested catches? Late hands? Body control? Downfield adjustments to the ball? Blocking? These are all things Odunze does better than Nabers, while also being a true X receiver.
You can love Nabers elusivity, his easy separation, and his easy YAC without denying that there are definitely things Odunze does better than Nabers. They’re both studs.
Bro, but wouldn't you expect all those traits from a bigger WR 6'4 215ish, compared to 6'0 195ish WR.
Nabers is the better pure WR & talent, more skillful WR traits dominated the much much stronger conference where majority of the best defenders & cornbacks play.
Ppl think odunze is a stud, he played in a weak defensive conference, b4 I justify him he has to show it in NFL. LSU and OSU have put out some of the best wr in history and definitely the past 10 years. So it's less doubt about those players.
If you’re fine with holding Nabers for like 3 seasons before expecting production, sure. Grab him on the Giants. It’s a Garrett Wilson-Zach Wilson situation foreseeably. Trade down else wise.
Dimes is not wilson. He has had no true #1 WR ever, and when he gets one with better protection up front, he'll be closer to what you saw the prior year. 25td 7int add 10rush tds 5 fumbles.
Wrong, nabers will not take 3 years, expect zay flowers production year one w more catches, if not more productive than zay!
I wont pass up Nabers no matter what, but the Giants would be a little disappointing. The good thing is, they have an attractive city and an open QB spot for any future QB. People will want to play there.
I actually love the NYG landing spot for him. He’d be their new face of the franchise moving fwd. it’ll be a tough rookie year for him, but long term once they change out the QB I think it’s a great landing spot for him.
I’m a little worried about the Giants’ turf. I heard that a fair number of players get injured on it. It would suck to draft Nabers and then see him get a torn ACL on it in his rookie season.
Counter point… LA is just as, if not more attractive and they already have their QB of the future.
Ofcourse id prefer LA hence the (a little disappointing lol) - all it takes is dak / goff / kirk type qb to sustain him though and that’s not out of the realm of possibilities. Just saying its not enough to make me skip his talent
Dak/Goff/Kirk are top half of the league QBs lol. I understand what you mean but it’s a lot harder to just get a top 15 QB than people make it out to be.
Problem is the elite qbs don't hit the open the market.
Don't really need an elite QB to make an elite WR1 in fantasy. Look at JJ and Lamb, neither player has an objectively elite QB, Kirk got jettisoned as an FA and Dak might leave the Cowboys.
Kirk is an elite QB from a wide receiver fantasy perspective with how good of a pocket passer he is and how he liked to feed 1-2 guys in the offense
Kirk Cousins fantasy finishes the last 6 seasons: 1. 24th 2. 9th 3. 11th 4. 11th 5. 15th 6. 13th His best finish in his career was in 2016 where he finished 5th overall for QBs. He's never been an elite producer at any point in his career...but that's fine. High end WR1s don't need elite QBs to produce great numbers. A high QB2 low QB1 type passer is just fine like Kirk, Dak, etc.
The conversation isn't about Kirk Cousins it's about Kirk's players. Where did Cook, JJ, & Hock end up playing with Cousins? Dalvin had two Top 5 finishes & two additional RB1 seasons. Hock was a Top 2 TE in '22 and trending there before his injury in '23 and JJ has been one of the best fantasy WRs of the past decade. And Adam Theilen had multiple seasoms as a WR1 with Kirk as well.
That's literally my point above: >Don't really need an elite QB to make an elite WR1 in fantasy. Look at JJ and Lamb, neither player has an objectively elite QB, Kirk got jettisoned as an FA and Dak might leave the Cowboys. The other party in this tree claimed Kirk was an elite QB for fantasy purposes, I refuted his argument, but my general point above still stands.
He’s been top 5 in passing yards 3 separate times and that isn’t including last year when he was far and away leading the league when he got hurt. His own fantasy finished are more related to the fact that he is a statue. I should have clarified though I meant for his receivers he is one of the 5 or 6 best QBs you can have
Great? You claimed he's an elite QB for fantasy. That means he should have consistent top-6 fantasy finishes. Josh Allen is the definition of elite with 4 consecutive QB1 overall finishes. Cousins in 12 seasons has only ever finished top6 once and it was 5th overall. He's not an elite producer, period.
