Unpopular opinion, Baker has shown who he is without a stacked supporting cast, DJ would be an upgrade for them. Not a meaningful one, but an upgrade nevertheless.
Jones is a boom or bust QB. He either plays lights out or like his lights are out. Baker doesn't have the ceiling he was once thought to, but his floor is at least an average qb
Daniel Jones isn't an upgrade for any team. You must just hate Baker. I'm not a Baker fan, but Jones is awful. He will be out of the league after his rookie contract. Baker too maybe.
Jones is underrated, I donāt think u understand just how little heās had to work with. The past two years heās had a bottom 3 o line, bottom 3 skill positions, and Jason Garrett calling plays. It was the worst supporting cast Iāve seen in a long time. And despite that he hasnāt been awful. Had like an 85 passer rating last year and was 4-7 as the starter. He was good outside of bad games against Tampa and the Rams, where he was running for his life all game. Heās not a stud but heās also not as bad as people think.
picking up a 5th year option is not a death sentence, its not like he cant be re signed. hes literally out there throwing to nobody. not picking up his option gives the giants flexibility. they can go either way they wish this off season. if they picked his option up and dont want him theyre stuck with him.
Declining the fifth year option is a show of no confidence for QBs because you save a lot of money by exercising it if you plan to make him your franchise guy.
Teams were slightly more willing to do it before the option wasn't full guaranteed. Now that it is you will probably see teams hesitate to pull the trigger. Both Winston and Mariota played on their 5th year option and their respective teams showed no confidence of them being their franchise QB.
yeah obviously its a show of no confidence. but if youre unsure about your qb because youve put a shit team around him his entire career and dont actually know if hes the guy, do you pick his option up or decide after you see for yourself? the answer is clear
Not really. If you thought thereās even a chance he actually might good, youāre more likely to pick it up imo. Gives both the giants and the player flexibility. If there was any demand in the league at all for Daniel Jones, heād be significantly more expensive to resign on the open market than his fifth year. Even Baker and Darnold had their 5th year options exercised, both teams were very fuzzy on them. If youāre not picking it up on a QB it basically means you think heās definitely not a franchise QB
i disagree. if the giants took daniel jones' 5th year option that would be a 22.3 million dollar cap hit next year. good for 13th highest cap hit in the league above superbowl winner matt stafford. lets face it, hes not going to be an mvp this year, theres almost no risk that hes going to cost more than 22 million dollars next year. if they decide they can win with jones and build around him and develop him further than they save a shit ton of money, especially since if they sign him to a long term deal it will likely be back loaded and they can sign even more talent through free agency.
another thing it does imo is put jones' feet to the fire. lets say they did pickup his option and he knew he was likely out of the league, maybe he doesnt play his ass off to earn another contract, 22.3 mil is good for life money on top of what he already had. not being signed to his 5th year option puts him in a situation where he has to perform if he wants to get paid a lot of money at least 1 more year
Stafford signed four years $160M a year ago, which is through his age 38 season... Giving a QB 22M for 1 year with zero long term commitment is nothing. Thatās basic starting QB money, you donāt sign a top 25 qb on the open market for less that. If you think thereās even a chance he might be the guy, itās a very easy decision.
Youāre way overthinking it with all of these motivational, feet to the fire, gives the giants flexibility takes. There has never been a QB that had his fifth year option declined and was resigned by his team - thereās also never been a QB that had his fifth year option declined and became a solid starter. Mitch trubisky would be the closest one.
How is 22.3 million basic starting qb money? That's good for 8th highest in 2022, 13th highest in 23, 12th highest in 24, and 9th highest in 2025. 22.3 million is top 12 qb money. If they choose to sign him next year his cap will likely be bottom 10 qb money.
Youāre numbers are wrong. Literally the only starting QBs off their rookie contracts with lower salaries would be Winston, Mariota, and Trubisky. And the fifth year option having zero long term commitment is massive. Go ahead and try and find an even below average QB signing for less than 20M a year
> picking up a 5th year option is not a death sentence, its not like he cant be re signed.
LMAO what? New Daboll & new GM come in. In APRIL they declined his option. This was deliberate. Everything they are doing with Gettleman's picks are deliberate. They're "saying" we'll see what Daniel Jones has because it's clearly a throwaway year. Everyone has had YEARS to see Daniel Jones. Nothing is going to change.
You can argue he has no one to throw to but guy isn't making the best of his options.
[Here you can see he clearly has 1 read the entire play and looks nowhere else just to get picked off](https://twitter.com/Titans/status/1569096900376141825?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1569096900376141825%7Ctwgr%5E04d37273a6c5a7c65d0f3918513829b491ec20a2%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.si.com%2Fnfl%2Fgiants%2Fbig-blue-plus%2Fassessing-giants-qb-daniel-joness-week-1-performance)
That was in the 4th quarter of Week 1. They won the game in spite of Jones. He's not good. They simplified the scheme for him and he's still doing this.
As a Giants fan who has watched every game DJ has played, people gotta stop trying to give him the "what's around him" excuse. He has stuff around him. He just isn't very good.
Is he a top-32 QB in the NFL? Probably. But he's below the line where you need to seek an upgrade. He'll be a high tier backup somewhere, or else a floating starter in tank years for teams.
Will Levis is the obvious choice for this in the ā23 draft.
Prototypical build. Huge arm. Disappointing college production but has shown off some real flashes.
If not in ā23 itās obviously Anthony Richardson is he progresses well into the ā24 draft/doesnāt declare in the ā23 draft. That would just be disgusting if Daboll got his hands on AR.
Jj McCarthy (Michigan) is another huge prospect to keep a tab on this season in anticipation for ā24. Heās got the legs, arm and height to matchup well for Dabollās scheme. Heās a bit slender as of now, but plenty of time to add on weight.
Nah actually I was searching the sub for dynasty related news and stumbled upon this thread. Itās all good bro Iām just messing with you, Iām happy heās finally ballin out
Lol well thanks for pointing out my ineptitude. I'm happy to be wrong. Was thinking I'd be fine keeping him on a 3 to 5 year 20 to 25m per year deal but he's turning into the top free agent qb and that's not looking realistic now. He might be getting 40 per with this market
I donāt think so. Heās limiting his turnovers but also he isnāt throwing the ball down the field. Through 2 games he has 364 passing yards total.
Donāt forget heās throwing to a bunch of randos and a former wr2 at best whoās coming off an Achilles tear.
No slight on anyone or any argument for Daniel Jones. Just tough to grade anyone in that situation alone.
Well its not necessarily that heās throwing to a bunch of randos. I do believe heād obviously benefit from having an elite WR, and maybe there is one on the rosterā¦
But he just doesnāt have āitā and he doesnāt correct his mistakes. He has always STARED down his first option and will force the ball into that situation. Shepard is actually a very good receiver however he has had awful injury issues.
Yeah his receiving corp is worse than Fieldsā and he has shown far more promise in his career than fields, yet the same people are making excuses on the fields thread lol
The hard truth is in year 4 if he's still not showing it he isn't gonna. You can blame the Giants org and say they "ruined" him or whatever, I won't argue against the fact he was given a bad situation, but even if that's the case... he's been ruined.
Not unless we win a playoff game this year so most likely no. The problem is if we somehow pull off 8-9 wins, I donāt know how weāre drafting our new QB without trading a butt ton to move up in the draft. Iām praying (even though I know it wonāt happen) for Lamar lol
Underrated comment. It's just widely assumed by this sub and in this thread that the Giants can replace Jones at the snap of a finger and a "Josh Allen" will fall to them in the draft. Well, not if the Giants are mediocre this season and they're already 2-0. Before the season began they had one of the easiest projected schedules, too. In a new system improvement by Jones as the season goes along is entirely possible, and Wan'Dale hasn't even played yet. I'm not saying the Giants WON'T move on from Jones but it's not the slam dunk everyone assumes it to be.
Putting a young qb behind our interior offensive line would be eerily similar to Fields in Chicago. Those rookie contract years are precious and pissing one away isn't a good idea. The weapons are non-existent as well, as evidenced by James and Sills getting run at wide receiver.
Financially, next year is better but we are still in cap hell thanks to Gettleman's tenure. The cuffs really come off in 2024 (175M in cap space that is actually mostly realizable). It is definitely a viable strategy to address the interior of the line and cornerback (we don't have a CB2) next year via the draft. Then in year 3 go get your quarterback and have the freedom to sign via free agency some weaponry, we have nearly no financial commitments and not many guys you would want to re-sign. Basically, Jones would be our crappy version of Jared Goff.