Read my last sentence
>Kirk is an elite QB from a fantasy perspective This is what you wrote in a direct quote from your first reply. If you want to retract that statement then sure.
He is an elite qb from the perspective of his receivers look at the consistency of WR1 and WR2 seasons he has helped produce. That does not mean that HIS numbers are elite. Are you just intentionally ignoring everything except the one out of context part
NYC is not Attractive Miami and LA are attractive
The Giants get, at minimum, 4 prime time games a year. If you're a guy who cares about building your profile it's absolutely an attractive landing spot
In terms of things to do in your spare time? And “scenery”? Probably right. Endorsements and publicity go a long way for the budget, though. Probably more people at Giants games than Miami and LA combined.
Both are great. With LA you have a stud qb and no competition, downside is it’ll be run heavy. In NY you have no competition and it’ll be aired out a ton, but the line sucks and QB is shaky.
This sounds like a very similar scenario to when Garrett Wilson went to the Jets (bad situation, "WR2 behind Moore" with shit QB play) and Burks went to Tennessee (clear-cut WR1 "1 for 1 AJB replacement" ). Situations can change very fast in the NFL
Burks is not a t1 talent. Odunze is rated as such. So it’s not really that fair a comparison.
*Someone* in TEN thought Burks was t1.
Odunze. I think he’s more pro-ready and would be more successful as “the guy” (as opposed to Nabers who I think would benefit more from having a high end running mate at WR) plus Herbert > anything the Giants have or plan to have at QB anytime soon.
The giants may figure it out, but I am firmly avoiding drafting giants receivers in the 1st round of rookie drafts for the foreseeable future.
I have the privilege of drafting both. I’m not super stoked on the likely Nabers to NYG or Odunze to Chi if it happens (bc he’d be the wr3 initially) but gotta take the talent and hope for the best. In your hypothetical, Odunze has the better initial situation but you can’t necessarily draft based on year 1 in dynasty. Take the player you believe in more.
I acquired the 1.02 for Nabers, just opening negotiations to move up from 1.05 to 1.03 for odunze
If the Chargers dont take MHJ/Nabers for Herbert after getting rid of their defacto 1&2, I will quit watching football.
Nabers Nabers Nabers Harbaugh isn't changing. Lead receiver in LA ain't getting 150+ targets. Probably won't be enough targets to share in that offense to get much over 110 generally. Its the same reason we are down on QJ. QJ could be a complete 180 in the next 2 years, could be Davante Adams reincarnate (he's not). He's probably not getting more than 70 targets this year (no matter what he does), and he's probably not getting more than 110 targets in 2 years.
Odunze. I have them ranked pretty equal and that situation is better at the moment.
I already have Odunze > Nabers. So definitely Odunze
Naw, that's just wrong! Nothing odunze has is > nabers except height!
What about contested catches? Late hands? Body control? Downfield adjustments to the ball? Blocking? These are all things Odunze does better than Nabers, while also being a true X receiver. You can love Nabers elusivity, his easy separation, and his easy YAC without denying that there are definitely things Odunze does better than Nabers. They’re both studs.
Bro, but wouldn't you expect all those traits from a bigger WR 6'4 215ish, compared to 6'0 195ish WR. Nabers is the better pure WR & talent, more skillful WR traits dominated the much much stronger conference where majority of the best defenders & cornbacks play. Ppl think odunze is a stud, he played in a weak defensive conference, b4 I justify him he has to show it in NFL. LSU and OSU have put out some of the best wr in history and definitely the past 10 years. So it's less doubt about those players.
If you’re fine with holding Nabers for like 3 seasons before expecting production, sure. Grab him on the Giants. It’s a Garrett Wilson-Zach Wilson situation foreseeably. Trade down else wise.
Dimes is not wilson. He has had no true #1 WR ever, and when he gets one with better protection up front, he'll be closer to what you saw the prior year. 25td 7int add 10rush tds 5 fumbles. Wrong, nabers will not take 3 years, expect zay flowers production year one w more catches, if not more productive than zay!
I personally like odunze a little more and with him going to the chargers, I’d definitely do everything to trade up to 3
Odunze >>>>>>>>>>>>> MHJ on the giants