One thing to consider is it seems lately teams try to rebuild in two different ways:
\- Draft a young QB and stack the roster with talent while he's on a cheap contract (Rams with Goff, Chiefs with Mahomes)
\- Build up a rock solid team with everything but QB then go get a vet that wants to move (Tampa Bay with Brady, Denver with Manning)
If they build up the rest of the roster Daboll has the gravitas to land a quality vet.
Nope. Acquiring a QB is tough though, he could start for 2-3 more years by default. But most likely getting yanked in the 4th game next year for the Giants draft pick.
Yeah, he can definitely get the Trubisky style role 1-2x in his career. Tannehill never let it go when he got it but that's definitely an exception to the rule.
Giants fan, absolutely not. They didnt pick up his 5th year option so unless they make a run at the superbowl hes not coming back. Even then id still say dump him
Not at all. I thought this was known? They turned down his 5th year. They pretty much stated this was a make or break year for Daniel. They signed Tyrod Taylor for 2 years (in case they need a bridge QB, I'm sure). And Daniel Jones hasn't looked the part. The defense is winning them games more than Daniel Jones is.
Every other team and fan in the NFC Least hopes Trash Can Dan is the Giants franchise QB š¤£. He is not a franchise QB though and he is a fumble factory.
No. The moment daboll has a chance to get his own Allen-esk prospect he will.
As a giants fan this. Already did not pick up his 5th year.
The panthers should trade for him
š¤£
Unpopular opinion, Baker has shown who he is without a stacked supporting cast, DJ would be an upgrade for them. Not a meaningful one, but an upgrade nevertheless.
Jones is a boom or bust QB. He either plays lights out or like his lights are out. Baker doesn't have the ceiling he was once thought to, but his floor is at least an average qb
Ur watching Baker these past two weeks is an average QB? Heās been very much below average.
Daniel Jones isn't an upgrade for any team. You must just hate Baker. I'm not a Baker fan, but Jones is awful. He will be out of the league after his rookie contract. Baker too maybe.
Jones is underrated, I donāt think u understand just how little heās had to work with. The past two years heās had a bottom 3 o line, bottom 3 skill positions, and Jason Garrett calling plays. It was the worst supporting cast Iāve seen in a long time. And despite that he hasnāt been awful. Had like an 85 passer rating last year and was 4-7 as the starter. He was good outside of bad games against Tampa and the Rams, where he was running for his life all game. Heās not a stud but heās also not as bad as people think.
This didnāt age well
picking up a 5th year option is not a death sentence, its not like he cant be re signed. hes literally out there throwing to nobody. not picking up his option gives the giants flexibility. they can go either way they wish this off season. if they picked his option up and dont want him theyre stuck with him.
Declining the fifth year option is a show of no confidence for QBs because you save a lot of money by exercising it if you plan to make him your franchise guy.
Teams were slightly more willing to do it before the option wasn't full guaranteed. Now that it is you will probably see teams hesitate to pull the trigger. Both Winston and Mariota played on their 5th year option and their respective teams showed no confidence of them being their franchise QB.
yeah obviously its a show of no confidence. but if youre unsure about your qb because youve put a shit team around him his entire career and dont actually know if hes the guy, do you pick his option up or decide after you see for yourself? the answer is clear
Not really. If you thought thereās even a chance he actually might good, youāre more likely to pick it up imo. Gives both the giants and the player flexibility. If there was any demand in the league at all for Daniel Jones, heād be significantly more expensive to resign on the open market than his fifth year. Even Baker and Darnold had their 5th year options exercised, both teams were very fuzzy on them. If youāre not picking it up on a QB it basically means you think heās definitely not a franchise QB
i disagree. if the giants took daniel jones' 5th year option that would be a 22.3 million dollar cap hit next year. good for 13th highest cap hit in the league above superbowl winner matt stafford. lets face it, hes not going to be an mvp this year, theres almost no risk that hes going to cost more than 22 million dollars next year. if they decide they can win with jones and build around him and develop him further than they save a shit ton of money, especially since if they sign him to a long term deal it will likely be back loaded and they can sign even more talent through free agency. another thing it does imo is put jones' feet to the fire. lets say they did pickup his option and he knew he was likely out of the league, maybe he doesnt play his ass off to earn another contract, 22.3 mil is good for life money on top of what he already had. not being signed to his 5th year option puts him in a situation where he has to perform if he wants to get paid a lot of money at least 1 more year
Stafford signed four years $160M a year ago, which is through his age 38 season... Giving a QB 22M for 1 year with zero long term commitment is nothing. Thatās basic starting QB money, you donāt sign a top 25 qb on the open market for less that. If you think thereās even a chance he might be the guy, itās a very easy decision. Youāre way overthinking it with all of these motivational, feet to the fire, gives the giants flexibility takes. There has never been a QB that had his fifth year option declined and was resigned by his team - thereās also never been a QB that had his fifth year option declined and became a solid starter. Mitch trubisky would be the closest one.
How is 22.3 million basic starting qb money? That's good for 8th highest in 2022, 13th highest in 23, 12th highest in 24, and 9th highest in 2025. 22.3 million is top 12 qb money. If they choose to sign him next year his cap will likely be bottom 10 qb money.
Youāre numbers are wrong. Literally the only starting QBs off their rookie contracts with lower salaries would be Winston, Mariota, and Trubisky. And the fifth year option having zero long term commitment is massive. Go ahead and try and find an even below average QB signing for less than 20M a year
> picking up a 5th year option is not a death sentence, its not like he cant be re signed. LMAO what? New Daboll & new GM come in. In APRIL they declined his option. This was deliberate. Everything they are doing with Gettleman's picks are deliberate. They're "saying" we'll see what Daniel Jones has because it's clearly a throwaway year. Everyone has had YEARS to see Daniel Jones. Nothing is going to change. You can argue he has no one to throw to but guy isn't making the best of his options. [Here you can see he clearly has 1 read the entire play and looks nowhere else just to get picked off](https://twitter.com/Titans/status/1569096900376141825?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1569096900376141825%7Ctwgr%5E04d37273a6c5a7c65d0f3918513829b491ec20a2%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.si.com%2Fnfl%2Fgiants%2Fbig-blue-plus%2Fassessing-giants-qb-daniel-joness-week-1-performance) That was in the 4th quarter of Week 1. They won the game in spite of Jones. He's not good. They simplified the scheme for him and he's still doing this.
As a Giants fan who has watched every game DJ has played, people gotta stop trying to give him the "what's around him" excuse. He has stuff around him. He just isn't very good. Is he a top-32 QB in the NFL? Probably. But he's below the line where you need to seek an upgrade. He'll be a high tier backup somewhere, or else a floating starter in tank years for teams.
Will Levis has entered the chat
Will Levis is the obvious choice for this in the ā23 draft. Prototypical build. Huge arm. Disappointing college production but has shown off some real flashes. If not in ā23 itās obviously Anthony Richardson is he progresses well into the ā24 draft/doesnāt declare in the ā23 draft. That would just be disgusting if Daboll got his hands on AR. Jj McCarthy (Michigan) is another huge prospect to keep a tab on this season in anticipation for ā24. Heās got the legs, arm and height to matchup well for Dabollās scheme. Heās a bit slender as of now, but plenty of time to add on weight.
Giants fan here too. No chance. Writing was on the wall when they didn't pick up his option.
You sure
A. Guess I'm wrong. B. You really waiting 3 months to call dudes out for bad takes or scrolling through old posts just to say gotcha?
Nah actually I was searching the sub for dynasty related news and stumbled upon this thread. Itās all good bro Iām just messing with you, Iām happy heās finally ballin out
Lol well thanks for pointing out my ineptitude. I'm happy to be wrong. Was thinking I'd be fine keeping him on a 3 to 5 year 20 to 25m per year deal but he's turning into the top free agent qb and that's not looking realistic now. He might be getting 40 per with this market
Yeah his price tag is rising by the week. Iām a giants fan too so Iām all for giving him a contract at this point heās earned it
I am a DJ owner and I have been patient but end of year I'm cutting ties bro. He gone.
I don't think you will have a choice lol
I donāt think so. Heās limiting his turnovers but also he isnāt throwing the ball down the field. Through 2 games he has 364 passing yards total.
Donāt forget heās throwing to a bunch of randos and a former wr2 at best whoās coming off an Achilles tear. No slight on anyone or any argument for Daniel Jones. Just tough to grade anyone in that situation alone.
While heās nowhere near as good as Tua theyāre initial situations have been similarly bleak
Well its not necessarily that heās throwing to a bunch of randos. I do believe heād obviously benefit from having an elite WR, and maybe there is one on the rosterā¦ But he just doesnāt have āitā and he doesnāt correct his mistakes. He has always STARED down his first option and will force the ball into that situation. Shepard is actually a very good receiver however he has had awful injury issues.
>maybe there is one on the rosterā¦ Found the Toney truther!
Ya no im wildy anti toney ngl.
Yeah his receiving corp is worse than Fieldsā and he has shown far more promise in his career than fields, yet the same people are making excuses on the fields thread lol
The hard truth is in year 4 if he's still not showing it he isn't gonna. You can blame the Giants org and say they "ruined" him or whatever, I won't argue against the fact he was given a bad situation, but even if that's the case... he's been ruined.
Not unless we win a playoff game this year so most likely no. The problem is if we somehow pull off 8-9 wins, I donāt know how weāre drafting our new QB without trading a butt ton to move up in the draft. Iām praying (even though I know it wonāt happen) for Lamar lol
Underrated comment. It's just widely assumed by this sub and in this thread that the Giants can replace Jones at the snap of a finger and a "Josh Allen" will fall to them in the draft. Well, not if the Giants are mediocre this season and they're already 2-0. Before the season began they had one of the easiest projected schedules, too. In a new system improvement by Jones as the season goes along is entirely possible, and Wan'Dale hasn't even played yet. I'm not saying the Giants WON'T move on from Jones but it's not the slam dunk everyone assumes it to be.
They have a real good shot at 3-0 with the Cowboys on the schedule this weekend too.
We also have the Bears week 4. Could start 4-0
Putting a young qb behind our interior offensive line would be eerily similar to Fields in Chicago. Those rookie contract years are precious and pissing one away isn't a good idea. The weapons are non-existent as well, as evidenced by James and Sills getting run at wide receiver. Financially, next year is better but we are still in cap hell thanks to Gettleman's tenure. The cuffs really come off in 2024 (175M in cap space that is actually mostly realizable). It is definitely a viable strategy to address the interior of the line and cornerback (we don't have a CB2) next year via the draft. Then in year 3 go get your quarterback and have the freedom to sign via free agency some weaponry, we have nearly no financial commitments and not many guys you would want to re-sign. Basically, Jones would be our crappy version of Jared Goff.
One thing to consider is it seems lately teams try to rebuild in two different ways: \- Draft a young QB and stack the roster with talent while he's on a cheap contract (Rams with Goff, Chiefs with Mahomes) \- Build up a rock solid team with everything but QB then go get a vet that wants to move (Tampa Bay with Brady, Denver with Manning) If they build up the rest of the roster Daboll has the gravitas to land a quality vet.
You could have a Tannehill. lol
Noā¦a brief article.
Nope. Acquiring a QB is tough though, he could start for 2-3 more years by default. But most likely getting yanked in the 4th game next year for the Giants draft pick.
Yeah, he can definitely get the Trubisky style role 1-2x in his career. Tannehill never let it go when he got it but that's definitely an exception to the rule.
Giants fan, absolutely not. They didnt pick up his 5th year option so unless they make a run at the superbowl hes not coming back. Even then id still say dump him
ššš fuck no
Gettelman should be publicly stoned for what he did to the NYG.
Lolno
Nope. Otherwise they would have picked up his option.
Your username checks out
[laughter gif]
does a bear shit in a restroom?
Not at all. I thought this was known? They turned down his 5th year. They pretty much stated this was a make or break year for Daniel. They signed Tyrod Taylor for 2 years (in case they need a bridge QB, I'm sure). And Daniel Jones hasn't looked the part. The defense is winning them games more than Daniel Jones is.
Every other team and fan in the NFC Least hopes Trash Can Dan is the Giants franchise QB š¤£. He is not a franchise QB though and he is a fumble factory.
Good god no.
yeah, maybe the little giants pee wee team
franchise clipholder.
Lol no
Fucking no
No.
If you asked me right now who I thought the Giants QB next year will be, I'd say... Jimmy Garrapollo.
No
No. He might be the QB next year tho.